308 Velocity: SHORT -vs- LONG (16" -vs- 24")

[Music] Shorty's back and in this video guy's going to walk through some performance data Gavin you here from Ultimate reloader.com I'm back with guy minor thank you guy for joining us again it's good to be here this is a fun one a while back I built shorty the 16 inch 308 compact suppressed rifle we've been having a ton of fun with it as a follow-on tell us about what we're going to do in this video well in this video we're going to review your build okay okay got to go over that stuff again and talk about some of the highlights of the build some of the products that were used and some techniques that you had to do to make this little tiny barrel work then we're going to explore hydrogen's pistol data for the 308 Winchester I bet you didn't know that existed because I didn't know that existed until guys showed that to me yeah it's a great source of info for shorter barrels like this very cool and we'll get into that and then the test results of several different types of ammunition both hand loaded and Factory ammo we can compare them between the 24 inch barrel on my rifle and the 16 inch barrel and shorty it's uh interesting differences and not necessarily a disaster right oh yeah we've seen green machine here on the channel in different forms different stock different configs and and that kind of thing I think even different Optics if I remember correctly and then there's shorties let's talk about shorty real quick okay so this was a recent build I wanted to do something really compact uh kind of along the lines of a Scout rifle but really really short barrel right at 16 inches we did a pole on that and over 4 500 of you all voted and the overwhelming majority wanted to see 16. I think the options I gave were 16 18 and 20 inch barrel options so this is built around a bat igniter action which is kind of like the TR action that you've seen here on the channel but a bit more affordable it doesn't have an integral rail it has a separate rail but a lot of the same attributes are are going to be familiar it also has a traditional style hanger instead of the removable hanger that you can load up cartridge style and we've got a benchmark Barrel Foundation Dominion stock trigger Tech special trigger just a really really nice package and the foundation Dominion if you've if you've been watching the channel you've seen the Genesis 2. it's a heavy PRS oriented stock this is a bit more compact this is a bit more lightweight it's got some cutouts right down here that you're going to see right there to reduce weight and it's just a really nice package and it's got that familiar characteristics and the familiar feel of Micarta which is a little different isn't it yes it feels very solid it's a good feeling and that stock I found incredibly comfortable to shoot so that that was really nice yep it's just kind of it's kind of a really nice feeling we do have a complete story on the Dominion you're going to want to check that out as well okay so another nice aspect of this build and and what makes it compact is the Hawkins Precision Hunter dbm this bottom metal features a release that's right here inside the trigger guard it takes a fair bit of force you're not going to accidentally drop your mag even if you've got gloves on and you sort of run your finger up against that and the hunter mag this is an aluminum mag this is CNC machined and it goes up into the bottom of the rifle almost flush but it leaves you enough to to grip it when you go to pull it out right so I'm a huge fan of the Hawkins Precision Hunter mag and the hunter dbm really really good stuff and again we've got the full store that goes through the build and some of the initial shooting that we did with that then we have the banish 30. and again we have this really in-depth story we put it on the recoil rig we ran the seven inch config and the nine inch config this is the seven inch config without the extension which I specifically wanted on a compact Rifle right right of course you sit down now you were noting something about the overall lengths on these rifles that is really interesting let me get these kind of next to each other yeah with with the suppressor on here shorty measures 42 inches overall length and the old green machine 44 inches two inch two inch difference yep so even with the suppressor you've got a more compact rifle than I do and if you threw a brake on here or a suppressor obviously it's a traditional thing it just kind of hangs even further out yep so kind of an interesting uh an interesting package and uh and so yeah the the bandage 30 is kind of one of our favorites we've seen it in a number of different uh rifle configurations and with different calibers as well okay so tell us about this pistol data this is stuff that I ran across years ago when I was contemplating buying or building one of those specialty bolt action pistols in a rifle cartridge I never did that but I saw the the data and it's not in all of hodgson's annual manuals the print ones but it's on there online the Reloading Data yes and so when you go there don't go clicking over on rifle to find your 308 so click on pistol and scroll down to to 308 or 7 millimeter 08 or there's a bunch of them really yeah okay there's a bunch of them in there and they're all in 15 inch barrels which is very typical for those specialty pistols and the data that was predicted in that is pretty darn close to what we managed to achieve nice okay so let's talk about chronograph results then right we took five different types of ammo two hand loads and three Factory loads and ran them through both the 24 inch barrel and the 16 inch barreled rifle which was a lot of fun I hadn't done a lot of shooting in a while that was that was a fair bit of ammo we burned up that day and I enjoyed that so the one that is well worth mentioning again we've used it before is hornady's 168 grain Factory ammo with their Amax bullet and because that has shot so very accurately for us I think that's what we have on this target here oh yeah take a look at that factory m demo this was during the break-in if I remember correctly right yeah you shot better than I did that day these are my day both of guys groups that he shot kind of back to back yeah 0.460 and 0.458 very nice and yeah I was very happy with that and so with our short barrel we're looking at 2506 feet per second that's our average and in the longer Barrel my 24 inch we picked up 200 feet per second we're at 27 11 which is right where I expect 168 grain 308 round to be from that Barrel from that rifle works out great um it just occurs to me here the one in eight Bart line with a 30 cal I'm wondering about doing 30 cal Subs with this right I think we had mentioned that previously yes and I think we should do that we've got we've got one and eight on our 300 Blackout if I remember correctly so we should be able to take those same berries 220 grain plated bullets load them in 308 and kind of like the fun that we had with the Henry 3030 you know push those guys through shorty and have all sorts of fun up up on the steel on the steel targets yeah why not perfect rig for that why not and so it looks like about a couple hundred feet per second yeah and that held true with all the roads between the two rifles right so you've got eight inches difference in barrel length that's about 200 feet per second about 25 feet per second per inch and uh that's an interesting you know and that's just an average and I know the two barrels are are different in many other ways but the big difference on the velocity comes from the length sure so that makes total sense yeah yeah I tried to tried the horny's uh tap their Tactical application police 155 grain Amax I actually expected a little more velocity out of it and I didn't get it was very minimally faster than the 168s but it's a very easy load to show per second faster and shorty yeah that is that is a little surprising but you never know until I thought it would be I thought it would be a little Zippy right but it wasn't and then I had a box of the military m118 with 175 grain bullet and that's pretty slow but it's a good bullet for carrying out there at distance it goes transonic a lot better than the traditional 168s gotcha yeah um 2400 2439 out of shorty which I think is respectable for 175 grain bullet and then 26 and a half 26.58 of the longer Barrel tried some of these bullets we got from Mid-South oh yeah these 168s right and I like them they're accurate they're easy to load I suspect they're made by one of the big makers and they offer them at a pretty good discount there at Mid-South yeah kind of nice yep um 2713 feet per second out of the little guy whoa yeah that got my attention now that was a Max load 46 grains of Varget safe in my rifle yeah that's one of those things you need to work up to okay and what's interesting there is that you know that was the performance you got out of the longer right with the factory right yeah with the 168 yeah so you you as a hand loader can work up that for your short barreled 308 and have kind of a Zinger it's a it's a pretty good moving round and of course we've got even more out of the longer Barrel yeah that's that's pushing pretty good up there 2 900 feet per second out of a 308 with a 168. yeah then then I got into uh I really like sometimes to use a short stubby bullet in a 308 reduces recoil bumps up velocity works great on deer we don't necessarily need a Gob of penetration but I use the 125 grain Nosler ballistic tip you could also use their accubond you could use the other companies make it Barnes makes a really nice 130 grain ttsx you can use any of those and again shorty came up with 2905 feet per second that's awesome that's moving now I know it's a lightweight little bullet but I've seen it absolutely pancake a white tail buck I think that'd be effective on rock chucks if that was the rifle and that was the load that you had around right I'm pretty sure it would be and uh what do you think we've got another month or so before there's very many Rock checks running around here yeah maybe a month and a half yeah yep it's a limited time frame and then yeah they'll come out and we'll say hi to them yeah hello so 200 feet per second difference roughly and so that's what you're giving up on with the little guy the short barrel version but you're gaining a much handier package so if you're hunting from say a deer blind where there's little very little room to maneuver inside well the long-barreled rifles get a little unwieldy and Shorty would be perfect for that absolutely and in close quarters you know it's it's always nice with the suppressor if you're going through dense brush or something like that to not have as much hanging out there and snagging on things and yeah exactly yeah so a little shorter package there and you you do give up some velocity but not enough to make it a problem sure yeah it's all depending on what your priorities are right exactly yeah looking at bullets for the short-barreled ones I kind of alluded to that a little bit earlier I like to keep the bullets lighter for hunting to keep the velocity up and you know I'm not talking long range 600 yard shooting of you dear I'm talking more typical deer hunting ranges out to 300 350 yards I've only shot one that was at 400. you know so yeah that hasn't been brought but keeping the bullets a little bit lighter helps you keep that velocity up and I don't think I'd pass up this Buck either well yeah yeah he's a good looking guy he is 150s 130s the ttsx that's uh yeah an interesting comp copper being lighter inherently for the bullet size yeah and it's a it's a tough bullet I know guys that consider it a genuine elk bullet oh wow yeah it is the penetration on those on those copper bullets is phenomenal so yeah I think we've already talked about some of our conclusions they sort of crept in there yeah um velocity loss sure yep but okay I can live with that right um applications hunting from a blind or a stand as you know 12 years as a leader of the schlang County SWAT sniper team most of my calls were in Fairly urban areas and I would have loved a shorter rifle I could have just taken a couple inches off mine but yeah this uh the little rifle you built here would be just about perfect for that nice yeah I think it's nice to have a multiple three eights on hand first of all right and it's really a choice uh regarding do you want the velocity or do you want the compactness and a lot of what's going to govern that decision might be whether a suppressor is is in scope for you right if you're not going to run a suppressor sure you can deal with a little bit more barrel length Now remind me what was the barrel length on the green machine 24 inches 24 yeah and I was 42 would be a good oh sure compromise yeah very much so yeah and I was shooting a lot of 600 yards and 600 meter matches in those days and I kind of like that extra little bit of velocity and a little more Barrel weight out there to kind of help it hang on target so that was that was all part of the thought process yeah but if I've got to jump into the side by side and and hold on to a rifle while I'm driving and then jump out yeah Shorty's gonna be my pick because I do like to run suppressed you know whatever yeah yep it's it's great and it really you know the suppressor makes that little rifle so easy to shoot you know it just enhances everything you did on that build um I like suppressors you know another thing that I really liked that we didn't really talk about too much is this Aries BTR gen 2. you know the the clarity of it and then just the I found the the reticle particularly useful and then its first focal plane which is also really nice as as an attribute yes so rounds out the package nicely our question for you is what do you think between the option of shorty uh with the suppressor coming in at a shorter overall length or a more traditional 308 with the 24 inch barrel yielding pretty much full performance potential what would be your pick or if you were going to build your own compact 308 what barrel length would you go with what suppressor would you go with and then finally what about the lows there's so many different 30 caliber bullet weights to pick from different charge levels supersonic subsonic tell us what you would shoot and tell us what you would shoot it in thanks again guy for putting this data together thank you really fun project it was fine and I've loved the 308 for many many years so it was it was good to work with two nice 308 rifles it's a classic it's a cartridge that concludes this video and that means it's time to wrap it up I hope you enjoyed this video don't forget to like And subscribe also we're on Facebook YouTube Rumble where we've got unrestricted content and Instagram make sure to follow us on all those channels ultimate reloader also has a commercial Solutions division serving law enforcement the military and the gun industry we have some unique capabilities including a comprehensive Suite of recoil testing and evaluation capabilities trigger profiling and more if you're interested in custom rifles like what we build here on the channel or Gunsmithing Services you're going to want to go to rifles.ultimate reloader.com and get on the waitlist if you're interested in becoming a professional gunsmith check out the Sonoran Desert Institute they've got a degree program they've got a certificate program and you can study from home learn more at sdi.edu thanks again for watching [Applause]

Channel: Ultimate Reloader

Views: 214,231

Keywords: 30-30, 308, 308 shorty, 308 Winchester, A-Max, Athlon, Athlon Ares Gen 2, Ballistics, BANISH 30, Barnes, Bat Action, BAT igniter action, Bear Hunting, Benchmark, Benchmark barrel, Berger, Big Game Hunting, Bolt Action Rifle, Cerakote, Foundation Dominion, Foundation Stocks, Hawkins Hunter Magazine and bottom metal, Hawkins Precision

Id: S9kqwf8DXys

Length: 17min 0sec (1020 seconds)

Published: Sat Apr 22 2023