Starship SN15 Cryogenic Proof Test

[Music] pressure looks good [Music] all right folks you know the drill let us know if you can see an active tank farm out there with starship sn how many starships is this 15 and let us know if you can hear us john galloway with nasa space flight here give me a five by five if you can see the video and you can hear my voice in chat as we stand by for proof testing which we think has already partially occurred today uh starship sn15 proof testing a couple different things in that workflow and we are hoping to catch the cryo proof test here that's why the tank farms online we think but again as usual the nasa space flight crew has been standing by watching sn15 all day and then when that tank farm spooled up indicating that there was something that we wanted to see we started up the live stream here so over here in the studio again john galloway with nasa space flight if you know me on twitch you may know me as das but we will or i will be here doing some live commentary joined by my friends with uh other nasa space flight folks here i believe back in the studio we've got jack byer as well jack we got you on yeah what's up everybody ready for some testing with sn15 and uh hopefully it'll get nice and frosty we'll be able to see it cryo proof all right folks jack is one of the video editor photographer live stream host robot deployer wrangler whatever you want to say across the board jack does all sorts of different stuff for nasa space flight and that is his voice that you will be hearing there jack thanks for joining us today yeah no problem i think i'm going to start writing a book called zen in the art of robot maintenance or robot hurting something like that it's a workshop we'll work drop it there's got to be like an electric sheep reference in there somewhere like do a robot stream of electric sheep or that makes me want to just like put a sheep in front of you know or next to one of the cameras just like here you go buddy night night you'd have to be electric though i don't know what that means but maybe neon sheep yeah i'm down that would be cool [Laughter] hey also in the studio it's kicking off the stream here we have michael baylor i think michael were you going to talk yes i am how's it going there's that answer michael baylor is another one of the critical people behind the scenes who keeps all the lights blinking in the proper order michael thank you for joining us this afternoon evening and you can actually see if you look really closely now some vapors coming from the ass section of starship sm15 which is good news because we obviously see the tank farm going crazy but the vapors underneath the vehicle is a definitive sign that a cryogenic proof test is underway you want to make sure we do not go live for an ambient proof test which is what they do first an ambient proof test is just when they pressurize the vehicle with gaseous nitrogen and other than a brief vent or two there's not really much to see over that several hour tests so we only try to go live when there is something interesting to see and the cryogenic proof test is far more interesting as you get a lot of empty from the tank farm we'll see the vehicle get quite frosty hopefully and we should see a great amount of venting and perhaps if we're lucky we might see some rcs tests but the cryogenic proof test is definitely the most exciting of the prove test campaign what's the uh what's the difference i mean between the ambient proof tests and the cryo proof tests so the cryogenic proof test use the liquid nitrogen as opposed to ambient tests that use the gaseous nitrogen so because they're using cryogenically uh chilled propellants or cryogenic propellants we're not propellant like cryogenic resumable or liquid i should say because obviously nitrogen is inert it's not a propellant which is why they use nitrogen for this test because something goes wrong nitrogen is inert it will not cause a big fire so as they saw with sn 1 sn 3 and s yes and mark 1 s1 and s and 3 were the three starship prototypes that failed the proof test and when they failed it was just a big you know plume of gas being released and a bulkhead or two going flying there was no big fireball like we saw with sm4 that had an anomaly during a static fire with actual propellants on boards the lack of propellant means that if something goes wrong today there will not be a big fireball yeah what do you think the uh probability that elon had proof testing on the mind when he tweeted the other day that blimps are cool or whatever it was like it's this is essentially a big blimp or you know giant steel pressure vessel that they are filling full of uh well not helium or hydrogen but uh you know something and they're seeing if it's gonna pop i don't know i just wonder if he had proof testing on the brain it was sort of an odd tweet you know what you had a cell phone pick so i'm just wondering if you like saw a blanket that weren't just thought about it i don't know yeah yeah that's what it looked like uh and more on topic uh the uh fun fact that that end of the intro video is sn3 that's an sm3 that's the sn3 pop during cryotesting so if you are relatively new to the channel or you haven't been watching since the early days of the tanks and and you know what not uh early days of tank watching i guess that's uh that's what that one is that's sn3 so hopefully we did not you know jinx sm15 by starting off the cryogenic proof stream with an essence three reminder but in any event if you look really closely on the left hand side of this look at that just below starship sm15 not only can you see the vapors you can also see another thing and the the metal surrounding is obviously the stand but in the center those metal beams going up to s and 50's f section are the thrust simulator and that threat simulator will stimulate the forces of a raptor engine when the vehicle is under pressure during today's test so that will help verify the vehicle is structurally ready for a test flight this vehicle was the first vehicle to undergo a cryogenic proof test with a thrust simulator since sn6 i believe or s sn8 i think yeah i can correct me if i'm wrong uh i don't i i should remember this but i don't um but i'm pretty sure eight was the yeah i think it was eight because eight was the one with the three raptors for the first time uh so the reason they're doing the thrust simulator testing again is because sn15 has an upgraded thrust puck which is the thrust section of the vehicle that you know has the raptors mounted on it so they're making sure this upgraded design can withstand the forces of the raptor engines under pressure so yeah that's another way to going to be testing today without using ash propellant so again if something goes wrong there won't be a fireball because they're not using actual raptor engines they're using a simulator wow that tank farm is really going crazy and you can see by down by that thrust simulator all of that vapor coming from that thrust section the aft section of starship underneath the skirt there so the vehicle is definitely being filled up with cryogenic liquid nitrogen and that's what we want to see for a cryo test didn't it yeah sure enough and i wonder you know elon tweeted that there's uh you know hundreds of changes or whatever on this vehicle so i i wonder what else there is beyond the the new designed thrust puck or engine mount or aft dome whatever you want to call it i'm sure you know maybe even just like how they did the welding on that is different on on or how it's welded to the the structure itself or hundreds of changes is a lot so i'm super curious i would love some more detail and color on exactly what is different here that we're looking at on sn15 versus previous vehicles but we we know that there's a lot different and so they want to test it with this thrust ram just like they have previous test articles whenever there's been major changes or i mean and and like you said hopefully we didn't jinx sn15 by uh by bringing up sn3 and what not at the very beginning but it's that's why this test is exciting like you said michael this is the most exciting of these tests and the reason it is is because you know i don't think it's going to happen i don't think any of us thinks it's going to happen but there is the possibility in you know on the spectrum of possibilities that sn15 could pop and uh and then it would be back to the drawing board a little bit but that's definitely doesn't seem like it'll be the case they already had a working solution with previous starships that flew you know multiple starships so it should be uh whatever changes they did obviously should be an improvement and not a regression but you never know and that's sort of what we're waiting and watching to find out today yeah hey again if you're just joining us uh we have gone live here with the cameras from boca chica because we saw activity at the tank farm supposed to be doing a proof test today and that's where they actually pump something into the starship to make sure that it's good to go it's going to be holding pressure all the ways and look we've actually got a little vent happening about two thirds of the way up starship there for a second but this is a proof test and we've gone line because the activity at the tank farm and the vapors coming out from the bottom of starship indicate that this looks like a cryo proof test where we'll start to get frost forming on the side of the vehicle um a couple very exciting things have happened during cryo proof test so we usually don't miss these if we can see the rocket fog notwithstanding but that is what we are here doing today we already see those vapors from the bottom of the vehicle we know that that means they're putting cryogenic liquids in this case probably liquid nitrogen into the vehicle a nice inert gas and or liquid there to make sure that sn15 can hold up to those super cold temperatures throughout all of the fuel tanks so we'll be watching for some frost to start to form on the sides of sn15 now exactly when that's gonna happen we don't always know but uh that is what we are hanging out doing here with the nasa space flight team also we've got some super chats that have been coming in and some questions in the queue jack do you want to grab some of those super chats for us real quick absolutely let's see here we go let me get my windows arranged as like i like them and i will talk while i do that look at that great great segue jack jedediah marky markley thank you so much for the uh for the membership let's see what member level did you come in at don't you love it when i talk through what i'm doing while i do it yeah right uh hang on i don't want to do that let's see okay thank you for the membership yeah thank you for the membership how about that whatever level you came in at you get uh various perks so we hope you enjoy the perks that you get and thank you for you know we couldn't do this without our members so thank you to everybody it really helps us do what we do joseph thank you for the ten dollars they say five by five here's a cryo and a pot of coffee for the team thank you joseph ten bucks good chunk of money charles shutrick thank you for the two dollars they say when the flippin burn when is the flippin burn opening uh rest rest i'm guessing that is supposed to be rest for three please oh man we do need to update that intro that's one of those things on my ever expanding to-do list uh but it'll it'll get done i think maybe when the first one lands we'll we'll use the flip and burn or we'll i think that would be the next major milestone where we really really need to to update the intro with some cool new footage but until then maybe that'll be our our like you know thing to look forward to not the landing or anything it'll be an intro anyways uh how do i say this leg leg thank you for the 20 currency units they say just had to be first but you weren't but you still are thanked thank you ebob thank you for the two euros the they're claiming to be the only one of themselves uh that's we're gonna get existential fast so we'll just move on thank you for the support there bud rough riders another one of those names that pops up all the time thank you for the 499. say what's the plan for crew 2 coverage more das robots uh any michael das you guys want to talk about crew 2 or you want to leave that up to the viewer's imagination and they'll just have to wait and see on the day in work there you go in work in work and when das says he's working on something oh you know it's getting worked on michael thank you for the 10 euros they say five by five just came home from a jam session bit tipsy really hyped uh to see you guys live today wen frost shout out to the robots most importantly to mary down there bringing us daily content for real mary has already spotted a couple really cool things for today so the daily video which is coming out later on it shouldn't actually be too long uh should have some really awesome stuff and of course we'll also have a cryo proof recap video but i don't want to spoil anything but again if you if you aren't watching our daily videos uh maybe like and subscribe and you know if you don't subscribe to the channel already those daily update videos of everything going on in boca chica that mary does are absolutely astounding and of course she's a legend that's why i always say thanks mary i mean out unreal dedication on her part matt miller thank you for the five dollars thomas and fang thank you for the two dollars and the note about yuri's day and the shuttle anniversary yeah today's what is it the 40th anniversary of the first flight of a space shuttle space shuttle columbia and it's the 60th anniversary or something like that of uh yuri gagarin's first you know human flight into space is that am i accurate with those dates yeah i'm not i'm not a dirty liar uh let's see astro guy thank you for the five dollars hey guys keep the starship train just keeps on rolling it was a great was great meeting jack at sn 11's first attempt thanks so much for the awesome coverage oh what's up astro guy thank you for the support musical wolves thanks for the five dollars they say well sn11s cleanup need to be finished before the license for sn15 um i mean good question i am not the faa uh so i'm not quite sure how that'll all play out and i'm super wondering how that cleanup is going it's a lot of pieces to say the least but thank you for the support there musical wolves no see the queue keeps growing it's it's a it's a good problem because we need your support but uh i'm trying to get through these and we can get to some other questions if you have any questions feel free to at nasa space flight and put the question into chat and we will see it and we might read it and you do not have to super chat i always like to reiterate that no seed thank you for the five euros they say great coverage is always coffee for mary and oil for the robot army nice thank you see also oil from my land rover please and thanks it leaks a lot of oil it's bad oh it needs to get fixed need some maintenance anyways neptune ai or neptune ow thank you for the new membership and leon thank you for the new membership uh like again members with the recurring donations every month i mean it really helps us uh to be able to plan stuff out i mean the super chats are amazing but the memberships are like another level of support and i see also osprey gt thank you for the capcom membership awesome of you awesome to all of our members um let's see patrick gadsdell gold goldstein thank you for the uh 10.99 for 10 euros 99. mark lueck thank you for the five dollars they say sn1 in the intro not sm3 am i a dirty oh my god did i get that wrong i thought it was that's the end of the video did you it wasn't it was it was me i should know this one that's a good point oh my god can we just do over all right end the stream and restart it we're gonna start all right stream's over i'm gonna stop just darn it well you know sn1 was also mark three before it was changed to sn1 so maybe i get a i get an out maybe can that be my past there um musical wolves asking if the puck shucker which i believe some people uh is what they call the thrust ram will be tested too i don't know if it's it's i don't know if you can say that it's being tested but yes they are using the thrust simulator ram to simulate the force of raptors on the vehicle during this test um let's see rmn24 thank you for the oil money minimum thank you for the new membership colton collingwood thank you for the five dollars to say what are the differences between sm15 and sn 8 and 11. we really don't know too much you know specifics in terms of what the differences are i believe there's been a couple elon tweets about it here and there but uh a lot of that stuff is going to be under the hood so to speak so we just know that there's a lot of different changes to 15 and you know these starship prototypes are just that they're prototypes they'll change rapidly as this development program progresses so don't forget that there used to be a giant carbon fiber what was it 12 meter starship like it used to be completely made out of carbon fiber and way bigger diameter and you know things change so um we'll just have to wait and see maybe we'll get some more color from elon or hey here's an idea how about another starship update i really really really really want another starship update didn't like elon tweeted last year i think in like november like starship update in a week or something along those lines and so come on man uh please give us another update i need one like scratching myself a little bit like come on you gotta get any updates um taylor van camp thank you for the five dollars smooth peanut butter game get out of here crunchy only here's to a great test hope you all have having a great day you too buddy thank you for the support joey rogers thanks for the 499 they say the grid fin is a little smaller than i was expecting oh right mary tweeted about the grid fin oh yeah the super heavy grid fan was spotted today so that's what you can look out for one of the things in the daily video keep your eyes open for that um it was i mean yeah i don't know if it was bigger or smaller if it was just a scale thing or you know distance telephoto lens whatever i don't know but if it's smaller than what you're expecting hopefully it's adequately sized for the job there thank you joey for the support carlos thank you for the what is that 2500 currency units of some kind they say what are these dots on the chassis of starship dots i'm not quite sure what you're talking about there buddy the attach points for the tps i think oh oh yeah a ton of little dots around the side and those look like the mechanical attachment points that they put the thermal protection system tiles on i would guess yeah i know that makes sense those are like little rivets that are basically built into the skin right yeah exactly like like pegs or something i don't know exactly how to describe them but yeah yeah those tiles mount with like a y-shaped uh bracket that is sort of embedded in the tile and there's three attach points and so each tile has three of those studs on the ring of the of the you know of the wall of the ship that it attaches to good stuff um perrin thank you for the two dollars they say hi fan of you guys what do you think of isro that's the uh indian space uh yeah right yeah they're awesome i mean i like i like all rockets i'm a huge creep creep fan like i think is like their nominal like like it means like everything's nominal everything's okay and you hear it all the time during the israel broadcast you hear kareem kareem in the background i don't even know if i'm i'm pronouncing it correctly but i've seen enough isro broadcast to uh to know that much at least so yeah heck yeah i mean it's almost like a it's it's more satisfying than nominal because it's two words it's like a it's like a good good kind of thing at least that's what i imagine in my head anyways thank you parents for the two dollars and the support wow roger nick one yeah yeah roderick lippert thank you so much for the fifty dollars to say thanks for your hard work get some donuts and go with the coffee excellent to go with the coffee night that's a lot of donuts uh 50 is nothing to sneeze at thank you so much for the support there and like we always do we don't just want to have a stream where we're reading super chat so you don't have to super chat to get a question in make sure you tag us at nasa space flight if you have something to ask there's no way we can get to every single question because there's ten thousand of you know over nine thousand of you watching right now and nine thousand people could type in a question and we would talk about each one for five minutes and we would be here until june or longer but uh if you got a question for us put it into chat at nasa space flight tag us and i believe to help us out with some of those viewer submitted questions we've got another nasa space flight member joining us here uh ian do we have you in the comms net sir how y'all doing oh hey how you doing today ian great how about you guys good to be here yeah hanging out uh watching a cryo proof test y'all ian is a writer slash livestream commentator slash uh the voice behind some of those really cool update videos that we've put out what was that last update it was like the starship update right again general overview of what's been going on the past few weeks that down at boca chica yeah good stuff and and like thank you for doing that you know i'd have done a couple of them and they're they're tricky to be on camera and to read a script and write a script and so thanks for doing those i'm hoping that we can do more of them uh going forward yep writing a script on the other camera to us all right so really quickly ian i'm going to cut i'm going to let you run with some questions there but also let's introduce mary's camera here so now we have mary's camera online out there and you can actually see the beginnings of the frost ring there down about the middle of the fins on the bottom you can see that little white circle that shows there's actually some south texas atmosphere the humidity freezing onto the side of starship a clear indication they've got some cryogenic liquid in that tank that's what we're expecting and we'll see that frost line grow and grow but uh as always massive thanks to mary at boca chicago the official starship photographer the the og out there at boca chica capturing documenting the events of the starship test program and sharing them literally with the rest of the world if you want the hottest freshest starship updates make sure you follow her on twitter there at boca chica gal for short mary thank you so much for rolling out today and giving us yet another view of what's going on so ian if you can grab some of those questions out of chat and uh let's get some of those the the nor i don't know the right way to call those the free questions that sounds dumb because that that seems to imply that there's a paid question cue and it's not really that's not really the thing does anybody have a better way to refer i mean just viewer any question actually question viewer question yeah that sounds can you grab uh you ready to grab some of those ian so let's see here we got the first question here from william asking what did spacex end up doing with starship mark ii in florida so for those who are unaware because it's been about a year uh spacex was actually building two starships one in boca chico one in florida the second one in florida was called mark ii uh so as of right now mark two has been mostly scrapped only the nose cone is still there so they never even end up finishing mark ii because the design was so old and outdated they decided to just scrap it and pause florida operations so mark 2 is kind of still there but it's mostly scrapped so sad situation i've seen it myself mark 2 is pretty cool has a spot in my heart but mark ii is no longer with us really yeah i kind of want to go back now and edit some of my mark ii photos because i took a couple uh i forget what launch i was there for it might have been uh maybe it was ifa i don't know but yeah that that whole era it seems like ancient history at this point where they had two competing teams both building starships and different places and they had to like share info and all that but you know mark two even though it didn't fly or even get to really be tested it surely provided them with data that they needed to progress on to mark three slash sn1 slash you know everything after it absolutely elon even said that the reason they were building one in florida was to have two slightly different designs competing to learn uh benefits from both different designs so i'm sure they learned a lot from mark ii that helped the design of sn1 and onwards uh next question here uh they're asking is sm15 using three millimeter stainless steel sm15 is not it's using four millimeter stainless steel now what the difference is between that three millimeter is obviously thinner and by using three millimeter stainless steel they would be able to save weight approximately 10 to 20 tons actually across the entire starship they have not implemented three millimeter stainless steel into prototype starships yet they have done some smaller testing with sn7.2 but as of right now it does not look like three millimeter stainless will be used anytime in the near future at least up until less than 20. uh so as of right now all starships have used four millimeter stainless steel uh from kieran here asking do you think stars do you think spacex will fly a starship with people in before dear moon absolutely i think they will i don't think you would want to go from not having people on board a ship to flying straight to the moon what do you guys think about that dos has thoughts no i mean i i don't i don't know that i think they'll have a test flight in a starship with spacex astronauts before they put the commercial deer moon passengers in a starship i i definitely think they'll have some other crude mission before dear moon makes sense to me and at the very least we also expect they have to do several flight tests in an unaccrued configuration before they fly crew so yeah i think both unquote flight tests and spacex proved flight tests likely you mean you mean like a starship model that's designed for crew but not actually carrying crew when you say that yes correct yeah because they're going to fly what did you on say like thousands of cargo flights in starships that are not designed for crew first i mean thousands who knows how many it'll actually be but uh there'll be cargo starships and then there'll be cruise starships with different designs in the front uh cargo area if i'm not mistaken right correct cool yeah it's a fitting thing to talk about today given that it's the first flight of the space shuttle anniversary right and bob bob uh and john uh flew the hell out of that thing and you know so at some point presumably with starship a similar thing will happen and there will be humans to fly the first starship into orbit and wow that's gonna be exciting is one word for it i think also maybe terrifying um but awesome either way yeah i agreed a question you from cyber asking when will the newer simpler design of raptors be used so i see two different possibilities of that question there one uh there will be elon has talked about there being upgrades to raptor for um sn15 uh we do know that there will be some upgrades to be a little bit simpler that's really all that we know uh we have seen some new raptors pulling up into boca chica but there's no real visible difference other than some of them have a green nozzle and what that is we don't even know either so there have been uh like i forget what serial numbers they started at but um mary has shot several raptors that have been delivered that look pretty dramatically different than previous raptors really i have not seen that that's a news oh man uh yeah they they look completely different like um much less wiring like we were talking about this i forget on maybe it was nsf live or maybe it was the last stream that we did um yeah the rollout thank you yeah we were talking about how um it's possible that those engines have a bunch less instrumentation on them um you know as they're they're further along in the development cycle and perhaps oh look at that frost going and so you know maybe those engines don't need as many sensors or as much augmentation because they already know what to expect in various parts of the engine they don't have to have it so uh heavily instrumented and just looks like a more compact design so yeah it it does seem like uh like i don't know if those are on sn15 or what but they've those raptors have been being delivered for a little while now so surely they'll start popping up on vehicles soon if they're not already you know going to be slated to be used on 15 whenever it does get its raptors very interesting well i just learned something today on the nsf stream so there's also a second version of a simpler raptor called the raptor boost and that will be a sort of uh bare bones if you want to call it raptor that will be the engines on the outer ring for super heavy now there's been no news about those recently so and super heavy is still a little way down the road so we're probably a little while away from seeing any raptor boost engines coming out those are gonna be nuts right i just imagine like an engine with the throttle stuck open or something like it's just like it's it's just raw power i don't know i'm excited to see our boost in the same way that i'm excited to see uh raptor vac the vacuum variant uh start to be tested more oh yeah i'm hyped to see raptor vac be installed on a starship but also raptor boost because it's gonna be higher thrust and higher efficiency no throttle no gimbal it's just like max power crank it to 11. just light it and go yeah pretty much it's like a solid rocket booster of liquid engines a question from zack here asking will they do a cryo test of gse1 so what gse1 is is ground support equipment tank one uh you can see actually on the right there of that view looks like a starship there on the right actually um that is actually the first of seven seven propellant tanks for the orbital tank farm uh so that will be holding either do we know what that will be holding question we've we've seen um labels on it that said both fuel and uh i forget what other than fuel maybe it was it said oxidizer or lox or something like that but um not quite clear which of the two propellants it'll be holding but i think it's safe to say it's a propellant tank oh there we go but again it could also be i guess i presume a nitrogen tank but i think propellant gotcha so uh to answer the question here i would assume they wouldn't because they haven't been doing uh cryotests on normal vehicles they're only doing it on sn15 here likely because of the up some of the upgrades that it may have because they haven't done cryo tests in a good while on a lot of starships so i don't see why they would do a test of gse one but then again if they did i wouldn't be too surprised and hey ian real quick uh we're talking about gsc one this angle sort of fools people sometimes it looks like gsc tank is just right next to starship right you if you look at it you can tell it's a little bit thinner but it's actually a pretty good distance behind starship you can see there the tank farm on the very right sn15 standing tall then we've got hopper a little ways back and then way off to the left that's where the orbital launch platform uh the orbital tower is being built and those big gse tanks are being installed you can actually see the crane between us and the tank from this angle but a little bit of uh of a trick of the camera lens there when it gets compressed together there is a pretty good distance between the launch test the sub orbital test stands and where this more permanent infrastructure is being built yeah i think this that crane is ready for the next gse tank that's why they positioned that where they did so we should see the second gsu tank rollout of the mid bay any day now yeah i believe that there have been parts for gse3 spotted right yes and slowly beyond that as well gotcha so it does seem like they're just cranking them out because they are they do seem to be much simpler than starships because you don't need to have the thrust dome no common bulkhead is just uh forward dome two stacks and forward dome so it's relatively simple i'll say it's interesting that uh seemingly the bandwidth that they have at the production site that they were putting into starships they have now kind of shifted to these gse tanks and i i don't think sn16 has sn16 begun stacking yet they've begun to roll out okay so yeah i mean it just it just it's interesting that they have devoted so much effort to these gse tanks you know they practically paused starship production at least seemingly unless i'm just completely an idiot but point being they really want that orbital launch site up and running so that they can get an orbital attempt at some point this year hopefully before too long i'm not going to say summer yeah sometime soon hopefully fingers crossed but uh to add on to what you were saying jack i'm actually excited to see when they're done with gse7 i would assume um how fast are they going to start cranking out just starships because now if they're it seems like they're mostly working on gse tanks right now if they can move that bandwidth over to starships as well it's going to be just crank them out to pad a pad b pad a pad b it's going to be nuts to see over the next few months yep no slowing down in boca chico that's for sure absolutely and another question here asking how many raptors does bn3 need for an orbital launch um so i believe ian has talked a few months ago so this information may be a little bit out of date that a super heavy would need about 20 raptors i believe maybe it was 24. so right now super heavy will have 28 raptors operationally but that's likely a little bit of margin in there and a little bit of safety so he said that they could use 20 raptors on a minimal payload minimal basic bare bones orbital flight and if i had to guess i would assume they would go for minimal amounts of raptors uh what do you guys think about that what do you think we'll see for a bn3 orbital flight yeah i think definitely the minimum amount of raptors necessary because i mean they don't have a tower that can catch it yet so what you know does bn3 have legs do they just chuck it into the ocean if it actually pushes something into orbit will bn3 do a oh i guess the question is about an orbital launch i mean yeah i would say the minimum amount necessary would make sense to me yeah i i agree i think there's a high probability they're not getting those raptors back so if you don't need them on there uh don't send them yeah and it's a quick status update if you're joining us uh we are still waiting for the frost line on the liquid oxygen tank to rise a bit currently the frost line is towards the base of the liquid oxygen tank uh there is a bulkhead down there or a bulkhead where the thrust puck is where the rafters are mounted so that there is actually more liquid nitrogen in that tank right now it appears but regardless we should expect that frost line to start rising a bit as they continue with this test and then of course the ch4 tank the methane tank on top of the liquid oxygen tank should also start to get frosty in a bit yeah and uh i wonder if we are our spotting here will be aided by the hot day that it appears to be out there uh you know maybe we'll get some extra frost or what have you i always wonder how the weather affects what we see yeah i'm hoping it cools down a little bit a little bit less turbulence here because we've got quite a bit of turbulence in the atmosphere just looking across about uh mile mile and a half of atmosphere do you have that that magic software in the loop or no got it all right let's see uh jonas thank you for the 499 they say go team team nsf and uh go marry have a great day well you have a great day jonas thank you for the support ebob thank you for the two dollars uh looks like they're having a fight with themselves but thank you too sorry two euros kizify common name thank you for all the support keys if i for the five euros today they say how they fuel starship when it's on top super heavy are they using the same connection for in-orbit refueling that's a really good question um will it just be like a giant thermometer that fills up from the bottom can they even do that what are they going to do for orbital refill fueling connections how will that work so many questions um not really any answers unfortunately does anyone have any thoughts on uh how they'll fuel it on top of when it's on top of a super heavy maybe they'll have like a an arm off of the tower just like they do for the second stage of falcon 9 or what do you guys think i think some people have speculated that they might just use the refueling attachment point that starship will have and pipe the propellant through a pipe on super heavy we'll see another possibility is definitely some sort of umbilical connection to where they would refuel the starships in orbit yeah basically that's the two options that we're looking at i mean for whatever reason the piping it through super heavy option just seems kind of like more futuristic or like just like a cooler thing to do in the same way that landing a rocket seems like the right thing to do you know you just plug the fuel in one spot it goes up it fills up the whole thing right like simpler better uh but good question there cuzify and thanks for the support go ahead i would assume that since starship is fueled from the bottom uh from inside the skirt which is likely going to be in some way evolved into its refueling port i would assume that they would fuel uh starship through super heavy in that way so they'd have pretty much the same infrastructure as they have on the suborbital launch mount on the top of super heavy so they fuel up super heavy when super heavy's full they just keep pushing fuel in and it goes up through super heavy into starship i think that's that's the same way they do the liquid oxygen header tank on starship so that's my two cents that's what i could see being easiest quote unquote remember the simplest from a launch pad perspective yeah totally that makes perfect sense to me good question cuzify and cool support thank you uh daniel weir thank you for the 15 pounds they say let's start up the car repair fund here and now thank you so much uh it's just you know it's a good car it just drives a lot i think i've driven over 10 000 miles in the last uh i what was it sn9 that i was driving out to i hit 222k and i just recently hit 232k so a lot of miles going on the old land rover and it's getting up there in the years but eventually someday i hope to own a cyber truck which the next super chatter thank you so much 499. they say jack this is to start a tesla fund for you let me tell you the idea of driving down a dirt road with no engine noise just quietly creeping down back roads without making a sound i mean one is just going to be cool and surreal and two i cannot wait for cyber trek because i imagine be able to sneak up on wildlife and photograph them a little bit easier if your car makes no sound thank you jason russell and thank you to everybody for caring james allen thanks for the 10 pounds let's say just a little coffee money thanks d right thanks for the new membership spacex or ebob another ebob whacked gsc pipes with my trusty hammer go s715 well thank you buddy for the two pounds or two euros i got it why do i always mess those up jade hanson thank you for the new membership musical wolves again thank you for the five dollars it's a mystery nose cone to test emergency nose cone ejection option i mean i don't know if they're gonna do any kind of launch escape or emergency escape pod option with the nose cone that seems kind of like a whole bunch of additional complexity but who knows what they will end up doing uh mystery nose cone ejection option i you know i don't uh who knows let's put it in the who knows category i think the mystery knows cone is just a structural stand they're probably gonna pull and twist on it and apply various forces to make sure the nose cone can't withstand what is required to you know do on a scent as there's lots of aerodynamic forces and whatnot yeah that makes perfect sense just a test article i mean we've seen a bunch of different nose cone pieces i mean there was like nose cone header tanks pop test at one point in like january of last year or something like that right yeah so it makes sense that as they keep building out the system and refining it they're going to want to keep testing components of it and i think that's actually the nose cone stand is going to be at least somewhat similar to the first stage booster test dana mcgregor where they have the cap they put on top and they pull it down to simulate flight loads on the booster while test firing it i can see it's that similar in purpose to what the nose cone stand is yeah but that makes a lot of sense i hadn't thought of that good call uh johanski ask or johanski or johan johann kl i don't know i can read i swear thank you for the 45 currency units and they say do you think elon will launch sn15 on 420 i it's like 50 50 at this point it's not going to try because yeah it's not out of the realm of possibility by any means um perrin oh das parent has responded with another two dollar super chat and said kareem creed means approximately approximately nice i like it nice thank you yeah thanks for the follow-up there sebastian thanks for the canadian two dollars they say not ebob hey what is this ebob thing uh did i miss something thank you for the two canadian i want a good name thank you for the five pounds are they going to paint the gse tanks to protect against corrosion it's stainless steel it doesn't it doesn't stain right it stays less it doesn't completely not stain but it's not it's not magic okay fine over time they'll run into problems i can see them painting them to be honest because like they painted the ones on the right here you could see i do wonder what sort of uh insulation they will get if any maybe they'll do like a whole bunch of spray on foam or something like a shuttle external tank just to you know you don't want the only protection to for the cryogenic fluids to be uh stainless steel and then air you know you want something in there whether it's like you know like the vacuum like the fancy glasses you put whiskey or whatever whatever favorite beverage you have in uh you know like a there's all sorts of different ways to insulate liquids in containers so we'll you know maybe paint will be part of that uh part of that mix there the current gfc one tank is not done that is just the bare skin layer of the pretty internal tank i'm not sure exactly what sort of insulation they will have there will be an insulating layer yeah that makes perfect sense you can actually kind of see like the aerial photos that rgb has taken you can see there is sort of the foundation for where the outer layer will be nice okay yeah that makes perfect sense i mean brief aside i really love how those the gse1 tank and all those tanks in that area are kind of mounted on the same concrete like circular pad that they used to build starships on like they had those at the build site and uh that's sort of before they had the steel you know nice little transport rings that they use now they had um they had uh weird concrete like structures that you could walk into same they look exactly the same as what they're building tanks on now and i think at the starship update they like walked us through one deliberately like check it out um but it's cool it's cool to see them reuse pieces of the puzzle that they've already figured out um let's see benjamin black thanks for the five dollars they say yucca plant fund are we is this for the tequila farm or for the uh or for the for the yucca plant that got that got hurt in sn11's kerploding either way thank you for the five dollars and stephen thank you for the two dollars they say bn1 might roll to the pad as test pre-scrap maybe uh like to see how they could roll something um perhaps you know it could be used as a transport article sort of like shuttle enterprise was right was am i thinking the right thing shuttle enterprise was used to like make sure vandy had the correct cuts in the mountains and like they put it on the back of the shuttle or the shuttle carrier aircraft and did tests with that so yeah maybe we should maybe we should call bn1 enterprise i wouldn't uh disagree with that nice no seed thank you for the five euros to say after all that coffee money mary must have a terrible caffeine flash so this is for valerian wow thank you nessie very thoughtful scott summers thank you for the five pounds let's see how many people in chat beyond and beyond would be prepared to take a trip on the dear moon project deal please respond with y or n all right scott i think you might have like secretly gotten a poll going here but i would go personally i would definitely go um i'm kind of bummed they didn't like you know do the whole application thing i feel sort of stupid for not having done it but oh well i would go too i applied and i haven't heard anything after phase two which was the uh pretty much enter your personal information stuff i haven't heard a thing about that absence after that yeah fingers crossed for everybody that is submitted would be one heck of a ride uh anish thank you for the two dollars they say hi trevor big fan of you and nff nsf who's only we have a trevor on today but either way thank you anush for the support as a quick recap on mike we have myself jack buyer i am the person who is talking right now and looking at chat it is going crazy with wise and ends so we're going to have to ask michael at some point to uh to pull that poll there that is spontaneously erupted uh michael is one of the people on that does all the stuff in the background software wise keeps the cameras going keeps the lights on michael what's up say your name and or say something so people know what you sound like hi this is ian atkinson i beg your pardon i'm michael yes i i am michael that's what my voice sounds like it is not yet i promise ian go uh hello i'm ian atkinson with nasa spaceflight and then das what's up i'm not going fast enough with the graphics i apologize i'm giving you a speed run here sorry uh okay let's see almost done with the super chats and then we can get to the uh the results of that poll there todd groff thank you for the five dollars they say they're gonna chill or boil off the gsc tanks uh non-cryo fuel would be substantially higher pressure wouldn't it uh i assume chill i don't think they would do boil off but i am not a tankonomer wait i heard that you can't just add anime to the end of every word jack i can't yeah oh i can't try and stop me um but yeah does anyone have any thoughts on on the gsa tanks there i mean i could see them having a sort of recondenser but that depends on like what insulation they go with if they go with good enough insulation they might be able to just be good with boil off and just vent every now and then but if it's really not good i could see them going with like a recondenser like what they have on the pad now i think for methane they will have to have a recondenser or a flare stack so i'm guessing it's going to be a recondenser but the liquid oxygen i'm not sure what they will do but the nitrogen is what they used to recondense with so one way or another the nitrogen will most likely be boiled off and that's not a big problem because they are building an air separation unit at the launch at the production site excuse me to produce liquid oxygen and the bypro one of the byproducts of an air separation unit we're trying to get liquid oxygen is nitrogen because nitrogen is the most abundant uh gas in the atmosphere so that when you're producing liquid oxygen you end up with a ton of nitrogen left over so spacex is going to have more than enough nitrogen to do their testing yeah i'm looking at pictures i've shot of the plumbing area that little bunker area over by um the orbital tank farm and there is a there's two panels that were visible on this day it was i guess the 13th of march and there is one panel that says gaseous ch4 recharge 400 bar storage and there's another panel that says gaseous nitrogen recharge 200 bar storage so that sounds like both of those will have some sort of i don't know recondenser recharge whatever you want to call it but definitely will be interesting to see how that tank farm grows up they definitely try to put really cold propellant in the vehicle so for i mean nitrogen is not a propellant again but if i require a proof test they might try to super chill it i'm not sure let's see super good question todd thank you for the support thomas thank you for the ten dollars they say it seems like flaps will be really vulnerable part of starship during re-entry other than tiles they're gonna be any other tricks to deal with the thermal load and drag forces who knows maybe they'll do some like transpirational cooling on the flaps or something they've talked about transpirational cooling in the fat in the past i don't know if that ever got truly scrapped or if it's just one of the ideas in that they're juggling who knows but it'll be interesting to see how the entire thermal protection system grows up over time just like i mean so much of this we're just early days right now waiting to see how these things plan out palace plane that's another name that pops up again with the north korean dollars joke because i'm a big dummy but thank you for the norwegian kroner 50 of them and the love from norway thanks for the support thank you i'm never gonna let you off the hook for that no norway loves me and hates me for that and i apologize to all of norway uh donald thank you for the new membership jonathan thanks for the two pounds let's say please say hi to my friend who finished an exam today hi to the friend of jonathan tanner who finished an exam today hopefully you got a good grade yeah right you don't want to just walk out of them bugo thank you for the 25 currency units to say nose cone looks similar with dragon's docking port dude what do you think about orbital docking and starship i don't think that's what that nose cone is going to have on it or is testing but i do not know but it does look kind of similar right hugo is a cool name stephen dickinson thank you for the five dollars they say gse one through six i think there's six slots contain some consumables at same consumables as existing farm will there be plumbing between farms makes sense for truck deliveries i don't think so i don't know i mean i'm not an expert on tank farms and whatnot but um i super think that uh having long long propellant lines like that might not be the best you know thing that you would want to do in terms of having the propellant get to where it's going at the appropriate temperature i think things need to be kind of in a narrow band of temperature ranges and what they're expecting and you know obviously they could probably mitigate for environmental effects of piping stuff that far but why put you know why dig a bunch of trenches and put a whole bunch of piping across the entire launch site when you just have two different tank farms but who knows maybe they did that and there's photos of it that rgv has already you know posted that i've missed who knows but uh it doesn't seem to me like that would be the optimal way to do that anybody have any thoughts yeah i think you'd want to keep them separate just in case also if you have any issues at one farm you don't accidentally take out the other um i think just kind of keep them separate and also there's going to be the second orbital launch site too the second the orbital pad b which will probably use the same pad as the same um tank infrastructure as well i would guess go ahead there is the second tank farm for the on the planning document for the second orbital pad yeah that's exactly what i was going to say there who knows if that's still the plan or what things obviously change rapidly in boca but there as just like there's two orbital pads planned there are there have been planning documents that show two orbital tank farms so we'll be on the lookout for uh gsc 8 through 14 yeah right i mean it makes sense the tank farm that we see now for the suborbital pads is not anywhere close to enough for fueling a super heavy and also not in the right spot so you know they're going to need to build these that infrastructure out if they and when they start wanting to get into orbital flights which hopefully seems soon um thank you for the support there stephen the jacks already interrupted we'll add there are seven of the like normal gsc tanks but there is one water tank per pad so a total of eight tanks uh-huh okay yeah that makes sense so you're telling me spacex is building a water tower at long last it's not a water tower it's a water tank thank you let me have my moment here no no moment no anyways before i uh before i digress jlp tv thank you for the 499. say what starship do you think will have the most tps tiles before sn20 sn19 uh if if sn19 exists it seems like every starship they put out has not doesn't seem like it has been so far every starship since eight has had more tiles than the last so it seems like a like a steady progression into a full thermal uh heat shield so just a matter of time and looks like this next one i'm going to i'm going to guess this is from my dad saying with a 10 super chat thank you dad uh yes i am a junior he has the same name as me he says how much do i how much do i donate to get jack to shave his beard which jack though uh i mean me i presume that it could be him jack i don't know if he has was he talking in the third person [Laughter] um joke's on you dad i'm not going to shave it uh never shaving it well no i'll shave it when it gets annoying which is probably pretty soon it's getting long either way you have the super chat fundraising goal like after x amount of super tests you have to save your beard maybe i mean i shaved it for like to get i think it was sn9 and i was like here i'm gonna shave my i'm gonna shave my uh my beard and give sn9 good luck and we all remember how that turned out but who knows it's just it's beard time right now okay you can only shave your beard when a starship sticks landing so ugly there you go okay it'll get real long i mean who knows how long it'll take for them to stick the landing i used to think it would be soon but uh we'll see hopefully it is soon but either way thanks dad thanks for the wanting me to shave my beard on stream higher pawn jensen hopefully i'm completely yeah no i i butchered that jensen thank you for the the what is that icelandic kroners for the 3 000 of them wow um cap capital corporal capital day walker thank you for the five dollars and beer money on fleetcam um i don't really go on fleetcam too much but i know you guys do hopefully somebody's hopefully somebody saw that i mean hey i got a lot i got a lot to do i like i like fleetcam i'm glad that it exists i do go and check stuff out but uh you know i'm not one of the one of the people that just goes in there and hangs out for a bunch of time which is fun to do i know a lot of people really like doing that and it's a 24-hour stream and you can go in and hang out on fleetcam anytime you want to just look for it on our channel uh i'm not hating oh jack i don't think you're a true nsf fan if you don't watch fleetcam 24 7. man i'm an original fleet chaser come on i was out at uh port of long beach shooting jrti the first one before they even put wings on it come on man give me some cred other quick status update go ahead go ahead michael i was going to say a quick status update because i know more people are joining and we've been answering a lot of chat questions which is good but that frost line does not seem to be changing much so still waiting to see what happens usually with these proof tests when they start loading to nitrogen quickly we will see a lot of venting from the two vans kind of midway up the vehicle and we are not seeing that right now so expect to see some venting happening when they start loading it more quickly that makes sense uh someone asking what our favorite taylor swift song is i don't know that i could name it what anybody else want to chime in on that either way thank you for the two dollars a niche a different account or something thank you yeah i was gonna make a trevor joke there perfect gun fox thank you for the five dollars uh you want to keep the tank farms on their own little system other than inflow system but underground lines would be protected and keep the temp very well yeah that makes sense i'm not a tank honor i'm just a texas tank watcher uh but good point and thank you for the support my guess with the new membership thank you mike s again all of our members you are seriously key in helping us do what we do that's why we put up a little uh graphic at the end of nsf live and thank all of our launch directors and uh and uh what is the flight engineers and you know couldn't do what we do without you guys just wait we we've got all kinds of stuff in the works we've always got all kinds of stuff in the works so by voting with your dollars and becoming a member it super helps us out and helps us be able to uh to be able to you know do what we do brian wow 25 thank you so much for the support there brian they say level you all do you got my son interested in space finally keep up the amazing work that i mean that means a lot to me and i know it means a lot to all you guys too to be able to inspire people to be excited about not only the future but about space because who knows what career paths that will lead to down the line almost done with the super chats anthony m thank you for the 99.99 they say always been curious is there a way you guys can cover or have a vid of them putting a falcon 9 on one of the pads for launch uh i don't know if i want to say pull a dos here and say in work but you know maybe someday we'll see we'll see what we can do that would be really neat but all of that stuff is in a uh in you know kennedy space center cape canaveral or vandenberg and a lot of times not visible to the public or even media but oh that makes me want to go to vandenberg now and and shoot the booster going getting rolled out from surf beach or something i wonder if that would be possible that would be a really cool time lapse owen horn thank you for the new membership and amtang thank you for the new membership thank you all y'all that's awesome of you let's see what levels did you come in at capcom and pad rat awesome pad rat you get the daily preview videos and the members emoji and chat and capcom you get all that stuff plus discord access so enjoy the discord access there kage tenant thank you for the five pounds they say nsf is my favorite channel i watch every time you're live if i can jack i apologize for the rocket pun poem before did you do a rocket pun poem i might have missed it and amtank thank you for the two dollars and good luck with your application to work in boca chica all right that is all the super chats we have for now and memberships i mean the support is amazing so thank you all i'm definitely not complaining but hopefully you don't get tired of me going through and thanking everybody we can get to some viewer questions now and uh again seriously thank you for all the support oh really quick austin brown austin brown thanks for the new membership and nobody's super chat no super cats allowed came in at capcom awesome thank you austin brown all right moratorium on super chats let's answer some questions i like one right here you have some questions what are you thinking do you think sn 15 will fly higher or you think it's going to go for the same same same height as previous starship tests i would say it's probably going to go the same height as the previous ones around the same height so i'd say between 10 to 15 kilometers if i had to guess i'd only see them going higher just yet i'd say maybe want to polish up the landing first and then start going higher maybe to 30 kilometers or 50 kilometers or whatever uh it floats their boat i guess yeah sn s 15 will go to 10 kilometers i hope if it sticks landing the next one will go higher but i think they really want to get that 10 kilometer flight profile working before they push the bounds further another question here asking have we got tfs installed yet uh that is uh tfs would that be i think they mean fts yeah that's what i'm thinking i was thinking either thermal protection system that's an f uh fts do with the i don't think they have the fts installed yet do they no they don't and it does kind of look like it almost with that white dot on the side of sm15 which kind of looks like those same white boxes that the fts is in but that white dot is an antenna if i'm not mistaken yeah we think it might be a starlink possibly darling terminal because there was an sec filing that said they're gonna be using starlink a starlight terminal an upcoming test flight net i think it was net 420 of course was the date on the sec application uh i think jack you'd mention on a previous stream it might have been something similar to what's been seen on falcon 9 i'm not entirely sure but it does look like the approximate shape to be a starling user terminal yeah i don't know either way i had just seen speculation that it was a falcon 9 derived antenna type but it could as equally likely be uh a starlink antenna i don't know one piece of evidence is that somebody tweeted the i think somebody tweeted the fcc application and a picture of that terminal or antenna had one tweet and elon did like it i'm not saying that's confirmation that is exactly what that antenna is for but elon did like a tweet saying it was for starlink so take for that what you will yeah that that seems like pretty close to confirmation not you know it's not ironclad but that would lead me to believe that it's a starling antenna and i'm actually wondering because i remember back on s11 on the spacex webcast there were issues with telemetry dropout mostly with um camera video dropout so if they have a starlink dish on there and the starling dish works do you think we might get straight clear telemetry or a straight clear video more often i wonder about the orientation though ian because that's such a angle i wonder if it's only going to work when they're doing a belly flop that's what i'm thinking it'll be like pointed towards the sky more i wanted to say i wanted the purpose though ian because it's on the side that won't be re-entering obviously but it's not like if they wanted you know a scent footage you think to put it up top on the nose cone because it's kind of lower down on that what's it called windward side right or the opposite leeward side we were inside thank you yes leeward side um i almost wonder if it's gonna be for trying to get telemetry when they're re-entering or something that is a great idea and i could absolutely see that because there wouldn't be much there would be turbulence but there wouldn't be as much plasma straight behind the vehicle so they might be able to get at least some telemetry back maybe pings of i'm alive because with sn20 which is pretty much seems like it's going to be throwing mud at the wall and seeing what sticks in terms of an orbital flight any bit of telemetry possible during re-entry would probably be beneficial so just being able to send basic things are just like hey i'm alive this is my orientation this is my altitude would probably be immensely beneficial rather than just being like okay we have no telemetry for the next minute so i could absolutely see that it's a great idea actually or a great point we have another question here from parth asking are they testing different sizes of heat shield tiles on sn15 and yes they are they are testing not only the main size heat shield tiles which i don't even know how big they would be because we haven't really seen any scale on them but i would guess around maybe two feet in size would you guys think that maybe one foot there were normal hexagon tiles i mean you're a professional uh do some division on how many heat tiles it takes to cover the abs section compared to the diameter or something i don't know all right all right i just got a message uh from a friend saying uh just over a foot approximately so yeah that sounds about good so they are they do have smaller size tiles on there as well some small sized tiles which are about two-thirds the size of that so they are testing different different sized tiles on sn15 but they have not tested any nose cone tiles yet which i think is very interesting yeah i do wonder how the tip the nose cone is going to be covered that seems like it's going to be a lot of smaller tiles maybe we'll see i could see it being smaller tiles and then right up towards the very tip of the header tank being several large tile segments somewhat similar to the shuttle's nose cone but broken up a bit more a question here from gaming falls asking how long do you think the launch tower will take to complete well given that we've seen on the public documentation that the permit for the launch tower goes up until about july i would guess they'll have it done by july um and that would probably just be the bare bones tower just a structure and maybe the crane on top then from there they would put all like the wiring lighting propellant feed lines if necessary we'll have to wait and see what the orb what the launch tower will actually look like um but i would assume the base structure would be done by early summer especially to facilitate an orbital launch attempt in july you'd want to have at least a basic launch tower in place a question here from james asking when do you think we'll see a starship and super heavy joint together if only as a manufacturing test i honestly think the first time we'll see a starship in super heavy together would be when they're going for an orbital launch attempt because i don't see them building a starship and a super heavy that would be capable of joining together and fueling each other if they're not going to try to test those same vehicles on an orbital flight what do you guys think um so as as is the question saying just if it would ever happen separate from a launch attempt as a test yes am i reading that right yeah yeah i could see it happening i don't know if we're gonna see it happening and then that same stack does not launch but i fully expect them to do an integration test and fit checks and a couple of wet dress rehearsals on a full stack before they launch it so that to me seems very likely but i don't know if we're going to see them build pathfinder vehicles that do not end up launching as a full stack yep i agree with that a question here from lucas asking is starship friction stir welded and the answer is no they actually use more traditional i believe i don't know exactly what they use right now but i know in the past they have used tig welding i know that i know they now use robotic welders but i don't know if that's welding or arc welding but they do not use friction friction stir welding is when you take a sort of high pressure bit push it into the two sheets of metal and sort of twist it so as it spins it generates heat and meshes the two metals together starship does not use that uses more traditional welding friction stir welding is used on i believe the falcon 9 is used on the space launch system um used on more traditional rockets but starship is really simpler in terms of welding i think elon said starship is two the stainless steel and starship is too thin to work with friction stir welding gotcha that would make sense i think it's tig welded still but you know that could have changed yeah it's definitely not friction stir welded yeah a question from space explorer 16 asking do you think they'll turn bn1 into a few gse tanks and my opinion on that would be no because while they are somewhat similar in construction why it may sound simple to just hook it up there's a lot of issues with that and because bn1 is actually two tanks together you would need to either split those two tanks or run those two tanks at the same time because if you put fuel or propellant in the top tank of bn1 and not in the bottom tank you'll get what happened for bn3 when it crumbles down on the pad but i i don't think there would really be any benefit into just doing that into putting bn1 on the um as a gse tank they're getting really good at building these tanks and i don't think the benefits of refurbishing a tank for something outside its original purpose outweighs the trade-off when you just build something exactly how you need it to work the first time there are some differences between super heavy and the tanks that they are using for the ground support equipment sounds good and we can see a pre-event sorry ian so i'm hoping that we're going to start seeing that frost increase but so far not a lot of changes in the past 30 minutes but hopefully we'll start seeing that fast filled with liquid nitrogen soon and a question from jacob this is a bit off topic but i just want to touch on this asking why does nasa continue to fund starliner when dragon is complete and proven to be safe and reliable well the reason they still do that is because you don't want to have just one method of transportation to the space station because what happens if there's an issue with dragon down the road and you don't have star line or say in a hypothetical you don't have starliner what do you do you'd have to shuffle around the soyuz flights just to get any amount of people up on the space station so to have two up there even if one's having a problem that's exactly why you have two the reason that there are two because starliner had an issue now dragon could take on the lead and say if dragon has the issue down the road starliner can take on a little bit of extra load so they can toss back and forth with each other this is exactly why they have two vehicles and not just one at a time because if you lose your main vehicle you're out of luck so it's still good even though dragon is reliable now it seems to be reliable it's only flown a few times so there could be an issue down the road even if it's mundane but it could ground dragon for a small amount of time you always want to have backups especially in spaceflight yeah go ahead i mean starliner's already been funded so it's not like there's a new funding round coming up and nasa has decided they're going to give starliner several more billion or whatever uh it's the program has been funded through six operational missions yes there will be more beyond that remains to be seen but the contracts have already been signed yep exactly just imagine if if after each shuttle you know mishap that had occurred we had had another vehicle we wouldn't have had years of downtime in between both challenger you know after challenger and after colombia um having a redundancy is good having redundancy is good having redundancy oh i'm sorry a bad joke alrighty and uh another question here from ldt asking did sn 16 start stacking yet no sn16 has not started stacking it but they have started rolling out some segments of sn16 so we saw i believe was yesterday mary posted on twitter a four ring stack with 960 tiles i counted on there so already a large amount of heat shield tiles for sn16 but they are starting to roll out the sections of sn16 so we should see stacking start probably in the next week or so if i had to guess but also you're having to work with the gse tank stacking as well so it's it's gonna be a bit of a messy schedule over the next few weeks as they go starship gse starship gse and work super heavy vn2 into there as well another question from dave asking you could describe how the hydraulic thrust simulator functions us what the thrust simulator is it's a sort of hydraulic mount uh underneath starship so underneath sn15 you can't see it right now it's sort of under the launch mount and there's stuff in the way that you can't really see it uh what they do they attach a hydraulic ram to the base of the launch mount on the inside and it pushes up on the engine mount of starship and the reason they do that is to test and ensure that the welds and just the structure of starship in general can handle a simulated thrust load on the base of the vehicle without having to actually fuel it up and sac to potentially put raptor engines at risk so it's a more simple way just to make sure the vehicle is completely ready to have raptor engine installed and it can take the forces involved question you from kira asking why doesn't spacex use the same technology for landing the starship rocket as they do for the booster landings so with the booster uh super heavy is gonna come in sort of straight down there's gonna be no belly flop nothing is gonna come straight down land your engine or ignite your engines and land straight up with starship as we know they do the belly flop where they come in horizontal ignite the engines and flip so the reason they do the belly flop is to slow the vehicle down a bit more during its descent use the atmosphere to your advantage and the reason they don't do the straight down is because you save a large large amount of propellant by slowing yourself down in any way possible so it means that saving propellant they can put more towards getting more payload into orbit having a little more margin for landing just makes it a bit easier on the propellant load now it is a lot more difficult on the vehicle to have to deal with doing the belly flop but the benefits it seems like spacex is confident the benefits outweigh the risks with the belly flap maneuver and we'll go through some super chats here we have some coming in from powell with the five i believe that is a pound five pound super chat no message there but thank you very much powell from kristoff here asking your thoughts on the mystery structure with a two euro super chat as we discussed this a bit before we think that the mystery structure may be for doing structural testing on the nose cone because they have not taken starship to any very high speeds yet such as supersonic so they may want to just be testing here on the ground to make sure the nose cone can handle the stresses it will be going through so they'll essentially what we think again this is speculation here what we think they'll do is attach uh some cables and pull the top of the nose cone down with the same force they think the atmosphere would put on the nose cone during a high speed flight just to make sure that it can hold the loads and not crumple because a crumpling nose cone would not be a good day a question here from cage with a two pound super chat asking any plants to construct an extra road so they are not currently not building an extra road i would assume you mean along highway 4 in bokuchika which is the highway you can't really see here but it's in front of the camera they are building a road actually between port of brownsville and highway 4 which may be used for starship and super heavy in the future to um sort of service the oil rigs that they'll be landing on but no they're not building any extra roads here around the launch pad and we have a new member here from tech brigade thank you very much for the membership they took the pad rat rank which is very helpful with the channel so thank you very much for the support there a question here uh sorry super chat here from marius i think they're poking some fun at jack here with some north korean kroners love from norway a quick question when hop quick answer i don't know uh but thank you very much for the support there marius uh and roulon here new member as well thank you very much for the support roulon uh question here from the super gosh with 499 pounds will they try to catch the booster on the first attempt or will they build another pad so they can land the booster and the ship that's a good question there so it seems like they i'm not sure about catching the booster but it seems like they don't want to land it on a landing pad so i would assume they're either going to try to catch the booster or maybe just expend it but again it plans are changing all the time at boca chica so we'll really just have to see i hate saying we'll have to wait and see all the time but that's really all i can say at this point and a 10 super chat from justin here saying no question just support well i appreciate that very much justin i'm sure we all do thank you very much for the support and question here from david 10 super chat thank you david asking is redundancy good of course redundancy is good i think that's poking fun at jack earlier uh but yes redundancy is always good and spaceflight you always want to have redundancy in your most important systems yeah you always want to have redundancy in your most important system redundancy it's good yep sorry i just wanted to be redundant again no it's okay jack you like being redundant and a super chat here 499 from tyrone love what you guys do thank you very much tyrone we appreciate your support love what you're doing and a question here from rise uh 199 pounds it needs to be more pointy good work guys thank you very much for the support and stephen here with a five pound super chat have you all built yet now you're doing yours while tank watching and thanks for the coverage i have not bought a lego shuttle i know there may be some people in nsf who may be mad at me for saying that um but i do not have the room or the money to buy a lego space shuttle right now so if i did have the room i would love to buy one anyone else here got the lego space shuttle yet basically the same i don't really have like disposable income or space but man that would be a fun build for sure i have one of the older ones that i have not opened i don't know if i should open it because it's going to lose value if i open it but i don't know exactly i noticed in a couple of models it's one of the one it's from the 2000s from the early 2000s i think i'm not sure exactly which one but it's an it's a different model than the current one maybe if they uh if they release a robotic camera version of the lego space shuttle i'll get it and assemble it [Laughter] we should like do uh you know like you can build your own lego kits we should build a robotic camera lego kit and then put it on our store or something no all right fine [Laughter] i mean i do have actually as michael's i do have this uh an old shuttle model it was the shuttle with external tank and boosters it's currently under my bed right now but it is fully assembled and it's a really cool model i got it about 10 years ago but that's really cool model nice and finally we have a super chat here from ilya asking how can i ask elon musk a question well the best way to ask elon would be to tweet it him on twitter um and that's pretty much all i can tell you yeah just everybody else does if he tweets about like the sky being blue ask him a technical question about tesla i mean a lot of people do that it works so i mean every now and then i get a response from him about something and it's it's nice to get a little bit of background on you know if we don't know this or that so worth a try just add them on twitter yeah shoot your shot shoot your thank shot and the next one next next super chat is from dyu89 oh hey what's up it's i don't i have no idea who you are asking wow uh asking when jack in a kayak uh at some point i'm glad that uh the beard memes and the uh and the north korean dollars uh memes are outliving the kayak slightly but we can we can cling to it still it'll happen um i do sort of wish i'd had it with me for my most recent times in boca chico since i was there for so long i almost certainly would have gone kayaking but there's always going to be future trips to boca did we see more frost warming it's hard to tell it looks the same to me yeah it looks the same to me on the other camera though the other angle from the village that one that one that kind of looks like more yeah almost looks like the the area inside the flap zone it's a terrible term um it looks like the flaps are sort of shielding or like sort of partially insulating i don't know maybe my eyes are just playing tricks on me but it does sort of look like the frost is starting to creep up there i think it's just reflections could be yeah no i think that's fast for me it looks like it's it looks like it's increasing like as we speak yeah let's keep it over those let's let's check this one here we may have a closer in yeah oh i just i just reminded myself uh we never um we never looked at the results of the poll or whatever when chat did wise and ends i forget what the question anyways anyways i don't even remember the question do you no and a question here from a curveless sphere asking will the upcoming crew 2 mission have any impact on boko chika operations spacex are all hands on deck on getting people to the iss or are they completely separate teams so they are completely separate teams there is very if anything there's very very little uh crossover between starship and falcon 9 teams actually i would say there's pretty much none between the crew dragon and starship teams so whatever goes on in boca chica does not affect uh what's going on in cape canaveral uh and it actually it does look to me like frost is very much increasing on starship now i think right yeah yeah it looks like condensation's forming that's good that's what we want to see yep absolutely fill it up with more nitrogen and again there are two tanks so right now the liquid oxygen tank is what is being sold with liquid nitrogen and then they usually move on to the methane tank after the methane tank is the tank on top and it runs towards about the halfway point of the vehicle and then the top section is the payload section so you got the ass action with the engines then the liquid oxygen tank is frosting now above that is the methane tank and above that is the payload area and the nosecone another question from harry asking do you know if sn15 has raptors installed yet and no sn15 does not have raptors installed yet and we know that because dram is stalled and the thrust ram connects directly to the raptor attachment points on the bottom of starship so you can't have the thrust ram in place if you have raptors installed on the vehicle so no there are no raptors installed just get an sn15 i never thought about with that before but that makes good sense like there's nothing for the thrust ram to attach to if the raptors are in place and a question from the observer is there any worry of bn3 crumbling under the weight of sn20 um i don't think that i think that absolutely is a concern but i think there are ways to manage that uh the main way would be keeping the booster pressurized at all times but that does throw me back to not only a starship sn3 which did crumble under the weight of its upper tank being filled but also the famous atlas agena i believe it was that crumpled on the pad because the booster lost pressure so as long keep the booster pressurized i don't think there's any risk of any collapse but if they do lose pressure on the booster it's anyone's game really so just keep your boosters pressurized i guess it's the moral of the story there keep your boosters pressurized if you learn one thing in space flights it's keep your boosters pressure i don't wanna imagine how they can be taken out of context so i'm gonna move on to the next question here david asking how long will we have to wait for a starship prototype with more than three raptors so it seems like that's actually very close on the horizon they have been testing out raptor vacuum mounts on a test bulk aft bulkhead they've been cutting holes in it essentially a bulkhead that they won't be using i believe that's from sn14 actually but they have been testing mounting points for raptor vacuums so i would assume that means we're going to see them happening soon maybe on sn20 with the orbital flight or maybe they won't want to risk those just yet but i think they are very soon on the horizon as in probably before the end of this year that's my guess that thing is really uh frosting up isn't it it's starting to look yeah very frosty yeah like a water bottle on a warm day yeah there you go it also looks like the methane tank on the far left-hand side if you go you have like the upper part of the lox tank that's frosted now it looks like it might be extending a little bit into the methane tank on the left-hand side there possibly i'm not sure if that's the front the surrounding tank being called if it's actually liquid nitrogen in the methane tank right now just looking at some of the different angles this is always tough because this angle it sort of has the sun in its eyes you know so we don't get as much contrasting there i think that was the methane tank because the the cables go into the nose cone right above the methane tank so it might be loading the methane tank too right now and uh on that note i believe i will actually have to head out for this stream uh thank you all for having me uh have a good day everybody have a good day everyone in chat good deal y'all that's the voice of ian atkinson one of our commentator editors writer et cetera et cetera for nasa space flight uh you can follow him on twitter at ian pineapple i have never asked why it's ian pineapple but uh ian thanks for hanging out with us today yeah glad to be here that question i guess off to go unanswered yeah just uh next time on nasa's space flight like well the short answer is pineapple huh the story behind the pineapple stay tuned next time yeah i could share it now but i'll keep you all in the edge of your seats static fire stream there you go static fire stream all right i'll see y'all later have a good night good deal ian thank you so much for joining us again y'all uh that is ian atkinson you hear his voice on the uh webcast quite frequently hopefully hear more from him in the future but one of our fantastic contributors to nasa space flight also purveyor of the commentary for that uh rare commentary video that we did uh the pre-recorded starship update we're looking to do more of those it's just a bandwidth thing and i mean not like internet band with like people who have enough hours in the day to write scripts and stuff but that's ian over there um this updated timeline to ch4 tank crossing because it looks like to me that frost is climbing up do you agree jack i agree yeah definitely and it's it's wild to me how much different it is looking at a cryo proof of a full starship versus just the tank section i have to keep reminding myself that where that white dot is approximately just above that is all nose cone space um so you know we don't expect the whole entire thing to get frosty but perhaps the whole tank section and it's just it's throwing me off a little bit for a second there you said uh like you said it was moving on to the ch4 tank the methane tank and i was like what is it really that high and it's like yeah it is because a lot of that is nose cone that we're looking at there but i think we have another personal commentary to replace ian i think so i think you might [Laughter] thomas uh we get you connected there yeah i'm here how's it going everybody did i did i miss that when did you connect because i thought i glanced over and i was like okay no like five seconds ago okay good cool i was going to do the intro then i glanced over one way then i glanced back and there you are sneaking into the stream uh folks we are now joined by another member of the nasa space flight crew thomas the thomas fan club looks like they're representing in chat already so thomas berghardt is one of our commentator editor just i'm just going to start saying member of the nasa space flight team because we all do so many different things thomas how you doing today i'm doing good i'm waiting for my production preview to load but right now i'm looking at a loading symbol so i don't i'm assuming you know starships all frosty and things at least that's what i get the impression that of what is going been going on it's pretty frosty looking yeah it looks pretty good yeah i mean we saw the tank farm spool up and belch a whole bunch of vapor like it does and we saw it starship sort of uh get frosty at the at the bulkhead weld the aft bulkhead there and uh chill for a minute and it kind of you know entered into a steady state for a while and now it has rapidly filled up the entire lox tank and is now appears to be in the process of filling up the uh the methane tank above it so even that that original frost ring down there at the bulkhead weld you can see it's getting sort of whiter and denser so or more dense i guess i should say but yeah this thing is definitely in the midst of a cryo proof i'm excited to see the next step when um you know they sort of have it full or as full as they want it and hold and then they'll do some venting out of the side vents that we typically see and sort of make sure it can hold pressure so we're we're well into it at this point yeah i can see that now definitely frosty definitely cryo proof and uh of course this is kind of the first test sm-15s done right i mean they rolled it out and this is kind of that first step towards getting engines installed getting a static fire test done and then of course flight so this is the you know this is the start of another launch campaign and somehow they just keep cranking out starships down there so uh yeah definitely very exciting let's see i can run through some super chats really quick reese thank you for the 199. they say what year should i book my mars hotel for um i'm gonna say 20 39. no siri shut up what the heck hotels in marshalltown what is that all about leaks oh my god marshalltown oh man oh what is that all about anyways robotic camera location right yes it's me betraying the fact that i'm a robot uh live on stream um but yes i'm remembering 339 is not a bad estimate i mean that's i think that might even be on the conservative side but hey i think that's you know if you're going to book your hotel you don't want to book your hotel for a date that the hotel doesn't exist yet so yeah you beat me to it i was going to say the exact same thing you want the hotel you typically want the hotel to exist when you book a room at it so it's kind of a prerequisite there um space ignorant thank you for the 4.99 cents they say look at us watching a cryo ram test just like the old days yeah right this does it has been a while since they've done one of those hasn't it yeah it's it's i like this this is you know classic tank watching um go for it i just like sadly jack this is the first time they have used the thrust ram thrust simulator thrust shocker whatever you want to call it with a full stack starship oh because previously they installed sn 8 snows cone at the pad after they did this test wow okay so yeah no wonder it's throwing me off it's we literally haven't seen anything this yet huh neat uh good point michael unknown thank you for the two euros to say what are current plans after sn20 sn21 of course or 26 technically not wrong yeah yeah oh yeah or 26 depending on how they feel about omitting numbers like they like to do um but not really the i'm not trying to be flipping thank you for the support we just don't know um they're gonna keep making them and keep refining them and we'll just see what happens thank you wes thank you yeah hopefully like refueling and re-entering safely and not croploading um wes irvin thank you for the 420 in the no comment trevor thank you for the five pounds they say what sm do you think will get some windows subscriber sins star hopper days thanks for the texas tank sanity all through lockdown and beyond well thank you trevor for being a texas tank watching og i don't know when they're gonna do windows that that might be quite a ways down the line but i was super super excited to see that that announcement from spacex the other day about uh dragons that aren't going to the space station having a cool like couple of type window so hopefully windows are on the brain at spacex and and i'm not of the opinion that a screen is a sufficient um substitute for a large awesome window i want to see with my own darn eyes come on right if somebody ever tells you that that a window can be substituted with the screen as two companies that will not name have tried to claim so far uh they are crazy that is my opinion there is no point in experiencing what you can see from earth in space like why would you go to space what's the point i mean i 100 agree with you but at the same time if you're there looking through a camera view like we could get you know we could we could game plan out all the different ones like if you're on a if you have a periscope what if it's a periscope okay what if it's a digital periscope like a camera on one end and then a screen but you still put your eyes up to it and you hold the thing like at what level are you satisfied with looking like your eyes are seeing the thing that your eyes would see if you're looking through a clear sheet of material either way optical with no digital yeah i mean that's entirely that's entirely fair and i think i would i would tend to agree with you there hopefully physics and manufacturing can uh advance the point where that's possible we we do not have screens that approach the resolution of pure photons hitting your retinas let's put it that way yeah there you go and even just things like color like i mean i know i'm always sort of bothered by um images that present something like with super enhanced color like we see like a photo of the um like the various nebulas or something from hubble space telescope and it's all these amazing colors then you read the footnote and it's like oh by the way the different colors uh correspond to different elements and you're like like what would i even see with my eyes um nothing you know anything or even just down to the like weird details like what the what the um you know white balance of the camera is and things like that it's totally different like you said das to see it with your actual eyes and speaking of quick nitpick is anyone else annoyed with the whole blue dunes on mars story that's been going around it's an infrared image there's not blue dunes ah anyways um i mean i'm not screaming ah about it or anything jack but uh yeah okay maybe i had a little bit too much coffee um observing the cue go for it no dude that's that's the whole camera processing thing to make these amazing views is one of the things that's always been ah it's kind of like a pet peeve for me because i got bit before i knew anything about cameras not that i know anything about cameras now um but before i knew about anything i was looking at photos online of launch viewing opportunities for the cape right and it's like oh where can i watch i can watch from the port i can watch from titusville i can watch from playa linda you know i'm seeing all these pictures and there were these amazing pictures from playa linda and they had telephoto compression in them and i didn't know this i didn't know this was a thing so i got all backed up and i went all the way down there oh i'm going to see my first launch and i go there and i'm like that doesn't look anything like the picture the record training please tell me please tell me that a stream of this exists on the internet somewhere no no no because if it was a stream that i would have cameras telephony lenses like that would be different but just going there with the mark 1 eyeballs i couldn't see with my eyes what i thought i was going to see based on the photos on the internet yeah i just didn't know you know i almost felt like like sort of bait and switch like i went there and i'm like that's nowhere near what i what they said it was going to look like on the internet and now i understand the telephoto compression and lenses and zoom like now i get it but i literally chose that location because i thought i was gonna see that with my eyes and i went there and even though it was amazing to see the launch i felt a little bit disappointed that i couldn't see what this camera was depicting you know what i mean so no i would completely agree it's sort of a pet peeve of mine as well and it's a double-edged sword too like on the one hand are you getting people that otherwise wouldn't be excited um that that's that's meaningful but then are you discouraging them hopefully not when they find out that the thing that they're looking at is not something that they would ever actually see with their like you say mark one mark one eyeballs that's exactly right it's just it's just something that caught me unaware because i didn't understand and i made this decision to travel down there to see it and then i didn't see what the camera could show and i'm like really come on oh man i was i was really hoping you had streamed this on twitch or something i could go back and watch like baby das be like what the heck man like rage cage about it that would be really great so yeah no i go ahead i'm going to say my pro tip for doing launches if you are viewing a launch for your first time doing binoculars that's the pro tip i have because that's what i did and it worked well yeah and you don't even have to have any kind of crazy fancy binocular like literally any kind of magnification do wonders for what you're able to see and probably you know i've seen a lot of people actually out of boca chika too with monoculars like from uh like a spotting scope from a rifle or what have you it's like really any kind of magnification is going to do you well because even the launch sites where you can get super close um you know boku chika is like five miles uh from isla blanca park but it's just it's um you know still far for the human eyeball even for large vehicles and my second pro tip jack is do not and this is the biggest one actually this is like my number one pro tip for doing a lodge i hope it's not whatever you do do not travel thousands of miles and spend hundreds of dollars to watch a launch through your cell phone screen please do not do it do not do it i will scream if i see it do not go all that do not go through all that effort to see your phone through the worst video that anybody has ever seen like just watch the webcast it will be better other than the audio i mean the audio will be great but do not watch a launch for yourself on screen every launch i go to you see hundreds of people doing it do not be the one that makes that mistake please yeah go that's a big thing like you tell people that are watching a launch for the first time and it's like put away the camera put away the cell phone just put it away and just watch the launch you know what i mean don't worry about capturing it or just take a selfie or something like that i don't know but there are entire teams of people whose job it is to capture the launch for you we've got that covered you just watch the launch it's true uh like enjoy the experience you know what i mean yeah i can't agree more and uh you know be here now that's what i'll say i'll say be here now awesome stay off the cellular networks because we're using them all for us look at that we got a frost ring uh looks like in the methane ring yeah and i will add one more thing to my rant the dslr is much better because you are still doing the launch through an optical viewfinder not through a digital screen not unless you have an ad not if you have a mirrorless thing yep well mirrorless cameras are dumb so you won't have that right i'm sorry oh man i just went all mirrorless i hate i'm just kidding no actually mirrorless cameras are good for this one problem which is that you cannot watch a launch with your own eyes through them but if you're using a dslr with a optical viewfinder even then your mind and trust me i noticed a shot a ton of launches before your mind starts thinking about the photos and not the experience of the launch so it is your first launch my strongest recommendation is not to take photos once you've seen several launches then by all means you know have fun taking photos but for your first launch i highly recommend as hard as it is just enjoying the experience because it is amazing so my recommendation long story short is for your first launch watch it through binoculars yeah i can't i can't agree more to that and i'm i like this rant for a lot of reasons partially because it's not me ranting for once um but no really it's a really really good thing to say and to let people know in case they haven't seen a launch yet and they're going to experience their first one i i can't tell you how many times i've shot something like a like a rocket launch and because i was in the moment sort of working and doing the job of taking photos i didn't really experience it firsthand or i'd go back and look at the photos while editing them and be like oh my god there was a giant green flash like cloud of green you know how did i miss that but it's because you're you know in the moment focusing on multiple different things like exposure and framing and all of that and not necessarily experiencing it with your own eyes and definitely can't agree more there michael um really quickly fifty dollars from osimo 3089 thank you so much asimo uh great streams as always thanks for doing this space flight team well thank you buddy yeah right that's the roblox guy um thank you so much for the uh the support it's repeated support it's a large amount of support and we really really really appreciate it um can't say that enough observing the queue thanks for the hundred rubles they say hey das there's a robotic camera lego set set 9731 and a couple more fresh from the year 2000 okay that's i'm looking it up right now if yeah if anybody needs a christmas present for das that's i think that's probably a great one um if you're we're thinking about christmas earlier here scott summers thinks it actually exists wait wait okay somebody somebody link it i want to see vision it nice oh my god that's awesome windstorms thing that is that's a mindstorms thing oh man i had mindstorms that was like super formative in my development as a nerd i taught uh i taught summer camps i taught kids how to do things with the lego mindstorms long ago and far away we didn't have the robotic camera kit but we had the little you know drag and drop programming sort of stuff and all that sort of thing mind source became something else didn't it it's called nxt is that in my brain somewhere i don't know i just know lessons yeah it's like an old school one yeah i wish i could say i'd like did something smart with my mind storms kit i mostly bait like made like centrifuges and then tried to make it so that they didn't spin themselves apart and then like weaken apart and then watch it spin itself apart i don't know what that says about me as a lego builder but maybe it's just that i like chaos um scott summers thank you for the five pounds they say is there a heat shield side of view uh i mean i guess we can kind of see the heat shield side from uh the beach view but not right now i don't think that's more like that side of the vehicle is sort of pointing towards the water um i'm pretty sure that's like all wildlife preserve out there i'm not positive though lily c with the thomas fan club thank you for that gilbert anderson thank you for the ten dollars they say been loving your stream since sn6 redundancy is ysn sh super heavy should have had three extra rappers at raptors to ensure their safe return yeah i mean more raptors is more better just like more rockets is more better super heavy will not have a shortage of raptors i don't think engine redundancy is a concern for super heavy yeah yeah good point uh josh palmer thanks for the 499 they say let's hear your odds sm 15 6 landing i'm gonna say 50 50. anybody else want to chime in i'll take 51.49 in favor of landing okay nice 52 48. one dollar bob one dollar bob jr thank you for the two dollars they say transparent aluminum i'm guessing that's back to the windows discussion we had uh not 95 talking like optical windows joe dad jokes i got him joe thank you for the five dollars michael weisman thank you for the 4.99 they're asking about material for the windows yeah again with the transparent aluminum that's something that's been thrown around i don't know that a sheet of vinyl has been made ever and aluminum as being a thing so yeah he did yeah yeah i mean i don't know if i've ever seen like a tech demo of that is it like a theoretical thing or something that's actually done but needs to be made into a state where it can be manufactured at scale or you know is it like a carbon nanotube situation where we can make carbon nanotubes but we can't mass produce them or something like that not sure but um either way holy cow we have a hundred dollar super chat from robert hobson good old bob hobb thank you bob uh hundred dollars bob hop i don't even know where do you get this money from bob thank you so much for the insane insane inconsistent insanity in the support and they say michael rand is best rant you know what i'm inclined to agree because michael is a very analytical and data-driven person and so you know the rant's going to be good um dan j thank you for the 5 australian they say launch pro tip i have a podcast on in the background while i wait for launch post box roulette is a good one all right cool yeah i mean you can always listen to our streams as a podcast you know just uh have it playing in the background wink wink nudge nudge um harry young thank you for the five euros another one of those consistent donators thanks harry uh so when was last time you all heeded your advice regarding but not through cameras i'll tell you very recently i watched sn11 with my own eyeballs and did not operate cameras at all i actually i think i think at one point i tilted my cameras up in a vain optimistic futile attempt to in hopes of catching anything but no i just sort of watched the fog and was sad much much like the launch of insight the only thing worse than watching it through your camera lens is watching it through fog so i don't know if i'm stepping up here like concur you can see it through the camera you know but still technically answers the question oh man stupid fog god that explosion would have been so cool okay anyways uh train navy thank you for the 25 they say thanks as always jack uh how's the nas oh man i still don't have a network attached storage i really need one i was so confused i thought they were talking about a naval air station like what does that have to do with anything we're talking about oh it's naval air station jack there's a whole bunch of t-38s there a whole bunch of uh f5s i guess they would be f5s anyways yeah there you go oh my god i need to go shooting jets again it's been too long uh uh let's see also my daughter would be in florida on 42 how do you recommend she watched the crew launch any any of you guys want to chime in on how to best watch crew 2 uh i'm assuming play linda won't be open so max brewer bridge would be my spot as far as a public spot to go to yeah it's probably too early for uh playa linda playa linda will be closed for all crew launches i think at least that's what ben cooper so i keep hearing that too but then it's like we haven't had a launch that's at a good time like because demo two was there for any reasons i think but yeah but the one thing i will say is that uh crew 2 is launching in the morning just before sunrise so as the rocket ascends it's going to fly into daylight and you'll get a really cool effect in the ground so even if you cannot get super close to crew 2 as the rocket gets hired it could be some really cool viewing effects so i would highly recommend trying to see that awesome thank you for the advice there let's see couple more super chats we can get back to viewer questions gary thank you for the twenty dollars very awesome of you gary sasha thank you for the 200 rubles they say they're asking about astronauts being interchangeable which vehicle they ride can crew on dragon train on dragonfly on the skyliner or are they fixed how much additional training needed ah that's a great question so i mean yes technically you can only fly on vehicles that you've been trained to fly on however astronauts get trained to fly on all vehicles so if you're training for an international space station mission you will be trained on dragon starliner and soyuz um although i don't know if they're actually training all astronauts on starliner yet but definitely dragon and soyuz um so you're when you're not assigned to an actual launch rotation yet but you're getting ready to go to the iss you receive training on all of them so it's so to that degree they are actually interchangeable they can fly on several different vehicles the number one thing i would want to do in that training regime is uh the poke stick training day here's how you use the pokes you poke things with it yeah for so i love it so much it's the best thing high technology controlled with a stick um musical wolves thank you for the five dollars asking about mrs tree and miss chief uh getting reused to send people to the c platform i'm not sure what the future of those will be all i know is they've gone home right to sort of the place where they were built it would be a great return to the spacex fleet if they became part of the starship support fleet but i think that is not i think it's too early for to know if that's actually in the planes or not awesome well hopefully we see them back in the rotation at some point sad to see them go and then you know to all this talk of catching a booster with a launch tower just makes me constantly think of hey but catching the fairings with a boat in an ocean didn't seem to work obviously much different problem but maybe catching isn't always the right option even though it's like a nice one at first uh and then two more super chats one from jefta thank you for the lego funding of the shuttle for the oh my god funding for the lego shuttle i can talk uh very awesome of you i don't know we'll have to divvy that up and like you know each of us will get a little a little parcel of it and put it towards a lego kit i don't know um but thank you for that for that and holy cow holy cow holy cow do you guys see this next super chat i do it's four hundred dollars bigger than i can count my fingers not quite a bit more quite a bit it's it's a 400 super chat i need to ask uh this person in our discord is that corporal day walker capital day walker oh yeah oh what's that look at that really quick look at our screens yeah we just had a sudden venting uh in a downward direction from the gse equipment it looks like maybe a hose popped off from the thrust section i wonder if they were hitting at the rams and that happened uh oh does it look like those rams are extended right now sorry sorry i don't think we can tell if the rams are extended or not but because that structure doesn't move uh it could have been they were hitting at the rams and something failed it could also be a test of the quick disconnect umbilicals that's entirely expected it could be a planned vent i don't know there are many options but we have observed a lot of venting from the ass section of the vehicle that much we can say we've had an observation and it was sudden as well i mean it was very much sudden in a downward direction not coming out of the side of starship which we see all the time right those normal vents but this was like suddenly pressure being released in a downwards direction so it does sort of look like it might be coming from a pipe on the superstructure there like um it's sort of jetting downwards at times i'm i don't know a little bit of venting from the methane tank just there but it wasn't sustained yeah i'm hesitant to say that uh anything is wrong with the vehicle at this point but definitely something interesting going on no like an emergency depressed or anything like that no exactly looks like it's coming from the base doesn't it not the out section it's hard to tell yeah it looks like it's coming from the stand itself but yeah yeah i agree with that it looks like it's coming from some piping going up to starship not coming like out of the base itself wow look at that wow that is huge all right that's both depressing now yeah that is increases the odds of that venting at the bottom is not planned yeah that is a big high pressure depressurization event you can see the velocity the force that's coming out of the side of sn15 right there and they usually do that so you can see that how far the whole thing yeah let's see here it's not even in the frame wow look at that that's a big vent it's the biggest vent we've seen i don't know if that's atmospheric conditions or pressure or what but wow yeah and another one wow look at that that's wild never a dull day in boca jerry maybe mary can hear that let's see here real quick we're gonna listen in on the microphone on that uh camera she's got methane vendors or methane tank fan obviously it's not methane but methane tank vent is also still going yep we would expect the frost not to go away at this time because when you drop the pressure inside the tanks it actually makes it colder so the frost will stick around until they're fully depressurized and the nitrogen actually vents out yeah think of when you use a can of of uh of canned air into like clean out your computer keyboard or whatever can gets cold as you uh exhaust the the whatever is in it oh wow yeah and a really quick there that was a big one really quick uh thank you for corporal day walker for the 400 uh 400 bucks on the super chat that is insane amount of money obviously we're going to keep doing what we do and keep upping our game so thank you for that and maybe i won't shave my beard until they land one and not explode maybe that's a maybe that'd be a fun thing to do you know with a super chat like that i kind of feel like i have to do it um but seriously thank you corporal day walker thank you thank you thank you for the membership and for the insane amount of support related to the beard but back to this i am super curious what's going on with sn 15 right now it's curious to me that that cascading of vapor from the stand area has not stopped yeah it definitely looked um yeah the one thing is it is hard to tell whether it's coming from the vehicle or from the ground equipment but either way based on the depressed venting that's coming afterwards and the fact that we haven't seen anything like that on previous cryo tests would suggest that it was not planned um that has no bearing on how major of a problem it is if a problem at all but that's kind of where we're at right now i mean these that venting is so intense i wonder if maybe it's just a really hot day out today or if they're you know if the pressure's being exerted on these on the vehicle or on the tanks is significant at this point so many questions yeah i don't know i mean they seem to be not duty cycling it really but they're turning that vent on and off and on and off yeah they'll be secondly to maintain some certain pressure that they want well i believe this is a relevant time to bring in a question here asking what does a choir press cryotest do is it to check for leaks pretty much and uh it's basically to ensure that all of your systems are uh tight all your tanks that are being tested for the first time don't have any leaks or anything like that and that the structure can maintain the loads of having flight pressures inside them they pressurize the tanks too on these tests where they don't have an engine installed they actually have those hydraulic rams underneath pushing against the bottom of the vehicle with the same force as engine thrust would be so you can tell that the structure supports those loads as well and doing all of that under cryogenic or very very cold conditions so that's where the name comes from and uh it's possible that what we just saw is them finding a potential problem under those conditions or it's possible that something else is going on um yes we haven't really seen this before so we're gonna keep an eye on it and see what exactly just happened here yeah i mean that venting continues to happen down at the bottom but it it doesn't really look like it's coming from starship it does look like it's coming from down lower yeah it looks like it's coming from the from the stand for like i don't want to say for sure because i've said things on this stream and then shortly thereafter things have exploded so yeah but yeah that was methane oh god i would i way preferred north korean dollars over that what you can't just say you would much prefer north korean dollars i mean i prefer i prefer the meme about me saying that but anyways uh beggars can't be choosers it's possible they're just clearing the lines at the end of the test it seems weird to that before they do tank i'm not sure but i haven't haven't seen a lot of the ice start to melt yet though it's still a pretty solid uh bit of ice you know what's really interesting here look at the fact that there's no ice on the thermal tiles yeah i would love to see that's a good point yeah there's no ice well i guess they're not meant to transfer heat very well right or cold yeah exactly i guess they are they're supposed to be insulators that's kind of their purpose god those fence i mean remember starship itself is 50 meters tall the tent is this the stand is somewhere around 10 meters tall so so lay starship on its side in those vents coming out the side that's 50 meters of vent coming out the side those are massive plumes coming out of those valves okay but what's that in american football fields does what's that american football feels about half what's that in ears of corn years of corn 42. how many whales whales asstory [Laughter] i have answers for all questions it really does i mean it's like off and on and off it's almost like they're trying to maintain a pressure here you know i mean there's going to be some pressure that they need to maintain well obviously okay i take that back because it can stand empty on its own um the bottom tank if there's if there's stuff in the upper tank the bottom tank will need to be pressurized to a certain amount to maintain to uh kind of withstand that extra weight right but they're also doing it on the top tank so the frost is still climbing rapidly on the metal tank they're rewinding so i think this might be normal well remember they're also depressing it so the frost will grow from that that doesn't seem like it's not like a constant depress it sort of seems more like pressure maintenance venting or whatever you want to call it like steady state um i'm sort of wondering theory you know here's a theory if they did if they disconnected the quick disconnect um you know maybe they're trying to also verify the pressure integrity of whatever valve right there on the vehicle itself and so they would want to disconnect the quick disconnect and that's where that vapor that we're seeing could potentially be coming from um sort of like you know you don't want to just close a valve and have the quick disconnect still attached maybe that's part of this test is is having that i mean it certainly looks like a normal cryo proof where they fill it up it gets frosty and then they do some venting for a bit while they make sure it can hold pressure just with the added component of a lot of vapor coming from the stand yeah probably in the yeah violet in the probably normal category yeah i'm skeptical but i'm not you you're right it could it could be not unexpected i know i'm watching that side camera a lot i'm going to see what a couple of these vents look like from these angles from the village angle so near where mary is and then where the where the village robots are those plumes come kind of straight at you so it just looks like a big cloud appearing there's one right there um in line it's hard to see how big the plumes are from this angle so that's why i've been spending so much time on those side angles there it go ahead thomas didn't mean to interrupt sorry yeah no i mean so we're going to keep an eye on this but i think in the meantime we can go back to just doing questions and things so i'll try and pull some out um [Music] uh colton asking what are the differences between sn15 and sn8 through 11. so what i know we know of a couple things elon has said that there's something like hundreds of changes that they've implemented to sn15 the ones we know of are a new thrust puck design which is the part at the bottom of the vehicle that all the engines mount to they have changed a little bit about the raptor themselves they've modified raptor's design for improved reliability among other things so that's some changes that will be visible on sn15 you can see they're still adding more and more heat shield tiles which they have been doing through all of these starships um trying to think if there's any others we know of for sure am i missing any of the known changes for sn15 there's there's one elon tweet that i always forget uh hundreds of pages i need to go find it yeah i know that but i'm trying to think if there's any specific ones that we know of there was there was like there's an elon tweet that's something along the lines of like the welds and oh gosh hang on i'm going to go looking for it come with me later okay jack will go research if we had no more specifics than that but those are some of the ones we know of a lot of them will likely be you know very minor things that we would never notice just observing but um basically a bunch of incremental changes based on what they learned from those previous vehicles so um we're going to keep going through some questions here here is a good one do you think that there will be abort mode similar to shuttle like transatlantic or rtls supports so the problem is if the if the abort is triggered because of some like major anomaly with super heavy during a launch for example raptor engines take a couple seconds to spool up they're not the same as an abort motor that can start within milliseconds so starship doesn't really have the ability to abort from a malfunctioning booster that way if it's a more minor issue though and super heavy simply shuts down its engines and performs basically an early stage separation in that scenario i could see starship being able to perform some sort of contingency aboard whether the pro i don't know what sort of launch sites or landing sites could support a starship abort at certain points there should be some return to launch site or rtls capability to basically do a booze back burn and fly back to the launch site but that would only be available through the early persons of flight before it gets too far downrange after that it's possible that the safest thing would be to abort to a low orbit um or like an abort once around kind of deal um that's kind of what i'm thinking of i don't know if there'd be a gap between starships able to do a boost back burn and perform an rtls landing and then you know wasn't far enough downrange that i can't do that is it close enough to orbit that it can do that instead or does there need to be an interim like transit landing report which would be more difficult because then you need landing sites that are able to support that which is more straightforward when you're talking about the space shuttle because you just need something with a runway a starship would need some sort of like landing pad which is not as common i don't know that's a very good question i would be it would be interesting to see how big the gap between an rtls capability and an abort to orbit or a poor once around capability is and if that would be considered like a black zone i guess that would be very interesting to hear about no black zones please please no black drums um that just seems like a no-brainer no black sounds dragon to my knowledge does not have any black zones dragon does not have any black zones starliner doesn't have any black stones orion does not have any black zones yeah that's just the way it should be uh so it would make sense to me if there are like a towel abort for starship and stuff like that it would just be you know if something underperforms a raptor underperforms or if there's an issue that they wanted encountered uh you know a big bird hits the windshield i don't know um you know just it turns into a point-to-point flight instead of an orbital flight and no big deal you just land and everything's fine i mean that's the way it would be if it's airliner like operations right right right the inside but i would be honestly be surprised if there's any point in flight where it can neither return to the launch site or reach orbit because of all the delta v that a starship has start oh okay actually you know what now that i think about this starship can almost with its recovery hardware stuff can almost get to orbit on its own so clearly after just a couple minutes in the flight it can abort the rest of the way to orbit if it needs to early in the flight what that's with the no payload thing so assuming but still payload you couldn't do that well right so my point is with some payload if you're early enough in flight where you still can't reach orbit that means you're still pretty close to the launch site so an rtls would probably be feasible and then once you're far enough in flight then rtls isn't feasible you have to be a fairly large way towards orbit i would imagine that there's actually not a gap between rtls mode and abort to orbit mode for a starship launch really good question either way i feel sad that we don't have chris b on to reminisce about the first shuttle flight and injections and bob and john and uh and just all of this this is a perfect speaking of which did you guys talk about that at all today yet given what today is a little bit but go for it i mean it's just worth mentioning that today is the 40th anniversary of the first ever flight of the space shuttle sts-1 with john young and bud griffin which of course was a test flight like no others putting two crew on a very unproven vehicle which we luckily don't have to do anymore um but that was 40 years ago today which of course started a huge era of first of all the world's first reusable spacecraft and then everything that the shuttle accomplished and taught us about how to make even better reusable spacecraft like the one we're looking at right now so worth mentioning that also the 60th anniversary of the first team in space yuri gagarin on vostok one so it does look like the frost is receding now on the liquid oxygen tank and it is holding on the methane tank so he might have finished the loading and from what i can tell it appears i don't think there was an anomaly at all i think that was i think it's been going to plan based on the frost continuing to rise after they had that venting from the bottom so in my opinion from what i can tell with no inside information or official data i think so far that has gone well and they now might be detanking but again i'm just going off of what i can see yeah i would be inclined to agree with that statement got a super chat here nathan asking is the thrust simulator being applied right now um it's hard we can't tell for sure from our interviews because it's kind of up into the thrust skirt of starship so you can't really get a direct view of it um but generally speaking i it would be interesting to know if they actually move the thrust simulator at all during the test or if it's just constantly applying whatever force they want from beginning to end um but at some point they're going to be applying it during a cryoproof test um we can't confirm whether or not they're doing it at this moment however oh and i found that uh the elon tweet that i thought was about sn15 details was actually about eight and nine or nine and ten uh he said many many small improvements but overall similar wiring is more robust engines are more mature nose cone is sealed better which i wouldn't have expected a nose cone seal to be a thing um or even a thing that was like necessary to improve it's sort of interesting to me i wonder what exactly that means but again that was for nine and ten so i do think the only details that we have about sm-15s changes are uh that there's hundreds of them so presumably even more robust wiring and even more mature engines and perhaps even better sealed nose cone but would love some more color from elon on that on twitter a super chat question here from james asking why would you have transparent aluminum windows when you could just have multiple cameras behind shielding less risky for starship integrity surely that is true it would be less risky for structural integrity windows can cause a problem with that however there is a legitimate argument that windows are more important than just a screen now obviously we talked about a little bit earlier about just our personal preferences as to would much rather experience those things through glass something transparent versus going through a camera lens because then you're viewing something that you also could have been seeing from the surface of earth because you're just recording it anyway um but there is also a very large um psychological impact to being able to look out the window during a spacecraft you have to remember that space travel is a very isolated and confined space that you're in for long periods of time and the ability to kind of look outside and not be trapped in a windowless kind of cabin even if there are screens showing you oh this is what's outside windows have a very important psychological impact in keeping a crew healthy and happy during those long duration missions there are lots of windows on the international space station including the big cupola module by the way really quick looks like oh no those are birds never mind i thought we saw a drone flying to the bed those are birds ignore me um but windows are very important that's why i mean crew dragon has windows starliner has windows they're there not just for the yeah we want to let astronauts look outside it's a legitimate health thing and it helps keep the crew happier and uh help relieve stress and things that are all part of space travel so it's not just about being cool or kind of being our preference there really is solid arguments that it helps mission success and keep your crew healthier yeah i see a lot of people always asking about the trip to mars in terms of questions about the radiation exposure or the questions about um gravity you know simulating gravity so that there's no muscle wasting a lot of questions in terms of effects of the journey on crew but i don't usually see questions about like mental health which i think is going to be a fairly significant issue in terms of of you know deep space flight for the crew you're going to have to keep everybody happy mentally healthy and you know mental health is a big deal so if if a component of that is the expense and complexity of a real window instead of a screen then i mean it just makes plain sense it's no different than having a good air you know a good air filtration system or a uh you know a good toilet for that matter or good food you know you want to keep people mentally healthy just like you want to keep them physically healthy as well it's can't be understated got a question here from oe gaming asking how can spacex text or see me how can spacex test vacuum engines without the extended nozzles breaking so this would apply to both marlin and raptor of course um you can fire vacuum optimized engines at sea level normally that's not a huge safety issue obviously the performance will be very different um and occasionally uh there are sort of structural risks with such the big nozzle that's kind of not supposed to operate in that conditions but that's usually resolved simply by supporting the nozzle a little bit on the test stand and that kind of mitigates that and then what you'll do is you'll take the data from those tests and say okay this is even though this engine is not operating in the conditions it would be we can calculate what its performance should be under the sea level conditions and as long as they match that we know the engine's operating nominally even though it's not giving the same thrust or efficiency that it would in vacuum so between some nozzle supports and factoring that into your data review you can still accurately test a vacuum engine at sea level a question here from jeremy will bn2 fly higher than 150 meters we do we know we'll be into let's start with welbian to fly because we know bn1 has already been scrapped inside of a manufacturing pathfinder versus an actual test article what what do we what do we know about current status of b2 it hasn't even been stacked yet right correct so it's so early i don't know if i want to speculate as to what bn2 will or will not do um i think if they're gonna fly a super heavy booster on its own i'm expecting something on the order of a 150 meter hop test it could be like 200 meters or something but a very low altitude hop test i think once they're ready to go higher it's going to be just part of an orbital launch attempt that's my current that's my personal speculation though yeah i'd be inclined to agree it won't fly to higher than 150 meters uh unless something bad happens that might be also good there's also that will it intentionally fly higher than one yeah yeah there you go that's yeah refine the question a little bit uh douglas sutherland with a super chat thank you so much for your support also vinnie asking do you think they are testing its puffing ability for a 420 launch i'm gonna offer no comment on that but we appreciate your support uh oh here's a good question from marcus is the starship heat shield based on pika x i don't believe so so pika x is a proprietary version of a heat shield nasa designed the original sort of pika design and spacex refined it a bit to make pika x and that's the heat shield used on dragon i believe that is substantially different than the ceramic silica heat shield tiles which are on starship which are actually a little more um similar to those used on the space shuttle different but more similar in that sense than than comparing it to picax or something like that uh here's a question from steven with the superchat will we have to wait till sn20 for the thinner metal or was sm50 built with three millimeter sheets is at what uh thickness is sm15 i don't actually know at the top of my head i think i i don't think that they've taken that down to the smaller size yet yeah i think it's formula four millimeter gotcha all right we've got a trademark speculation question here asking when can we expect a full starship and super heavy system test flight realistically i i'd say we can go around the horn here uh anyone want to jump on this first first full stack test flight uh december of what year uh this year i don't know i don't know that you can come up with anything realistically all we can do is guess because there hasn't even been a booster rolled out to the pad yet you know what i mean like i i don't know i hate to be such a party pooper with that but we haven't even seen one rolled out how can we possibly give a realistic guess now if you just want a completely wild and crazy guess i could give you one of those but a realistic guess without having some of that that data under our belt i don't know you know is that common no i think that's because i think that's completely fair with the very limited knowledge that we do have and what we've seen so far i will put a low confidence but somewhat realistic guess of q4 2021 so similar to jack's answer that would be my speculation michael do you have any differing thoughts um realistically i mean the biggest question i have is the launch licensing and the environmental permits to approve this type of launch activity that was one of the risks that nasa stated in their spacex's request to launch the tropics mission when spacecraft did not win they lost that to astra so i'm not sure from a regular from a regulatory standpoint when spacex is going to get all the approvals but i think maybe a late portion of this year is possible so there we go sounds like three of the four of us are feeling the end of this year um no idea how accurate that is though so we'll see but appreciate the question there uh did you fix with a super chat saying hashtag when shave i believe that's directed at jack says thanks for the coverage you rock appreciate the support there i mean i am astonished at the amount that people care about the beard i swear i've had a beard and stuff before maybe i haven't i'd tend to be clean-shaven but wow people really latched onto the beard and i can't say i'm complaining jack the last time i saw you in person you were clean-shaven so i mean i swear i've done like a weekly update or something with a beard but maybe i just i forget or maybe we just have a bunch of new members between now and then but uh either way it seems like i'm not gonna shave until they land one of these and it doesn't explode thank you again to uh corporal jaywalker there for the super huge super chat i'm gonna keep reading through some questions here uh jake asking do we have an idea of the potential down mass capability of starship so we've talked a lot about up mass the spacex i believe still officially saying a hundred plus tons still not not refined on a more specific number than that um is there any speculation or reason to think that the down mass might be less or if it would be pretty much the same 100 tons ish i mean if you're talking about this launching payloads to the moon or bars those are payloads that starships can have to land with to deliver them so i would imagine that down mass that landing payload capacity is the same as the up mass but but doing a flip and burn with a huge amount of mass at the tip of the vehicle i wonder if that's even possible or what the limits on that might be technically if you put a bunch of mass in the nose cone that moves the center of mass farther from the engines and thus when you gimbal the engines to do the flip and burn you get more torque so it's actually easier it's like it's easier to balance a broom on your fingertip than a pencil or something is it no yeah i mean i i can balance a broom on my fingertip no problem because all the weight is at the end of the broom um lever arm or whatever but a pencil is just a tiny little thing with uniform mass distribution um i don't know if that's real or not i'm not you're the other person that goes to embry riddle but this is just this is me my my roadside rocket science here coming here yeah yeah i think you're onto it and i think yeah so i i think payload up top will actually in theory make the flip and burn easier as long as the you know it can structurally handle whatever loads and stresses that that results in and then so but the concern will then be okay now once you're kind of in the vertical orientation the vehicle simply weighs more so you need a little more thrust and a little more fuel to make the landing happen but that's within fuel margins anyway so um yeah i would imagine the down mass capability just matches the up mass capability is to answer the main question it looks like that frost is continuing to go down so i think it's fair to say that they have likely completed the cryo proof and are now detanking i'm not sure how long it's going to take it usually takes quite a bit of time for a fireproof test but we'll know for sure if testing is over when they reopen the road or reopen the pad if they reopen the pad and they also reopen the road then we know they are done testing the road stays closed that's a sign there could still be more testing i'm not sure if we're going to stay live all the way until that happens but we'll we'll figure out what we're going to do here but it does look like that they have what we can tell completed today's test why not stay live party stream party stream um here's a question kind of on the fun side kyle trick asking star trek star wars or battle star galactic black galactica i'm gonna say neither i'm gonna say cowboy bebop all the way that is my uh vision of the universe it's so real anyways what do you guys think do you want to weigh in on this controversy controversy thomas what do you think oh god don't put me on the spot um i've never seen any of battlestar galactica but i've seen a fair amount of the other two so i'll just lean towards the other two and let the internet hate me for it oh man i don't know if we could be friends anymore do you watch shows like ever i just said i watched star trek in star wars were you not listening a lot of people are in chat or saying stargate which you know i have watched stargate it's a good one a lot of people saying the expanse or firefly everyone has their favorite sci-fi property which is good we don't have to be tribalist about it but uh like what you like i like cowboy bebop oh also red dwarf someone just said red dwarf very much agree on the red dwarf it's just i i like to ten i tend to like the more real ones you know where things are kind of cruddy and uh not necessarily altruistic and nice and neat and and or just completely fantastical i kind of you know i like the space and sci-fi where it's like hey if we're going to go somewhere we're limited by the speed of light and it's going to take a while or stuff like that i don't know that's that's my personal preference i don't know das what do you think michael what do you think or do you want to just punt that one and we'll move on if i had to choose from those three i would choose battlestar galactica but the remake battlestar galactica like i don't know there's there's something about the the flight scenes and the space combat scenes and that to just feel really visceral and flying around and seeing raptors flip around and and that sort of stuff as they're you know what i mean like vipers and raptors and the way they maneuver and the way they land and sort of crash down on the mag and skid in like in terms of space combat i don't think that anything really beats battlestar galactica there i don't know just in terms of the way that those spaceships fly and they don't fly like planes they fly like i would expect a spaceship to fly um like star trek and star wars a little bit more drama i mean star wars is like a you know movie sort of spectacle thing and then star trek is the long series with all the different little things that happen and my problem with star trek is nothing ever works on that silly spaceship good grief after like 90 of the problems on the enterprise are because something doesn't work all the time it just doesn't work like if the enterprise would just work they wouldn't have a show so anyways you all can come after me for that one but if i had to choose from those three i'm a big fan of battlestar galactica plus we're looking at starships i mean we've got the adama maneuver we got battlestar galactica um i'm just saying you know yeah it just works i will say you can have fun if you're star trek star wars battlestar galactica i will have fun with my starship your starship like this one which one yeah i mean reality is much more exciting than science fiction yeah you're not wrong this is absolutely wild and incredibly sci-fi to see and witness this stuff happen so that's a that's a valid answer if you ask me we got asked a b or c i said like r and michael said q [Laughter] let's see what else we got here i can't get behind the expanse i'm sorry i can't i can't get behind the expanse i've never watched it why explain briefly you're not missing much everybody's like oh it's so realistic and all i can do when i watch the expanse is just look at everything and how not realistic it is like every time you come in for an approach you're spewing your exhaust drive like you're driving exhaust all over the space station at close range good job wow okay das is making some enemies here i can't get behind it i can't get behind the expanse i'm sorry no everyone has their has their cup of tea you express yourself have strong opinions i i'm completely on board with that uh really quick a couple super chats came in jonas thank you for the 2.99 they're asking if it was successful we think so but we don't know tech brigade thank you for the five dollars they say i am older than google nice that's interesting um thank you for the five dollars yeah uh douglas oh god am i older than google oh god yeah douglas google's not that old for the record i am not older than google wow okay i don't want to do this anymore abort douglas sutherland thank you for the 199. james tyrell thank you for the five dollar five euros and say thanks for the response it's a good reason i'm not sure if it'll be the same between planets and being able to see the earth but i get it oh there must have been about the windows thing um armin thank you for the icelandic kroner i'm guessing talking about beards are godly i mean wow the beard is a serious earner at this point uh steven benson thank you for the five dollars canadian kevin martin thank you for the 10 euros saying well what weight will starship be when it lands on mars given the gravity difference there that's like that's a question for they did the math so somebody do the math and i will parrot that out as if i know that it's accurate on stream um blazon 469 nice name thanks for the five dollars asking about orange truck is there an orange truck somewhere no idea there's a there's an orange lift down in the lower right hand corner but that's that's usually parked in that area uh okay yeah uh when shave is when it lands and doesn't explode i guess we're going to make this a thing okay bold bet because you know if sn15 is not land for whatever reason there's no s and 16 even being stacked right now yeah well i'll just have to deal maybe i'll braid it um it wasn't a bet it was that uh corporal daywalker donated a 400 super chat and said they think i should shave when they first land a starship and don't blow it up so i have i have soft committed to that like live on the camera though it might be a while i see what you're saying yeah yeah das it would have to be a members only stream or maybe i would do it on my own youtube channel or something a starship shave starship shave stream as soon as it as soon as it lands you step around in front of your own camera and you start shaving right there in the video what if and explodes like eight minutes later then you gotta stop shaving like halfway glue the hair back to my face now wherever you are you just stop that would be hilarious that would be really really funny uh the heaven man 88 thank you for the 4.99 uh some differences of opinion about the expanse lionel l thank you for the five dollars talking about the expanse being uh the most realistic science fiction show as far as the science faux rage it's not even i'm so often you stay you stay neutral and every now and then i get you or we get you to uh to express an opinion and i'm loving it um shadow viper say jack not today thank you for the five dollars canadian they say what do you think sn11 uh while it was foggy visual data not important as a program diagnostics yeah i think it's just a matter of if they didn't see it they launched rockets in the fog all the time it's unfortunate for us viewers but they wanted to get that thing sent and you know i think they need a pretty specific weather in terms of recovery i believe tank zillow at that time was at the build site ready to be rolled to the launch site and if the weather later in the day had deteriorated significantly then they wouldn't have been able to fly you know maybe they needed to fly early so they could have good enough weather to get tangzilla to the lawn site and get it partially recovered before the weather rolled in and maybe that entailed flying as early as possible and flying in the fog unfortunately will cooper thanks for the 25 dollars they say are there 28 raptors the minimum number of engines to push a starship to orbit no uh we think maybe around 20 based on an elon tweet and last up also thank you will cooper for the 25 bucks huge amount of money um last up mad scientist thanks for the five bucks asking how much damage our cameras took just lost a solar panel no big deal and let's see a recommendation for watching all mankind which for all mankind looks good i do like the whole alternate history kind of thing so definitely going to have to check that out at some point when i've got some spare time all right super chats that's enough for now thank you everybody i mean i don't even know how long i was just doing that for it felt like an eternity so thank you for the support that uh you know enables us to continue to do stuff like this thomas you want to run some questions i was going to say i'd be happily take over and do some question q now that you've cleared out our super chats uh let's see what we've got here um oh here is a question i saw this earlier and then didn't answer right away because i had no idea how to answer but now i think i re-understood the question asking do you think elon will use the proven door hardware from the shuttle on starship at first i thought we were talking about like enter and hatches and i was like is that something specific to shuttle but now i think they might be talking about the payload bay door which makes a lot more sense um however i think the answer is still no because if i'm just based on the renders of the starship variant which will have like a payload bay door to deploy satellites and things like that it doesn't look that similar to the one on the shuttle instead the shuttle one is kind of split in two it opens up sideways the spacex runners have all had just kind of like one hinge that opens it up in one dimension and so just based on that i'm going to guess that the door will look pretty different not that the science of making a hinge is super complex um i don't think there's anything to be too concerned about um if anything it might just be a scaled up version of the dragon nose cone by a lot but uh yeah so i don't think the payload bay is going to look too similar to the shuttle hoping that that was what you were asking about there sam um a question here asking about a road closure that's happening tomorrow if they still don't have any of the raptor engines installed what are your thoughts on what they might do tomorrow if i had to guess that was just a backup window if they didn't get to testing today or if testing today reveals an issue and they have to re-test but i think if a cryogenic proof test is successful a good sign of that will be that tomorrow's work pusher will be closed because they'll have to install engines and things like that and that doesn't require the road being closed so um that would be um my my my guess is that the road glitch mar will actually be closed if today's test was successful and then they'll reschedule closures when they're ready for static fire testing um a bow asking i follow or saying i follow starship pretty closely but can i get a rundown of a cryo test so a cryogenic proof test which is the full name for a cryotest is proving that the tanks and other structures on starship can handle all of the lows that they need to at cryogenic or very very cold temperatures um we're talking about the temperatures where you know in this case nitrogen is liquid but also the same temperatures that liquid methane and liquid oxygen would be at for actual propellants when they're loading for fuel um so they pump in liquid nitrogen they use nitrogen because it is inert so if there is a leak or something like that there's not a risk of you know actual actual ignition or explosion it would just be cold nitrogen flowing everywhere so they use nitrogen but they chill it down to the same temperatures as the propellants would be the methane and oxygen and they pump them into the propellant tanks those tanks are also up thomas real quick that's a big double d press it looks like sorry yeah no thank you for interrupting me that is definitely that could be that final depress event yeah it could be i saw that i couldn't see most of starship anymore from the other angle so that is the long high pressure double uh depress it looks like sorry to interrupt yeah and this time we're not seeing at least yet be a bit quite as sporadic as when we saw the venting earlier so the longer the venting goes on for it the more it looks like a depressed vent yeah you can also see watch for it to start to lose pressure so it'll get a little bit less energetic as events like that but that is definitely something we see when they're done with tests a lot of the time so as i was mentioning these tanks are pressurized during this test and what we're seeing now is actually the release of that pressure because we believe the testing is done um but so they test the tanks at the pressures and temperatures that they would expect during an actual launch um in this particular scenario since there are no engines installed on the vehicle yet they are using something called a hydraulic ram or a thrust simulator or there's a couple different names for it to push up on the bottom of the vehicle and basically take the place of what the force of thrust from the engines would be so they can also test that the vehicle withstands those loads from the bottom of the vehicle so those are the kind of things that they are testing during a cryogenic test as you see they are actually depressing and venting out the nitrogen now obviously nitrogen makes up the bulk of earth's atmosphere so no problem just venting that into the surrounding atmosphere no safety risks or environmental risk or anything like that and they're emptying out those tanks and you'll see the frost that is formed on the outside due to the cold temperature start to subside once all of that nitrogen has been vented out and the pressure starts to equalize so there is your cryo test rundown i hope i answered your question there but we've also got a queue of super chats here that i'll run through really quick uh made 582 saying santa jack another beard reference appreciate the support there um blazen says dune and hashtag when shave uh pimplex says spaceballs are galaxy quest here's another one i've only seen spaceballs i haven't seen galaxy quest what's galaxy quest what you haven't seen how have you seen galaxy crystal my gosh i feel like thomas was graves like on a farm or something where they didn't have electricity and then sent off to aerospace engineering school but without seeing any shows ever like yeah galaxy quest is an absolute classic i mean it has alan rickman alan rickman is a freaking treasure i'm so sad and he's uh you know shuffled the mortar coil mortal coil or whatever but um you know you got to watch galaxy quests and i'm not going to even spoil anything but it's extending my list of things i need to watch here yeah we'll make a list for you uh something something brilliant sphere [Laughter] it's like like they build the big starship in the space dock and they're already ready to launch okay and then they're like take her out and when they start to go forward they start to scrape the side of the space dock and it's like it's just it's like a five minute scene where the guy driving the ship is just scraping the side of the space dock on the maiden voyage it's that sort of deal so good uh brian banks with a superchat saying y'all are all awesome glad to see jack got to leave boca for a second i still think nose cone test modification is a prerequisite to a launch or landing abort system that is a good point um yeah if there's if there's some sort of like ker dragon esca board system that's going to need some heavy modifications and likely its own propulsion system which is why it seems unlikely that they'll go that route um and we kind of we're talking about uh how today is the 40th anniversary of sts-1 first flight of the space shuttle that is a vehicle that was very very successful um even though it did not have an integrated abort system um and the one in during launch uh failure that this uh that the space shuttle had would not have was not a design flaw that was an operational flaw and so it is there is proof out there that you can make a reliable and crew rated vehicle that doesn't have an abort system just gonna wrap that up there but uh thank you for the super chat there brian we appreciate it roberto asking when landing can it perf cam so can it perform the flip maneuver uh sooner in order to avoid sloshing during relight i don't believe the time of the flip would affect the sloshing issue because it's still going to happen regardless of what altitude you're doing it and if you did the flip sooner or sooner so that you could do it more slowly um maybe but i i don't know how i don't think that would have too significant of an effect on the sloshing issue i think there are other ways they're going to have to go about solving that i mean they light the engines to help with the flip so it doesn't really matter it's not it's not like oh the fuel sloshing so if you just do it higher i mean i've seen some people talk about they'll have more time to slow down or get to the right orientation or whatever because they do swing that tail really close to the ground but uh i don't think because the engines are used to perform thrust factor or to provide thrust vectoring for the flip i don't think that that's going to help specifically with the sloshing you know right exactly uh jonathan silva with the super chats asking about could they use carbon fiber for barrel sections of lunar starship i don't believe there would be any reason to do a different material on the different variants of starch but i think they're all going to be stainless steel for commonality reasons and this becomes a lot more complex to have carbon fiber tooling and things like that i have spacex investigated when they were first planning on making the interplanetary transport system and then bfr and now starship those designs did start with a carbon fiber assembly and they moved away from it because they determined the car uh stainless steel was actually better so i don't think they're going to be going back to carbon fiber anytime soon geraldine with the superchat thank you so much for your support also taking christian thank you so much as well for your support we appreciate it kyle trick asking did we get an update on the sizes of the fins are they smaller i'm assuming they're talking about sn15 specifically i don't think we have any reason to believe the fins are smaller on sn15 correct i think that was just like a chat optical illusion like where chat says something and then it doesn't actually work out that way i don't think that we did we get any information on that michael like i have not seen any information the sizes are different yeah to me it looks the same did we count the rings or anything like that i didn't i don't know somebody else did i don't know somebody hey somebody in discord can tell us we don't have to wait for that yeah yeah no i'll keep going with your questions we'll get back to if we have more info on that but i believe the answer is no um pylon mountain with a super chat thank you so much for your support appreciate it uh roof writers show a regular on our streams uh asking to change the subject briefly uh philip one of the writers for now space flight is reporting an artemis one date of no earlier than november 4th any more details you can share there we did publish a story giving an update on artemis 1 status and that includes a very optimistic kind of work to date for the launch of rms1 being november 4th of this year but that is an optimistic date that relies on kind of everything up until then going perfectly um the more realistic time frame as also described in that article is sort of the first quarter of 2022 or early 2022 um we'll know a lot more once the core stage gets shipped off to kennedy space center so that's i think that all the details that we have right now and then a question here asking do we think that the faa would approve starship flights with humans on board without an emergency escape system uh yes because the space shuttle flew humans without an emergency escape system so yes sorry thomas but i mean virgin galactic does not really have an escape system and the fa is also true that's true it doesn't have the ability to glide down after a shutdown yes from like an explosion yeah because there's a long number oh god if you remember their most recent uh test flight the one that we streamed from new mexico which was awesome uh they had an abort at engine ignition and were able to glide down to the runway although i'm not i'm pretty sure they can shut down their engine mid flight or mid burn um since it's a it's a hybrid rocket engine if i'm not mistaken so it's not like a solid where once you light it it's just lit but uh yeah they do have abort modes but not really like an abort capsule or launches if the vehicle you're riding on has a problem you may be in trouble it's not like you can just get it's not like you can just like escape from the actual vehicle itself the actual spacecraft itself has to work to some degree yeah that makes sense uh just to finish the superchat from rich really quick who says babylon 5 had the best most realistic ships and epic storylines so there's another entrance into our sci-fi conversation from earlier no one no one has mentioned starship troopers yet which also is amazing but as a movie i don't know if i want to keep it just to tv shows but anyways i digress anyways uh thank you for coming to my television show webinar um or is ezra with a question asking is sn15 still using helium we're talking about tank pressurization uh do we have any updates on how they're pressurizing their tanks for flight i don't think so elon said it was a mistake to use helium after the sn10 anomaly so that kind of implied they were going to go back to the autogenous pressurization but i'm not sure if that's actually happened yet or what the work around going to work to now is because autogenous pressurization issues were what caused the problems with s and age and then the fix was to move the helium and then helium caused a problem with sm10 so i'm not sure what the final design they're going to settle on is going to be uh carol with a question asking where are starship flaps made we do see them get trucked into boca chica so they're not built on site i don't think do we know if they're built in hawthorne or mcgregor maybe pretty sure hawthorne i'm almost positive hawthorne but i don't know that very you know no one's told me hey these are builder hawthorne but from what i know hawthorne there is our unconfirmed but probable answer hawthorne california which is spacex headquarters same place that the raptors are built we know they're their built in hawthorne takeshi with a question how would a bn static fire look several at a time or altogether i think they might be talking about like staggered engine starts as i think the angle of the question um as opposed to multiple boosters at a time i think they're talking about a single booster um i believe it would make a lot of sense to at least slightly stagger the engine starts even if it's by a couple milliseconds um that's kind of general practice they even do that i don't know if they do it on falcon i know they did it on falcon heavy um i don't know if engine starts staggering on falcon 9 at all um but it is a falcon heavy it's staggered with staggered on shuttle it will be staggered on sls um and that's just kind of a way to make sure the vibrations don't amplify one another and cause any damage right at engine ignition uh would not be surprised if they employ something similar for super heavy i mean they already staggered the engine starts with starships oh that's true you can tell so yeah so if even if they're staggering them for only three raptors on a starship then yeah almost certainly they'll stagger them super heavy as well that's a very good point michael but i think the question might always be asking like will they even do a 28 engine static fire all at once i'm not sure if the pad will like that or not given there's no flame trench well i mean it has to survive it for the period of liftoff which isn't that dissimilar to the period of a static fire so i would imagine it will be able to handle it at least i would hope so i'm not sure how often it's going to be able to handle it we'll see right sure thomas i was just going to point out um it looks like we've got some of that early evening fog starting to come in uh the top of the crane is actually barely visible now oh yeah yeah so we've seen uh the last couple of streams when we get into the evening hours here we see sort of this i don't know if it's a temperature inversion thing or what it is but we'll get some either really low hanging clouds or fog i'm not a meteorologist or anything like that and it looks like that crane is you can actually see things blowing in front of the top of the crane like the cloud or the fog sort of moving by so continuing to watch the ice melt here though yes uh carson reed asking will sn20 have vacuum raptors oh on this camera i cannot even tell which camera you're on i'm sorry i'm sorry yeah i'm on this camera it looks so similar i wasn't even i was not even i thought you were on the other camera but that's what it looks like from zoomed out [Laughter] one uh one of them was framed a little bit more to one side and the other one was framed sort of middle to show the gse1 tank back there was the only difference between them but nobody do you need this camera for something no i was going to see if you could see what the fog looked like from here but it looks like it's kind of blended in with the background but yeah there you go it really is there you go can't quite see it from here yet and then from the beach we can still see starship it's just getting a little a little hazy we got a little bit of something in the way so um about to answer this question about sn20 heavy vacuum raptors i would be very surprised if it doesn't simply because that is supposed to be the first orbital starship and so it would be a little weird for them to try to make orbit with before having the vacuum raptors ready and try to make it with just sea level engines seeing is that not that's not how they would do it operationally can't rule it out i suppose but i would be surprised if they uh did not have vacuum rafters for that first orbital attempt and a question here asking about what is in store for essence 7.2 talking about that test tank which they've now rolled back to the production site i believe that's i think the speculation or the consensus currently is that they're done with essence 7.2 it accomplished its goals and we'll expect to see maybe another testing essence 7.3 or something at some point um but i think sn7.2 is done seeing as they have not rolled it back out to test it more recently and it's been a while so i believe sn7.2 is done ragfire twitch chat said uh tonight's forecast is three clearly i'm not a meteorologist i think it's a joke i love it i laughed sorry that's that's a solid joke uh chris berzon with a super chat thank you so much for your support i appreciate it random asking thank you so much do we know if the header tanks have internal baffles to control slosh and if not why not do the header tanks have internal baffles i think yes yes i think so yeah i believe they do um and then a question do they cryotest beyond nominal pressures or temperatures to ensure it will be fine on hot day um i would imagine that there's a little bit of margin they don't go to the exact flight pressures or temperatures they might go slightly more extreme generally speaking how you test these kind of things not by so much that you endanger breaking things but they'll go to whatever the maximum margin they need to be confident that their flight levels are safe so which will be a little bit beyond your flight levels so probably your yours probably yes uh jeremy with the superchat question why is it that nasa wants to launch artemis one within 2021 is this something about contracts i don't think so i believe that is just kind of a you know obviously the artemis program has been subject to a lot of delays and they're trying to mitigate that as much as possible so it's admittedly arbitrary um but trying to keep to some sort of time frame even if it is a little arbitrary just to kind of keep the pressure on the teams to make sure that um not an unhealthy amount of pressure where safety is a concern but so that you're not sitting around and waiting for things to happen that you're actively making progress all along the way is helpful um so i think there's just sort of a date that they're trying to meet to keep the cadence where they wanted and try and speed things up a little bit and prevent unnecessary delays which is not dissimilar to how spacex operates for the record and uh mike d asking why they didn't make a flame transfer the starship booster one that destroyed the payment and possibly the booster itself i wish i knew the answer to that question but i don't i don't know why they didn't put a flame diverter on the orbital launch site so and maybe they will in the future but i'm afraid that i don't know the explanation for that uh geoff asking will the header tanks be the only fuel on starship on the way to mars assuming that the main tanks don't burn all the way down to ablation there will be some residual fuel there i don't know if they'll be useful for anything but unlikely that the header tanks will be the only ones filled during a mars mission even if those header tanks are the fuel for landing and you don't plan to use the other amounts of fuel yeah i don't i don't know that the header tanks alone would be enough to do the entire mars landing um also that yeah i don't know i mean because you gotta you get there are they going for direct like they're just going straight down to the surface they're not going to orbit first or anything have they even said anything like that like are they just plowing straight into mars america style i do not believe there would be i do not believe there would be an orbital insertion first i think it would be blazing straight into the atmosphere at interplanetary transfer philosophy yes gotcha so so maybe you don't need as much um you know something look at that those thermal tiles do they have frost on them now or am i crazy no so that top corner was missing tiles right there weren't tiles there yeah there's their tiles there that's the mounting point it's the mounting point but they did not put tiles there ah so you sort of see the outline of it but it must be that the mounting points are warming it up faster or something because it looks like it's or you're just seeing the like pin they're like because there's like pins sticking out and stuff so you might just be seeing that yeah huh sorry i just noticed that i thought i'd yeah no make a note good observation but uh i don't believe yeah you can see the where it's still black and though you still see the heat shift house clearly there's no frost there yeah very interesting geraldine with a new membership thank you so much for joining on appreciate the support hope you enjoy all of your membership benefits uh a question from joe asking has anyone tried to calculate max q for an orbital starship the shuttle was under 5 psi i don't know if i've seen those kinds of numbers i would imagine it is not dissimilar to something like shuttle or actually if i had to speculate i would say shuttle might be a little higher q just because solid rocket powered vehicles or vehicles that include solid boosters tend to have a little bit higher max-q but obviously the liquid engines that they're along there along with can throttle down to mitigate that so that's not always the case um quantum spin asking what was the farthest the shuttle traveled from earth i'm going to start googling that answer i mean i know that the the hubble servicing missions were some higher altitude orbits but i don't know if that was the the highest ones you know i'm checking let's see uh yeah it does look like it would have been sts-82 hold on i'm confirming which was one of the hubble servicing missions hubble orbits a little higher than the international space station or other low earth orbits that the shuttle is normally serviced so well i'm glad you're answering this question i i put it in the queue because i was curious myself yeah so yeah here we go on full disclosure i'm reading off of wikipedia but it says uh ssa2 was nasa's second mission to service the hubble during which discoveries crew repaired and upgraded the telescope scientific instruments and also achieved the highest altitude ever attained by an sds orbiter 620 kilometers so that's altitude i know the question said radius so add the radius of the earth but um 620 kilometers altitude uh is the record for a shuttle mission for a hubble servicing mission sts-82 space shuttle discovery it's a pretty spicy altitude wow that's almost double not really double but but not quite double the normal altitude like when you're going to the iss or whatever right yeah iss is what 400 something ish yeah 380 3 9 400 like depending on when they've raised the orbit level right so at least 50 percent higher than the normal altitude of the iss i guess huh and look at that the bottom tank has completely lost all its frost now yeah and you can see it's starting to go away from the top tank too it's a little bit left but and the road closure ends at 8 pm so most likely they are done for today here is a question i wish we had i wish we had some more shuttle experts on the stream because i know they would have the answers to these if sls was to pad abort what's the turnaround time so i do not know if the top of my head what the standard turnaround time for an rs25 um pad a port is i think it's on the order of less than a week but like a couple days but i could be mistaken usually the determinate the terminating factor in that is you have to replace the rope fees that burn off the hydrogen at the pad that's true that's at least for delta for heavy that is the critical path and that happens yeah and we're not going to talk or think about delta iv heavy aborts for the upcoming first attempt right off the pad i don't know if they i don't think they've published a window for that it's just classified whoa afternoon right yes oh no way it's a day launch it's a day launch oh 12 39 local time until three something i forget the exact time but oh my god that makes me so happy delta heavy day launch vandenberg baby slick six all right the hype train is sailing 357. it's the engine window not too shabby no nice window in case you have issues they can work them out and not scrub or abort let's see here we got a chat here from flynn matthews saying thank you for everything that you have done and as a spaceflight i'm only 12 years old and found interest in spaceflight at age 10 thank you very much for what you have done flynn thank you for the kion words and for tuning in we're glad that our coverage has at least helped you get some interest in space flight and uh we hope that uh the cool stuff that we like to share with everybody here uh can keep keep reminding you why space flight's cool and why you should be interested not just to you but to everyone else who's watching too that's why we're here to kind of spread all the cool things that is happening in spaceflight and why people should care about this stuff so flynn thanks for tuning in we appreciate it yeah i can't i mean it would be so cool to be 12 right now and have all of this awesome stuff in front of you i mean i am i remember being 12 and being frustrated a lot like man i wish i could uh you know do x or y or i don't feel like a kid i feel like a normal adult human like you know any other human just let me do you know treat me like an adult and uh but with that frustration for those of you who are young right and out there and listening i mean hopefully as mitigated by if you have it is mitigated by uh just knowing the future is going to have a lot of stuff thanks in no small part to starship and systems like it and we're at the new the dawn of the new era in space flight and you are in prime position to experience so much so congrats also uh dr pork with a 20 super chat thank you so much saying hey this is kyle from california what's up kyle love you guys streams keep up the great work and can't wait to see a successful starship landing us too and appreciate the support there kyle thanks for tuning in and sending the love our way appreciate it yeah it's kind of surreal a lot of people no oh oh rest in peace jack jack dxe has crashed well get jack back in a second hopefully you may need to reconnect uh yeah quick status update the ice continues to go down what we're expecting what we're seeing right now everyone if you're just joining us is what we believe the final depressurization after cryogenic testing will know for sure um if and when the pad reopens but it does appear that they have gone through a in a cryogenic test cycle and are ready to conclude testing for the day here before too long but we will we will see in the meantime we are continuing to ask or ask questions i guess we could also ask questions we're mostly answering questions but that would be a fun thing what if we do an entire stream where instead of us answering questions from chat we ask questions and chat answers we ask questions nice hashtag engagement hashtag engagement well okay we won't we won't do any of the things it's late enough in the stream there are engagement tricks that we have but we'll save those for another time uh blazing with another super chat and another hashtag winshave appreciate the support there hopefully when jack gets back he will yeah hey sorry about that there you go my internet went went cruddy for a second there i apologize if i went all robotic or cut out in the middle of a thought or something i have no idea where it happened you were just like the secret to the life universe and everything is and then just yeah i just stopped oh yeah classic me classic me um and then uh jack laurel i believe is with the super chat saying with the starlink antenna spotted on sn15 future in-flight entertainment confirmed better than netflix via the deep space network uh yeah i don't know that could be a thing um yeah it's kind of hard to see i don't know exactly how they would use starlink on a starship vehicle it might even just be for these low altitude tests or relatively low out to do tests to do weird starlink testing and not a sign of what they'll actually put starlink on starships in the future but maybe they will i'm not sure um all i'm saying is that they will need in-flight entertainment if we're going basically if i'm booking a six-month trip to mars i'm gonna want in flight entertainment so i agree with you appreciate the support there jack i think it's called a thumb drive in that case maybe that's true that's a lot easier is just to put everything pre-installed and not have to stream anything but just let's go watch msf streams when i'm on starship we'll pre-record them for you is that how that works can i watch my own launch stream live yeah well well in advance of when it actually happens let's see here uh jack asking have any vacuum raptors been spotted in boca chica i do not believe so in fact only recently we saw pictures from gary blair showing the second ever vacuum raptor in mcgregor so since they've literally only gotten two to mcgregor i highly doubt any have made their way to pukachika just yet and then a question about estimating when the launch table might be installed so we're talking about over at the orbital launch site i will open this up to someone else because i don't know the answer any like at all oh i we haven't even seen it rolled out yet right yeah right it's hard to say yeah super hard i mean you could just say a date and it would be plausible oh oh hey this just in mary reporting uh the road is open let's see we need to start doing sound drops man i'm telling you we could do the horse winning horse winning whip crack whip crack we could do all sorts of stuff trying to see if we've got one a little wider angle there but report from mary that the road is opened and seeing if we don't see vehicles moving on one of the cameras there you go thank you michael and there are vehicles approaching the pad folks so that means that the road has been opened and looking there goes a disco party too um that usually indicates that they are done with testing now is it the road open is it the pad open i mean clearly there are vehicles driving out there is it public open to the public yet when the ice is still melting um mary said that the road is open and that is usually what we wait for the end of the stream so that likely means that they're not only ready to return to the pad but they're also done testing for the day so not they didn't just open the pad but they also just opened the road yeah nobody at the checkpoint so yeah that would be a conclusion of testing uh again we did see that weird sort of vapor thing that we hadn't seen before but we're no really strong evidence one way or another whether that was bad or not yeah it didn't look like a pretty complete cryo test so yeah it didn't it's not like they immediately long duration vented after that happened you know yeah so they continue to do that maintenance vending for a while so it looks like that may have just been a relief for or testing the disconnects or something like that right so um hopefully that means that today's test was successful again one sign of that will possibly be if they cancel tomorrow's road closures that would be a sign that they don't need those backup windows and they're going to take the next attempt or the next days to start installing engines and things like that but we'll keep an eye out but it appears that a successful day of testing has been completed in pokechiga as sn15 begins its campaign and gets closer to an eventual flight test yeah the next thing i think the next major tell would either be like an elon tweet saying the proof was successful or um uh them starting to dismantle the supports and the thrust ram because they can just pull that thrust ram out from underneath it and uh start putting raptors on this thing and progress towards a static fire which would be next and of course after that a flight so hopefully today's test like you said was good and they start removing that thrust ram and of course mary will have eyes on it like she always does and so if that happens we'll know and i guarantee you if they get into the next testing that static fire test we will be here ready to cover it for y'all that's sort of what we do live coverage commentary explanations for everybody to be able to experience these events as they happen and then in the meantime as work continues all across boca chica you'll get the daily videos the recorded daily videos here on the nasa space flight channel if you haven't yet make sure you subscribe follow whatever the kids are calling it these days uh so you can see what's happening at bogachika on a daily basis every single day mary boca chicago is out there capturing what's going on the booster moving around tanks getting flipped whatever is happening uh new stuff being installed out at the orbital launch site she's there every day and we have a daily video showing what's going on so live streams will be right here daily videos the pre-recorded videos will be right here as well and if you want to keep up with other coverage make sure you follow on twitter too at nasa space flight is the primary account if there's something happening over on fleetcam if there's a new article that comes out across the board if there's something happening in space flight we're probably covering it and you can get all that from that nasa space flight twitter account at nasa space flight somebody put a link into chat if you could for that so are we wrapping it up we ready to go around the horn here folks and uh say our goodbyes all righty well folks on the stream today of course we will start out here out there at boca chica we had boku chicago mary rolling out her livestream rig there we go her live stream rig so that we could see what was going on for her perspective over there make sure you give her a follow on twitter as well at boca chicago she is the original starship documentary out there who's been basically as long as they've been putting pieces of stainless steel intense mary's been out there taking photos and videos since before it was even just piles of dirt even yeah she lived there before spacex even came out that way didn't she yeah remember river when it was just soil surcharging for like two or three years we should have a texas uh dirt watchers shirt or something for like the og og people only mary can wear it but that's her information in the upper right hand corner there as always thank you so much to mary for all the daily content all the videos that come through and the live streams she is out there and like i said they can't slap a label on a piece of stainless steel without mary getting footage of it to share with everybody so massive thanks to her for rolling out today and then back here doing remote commentary we had thomas berghardt for a good amount of time there thomas thank you so much for hanging out with us and literally holding down the live q a there for quite a while we appreciate you absolutely always a pleasure thanks for having me on as as always absolutely so y'all you can follow thomas over on twitter at tg mets fan 98 one of the mods can get that link into chat too if you can um also back in the studio jack buyer jack how you doing no complaints hopefully a successful test today thanks everybody for all the support especially uh corporal day walker thanks again for that insane super chat and yeah we'll see what's up next for sn 15 um progressing towards its flight test you heading out there like they're gonna do a static fire you're gonna hop in the lantern over and just get out of dodge or what oh man so there's like there's multiple things this month uh yeah that i really want to shoot i think blue origin or there's a there's a tfr for van uh for van horn yeah on wednesday yep and then there's uh there's the others nro 82 from vandenberg the delta heavy we were talking about earlier that's on the 26th so it did my schedule is getting packed and of course i don't want to miss sn15 and there's also something else which you can't talk about yet but there's things coming there's lots of cool things so it we'll see i mean i'm maybe on this one the land rover will have to stay home and i'll take a flight out there because i've started to get my vaccination shots and you know that would be that would be a nice quick way to pop out shoot sm-15 and not miss any of these other events that we want to cover um coming up here in april but busy month in space flight we'll just have to wait and see how that puzzle comes together it's like a rubik's cube of cool stuff and you don't want to mess up any of the sides i don't know you get it what a problem to have too many things to cover and you got to start choosing geez yeah it's i mean seriously what a problem good stuff a little bit earlier not on the stream anymore but we also had ian atkinson uh he was on he had to take off but he was doing a bunch of the q a there earlier in the stream so thanks to ian for stopping through and then we also had michael baylor still here we still have michael baylor uh michael thanks for making sure all the lights continue to blink in the proper order in the background and moving the cameras to look at fog when i was on that camera they look so similar i'm sorry but [Laughter] yeah good to see what i assume was a successful cryogenic proof test today hopefully that means the flight of snf-15 as much as jack wants it to be delayed i hope the flight of sm-15 is as soon as possible because i cannot wait to see stars should fly again nice yeah you can follow uh michael on twitter there at next spaceflight and uh i miss jack as well jack was the jack buyer there if mods could put both of those links into chat we'd appreciate it and lastly here from the nasa space flight live stream control my name is john galloway talking and running robots and hanging out here in the background now it's time to start pulling some of this footage so we can put together the cryo proof test summary video which you should look for either late tonight or tomorrow morning condensing the entire event down to like a 12 minute video for people who don't have time to sit through a three hour and 19 minute live stream we will be working on that as well here on the same channel but make sure you follow us here at nasa space flight on twitter and uh that is the best way to make sure you know what's going on because when videos are released you'll get a tweet or you'll get a notification if that's working for you etc etc uh that is going to wrap up our live stream coverage of the proof testing here today thanks to everybody for all the support however you're a part of the community whether you're coming and you're just asking great questions you're talking in chat of course people that are doing memberships and super chats and the people that are the recurring members every month people that buy stuff from the merch store we've got all sorts of different win hop merchandise at shop.nasaspaceflight.com or just people who show up for a little bit and they like a tweet or something however you engage however you hang out with us and however you're a member of the space flight community we appreciate y'all showing up every time we go live it's what makes it possible for us to do these streams but uh i don't think that i missed anything there did i folks are we good to go nasa's space flight team i think way to go all right well that is going to end our stream today folks again thank you so much for watching and uh by grab thar's hammer we'll see you next time thanks for watching nerds [Music] um [Music] we don't need any more of these you

Channel: NASASpaceflight

Views: 412,740

Rating: 4.9200263 out of 5

Keywords: spacex, starship, boca chica, testing, bocachicagal, live, SN5, hop, launch, success

Id: CfdFqchowds

Length: 197min 23sec (11843 seconds)

Published: Mon Apr 12 2021

Reddit Comments

[u/kyoto_magic]

Elon is on his way to Brownsville. I’m gonna put my money on a flight attempt early to mid next week

[u/Defiant_Extreme8539]

I saw a comment on Twitter that made sense: The venting was probably simulating fuel use with the thrust simulator

[u/avboden]

Unsure if it was a good test or not, seemed curious with the massive depress vent

[u/BananaEpicGAMER]

imagine they actually launch this thing on 4/20