The Theology behind the Culture War

one of the big problems people face today regarding religion or regarding the notion of god is a problem that i would call something like the reality of god versus the reality of the world and it might seem like an abstract problem which matters only to theologians but it actually ends up manifesting itself in everybody's life actually whether you are religious or not and it ends up manifesting itself in opposites so it manifests itself in things like for example in scripture you have christ who says something like call no one on earth father because god in heaven is your father you know or christ saying things like no one is good but god and you'll find many places in scripture where christ seems to bring everything to god and to reduce the world to almost nothing and then there are other places in scripture for example where we have the law of god where we have the prescription of god where we have christ saying do this in remembrance of me where on the other hand he seems to be saying that these things are really important and so how do we bring this together how do we make sense of this and how does it help us understand some of the discourse that people are using and how we often feel trapped in opposites sometimes and struggle to uh to find a way out so we're gonna look at some of this and see how it relates to your everyday life this is jonathan pedro welcome to the symbolic world [Music] [Applause] [Music] so this question is very important today especially in the kind of cultural battle you know in the the cultural war we can call them let me give you a few examples once again and uh and you'll see what i'm talking about so for example a famous verse that is being used very often today is the verse where it says there's neither jew nor greek slave nor free male nor female for you're all one in christ jesus and so many people will use that verse to argue for things like you know the abolition of gender roles you know for having women priests or also for other even more kind of notions of fluid identity and uh and you know certain woke values let's say will be we'll be hiding people will use this verse to argue for those types of positions so what's interesting is that if you look at that from that side you'll notice that this is something which is absolutely there in scripture christ does it all the time like i mentioned before christ says none is good but god you know christ says don't call anyone on earth your father there are so many places where christ seems to say that you know even places for example when he says that talks about the person who sells the field in order to get the pearl or to rip your eye out you know if it causes you to fall all of this type of thinking you know moves towards the idea that the world itself is dangerous the world is dangerous in the sense that it can become idolatry and this is of course something which we find in certain strains of christianity today where all forms are seen as suspicious we want to remove liturgy we want to remove a ritual because we feel like ritual is suspicious it can be idolatrous we can be attached to it and it can actually turn us away from god and there is actually position for that in scripture i mentioned some verses but there are many other verses which will go in that direction now this is of course the problem the problem of so many types of interpretation is when we take one verb we take a line and we draw it through scripture and we find all the verses that kind of agree with the position and we just argue from that now what's fascinating for example is that for every verse that i've mentioned in scripture there is a counter example and so for example it says there you know there's neither a june or greek slave nor free male nor female for you all one in christ jesus and then christ will then in other places say that and even saint paul will talk about you know the gospel going out to the jew first and then to the the pagan or then to the gentile there are other places where for example saint paul talks about gender roles and talks about the role of the man the role of the father the role of the wife the role of the woman in church and you think well how does this jive so what happens is people will tend to create a false hierarchy they'll try to say well this this verse here the one where it says there's neither there are no divisions there's no separation there's no particularity we're all one that is really that's the real truth and the other one that's just kind of detail it's not really important uh but you when if you follow the line you'll see that this happens all the time for example when it says when christ says self says you know none is good but god you have to realize that there is an apporia in what he's saying because in the very creation of the world god creates the world and you know at almost every day of creation he says and he saw that it was good and so what is going on here how is it that we can have saying this you know in one place and the other the other example that i gave which is uh do not call anyone on earth your father there's another place in scripture where saint paul says to the corinthians that he became their spiritual father that he is their father in christ so one again once again what is going on here now what's going on here is something about the very nature of reality and the very nature of god which is that in in the modern world the modern world has taken up this kind of dialectical thinking this kind of oppositional thinking and we we tend to frame it in a certain way so for example we talk about nominalism and univocalism now these are fancy terms but what it means is that in the late middle ages there are some thinkers we talk about you know uh about occam or don scotus akam is associated with nominalism and scotus is associated with univocalism now people argue for example that it's not totally there and they're thinking that it's later people that interpreted it and made it more radical it doesn't matter it doesn't matter for our purpose our purpose is that this is how the world started to frame itself as these kind of two opposites one was one was that god is so high above reality that nothing you can say can touch god like you know that god is beyond everything and that that reality nothing in reality is connected to god so when you say that god is good we don't mean it in the same way that we say other things are good when we say that god is love we don't mean it in the same way that we mean talk about the secular love there's a there's a radical disjunct between god and all the rest of reality now this is what we call nominalism on the other hand there's something we call univocalism which is that no that everything that god because god is is the source of reality then god is necessarily has to be related to the things we say so when we say you know we talk about love in the world it has to be the same as the love that god has because or else what would it even mean to talk about love in the world and so god is love but supreme love like the being of supreme supreme love so we have the same type of love that we have it's just it's just more than we have and bigger and so god is in that sense god is like the super everything so everything that you think about god is the super everything and so what so what the the nominalist will say of the univocalist is that you're trapping god in creation you're making god part of creation and that is a mistake you're making him into kind of a pagan god god is beyond creation he's the source of creation and so what the univocalist will accuse the the the nominalist of is saying you're putting god so high above the world that he's completely disjunct and you're making the world arbitrary you're making all of reality arbitrary because there's no connection between the source of reality and reality itself and so everything here is just arbitrary because we there's no connection to or at least god's will is arbitrary god acts arbitrarily in the world like some divine tyrant that just kind of acts without no without without without no connection to how the world lays itself out now this like i said this might seem like uh like a arbit like something which isn't that important but it ends up playing itself playing its out very importantly in the world and it looks like for example the the it can look like something like a kind of bare evangelical service where everything is we attempt to strip everything down because we find the world to be suspicious now that is would be the extreme of kind of uh you could say of a nominalism and then you have the other side like an extreme univocalism which is to think that every little detail of for example the liturgy is supremely important and we have to we have to practice it exactly the way it's written and we have to do things exactly the way it is because all of these things all of these things in the world are actually manifesting god they are a little body of god you could say and so how do we deal with it it's really important to deal with this because it will lead to several conclusions that you see in the world today and arguments that people will use you'll find people who who for example refuse to participate in religion because they'll say things like multiplicity is an illusion you know it's all maya it's all an illusion you know all forms are relative and therefore you know i'm a universalist which means that i just see the transcendent absolute but i don't want to get dirtied up in uh in these particular forms but the same type of argument can lead to another excess you know which is that uh you hate all forms and so the the universalist loves all forms and because he kind of loves all forms and sees them only at these kind of relative illusory uh representations of god he's like eh you know i'm not going to do all any of this and then the other one hate all forms and see them all as idols and thinks all creation is suspect this also leads to the kind of conspiracy theory symbolism which is that as soon as you see meaning in the world because you don't believe the world is actually kind of full of the manifestation of god then you immediately see ill will and all ritual is satanic you know and you see that and the saddest part is really to see even catholics and orthodox christians embark in this like as soon as they see a ritual that isn't their own liturgy they immediately think it's satanic it's like just because something is ritualized doesn't mean it's satanic just because it is anyway so there are different versions of that of course it leads also like i said it leads to like the the new age mush as well to this kind of it's like it's the opposite but you can see how it all leads to the same type of thinking uh which is that you know i can just pick and choose all the forms that i want you know and all these forms are good so i can just kind of navigate through any of them it doesn't matter none of this matters right it's all it's all it's all maya anyways where it's all kind of bodies of god and and and there isn't any form of of balance you know and it's very difficult to buy to find balance now the balance has to be found in the aporia when i use the word of pory i know maybe some people might not know what it means it means like a contradiction which points a contradiction which is held and which points to something which is beyond reason which is beyond uh something that you can totally capture in words and so the tr the absolute transcendence of god and the absolute imminence of god are actually related to each other but you can't you can't formulate them at the same time it's very difficult you can't find an image in which you formulate both the absolute transcendence of god and the absolute imminence of god at the same time so what you'll see in scripture is you'll see moves you'll see moves towards absolute transcendence we could call them ascetic moves where the the the desires to kind of clear out all the forms to show that they're that they're not enough that they're not sufficient that god is always above them so these are the places where christ says things like none is good but god you know where where uh saint paul will say all these multiplicities they're not real what's real is our unity in christ and so you'll find moves like that and then you'll find other moves in scripture where the opposite is happening where christ or saint paul or in general just the law or the the temple or the rituals which are given are given as things you need to participate in things that are real things that that have are actually manifesting god that they are remembrance of god in in a real way not in just some kind of uh secondary illusory way but that that they they participate in the life of god and so when christ gives baptism and and communion as a ritual you know when saint paul talks about the different roles for different genders when saint paul kind of tells people how to act these are relative goods but they are goods that we need to embark in they are not relative in the sense that they can just be discounted and ignored they are the manner in which kind of god fills up the world but they can be dangerous because if we think that they're absolute then we're missing the point the point is obviously that they're pointing towards god but it's the same thing if we only kind of focus on this the absolute of god's transcendence then we miss something important as well which is that because he is transcendent he actually fills all of reality with his being and so what i'm going to do for you is i usually don't read text directly from the church fathers but i want to read from you a text from from saint dianis the areopagite i've mentioned him several times on this channel he is one of the most important saints in terms of mysticism and in terms of understanding this symbolic world and how it is that this symbolic world is both the reality of how god manifests himself in all of creation but how all of creation has and must point towards god who is also completely above and completely transcendent and completely infinite above all all things and so you'll see if you watch my videos you'll see that i sometimes make these two moves and like i said you can't make them at the same time but sometimes they'll say things like god is beyond being god is beyond all name god is beyond all definition then you'll find me in another place arguing for how this manifests christ and how these all these different little elements of reality are manifesting god in reality so let me read a little text from you from saint dionysis from the divine names and i'll read it and maybe i'll make a few comments i'll skip some parts as well you can find it yourself you know just by google searching some of the words i'm using um so sandianes it says uh with regard to the super essential being of god transcendent goodness transcendently there no lover of the truth which is above all truth will seek to praise it as word or power or mind or life or being no it is at a total remove from every condition movement life imagination conjecture name discourse thought conception being rest dwelling unity limit infinity the totality of existence and so he yeah saint daniel says loves to string those words together but what he's doing is he's saying it's like if you if you love if you understand the super essential identity being of god that is that god is beyond being actually beyond all all thought all every all of the things that he mentioned right you will never think that you can praise him as one of these things and then you think oh here we are like here it is in this kind of transcendent moment where he's saying god is beyond all things and so we can't recognize them in anything that exists right um but then saint diana just continues and now he goes to this to the other move now right after what i just read when he says that he is beyond everything beyond the totality of existence and yet since it is the underpinning of goodness and by merely being there is the cause of everything to praise this divinely beneficial providence you must turn to all of creation it is there at the center of everything and everything has it for a destiny when we talk about theosis i've mentioned this a few times before i mentioned this with jedi for example when we were i was talking to him it's not just humans that are meant to be deified it's everything that is meant to be deified everything has as its destiny god okay so it is there before all things and in all things hold it is before all things and in it all things hold together this description citing colossians because it is there the world has come to be and exists all things long for it the intelligent and rational long forward by way of knowledge the lower strata by way of perception the remainder by way of the stirrings of being the stirrings of being alive and in whatever fashion befits their condition so what it's saying is that all things that exist long to move into this transcendence and they do it by the means that they have at whatever level of being they exist because they are connected to this transcendent god fills the world with himself but the world is not himself but it's called to kind of move into god and so all things at their level can participate in the life of god by whatever it is that they have and so like you said the higher beings because we're intelligence this is how we are the image of god that's not the only way right the the the idea of even perceiving is something which is in the image of god and then just the stirrings of being alive right this just this even the desires even these passions even these raw uh passions are are ways in which we can participate in the life of god and so realizing this the theologians praise it by every name and as the nameless one for they call it nameless when they speak of so i'm not gonna go into this but he talks about how god is nameless and he talks about how when god you know doesn't really want to reveal his name to moses and basically says i am the one who is uh uh he's he's in a way rebuking moses by ask by that moses is asking him for a proper name and he's saying i don't have a proper name right my name is beyond all names but then he says at the same time then then we also praise him with all these other names that god has and then he just lists them you know being life light the truth uh he talks about the beautiful the wise the beloved the god of god lord of lords holy of holies you know the cause of ages and just goes on and on and on just all these these terms for god righteousness sanctification um et cetera et cetera you can go through it uh yourself uh all the lists of the names of god and all the images that are used to talk about god so here he comes to his his kind of conclusion you could say and so it is the cause of all and as transcending all he is rightly nameless and yet has the names of everything that is truly he has dominion over all and all things revolve around him for he is their cause their source and their destiny he is all in all as scripture affirms and certainly he is to be praised as being for all things the creator and originator the one who brings them the power which returns them to itself and all this in the one single irrepressible and supreme act so what he means is that this is eternally true that the supreme eternal act you could say makes all of this true in simultaneity that is both this this kind of this this moving out of god into creation and the bringing back of god into himself you know this is very mysterious but it can help you understand a lot of things about about you know how things that happen in scripture even the incarnation the the crucifixion the resurrection are eternally true in god they are eternal realities in god like i said it's mysterious but it's important if you don't have that at some point you're going to run into some serious problems in terms of your theology now once again for many people this might seem still a little bit abstract and i thank you for following me all the way here if you've had the courage to do so but this true truth that we just talked about is true at every level of reality it is fractally true it is true of any object you can perceive and so you know let's you you what example are we going to use let's use a chair because it's an example that i like to use and so the being of the chair right the the the fact that it's a chair the chairness of the chair is beyond all the parts of the chair it has to be and so it it it's beyond all the parts of the chair but it is the source of all the parts of the chair as well that is it is the reason why these parts are even perceived as parts of the chair you know themselves and they're not seen as something else like a bit of wood or a bit of paint or you know a branch or whatever that the fact that we see them as legs as different aspects of the chair is because they're held together by the identity of the chair which is above the chair itself and so you can't if you say that the leg of the chair is the chair you're lying if you say the back of the chair is the chair you're lying there it's not none of the elements of the chair are the chair and so to try to name them by their elements is to is to miss the major the basic point that the identity of the chair is beyond it but at the same time because the identity of the chair gives reason for these parts of the chair to be parts of the chair therefore it fills the chair with its presence and it makes those parts let's say little names for the chair so it is a leg of a chair it is the back of a chair it is it is you know the the aspects of the chair and so they become like we have to look to all the parts of the chair and at the same time see that the chair itself is beyond all the parts to be able to get the full movement of reality right the movement up and the movement down this kind of you know these two movements that i talk about for example with john vervicky all the time it's kind of eminent this this emanation and this emergent reality this is what saint dionysus is talking about and he is he is actually giving us a very powerful solution to many of the problems where whether it is complex systems or just the way in which the church exists or just in how we can interpret scripture without falling into these absolutes the balance is difficult to find it's very difficult to find the balance between recognizing how all forms are relative to the highest purpose but also how they're real and without them you can't sit on the chair without the legs of the chair even though the the identity of the chair transcends its elements and so i hope this is a little useful to kind of understand you know the problems you run into i'm sure if you think about it you will remember many times where you you've been kind of trapped in this moment where someone has presented to you or even in your own mind presented to you an argument which wants to make god transcendent or reality transcended and wants to negate all the particulars and then on the other side as well where there's kind of this obsession with with the particulars and an incapacity to see how the unity of something transcends its multiplicity and so like i said thank you for your attention as usual and uh and more videos coming very soon i'll talk to you very soon bye-bye as you know the symbolic world is not just a bunch of videos on youtube we are also a podcast which you can find on your usual podcast platform but we also have a website with a blog and several very interesting articles by very intelligent people that have been thinking about symbolism on all kinds of subjects we also have a clips channel a facebook group you know there's a whole lot of ways that you can get more involved in the exploration and the discussion of symbolism don't forget that my brother matsuya wrote a book called the language of creation which is a very powerful synthesis of a lot of the ideas that explore and so please go ahead and explore this world you can also participate by you know buying things that i've designed t-shirts with different designs on them and you can also support this podcast and these videos through paypal or through patreon everybody who supports me has access to an extra video a month and there are also all kinds of other goodies and tiers that you can get involved with so everybody thank you again and thank you for your support

Channel: Jonathan Pageau

Views: 40,967

Keywords: symbolism, myths, religion

Id: blY45eUx8iI

Length: 26min 23sec (1583 seconds)

Published: Wed Oct 06 2021