[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
>> Stephen: HEY! MAN ALIVE.
WHOO! WELCOME.
WELCOME ONE AND ALL BACK TO "THE LATE SHOW."
MY FIRST GUEST IS A DOCTOR
AND PRESIDENTIAL MEDAL OF FREEDOM WINNER
WHO YOU KNOW FROM HIS GUIDANCE THROUGH THE COVID-19 PANDEMIC.
PLEASE WELCOME BACK TO "THE LATE SHOW,"
DR. ANTHONY FAUCI. [CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
♪ ♪ [CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]
♪ ♪ NICE TO SEE YOU AGAIN, DOCTOR.
>> Dr. Fauci: GOOD TO BE WITH YOU.
>> Stephen: ALWAYS A PLEASURE TO HAVE YOU ON.
I'VE GOT TO SAY YOU ARE A SPRY 83 YEARS OLD.
[CHEERING] HAVE YOU...
HAVE YOU THOUGHT ABOUT RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT?
>> Dr. Fauci: NO. >> Stephen: NO INTEREST
WHATSOEVER? YOU SERVED UNDER SIX.
>> Dr. Fauci: SEVEN PRESIDENTS.
>> Stephen: SEVEN PRESIDENTS. POLITICIZATION OF SCIENCE IS
DANGEROUS BUT IT'S NOT A NEW THING.
THIS HAS HAPPENED IN THE PAST. YOU'VE DEALT WITH IT IN THE
PAST. HAVE YOU SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THE
WAY IT IS NOW? CERTAINLY JUST A FEW DAYS AGO,
YOUR TESTIMONY IN WASHINGTON, D.C., MADE HEADLINES
FOR THE HOSTILITY. YOUR LONG STR BEING INVOLVED WITH ALL THESE
POLITICIANS, DOES THIS SEEM LIKE SOMETHING NEW TO YOU?
>> Dr. Fauci: QUITE NEW AND DISTURBING.
BACK WHEN I FIRST BECAME DIRECTOR OF THE INSTITUTE,
WHICH -- I HAD BEEN DIRECTOR FOR ALMOST
40 YEARS, IN THE BEGINNING THERE WAS ALWAYS POLITICS.
PEOPLE OF DIFFERENT IDEOLOGY. CENTER, CENTER LEFT,
CENTER RIGHT. THEY DISAGREED.
THEY SOMETIMES WOULD ARGUE WITH EACH OTHER BUT AT THE END OF THE
DAY, THERE WAS CIVILITY AND RESPECT FOR EACH OTHER.
WHAT WE'RE SAYING NOW IS WHAT YOU MENTIONED, STEPHEN, IT'S
VITRIOL AND PURE HOSTILITY. I WOULD GET QUESTIONED IN A VERY
STRICT PUSHING WAVE MAY BE BACK IN OTHER ADMINISTRATIONS.
BUT AT THE END OF THE HEARING, THEY WOULD COME OVER IT TO YOU
AND SAY YOU KNOW, GOOD JOB. SORRY THAT WE HAD TO BE TOUGH
WITH HER QUESTIONING WHAT WE WANT TO GET TO THE RIGHT PLACE.
NOW IT'S PURE ATTACK, WHICH IS TOTALLY --
I BELIEVE IT'S A REFLECTION OF THE PROFOUND DEGREE OF
DIVISIVENESS IN THE COUNTRY WHICH IS VERY DESTRUCTIVE.
>> Stephen: YOUR DOCTOR. IF YOU ARE GOING TO DIAGNOSE...
AMERICA AS A PATIENT RIGHT NOW. HOW WOULD YOU DIAGNOSE US?
WHAT'S OUR -- GIVE IT TO ME STRAIGHT, DOG.
>> Dr. Fauci: I THINK YOU NEED A SURGEON, NOT AN INTERNIST.
>> Stephen: A LITTLE SOMETHING NEEDS TO COME OUT?
WHAT ABOUT -- IF YOU ARE A PSYCHOLOGIST.
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY? >> Dr. Fauci: THERE'S A DEGREE
OF SCHIZOPHRENIA IN THE COUNTRY. IT REALLY IS.
HOW FAR APART PEOPLE CAN BE THAT THEY SEEM TO FORGET HOW MUCH
ALIKE WE ARE. BUT WE'RE ACTING LIKE WE'RE
SLOW, SO DIFFERENT. >> Stephen: CONSPIRACY HAS
SUCH A BIG PART OF THE PUBLIC CONVERSATION.
SEEING PATTERNS WHERE NONE EXIST OR ADDING THINGS TOGETHER INTO
CONSPIRACY THAT IS UNLIKELY. FOR INSTANCE, THERE'S A BELIEF
BEING PUSHED BY SOME OF THE PEOPLE QUESTIONING YOU AND
CONGRESS ABOUT THE IDEA THAT YOUR APPROVAL OF A GRANT THAT
WENT TO A COMPANY THAT GAVE SOME OF THE MONEY TO THE WUHAN LAB
CREATED -- USED GAIN OF FUNCTION TO CHANGE
THE NATURE, THE VIRALITY OF CERTAIN CORONA VIRUSES THAT
BECAME COVID-19 SO YOU ARE TO BLAME FOR COVID-19.
>> Dr. Fauci: YES. AND I ALSO DID IT SO I CAN MAKE
A BILLION DOLLARS FROM THE VACCINES.
>> Stephen: OH, RIGHT. THE IDEAS THAT YOU HAD A DEAL
WITH PFIZER AND MODERNA AND ASTRAZENECA.
HOW MUCH OF THAT IS TRUE? 90%?
95%? COULD THE CORONAVIRUS HAVE BEEN
DEVELOPED AT WUHAN AS PART OF THE GAIN OF FUNCTION STUDY?
>> Dr. Fauci: NOT FROM THE GRANT THAT WAS GIVEN BY THE NIH
TO STUDY THE VIRUSES THEY WERE STUDYING.
>> Stephen: WHY NOT? >> Dr. Fauci: THE NATURE OF
THOSE VIRUSES THAT WERE STUDIED WERE EVOLUTIONARY SO FAR DISTANT
FROM WHAT TURNED OUT TO BE SARS-COV-2 THAT NO MATTER WHAT
YOU DID WITH THOSE VIRUSES YOU WOULD NOT BE WILL TO DO THAT.
THAT IS IN ME THAT -- THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT SOMEWHERE
IN CHINA IT ISN'T CONCEIVABLE THAT SOMEONE MAY BEEN WORKING ON
SOMETHING BRINGING IT OUT FOR THE ENVIRONMENT.
THAT'S THE REASON WHY MAKE AN OPEN MIND AS TO WHAT THE CAUSE
OF IT IS. >> Stephen: SO A LOT OF
CONTROVERSY ABOUT WHAT THE ORIGIN NOW THAT IS.
A, WHY IS IT SO IMPORTANT THAT WE KNOW?
AND B, IS THERE ANYTHING NEW WE'VE LEARNED RECENTLY?
>> Dr. Fauci: WELL, FIRST OF ALL, IT'S IMPORTANT TO KNOW
BECAUSE YOU WANT TO MAKE SURE YOU PUT INTO PLACE THINGS THAT
WOULD PREVENT THAT FROM HAPPENING AGAIN.
SO SINCE WE UNLIKELY WILL KNOW, BECAUSE OF THE REAL SOLICITATION
OF ANY COOPERATION BETWEEN CHINA AND THE UNITED STATES.
>> Stephen: THEIR PROCESSES ARE BLACK BOXED.
>> Dr. Fauci: AND THE HOSTILITY BETWEEN THE COUNTRIES
IS SUCH THAT THERE IS NOT GOING TO BE COOPERATION.
SO IF YOU SAY IT'S ONE OF THE OTHER, IT'S EITHER A LAB LEAK OR
IT'S A NATURAL OCCURRENCE, IN MY OPINION AND IN THE OPINION OF
MOST VIROLOGISTS WHO UNDERSTAND THE PROCESS, IT IS MUCH MORE
LIKELY THOUGH NOT DEFINITIVE THAT IT WAS A NATURAL OCCURRENCE
FROM DRIPPING FROM AN ANIMAL INTO A HUMAN AT THE WUHAN
MARKET. BUT SINCE IT'S NOT DEFINITIVE,
THERE'S STILL A POSSIBILITY THAT SOMEWHERE IN CHINA, SOMETHING
WAS GOING ON WHERE PEOPLE BROUGHT IN A VIRUS FROM THE
ENVIRONMENT AND IT ESCAPED FROM THE LAB.
SO GIVEN THAT THERE ARE TWO POSSIBILITIES, THE WAY TO DO IT
IS TO TRY TO PREVENT BOTH OF THOSE POSSIBILITIES FROM
HAPPENING AGAIN. PUT BETTER CONSTRAINTS ON THE
KINDS OF EXPERIMENTS. THEY SHOULD AS GOOD FACILITIES
AND PEOPLE ARE WELL-TRAINED AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE
ANIMAL-HUMAN INTERFACE. IT IS 75% TO 80% OF THE NEW
VIRUSES, INFECTIONS THAT COME OUT ARE WHAT WE CALL ZUNE ATTIC.
THEY JUMP FROM AN ANIMAL RESERVOIR TO A HUMAN.
WE SAW IT WITH HIV/AIDS. WE SEE IT WITH INFLUENZA.
WE SEE IT WITH EBOLA. SO THAT'S NOT SOMETHING IT'S
UNUSUAL, IT HAPPENS A FAIR AMOUNT.
>> Stephen: WE HAVE TO TAKE A QUICK BREAK.
WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK WITH MORE DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, EVERYBODY.
STICK AROUND.
