Vietnam Veterans: Full Interview with RJ Howell

so tell me where you I can't recall were you drafted or did you join I volunteered I knew that I wasn't going to be able to go to college for several reasons back then you have to have pretty high a CT and SAT scores and mine were not and didn't have the money anyway and then my draft number was between two and ten so I knew I was gonna be drafted so I joined my dad was a career Navy veteran he was a naval corpsman in World War two starting May 42 and he got out sometimes 46 so was he in more war to you then he was a Navy corpsman with Marine Corps and world war ii landed on several islands and he was out for three years then went back in and he was a navy veteran for 25 years they told him this rotation came that he had to go to vietnam and he told him no he had two wars World War two in Korea Vietnam wasn't his sworn he didn't really want to have anything to do with it ended up being my war okay he was he was Navy and then you you joined a different branch I joined the army my brother joined the army and my sister joined the army Wow well ship blows up sinks at least somebody dropping bombs ain't dig a hole and get in it but we just I just went in the army I wanted to be a paratrooper in Special Forces Special Forces training and I got hurt pretty bad with a parachute malfunctioned didn't open properly and got tangled up in those trees and it put my vertebrae in the lower back and I had a I lived for about a year and a half my left leg whatever and next thing you know I got more just go to Vietnam I have profile but I couldn't take care of the problem till I got the Fort Lewis got the Fort Lewis Washington and I said oh i got this profile well you got to take care of that when you get the camera on bay so I get the Cam'ron Bey and I said I got this profile it's okay we'll make you a clerk or truck driver somewhere that's it okay next thing I know I'm on a chopper to Cam Ranh Bay our chopper it was a c-124 Cam Ranh Bay I mean Quinn Yan and their got process of what have you and then I was shipped to LZ uplift and well the first sergeant was doing the paperwork the company was out and they got hit and there were six of us that came in and so they loaded this up and out in the boonies I went and that's where I stayed even with a profile with a back injury Wow and even got injured more so so you're out there I mean tell me what the boonies were like describe that place hot miserable temperatures 120 humidity anywhere from 90 hundred percent always sweating I always have to take salt tablets have to drink as much what he's possibly can get and it was just hot miserable but it was pretty country too you know I've never seen rice paddies before I learned real quick what they were I never seen whether they call those big ox they had out there you know they pull those plows what-have-you and I've never really seen oriental people except navy bases where we were stationed out you know we've seen some Koreans and some Japanese American citizens that were the military but these are completely different type of people and they live like they lived back in 14th century you know no communications no telephones they live in grass huts and what-have-you and and they they just used bathroom over they had to choose that I guess like we seem to do so many times and there's just a completely different animal altogether what you're used to but we but kind of and Fort Louis when we went over there we were at ole first off by a lot of the officers I was briefing us but to expect over there to commit it into people the culture and the problems that were prevalent that our Pacific assignment was not necessarily people think the winner war it was basically to secure South Vietnam from the insurgency's which were the Vietcong until they completely were decimated and in the Tet Offensive and then North Vietnam got involved in and basically we got involved big time then but it was basically we were ordered to secure South Vietnam so the suffering Tamizh people can decide how they wanted to live their lives what type of government they wanted to go communist fine go comedies we'd get out well a lot of people don't understand that that's was the mission and never was to invade North Vietnam Cambodia whatever you know it was just as secure to south so they could decide what they wanted to do so how did you get along with the people never had much interaction with the people the villages we'd go through during the daytime they treated you fine they shared their food and if they had any beer or whatever they shared it with you we shared our candy bars with the kids and stuff like this but then at night you knew some of them was gonna put on those black pajamas and come looking for you so we go about a click click and a half down the trail whatever and we just set up an ambush wait for see if they got I'm sure enough here they come someone would come anyway you know and you can always tell then all those villages there's always a Viet con someplace you know you can tell them when you walk in the atmosphere would change and you can tell you know that they were being controlled and that there was at least one or two Viet Cong insurgents there watching how the people were reacting to us things of this nature you said the atmosphere would change what did it feel like well you know we would see the village it's a lot of times we knew where certain villages were at and we knew which villages had been friendly to us for but when you come into a village now sunny you know people are going about their business on Sunday they stiffen up they do one these numbers you know eyeballs and they're looking around not at us but at their own people whatever and then you knew something was up you knew Vic Khan were in the village are in the area had been there threatened them or whatever you are was there threatened them right now yeah you know I've seen this kind of things of this nature you can tell that some people there were under duress then oh yeah you knew it right off the bat see we're going to villages sometimes that were friendly to us and that the village would be killed and what-have-you we've seen them at times where they've taken pregnant women and hang him up by the wrists and slit the their bellies open and the unborn child just dangling by those umbilical cords this is how they treated them kept them in line and regardless when anybody says but to common especially the oriental communists they they were not very forgiving and very kind to the wrong people like to dis use a Mis cannon fodder you know you know North Vietnamese major we captured even a minute that effect you know they draft a lotta their own people to fight in the war women and children and young men and they just used mr. cannon fodder you know if we lost fifty eight thousand people and one made you tell me they already lost over me and people you know just a conflict or whatever knew they couldn't beat us but they knew several things that a lot of us young boys didn't know where are they they knew that the American people were used to having worse one in four years our lease in two hours like on John Wayne movie I was kind of surprising to me and he said American people don't like large body counts them they're used to it you know human life didn't mean anything to and number three they knew we wait long enough we'd have to leave well they'd been there pretty close ten years I was back in 1971 when I was there and I says and said that in your American the politicians are cricket yeah I like that anyway you're not telling me nothing new there and I said what do you mean cricket they said you ever wonder why the Democrats won't let the Republicans or Nixon them declare war I never thought about it but I thought about it all the last 45 years system what have you concluded well simple if you declare it a war just like World War two you destroyed the military the enemy military like we didn't World War two didn't you destroy the infrastructure if they're still fighting didn't you get her destroyed the people will the fight to support the government we were not permitted to do certain things the Air Force and Navy were only permitted to destroy certain targets kind of weird that I found out years later the North Vietnamese would say here's our target you can hit and our Congress would tell the Navy and the Air Force you have to hit those targets well there was nothing there you know and I found that out years later sure enough yeah that's what they're some of the Air Force Navy Postum oh yeah hit the same target overawed nothing there why do you think we're doing quick the politicians I think our political agenda at that time I was a registered Democrat but I'm a conservative Democrat at that time the Democratic Party was being controlled or taken over by well radicals left wings I like to call them now as socialist communist progressive liberal Democrats they left the Conservatives out you know and and so and I think the you know it was just an agenda because the peace treaty if you look at it had to do a paper on in college that a college professor and let's see what was a social science he said the world can change with the action of one person and of course Hitler proved that I Stalin proved it Mayo and China proved that in the in Castro and let's prove their what have you and then he come up and I said that if anybody in here to prove that the American army was not defeated I'll give you being the class you won't have to show up well I'd already dis was seventy-five I was at Rollins College in Winter Park Florida getting a degree in criminal justice and I'd already seen that on TV in April 2nd after Nixon resigned the Democrats won the house and then Senate all those protestors got elected well it's payback time now a lot of people my generation and after don't understand that the peace treaty that even the Russians in the Chinese made the North Vietnamese and the Viet Cong signed to end the pro the war to themselves stated that if South Vietnam had to expend a bullet lost a rifle tank plane to what have you we would supply it one for one and I think it was a provision in there that their full-scale invasion we would come back all right well when Nixon resigned because of what he did and the Democrats took control Fulbright and them cut the money off in April 75 I think was April 5th Ford went to the full joint House and Senate and begged him on national TV to honor the peace treaty to release the funds and the equipment and all the Democrats except for fuel walked out and Fulbright made the statement on national TV and I'll never forget this and he didn't give a damn about South Vietnam it can go communist no more than Arkansas losing the Texas and the football game well April 25th for 27th Saigon fell because right there in Cambodia where the dealt there were a lot of DB I thought you meant rolls in they had 15 divisions and they had a company of t-34 tanks and from that section there the Saigon is only about 150 miles and it didn't take long for 15 divisions going in take it and it was over regardless what the South Bend meas army was doing in central section what havean wants to cap on the government felt it was over so basically to me to this day Democrats gave that war way especially Fulbright in when they walked out American soldier didn't lose the battle we did what we was told to do the running surgeon sound so South Vietnam could decide for how they wanted to run their own country and you know it was that way because we had to go into Cambodia illegally to take the fight to them because they was building up their mass summer we knew it we saw it you know you can't help see the Ho Chi Minh Trail you see divisions at the division of troops and tanks coming down that trail they didn't working on anything you know but but that's the way it was and ever since then American people especially the government won't let the US Army win any war ever again it's just one skirmish after another I assume for the rest of our lives that's my take on it anyway you can cut all that out later [Music] so you're how old when you were sent to those jungles I joined the army 19 right after high school ten days after high school I joined up in January called the delay Entry Program and when I got to basic training I was always consider neat too I had one strike and so they know what the basic training and then I to jump schooled in a Special Forces training when I got to Nam even with that profile I was I see 20 years of age but 21 years of age 21 and I was the old man I was the oldest one in my platoon the youngest one in the platoon he was about 17 but he no speaking to English he was what we consider back in a okay he got caught and back then the examining judge would come by or whatever judge it was you don't have this hearing and told me how we're gonna send you back you've been in a County Jail for six months gonna send you back I even join the army so he joined the army you know saying the army five years you know you meet that requirement coming US citizen and then the government told him and says well you go to Vietnam and survive you'll be an instant citizen so here he comes him and a few others like that hardly spoke in the English but they were pretty good fighters they obeyed orders you know they knew enough what have you and so but when I got there it was after what the officers told us the fort Louis don't get our expectations up high and what gave you about winning any conflict because there wasn't that type of war well you can tell they were political officers already we got to camera on bay in this kernel land all 600 of us up they say look to your right your left front and back your fighting front each other you're not fighting for God country are for home or whatever you're fighting for each other and bring back as many as your buddies just possibly can this is what you're fighting for and even eat this I remember this Colonel telling us that he said Tip O'Neill Messam Blom Brown and Ted Kennedy I'm not gonna let you win any conflict or war they've already decided that that was a iOpener for a lot of us young boys and was heavy their own government but do that in these officers but say that but apparently they come to realization that this was a political mess and there was no way out of it except just running this course so you're you're 21 one of the older and your assignment is to bring back as many of your buddies well that's what he said at Cam Ranh Bay of course once I got those the uplift for once heavy was something definitely it was kind of unusual but every 15 20 days was different lieutenant run of the platoon of what have you and I never did knew who the captain was because they came and went first sergeants came and went because they were trying to rotate his bindis younger officers out of this OCS school because you had to be in combat for 30 days longer get that CIB badge and if he was a career going to be a career army officer especially infantry wise what have you to become a general or command staff you had to have that CIB so they'd be running that's that blue badge when these told up here it's got that rifle from the reef around it it's a combat infantry badge okay and you had to be in country in a combat zone situation for 30 days in order to get that CIB badge down and they were running all these non cons and officers and second lieutenants first lieutenant's through there as fast as they could before 'ti we finally left the country I guess to get them that's that badge that experience so they can move up in their career in the military if they chose to stay in so I hardly ever knew who the lieutenant was or whatever most of time didn't have one just we're not in the field by ourselves Wow so you've said uplift a few times what was that that was the up level LLC stands for landing zone paratrooper lingo just like in in World War two market guard and things of this nature they call LZ landing zone it was the uplift and they call the base uplift now that was a primary base it was on highway 1 essentials central Highland Donner's what was the name of the base again LZ uplift ok UPL aft ok it's like it sounds ok don't ask me why they chose the name uplift but they did and that's basically worthy first is second Battalion of the hundred seventy third Airborne Brigade was stationed and I think the second battalion was @lz English about 50 60 miles north of us on highway 1 we were close to the community called bond song and we were about 50 60 miles north of Phuket Air Force Base and about a hundred miles north of quinion but mainly my platoon and a couple other platoons from the 1st battalion operated out of where was it done docto in 1974 I got there there was a humongous humongous battle there docto involving 173rd or what have you well there was still an airbase there it did about 10 miles further towards the Cambodian border there was a couple fire bases there now we call that firebase I was the uplift day I do not know what the artillery people called it and I do not know what the I think it was a 25th division or might have been the first calf infantry that was responsible for guarding the base what they called it but for recall that LZ uplift a because we weren't supposed to be there it was an unofficial base but we're still in South Vietnam we were two miles from Cambodia and by ten miles from Laos so you can probably guess from us why operations for at even though we weren't there even though you weren't there that's Declassified now I admit no it's not still no fact when I came back from Vietnam we were threatened with the Leavenworth we ever did pose the information we were actually fighting that of course to him what are you gonna do since 11 we're so wide I wish I could do it since back Vietnam Lord have been there done that said a little nice choice words we did to you and the commanding officer to base whatever and he said I'm just telling you what they told me to tell you I guess a lot of that had to happen because of the restrictions they put on us or what have you and if you're receiving fire from inside those country don't tell me we can't go after them and protect ourselves what have you people out of your mind they give us restriction as you can't fire on religious temples even though the Vietcong North Vietnamese were using those as their base to fire point because they knew those restrictions well who gave us those restrictions well Congress did and who was controlling the Congress at the time the same people I could care less about today Democrats but anyway well those people giving us the instruction well there were 10,000 miles back home and the officers telling us the command officers well they were 100 miles behind us they weren't there so we pretty well just ignored it you fire us we're taking it out and they love specially in VA they loved using civilians as shields but we had to do it we had to do you know aren't my orders were my instructions were that I remembered from that colonel at Queenie on our camera obey bring back each other how hard was that to do it was hard to shoot through the shield of civilian sit tight but when you see your guys were dropping getting wound to what heavy you just had to do it and you just had to be done and sometimes they use children boys especially come up shine your boots or what have you and then they self detonate and kill themselves and kill the troopers when you see stuff like that and you tell it's going on yet got the children too you know you try not to think about it and I asked my favorite put it out of my mind no I did yeah tears me up every time I think about it I see young children today you hear about car action I was a police officer for years and it always tore me up and had to go to autopsies for children because I'd have those flashbacks those young children never got to grow up like this young child that was inadvertently killed for whatever reason was heavy you know things like that being charged the memory stuff how what about casualties you're on your side they just kept mounting up on their side in our side it was just a useless killing field you know the North Vietnamese and Viet Cong threw away their people almost says easily as our government threw us away so what you feel like I I feel like I was betrayed not only by my government what-have-you but by the citizens of my country you know the protesters was only one percent of one percent of the people and they want college students that's when the term rental mob came in that's basically what there were they just followed most of their communist-led professors of whatever if you can call them professors and they protest it well my question always have for my parents my fiance and all my friends where the hell were you why weren't you protesting against them and making our government honored their commitment to us and let us do our job totally support us why not answer damn have any answer well we watch the party we wrote your letter assistant that yeah fine I said but protesters write me letter to hoping I'd die you know they find out who your name or what have you and then they had assembly line to be writing these letters all these gee I hope you get Carroll hope you get tortured if you become a prisoner you're never gonna come home you know Jane Fonda said they can kill you and all that kind of crap crap comfortably you just just went on burnout latter what I just found your name and sent those guys well wasn't hard to get yeah I mean gummit plastered all over I guess he's nothing yes or they got it yeah I I don't know where they got the name but I can imagine where they got the first time you opened up one of those well we knew what it was we were warned that we probably get some of these letters and what-have-you and then the officers told us the commanding officer told us that it wasn't difficult for the Russian intelligence KGB or would ever get the names of the list of whatever especially when 173rd was there they knew was there at Fort Division the first Marine Division on our first whatever well they pretty well know who those people were you know it's kind of broadcast anyway you go to any military base and probably get the names and it wouldn't be difficult for them to get and they just sit there like assembly line like those letters hate letters and everything else and you'd get them address sometimes I look at a girl's name one who is this you know open it up you know that's what it'd be only got a few like that now you know when you got a chance to read a newspaper of course most of newspapers for three weeks or three months old whatever you can still see the protests and everything going on you can see the handwriting on the wall and you knew what was going on it just big nor did I just put down a bunch of stupid ignorant people and now some of them are running this country do you what did you think about the news media at the time because I mean the war was covered in an entirely different way than other Wars have been one of the biggest mistakes during you know in world war ii the marines did not let news media be in the pacific but they sure all over europe what they you ever wondered why they weren't allowed in the Pacific the Japanese code of conduct was a reason why those Marines had to go in there and kill them all because their code was not to surrender was dishonorable if a Japanese soldier surrendered he was considered dead too as country because he dishonored the Emperor the Sun God on earth to them at the time and their families would be Dishonored and they become homeless they would be non people so they could not surrender a lot of them dead towards you you know but dance early part they could not so her orders were the Marines of what having the army personnel you had to kill them all because they just were not surrendering and in Okinawa my dad would tell me in their regime aware he was that you could hear the explosions in the cave they were put to detonate the grenades and their bodies killed themselves a set of surrendering cause there's more honorable for death for the Emperor didn't watch that surrender alright so you didn't have a but in Europe was different in Vietnam and career I don't know much about the news media but man they were all over Vietnam from every country in the world all over Vietnam except basically where we were at we did have one come with us a smart mouth young lady for I think it was the UPI or something like back then and we just simply told her you're on your own we're going as a hot zone and I'm not going to assign anybody protect you you're on your own young lady she took it I never saw her again we got in the boonies disappeared I don't know what happened to her I went about to expend a man to assign to protect her because those idiots jump up take pictures thinking do well I'm a news reporter I get this press thing the enemy is not going to shoot me or whatever well bullets and grenades don't know who you are and a lot of those young North Vietnamese soldiers 16 17 years old get that automatic weapon a little bit of training all they knew how to do is put that thing a full automatic and just spray the area and they're not gonna be too concerned about a Red Cross for medic because our medics took them off and they're not gonna be too concerned about a female out there taking pictures you know there are dirt object was to kill America's and now I like that said you're an American we don't know what happened to not even to this day so she just disappeared out there that's better never did find her body after the battle was over I don't know if maybe she just decided to step on over to the North fittingly side or maybe they captured her whatever and find out she was a news reporter and released her whatever I never they're fine I didn't know her name didn't well they care there's a combat situation the idiot going out there with a camera yeah you were on your own you know you know the capital it got you well you got to protect this person he looked at you in role as I said no no oh yeah you know you're not carrying a weapon you're on your own you know you're not supposed to be that you shouldn't be there how you doing cinder me and my job I got to protect you and you just can't do it yeah I just watching you unexperienced somebody just to protect an idiot what was the most dangerous when wasn't it it was the uplift us have been safe area because that central highland was pretty well supposed to been under control but you can see Dan the Vietnamese would come in and work to barber shops the garbage detail the laundry and things of this nature and sometimes you can sitting you'd watch them and you see how someone walk kind of funny and they'd be told from one place to hot by the captain huts over there the officers over there that's all over there the ammo dumps right dan used him pace off but he knew what was happening you know there's pacing off for the mortars in the hills they know who's gonna get hit by you you end up catching them what have you if everyone you called to got away with the information jaren I feared God you know even though it was it does safe place what have you on the LZ uplift a that there firebase just outside of docto it was not uncommon had to call in air support almost every other night they would hit it hit it hard come across the board a Cambodian hit the place you know there's a couple thousand NVA troops or whatever then they run back across they can you can't chase them I suppose to book wrap of that next day we're going after you Cambodia you're not you know stop this especially those big 55 millimeter 105 borders coming in at you you know then them suckers hurt and they get close enough the concussions enough to throw in the air 10 12 feet and throw year-round causes your blood vessels to burst blood coming out of your eyes in those years and what havea concussion what have you I never could explain it to my wife or what here but well all that concussion that stuff did until we saw that Saving Private Ryan you know what that opening beach scene you know what the explosion goes off and he just fogged it I said that's it I said that's what I've been trying to explain how it was nice concussions and grenades and mortars to go off and you get caught in that that zone right there what the shrapnel Dinky is nothing but sure messed-up brain is stuff just like a fog where are you injured yes I was injured several times mortar went off and I got peppered from the face chest and what gave you at times if I take my shirt off in the summertime and I get a little red you can see the the white spots all over me where it was just peppered in and the doctor just said just leave it in you know just too much to take out in a lot of times it it would come out I'd be in the shower and what gave you in it just like my when I come back from the war just like I was bleeding there just to rust coming out not quite as bad now in fact I hadn't any haven't had any of that in the past 15 20 years and I got impelled in the chest with a big five inch piece I had a habit of wearing a band early you know what a bandolier is okay and back in the the magazine calls 20 rounds you know and you had six I've had one run this way but I always had a habit after I'd emptied it I'd put the empty one back in because you never know when you can going to get another band or there sometimes their senior boxes of ammo for the m16 but to be loose and you'd have to put them in well if you just don't want to grill having more magazines so I spent empty one there and I had one over my heart when with the 55 millimeter round mortar went off you know such enough than concussion when I finally come to in what have you had a five inch piece sticking out through there and embedding in my chest cluster the heart when our automatic did was just wrapped it up and when they got me back to the aid station which was a portable mass unit that was about one miles behind the fighting and we was in South Vietnam at this time close to the border and I remember the doctor took the next ray of it and he saw it was just pretty close to the heart and he grabbed a pair of pliers he just nicked the thing out you know and he just didn't really stitch it he put some type of effect like a glue and he put the bandage over and everything else they said how do you feel like I said sore there you go be sore for a couple of days but it's equipment you know back to the field but I didn't he sent me back to the hospital and then we went home okay all of us from there went home and after we got out of hospital that quinion we're going back to the field we got met by an officer from the AG said you six men are going home well some of the guys still had six months to go hey my cigar stuff like that say no you're going home your units been disbanded you're going home I said okay so we get the camera on bang they put us on the plane we get the fort loss and that's when we were processed got in nine o'clock at night to the plane at Seattle Washington they want to come in to the airport already down at the end of the tarmac down there and have all those deuce in the half and everybody got on that cuz all the protesters are out front and we go out the back gate whatever fort louis it was by nine o'clock at night by six o'clock the next morning we had our shots we had our delousing baths and all this kind of stuff we had a new uniforms we've been fed got paid and got everything else and didn't got that warning and then we was taken back to the airport did they take it to the front gate and I see in the firm's and stuff cuz worse events now and what all they go home if you wanted three up they want to let anybody read up because there were too many people in the military at the time so did the protesters know you'd been in Vietnam when you came out that front well luckily that day was six o'clock in the morning I guess they were all asleep they got bombed up in marijuana stuff the night before you didn't see the tents out there everybody it currently had a you know like a u-shaped driveway so to speak like most of them you sell the tents and everything out there and they were all just laying around in the morning do 6 o'clock in the morning you know it was May 17th 1971 and they were all asleep I guess it got all bombed out of their minds not before you know little parties whatever and I remember winning got the with the Northwest Godsey Stern didn't have a plane going to Daytona Beach not anytime soon but I got the northwestern and they firmly told landed and when I got on the eastern for the Daytona Beach but it was really unusual there well I'm not unusual well it was for me nobody will look at me nobody would say anything to me stuff some of the pilots I guess we're Air Force pilots Navy pilots what have you been in maybe World War two or what have you Korea and but the resident regular people went in Tacoma and we've got to Atlanta I got the Daytona Beach nobody will I got there for my parents and fiancee arrived and I stood there for about 40 minutes and I saw these people walking by and nobody nobody but I see me they did direct her eyes nobody would say or even look at me were you in uniform yeah mm-hmm Joe was so that was their signal to avert their eyes I guess it was No what do you make of that well at the time I just I just I shouted at the Daytona Beach I said people you can look at me I said I don't have any disease I'm not gonna hurt you I'm not gonna bite your heads off I said I'm a human being I'm Americans just like the rest of you everybody look at me except for this pilot no no no they would not they just walked right on pass I screamed look at me I'm a human being like anybody else and they wouldn't they just walked by except for one pilot an older man he come up and he said ignore the fools shirk my hair he said as a pilot in Nam anyone oh they're my parents and my fiance showed up I went on protecting uniform off never put it back on so are you proud of this service in Vietnam looking back at it well you know when I came home I had three choices a lot of said three choices you can become homeless like a lot I'm dead I can go to prison like a lot of them did I even kind of a police officer like I did and I thought I got my frustrations out yeah oh you wanted to fight I'll fight was on you know that type of thing you know and of course back then we didn't have to worry about it too much you know did have walkie-talkies back there when I first started and Daytona Beach area and I sir didn't have body cameras or what did anybody with cell phones like they are today or what have you in pretty well if an old boy didn't want to go to jail he wanted to fight what the fight was on if the ambulance took me to the hospital to get my nose fixed or whatever well he was next to me you know and basically I found most of the police departments at that time hired Vietnam veterans because we knew how to take orders and about that was about the time the Miranda warning was coming in but we really wasn't quite formally like it is today or what have you and if there was any riots we took care of the riots you know worried about your rights later we took care of the right stopped it because if you don't continues well people burn down the hole see what they're doing today to please back off well people burn into towns down you know because this is a new strategy don't stop it let them get the frustration or anger out burn the town down shoot the police shoot anybody don't interfere let him burn themselves out and then they'll go home how stupid can you be back then not I mean having that we're putting a stop to it and that's what they hurt us for you know but then over the years out the 20 years they finally got rid of a lot of us is retired they got the younger gentler Police Department in its up right now I don't know what's happening what do you think residual effects on me not trust in society don't trust people don't believe in my government I could care less if why shouldn't burn to the ground or what have you you know politicians are liars and you know and I can't I can't really imagine how stupid some people are to keep keep putting these professional politicians back in power to promise you everything give you crumbs and didn't blame your failure still on somebody else no but people buy it I still vote for these idiots I put them back in Washington or Austin or wherever they're called professional politicians that's how they know how to do they couldn't function without somebody telling them when to vote for this do that or what have you you said you still see the children do you have some PTSD well I am surprised that my wife stayed with me all these many years I can't tell you how many TVs I've had to replace windshields I had replace effects the sheet rock in the house replaced because back then nobody recognized PTSD well we call it battle fatigue and I didn't even know the term PTSD until I called when I moved out here my back was giving me problems so I called the VA in Waco I said I need to have this back to mine like that because I injured it well they got the paperwork says yeah we see it but you had to apply within two years after you got out I said what do you mean apply for two years you had to give it that package and everything when you got out how to contact the VA I said hell I didn't even know the VA existed until 84 and then I thought the VA was just no folks home for soldiers it's what all I thought it was I said the only package I got was the GI Bill for school and GI Bill for home or business that's it and I remember this old little boy and stuff on Saturday told everybody that you had two years that's they don't call me a liar you know but when I had to go to Austin I looked him up that's before they had all the guards and those some machines and what gave you you had to walk through you know metal detectors and stuff and I walked in and found that little boy and I went after it you know and then was heavy kindly and an old veteran stepped in and told me yeah he's right man they didn't tell these guys about the VA just strict education and home because it was processing six hundred to a thousand of us a day to just couldn't and those little corporals of what he would he could probably care less them so they were just doing a job to go through their requirements some of them were drafting whatever they really didn't care they've just done a job and give you this package with just the education and about how to buy a home that's all mine consisted of and I didn't and all I had was just a dd-214 take home that was it nothing else like to bring home today you know they give them two CDs of what have you wanted a whole personnel file and what were their medical records we didn't get that stuff and now I'm trying to apply where's my medal correction all that got burned up in in Kansas City back in 75 72 and all that kind of stuff our Vietnam still hasn't that big warehouse that they left and Cam'ron Bay that's what the department the owner told me Oh I said well that's great he said yeah you might want to call them they might have him find them for you soon to you I said they're really nice do we need okay just since the vacuum cleaner started okay so you're you're back in the states have you been to the one of the things we're gonna do with this project I think I don't know that we had this figured out before or when we came to Pampa but we're bringing the the wall that heals half-size replica of the Vietnam Memorial Wall to Amarillo in December we didn't choose the date but December here's what we got have you been to the wall in in DC no you sound like you have a reason for that I don't want to go to Washington DC because I'm afraid that I would probably just loose it to buy salt congressman or senator and I don't want to go to Washington DC because she's really me there's nothing there for me now I did see the replica of the wall when it came to Pampa many years ago and I finally forced myself to go see it and I found certain names and I lost it so I won't go see the wall again just because you lost it or yeah you try to keep all that in it's a part of me you know my dad never forgot his experience he had nightmares what-have-you and now understand it's a part of me even my mistakes in normal what have you how I feel the things of this nature you know I talk about burning down Washington DC but I probably never would and I probably wouldn't hurt a senator nothing now but in my younger days I probably would have when I come back to Nam I probably would have I wonder does my anger was the first part of the 30 35 years of my coming home I'm getting no more mellowed out now I never thought I'd lived this long there have been many days I put that 357 in my mouth has sucked on the barrel but it never went off and I have two children grown and I got three grandkids and the thoughts of that suicide is not quite as horrendous as it was when I came back psychiatrist is smart a psychiatrist anyway you got survivor guilt oh no Sherlock really well I'm sorry I said really took a genius or somebody with a doctor degree to figure that out I could have told you that you know but that's what they call it survivor's guilt and they're right you always ask yourself why me not this other guy especially when he was standing next to you and when the border went off and he's dead and you're not I don't know I have no no idea why the nightmares aren't quite as Rinna says they used to be but they're still there they become like old friends if they don't show up at least once a week I figure I'm dead you know just kind of expect it it's just just there it doesn't go away I don't care what everybody tells you if they tell us it's gone away in just a map well they never were in a combat situation that might have been rare in salon type of personnel never even saw no fighting or whatever but the real combat soldiers nothing saw it doesn't go away it's with me for the rest of my life and I just learned to cope with it all the veterans from World War two did the same thing you know a Korean or what have you and these guys came back from Iraq at the same thing that's life excuse me it seems like your generation of War veterans is trying to make sure that the same things that happened after Vietnam don't happen with the newer generation of soldiers well you can't stop it because this is the way society yes American people get bored after a while their attention span isn't but two seconds you know in this generation they can't read can't write the schools are more worried about their grading system that the state has get an aid to a deal whatever and instead of rather Johnny can read or write they don't teach cursive in school anymore they don't teach history in school anymore so if we got a couple of generations of failures now the veterans today are all volunteers regardless what anybody says they're not ever going to be able to wind out war over there because of the way society is today nobody expects a world war like it was in World War two where all the countries were involved you have two sides you know and regardless what what happens we get rid of al-qaeda here comes Isis figurative Isis here comes something else it's never going to end you can't win this type of war all you can do is just keep it contained in one area of the world and this is what American people don't understand especially politicians don't understand and I ain't so sure you need the generals understand that anybody with common sense can tell you any going end you know there's been people who care less about our way of life for years have been for centuries been trying to destroy it you know now we've got a really committed enemy that wants to destroy it and our own people trying to help them you know I saw but it's not gonna end this type of wars never get here now what would you is there anything you would do differently about going into that war what Vietnam yeah I don't know I have no idea the concept at the time was probably the correct concept to stop communism wherever you could because the fear of domino effect was just correct in regardless when anybody says we are the policeman's of the world the people the good people we really care for American what have you they see us as that I mean after all with two wars now we had to go help Great Britain and France you know in other places around the world or what have you Saudi Arabia depends on us what hey we to keep Isis and to radical Islam at bay and what have you to keep them kind of pinned up in one certain area in regardless Minh everybody says that's what this country was founded on depending on what your religious beliefs are and what you believe but I happen to believe this is one reason why this country was founded what have you and allowed to thrive and become great at one time like it was but nowadays I don't think people American paper could really care less as long as they got there there are coffee Starbucks and they got to a little cell phones they could care less about anything else and got the government to pay for their marijuana or pay for their medical supplies or what-have-you they could care less well I appreciate your telling your story

Channel: Panhandle PBS

Views: 17,731

Rating: 4.625 out of 5

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Id: D_eH5WAMtXw

Length: 55min 28sec (3328 seconds)

Published: Wed Feb 14 2018