WATCH LIVE: Hannah Payne testifies in trial

[Music] for for okay I'm going to go ahead and bring the jewers back in at this time um belief in this if you would thank you good afternoon ladies and gentlemen of the jewry at the time that we broke for lunch the state had rested I mean it it had concluded bringing all the evidence it intended to aduce in this case at this time I'm going to inquire of the defense if they intend to call any Witnesses attorney Taco yes ma' I do plan to call Miss pay to the stand okay you may me swear I can um Miss P please raise your right hand do you solemnly swear or affirm any testimony you shall give in this case today shall be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you God I do yes we may Lory your right hand have a seat if you just put yourself up to the mic and project so that we can all hear you and that the court recorder can record what is being said uh you may proceed attorney to if you say your full name for the record and spell it out for the course no it's Hannah h a n n a h Payne p a y n e okay Miss pay um where do you have you lived in Bay County or Clayton County close proximity uh I don't want to get out of addresses but have you lived the majority of your life I have I was born and raised in Clayton County and then moved to fet when I was eight do you uh have any family members that are law enforcement you recall um what do you do for um I'm in property management for apartment communities and I've been in that industry now for going on 10 years okay so you came straight out of high school into that I did and that kind of industry what do you do for uh for your job typically I'm in the field I go from property to property um either collecting rent um sometimes walking vacant Andor abandoned apartments that could potentially be under construction and I would show vacant apartments to um potential renters okay so at times you were carrying basically teals for your company of large amount of money correct yes okay and um you testified that on some occasions or more occasions you have to show empty Properties or empty uh locations to people that you don't know or that you're told to Val your company correct whether it be vacant apartments or vendors either or and how do you feel about that I mean it's it's a part of my job um in the beginning we had smaller properties where I was the only person who was going from property to property um there were occasions that were unsettling but it was it was still a part of my job and the longer that I was with the company the larger we got the more properties we received um and the more I guess it it put me more out um alone by myself without additional site staff without anybody with me and they would know that you were going to these sites correct correct not exactly which ones I would be kind of all over the place depending on which ones I was going to and because you were going to all these different places to meet people you don't know did you do anything for your safety I did and what was that I um registered for a concealed carry permit and when I received it I purchased a firearm did your company know about this um they did yes and were they in support of this I would yes they were and it was it was not unusual for other individuals with the same type of work to wear a gun or have a gun uh no not at all okay and you said you purchased a gun uh what kind of gun did you purchase uh was this Springfield and it was a XD um cuz it was smaller so I was able to keep it concealed okay and you got a valid permit correct correct what else did you do to help uh make sure that carrying a permit or carrying a gun on your side would be safe I would go to the shooting range and at different shooting ranges they offer kind of like a variety of options um including self-defense kind of classes or tutorials rather and did you ever take one of those classes or tutorials I did and which one did you take um it was this was a while ago so I wouldn't be able to tell you exactly but it was a self-defense um training course okay and in this training what did you learn from what they were teaching just how to properly store your weapon how to properly remove your weapon how to make sure that your safety when doing so doesn't cause accidental discharge um and they would explain how when you pull your weapon out that the way you hold it is determin is determined based on what your you're ready to do in other words you keep your index finger on the slide until you're ready to pull the trigger when you're ready to pull the trigger is when you put your finger into the trigger guard right now when you say the slide um is that the top portion the side portion or is it a combination of both like the side okay how your hand would nor just rest and is that all that um were training for at that time um for the most part yes I mean they taught us you know how to load or unload and smaller things like that but have you ever had a accidental discharge of the firearm while loading or unloading no okay and did you commonly wear this weapon uh every day where'd you wear it on my person you mean mhm I had a holster that went inside of my pants and I wore it on my front right hip was that visible to individuals no okay and did you do that purposely I did okay and uh do you recall uh May 7th of 2019 I do prior to that day have you ever had to draw your weapon or find yourself in a position where you would need to no okay um so on this May 7th of course you been here in these stores could you tell us what happened on that day I can um I was on my way home from work and I was coming up to an intersection where the light had just turned green as I was getting ready to turn left there was a semi that was turning right um someone ran the red light and I watched him run right into the tractor trailer I pulled off to the side and I got on the phone with 911 to just to give an account of what I had noticed um I had assumed that the truck driver or someone else that was involved had already called and they hadn't and if I could stop you right there you said that you pulled off to the side whereabouts um I pulled up onto the curb okay right through the intersection and why did you do that I wanted to get out of the lane of travel so there was heavy traffic that day it was pretty steady okay and is that where you called the 911 it is yes okay and then what did you do um after I got on the phone with 911 I was it kind of explaining everything that I saw and I started to walk over to the truck driver um cuz I noticed that there was someone else who had witnessed it who pulled off to the side and if I'm sorry to interupts you said you walked up to the truck driver what was that driver's name uh believe was Mr Kimble okay right go ahead so I um walked over to the truck driver and we kind of just were conversing asking I don't even know what happened and he just was confirming that we did have a green light so um I noticed that someone else had walked over to the other vehicle that was involved and was checking on them I after talking to Mr Kimble for a while um he was on the phone with his dispatch the entire time and so I was kind of relaying everything that happened so that they were able to hear it from me and not just from him relaying it to whom to his um job okay so his supervisor I would assume all right so you're speaking with him relating to the dispatch about what was going confirming the light was green for him correct and then what else happened um after that we were kind of just standing there waiting for the police to arrive and um the other gentleman who had witnessed it walked over to us and he introduced himself and said that he was a state officer and he flashed his badge and said that he had checked on the other gentleman and that was asking us are we okay is everybody right um and actually told me that he had saw where he ran the red light and confirmed it to Mr uh Kimble as well okay now clar he came and um identified himself as a state officer correct okay and you've heard a couple of times it being called a correctional officer or another name are you sure he he identified himself as a state officer to you he told and to Mr Kimbell cor correct he told me that he was a state officer I didn't find out that it was a correctional officer until months later when I found out from you but he did show a badge he he did okay I mean he didn't pull it off he just lifted his shirt and we saw the badge and then he continued and how was he speaking to you or how was his demeanor to you and Mr Kimbell he was trying to make sure everyone was okay um making sure that we kind of stayed over here and that anything that you know we could remember that happened we were kind of going over it with him um but he he seemed to be comfortable with the situation and making sure that all of us felt comfortable I guess is the best way to explain it okay so your voice on the 911 appeared to be kind of calm and so that was the tone or how you perceived everybody's tone as this was continuing on for the most part I think that me and the truck driver were kind of more calm um the officer the way that he it was kind of like he was I don't know any other term other than kind of hyped up like he just he wanted to make sure that he was in charge in a way okay and what else did he um State while you were sitting there waiting on the police to arrive well we were me and the truck driver were curious because we didn't know what had just happened it seemed obvious that he ran the red light so we were asking him if he was okay and if he was if there was something going on and he said he's okay but he said he's definitely inebriated are you sure that's the word he used I'm positive because it prompted both me and the truck driver to reply simultaneously saying do you mean he's drunk okay and um did Mr Kimble dispatch here or over here that conversation or he the conclusion I'm not sure to be honest okay so the state officer said that and it kind of sparked yours Mr Kimble's attention what happened next um afterwards we're still standing around probably another um maybe 10 or 15 minutes now um additional from the original 10 minutes or so and me and Mr Kimble are continuing to speak and um the state officer had walked back over because at this time the guy in the truck had got out of his vehicle okay and when he got out of his vehicle did the state officer address him uh he did and what was said he was just asking him what was he doing and what are you where are you going you know come out of traffic because his truck was still in the lane so there were still cars that were passing and he was just basically trying to make sure you need to just come out the way and stay out of traffic so the from your perception the state officer was remaining calm trying to direct um at that time you didn't know but now you you know Mr Herring to be safe and get out of Harm's Way correct originally yes okay and then what continued from there um I couldn't hear what they were saying but he kind of started walking around and um the officers started following him around the vehicle and you could see him having conversations but again I couldn't hear what they were saying and when you said walking around walking around where um his truck and just in that proximity of just just his drug yes okay sorry continue so after he was walking around for a little bit he kind of started uh he being the state officer started to walk back over to us and he was kind of just giving us this look like this this guy is there's something there's something that's up and before anybody could ask or either of us could ask him what he meant he walked back over to him um I was actually on the phone with my family when I was on my way home from work which I hung up to call the police so during this time is when I took that opportunity and I kind of walked back to my vehicle and I was on the phone I called my family back to let them know uh what was going on and it was to let him know what's going on or let him know that you were safe or correct okay and is that when you made the second call the 91 call it is um I noticed from a distance that it was getting more tension I guess um couldn't hear the conversations but I could see the hand movements and the gestures between the two of them um again I don't know what he was saying but it was almost like he's trying to explain to him something which is when I told them I'm going to call you guys back I'm going to call the police back because something else is is going on cuz he started walking towards his vehicle again like the driver's side at that time and when you called 911 the second time was it kind of the same manner you did the first time it was um I was just basically explaining to them what I what it looked like was about to take off take place um assuming and hoping that they would say okay well we actually have an officer he's literally right there given the time frame I would have assumed that someone would have been there by then okay how many how many accidents have you seen before this one um I mean passed on the road a few witness firsthand none and have you ever been in an accident yourself no okay so this is the first time you're countering any kind of accident really firsthand or close by yes okay and you get back on the phone with 911 and what occurs then I'm explaining to them um what I thought that we had Learned was that um the driver who had caused the original accident was potentially drunk and and that came from what the state officer said yes okay go ahead um and as I'm explaining it to her I notice that's when he completely gets in his truck he starts trying to turn it on and you can hear him like revving it to get it to turn on um which I I think that all of us were shocked that it even turned on to begin with and that's when he he started to drive away and you said you were shocked why were you shocked that it started back up there was fluids everywhere it was smoking there was I mean it was damaged was there a Major Impact there was yeah I mean the entire tractor trailer just shifted and rocked when he hit him and you don't know what speed he was going at going through the red line I don't okay but you did see the effects it had on the 18-wheeler and then you are on the phone with 911 you see him jump into his vehicle red up and what happens then um I'm just basically just telling dispatch that that's what's happening I am explaining to her he just got in his car and she asked me um if if I was able to get the tag number as he's pulling away were you able to get the tag number at that point I wasn't no did it appear anybody had gotten the tag number no and they were just trying to get out of the middle of the road so people were trying to get out of the way was anybody screaming get the tag number or I mean at the time all I could see was the state officer and the truck driver kind of the state officer was kind of grab and the truck driver kind of telling him you know to get out of the way um where was this truck driver standing they were so if this was the the lane where they were turning and the truck was kind of partially turned they were standing at the like kind of the middle part of the intersection which would have been middle part of the tractor trailer which is kind of in front of Mr herring's V vehicle okay did it ever appear that any of them might have been in Jeopardy of being hit when Mr Haron was starting up his vehicle um initially it's not the first thing that came to I think anybody's mind but then once he started rev it and just kind of took off then yeah okay and then what happened so I'm explaining to the dispatch what happened and as he's pulling off she's asking me you know was I able to get the tag number realizing I wasn't able to I was already my vehicle and I got in my I completely got in my vehicle and went to go pull off okay and at that time the uh truck driver and the state officer was still standing over in the street and he started waving me over like calling me towards him okay and when you got up close to him what happened um he I asked him did he go straight and he said yes and he's telling me he said go so at that time you were under depression that he's a state officer sending you to get the tag and 911 knows that you're on the way to get the tag correct and he was when I was in my vehicle when he was waving me over his motions were was almost like he was waving me on so when he brought me up when I got up to him is when he told me to go okay and he said go or did he say something else or no he just said good go go okay all right so then now you're you're going in the direction they pointed you and you're on the phone with 911 was 911 saying anything uh no she was not I was just there was kind of Silence from the time that she had initially asked me if I had got the tag um I was still kind of getting my bearings and I just started repeating to her telling her okay you know he's going down um Clark Howell or Forest Parkway so you never heard them give a warning of not to Chase or no and having heard the tape did you feel that um you were talking over it or you just didn't hear it or no I was explaining to her as we were as we were going down the road I'm explaining to her what's happening and from what how I remembered it she asked me again so were you able to get it and I explained to her not yet but I am about to and that's when she told me that she just wanted me to be safe I told her that I understood um and that I wasn't chasing I was just going to follow to stay behind him to stay with him until the police officer could get to us so I was able to kind of accurately basically just keep them in the loop since they obviously weren't there yet okay um so your impression at that point is that you're just going to get the tag and then hopefully that'll be it you just report the tag correct okay and did 911 ever come on and say hey we've already got the tag from somebody else no they she never did okay so um as you're getting up close to get the tag what happens then as I'm getting closer um I explained to her that I had the tag and she basically tells me that this is the way that I interpreted it was that she wanted both of us to go back to the original accident site because police should be there by now all right was that did she say something before that about you just returning or the only thing you heard was that both of y'all needed to be corre correct she just told me she wanted me to be safe I told her I felt like I was safe and that's when she I told her that I was going to stay with them until an officer could get to us um and she said that that's what she wanted me to do at any time did you identify you had a gun or was carrying a gun done I didn't okay so you're following the individual to get his tag and you get it and then your interpretation of what was said is that they wanted both of y'all to come back to the scene correct so what did you do at that point at that point is when um we had both come up to the intersection and I saw him stopped in the turning lane so I turned as well and when I stopped I was under the impression with me having 911 on the phone that I could just be kind of like a messenger so I took my phone on speaker and I took it to him to show him that I had the police on the phone and I'm telling him they want us to go back to the original accident site all right at this point you y'all have not made contact correct no we have not so how far do you think you pulled over the distance between you and his truck um well he was in the turning lane and I was in what would be considered like the right straight Lane um and the distance between the vehicles were probably I don't maybe the width of this table but there was no contact correct no there was not okay and did you have any fear that something was going to happen by walking up to him with the phone I didn't think I had anything to fear I assumed that having Authorities on the phone explaining that to him that that would just mean okay we'll go back because you had not heard heard what the interchange between him and the state officer correct I had not no okay and as you approached him with the phone how did you have it in your hand um I had it on speaker and I was kind of holding it like in my palm with it kind of resting in my hand just like facing him so that he could see it says 911 now you mentioned that he was internally and was stopped correct correct did you cause him to stop I did not and why would he been sto in that lane the only thing that I could think of was either he was merging and his vehicle finally gave up um or that it but e okay so the way that the lanes merged I was assuming that he was either waiting for traffic but then getting up closer you can see all of the liquid like underneath the vehicle you can see the truck is smoking okay and you said earlier that it might have just finally exhausted correct I mean and even when we were back at the original accident site the um the state officer and even the truck driver but they were they were adamant that they don't understand how this truck hasn't just kind of blown was how they Works describing it okay so your intents to walk up with the phone tell them hey the police are on the phone what happened then I was walking up to him and I am explaining that I'm on the phone with the police and that they wanted us to go back to the original accident site um it's loud we're near an interstate it's a busy road and I can't hear what he's saying to me but as I got closer I heard him um asking me who the f are you and I told him that I was nobody but that I had the police on the phone um and that they wanted us to go back to the original accident site okay so you'd explain that to him did you have the phone close to you did you have it away from you where was the phone it was kind of not extended but partially of the way okay and uh what happened then um apparently I was close enough for him to reach out the car and he knocked my phone out of my hand and he grabbed me by my wrist and he pulled me into the vehicle okay now you said apparently you got too close to the vehicle did it appear to you you were too close to the vehicle or I wasn't thinking that I needed adequate space to stay away from him or anybody or anything okay and then you said he knocked the phone out of your hand yes and then he grabbed you you said one was on your wrist and where was the other hand um originally he had just grabbed my wrist and he had pulled me in the car and um at some point my shirt had gotten grabbed okay um and he go ahead he was pulling my wrist and he pulled me in the vehicle and he kept yelling at me telling me I have something for you um and he used I have some pardon but I have something for you [ __ ] and he's leaning and he's reaching and he's pulling and at this point I remember that I'm I'm sorry take your time I remember that he had let go of my wrist and he grabbed me by the back of my neck and it was was as if he was trying to kind of keep a hold of me um the entire time I'm telling him I'm I'm thinking I'm still have to be on the phone with the police they have to know um I'm telling him to let me go and that's when he hits the gas and we go forward um I'm still in the car at this point and while it only may have been a few steps or a few feet um when you are being held against your will and you have no idea what's ahead of you and you're looking down it felt like it lasted forever and I just remember it was like I saw my like my light flashed before my eyes and I thought I was going to go down Riverdale Road um out hanging out the side of this car and the whole time are you trying to get away from the situation I'm trying to pull away from him yes and how did you do that um I my entire body was up against the vehicle and I'm just trying my hardest to push away with any part of me that I can whether it was my my arms or my knees trying to just put distance between me and the vehicle thinking I could get away from it and uh was unsuccessful and at one part you hear yourself screaming get the F out of the car um what was going on then I'm thinking that I have a better chance of not being drugg if he's not in the vehicle okay for what I hold here is a bag has been labeled with evidence that we're going to call it defense exhibit number 39 389 39 okay and as you can see been sealed and not open at this time of your honor I'm going to approach the witness although although I'm not sure until I open it she but do you see the writing on this right here yes okay does that identify a article of clothing it does okay and at this time I'm going to open evidence do this appear to be show it to her this time your honor may approach you may approach do you see this shirt yes does that shirt look familiar to you yes is it accurate representation of the shirt you were wearing that day of the yes this time your honor I would like to Tender what is exhibit defense 39 any objection from the state no objection admitted without objection and i' like to present it to or show to the jury shirt she was wearing on the day of the incident was it torn when you were wearing it that day no when uh Mr Heron grabbed you did he tear it yes and is this a fair representation of the rips and what it ended up being at the end yes along with the ribs in that shirt was there any other part of your body that had any kind of marks from where he grabbed you uh yes okay where were those I had marks on the back of my neck and kind of scratches along my arms bruisings um on my wrist and scratches along my chest okay anything in the facial area yes um I had a kind of a black eye but a bruised eye and a busted um upper lip and other I guess like sore spots like her bruising and redness around the edges of my face and all of this occurred while he was dragging you uh forward towards your vehicle correct okay and you said he was making a statement to you of I've got something for you [ __ ] was there any other statements made that you can remember at this time no he just kept telling me that kind of over and over again and that I was nobody now what was he doing in the vehicle while this was all going on um before but before he punched the gas is when he was kind of turning his body and he was reaching like reaching behind him did you see what he was reaching for I no I did not did you see any of the contents of the inside of his vehicle during no okay I could see that there were things everywhere but other than that I didn't really have you ever experienced anything like that prior to this incident then no okay and then what happened then um after the reaching is when he P mashed the gas and when he mashed the gas I like I said have no understanding of how far we went how much farther we can go at that point I didn't know that it we had stopped because we hit my vehicle um and that's when I uh Drew my weapon right now you said mashing the gas what did that sound like uh you could hear the the truck just revving and hissing from like the um liquids spewing and it was it was me just loud okay and you stated that then you said you have a gun I did and what was your intent at that point um my intent was that pulling and out he would let me go and I'd pull away from the vehicle and that would be it did you ever stop trying to pull away from the vehicle no and explain to me how you uh pulled your gun out uh at that time um it was in my holster on my right hip and he had a hold of me and I just I I pulled it out and immediately started trying to just continue to push against the door with it like pushing away from him okay and as you're pushing away from the door what happens then um he grabbed my hand with the gun in it okay let me let me cl which arm did you pull or which hand did you pull the gun with it was my right hand okay and you said he grabbed your wrist which wrist he grabbed my right wrist all right and how did he have that wrist um well with one of his hands he actually grabbed my wrist to pull it towards him could you tell which hand or arm he had grabbed your wrist with um it was his left because he had a hold of he he had released me with this hand from my neck to grab me with this hand okay and the gun that was outside the door that you pushing away from he got a hold of that correct correct and what happened then um after he originally grabbed it and was kind of pulling at it back and forth is um when he put his other hand on top and he started trying to actually yank it away from me um and then he started to trying to turn it to pry it almost like he was trying to pry it out of my my hands so that he could take it away and which angle was you trying to pry it out of your hand um like a away from me so it was this way okay and that obviously is not the way your wrist is supposed to move correct correct is is that what caused the bruising or the it is okay and you said he's trying to push it this way and pry it out of your hands to me it's what it felt like like he was trying to pry it out of my hand and you said another hand came over and grabbed it yes okay from the top good understanding jury can see it if I may approach demonstration what she's saying you may this is a toy gun to and even though it's toy gun it does have a slide on it as you can see that pulled back there's nothing in this gun it's toy gun so this is the gun that you have he was pointing it say I am him in his seat how was he how did he have your wrist like this this hand was here yes okay and the gun was here he's pulling you forward yes and he said he he had you here on this he was closer all right so and he had your shoulder with his hand or what was his hand doing that he let go he let go once he got a hold of this ver so he came and he grabbed the gun all right he tried to grab the gun like this correct okay and where was your finger the same way that I have it now and when you grabb like this that shows his fingers are right there over the trigger correct is that a correct I mean yes so it's possible any of the four digits got into that trigger correct again thank um so that occurred and he's grabbing the gun like that what happens next um he's pulling at it he's pulling at it and I'm just yelling at him to stop thinking that if I could just get away it'll just be over I guess were you say anything to him at this time to stop were you saying it loudly yeah over and over again yeah I was screaming it okay and then what happened um as he's turning it towards like that way I'm being pulled and pulled and I can feel myself like pressing up against the car like my face is up against the door and as he's pulling it is when it the should could went off okay and you saw the pictures that showed your hand kind of pulled back um why would your hand or arm been pulled back like that after it went off my entire body kind of fell backwards like I I was almost like I was falling over and I was trying to catch my ballots um and my arm was turned so far in that once it was went off and I was released it just kind of sprung back what was going through your mind at that time a lot um I I I knew that I was still had to be on the phone with 911 and that I was just trying to get away from where I've been trying to get away from for the last however many minutes and then I needed to communicate back to 911 what it happened so you picked up the phone and I I turned and I picked up my phone that was on the ground and I I told her what happened okay at anytime did you look around for a shell and pick up a shell no I did not were you concerned about a shell I was not at all okay and when you got on the phone with 911 you stated that he' pull the trigger yes and what else did you stay um to her I had told her that he had just pulled a trigger on my gun um and I remember kind of looking around and and I noticed behind me that there was someone who was standing behind me and I asked them if if they seen everything if they would stay to you know be a witness um and he was asking like if we were okay he's like are you okay is everything okay and I told him said I I'm I mean I am but no he's not and I asked um I asked the the dispatch for uh an ambulance okay so your concern at that point was to try to get dispatched to send an ambulance out correct did you look around to see if anyone were close I did and I that's when I noticed that there were actually I mean there were police that were to me felt so close that all of this could have just just been avoided but you had no foresight or any kind of anticipation that it would conclude like this I had no idea and it appears that a lot of witnesses did come up to confront you or to uh say what they thought they'd saw I mean originally the everyone that was standing around they weren't they weren't like saying anything direct everyone was asking each other what happened everyone was trying to figure out like well where where did this car come from and how did this happen um did any of them or one particular stick out to you only the one that was right next to me because I I was assuming that he saw the whole thing did you know his name at that time I did not after seeing him get up and testify do you know his name I do and what was his name uh Cameron Cameron Williams okay and he did stay around um he did I don't know where he went exactly he kind of started to walk around where everybody else was um and it was like I was still on the phone with 911 and I'm trying to explain to her what's going on but at this point I just I'm kind of in a a bit of a days I didn't it was all over the place honestly and what did you do with the gun um I reh holstered it I took the holster off my hip and I put it back in the holster okay and did it stay in that condition till the police came it did um I remember looking up and seeing that there was a police officer who was coming up from where he would have been at like the interstate area um and as he was walking up I was trying to get his attention because he was like walking towards all the bystanders having no idea what was going on having no idea who was involved with what or where or how um and I was trying to get his attention so that he knew here's the weapon so that he could have it all right now you said that the a lot of crowds were saying stuff trying to confirm what had happened uh did you hear all that they were saying um it was more a bunch of kind of questions um after the police officer had come up one of the people that was standing there were basically again asking what had happened did you and she she asked me she said did you just shoot him and I told her I said no I said he he pulled me into the vehicle he had a hold of me but that I never had my finger on the trigger and why is that I mean number one from training and number two I never had any intention on pulling the TR and in fact you never did pull that trigger did you correct now the officers of course came up took your gun and was there another officer that you encountered at that time um there was I was standing on the sidewalk I was just trying to stay out of the way and the original officer who I handed my uh my gun to um went into Mr herring's truck and the other officer had come up and everyone was kind of like you know pointing towards me basically and he walked up to me and just told me that until they could figure out what was going on that I would be detained okay so as you said kind of this fog's going on and you're in shock um did you ever see that there was an opportunity to try to render Assistance or did that even cross your mind from the time that it happened to the time that the police officer got there the initial response for me was I was away from this vehicle and I wasn't trying to interject D myself back into a situation that I had just got away from yeah and when the other officer detained you did you did he put you somewhere um he did in the back of the police car a recording in there so I'm going to take a recording or video of what occurred with you in the back seat it may take me in second to use this technology if you want to take a break or they're ready to go are you going to require any it assistance I'm I I've learned a lot on this machine that I might I wouldn't want to mess it up here so yes I might okay um ladies and gentlemen I am going to give you a brief break it's now 3:30 uh I just ask that you report back at 3:45 thank you [Music] okay are you ready to proceed yes ma' I'm trying to be a step ahead and appreciates that okay I'm going to go ahead and bring the jewers in at this time all get back I'm to stay okay you may be seated thank you you may proceed attorney temp when we left off i' asked what happened uh once the officers came up officer Richie took your weapon correct correct and then another officer came and got you and was taking you to the car um correct I mean there was a little bit of time that went in between that but from him taking my weapon to me walking trying to stay out of the way um and I just remembered kind of going back and forth with the witnesses talking about again them asking what happened um and I remember yelling for one of the officers um to come on to come up um and that we needed an ambulance I was asking where the ambulance was okay and you do recall being placed in the back of a car similar to this correct um yes and there was a video that you've seen prior to today that shows what happens in this video correct correct and I will show you a small bit and then I'll stop it so you can confirm that that is the video that you recall of the interview with you after the after being put in the vehicle okay okay B where's the B here he's not alone do is it on the computer oh volume oh I don't want to be too [Music] loud seems to be 100 they should turn and I don't see where it's all right does that appear to be you in the back of that car yes do you recall an officer coming up you may not seen him as well but do you recall being in the back and that officer come up yes speak to you and does this appear to be a fair and accurate representation of what it was when they came and talked to you yes at this time your honor I would like to Tender defense exhibit number 39 40 40 40 yes no your honor as long as we have that we of play the times that we previously discussed correct and I'm not sure why the volume is not working but of course we need volume hold on it's Crystal there's a good volume for PC that did you try this one I don't see any right this one I've got it going through the PC the PC has volume all the way up got the audio here Podium Maybe in Podium no not okay I the video broadcast okay I you there's got to be video broadcast for for did it play while we were on break oh we never got okay just crave everyone's patience while we get it who is here thank you and I know I'm going to talk to her huh I didn't open that yet oh yeah you get I ran up I yeah appreciate it all right how you doing man so you said you recall that situation happening that's fair accurate representation of him walking up to the and then from what's going to occur here I would like you to listen please and not doing good I'm talking to Mar Clayton County Police Department all right can you just give me a you mind talk to me and telling me what happened okay TR left barely front of my car into okay I pulled off the road I called he ran to the semi okay called the police okay minutes later I police police off I and I okay I got up and I was able to cut and I told get out the car the car okay I my on my right I I [Applause] on I going back and what did he have a hold of okay your hand okay how did you grab your did you reach the vehicle or what I was like when he grabbing my shirt when I gotos to window don't know okay I all I need is a quick you don't got to go that they're going they going to talk to you at C I just need to know what came up to when the weap was [Music] fired my hand I my iing him and I'm pulling away pull my f I didn't I didn't want to pull the trigger he's not he don't have anything in his hand now I canle doesn't have his gun have anything on but we grabbed my hand and we're going back and forth in the car and he last week okay all right I stood back I he was moving around that's when our dispatch to come back around and I back to I there waiting were you on the phone with dispatch time the whole time okay all right and I was came around the [Applause] corner okay all right all right thank you you have opportunity to call give a minute now I take it out there just on you need some assist yeah you want stop want to take it out yes ma'am now having heard that um is that what your recollection of the account the how it happened minus details okay generally well well how were you feeling at that time I was overwhelmed I mean I I didn't know what was really going on um um is that why you want scared is that why you wanted to call your parents okay and they had some pictures earlier that were presented if I may approach your honor you may did you show yes I did I showed some okay um what I have here is VC divot number 27 28 29 all the way through appears to be 30 35 we call seeing those when I entered them into PS correct yes I may present you may just go chronological order okay the does this look like a fair inacurate representation of where it appears you were scratched yes okay is that where when you said he was reaching for your head or trying to pull you in that's where the marks came from yes it didn't come from putting a sweatshirt on did it no it did not okay and this is defense exhibit number 208 you recall this yes okay and this area here is that what is that to my wrist is that where the swelling or what yes is that's your right hand um I believe so yes okay and that would be swelling for why what raison well there was swelling on both but on this side it was from where I was grab but then my right wrist is where it was being like twisted and pulled okay and grabbed is this another another photograph of how your shirt ended up yes that day yes okay and when they were taking pictures they took a picture of here what was going on there um you can't really tell in this picture but um it was starting it was it was hurting like it was starting to uh swell and there's irritation around it I guess you could call it okay and you you recall them pulling out a ruler to measure the marks on the back of your neck yes okay and you recall I'm taking pictures of your hand there yes okay and describe what was going on there um there were like scratches and marks all along my hands and on my fingernails um there were a couple of them and to try and remember now I don't remember which ones but there were a couple of them that had were broken off when all of this was happening and there's some marks over here here do you recall what those marks were um the one right on the top was where um detective Moore basically was asking me if I was showing her where it was hurting and in that area um she wanted him to document that it looked like a like a busted blood vessel okay and you re do you recall seeing this being presented into evidence I do did you ever see that in the vehicle not at the time no was that the biggest nightmare you had if that was in the vehicle yes is there anything else I want to tell you is there anything else you can remember about that in incident that you might have missed from seeing the back of the truck or back of the police car and speak with them and those pictures small details don't really resonate very well um I mean it's been the only thing that I've thought about for the last 4 and 1/2 years but it's not um details no nothing that I can think of now did you get an opportunity to speak to other officers um yes I did all right and who was that after I was taken to the police station um they put me in a interview room um and eventually a detective Hayward um came in and introduced himself and said that he was waiting on his partner do you recall who his partner was I was detective Moore okay and do you recall how that interview went um I was remember feeling like I was waiting for hours I didn't know what was going on um I hadn't talked to anybody since it happened other than the police officers and U I just I just remember like feeling like I was waiting for forever and I had no sense of time or even or what was going on all right while you were waiting did you do anything while you're waiting and sitting there alone um I remember pacing and that's when I I noticed that my nails were broken um so I started started messing with my fingernails started like taking them off one of them I remember was hurting which is what made me realize it was broken okay and do you recall any of the conversation between detective Haywood and more in that interview not really I remember that to me it seemed like they they would kind of go back and forth between one being more interested than the other um and they kept asking me the same things over and over again um but every time they would ask me they would kind of insinuate like a a different narrative um which to me I'm I'm thinking that there's an obvious explanation that everybody that could have that was standing around would have been able to see what I said happened um um so to me I didn't feel like it was I guess logical so I was just confused okay and you said they were insinuating that there was a different answer or a can you give an example of that I mean if just trying to change like my wording trying to instead of when I explained to them that I was at the side of his vehicle um when they went back to repeat what I had said they they said so you you reached in his vehicle to show him your phone or something like that and I just remember no I that's not what I said I was trying to tell them exactly what happened they kept stopping me and then they would try and turn what I was saying um and then they'd pass it back to the other person okay at any time during this interview they tell you what was going on with Mr hering no they did everyone said his status or never no and I remember asking detective Hayward um in the beginning kind of you know is what's going on is have you have you talked to anybody else like insinuating can you tell me anything and he just said I feel like he kind of brushed it off and just said that he would have to see um and that's when I asked about calling you know like my family so your knowledge through this whole interview you didn't know the status I never knew no and you were getting questions as you said from both sides correct how do that make you feel um in the beginning when I was telling them what happened I thought it was more of a kind of like a witness account like here's here's what happened uh as it got further into into it I could tell it to me it kind of started feeling like interrogation um but originally I wasn't thinking that it it could have I guess could have been an interrogation because I'm just thinking that it was just it was an incident that had a clear explanation as to what happened have you ever been in a situation like that before never and having gone through that situation and here are in court is there anything You' learned from this situation or that sticks in your mind uh from all this four years later four and a half years later that not everybody is going to have a reaction that you think they're going to have and that clearly trying to do the right thing is not the right answer you think you're ever going to help help anybody else try to help anybody ever again y just the state have cost examination yes okay take a [Applause] [Applause] minute are we still going to need it right now do you plan to play anything else attorney Tucker I I think go back to the I know we're doing up there understand not these specialist but I think you can handle it and I don't anticipate okay you call thank you so much AR you just discussed you remember having an interview on May 7 2019 with Detective Moren and detective Hayward correct and you recall during that interview when you were discussing the original incident that occurred on Clark Howell that your vehicle was almost struck by Mr hering correct correct it was not struck no it was not and that you were able to stop your vehicle before he came through the intersection correct and at that time you were able to go around and you pulled up on the sidewalk and waited to call the police correct and while you were on scene at Clark house you had no issues with Mr Herring correct no none you never spoke to him directly no you didn't see any weapons on him no you never got close to him to smell any odor of alcohol on no I did not and he didn't threaten you in any way no it did not and you never told the detectives or the police that Terry Robinson told you he was shuck I did yes you told the police I told 911 dispatch let's talk about 911 dispatch now you also stated that when Mr hering took off from the incident location you were already at your vehicle correct and you had gotten into your your vehicle correct I was sitting in my vehicle on the phone correct and Terry Robinson and Mr Kimble were still in the street correct and you stated that he waved you over yes and the only thing you heard Terry Robinson say was go go go correct that's your testimony today correct so he never told you to take a picture of the tag not that I remember no and you also testified today that you never heard the 911 dispatch give you a warning not to chase no I never said that I said that she told me that she wanted me to be safe and I said that from what I took it as was that she didn't want me to Chase and when I explained to her I wasn't chasing I was just simply staying with him until the police officer could get to us in the 911 dispatch indicated to you approximately four times to either not chase Mr Herring and go back to the scene correct incorrect I only heard it one time and she told me not to chase to be safe she never told me to go back to the scene until after I had told her that I was behind him and that she wanted me to be safe and in doing so she said that she wanted both of us to go back for I approach the I'm handing you what has been previously marked in States exhibit 40 which is a copy of the 911 transcript if you can review that the it's in its entirety or just what you're referencing you can review the entire transcript you ready yes all right you see on page one female caller dispatcher tells you okay can you get his tag number your response hold on he's driving away um it's a red red Dodge Dakota give me one second hold on okay so he is going west down Clark Howell no I'm sorry Down Forest Parkway dispatcher okay so couldn't you couldn't get a tag number your response no but I'm catching up to him right now and the dispatcher tells you okay ma'am we actually do not want you to chase him we just want you to be safe it's the first time they tell you not to chase him correct she didn't tell me not to she just said that they didn't want me to because of my safety at least is the way that I interpreted interpreted I'll give you that so they told you that they do not want you to chase him correct correct and what did you say next you can read it I understand okay and the dispatcher tells you after that it's not safe to chase him second time correct that's what the transcript SC said when we're listening to it I don't remember hearing that but and can you read what your response was I understand 100% I'm not going I'm sorry I'm just going to get the tag number um if nothing else but I am going west Down Forest Parkway and I'm almost up to him so you told the dispatcher that you understood 100% correct that I needed to be safe correct and the dispatcher States after that okay after you provide the tag number which you provide the tag number before you make contact with Mr Heron correct correct cor and once she gets the tag number from you she tells you okay so if you could go back to that location where the incident happened because someone is actually on the way to you guys now is that correct correct so there should be no confusion that she told both of you to go back to that location well if you if you keep it's not confusion it's just more to the conversation but you said your interpretation was that she advised you thought that she was advising you and Mr hering to return to the incident Loc correct because that's what she says in the next line okay I'll let you read it read the entire response from dispatch from what the transcript reads is you know from the beginning okay female caller dispatcher dispatcher okay so if you could go back to that location where the incident happened because someone is actually on the way to you guys now and Terry Robinson and Mr Kimmel were still at that location correct that was two out of the four Terry Robinson and Mr Kimble were still at that location correct and that's the third time she's telling you to not continue to follow Mr hering and go back to the location no that's when she told me to go back to the location the first time she didn't say anything about not following all right and so what is your response to the dispatch at that time you can read the next paragraph that there's a police officer okay well there is a police officer there but he is drunk I'm not I'm not I'm sorry but I'm here to tell you I'm not not going to follow him because he's going to cause another accident so I will stay behind him until an officer can get to us but until then I'm not moving right so you were aware that dispatcher did not want you to continue to follow Mr Herring correct sure is that yes yes all right and the dispatcher tells you after that you know that's what I want I want you guys to go back to the location where it happened and an officer would be out there momentarily so that's a fourth time she's telling you again don't follow and head back to the incident location correct incorrect okay so what am I missing she said which in the transcript it reads differently than what you can hear on the call I'm talking about the transcript that's before you miss pay I'm I'm just speaking from Facts of what I I've known I'm asking you to she could allow the witness to finish answering the question instead of interrupting her the defendant is she get her question answered if she allow her to finance your response the defendant is non responsive to the question I'm only asking her about the transcript that's in front of her so I'm going to overrule the objection and Miss B will answer the question that's been posed okay you can explain after you've um indicated whether she's correct or not correct so can you repeat your question the dispatcher for a fourth time indicated to you that she wanted you to return to the incident location correct correct and not for a fourth time that she wanted me to not follow okay you testified that you didn't cut Mr Herring off on Riverdale Road you saw him stopped in the turnning lane is that correct is that your testimony I said I saw him stopped in the turning lane and I never used the terminology cut him off because in my eyes I was still in my lane of travel and do you remember telling the detectives on May 7th 2019 that you got in your Jeep you followed Mr Herring you told the dispatch that you were following him and she told you that she didn't advise it she told you to get his tag number you got the tag number by the time you got to the end right when I got to rivale Road correct you're on objection this this is a very long question if she break it up maybe uh the winess could understand it and answer a little bit clear your response and I'm asking her if that's what she said that's a statement that she would have made to the detectives I'm asking her was that a statement that she made to detectives okay so I I'll overrule the objection it's not a compound question she's just asking if that's actually what she said so Lo it so if you if you're asking me if I remember word for word what I said 4 and a half years ago I canot say that I do remember exactly what I said and do recall that you told them that you came around that curve and you had an opportunity to get in front of him if that's what I said then I don't remember like I said exactly it was 4 and a half years ago there was hours worth of interview so and do you recall telling the detectives that you got in front of him and I stopped in front of him and I got out okay you recall that again I don't remember word for word what I said I would have assumed that I would have explained what happened which you were able to see in the pictures so it's your testimony today that you did not cause him to stop his vehicle correct for I'm showing you what has been is that your Jeep it it was and do you see how your vehicle is angled toward the red Dodge Dakota no I see his vehicle's angle towards mine okay I can give you a better View [Applause] showing you what has been previously at n states8 now is your vehicle slightly ahead of Mr her's vehicle slightly ahead yes and is your right passenger tire turned towards the right toward his vehicle the tire is turned but the vehicle is not and so in order for you to get in that position you had to turn your steering wheel to the right towards Mr herring's vehicle correct towards the lane and his vehicle is in that lane correct at the time it was further back so no so if it was further back you had to turn your vehicle in front of his vehicle correct no so how did you end up in that position in this meaning like with the cars connected or with me with you partially in his Lane with my front tire partially in his Lane my wheel was turned now you testified that you walked up to him and you were as it sound like you described it calmly telling him to that the 911 dispatch wanted him to go back to the scene correct and telling him calmly that you were on the phone with 911 what I mean you you you say calmly do you mean like was I iate or was I was I louder that is your testimony today that you did not get out of your vehicle and run up to Mr herring's vehicle telling him to get out of the car correct and you never once got out of your vehicle and go up to him and tell him to get out of the [ __ ] car well everyone heard I did and so at no point on that 911 tape did you ever tell him to stop I did go back to the scene I did and did you hear that on a 911 conveniently know on okay and so I believe you testified that as you were at Mr herrings window his vehicle moved forward towards your Jeep correct um I was in the vehicle but yes correct while that vehicle was moving forward correct so do you remember speaking with the detectives okay for for for may I approach owner yes you may I'm handing you what been prev Mark State exibit 41 which is a copy of the transcript of your interview with Detective Mo and detective Hayward can you turn to page 11 the page number will be at the top of the page [Applause] [Applause] okay and down at the bottom of the page um where it says your name and it starts with and yes and can you read that paragraph and he's just like who are you who are you I said I'm no one but I'm on the phone with dispatch I'm on the phone with the police you need to stop you just caused that accident and he's like yeah okay I got something for you and that's when he pulled forward and detective Mo asked you so at this time it was just words being exchanged there was no he stopped and then re what did you respond uh she stopped and I responded saying no contact and she responded no contact at all yet and what was your response right so at the time his car pulled forward there was no contact between you and Mr Herring correct there's between the vehicles so when detective Moore said there were just words being exchanged there was no contact is your position that she was just talking about the vehicles that's what I would assume yes so words in vehicle yes question respon I'll move on y okay I will sustain the objection you can move on with your next question is now is your testimony today that you've never had your finger on the trigger it is can you turn to page 49 okay all right down at the bottom of the page where you see your name and it starts off I mean can you read that paragraph I mean he's almost fully turned by pulling and I think that was more so just a matter of us kind of going back and forth with him like this Hannah is showing the position he is in and he's pulling and after he tried to pull the trigger when he came back around is when I had my hand on the trigger and um he was he still was squeezing reaching pulling turning but I'm pretty sure that in prior testimony we were speaking of the trigger guard and can you turn to page 41 okay can you start down where it says your name I pulled it out I pulled it out and I had it up here and detective Hayward asked you where the muzzle was pointed what was your response uh it's more so pointing sideways and he also asked you that he stated so the it was not pointed at Mr hering just raised correct and he stated ready if you had to pull it uh that's what he States yes and on page 42 and detective Hayward States and he reaches out with his right hand so you know there is nothing no weapon or nothing in his right hand correct and what is your response he correct well yes yes and detective hey will ask you could you didn't see no weapons or nothing in his right and what is your response I didn't see anything in his but he didn't have anything in his hands and on page 40 turn to page 40 and at the top I believe that's you respond and I had it my gun in my hand and detective Hayward asked you are you pointing it at him at this time what was your response no I am not I am not pointing it at him but I'm pointing it away no I'm reread that I don't believe that's what that says I'm not pointing it at him but I'm not pointing it away where it goes on to show that I was resting it on the window of the car as I explained I was pushing away and so your testimony today was all of this could have been avoided correct correct and you also stated that you had no intention and you wasn't trying to interject yourself in a situation that you just got away from correct correct but that's in fact what happened on May 7 2019 interjecting myself twice or initially so in the initial incident your vehicle was not struck correct correct and so there was no reason for you to interject yourself in the final conclusion of what happened with Mr Herring as far as that incident was concerned well there's a lot that led up to that so for me to have injected myself to begin with was me doing something that I would have wanted someone else to do for me which was to be a witness for an what I thought was an accident and you're not post certified no I'm not you're not a police officer I'm not nobody deputized you on that day to apprehend anyone no they did not and you also stated that you never had any intention of pulling the trigger correct so when you told Mr Herring that that you would shoot him you were just bluffing it's not a I wasn't bluffing I was as I explained thinking it was a deterrent like I would be able to get away and you said you had training with this firearm yes and in that training you didn't learn that you don't pull a gun unless you're going to use it I learned that you don't put your finger on the trigger unless you're going to use it and it was your testimony today in that interview that your trigger your hand your finger was on the trigger correct my finger was in the trigger on the trigger guard not in the trigger thank you any redir yes ma'am attorney CH yes ma'am okay now they they talked about this 911 tape with you um during this 911 tape is you heard it while you were sitting at the table did it appear sometimes you were talking over the 911 operator and they were talking over you it appeared that way yes okay it did it appear that when they were saying one time we don't want you to chase we want you to be safe that you were giving directions at that time correct could that be the reason you did not hear the first or the second time correct okay now the kept State kept saying that they said don't chase don't chase but you recall them saying be safe and come back to a location correct from my recollection I remember them tell telling me not to chase I told him I wasn't chasing I was just following behind she wanted me to be safe and I told her that I understood that I had no reason to think that I wouldn't be safe okay and the last time from you saying I'm just trying to get his tag how many seconds went by before 911 came even back on the line to talk to you um there was a large gap between both times of her originally asking me can I get the tag and I said no hold on there was a a large gap and then she asked me again if I was able to get the tag and there was another large gap right and and I recall hearing you walking at a fast pace to your car to your Jeep while they were asking about the tag so did you get into your Jeep at that time yes cuz I was sitting on my like my passenger side or standing at my passenger side and you were on the phone concentrating to what 911 was saying correct uh correct yes did you hear any outside noise of the um State officer telling somebody to take a picture of the tag or to get the tag number no so you were doing what you were told to or requested to by 911 yes okay now um stay at asked you a specific question and I think you read the transcripts of you never had your finger on the trigger but a't it true that the portion you read said your hand was on the trigger that's the way that I interpreted it which is why I tried to explain about the previous statements is your hand different than your finger it's a part of okay but it's different when you're holding a gun to have a hand versus a finger on a trigger correct correct and do you recall anybody ever coming in there to get fingerprints to check uh the trigger to see if there were any fingerprints on the trigger no they never checked for fingerprints they never took my fingerprints they never even checked the fact that I had the marks or the ripped shirt or anything like that until way after and did you request them to take pictures or to check that or did someone else um well uh to detective MO is who actually asked the photographer to come in after it was brought to her attention and you mentioned that they were going back and forth uh detective Moore and detective Haywood correct correct and was it kind of a good cop bad cop situation in hindsight yes okay and did it appear they were looking for a certain answer or they were changing your words to get that answer that's what how I explained it that's how I felt okay and now you stated that you know there was no contact UM and you stated you thought it was the vehicle vehicle correct correct was there any contact with the vehicle prior prior to the question they asked at that point there was not but was there had he grabbed you or done anything to you prior to that um prior I'm sorry prior to what are you referencing to the vehicle moving forward and hitting your vehicle and that's the contact you thought they were talking about correct correct correct yes so when he had a hold and then once he grabbed a hold of me after that is when the vehicle's hit which I didn't figure out until after the fact of course now um it said you pulled it out and possibly had pointed it sideways but the gun would have been sideways he stay pushing off of the car correct correct so that when he grabbed your wrist yes so the gun would have been pointing kind of upward or downward not at him when he grabbed your wrist correct correct okay and when he grabbed D he tried to pull the gun intoing it's c your H I'm sorry I thought in Cross you can ask leading questions or ask questions about what they redirect at this point you're not cross-examining you're redirecting so I will sustain the objection as to leaded W so what was the position of the gun uh as was asked by the state when it was resed on it was in my hand and I was like this so it was like towards the steering wheel I guess is where it would the natural position would be until it was grabbed and then once it was grabbed it was back and forth but inevitably in the end it ended up to where it was being pulled that way like a away and you were asked about hearing your voice on the 911 tag um did you hear your boy saying stop on the 911 T I couldn't hear any of my what I consider cries for help on the N1 mon do you recall a a Cameron Williams that came and testified that had a video yes okay and do you do you recall after the state had taken him back to refresh his memory and then he came back to finish his testimony do you recall hearing the video I do what did they say in the video you can hear me saying stop stop over and over again and the phone was right there close to you it was so obviously just wasn't allowed enough to be on the 911 tap I mean my voice projection didn't change for me yelling from get out of the car to stop so I I don't know how it picked up one and not the other and it stated at state requested that this could have been avoided and asked you that question you recall that I do how could it been avoided um initially me not trying to do the right thing and in the end I don't know just trying to stay away from the original scene put it that way okay so there's you said at the beginning but at the end it could have been avoided a different way I believe if there wasn't if he wasn't trying to take it from me it would have never went off and you would have never pulled it hadly a situation that escalate correct okay and you told the detectives as well as the 911 as well as the people around there you never had your finger on the trigger correct and if anything your hand was on the trigger guard but that's where your hand's rest is alongside yes thank you question thank you anything further [Music] you talked about the fact that it could have been avoided had you not attempted to I guess assist or help but this actually could have been avoided if you not had introduced a gun into this incident correct I introduced a gun too try and save my life nothing further on um she asked the question to interject yourself what is the objection he's already directed the wi he already redirected the and you're saying I think I can redirect again what you've done another question question um I'm going to sustain the objection do have you concluded uh with this witness attorney obviously I'm yes I I you may St does the defense have another witness not that should have there you know your honor nothing so the defense rests at this time yes ma okay um does the state intend to use any rebuttal Witnesses yes judge okay um can councils please approach I council's approach again for just a minute please ladies and gentlemen of the jury I am going to release you at this time for the evening and ask that you return tomorrow at um well hopefully you'll get here by 8:30 so that we can promptly start start at 9:00 um you are released for the evening with the instructions that I previously gave they still apply no discussion no social media searches um all the instructions that I've given and uh hopefully you'll have a good evening and we'll see you back here tomorrow at 8:30 thank you so much so just to place on the record what was um discussed at the bench uh we're going to conduct the charge conference or pre-charge conference at this time um the state will call its robort will witness tomorrow at 9:00 um but at this time we can go ahead and look at the charges and determine what uh will be read to the jurors tomorrow um attorney Tucker were you able to receive a copy uh I believe theer came out and made a copy for everyone of mine okay I'm not sure if she gave it to them or not I think what what was discussed in her email is kind of similar to what I wrote All Over the paperwork and I agree some of the I think the majority of the issues brought up I agree with and M are just notes on the charge itself because there's duplicate charges there's gaps there's some other stuff so I think if we go through and make sure that every charge is correct the way it's said and some of ours are the same I think we we go to the order of what it needs to be and that should satisfy that I don't think there's something that I'm going to jump up and really to because all it looks on pattern okay all right so um let me I'm going to step off the bench for just a minute let me just the staff attorneys here so that we can go ahead and try to handle this portion of it um for those of you that are sitting in the courtroom um pretty much we're recessed in terms of any evidence we're just doing charges what the jewelry will be charged with um so you're free to remain here or you're free to leave um this is just something that the court has to handle with coun at this time so I'm going to step off for just a couple minutes and then I'll be back to review the charges State uh was the state able to send um any revisions to the staff attorney yes I've sent um my revisions to staff attorney and defense I don't have any of their suggestions or their requests at revision nothing from defense attorney I have his original request to charge that we did both did in October of 2022 but I don't have anything if there's if there's something more important I have one an email but his comments and suggestions and things along those ons I don't have you do not have and I believe the staff attorney came out this morning take my copy and made copies for all parties that was my understanding and she came back later on and gave me my copy back right but did you email anything to um to Chief assistant or to Ada I I emailed explain that I make my corrections on these documents but it was similar to her um comments and documents and that I would have this present and available and that's what I was understanding the staff attorney did was make copies for all parties okay but they're similar comments and similar statements that I think we sit there and just go through it we can knock it out there's not going to be much objections okay all right give me a second I'll be right back she

Channel: Atlanta News First

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Id: KnCiG4zv27A

Length: 161min 14sec (9674 seconds)

Published: Mon Dec 11 2023