- So there are many
different theories of gender, and mine is just one. Sometimes, people who really hate gender name me as the one who made this up, but that's actually not true. You know, in my view, everybody
has a theory of gender, and what I mean by that is that everybody has
certain assumptions going about what gender is or should be. And at a certain point in
life, we ask ourselves, "Wow, where'd that assumption come from?" (Judith laughs) At this point, I'm less concerned about
whose theory is right and whose theory is wrong because the assault on gender is also an assault on democracy. We have the power and the freedom to make more livable lives for ourselves, where bodies can be more free
to breathe, to move, to love without discrimination and
without fear of violence. I am Judith Butler, distinguished professor
in the graduate school at the University of
California at Berkeley. I teach literature, philosophy,
and critical theory, and I'm most well-known
for my two books on gender, "Gender Trouble" and "Bodies That Matter"
from the early 1990s. My work has been translated
into more than 27 languages. (pensive music) I insist that what it is to be a woman, or indeed what it is to be
a man or any other gender, is an open-ended question. (pensive music) We have a whole range of
differences, biological in nature, so I don't deny them, but I don't think they
determine who we are in some sort of final way. At the heart of these controversies is the distinction between sex and gender. But what is that distinction? How do we think about it? Sex is generally a category
that is assigned to infants that has importance within
medical and legal worlds. Gender is a mix of cultural
norms, historical formations, family influence, psychic
realities, desires, and wishes. And we have a say in that. My early life was affected by the 1960s and the social movements that
took shape during that time. I grew up on the East side of Cleveland, part of a Jewish community, and by the time I was in high school, I was politically active. But I was also taking university
courses in philosophy. In my 20s, I came to see that it was not just the
Jews who were apprehended and extinguished by the Nazi regime. It was queer people, it
was gay/lesbian people, it was people with disabilities, people with illnesses,
Polish workers, communists. And my sense was that one
needed to widen the lens and see that many people have been
subject to genocidal politics and to understand that there are different
forms of oppression. I remained convinced that
one does need to know history in order to make sure it does not repeat and that one wants justice not just for the group
to which one belongs, but for any group that
suffers in a similar way. In the '70s and '80s, I was part of a movement of people who were rethinking
gender during that time. Queer theory was emerging. It was in a complicated
conversation with feminism. Trans issues had not yet surfaced as part of our contemporary reality, so it was a moment in which
we asked questions like, "What has society made of us, and what can we make of ourselves?" There were a number of
versions of feminism that I tended to oppose. One of them held that, well, women are fundamentally mothers and that maternity is the
essence of the feminine. And then a second one thought that feminism was about sexual difference, but the way they defined sexual difference was always presumptively heterosexual. And both of them struck me as wrong. I was pretty committed to the idea that people ought not to
be discriminated against on the basis of what
they do with their body, who they love, or how they
move, or how they look. All I was saying is that the
sex you're assigned at birth and the gender that you are taught to be should not determine
how you live your life. (film camera rolling) Sometimes, people point
to "Gender Trouble" as the inception of gender theory, but people were working
on gender before me, Gayle Rubin, and Juliet Mitchell, and Simone de Beauvoir herself. Simone de Beauvoir was an
existential philosopher and a feminist philosopher who wrote "The Second Sex" in the 1940s. The basic point is that
one is not born a woman, but rather becomes one,
that the body is not a fact. She opened up the
possibility of a difference between the sex you're assigned
and the sex you become. (pensive music) Gayle Rubin was an anthropologist, and remains an anthropologist, who wrote an extremely influential article called "The Traffic in Women." And what she tried to say was that the family was a structure whose task it was to reproduce gender, and one of the aims it had was to kind of keep heterosexuality
looking really normal. And although it was part
of feminist anthropology at the time, it allowed us to start
thinking about gender as something that could be
reproduced, crafted, cultivated, and that there were systems, frameworks, to which gender belongs. There was one other
dimension of Rubin's work which was, interestingly, psychoanalysis. She basically said, "Well, maybe there's a
whole lot of repression going into becoming a man and a whole lot of repression
going into becoming a woman," and that one of the things
we have to do to conform with existing gender norms is to rule out all those possibilities of being, feeling, doing, loving that don't line up with the gender norms that are governing our lives. So anthropology, psychoanalysis, they all had their place in that moment way before "Gender Trouble"
emerged on the scene. I think at the time that
I wrote "Gender Trouble," people treated gender as
if it was a natural fact or a sociological reality, but they didn't treat it as something that you
could make and remake. Performance is important to this extent that we do enact who we are, and anybody in performance studies actually knows that there are performances that we do in our lives that are not mere
performance, they're not fake. When performative was
first coined as a word, the philosopher J.L. Austin was trying to understand legal utterances. So when a judge says, "I
declare you man and wife," you become man and wife once
that declaration has happened. That's not fake, that happened. Now, what if we were to say that in enacting our lives
as a particular gender, we are actually realizing
that gender anew, we are making something real happen. When gay and lesbian
people started coming out or when trans people
started living openly, something changed in the world. By appearing, speaking,
acting in certain ways, reality changed. And it has changed. We are seeing the changing of terms. We no longer speak about
family, woman, man, desire, sex in the same way. Even the Cambridge Dictionary (Judith laughs) acknowledges that something has changed. Okay, so when we talk about performative, we're talking about an act that makes something come into being or an act that has real consequences. We're talking about the
changing of reality. Even among progressive
and liberal people I know, there can sometimes be a real resistance to thinking about trans rights,
or lesbian and gay rights, or even women's rights. They sometimes say that
these are secondary issues or it simply makes them uncomfortable. "Why should I have to refer to someone as a he, or a she, or a they?" And yet, at least in the US, we've learned how to talk
about Black people differently or we talk about women differently. And sure, it was probably hard to learn how to use new language. Maybe we had to adjust our habits. But stumbling is part of learning and making an error is part of learning, especially when we're
learning something new. Sometimes, we can all be vitriolic, right? Some certain statements will
set me off and I will scream, but if I only were to do that, then I would never be having
a conversation with anyone. I think we all want to be the
moral center of our universe, like, "That's right, that's wrong." "You're canceled, you're not." "You're with me, you're against me." But we have to allow
ourselves to be challenged and accept the invitation to
revise our ways of thinking because that's the only way of being open to people who are trying to
make their claim sometimes for the very first time, to be heard, to be known, to be acknowledged. (uplifting music) Now, I'm less interested in
defending a theory of gender. I'm much more concerned with finding creative and effective ways of countering the attack on gender. One problem is that many people who refuse to allow trans people to define themselves is that they feel that
their own self-definition is destabilized. The idea that we can change
reality, transform reality to be more open, inclusive,
just less violent - there's an instability in that that's very frightening to people who want to understand
their genders as fixed. But is anybody's gender
necessary and universal, or is it a complicated emergence that happens with each of us? Our deepest sense of self
is also formed in time, and we can't always know, in
advance, what that will be. (uplifting music) Freedom is a struggle because
there's so much in our world that's telling us not to
be free with our bodies. And if we are seeking to
love in a free way, to live, and move in a free way, we actually have to struggle
to claim that freedom. When we live in a democracy, we assume that we're living according to certain principles - equality, freedom, justice - and yet we're constantly
learning what freedom is, and what equality is,
and what justice can be. And those challenges, right, the anti-slavery movement,
the suffrage movement, the movement for LGBTQIA+ rights, I mean, each of those struggles involve challenging
people's existing ideas of: Who's equal? Who has the right to be free? And how do we define justice? We are, all the time,
struggling to achieve that goal. We need to reoccupy these notions and show that concerns
with racial justice, and gender equality, and gender freedom are an integral part of
any democratic struggle, especially if we want to
rethink who the people are and what it means for them to
live in freedom without fear. (uplifting music) - [Crew] Let's just wrap
up the gender stuff. Unless you want to take
a break from gender, we can go back to that. Do you want to get... Let me give you the prompt for the last- - My whole life, I've wanted
to take a break from gender. I can never take a break from gender. - [Announcer] Get smarter faster with videos from the
world's biggest thinkers. To learn even more from the
world's biggest thinkers, get Big Think+ for your business.
I loved this video, and Judith is so charismatic.
I've actually never heard them talk and I've only seen their static profile picture. It's a little surreal to see them move and hear them talk!
Thanks for sharing!
Never heard of Big Think. Thanks for sharing this, I want to check out who else they interview. Judith is awesome.
My beard doesn't make me a man. My bald spot doesn't make me a man. My DNA doesn't make me a man. My genitals don't make me a man. My wife doesn't make me a man. What makes me a man? Nothing. I have no interest in being a man. I have no interest in being a woman. I like being how I like being, and it makes me happy to be me. Its enough for me. Let everyone be themselves; it's not that hard.