What I Now Know About Fasting & Keto After 7 Years

you have all kinds of different hunger cues that are coming in and I'm very strategic about how people break their fasts with protein to try to curb that that hunger so they're more satiated so that they're not rolling into their next meal the blood sugar crash that's making them want to you know eat everything in sight the benefits of intermittent fasting why is this something worth doing everybody's talking about it there's a lot of debate right intermittent fasting is a is a tool it's it's magic it does nothing at all help us sort of like parse um fact from fiction and and arrive at the truth about intermittent fasting I want to mention I popped the 30 off discount link down below for Thrive market now Thrive Market is an online grocery store but it's not like a regular grocery store it's set up by different diet categories okay so you've got keto you've got vegan you've got paleo you've got different diet categories so it allows you to get the best quality foods okay no preservatives no garbage you can stock up your whole house not just your pantry they have sustainable Meat and seafood options so you can stock up your fridge they're working on really cool options as well so you're looking at just everything you can get in a store essentially that's going to be in Frozen or in the regular section delivered to your doorstep and with this link you save 30 off your entire first grocery order plus a free 50 gift so I've also created My fasting bundle which is things that I recommend people get for breaking their fast and also for sustaining their eating period with the right kind of foods so that link is in the top line in the description right below this video I definitely recommend you check them out they are a sponsor on this channel but they have been for like five or six years now and it is definitely where you want to be going as pretty much your One-Stop shop almost entirely your One-Stop shop for what you can get delivered to your doorstep for your intermittent fasting routine yeah I think you know we can come back to a very basic level you know when I lost 110 pounds for me nothing else really worked except for that so it would be easy for me to get on a high horse and say fasting is Magic but it's not magic right it is at the end of the day a form of caloric restriction but with it comes fairly unique properties that are I think fairly unique to intermittent fasting and now I think the big reason it works for such a large amount of people in terms of weight loss is because it's very black and white I mean so I get the easy stuff out of the way right we can go deep into the biochemistry we can absolutely can but I think for a lot of people they're just wired that way where it's easy to say I'm not going to eat for x amount of time and when you look at the big equation where people yeah like if you want to lose weight unfortunately as unsexy as it sounds yes you have to be in a deficit well intermittent fasting can put you in that deficit in a little bit of an easier way for me that worked I liked food I had serious food addictions I became overweight because I was an endurance athlete and then I had some injuries and I continued to eat like I was an athlete and I was sedentary and I was working kind of you know corporate Healthcare job and you know ballooned up to 300 pounds it was hard for me to kick the eating period but if I put myself in a box and I was saying okay I'm not going to eat for 16 hours you know sleep and then I'm gonna skip breakfast it just worked because I just simply couldn't eat that much in the afternoon I just I mean I didn't want to Gorge myself so getting the basic stuff out in the open I think that's the reason people have success with it now anytime people have success with something they want to shout from the rooftops right so I don't fault people for saying hey yeah it's magic it works it works because these people that have battled with you know being overweight for 10 20 30 years and suddenly find something that works for them great but with that you know we're starting to see so many other benefits that can also come into play and I think the benefits that I talk about the most are like the cognitive benefits and that's why I continue to do it people ask me okay you're already in shape now why do you continue to do it because it makes my brain feel really really good and it makes me feel sharp and I'm on camera all the time so I feel astute I feel sharp I feel like I can articulate things better when I am deeper in a fast um and again we can get into the biochemistry of it and I'm sure we will but I think you know those are the big benefits and then as we're starting to look at some of the more research as far as like NAD goes as far as what are called sirtuins there's some interesting longevity attributes but those largely come from the fact that when you are fasting it is a stressor and people forget that that fasting is a stressor and when you introduce a stressor to your body just like working out you have an adaptation you go to the gym you lift weights the adaptation is you get stronger you get more fit you get more cardiovascularly fit well with fasting you train your body to become more efficient it learns to do more with less and that is a very good thing for the body for health cells function for autophagy for longevity I mean you look at almost all of the research when you look at the blue zones and things like that for longevity as much as people might want to poke holes in the blue zones the common denominator with a lot of those is they eat less right and when you get your body into this efficient State yeah it can be very beneficial for a longevity Point yeah they're they're eating I mean they're doing a bunch of different things there's so many variables right that they're that they're doing differently in those in those blue zones and blue zones are not the only parts of the world where people are aging successfully either it's just I mean I always think about the blue zones is this like cherry-picked um you know for whatever reason uh community of of of of locales that are um largely plant-based I mean to me that it kind of fits a narrative but you're right they're not eating 16 hours a day like you're average American 100 yeah so what are your how does it what does this look like for you then like how does it work what what like what what are your eating hours what's your fasting window look like yeah you know so I'm a little bit different with fasting right when people look at intermittent fasting they initially say okay well I'm gonna fast for 16 hours every day I could poke some holes in that I talked about that on my channel quite a bit because once you start fasting every single day you're essentially just putting yourself into a normal state of caloric restriction anyway right so I encourage people to view fasting as the anomaly fasting should remain that stressor right because if you want fast you want the benefits of fasting that come potentially outside of caloric restriction are coming from the fact that you are inflicting stress upon the body just enough to trigger adaptation well if you're fasting every day you're going to adapt to that it's just like if you were to go and do squats with 225 every day eventually you're not going to grow from squats at 225 anymore right but with fasting it doesn't mean that you have to continually increase the length of your fast it means that you need to be doing it infrequently enough that it remains a stressor it should still remain relatively difficult so for me I tend to fast two to three days a week and usually do like 20 or 22 hour fasts wow so I'll do like you know one to two meals per day on those days and rather really Consolidated Windows um I get I get very nuancy with it in terms of the times of day and circadian rhythms and stuff like that which again it's nerd out like crazy on my channel but yeah so with that it's my schedule is usually two or three days a week that I'll be fasting pretty aggressive lengths pretty strict food that I'm eating those days and then the other days of the week I'm pretty relaxed I mean I typically follow lower carb keto kind of transition maybe more paleo depending on the time of year and what I'm going for but yeah it's it remains kind of an anomaly so you see people that do 16-8 where they fast for 16 hours every single day which works well for them but unfortunately a lot of times after a year or so they start reaching this point where they stop having success with that and they get frustrated I think it's worth mentioning also that you can be fasting and not necessarily be in a calorie deficit right and you could you could you could potentially be in a calorie Surplus if you're going overboard with your food right during the during the feeding window 100 yeah 100 and it happens quicker than people think especially with like a low carb high fat protocol like if someone's doing keto along with fasting I don't think people realize how calorically dense high fat foods are right so even if you're eating macadamia nuts which are largely very healthy and very good for you it's anyone that's had a handful of macadamia nuts knows that's a lot of calories right like yeah yeah that's a lot so the nuts are so easy to over consume they're one of the most if not the most calorie dense Whole Foods that exist right like I mean generally we tend to say in the wellness industry like Whole Foods are better than Ultra processed foods because they don't have the calorie density that you see in Ultra processed foods but I feel like nuts are kind of the exception and it's and then and I think the reason for that is that nuts we don't have to Shell them ourselves right like if you actually have to Shell nuts yourself or or grow how do you pick them I guess yeah pick yourself and then and then shell them you probably you know you probably end up eating a lot less of them yeah no I totally agree and I think it's that way with a lot of the keto Foods right it's because it's so it's becoming more processed and also becoming more hyper palatable so we're running ourselves into the same situation we would with the standard American diet compared to the keto diet it's like you're still going to be in this massive Surplus if you don't keep it under control and yeah it's very easy even with intermittent fasting to say okay yeah well I'm gonna go ahead and I feel good or or again you have all kinds of different hunger cues that are coming in and I'm very strategic about how people break their fasts with protein to try to curb that that hunger so they're more satiated so that they're not rolling into their next meal with a blood sugar crash that's making them want to you know eat everything in sight right so the first the first meal the meal that you break your fast with it's wise to prioritize protein you're seven percent yeah that's that's definitely my big thing is you know no matter which way you go about it if you're plant-based find a plant-based way if you're not I usually say you know lean protein lean chicken lean you know lean fish I usually say don't introduce the red meat until later on like try to go something very lean and high in protein and basically I mean you're killing two birds with one stone with that you're giving your body what it needs you know you're ending the fast abruptly giving it the fuel that it needs to rebuild because yes you've just been fastening for x amount of hours your body is in a pretty catabolic breakdown State and you want to be able to kind of stop that okay but the other side of the equation is also just the satiety and it makes it so that 30 60 90 minutes later when you go and have a larger meal you're going to make a better decision I mean the worst thing you can do is say I'm going to fast until I go out to dinner with some friends like no that's like Oracle grocery shopping right like when you load up with a bunch of stuff you don't really want to get exactly I love by the way you're so good at breaking down the science I could see I can see why you're you're such a phenomenon on on YouTube it's like you're you're a walking like meta-analysis yeah which is which is awesome um I love that you mentioned the the fact that fasting is a sort of stressor on the body but talk about maybe like the hormonal effects right because I feel like you know we tend to be more insulin sensitive earlier in the day right like those so there are some benefits to time restricted eating yep but it seems the research seems to point to early time restricted feeding dude I love that you just said that yeah it's it's like this sort of important distinction that you don't often hear get made especially when people are bashing uh timer started eating and and intermittent fasting so glad I can't even believe it's like so weird that you're saying this I just don't know like that's what we've been filming for like the last two weeks is content on that that hasn't even released and that is a huge thing and when you look at the so there was a relatively recent study that was published in the New England medical journal uh or new Journal of medicines are that took a look at intermittent fasting versus caloric restriction and the consensus of that study was there was no statistical significance when it came down to the difference between caloric restriction via intermittent fasting and standard caloric restriction well that was like a big punch in the face to a lot of the fasting Community they felt like they were you know oh my gosh this is this is crazy have I been doing things well when you actually look at the data there's a difference between a a meaningful difference and be a significant difference when you're looking at statistics so uh there was a no statistically significant difference between the two but there was actually a meaningful difference between the two and I'm just getting this off the table first because it I know people are probably wondering if they're intermittent fasting people and most of the data for the intermittent fasting was still like a pretty significant amount ahead of the caloric restriction data right it's like there was more weight loss there was better fasting glucose okay great so even if they are six and one half dozen in the other we're still at the same point we're still finding out that okay well great they're both good one isn't bad one isn't great they're both good okay so however you want to get there but one of the confounders that my team and I were really looking at we were like okay there's no real studies that are comparing caloric restriction with early time restricted feed right they're all looking almost every single intermittent fasting versus caloric restriction study is looking at intermittent fasting with the calories Consolidated to the afternoon or the latter part of the day when you look at how the circadian rhythms work just in general we have so many environmental cues that are coming at us during the daytime telling us to be awake eating is one of those right now the vast majority of people including people that are intermittent fasting are consolidating a good portion of their calories to the evening hours after dark right when all your environmental cues are saying go to sleep and we should be kind of limiting how much we're eating and if you start looking at the data with early time restricted feeding where people are maybe skipping dinner instead of skipping breakfast it's really interesting like there was a 2022 study I can't remember where it was published but it's brand new it was like in February that compared early time restricted feeding to midday time-restricted feeding we're talking like a negligible difference in time I shouldn't say negligible but a very like to most people not a huge difference like ending eating by like 1 pm versus ending eating by like 4 P.M and even the differences between those two fasting groups were hugely skewed towards being more beneficial with early time restricted feeding wow and that has to do with like you mentioned you're more insulin sensitive in the morning so you have ability to deal with the food that you're consuming better and put it to better use as the day goes on you become more insulin resistant slowly so the food that you do take in the afternoon in the evening you are less likely to utilize as fuel and more likely to store so it makes sense that yes that would make sense to have more calories Consolidated in the morning and so when we're looking at all these intermittent fasting studies it's like wow I think we really need to be comparing Apples to Apples here because if we're looking at caloric restriction versus intermittent fasting and people are eating in the afternoon and evening that's not an accurate representation of what the benefits of intermittent fasting can provide that's an accurate representation of what I have considered to be the standard American diet version of intermittent fasting which is still crap food eaten at crappy times yeah yeah yeah and I think like I mean at least for me when I first heard about intermittent fasting my the presumption was that the window didn't matter right like if I was eating I could you know because I think I began with a with an eight hour window um I thought that it was it was fine to eat between the hours of 2 p.m and 10 p.m right and I think that's it tends to be easiest to skew the eating window later because dinner is our most social meal right um and so I think that that's that's an important like point to make is that like the window like where where it's placed within the day matters yeah it definitely does and I encourage people to rotate the times of day in which they fast so let's pretend for a second that fasting does cast amazing benefits During the period of the fast okay I'm not going to say with certainty that it does I'm going to say let's hypothetically assume that intermittent fasting during your fasting period you're getting a myriad of benefits that are occurring during the actual fasting period why wouldn't you want that fasting period to be throughout different times of the day why wouldn't you want to cast the benefits of a fasting period and sprinkle those benefits throughout different periods of the day when you have different hormonal responses and different things happening oh I want the benefits of fasting during the morning I want the benefits of fasting during the evening I want the benefits of fasting during my sleep because if there is this trickle-down effect that happens with gene expression and different hormone Cascades that are going to occur I want to experience it in all different times so I usually encourage people to like hey yeah go ahead and Skip breakfast but then two days later try skipping dinner and switch it up and to sound pretty like basic you know keep your body guessing I hate saying that because you're never really keeping your body guessing the body does a really good job of keeping ahead of that but yeah I mean shock it a little bit do different things don't just fast during the same hours switch it up all the time it's a bit a bit tangential but uh is that that notion that you got to keep your body guessing in the context of fitness and workouts because I've been debunked at this point or is that still something that like as a fitness expert I mean do you are you going to the gym trying to keep your body guessing with every workout that's a good question because I wouldn't say I'm trying to keep my body guessing but I'm trying to always touch on new things like you don't I don't think you're going to keep your body guessing because it's the job of the body to really figure it out right so it's more so keeping your body training I mean you're training a new thing right so yeah when I go to the gym I don't say haha my my it's Thursday my body thinks that I'm going to train quads so I'm going to shock it and I'm going to train shoulders like it has no idea it's not going to be a shock system back up we're doing this right it's like so I don't necessarily think that it's incorrect but I also don't think that it's right either because in the context of training you do kind of want to keep your body guessing because you don't want to just go in and train the same thing over and over and over again and in the very context of a hormetic stressor itself you should view things as a stressor so once you develop an adaptation to a stressor it ceases to be a stressor yeah exactly it's no longer a stressor it's like you're thinking of it as okay well this is stress here I'm gonna whatever but is it really that stressful it's like if you go for a run and you start getting good at running you're like well running's easy now like okay good it's time to change it up like or you get back from your run you're like that run was really effing hard like I'm sucking at running no that hard run that was good like it should be hard X number of days per week or and the same kind of thing with your diet like I don't think people need to live in like a terrible thing where they don't enjoy their food and because I think that's a big part of life is being able to enjoy our food at least as a human right but occasionally the occasional suffering is probably a little bit of a good thing right just like with working out the occasional suffering is probably going to lead to better adaptation absolutely without a little bit of stress you you're gonna I think we're you'll end up like one of those characters at the end of Wally you ever see that movie oh yeah where they're just like all stressors have been removed they don't even have to walk anymore and they just become these big bloated balloon type characters it's not what we want yep I've referenced that in many videos going around the People Movers you just saying nothing nothing to worry about and everything like that and it's like in the context of a competition like if you take someone that's training for something like competition itself in athletics is really kind of a deload week it really is a deloading phase like you're not really your training should be higher intensity than your competition right so in a lot of ways when you reach Peak Performance and competition you're still not even reaching the same well maybe you will at certain touch points but training is supposed to be a demand right it's supposed to be this demand that allows you to grow so that when you are are competing you are in your glory phase if every you should it should hurt when you're competing but you should also be like if you're running a marathon you want to be able to confidently be able to push it and your level of stress should be matched or maybe even a little bit less than when you're training so that you can you know have the flexibility to change when things things change with competition right with training it's pretty linear with competition you don't know what's coming at you with training you have know a little bit more of what's coming at you we can go very tangential we could go down forever with that but it's interesting what was your sport you said you're an endurance athlete I was uh so I ran my first marathon when I was 11. so I was mainly just long distance Runner when I played rugby in high school and yeah then I messed up my knees when I was in my late teens and that was that that was that yeah in terms of diet you uh or are known for being a vocal sort of Keto Advocate um and the the benefits of like ketogenic diets but you mentioned that your diet has evolved and it's become a bit more maybe a less a bit less ketogenic yeah do you want to talk about that yeah like like your your sort of overall diet philosophy yeah for sure I think you know my diet philosophy is again comes back to the stressor piece right so the ketogenic diet I have so much so much thankfulness for that because just what it did and I'm so grateful for learning that and how it changed my life but when you start looking at the research it works great for weight loss but it also has huge benefits when it comes down to cognitive performance and it comes down to all these things which is what I pay attention to so keto's really become a tool in my toolbox I would say seven to eight months out of the year I'm ketogenic you know but I usually do two months on maybe a month off two months on one month off kind of thing and when I'm off I'm still very low carb I'm just much more a Paleo Approach you know really just to limit my grains and things like that um you know I wear this continuous glucose monitor all the time so I'm really my diet philosophy is keeping my glucose within a healthy range period right that's that's number one and I've started to draw a correlation between whether I'm in a ketogenic state or not as long as my glucose is stable I really feel good I really feel good but with ketosis there's a lot of different things that come into play like there's more gene expression so I mean there's better effects in being able to have neural adaptation and for me like the brain being able to run on simultaneously you know glucose and ketones there's pretty decent evidence with fmri scans that when people are in ketosis they're having more brain energetics and they're having better what's called Network stability where regions of the brain are able to communicate better with one another neurotransmittal function is better so that's where I come to say okay I do think that we have been designed as humans to periodically go in and out of ketosis obviously I mean we have a mechanism for it so we're designed for that right so I think that by permanently keeping ourselves out of it I don't think it's dangerous by not being in ketosis but I think we might be doing ourselves a disservice when it comes down to Optimal Performance because once again it's a stressor and even with ketosis let's hypothetically my performance is fine on ketosis I don't see a change in anaerobic performance I don't see a change in strength I might see a change in like sprinting like things like that where it's kind of a combo but when I look at that I say okay let's say even if my training did suffer when I'm in a low-carb ketogenic state okay that's just an additional stressor and then when I am potentially out of ketosis then I'm stronger right it's just like training fasted if you're training with no fuel in the tank you adapt to that so then when you do have fuel in the tank you'll Excel even more it's all about training under stress and being to put yourself under stress and one of the benefits of a ketogenic diet is yeah you have a big increase in specific oxidative stressors when you are in ketosis that allow your body to adapt you know there's a transcription Factor called fox03 and foxo3 is designed to allow your body to become more resilient it casts sort of an effect upon various genes that Express that make your cells stronger and it's just like fasting like when you're stressing your body through a temporary ketogenic shape you're eliciting all these effects but the reason that I like doing periods of ketosis is because I'm getting effects of fasting without putting myself in a caloric deficit so I can stay at maintenance level maintain my muscle mass but still have a subset of the effects that I would get from fasting interesting where does your interest in in like the cognitive side of things super high oh obviously yeah I mean that is what I'm super into right now I would say um it started out personally because when I'm filming videos like it's very biochemistry dense and I get performance anxiety myself just like any athlete would like but when I'm filming like there's a lot of stuff that I really have to cover and I have to go pretty dense and if I'm not really in the mode then the videos come out crappy right I have to be able to like articulate things well so it started as that way I'm like I started getting really particular about what I was eating days before filming days and how I went through this whole cycle to okay I'm at a fast X day get my ketones level Ketone level is very high this day yada yada so that when it comes filming day like my brain is just on fire and then I started realizing well wait a minute like okay there's obviously something here so then you know I have some military contracts I work with with special operations and them in particular they were like looking at these kind of things like how do we maximize brain performance without really hurting our anaerobic performance for whatever situations whether it be combat or more often than not it's just training just being able to train and not lose that performance so that kind of piqued my curiosity more be like how can I look into this more um there's a lot of evidence when it comes down to like neurodegenerative diseases with fasting and keto I would be lying if I would say that I was like super interested in that I I am I think it's very interesting and I want to help a lot of people with that but from a personal side of things I'm just all about like what are ways that I can perform better that I can actually attribute to something you know and so really from a performance side yeah I mean you're you're an athlete I mean in in many ways right like you're an athlete in terms of like your physicality and and athleticism but also a cognitive athlete right like you've got your you have a high demand job you've always got to be delivering with regard to your YouTube content with regard to your I don't know coaching everything yeah definitely yeah so the the keto stuff um definitely definitely sounds like it can help um but what about like I mean isn't there you know when people go on ketogenic diets they lose weight they lose a lot of like uh water weight because the the glyc you know there's glycogen depletion in the muscles do you feel like there's a you don't see any like physical downside because I know that like people who are like you know bodybuilders for example or like you know athletes who are like actively engaged in in sports right it's like isn't the ketogenic diet known to not be optimal for for that level of physical performance it depends on what level of physical performance and yes there's always a downside right there's a downside to everything right there's the downside with carbohydrates are that you're not getting as much fatty acid oxidation you know it's like right so there's like there's downsides to everything so I'm never one to say that the ketogenic diet is going to be superior to one thing or another I also feel you know just to back up for one second that epigenetically and how we are built bio-individually may play a huge role probably plays a huge role in what diet works best for us right so if someone is just has more ppar alpha or has more of these nuclear receptor proteins that allow them to be adapted to fats easier they're probably going to do better there's also people that are better carboxidizer so I really firmly believe that there are people that thrive on a ketogenic diet and people that don't and that's totally okay but I do think that dabbling back and forth is going to be a very good thing now as far as the weight loss is concerned uh yes there's an obvious dump in glycogen you know and water that is related to that glycogen storage so you have glycog carbohydrates stored in our muscles as soon as you start depleting those carbohydrates yes you're going to drain those you're going to drain the intercellular water that's along with them but very very quickly your body starts restoring glycogen levels from other substrates so what I mean by that is your body will break down proteins and my proteins I don't just mean your muscle I mean it'll deaminate protein from the protein that you eat and it'll take those amino acids and they'll go through gluconeogenesis and turn into glucose so there's some studies even the virta health study that shows that like after six months a year 18 months and then up to two years glycogen levels in a ketogenic athlete are just as high as they are in a carb-fueled athlete interesting so the body just creates glycogen from other substrates it can even create it from what are called glycerol backgrounds the fatty acid backbone of fat like when you take fat out of your tissue it breaks that fat down into fatty acids in a glycerol molecule the fatty acids go and ultimately get oxidized and used as fuel while the glycerol backbone is like I have nowhere to go so it goes to the liver and the liver converts the glycerol backbone into glucose so we are literally creating carbohydrates from other substrates so you're never in carbohydrate deprivation you're in dietary carbohydrate deprivation but you're not in literal glucose deprivate patient glucose is very important your brain runs on glucose predominantly it's the primary fuel within our body so no one in the ketogenic community that is reputable operative or reputable or credible is going to tell you that glucose isn't important or that the cells don't need glucose I would be the first to tell you that and so when the cells will utilize glucose but they'll create glucose from other substrates so when it comes down to the ketogenic athlete someone that has been in ketosis for a year or a year and a half is going to compare very similarly at least not statistically different to someone that is fueled on carbs that being said someone that is just starting the ketogenic diet for maybe the first six months they will see a decline in performance compared to the person that is carb fueled which makes it very difficult for professional athletes because they can't afford to take six months of having a 10 drop in performance so you see people like I mean I've worked with a lot of athletes like Noah syndergaard you know is an amazing one he's the starting pitcher for the Angels you know he's a huge keto guy right it's you know and a lot of these people have to like switch over to a ketogenic protocol in the off season so they give theirself time to get that fat adaptation but another way that you can get that fat adaptation is also through fasting so you're really like you know two ways of getting there and I mean it gets complicated and it gets again nuancy but from an athlete's perspective you're seeing a lot of the CrossFit Community same kind of thing they're starting to realize wait a minute like when I'm in this hybrid situation where I'm having to do a little bit of both crazy anaerobic and then go crazy aerobic endurance like they're finding that wait a minute I'm feeling better I'm talking to more and more CrossFit people every day you know that's like you know Dave Castro's a friend of mine and you know he's a big fasting guy he's interested in keto and all that you're starting to say Jason calipa you know obviously retired from Crossfit but he's just like I wish I knew about keto when I was competing because it's changed how he performs now and you're seeing more and more of it uh just because they're getting that dual fueled component you know when I say dual fuel just because you're in ketosis does not mean that carbs are going away it means your body's just creating carbs in a different way but now you're in a unique situation where your body has the ability to use both substrates instead of predominantly just one right and so is that 10 loss in performance recouped over time with a long enough adaptation period you know there's no studies to really show that specifically but when you look at you know anecdotally that's what happens and when you look at like the glycogen that's restored and when you look at it's been demonstrating endurance athletes but I don't think that endurance athletes are a fair assessment of that because they're going to be predominantly fat oxidizing anyway because of just the nature of what they're doing like fat oxidation lower intensity like if you were to go on a treadmill and run at 60 of your maximum heart rate you'd predominantly be utilizing fats because it's just beta oxidation so that's not necessarily a fair assessment but most people in the scientific Community would argue yes like people that are endurance athletes thrive on a ketogenic diet because it's giving them more available fuel um but yes the bottom line is that as you get fat adapted the lack of carbohydrates becomes less of an issue because your body has the ability to switch back and forth so it's that metabolic switching call it metabolic flexibility and one of the things that I kind of liken it to is if you were to go for a run right now on a flat ground and you were just cruising at a comfortable Pace but then all of a sudden you hit a hill okay as soon as you hit that Hill about you know 10 of the way up the hill you're going to start breathing heavy you're going to start going into you know potentially reach your lactate threshold if the Hill's steep enough but you're getting to a point where you're turning anaerobic where your body's running out of oxygen and now needs to utilize carbohydrates okay well in a person that is inefficient that transition would take a lot of time so it's like if you were to start running up that hill you might get winded for a minute or so and then finally catch up and be able to like cruise at that uphill Pace but a lot of times when you find people are metabolically flexible that transition time shrinks and if you ask me a level of Fitness in my personal opinion is not someone's ability to squat x amount of pounds or run X distance I think it's measurable by how fast they can switch back and forth I think that's a true Testament to someone's health and fitness is how good are you at doing both and how quickly can you switch back and forth from squatting to running up a hill to running five miles and again I liken it to work I do at the military it's like those guys they try to be well they try to be well-rounded and fit in that respect right so again it go on and on about it but yeah how do you measure it would you need like a metabolic cart to measure that that switch yeah that'd be a good question I mean you can look at okay the rate of fat oxidation for someone like if you take two people someone that's a carb diet someone that's a keto diet and the percentage of fat they're utilizing as as fuel how much their their rate of fatty acid oxidation will tell you a lot if they were under the same load the downside is all their previous training would take have to take and be taken into account so because someone's level of Fitness at Baseline makes a big difference so to really track it and say with absolute 100 certainty this is the case you'd have to have someone for like five years really have a baseline level of Fitness that is equal but then even comes into question like their epigenetic ability like what what's happened over their lifetime and what I mean by epigenetics this is where it gets wild it's like I was an endurance athlete when I was a very young kid I often wonder if I conditioned my cells and my mitochondria at a very young young age where epigenetically my cells become very efficient at using fats Flash Forward 20 years when I'm overweight or 15 years later when I'm overweight and I switch to a ketogenic diet and intermittent fasting my cells are like hey this is what we've been waiting for for the last 15 years man yes we're gonna work wow interesting now that's a theory because there's nothing to prove that but the world of epigenetics are fascinating how we what we do to our bodies dietarily uh Fitness wise workout wise stress wise dictates how our body the lens in which our body sees everything else yeah well you're I mean you're obviously super high performer and and you work with very high performing athletes but I you know for the rest of us and I'm including myself in that um talk about stress because it sounds like the ketogenic diet is a stress fasting is a stress exercise is stress how much stress is too much you know like you're you're eating a very low carb carbohydrate diet you're fasting you're doing high intensity exercise in the gym as you should be can't that ultimately take a toll on the body yes yes and it's something we cover a lot on my channel and it's it confuses people because just like you said it's like well when is too much wait you told me to do this now you're telling me not you know and also just the quelling of inflammation and things like that like I'll take an ice bath for an example like an ice bath is a very very good thing neurologically very very good thing for a number of different reasons but it's still a huge stressor right and it still can Crush inflammation down to such a low level that it can actually be detrimental like you could ice bath yourself to the point where you get sick right just like you've been over train to the point where you get sick you can over diet to the point that you get sick where do you draw the line it's different for each individual person but yeah you need to be periodizing all of these things and rotate your stressors right I would never recommend like I never recommend someone doing aggressive fast when they feel like they're getting sick you know oh I feel so run down well some the thought process of some people is oh fasting is good it's going to clean my cells up no well yes but it's still a stressor right it's still going to cause a problem and it's still going to suppress your immune system the idea is to do it when you are healthy so your body can rebound from it it's just the same kind of thing with training it's like why would you go in and do interval training to the max every single day you never give yourself a chance to actually recover and get stronger it's just hard for people that are wired in such a way where you know more is better to really do that so always switching it up and the same kind of thing with the ketogenic diet like my thought process on it there was a period the longest snent that I went with ketosis without ever taking a break was like two and a half years I went you know straight right wow felt great but actually like at the end of that two like two years to two and a half years I was getting sick again I was like starting to get sick I didn't get sick for like two years and then after that I was like the frequency of colds was increasing I'm like okay you know what my body is probably asking for something different and that's when I started realizing okay cycling in and out of ketosis was good for me it allowed the stress to be an anomaly and remain a stressor and then it reminded it allowed me these periods of time which I would recover so that's kind of how I periodize my diet is when I feel like my performance is down or I feel like that's a great indicator for me to maybe start rotating in some fruit and start getting the carbs back in in a clean way and be just very particular about how I Implement them but I find over the course of four or five weeks of doing that I feel recharged and then the magic of ketosis comes back when I re-enter it so it's like I don't know if that makes sense at all but you kind of wanted to rotate and periodize just like you would rotate and periodize any other stressor I wouldn't recommend that someone ice baths three times a day but maybe do it a couple times per week so it's a stressor use it as a tool yeah um a cyclical ketogenic diet essentially where are you like these days you're eating like fruit like what's your right now I'm ketogenic you know so but I'll probably stay deep in ketosis for like another month I have at the time of recording I'm about a month out from a I have a 35 mile 35 pound fasted Ruck that I'm doing wow so rocking is cool rucking is awesome you do it often yeah I'm a big big fan of it just I feel like it's less concussive I mean it depends on how downhill you're going that can be very concussive but well how do you actually do it you're just wearing a backpack while essentially hiking right yeah you're just backpacking with nowhere to go yeah with nowhere to go so you just I mean sometimes you have a place to go but I grew up as a Backpacker so I my heart loves it my mind loves it I have a I have a rock pack and I feel like it's a little bit tough on the shoulders and like it pulls my you know it's like it's weird from a postural standpoint also like kind of compressive on the lower back yeah you got to find the right back for sure gotta find the right path yeah that's definitely I use one called a uh I've drawn a blank on the name uh oh a kieferu it's a k-i-f-a-r-u and it was I went through all kinds of packs I went through you know go Ruck I went through different ones and like same kind of thing like some people complain about the hips it was really getting me the same kind of thing like pulling my traps would be super tight yeah and then it felt like it was like restricting my breathing a couple days later because everything was so tight so the key through I like because it's much more hip focused but you know that's that's part of rucking is getting adapted to that but I find from a metabolic standpoint it's just a nice slow grind you can go for a long time I've got two small kids so I can't be gone for super super long periods of time but you know I can get up early and go knock out a four hour wreck and the amazing I mean knock out a couple thousand calories you don't realize it you clear your headspace so it's hugely beneficial um but yeah so I mean right now training leading up to that since that whole 35 miles is going to be fasted it's very important that I am keto adapted and fat adapted really strongly leading into that so if I was feeding myself a lot of carbohydrates now then when I would go into that fast I would probably have a pretty significant drop in blood glucose and would be inefficient as switching back into that I want to get my body very accustomed to utilizing fats right now so that when I go into that event my body just knows to tap right into the fat storage rather than having to go through this awkward transitional period in the middle of a Ruck that makes sense how do you balance like family life with the rigors of your you know your physical needs like your job schedule your your uh you know workout schedule and all these like competitions that you do like how do you how do you balance those those variables just bring them with me yeah yeah we could you could rock your kids right I do I do I wreck my daughter my son's too big now he's four and a half four and a half I mean I shouldn't say he's too big but he just gets swear me if I try to put him in a pack he's doing it wouldn't work but my daughter's two just turned two she's like 30 35 pounds it's perfect you know so I put him in for her in the pack the pack itself weighs 15 or so so I've got a nice 45 50 pound it's perfect but the hard part is the four-year-old is at that awkward age where he's too big to be in a pack but he can't really go too long he's cranked out some Seven Mile hikes with me which is impressive for a four-year-old um so he's awesome I know he's got the jeans for that but I mean the mental load that it takes to say okay come on you can do this okay we'll get a milkshake afterwards you know what you know whatever you got to do to kind of like you know and then we end up making him some like sugar-free milkshake or something like that but he still likes it either way point is is that it's difficult so uh to balance everything though I mean we all work out together I'm you know fortunate enough to you know have my own gym that I train at it's built my own um so we all go to the gym together kids you know they'll bring their Magna tiles and they'll play with stuff or sometimes they'll work out with us they really I'm not a I'm not a crossfitter but I like CrossFit style workouts because I like to have things gamified and that's just how I'm wired my kids really like the CrossFit style approach because they find it fun they find it fun to count burpees they find it fun to count count reps and okay now we're gonna go run 100 yards so they can really get involved in that they're a little too young to understand like the fitness ritual but for us it really is a ritual and it's just my wife you know we all I'd say at least three or four days a week we're all working out together the other days of the week you know I'm flying solo but you know and then the filming we just got it down to a really good system and once everything had happened with uh you know the last couple of years it's forced us to adapt once again there's that adaptation right it was a stress it was difficult at first I'm like how am I going to film like okay you guys need to lock yourself in the bedroom in a film in the kitchen for a little while and self shoot and do all so now when I go back to an area where I have my studio I mean it's like bam I can walk in there and knock out 10 videos in a day and be good you know is that your kitchen I was watching a video where you're talking about the benefits of putting lemon in your water is that is that a set or is that like your that one is because I have a few different places I film so I have uh my my studio that's in Thousand Oaks that's the one that's like got the corrugated metal background I think maybe that was okay yeah that's my studio so if you flip the camera around that's a gym is behind the camera so it's like there's a kitchen set that's really a non-functional kitchen the sink in the oven worked but really other than that there's nothing uh and then you but yeah if you were to like look what was behind the camera then yeah then there's a rig and all my dumbbells and everything like that so it's like a three or four thousand square foot area that's got my studio and then my gym that's the what are the benefits of putting lemon in your water to actually believe it or not it's really interesting and I did this video because I've been seeing so many people make fun of it on Instagram right right so I've been seeing people like because it's such a thing in the wellness industry right it is and it's kind of cheesy and I've been seeing people make fun of it and I'm like you know what let's actually make a legit video talking about the benefits of this because there is something there it's not necessarily the polyphenols that everyone talks about what it is is it's purely an acid thing and you can get the same effect with vinegar apple cider vinegar balsamic vinegar I don't care any vinegar really um you have these uh the salivary response and when you consume vinegar what ends up happening is it actually attenuates the salivary like acid response so by consuming vinegar your taste buds see that you stop producing as much uh salary it's called HSP this is the type of you know salivary enzymes then what ends up happening is you have less ability to digest and break down those carbohydrates in your gut so it slows down the digestion in the gut so consuming lemon water water or even apple cider vinegar with a meal can attenuate the blood glucose response and it's nothing to shy at it's like a 20 to 25 percent difference in your blood glucose so it's a pretty serious difference when you're talking about okay I'm going to squeeze the juice of a lemon in my water and drink it with lunch right that's a pretty awesome thing to do if you're going to be having a higher carb meal and you can potentially mitigate that glucose Spike so that's really the big thing and then there's some benefits to you know doing it when you're fasting because it can help stabilize the glucose that way if you're like you know we're going to have some lemon water right at the beginning of your fast with like your last meal okay let's say like you were fasting from uh breakfast to breakfast 24 hour fast or something you know right with that big breakfast meal consume some of that you know lemon water and that can help keep your blood glucose a little bit more stable so it's going to prevent you from having to rise and fall that would ultimately make you hungry six hours into your fast wow yeah are there any I mean people I think people also say that like it's electrolytes in the morning are there electrolytes and lemon I'm gonna I would assume maybe there's like a little bit of potassium but yeah a little potassium nothing really nothing to write home about there's some interesting evidence on the polyphenols but like it's it really has to do with kind of how the liver metabolizes things and it's it's a little far-fetched I would focus I mean the digestive piece the acid piece that pH piece we know that that's pretty clear at least we never say with 100 certainty but you know in rodent models and human models pretty aggressive difference uh the polyphenol thing I think is a little bit of a stretch but there's still some benefit there yeah what are I mean because I feel like your YouTube channel is full of like little little sort of counter-intuitive food hacks like that what are some other ones yeah I mean apple cider vinegar is a big one for sure is it yeah that's just added drinking it along with your food yeah I think you know especially at night especially having just like a couple tablespoons of apple cider vinegar at night I mean just to Aid in again that glucose response to help keep you a little more even keeled so that you can sleep better wait with dinner or you're talking about before bed no well with with dinner so that it attenuates your glucose so that's not spiked before bed got it especially if people are eating later right which kind of leads me into another one I think a big thing that if you just eat with the Sun Life is a lot better like and I found that personally anecdotally and also in the research right it's like if you can just eat with the Sun a lot of problems end up solving themselves as far as glucose modulation goes and as far as that Health piece so in the summertime it gives you a little bit more flexibility to possibly eat a little bit later but then you kind of have to factor in yeah okay maybe don't eat a few hours before bed maybe kind of cut it off but really like I try to eat with the Sun so like right now it's like Sunset around like sevenish seven fifteen something like that so I still nice plates on sets oh my God so you know I'll let myself eat until like seven ish right but in the winter time it's a little bit harder I'm cutting it off at like five but it's made a huge difference in my sleep and it's made a huge difference in just overall how I feel not to mention if I stop eating at say 5 p.m then even if I'm not fasting if I'm not officially intermittent fasting if I get up at say 5 or 6 a.m the next day and then I go work out like and I tend to work out fasted or without you know without I don't call it officially fasted I just whether I'm intermittent fasting or not I work out on an empty snack right I just feel better that way it's just your preference just my preference right I mean I like it too we could talk about benefits of that but I think it's always a dead end street because there's always one side or the other but the point is is that well cool well then I'm deeper into a fast and by the time I'm done with my workout without even thinking about it I've done a 14 hour fast and let's just consolidates my eating window even more so it's easier for me to stay in a deficit easier for me to stay lean easier for me to stay you know cognitively functioning the way I want to another little hack is there's some interesting evidence just on MCT oil even if people are not ketogenic where MCT oil might improve brain energetics because MCT oil seems to at least in the early research be able to allow for the fatty acids to cross through the blood-brain barrier I shouldn't say the fatty acid but converting to ketones that will cross through the blood-brain barrier even if someone is not necessarily deep into a ketogenic state so like if someone is wakes up in the morning has a little MCT oil with their coffee or with their tea even if they're not necessarily following a ketogenic protocol they could have a pretty significant increase in the presence of ketones and glucose in their brain meaning they're having two kinds of energy substrates in the brain giving more brain energetics and potentially better Network stability again where the brain regions can communicate so a little bit of MCT oil like a tablespoon or two is just a huge hack for people that no matter what kind of diet they're doing it can potentially really make your brain function a little bit better yeah so cool are you chronically in a in a calorie deficit it's a good question I think if I was chronically in a calorie deficit eventually I'd only be eating 500 calories a day right right I tend to I was just talking about this with one of my my guys on my team yesterday we were just nerding out what I tend to do is I tend to rotate my deficits and what I mean by that is you know maybe this week I'll be in a 30 deficit overall then maybe next week I'll be at maintenance and then maybe the next week I'll be at a 10 deficit right I always kind of like fluctuate my deficits because I feel like the body is very good at predicting and trying to learn and trying to stay ahead of the metabolism you know the metabolism is slowing down because of a caloric deficit is not a bad thing the body's doing what it's supposed to do is this like starvation mode like the longer you spend in a calorie deficit starvation mode but I I just think it's a very good thing the body does that right it's protecting you it's like if it's saying like Okay this is the new metabolic demand this is what is asked for so let's go ahead and let's decrease the amount of energy this body takes to function so that this person can thrive on 1200 calories a day because his body is the body can handle pretty low calories it really can okay we it just accustoms to what we give it right so with me I do feel like being in a deficit is important but if I was Progressive in a deficit then I'd progressively be having to reduce my calories over and over and over again it comes right back to kind of the holes you can poke even with what they say about the Blue Zone diets they say okay well these these people typically eat a 15 deficit their whole life hmm how does that really add up so you're telling me from the time you were a newborn to the time you die you've been progressively decreasing calories 15 I think there's a lot more to the equation than that is my point but the point is is that generally speaking they are in a deficit so I rotate my deficits and I have periods of time when I also feel like I need to be in a surplus but one of the things that I think people take away from my Channel that I repeat a lot that is a very big piece whether someone is keto paleo fastening vegan whatever is look at your calories over the course of a week instead of over the course of a day because a lot of different things happen a lot of different confounders a lot of different things so if I look at okay maybe today I consumed 2 000 calories maybe tomorrow I consume four thousand maybe the next day I consume one but am I at a deficit at the end of the week or am I at a surplus or am I at maintenance at the end of the week and I'd say the line share of the time I try to put myself so that I'm right at maintenance by the seven day revolving period so that way some days I have a more aggressive caloric restriction some days it's very minor some days I'm in a surplus but at all net balances is out because I don't really care to gain weight or lose weight at this point I'm happy with where I'm at so is there but is there a benefit to doing that versus just being eating your maintenance calories every day I don't know other than the fact that you know if you do like if I were to say you're going to do hypothetically a 48-hour fast one day a week I think there could be some benefit from that like 48 hour fast one day a week and then not saying people should do it it's purely hypothetical right yeah 48 hour fast one day a week five days you're eating as much as you want to or up to above your Surplus whatever above your maintenance to a surplus because there's different benefits that come in once you start producing ketones with a longer fast different benefits that are outside the Continuum of just caloric restriction the presence of Ketone bodies whether it be through a fast or a ketogenic diet as histone diacetylase Inhibitors as various components of what they do for the brain as far as what they do for potential stem cells there's benefits there okay and there are discussion they really are discussion outside of caloric restriction in a lot of ways so as far as basic body metabolism and composition is concerned I don't think there's a huge difference I mean you could probably squeak out some differences one way or the other but I think the benefits start coming in outside of the body composition Continuum if that makes sense yeah it does I mean yeah but body composition is one variable right but we want to Stack variables we want to keep make sure that our blood glucose is healthy we want to make sure that we're not stressing ourselves too much that uh you know I think yeah this intermittent um Obsession from food is is important important for stimulating all these genetic Pathways that you talked about definitely super super important what like because I mean this is your your personal preferences to stay lean right yeah like 365 days a year yep what like I mean what body fat percentage would you say you're right at between six and eight usually yeah damn do you but isn't there like benefit to having a little bit more like fat on the body maybe I'm just speaking like you know wishful thinking but like for me but um but yeah isn't it like aren't there like hormonal benefits to maybe not being as Lean Like or have you found it to be like ideal for you yeah I I found it to be ideal for me but I do I do agree with you I do I find that when people uh stay super lean for a very long period of time yeah they start to run into some issues hormonally everything's fine for me if I start dipping below six for more than like a month I start to notice problems but I feel like for you like you miss a meal you're going to be dipping below six you know the funny thing is is that my metabolism is not as fast as people would think right I do so much fasting my metabolic rate is actually relatively slow so it doesn't take much for me to maintain and it would actually take quite a bit for me to really get leaner so I'm kind of in this sweet spot right so but if I get down to five percent four percent like I'm I'm increasing my running I do have to keep a very conscious eye on my calories because then all of a sudden I see myself every day you know so I don't notice these changes and then sometimes it'll be someone pointing it out on YouTube they'll be like dude you look pretty like drawn in you need to go eat some carbs and sometimes that'll give me a chance to look in the mirror and say yeah you know what maybe I'm running you know I'm running 60 miles a week right now maybe I should back that down a little bit you know or eat some more to compensate um because I don't I'm not this like orthorexic person that just is obsessed with everything I eat I'm pretty LAX actually I know what works for me I I mean I eat very very clean through track go off and on with tracking because I feel like tracking is is important uh I think it's a little too obsessive for many people including myself I don't like to obsess over it but I do I think we have this lava of a tree it's like it's a gray line it's a gray line it's a great line until it's a black line it's kind of like with the handful of nuts where it's like okay I have an ounce of nuts well you know what an ounce looks like for about two months and then it suddenly becomes an ounce and a quarter then it's an ounce and a half and it's two ounces and a handful and you think you're eating an ounce but you're really eating two so I do think there is Merit to occasionally stopping whatever dietary pattern you're doing saying you know what I'm gonna weigh my food for a week just to keep myself honest and make sure that things are right because you kind of lose sight of what six ounces of chicken looks like but if you know roughly where you could stand then it's great and I think years of being in this industry now even though I was overweight before you know now for the I guess six years that I've really been or seven years that I've been in this industry so to speak uh it has become such an obsession that now I'm pretty good at eyeballing it right um but yeah it's it all depends on the person some people are so turned off by tracking do you uh do you I mean what's like an Indulgence for Thomas delauer like are you uh like do you abstain from all junk food do you is there any in the house junk food yeah I don't go crazy on it but it's uh I would say and this is a little weird but whenever you're gonna ask yeah first of all and this isn't necessarily a purpose purposeful shout out but there is a place in Westlake Village which is like just near north of La uh a place called karma Donuts that has these Donuts that are so good and they're they're made with like spelled flour and like so they're like gluten-free and they're relatively low glycemic they're sweetened with coconut sugar but they are so good they're almost more like a cake than a donut um because they're not fried they're baked they're so good uh so what my wife and I will do is we'll you know maybe once every few weeks or so we'll we call it a Karma party and we do it what we call a Karma walk where we're like okay we're gonna we're gonna have like five or six donuts between the two of us but we're also gonna go from our house we're gonna walk to the store just like three miles out three miles back pushing the stroller sometimes I'll wear a white vest because I'm weird and I just want to do it and then we come back and we're like okay we walked six miles we walked x amount of steps you know and we're not it's hard to say we're not being obsessive about it because we are being obsessed about it but we're not like restricting calories We're not gonna like skip dinner in order to go have those donuts right we still eat normally throughout the day but we also earn it so when we go and we have our cheat meal we're gonna go earn our cheat meal and it goes against the grain with a lot of things I say because I say like you shouldn't have food be a reward because it can kind of build bad patterns but when it's fun and it's a family thing I think it's great the kids and we all get to go walk we all get to go have fun we enjoy it we all have a little celebration at the end of it so that's like our normal Vice I mean we're pretty boring when it comes down to our cheat meals we're like we know my wife and I'll be like what do you want to go you know what do you want to splurge on well we know like our four things that don't mess us up that we feel still feel good after having because they're clean enough we've got a couple Thai food restaurants we like I'm a big Thai food guy so I almost always keep the gluten out I still don't have gluten either way so you know I'll have like Drunken Noodles uh which is like my favorite Thai Dish so awesome a little issue with peanuts so the pad thai kind of makes me like sneeze and do weird stuff um yeah no I love food so Thai is awesome my favorite Thai restaurant on the planet is uh in Hollywood it's called Pink Pepper ever hear of it I've heard of it you've heard of it it's great dude it's really good great great Pad Thai but the chicken curry 's kiss so good yeah really bomb is your wife as into fitness as as you are she's not into it as much as I am but she's definitely into it yeah we met in high school so she's been with me through when I was a skinny Runner she was with me when I was obese she's with me now like you know we've been together for going on 18 years so wow it's is she sometimes just like kind of laughs at my antics you know she's just like you would think that by now she would either completely be opposed to it or be totally jumping on board but she's so even keeled and so awesome like she's just a great human being but she's she never pushes me one way or the other she just knows I'm I'm weird and I'm gonna do weird stuff and Thomas is going to experiment oh and Thomas is skipping dinner tonight okay well okay we'll enjoy food you have fun watching you know but so she's totally on board with it but she has a little bit more of a human element to her where I can I can flip a switch and become pretty robotic if I want to because I do it in the name of science or I do it you know whatever I just have fun with it yeah you're a data nerd you're like a nutrition nerd for you it's like very deliberate very calculated it's not it's clearly like not disordered in any way it's like you you derive Joy from it and talking about evangelizing you know like what it is that you're doing and experimenting with it's a good point I do I do thoroughly draw Joy from it I I get genuinely enthusiastic when I learn something new that I get to try out and that is why my channel personally I feel the volume of my channel helps but I think just the sheer sincerity of like really getting excited about these new things is what has made my channel different is because I truly speak from Passion when I talk about these things because I learned something and I'm like oh cool I'm gonna try that and I get excited about it because I saw a result and okay now I want to share it with the audience and uh so I think that that shines through with people and my wife sees that passion and I think she's kind of like I can't stand in the way of that he's so happy just let him do it you know

Channel: Thomas DeLauer

Views: 210,081

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Id: f8ZpkzoDoTw

Length: 58min 43sec (3523 seconds)

Published: Fri Feb 24 2023