The Chicago Story. As Told by James Pankow. Part One.

hi I'm Joe chambers welcome to musicians Hall of Fame backstage this week's guest is James Penn co-founder trombonist songwriter arranger of the great group Chicago this interview is just too long to make one show out of so this is going to be part one of two parts we're going to start at the beginning of Chicago until they became the band that we all know and love sit back and get ready for a great interview James panco part 1 [Music] welcome to the musicians Hall of Fame backstage with James panko until just recently I pronounced James Pankow and now I'm Ronnie does I start directing people but because we're official yes later than gem I just wanted to put Joe in the record okay yes okay now that that's been said so this is a whole lot of fun for me because I've told that story a lot of times I was riding down Music Row 1975 and I had we had a band that were we were doing original we wanted to be Chicago jr. you know you and your uncle and and some going down Music Row and like we were just talking about a little bitty houses there's nothing you know and then all of a sudden CBS record so what got to pull in this this is the label Chicago's own so walk in and because of that it changed my whole life because I ended up meeting the president of the record label who happened to be sitting in the lobby and so that's all I'm gonna say about that but that's the reason I pulled into CBS was because you guys from CBS okay yeah so yeah and but they already had you something they didn't need us so and we weren't y'all anyway there's only one you and so one thing on this show we want to do here is not just talk about things that fans want to know but also musicians so and you know we're doing a couple of these two in one day and so just a little while ago Steve cropper left and we talked about you know kind of guitar did you play and the why so let's go ahead and do this for the for the for the horn players out there why did what do you play why did you play what you played a particular brand and why did you pick the instrument you picked well you know trombone was not really my first choice honestly I was 10 years old my parents decided that it was absolutely necessary to channel this energy that was obviously coursing through me anytime they put a record on I started grooving and to the point where my mother said that my crib would start shaking because even before I could walk I would react to music I was 10 years old and again the boys dorm bedroom was above the kitchen and I'd be up there doing my homework and my mom and dad would be in the kitchen getting ready for dinner and they'd be hearing on the floor upstairs radiating into the kitchen ceiling and it drove him nuts it was like a jackhammer around him my dad had take a broom and hit the ceiling of the kitchen to make me stop I was tapping my feet or wet tapping my pencil on the desk in school driving the teachers nuts so they took me to the the try out surface at the in the church basement okay you're gonna take me to these tryouts I'm looking at all these instruments the drums was my first choice but there were a hundred kids in line and I got exasperated with waiting so I went to the guitar line I essentially I wanted to play an instrument that was cool you know that was that was usable in playing music of my peers rock and roll whatever and then as I'm standing in more lines waiting to try the instruments my mom and dad accompanied by the band director approached me and pointed to the trombone that was on a table there were no kids standing around the doors nor myself and they they argued that if if if I play trombone I would have no competition I'd have a much better chance of advancing myself playing lead you know and excelling on that instrument and I looked at that thing and I said I'm not taking that sewer pipe all no way well the band director chimed in and you know he was a trumpet player he said hey man you know brass instruments are really cool they talked me into this continued I continued practicing taking lessons playing in the school band then came high school and my parents made a sacrifice because with nine kids we couldn't afford private schooling and stuff like that but they made the sacrifice of putting me in Notre Dame High School for Boys in Niles Illinois and there was a band director there father George boys Kirk we won the state jazz band competition every year I was there I got a scholarship with my horn and wound up going to Quincy College a small liberal arts college and central Illinois great band music department great band director trombonist and a very wicked teacher tough tough I hated the guy because he made me do it he made me do it he taught me discipline I had no excuse it I had no way to squirm out of it after a year at Quincy I came back to Chicago for the summer and I put a band together and got an agent started working I started making serious coin serious money well I didn't want to give that up because I was creating income with my horn I was hey when a concept I'm getting paid to play music I like this so I called Quincy and I I gave them the bad news I said you know I can't come back to Quincy because I will give up the the income that I generate started to generate with my horn and Charlie winking as disappointed as he was he had to admit he said you know we go to school to learn how to make a living at music you're doing that I can't argue with that good luck to you I enrolled at DePaul University then in Chicago as a sophomore where I was to meet Walter para Zeta and Lee luck named Terry Kath and the people that were to become this band will be right back and hear the beginnings of the group Chicago the musicians Hall of Fame and Museum has been celebrating the men and women who make the music of our lives since 2006 the musicians Hall of Fame is the one and only Museum in the world that honors the talented musicians who played on the greatest recordings of all time it's 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receptions and more contact me today to book your next event welcome back to musicians Hall of Fame backstage with James Pankow James so we were just getting into you were just meeting Terry Kath and Walter and what was to become Chicago okay I'm back at DePaul and I'm practicing in the practice room at DePaul I'm a new student a transfer student and I keep seeing the practice rooms were these soundproof little cubicles you know and they had a door with a little window in the door and they were so improved you know and I go in there after classes I mean I shed on the trombone I'm practice and I keep seeing this face in the window of the door I made a lot of people who kind of peek in and you know see who was in there but there was one face in particular that kept coming by and looking at me and he wasn't just saying who were there he was looking at me like like I'm on to you man I woke you and I kept seeing his face I kept seeing his face and finally he knocked on the door and I opened the door he said dude you're probably wondering who the heck I am because you keep seeing my face in the window but I just had to tell you I really like your playing and I'm Walter is Aitor and I have an idea that I'd like to run by you and he talked to me about forming a rock-and-roll band with an indigenous horn section not just frosting on the cake doing riffs but a horn section that was one of the main characters in the music we he wasn't quite sure how that might play out or maybe wasn't quite sure musically what he was trying to explain that the idea was gave a rock and roll band with a lead horn section just like another vocal you know and the concept was fascinating because that hadn't been done and I went yeah man I want to talk some more about this I'm in you know yeah yeah what year was this this was 1967 and he introduced me to another student by the name of Lee lockni trumpet player and he had talked to Lee about the idea and Lee said so Jimmy what do you think I want I think it's amazing I think it's worth pursuing but what are we gonna do about a rhythm section I mean you know okay we we got our one section here we got a saxophone trumpet and trombone what about a rhythm section and Walt said well the missing links are on their way out and the missing links were a local club group act that Walt and Danny surfin and Terry calf had been members of and they were they were going away the leader of the band had had very little or no talent and his father booked the band so all that was to them was income but it was not fun so Terry and Danny and Walt decided to break off and proposed this idea to some worthwhile horn players fortunately I had transferred to DePaul and I came into Walt's radar and he invited me to be the traveler I can't imagine there ever being anybody else though can you who knows who knows of course of course that you could I don't think I just happened to be I was I was blessed enough to be at the right place at the right time we had Danny Seraphin a drummer we had Terry Kath a guitar player we had the horn section we needed a bass player and the keyboard player perhaps and who was gonna sing vocals well Terry sang but none of the three of us one players were really lead vocalists per se we had good pitch we were capable of singing backgrounds but we needed another strong vocalist bass player keyboards for him Danny Seraphin and Walt heard about this guy that was in a club in the south side his name was Bobby Charles and his band was The Wanderers he wrote all his own material he played the crap out of it and he sang amazingly well and they asked him if he you know if he could play b3 because it had bass pedals and that way we could have a keyboard and a bass and not have to pay another guy to play bass as he sang - and he was playing a Wurlitzer some electric piano at that club and he said yeah sure I could I can played b3 I can play with Hammond which was total BS he had never played him but he loved this idea they proposed so much that he was willing to stick his neck out and go buy a used organ and on it until we all convened for the first time and they're not cheap no no not even then no he probably mortgaged most of his life to get there it was an m3 mm-hmm a cut-down version of a v3 with it with the bass pedals and we met at Walt's parents house and you know for the first time you know I had just recently met Terry Kath and Danny Seraphin and before we met at welts parents house all of us Walter ranged to have all of us meet at his apartment on the north side Chicago he had a bottle of whisky on the table we each poured a shot and we took a shot and made an and shook hands and agreed and promised to commit all of our time and energy into making this idea happen Terry goes Terry just starts after you good Terry loved James Brown and we started jamming on James Brown and Danny was like the funkiest soul drummer I mean I had ever heard and Robert was down the bass pedals on the Hammond he had done some serious reading because he was right on it and Papa's got a brand new bang Papa's got a brand it was like oh yeah it was it was like we had been playing together for ever it was just very nice so good Terry was playing bass guitar originally one oh he was playing bass with the missing links but he switched over but he we hired him to be our guitar he played both but they needed but in the missing links the leader of the band who's dead booked a bed was the guitar player and he sucked so but Terry was relegated to play bass and Terry was an amazing bass player but in the in the context of Chicago which wasn't really Chicago yet it was just a bunch of guys he was looked at by us as hopefully being our guitar player and he started playing the turn we were going crazy I mean he was playing the funk I mean Prince would have kissed his feet I mean I closed my eyes it could have been Steve cropper it could've been you know as good as it gets and so we all realized that there we had something you know the ones that you really just ruin head links and it was fun and it was smoking it was smoking but that wasn't the finality of this idea this path that we chose that fell in my lap because I had already begun arranging for my outfit and had been working with Bill Rousseau Chicago Jazz Ensemble and pickup player for big bands coming through the city so I was already I had already begun doing instrumental arrangements but not like this and this gave me a whole palette to do anything I heard for the time being it wasn't a concern because we had to build a reputation and pay our rent and to do that we got an agent who booked all the nightclubs and the mid was you know we wound up going out and getting cheap flashy suits and we were kind of a half-baked Vegas show band can you leave the gel there welcome to the club GG we gonna move you up for the little team up nice and they want you to take a little break let's see yeah remember the more you drink the better we sound you know and we'd be doing you know everything you know we'd start the night you know slow this one club owner who owned this place called the Attic in Milwaukee he was a very powerful guy he was a Greek he owned couple city blocks of Milwaukee and this nightclub was his playground and he'd invited all his cronies there you know and hold court at the bar you know and you know you know you guys you're a good bunch of guys man you got a good band but let me tell you something in my club you got a one them up they come in here after work you know you got to start them up with belly rub roots with the way belly rubs you know like satin down misty you know how to miss to you you you in too much you know start them off slow you know get them drinking get them drinking then you know second set third set you can start hitting them with that soul stuff okay Zoe whatever you say okay so we come into the club and we'd start with the soft you know satin doll yeah lonely both you wanna brass you know and on where'd it went downward away and finally when I got to about the third set we'd be able to start you know sneaking in when you did yeah I'm a soul man James Brown the temptations hold on I'm coming you know and one thing led to another and then the other set built and people were rocking we started packing that place it was arguably the biggest nightclub in the Midwest it was on a second floor and it was a big place it held seven or eight hundred people and after after a couple of weeks we the word got out and we Pat we started pack in that place even on weeknights and Zoey was very happy with us but also about that time you know we started working the circuit we worked Peoria we worked Madison Wisconsin we're working these clubs there about a year or so all of a sudden you know Robert who had been writing songs all along started bringing original music into the band and we loved it before we started doing completely original music however we we first experimented with doing Chicago wised at that time we were in Chicago we were the big thing this this mob boss this mob agent in Chicago you guys I got a good name for you guys the big thing cuz you guys sound like you could be the next big big you know what I mean so let's let's make him name the big ding King T ing the big ding Jodi so as the big thing we slowly evolved into doing customized arrangements of popular songs but the club owners wanted to hear top 40 R&B was the top 40 at that time Wilson Pickett Sam and Dave the temptations for tops the rascals came along we did some that the Righteous Brothers Aretha James Brown it was all the hit music of the day which was great for us because it did have horns in it although the horns have played more of a secondary role so we started taking a lot of these songs and customizing them putting little instrumental stretch outs in them with horn ensembles where there was nothing but the horns playing instrumental melody and this started to become really inspiring it started shaping a direction for me the guys were digging it the guys in the band were digging i they going man this is awesome how did you do that well you know I listened to the vocal and I just kind of sing a solo in my head around the vocal that complements it and then I voice it where it works it's just kind of a I'm humming a an alternate melody that complements the vocal melody that's already there and it seems to work but as soon as we started putting the these original arrangements and music into our club sets we got fired we got fired from one place after another and we were on stage at the attic the place was packed and we showed up at the club we had been slicking our hair back right with Vaseline you know because we in those days you know the Beatles had had come along and you know the Beatles you know the long hair you know and so the long hair was forbidden nobody wanted anything to do with oh yeah well your hippies you know your war you're against the war in Vietnam you're demonstrating you know Abbie Hoffman alright so if you had long hair you were a communist you know a commie sicko is they called us so we used to grease our hair back you know or put it in a ponytail or whatever this night you know before this show we were we were just beginning the second week of a two-week engagement and we're at the the motel and we had all taken so shall we say mind enhancers and Terry Kath went out but sergeant pepper and we put that record on and it changed everything we were psychedelic and we were listening to Sergeant Pepper Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds magical mystery tour [Music] George Martin man now that's that's lords that's orchestral that's melodic and it's unique and that's what we decided we're gonna be us screw these clubs we're gonna be us but that was a tough decision because we were looking a gift horse in the mouth which was our bread and butter which was our food on the table do we roll the dice and be us and continue to get fired looking for work or do we play the game and just do us on the side for our own amusement they told the right people hear it because we'll never pay our rent well well let's start by doing it tonight okay so we showed up at the attic we went on stage with our suits inside out in our hair our hair was long we let our hair down and the club owners at the bar with all his cronies getting his butt kissed we launch into dude you were everything to me how could I be such a fool by Frank Zappa and the mothers of invention and we carved it and as we're doing this and getting just getting outside with it the club owner turns and looks at us like he wanted to kill us he gets up up his barstool walks over to the stage minding the club is packed he walks right up to the front of the stage and grabs Walt's pants leg and he's doing this and what he was saying well you're all a bunch of you're fired get the hell out of my club and I'm going well what are you saying What did he say what I think we're fired Walt gets under my keel and gentlemen we're gonna take another ten minute break everybody chill out relax I would drink it all the more you drink the better we sigh yeah as he's saying this Robert Lamm dives off the stage and grabs the club owner by the throat [Music] [Music] [Applause] [Music] you

Channel: Musicians Hall of Fame & Museum

Views: 72,055

Rating: 4.9056602 out of 5

Keywords: James Pankow, Nashville, Trombone, Chicago

Id: CLyHCyySYmo

Length: 29min 31sec (1771 seconds)

Published: Mon Sep 23 2019