B17 9o9 Final Report Update #3 Dr Blue on C0 and FAA Reaction

[Music] okay i've got update number three a couple of things happen interesting things that happen uh one about the faa what the faa has done what their action items are what their plan is how to deal with the v17 909 accident fall out of the final report and also clarification on co poisoning and some other medical issues so stick with us on flywire [Music] hey scott perdue here on flywire and today we're going to do update number three for 317 909 final report uh interesting developments uh today so the first one is i'm going to talk about i'm going to talk to dr brent blue here in a second and he's the my medical liaison that helps me with uh evaluate my medical details uh for very for this accident at least and uh he's clarifying the co poisoning issue and how long the exposure was uh likely to be and its effect on the crew during the accident so without further ado let's check it out all right i have dr brent blue with me here and he's my my medical support team to look at this uh look at this accident as i said in the previous uh update on this uh on this topic uh i sent him the medical documents that uh were part of the faa docket by the ntsb document sorry uh on this investigation he reviewed it right could you tell us what you found well scott you had uh had a concern about whether or not carbon monoxide may have been present uh prior to the actual accident and certainly uh carbon monoxide is one of those things that can definitely impair a pilot uh but in this situation because of the findings of autopsy i think this was all after the accident the reason i say that is is that the injuries that the pilot had were not immediately fatal from a traumatic point of view and uh what i mean by that is that he didn't have like a ruptured aorta or ruptured heart are something that he would have been dead in 30 seconds and what happens in a in a situation like this where a pilot may be uh conscious or at least unable to extricate themselves from their position uh the it's like being if you get close to a bonfire you back up because it's there's heat but in a situation like that he's not going to be backing up because he's stuck or he's unconscious and so you get tremendous levels of carbon monoxide uh exposure and and if the pilot's sitting there breathing for a minute or two minutes or three minutes that's enough to raise that level to uh 18 parts per million um they're not 18 parts per million but 18 uh but i think you the other issue is is on the autopsy there was soot not only in the mouth but in the bronchial tubes and that definitely implies that the pilot was breathing and breathing during the fire before he expired and that's what raises that level up very high you have to remember that carbon monoxide has a much higher affinity for hemoglobin than oxygen and by a factor of about 10 and so it does not take very long for very high levels of carbon monoxide to get into the bloodstream so that's really what i think happened as far as the high levels of carbon monoxide i did not think that was a pre-accident problem okay and uh the 18 and the captain and the 16 in the co-pilot um those numbers uh the relative we can we can believe that those numbers are probably what happened in the accident because once respiration stopped pretty much that uh the blow-off of that co gas release from the hemoglobin isn't going to happen well and also they're in a high exposure uh uh area until they died and so they're they're even if they i mean there's there was never a point where they could have been breathing off the carbon monoxide and the half-life of carbon monoxide in the blood is about eight hours in room air meaning that if you have say a level of 10 and you're breathing repairing you're not being exposed any longer it would take eight hours for it to drop down to five then eight more hours to be two and a half if you're on high flow oxygen or on a ventilator on high flow oxygen then that increases or assuming decreases the half-life but it's still a significant amount of time the other thing that happens just for pilots just in general understand this is that carbon monoxide is is measured in the blood but there is also a tissue effect and carbon monoxide particularly on the mitochondria of the cells and so for i mean one of the things that's important for pilots to understand is exposure to carbon monoxide at altitude is sort of a double whammy the combination of the carbon monoxide effect of hypoxia so you have to be very very careful about carbon monoxide particularly in single-engine aircraft let's see if i understand so if you are exposed for long multiple times over long periods then the half-life half-life of the carbon monoxide is blowing off every eight hours but it can also get into your cells and build up over time that that's correct chronic exposure can definitely cause things like headache and blurred vision and just kind of feeling out of sorts and so on but uh and for for i mean the lesson learned here for for your uh ga pilot is is that if they've got a leak uh into their cabin of carbon monoxide uh it can definitely be significant even though it may not be over a single flight it might be over flights over days and that can be pretty pretty bad one of the reasons we know about the mitochondria now is is that we used to think that just giving people high flow oxygen and bringing their levels down into you know below five that uh that was pretty much all we needed to do but we there are many studies now that show that high flow oxygen for extended periods of time even after carbon monoxide level has dropped or hyperbaric oxygen can be beneficial in preventing long-term damage interesting okay so the i correct me if i'm wrong but i don't think the ntsb the people who did the medical investigation did anything but check the uh the toxic or the level of carbon monoxide and the other things in the blood they didn't check the cells or anything like that so there's really no no easy way to check the cellular level of the carbon dioxide okay all right interesting i mean they could do it in academic centers but but uh it's a very specific kind of uh test and i doubt that in fact i'm sure that fa does not do that yeah okay great well you were we were also talking uh in background we were talking about this and i mentioned that the pilot had had three dui's and it actually had a his medical revoked and then given back over time what do you think the the risk factors of alcoholism is because i mean 3d ui is probably is an indicator that there's a severe alcohol problem yes and and the faa if they were doing their job through the hymns program when they gave him his medical back should have been doing random testing and and many times they stopped doing that random testing so it's hard to know uh what was going on in this specific situation but uh people who who are big league drinkers are subject to developing what is called organic brain syndrome which is basically just uh uh you've heard people call rummy on the past uh they're they're they're basically they literally can get brain atrophy uh that will affect their cognitive abilities with chronic alcohol exposure and that exposure i mean generally the the organic brain syndrome or the person as as a person drinks it generally will stop uh when they stop drinking but it will still progress a little bit uh as time goes on so that plus age you make me wonder well why would this guy make such crazy decisions was he made in this situation and it's always easy to arm chair quarterback but it just seems like there there was something going on here where he made really bad decisions yeah that i i totally agree and people say he was a good pilot but he made really terrible decisions so that was my original thought was maybe carbon monoxide wasn't a reason for that but you're suggesting the possibility we don't know because they didn't they didn't follow up with the testing to determine this but that's the brain empathy and its effect on cognitive ability might have affected might have been one of the causes of his decision making in this accident right okay well thank you so the other thing he had was he had two uh two drugs for hypertension and arrhythmia that are approved with a special or with evaluation and he didn't declare them so what do you think i think that's a problem but whatever uh what do you think that effect had on his his medical condition as far as flying that flight i i don't think the medications themselves had an effect i guess the thing would be more concerned is if he hid those medications which are approved i mean they're not even a special issuance approval for the most part of a uh what are called khaki approval uh which conditions amy can issue um if he lied about those and you have to be wondering if he's lying about other conditions or other medical issues or even drinking again so i i mean no that's all conjecture but you know it's it's it's you know lying about those medications is is i mean those are pretty benign with the faa and so that's reason uh i don't understand why he would do that i don't even i don't either it's just i don't understand it at all uh the uh the co-pilot um he he had some of the same situation i think he also had soot in his lungs but uh i believe in my layperson uh read of that he died much quicker from the impact as i under as i recall and i don't have the report right for me but he had soot in his oropharynx meaning his nose and his mouth but did not have it down deep in his lungs like the pilot did so he did not breed it as long as the as the pilot did okay all right well thanks for uh uh elucidating this issue especially with the regards to co uh the co poisoning and how it how it would persist and one of the other risk factors and stuff like that very interesting i appreciate that my pleasure scott thank you for having me all right i just want to thank dr blue for uh talking to us about co poisoning and some of the other medical issues i really appreciate that and the other one i wanted to talk about was the some of the the faa reaction i guess they knew what the final report is they've already talked about it and they've come up with a plan and they've been implementing that plan since about december of uh last year so uh in december of last year they issued a notice to this is a summary of the different things that they're doing and their plan of action uh they issued a notice that required the inspection of 100 of all living history flight experience exemption holders prior to the close of fiscal 2021 so as of now they've got until the end of september to do that produce new lhfe oversight guidance for the inspector workforce and that was published in december of 2020 as well the they developed an inspector training course within the fa academy this course is in its final stages with an expected rollout of early may this month in 2021 and that course is going to be more in depth on how to properly do the job of maintaining oversight over lhfe organizations they conducted a webinar for all lhfe fl holders exemption holders in january of 2021 to brief the industry of the upcoming oversight enhancements and they usually do this at a national orbit operators conference in wak [Music] they completed the lms hfe inspector training course which they were talking about before continues to commit resources to work with lhfe exemption holders however events orion and code have slowed the onboarding inspection process for new additions to the lhfe fleet uh continues inclusion of the industry participation and implementation of mandates imposed by section 532 of the 2018 faa reauthorization act i'm not really sure what that means i'll check into it is currently training inspectors one-on-one in lhfe oversight we'll meet with industry groups uh i guess this has happened already in march with three additional meetings planned for sun and fun which just happened uh air venture in 20 in july and then i cast the international council of air shows which is the air show meeting in december in vegas and everybody involved in their shows in particular the warbirds are going to be there and they're going to talk about the the different uh programs that they're doing action items that's called the office that deals with this is called afx 800 they assigned two inspectors to visit maintenance facility the collings foundation maintenance facility and review other collings aircraft and due to the gross violations of the collings exemption afs 500 revoked the lhfe for collings foundation they asked for reinstatement and it was denied and that's the way it sits right now collins does not have an lfh lhfe exemption anymore uh so that start from square one and apparently they have bought a b17 to replace 909 afx has identified the fizdos who will monitor other lhfe operators and what i am my take on this is is they're not going to have every if fizdo if that lhfe operates within their fisdo they're going to be in charge of it apparently they're going to only designate a few fisdos to have oversight over the lhfe operators so it kind of takes a little bit out of the fisdo hands at least the local fizdo fx has made lhfe operations a special interest item and has added regular surveillance to their inspectors and their guidance okay they have stated that this accident this is the position the faa that this accident the colleagues accident does not emulate other lhfe operators and their intention is to not kill the lhfe program which i think is good news sounds like they're doing some stuff to tighten it up and hopefully they're involved in industry instead of just briefing them on this so that's good news and i thought you might be interested in the update so hope you enjoyed the video and uh well we'll see you next time on flywire

Channel: FlyWire- scott perdue

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Keywords: b 17 crash, b 17 909 crash update, FAA reaction, Dr Blue, Flywire, flywire online, flywire youtube, scott perdue, beechcraft bonanza, general aviation, Aviation, F33C, F33 Bonanza, A36 Bonanza, V35 Bonanza, Aerobatic Bonanza, Aerobatics, Acrobatics, Flying, pilot vlog, flight training, flying vlog, cockpit, airplane audio, cfi, pilot life, bonanza, private pilot, commercial pilot, airline pilot, ATP, pilot, atc, travel, travel by plane, flying an airplane, flywire- scott purdue

Id: BANDvF9V4bk

Length: 16min 47sec (1007 seconds)

Published: Sun May 02 2021