Turkish F-16 vs Greek F-16 Intercept Breakdown | Dogfight Over The Mediterranean or Fake?

foreign on August 27 2020 radar systems of the Turkish Air Force detected six F-16 aircraft departing from Crete island heading towards Southern Cyprus the Hellenic Air Force's s-16 aircraft were prevented by the Turkish Air Force in the southwest of the island of Cyprus in order to visually identify the military traffic approaching the region declared nav tax and to remove them from the region the aircraft were identified as belonging to Greece and removed from the region today we're going to take a look at the HUD video released by the Turkish Ministry of Defense what's up everybody it's Monday I'm mover CW Lemoine author of The Specter series if you're looking for Aviation military Espionage books to check out uh Specter series uh is related to that it's uh F-16 pilot I flew f-16s if you're new to the channel also f-18s and today we're going to take a look at the video released on uh Thursday actually it was released Friday it happened on Thursday of six Hellenic vipers um that were intercepted by Turkish vipers now this came up last time I did one of these videos and people get pretty pedantic about my use of the word Viper any F-16 pilot or maintainer or anybody who's ever been around the F-16 calls it the Viper there's no differentiation between a block 40 block 50 they're all vipers I know in later box they have more officially been called the Viper but the Viper has been a nickname since the 70s and Battlestar Galactica the pilots started calling that and that's just what we've called it so my whole career I've called it the Viper no matter what block it is and so today I'm going to talk about it and when I say viper I'm not specifically referring to a block I'm just saying F-16 so let's take a look at the video I had a viewer actually send me the um the video on his YouTube channel where he actually did closed captioning so here we go squat locked we'll go through it one time real real uh real time and then uh I'll break it down he's breathing I'm glad we had that translation [Music] I'm gonna gun wise here whereas weapons engagement Zone he's in a dog fight mode we'll talk about what the symbology means here in a second uh that's a pretty stable gunshot bingo on 7000 feet foreign let's see all right so that's the real time let's break it down um I'll turn the audio down because we don't need it anymore uh or at least lower uh all right so what are we looking at here um for those of you unfamiliar with the F-16 HUD that's 260 knots calibrated AirSpeed um so that is Imperial I know we always get into this whether it's metric or imperial that's an imperial measurement calibrated AirSpeed uh this is his Bullseye position so whatever he set up uh as the bullseye so he's bearing 296 for 46 miles from whatever I mean maybe it's their home base maybe it's something else I don't know um this is the ranging so the radar f uh 1.6 miles nautical miles uh and that's his altitude this is he's in a dog fight mode air-to-air symbology and that's his g-forces so um that's something to note right off the bat he's in a dogfight mode he's in Sim so what does Sim mean Sim means that weapons employment is simulated anything he presses the pickle button the trigger or anything like that nothing's actually going to come off the aircraft uh which tells me this immediately that this is not uh they're not intending to go out and shoot down so otherwise the master arm would be hot this is more of what we saw in the last video where it's kind of uh um it's an intercept but they're not intending to start a war this is not going to kick off any kind of uh you know shooting because he's in some he's not intending to do that which is a with live weapons presumably on the aircraft we obviously can't see what the Turkish jet configuration is um you know Sim is an okay place to be off is a little bit better but Sim gives you all the symbology and stuff so Sam's a good place to be and uh I don't see him ever actually pull the trigger or hit the pickle button so that's a good thing too and we'll talk about uh the aim9 here so right now uh he's a mile and a half away he's basically in lead you can see the cross up here um the boresight cross so that's bore side of the aircraft so his nose is out front um this is the computed Gun Site the diamond is the aim9 which is tracking the aircraft because of the radar lock um you can hear the growl that means it it knows there's something there but it he hasn't it's called uncaged so you never get a solid tone which means he doesn't intend to actually shoot the aim9 at any time you just hear that constant growl the whole time throughout the video all right so this actually cuts to another part so we went from one point something miles to right inside of uh or right outside of 3000 feet he's well in lead now um the other aircraft's in lead he says he's in six miles I got him locked that might be the other his wingman or his flight lead or something because this guy is inside of 2 000 feet now so he goes to lag um and then we get now it's something else so this is a lot of different separate Clips I don't know if they gave us video clips of all six aircraft or what but this is not one solid engagement because you can see now uh we went from 26 000 feet down to 11 000 feet so uh these are obviously separate engagements so it's not quite as complete as what the Hellenic Air Force did in their video where it was one continuous engagement I don't know what the Beeper is um you gotta understand F-16 blocks are different between each block and also between countries so this is not a hundred percent what I'm used to Flying I don't know I've never heard a beeper on any of the f-16s I flew so I don't know how they have that set up it's obviously not a g rate beeper because he's only pulling a d and a half so I don't know but what you'll see here too is this little circle uh predicts where the bullets are so if you put him in between the plus and a minus and put that little circle there that's pretty much a gun's track so that's what he's looking to do so right there um you can see that the the other Viper or the uh the Greek Viper is I mean he's not maneuvering a whole lot he's just in this uh constant turn uh but you can see the configuration so looks like he's got conformal tanks and it looks like he also has two 370 gallon drop tanks which again we talked about this the last time um were they to feel like this was a real engagement they'd have punched off those tanks and they'd actually be fighting so again same as last time this is more of a an intercept with a little bit of maneuvering and then a knock it off and then they go back home foreign so right there he could get a FL I mean if they were really fighting this would be a really good fleeting gunshot um not really stable but a good gunshot way in lead so a lot of playing for him he's got 100 knots closure and see what happens here tracking him well you're not I mean you're you're tracking him but that's not a guns track because your Pepper's nowhere near him right now but it will be right there that is the pepper on the canopy that is a valid guns track uh we'd have to count frames but you know if he pulls the trigger right now and the the bullets at target range the batter would show up and it would show that yeah it's it's a gun good track but he doesn't pull the trigger which I think is a really good thing but as far as guns track goes I mean he's at a thousand feet so he's a little bit close uh he's got zero uh V Sub C he's only pulling three and a half G's and they're down at eight eight and a half uh or 8 500 feet um but again I think this guy's just doing a solid turn like I I don't think he's I don't I don't think they're maneuvering in relation to each other just like the other one um there's not much of a fight here so he says he's in firing position which is true I mean that's a stable gun track but you know I mean they're they're not really dog fighting so just like the other one okay bingo I've seen this mentioned in the media and they're like well how come he doesn't have enough fuel so the Bingo bug is actually configurable on The Upfront control panel and it's just whatever you type in so I mean it could be Joker fuel which is uh cease maneuvering um there's difference between Joker and bingo Joker is just a cease maneuvering for that phase of flight to let you know you have a buffer before Bingo and bingo is enough fuel to rtb so um just getting a fuel warning doesn't tell me a whole lot because I don't know what they had I mean this could be hey this is Joker or this is a pre-planned fuel state to go to the tanker or before I can't use afterburner anymore or something else it doesn't necessarily mean that they were out of fuel and they had to go rtb already but I mean he's obviously in an offensive position and you can see really well here that those are conformal fuel tanks and is obviously in a very offensive position but again they're at six thousand feet 230 knots and two and a half G's so um and you don't see usually you'd see Vapes off the uh the other aircraft if it was kind of geed up and low low speed high energy or low speed low energy state where it's actually trying to maneuver he just looks like he's in a solid 3G turn at 250 knots 200 knots so that looked like a Jank I can't tell because of the the way it works but that almost looked like he did a tuck under Jinx so that is a little different and they're a little low to be doing this too typically especially over water we stopped fighting at 5 000 feet obviously this is real world so there's no training rules or anything but they're a little bit low to be doing stuff like that um but yeah now he's now he's turning away and at this point there are 26 000 feet 400 knots this dude's bugging out um so 50 knots V Sub C so that dude's probably doing 370. um so I think this is when they're they're going away um you know when they've turned them away back to where they came from so they're they're basically in the result of the vid too long I don't know what too long too short means but f-16s with drop tanks [Music] and this is where he's gotten closer he's in five 500 feet he's just doing an air defense intercept we do him all the time I mean you see in the news all the time with us doing this with the Russians yeah and at this point he's just hanging out in kind of a trail fighting Wing position or whatever so there has been some dispute about whether this video is actually even real uh especially on Twitter and some of uh Greek media obviously there's a lot of turmoil between these two countries and anytime anything like this comes out both sides are saying that the other side's lying or it's not real or whatever so one site pointed out that um it's not real because it's in Sim and I talked about that in the breakdown but just to clarify it's a three position switch Master arm switch uh if you go Master arm on off or Sim Sim gives you the ability to simulate weapons employment um on the side of whether it's real or fake well if you're doing a real air defense scramble I can't see a reason why you would be in Sim unless you absolutely knew that the people that you were intercepting we're friendlies or not hostile so in that case could go either way you know if it were if they were intercepting for the purpose of actually fighting them then you wouldn't be in sem but if they were intercepting knowing that there's no chance that they were going to fight or that there's no chance that they were going to uh actually turn what because their defensive the Greek f-16s are defensive through this and the Turkish f-16s are offensive but if it turns around you know and you realize you do need to shoot you know you're going to have to under g go and flip that up to arm and remember to do that so I'm not sure another way would stay in Sim is if you absolutely 100 knew that um you weren't going to employ or in the favor of the argument that it's not a real video uh is that you know we use sim in training when we're when we're simulating with each other um and doing basic fighter Maneuvers ACM any of that other stuff we always leave it in some because we know that's how we evaluate rounds on the flip side of that argument people saying well because it's in Sim that means it's fake well they never pulled the trigger so you get a witness cue if you hit the pickle button uh you pull the trigger you're gonna hit the batter so if it's a training video of them fighting themselves that doesn't make a whole lot of sense either because well I mean where's the them actually training to employ now they could have edited that part out I don't know but it's really hard to say the other argument was the fuel thing I talked about that uh it's just a bingo bug doesn't mean anything at all so you can't really get anything out of that and somebody also said the altitude warning that's also something you can plug in uh it's called the Halo and it's the altitude alerting system that's just what you type in so I think they had it at 10 000 feet that's why it happened I can't say whether it's real or fake just based on people who have posted pictures and said well you know you can tell the multi-colors and the colors of the F-16 I looked I really did I tried to blow up the still images from when they were inside of 2000 feet inside of a thousand feet and stuff I can't tell HUD footage is not high quality it's not 1080p I mean at best it may be 480p I think it's actually less than that so or the DVRs might be 480 but you can't tell so I I don't know how you tell I looked at one image where you can see the uh the roundel on the left wing and it in some ways to look at it looks blue in some ways you look at it it looks red I can't tell I mean I'm just not I don't have the the video is not high quality enough to be able to tell markings and color patterns and stuff like that and with with the sun angle and the shadows and stuff I don't think there really is a good way to tell just by looking at the markings whether they're Turkish emblems or Turkish paint schemes or uh Hellenic f-16s the only thing I can tell is that it is conform it is an F-16 with conformal fuel tanks that's really all I can get out of it again that's not really I'm here just to break down the video I I just I can't say whether it's real or fake there's just not enough information what I can say is that this video is obviously spliced so it's not one continuous dog fighting scene like we saw the first time I did this uh you know it's it's it looks like multiple sets of multiple different things because you see altitude changes you see the bullseye change in the bottom left corner you see a bunch of different things so it's it's very spliced together which could be an argument for it being fake or it could be an argument of operation security and the Turks are just trying to protect their tactics and methods it does make sense in the sense that they're just in a turn they're not really fighting each other it doesn't look like either side is being very aggressive towards each other now granted nose on you know if you're the the Greeks you would probably react to that if it's a situation where both sides realize that they're not going to do anything because they don't want to kick off a war then yeah you might be on the Greek side you might be very predictable you might not want to show any kind of aggression or anything like that as you turn around and go home and on the Turkish side yeah you get your guns track or whatever for bragging rights but you're not going to push it beyond that there's no flares observed if If This Were Real you would see flares you would see uh the 370 gallon tanks being punched off you would see more aggressive maneuvering this is not a real dog fight this is more of an intercept with the HUD video of getting some gun frames as they're maneuvering around versus an actual fight I don't know why they went all the way down to 4 000 feet that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me but again there's no continuity between Clips so it's very hard to tell what does make sense is the progression uh how they designed it from turning to basically turning and going home I know some people said that the audio doesn't match either they're like the one minute Mark there's uh you can hear Greek Pilots it could be Greek Pilots you could be hearing them on guard which is 243-0 uh that they could be transmitting and hearing that I don't know typically for an intercept everybody would be speaking English they would all be talking to each other I I don't understand the the different languages and stuff that they're using here so with that said I just don't know there's some continuity issues with it but it could very well be real and if it is real it's it's a very benign event um you know it's it's a gun's track but there was never any intent to fire because the things in Sim the whole time and he never even uncaged his aimed nine so not that the other pilot would know but if I were thinking that I were gonna go and shoot somebody I'd be Master arm on that aim9 would be uncaged and you'd be you'd hear a solid tone ready to fire uh at any time so it's really hard to tell whether this is real or anything like that but it is part of an ongoing conflict between the Greeks and the Turks but that's as far as I want to go into the politics of it because all I'm here for is just to talk about the flying and the dog fighting stuff so I tried to break down just the F-16 related stuff of what's going on and not getting into the geopolitical stuff which I try to avoid and the last time there were some issues where I read the article and people were mad because I said disputed Islands well that's just what the article said I I don't want to get into the geopolitics of it because that's not my purview and that's not you know I like to stay within my lane and you know I'm just analyzing what I see from having flown these Jets before anyway coming up soon on the channel uh the announcement for the folds of Honor fight for Honor 2020 will be coming up I'll give you the dates and how you can register and some pretty big news on that don't forget next week I'm going to be interviewing Heron systems who developed the AI Falco that fought Banger in the alpha dogfight trials that uh the AI beat the F-16 human fighter pilot F6 teamview F16 so that'll be cool to talk to him get your questions ready because it'll be a live event and we're really excited to have them on the channel we got a big announcement from them as well so um hope you guys enjoyed this hope you guys have a great week thanks for watching we will see you next time experience [Music] don't be a douche rule number one I can tell you now

Channel: C.W. Lemoine

Views: 575,132

Keywords: F-16, turkey, greece, HAF, Hellenic AF, Air Force, Turkish AF, Turkish Air Force, Greek Air Force, Viper, Block 52, turkey vs greece, greece vs turkey, intercept, vipers, dogfight, basic fighter maneuvers, bfm, breakdown, cwlemoine, mover, c.w. lemoine

Id: jmhIi-5DzoQ

Length: 22min 45sec (1365 seconds)

Published: Mon Aug 31 2020