(GUITAR THEME MUSIC) >> WELCOME. I AM FATHER MITCH AND WELCOME TO 'SCRIPTURE AND TRADITION' WHERE WE TAKE A LOOK AT SACRED SCRIPTURE AND SACRED TRADITION THAT COMES TO US FROM THE APOSTLES AS BLESSED ST. PAUL HAD TAUGHT US IN HIS 2ND LETTER TO THE CORINTHIANS. THESSALONIANS. SORRY. OF COURSE WE WANT YOU TO BE A PART OF THE SHOW AND YOU CAN ADD YOUR QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS DURING THE LIVE PROGRAM BY CALLING 1 800 221 9460. IF YOU ARE NOT IN NORTH AMERICA IT WILL NOT WORK. YOU CAN CALL ANOTHER NUMBER. IT'S 1 205 271 2980. OR SEND TO EMAIL TO: SCRIPTUREANDTRADITION@EWTN.COM. YOU CAN GO TO OUR SOCIAL MEDIA PAGES FACEBOOK AND YOUTUBE. TODAY WE ARE GOING TO CONTINUE THE MATERIAL I WROTE ON THE SPIRITUAL DESOLATION IN OUR LIVES THAT OCCURS EVERY SO OFTEN AND HOW ST. IGNATIUS OF LOYOLA REMINDS US AND TEACHES US THIS PROCESS OF DISCERNMENT. REMINDING US THAT EVENTUALLY THESE TIMES OF DESOLATION WILL COME TO AN END AND THEY WILL BE REPLACED WITH CONSOLATION. THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL DO THAT. WE ARE STARTING TODAY ON PAGE 61 OF MY BOOK ENTITLED "HOW TO LISTEN WHEN GOD IS SPEAKING: A GUIDE FOR MODERN DAY CATHOLICS. YOU MAY GET A COPY OF THAT AT EWTNRC.COM. IT IS ITEM 1833. AD IF YOU GO THERE, AND YOU WANT T COPY OF THE SPIRITUAL EXERCISES THEY HAVE BOOKS ON THAT BUT YOU CAN ALSO DOWNLOAD FOR FREE THE SPIRITUAL EXERCISES BY GOING TO THE EWTN DOCUMENT LIBRARY AND THERE YOU CAN LOOK UP THE SPIRITUAL EXERCISES AND DOWNLOAD IT TO FOLLOW ALONG. THAT IS EWTN.COM/CATHOLICISM/LIBRARY. WHEN YOU DO GET IT YOU WILL SEE THAT WE ARE DEALING WITH SPIRITUAL EXERCISES PARAGRAPH 321. THIS IS RULE 8 OF THE RULES FOR DISCERNMENT OF SPIRITS. AND WHAT HE WANTS TO DO IS REMIND US AS I JUST MENTIONED THE VARIOUS ENCOURAGEMENTS THAT WE CAN HAVE DURING DESOLATION. 1ST, TAKE EFFORTS TO HOLD ONTO YOUR FAITH PATIENTLY. DO NOT TRY TO WORK UP A STRONG FEELING ABOUT IT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. JUST QUIETLY AND PATIENTLY HOLD ONTO YOUR FAITH AND KNOW THAT THAT PATIENCE IS GOING TO COUNTERACT THE HARASSMENTS FROM THE EVIL SPIRIT. YOU KNOW, IF, I LIKE TO WATCH A LOT OF OLD TIME WESTERNS AND THE PEOPLE WHO GET RATTLED IN A FIST FIGHT OR A GUNFIGHT ARE THE ONES WHO LOSE. IT IS THE ONE TO STAY CALM AND PAY ATTENTION DURING THE GUNFIGHT TO WHAT IS GOING ON AND PATIENTLY WATCH. IF YOU START SHOOTING ERRATICALLY YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE. THE SAME THING IN THE BATTLE WITH THE EVIL ONE. 1 OF THE REASONS I LIKE OLD TIME WESTERNS IS IT IS JUST AN EXAMPLE OF THE BATTLE BETWEEN GOOD AND EVIL. THEY OFTEN PORTRAY THAT VERY STRONGLY. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE HARASSMENTS OF THE DEVIL. HE WANTS TO GET US RATTLED. HE WANTS US TO BE NERVOUS AND JUST LUNGE OUT. "I GOTTA DO SOMETHING!" AND THEN DO SOMETHING STUPID. BUT DO NOT DO THAT. YOU WANT TO TAKE CARE. AS I WROTE, YOU HAVE TO HUNKER DOWN A LITTLE. THAT MEANS YOU HAVE TO MEDITATE MORE, TAKING A LOOK AT THE GOSPELS AND SPENDING MORE TIME UNDERSTANDING JESUS IN THE GOSPEL. ANOTHER WAY TO HUNKER DOWN AND FIND THAT PATIENCE IS TO PRAY MORE. SAY THE ROSARY MORE OFTEN. THE DIVINE MERCY CHAPLET. TAKE MORE TIME TO MAKE A HOLY HOUR. HUNKER DOWN AND CALM DOWN AND SEE WHAT IS GOING ON. THIS IS GOING TO BE 1 LAST GREAT WAY TO HUNKER DOWN IS TO EXAMINE YOUR LIFE AND TO DO MORE PENANCE FOR PAST SINS. THIS IS A GOOD WAY TO CALM YOURSELF DOWN AND NOT GET ALL INTO A DITHER OVER THE STUFF THAT SATAN TRIES TO THROW AT YOU. THAT IS A VERY IMPORTANT POINT. WHEN YOU ARE EXPERIENCING DESOLATION, ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND IT WILL COME TO AN END. IT IS NOT FUN TO EXPERIENCE DESOLATION IN THE MIDDLE OF IT BUT IT WILL COME TO AN END. THAT IS THE NATURE OF IT. AND IT WILL BE REPLACED BY CONSOLATION IF YOU MAINTAIN YOUR FAITH PATIENTLY. A LOT OF PEOPLE GET INTO A DITHER AND SAY THAT IS IT. I QUIT. I AM OUT OF HERE. THEY WILL GO ALL SORTS OF WAYS TO LEAVING THE FAITH, NOT WANTING TO PRACTICE IT ANYMORE. "I CANNOT STAND SOME OF THESE PEOPLE AT CHURCH. I CANNOT STAND SOME OF THE LEADERS IN THE CHURCH. I DO NOT LIKE THIS. I AM OUT OF HERE." THAT IS NOT THE WAY TO OVERCOME THE DESOLATION. ALL YOU WILL END UP DOING IS CHANGING WHAT DESOLATION YOU HAVE BUT YOU WILL NOT GET RID OF DESOLATION. THAT IS FOR SURE. ANOTHER THING THAT MAY BE USEFUL, AND THIS IS SOMETHING I HAVE FOUND HELPFUL. IN PARTICULAR WHEN I'M DEALING WITH PEOPLE WHO ARE EXPERIENCING GREAT GRIEF. THAT IS TO CONSIDER THE BLESSED MOTHER ON GOOD FRIDAY EVENING AND DURING THE DAY OF HOLY SATURDAY. THINK ABOUT THE DEPTHS OF DESOLATION THAT SHE FELT AFTER HAVING TO LEAVE JESUS IN THE TOMB. AND YOU PARENTS WHO HAVE LOST A CHILD HAVE A GOOD UNDERSTANDING OF THAT. IT IS A HORRIBLE THING. PARENTS ARE SUPPOSED TO DIE BEFORE THEIR CHILDREN. AND CHILDREN ARE SUPPOSED TO BURY THEIR PARENTS. THAT IS THE WAY IT WOULD SEEM TO BE THE NORMAL COURSE, BUT IT DOES NOT HAPPEN THAT WAY ALL THE TIME. FOR A VARIETY OF REASONS. IT IS A GREAT GRIEF WHEN PARENTS BURY THE CHILDREN. IMAGINE OUR LADY. IMAGINE WHAT SHE WAS THINKING. THAT THE ANGEL GABRIEL HAD SAID THAT HE WOULD SIT ON THE THRONE OF HIS FATHER DAVID. THAT HE WOULD RULE OVER ISRAEL. AND THE ONLY TIME THAT SHE SEES JESUS HER SON PUBLICLY PROCLAIMED AS THE KING OF THE JEWS IS WHEN HE IS ON THE CROSS AND THE SIGN ABOVE IT SAYS JESUS THE NAZARENE, KING OF THE JEWS. THAT IS NOT WHAT I THINK SHE WOULD HAVE HAD IN MIND WHEN THE ARCHANGEL GABRIEL GAVE HER THE ANNUNCIATION. I'LL BET THAT WAS NOT WHAT SHE PICTURED IMMEDIATELY. SHE MOST LIKELY PICTURED A PALACE WHERE FROM THE SEAT THE THRONE OF THE KING HER SON WOULD BE ADMINISTERING JUSTICE AND GOODNESS TO ALL OF THE PEOPLE. I AM SURE THAT IS WHAT SHE THOUGHT. THAT IS WHAT ANY MOTHER WOULD THINK. IMAGINE HOW DIFFICULT THAT PICTURE IN HER MIND AFTER HAVING HEARD WHAT THE ARCHANGEL SAID AND THEN TO SEE HIM CROWNED WITH THORNS. TO SEE HIM CRUCIFIED AND DIED. AND THEN TAKE HIM IN HER ARMS AS A DEAD MAN AND LEAVE HIM IN A TOMB. THAT WAS NOT EVEN HIS TOMB. IT WAS SOMEBODY ELSE'S TOMB. THIS IS VERY DIFFICULT. THIS IS SOMETHING WHERE A LOT OF CHRISTIANS TRY TO GET INTO THAT EXPERIENCE. THERE ARE WONDERFUL HYMNS. I DO NOT KNOW OF MANY IN ENGLISH. OF COURSE THERE IS THE ENGLISH TRANSLATION OF THE "STABAT MATER". THE "STABAT MATER" IS A WONDERFUL OLD LATIN HYMN OF OUR LADY'S SUFFERING AT THE CROSS. WE USUALLY SING IT AT THE STATIONS OF THE CROSS. IT HAS MANY VERSES AND WE ALSO SING IT AS THE SEQUENCE ON THE FEAST OF OUR LADIES SORROWS IN SEPTEMBER. BUT THERE ARE NOT TOO MANY OTHER HYMNS THAT GET INTO HER EXPERIENCE IN ENGLISH OR IN I DO NOT KNOW MAYBE THERE'S SOME IN LATIN BUT I DO NOT KNOW THEM. IN ARABIC WE HAVE A LOT. THERE IS SO WHOLE GROUP OF HYMNS THAT ARE JUST WONDERFUL. IF YOU SAW THE MOVIE THE PASSION OF THE CHRIST, THEY PLAY ONE AS THE BACKGROUND DURING THAT WHOLE SUFFERING AND CARRYING THE CROSS AND THE CRUCIFIXION. THEY SING ... "I AM THE SORROWFUL MOTHER." IF YOU EVER GET A CHANCE TO HEAR IT IT IS BY FAIRUZ. A GREAT SINGER. IT IS MARVELOUS. IT IS MEANT TO HELP US, LIKE MANY OTHER HYMNS, UNDERSTAND THE DEPTH OF SUFFERING THAT OUR LADY EXPERIENCED AS SHE WATCHED JESUS DIE. AND GETTING TO THAT YOU UNDERSTAND DESOLATION. WHICH WOULD'VE BEEN HERS NOT BECAUSE OF ANY FAULT. SHE HAD NO FAULT ON HER PART BUT SHE CERTAINLY EXPERIENCED THAT EMPTINESS, THAT LOSS OF CHRIST. AND THEN TO CONSIDER AFTER THAT THE RESURRECTION HYMNS. WE HAVE MORE HYMNS IN ENGLISH ABOUT THE RESURRECTION THAT BRING OUT THE TRIUMPH AND JOY AND OTHER LANGUAGES OF COURSE AS WELL. THOSE ARE VERY COMMON THEMES FOR CHRISTIANS. AND WE CAN ALWAYS REMEMBER; AS A MATTER OF FACT WHEN I PRAY THE ROSARY I WILL HAVE, I WILL PLAY THE STABAT MATER, OR 1 OF THESE GOOD FRIDAY HYMNS THAT WE SING IN THE MARONITE AND THE MALACHITE CHURCHES. I LOVE THOSE HYMNS. BUT THEN WHEN I MOVE TO THE JOYFUL MYSTERIES I PLAY AN EASTER HYMN AND TO REMEMBER THAT PROCESS. THAT IS 1 OF THE REASONS IT IS SO IMPORTANT TO PRAY THE ROSARY. YOU REMIND YOURSELF OF THE SORROWFUL MYSTERIES BUT THEN YOU ALSO REMIND YOURSELF OF THE GLORIOUS MYSTERIES. AND WE NEED TO SEE THAT RHYTHM IS NOT ONLY IN THE ROSARY BUT IT IS A RHYTHM IN OUR LIVES. YOU NEVER FORGET WHEN YOU ARE EXPERIENCING DESOLATION THAT CONSOLATION WILL COME TO YOU. AT SOME POINT OUR LORD, IT IS NOT IN SCRIPTURES BUT THERE WERE SOME POINT AT WHICH OUR LORD DID MEET HIS MOTHER AND IN FACT AT THE HOLY SEPULCHER CHURCH IN JERUSALEM THERE IS A CHAPEL THAT COMMEMORATES HIM MEETING HIS MOTHER, AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE CAN IMAGINE THE INCREDIBLE JOY THAT SHE HAD AND CONSOLATION AT SEEING HIM AGAIN, THAT WILL BE OURS AS WELL. NOW WE ALSO NEED TO REMEMBER THAT WHEN WE GO THROUGH THESE CONSOLATIONS; WE GO THROUGH DESOLATION THAT WILL BE APPROPRIATE CONSOLATIONS AND THAT COMES. IT COMES. YOU DO NOT WANT TO FORGET PAST CONSOLATIONS EITHER. LET US TAKE A LOOK AT RULE 9 OF THE RULES FOR DISCERNMENT. THIS IS IN THE SPIRITUAL EXERCISES PARAGRAPH NUMBER 322. THIS IS A WONDERFUL SECTION IN ST. IGNATIUS. HE GIVES US THE 3 MAIN CAUSES THAT WE EXPERIENCE DESOLATION. 1ST REASON PEOPLE EXPERIENCE DESOLATION. IT IS THAT THEY BECOME LUKEWARM IN THEIR DEVOTION TO GOD. OR IS HE USES THE WORD TEPID. BUT THAT IS JUST LUKEWARM. IT IS A GOOD WORD FOR LUKEWARM. I LIKE IT. THEY BECOME LAZY IN DOING THEIR SPIRITUAL EXERCISES. THEY THINK, I'M NOT SO SURE I WILL GET A ROSARY IN TODAY OR DO SOME OTHER PRAYERS. I MAY NOT; IF I HAVE TIME, IF I REMEMBER MAYBE I WILL GET TO THE ANGELUS, REGINA CAELI AT NOON AND 6 AT NIGHT. AND MAYBE DAILY MASS. I DO NOT KNOW. THAT LUKEWARM QUALITY BRINGS ON DESOLATION. AND WE START MISSING MASS, ROSARY, PRAYER AND MEDITATION THE LORD WILL WITHDRAW. THAT WE SHOULD EXPECT SPIRITUAL DESOLATION TO COME TO US. 1 OF THE REASONS THAT WE HAVE THE SPIRITUAL EXERCISES, THESE DEVOTIONS IS SO THAT HELPS US TO FIND GOD IN OUR LIVES IN EVERY PART OF OUR LIVES. THAT IS OUR GOAL. WE NEED THAT. THIS HAPPENS. I REMEMBER IN READING; I READ A NUMBER OF LIVES OF MARTIN LUTHER AND HE HAD BEEN AN AUGUSTINIAN MONK IN GERMANY AND AS A MONK AND PRIEST HE WAS OBLIGED PRAY THE OFFICE, THE LITURGY OF THE HOURS. THE MATINS, THE LAUDS, AND THE DAYTIME PRAYERS AS WELL AS EVENING PRAYER AND ALL OF THAT. THAT WAS VERY IMPORTANT PART OF EVERY PRIEST'S LIFE AND EVERY MONK'S LIFE. BUT FATHER MARTIN LUTHER USED TO GET SO CAUGHT UP IN HIS STUDIES THAT HE WOULD NEGLECT TO SAY HIS OFFICE. THE OFFICE IS MEANT, IT IS DIVIDED UP INTO DIFFERENT TIMES OF THE DAY SO THAT YOU SANCTIFY THE DAY COMING BACK TO DIFFERENT TIMES OF PRAYER. AND WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IS THAT HE WOULD NEGLECT THE OFFICE, SOMETIMES FOR DAYS OR EVEN WEEKS AT A TIME AND THEN HE WOULD FEEL THE DESOLATION AND GET PANICKY AND SPEND A FEW DAYS JUST SAYING THE OFFICE. GOING THROUGH ALL THE STUFF THAT HE HAD NEGLECTED. AND THIS MADE HIM FEEL A LOT OF GUILT AND REMORSE, AND HE WOULD JUST TRY TO GET THROUGH ALL OF THIS, BUT IT BECAME COMPULSIVE READING OF HIS OFFICE. COMPULSIVE PRAYING. RATHER THAN MAKING IT LIKE I LIKE TO CALL IT, THE WARP AND WOOF OF LIFE. DO YOU KNOW WHAT WARPS AND WOOFS ARE? WHEN YOU MAKE A BASKET YOU HAVE THE UP, LIKE THE SHAPE OF THE BASKET YOU HAVE ONE STRONG PIECE OF TWIG AND THEN YOU WRAP THE OTHER MATERIAL AROUND IT, SO THAT IT FORMS A BASKET. THAT IS WARP AND WOOF. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO MAKE WITH OUR PRAYER. WELL, HE DID NOT. IT WAS NOT BY ANY MEANS, I'M NOT TRYING TO SAY THIS WAS THE MAIN THING GOING ON, BUT THAT KIND OF DESOLATION AND GUILT AND REMORSE THAT HE HAD FROM HIS IRREGULAR PRAYER TIME, THAT CONTRIBUTED TO THE PERSONALITY THAT LED HIM TO HAVE A BREAK WITH THE CHURCH. NOT THAT THERE WERE NOT THE ABUSES THAT HE CRITICIZED. THE ABUSES NEEDED TO BE CRITICIZED AND IN FACT LATER ON THE COUNCIL OF TRENT DID CONDEMN A LOT OF THE ABUSES THAT HE BROUGHT UP. ABSOLUTELY. BUT IT WAS SOMETHING THAT HE DID OUT OF THIS DESOLATION THAT WEAKENED HIM IN TERMS OF HIS LOVE FOR THE CHURCH AND HE BECAME VERY ANGRY. IT WAS NOT TOO LONG AFTER HE STARTED THIS BREAK THAT HE STARTED CALLING THE POPE ANTICHRIST AND THE POPE WAS CALLING HIM ANTICHRIST. NEITHER ONE WAS DOING WELL WITH THIS. WE NEED TO HAVE OUR DEVOTION IN GOOD ORDER AND THAT WILL BE 1 PROTECTION AGAINST DESOLATION. DESOLATION DOES COME FOR OTHER REASONS ALSO. WHEN WE COME BACK WE WILL TAKE A LOOK AT THOSE OTHER 2 REASONS ST IGNATIUS POINTS OUT THAT WE HAVE DESOLATION. SO PLEASE STAY WITH US. (GUITAR THEME MUSIC) (GUITAR THEME MUSIC) >> ALL RIGHT. WE ARE TALKING ABOUT ST. IGNATIUS LOYOLA AND HIS RULES FOR DISCERNMENT, AND WE ARE DISCUSSING RULE 9 WHICH POINTS OUT 3 REASONS THAT PEOPLE EXPERIENCE DESOLATION. 1ST WE MENTIONED IT IS PEOPLE NEGLECT THEIR DEVOTION. THAT LEADS TO DESOLATION. THE 2ND REASON IS THAT GOD SOMETIMES WANTS TO TEST US. NOW THIS IS SOMETHING THAT IS NOT A POPULAR IDEA. BUT ST. IGNATIUS I THINK WAS QUITE CORRECT. NOW IT DOES NOT MEAN THAT A PERSON HAS DONE SOMETHING WRONG WHEN THEY EXPERIENCE DESOLATION. IT IS THAT THE LORD WANTS TO TEST US TO SEE HOW FAR WE WILL EXPAND AND EXTEND OURSELVES IN SERVING HIM AND PRAISING HIM EVEN WHEN WE DO NOT RECEIVE CONSOLATION IN RETURN. THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT THING. IT IS A TYPE OF TEST THAT STRENGTHENS US JUST AS WHEN ATHLETES AND SOLDIERS GET PUSHED TO THEIR LIMITS, AND THEN WHEN YOU ARE IN CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES YOU GET TESTED YOU KNOW WITH A LOT OF ANXIETY. I KNOW ONE JESUIT WHO USED TO GET SO ANXIOUS AND THE GUY IS A BRILLIANT MAN. BRILLIANT. BUT HE WOULD GET SO ANXIOUS ABOUT HIS TESTS THAT WHEN HE WAS A SCHOLASTIC THEY WOULD NOT TELL HIM WHEN HIS TEST WAS, AND THEN SOME GUY WOULD JUST SAY, COME ON WITH US, THE SPIRIT WANTS TO SEE YOU AND THEY WOULD TAKE HIM UP THERE AND HE WOULD GET THE TEST. AND HE DID FINE BECAUSE HE WAS SO BRILLIANT. THIS IS WHERE WE FIND OUT WHAT WE ARE MADE OF IN A TEST. THAT IS NOT A BAD THING. LIKE TESTS IN SCHOOLS, I DO NOT THINK IT IS BAD FOR STUDENTS TO FEEL A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF ANXIETY ABOUT THEIR TESTS. I WANT THEM TO; I HAVE BEEN A TEACHER. I WAS TEACHING THIS PAST YEAR A COURSE ONLINE. I GIVE MY STUDENTS TESTS. THEY FEEL A CERTAIN ANXIETY ABOUT IT. BUT THAT IS NOT BAD BECAUSE THAT ANXIETY ALSO CAN MOTIVATE THEM TO STUDY MORE. TO MEMORIZE SOME OF THE THINGS I TAUGHT THEM. SO THAT IS NOT A BAD THING. EVEN WHEN STUDENTS ARE WELL PREPARED. I KNOW SOME REALLY BRILLIANT STUDENTS. THEY WOULD GET SO NERVOUS. SOMETIMES I WOULD JUST LAUGH AT THEM TEASINGLY ABOUT HOW NERVOUS THEY WERE. THEY SAID, I DO NOT KNOW HOW I DID. I DON'T THINK I WAS READY FOR THIS. AND YET THEY GET STRAIGHT A'S. THAT KIND OF ANXIETY HELPS MOTIVATE THEM TO STUDY AND IN THAT PROCESS OF STUDYING THEY MOVE THEIR KNOWLEDGE FROM A PASSIVE RECOGNITION OF THINGS TO AN ACTIVE USE OF IT. 1 OF MY FRIENDS IS A MEDICAL DOCTOR. SHE EXPERIENCED THAT A LOT WHEN SHE WAS GOING THROUGH MEDICAL SCHOOL FOR HER BOARD EXAMS AND ALL OF THIS KIND OF THING. AT 1ST I DID NOT THINK SHE SHOULD BE SO NERVOUS BUT MAYBE SHE IS. THEN SHE KEPT GETTING A'S. IT WAS THE KIND OF THING THOUGH THAT HELPED MOTIVATE HER, LIKE MANY OTHER STUDENTS, TO DO EXTRA WELL. AND THIS IS A TEST THROUGH SPIRITUAL DESOLATION THAT HELPS US TO BECOME MORE ASSIDUOUS IN OUR PRAYER. TO DO WHAT WE DO FOR GOD NOT BECAUSE WE WANT TO GET SOMETHING OUT OF IT. WHAT IS GOD GOING TO GIVE ME IF I PRAY MORE? NO. IT IS PART OF THE RELATIONSHIP. YOU GIVE YOURSELF WITHOUT WORRYING ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO GET BACK. TRUST. TRUST THAT GOD IS GOING TO BE FAR MORE GENEROUS THAN I AM. BUT IT IS A VERY IMPORTANT THING THAT HE DOES TEST US. THIS IS A WAY THAT WE PUT OUR COMMITMENTS INTO ACTION EVEN WHEN WE DO NOT FEEL LIKE IT. A LOT OF YOU PARENTS, YOU KNOW THAT. IT IS SO WONDERFUL TO HAVE A BABY. BUT IT IS PRETTY TOUGH ON A LOT OF MOMS AT THE OUTSET. THEN THEY ARE SO HAPPY TO SEE THEIR BABY AND THEY ARE FILLED WITH LOVE FOR THE CHILD BUT THEN AS TIME GOES ON THERE IS A LOT OF WORK. CHANGING THE DIAPERS, FEEDING AND WONDERING WHY THEY'RE CRYING THIS TIME. ARE THEY SICK? DO THEY HAVE A FEVER OR EAR INFECTION? ALL THOSE THINGS THAT GO ON. YOU ARE TESTED BUT GROW IN LOVE PRECISELY THROUGH THAT ALL, AND THAT ACTUALLY ENDS UP DEEPENING YOUR LOVE. THE SAME THING IN OUR RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD. SOMETHING ELSE THAT WE SHOULD DO WELL TO REMEMBER IS THAT OUR BLESSED LORD JESUS CHRIST WAS ALSO TESTED. WHEN WE READ THE GOSPEL WE SEE IN MATTHEW CHAPTER 4:1, THEN JESUS WAS LED UP BY THE SPIRIT INTO THE WILDERNESS TO BE TEMPTED BY THE DEVIL. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT. IT IS THE SAME HOLY SPIRIT WHO HOVERED OVER HIM IN THE FORM OF A DOVE WHEN HE WAS BEING BAPTIZED AND NOW THAT SAME HOLY SPIRIT IS LEADING HIM INTO THE DESERT IN ORDER TO BE TEMPTED BY THE DEVIL. HE DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG. AND WE NEED TO REMEMBER THAT AT TIMES WHEN WE HAVE DESOLATION AND WE ARE BEING TEMPTED IT IS NOT BECAUSE WE DID SOMETHING WRONG BUT WE ARE BEING TESTED. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT IS NOT A PUNISHMENT FOR SIN BY ANY MEANS BECAUSE IT HAPPENED TO THE SINLESS SON OF GOD. LOOK AT HEBREWS CHAPTER 5:7-8, TO UNDERSTAND THIS BETTER. IT SAYS IN THE DAYS OF HIS FLESH, JESUS OFFERED UP PRAYERS AND SUPPLICATIONS WITH LOUD CRIES AND TEARS TO THE ONE WHO WAS ABLE TO SAVE HIM FROM DEATH AND HE WAS HEARD BECAUSE OF HIS REVERENT SUBMISSION. ALTHOUGH HE WAS A SON HE LEARNED OBEDIENCE THROUGH WHAT HE SUFFERED. THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT HE HAD. I KNOW THERE'S A CONTROVERSY OUT THERE ABOUT THE TRANSLATION OF THE OUR FATHER. THE LORD'S PRAYER. BUT I TELL YOU THIS, THE GREEK IS ABSOLUTELY CLEAR, AND IT SAYS LEAD US NOT INTO TEMPTATION. THAT IS WHAT IT SAYS. [SPEAKS GREEK] THAT IS WHAT IT SAYS IN GREEK. IT CANNOT CHANGE THAT. IT IS BASED; OUR LORD IS BASING THAT PETITION ON HIS OWN EXPERIENCE OF BEING LED INTO TEMPTATION. GOD WAS NOT TEMPTING HIM. THE DEVIL WAS TEMPTING HIM. BUT GOD LED HIM TO THE PLACE WHERE THAT WAS GOING TO BE. AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT. THEN LET ME JUST GIVE ONE THE LAST REASON FOR DESOLATION. THAT IS TO MAKE IT CLEAR TO US HUMAN BEINGS THAT CONSOLATION IS NOT SOMETHING WE CAN CREATE OR MAINTAIN BY HUMAN ABILITY. INCREASES THE FAITH, HOPE AND LOVE AND VARIOUS EXPERIENCES OF TEARS AND JOY DO NOT COME SIMPLY BY HUMAN TECHNIQUES AND HUMAN MEANS. SOMETIMES GOD WANTS TO REMIND US THIS IS PART OF HIS GRACE. THERE HAVE BEEN A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO TRIED VARIOUS TECHNIQUES TO MAKE YOU EXPERIENCE PEACE. THERE IS NO TECHNIQUE. IT IS A RELATIONSHIP. THAT WAS SOME OF MY CRITIQUE OF CENTERING PRAYER. NOT ONLY MY CRITIQUE BUT THE CRITIQUE THAT CAME FROM THE OFFICE OF FAITH. AND SOMETIMES WE NEED A LITTLE BIT OF DESOLATION TO REALIZE THAT OUR JOY AND CONSOLATION IS A GIFT AND WE DO NOT WANT TO BECOME PRIDEFUL HYPOCRITES ABOUT THAT. WE DEPEND UPON GOD'S MERCY AND WE DEPEND UPON HIS LOVE. WE DEPEND UPON HIS GRACE. NOT ON OUR HUMAN CLEVERNESS OR HUMAN TECHNIQUES. THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT. ALL RIGHT WE WILL STOP THERE AND FINISH UP RULE 9, AND NEXT WEEK WE START WITH RULE 10 AND THAT WILL BE ON PAGE 64 MY BOOK HOW TO LISTEN WHEN GOD IS SPEAKING. WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO DO NOW IS TAKE A LOOK AT SOME OF CALLS AND QUESTIONS. LET US START OFF WITH VICKI. VICKI, WHERE YOU CALLING FROM? >> MICHIGAN. >> WHAT PART OF MICHIGAN? >> WESTERN PART. >> THAT IS WHERE MY BROTHER LIVES. >> GRAND RAPIDS AREA. >> HE IS DOWN IN SOUTH HAVEN. >> I AM NORTH OF THAT. I REALLY HAVE GOTTEN A LOT OUT OF YOUR PROGRAM. THANK YOU. >> SO, WHAT IS GOING ON HERE? WHAT IS YOUR QUESTION? >> I HOPE I FRAME IT RIGHT. IN THE FAMILY THERE HAS BEEN A GENERATIONAL HEREDITARY TENDENCY TOWARD DEPRESSION AND SOME MEMBERS HAVE HAD MANIC DEPRESSION. THERE ARE 2 SCHOOLS OF THOUGHT. SOME OF THE FOLKS SEEM TO THINK THIS IS JUST A MANIFESTATION OF SIN AND SOME SEE IT AS SICKNESS. THERE HAS BEEN PROFESSIONAL CARE SOUGHT IN MEDICATIONS AND THINGS AND THEY HELP SOMEWHAT BUT NOT ELIMINATE THE PROBLEM BECAUSE THIS IS GONE ON A COUPLE GENERATIONS, DOES THAT MEAN? WHAT IS YOUR TAKE ON THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SICKNESS AND SIN OR IS IT 2 SIDES OF THE SAME COIN? >> I DO NOT KNOW THE SPECIFIC INDIVIDUALS SO I CANNOT GIVE ANY SPECIFIC TREATMENT PLAN OR ANY SUCH THING. BUT HERE IS A COUPLE OF THINGS I WOULD BRING OUT. FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE EXPERIENCING DEPRESSION, CLINICAL DEPRESSION YOU HAVE TO DISTINGUISH THAT FROM SADNESS. NOT ALL SADNESS IS DEPRESSION AND NOT ALL DEPRESSION IS SADNESS. THERE ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS. A LOT OF TIMES; I REMEMBER ONE PSYCHOLOGIST DESCRIBED DEPRESSION AS THE ATTEMPT TO HOLD IN FEELINGS THAT YOU ARE AFRAID OF. YOU TRY TO HOLD IN VERY NEGATIVE EMOTIONS. OFTEN TIMES ANGER. SOMETIMES LUST. AND YOU TRY TO STUFF THEM DOWN. PEOPLE DEAL WITH IT IN A VARIETY OF WAYS. SOMETIMES THEY STUFF IT DOWN WITH OVER EATING. SOMETIMES WITH SEXUAL COMPULSION. SOMETIMES WITH OTHER SYMPTOMS. BUYING THINGS AND SUCH. ALCOHOLISM. SOMETIMES. A VARIETY OF WAYS. I THINK YOU HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT ON A NUMBER OF LEVELS. THERE IS THE SYMPTOMATIC ISSUE THAT YOU NEED TO, WITH THE HELP OF A PROFESSIONAL, MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL, FIND THAT WHICH CAN HELP YOU DEAL WITH THE SYMPTOMS THAT HAVE TO BE CONTROLLED SO THAT YOU CAN LIVE IN LIFE. THAT IS NOT A BAD THING. THERE ARE OTHER CASES, THERE ARE CASES WHERE THERE ARE PHYSICAL ROUTES TO THE DEPRESSION AND, AGAIN YOU HAVE TO SEE A PROFESSIONAL ABOUT THAT. BUT THERE ARE OFTEN TIMES SOCIAL AND PSYCHOLOGICAL COMPONENTS THAT MUST BE ADDRESSED AND YOU HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK AT THOSE PSYCHOLOGICAL AND SOCIAL ISSUES AND SOMETIMES SPIRITUAL ONES THAT ARE SINFUL. FOR INSTANCE, SOME PEOPLE REACT TO THE ATTEMPT TO CONTROL THEIR LIVES BY OTHER FAMILY MEMBERS WITH DEPRESSION. WHEN SOME FAMILY MEMBERS TRY TO CONTROL SOMEBODY'S LIFE AND ACT AS IF THEY ARE TOTALLY IN CHARGE OF THEM, WHEN THEY ARE NOT, THAT CAN LEAD TO DEPRESSION. THAT FAMILY ISSUE NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED. SOMETIMES THERE IS AN ISSUE OF ANGER. MAYBE LEGITIMATE ANGER. MAYBE NOT. BUT THEY HAVE TO FIND OUT WHAT THAT ANGER IS. YOU HAVE TO FIND A WAY TO EXPRESS IT IN A NON OFFENSIVE OR NONLETHAL WAY. ONE PSYCHOLOGIST RECOMMENDED THAT PEOPLE GO TO A PUNCHING BAG AND JUST EXPRESS THEIR ANGER THERE, AND PHYSICALLY. BUT ALSO ONCE YOU LET THE FEELING OUT DEAL WITH WHAT CAUSES ARE UNDERLYING IT. THESE ARE THINGS THAT YOU HAVE TO PAY ATTENTION TO. THERE COULD BE ELEMENTS OF SIN. BUT YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT A QUICK ACCUSATION OR ONE ACCUSATION FITS ALL DEPRESSIONS. THAT IS NOT TRUE. IT IS CAREFUL PAYING ATTENTION AND LISTENING AND PROFESSIONALS CAN BE VERY HELPFUL IN THIS BUT THE PERSON HIM OR HERSELF ALSO MUST EXAMINE THEIR OWN LIVES TO SEE WHAT IS GOING ON. WHY AM I THIS WAY? WHAT LEADS ME TO THIS? HOW CAN I FIND A WAY FORWARD? THAT IS THE QUESTION. SO THAT WOULD BE, IT IS NOT, HERE IS THE ANSWER. IT IS NOT THAT WAY. DEPRESSION IS MORE COMPLICATED. BUT IT CAN BE DEALT WITH ON A NUMBER OF FRONTS. AND I WOULD TAKE ON ALL OF THE FRONTS AS BEST YOU CAN, AND AGAIN WITH THE HELP OF GOOD LOCAL PROFESSIONALS. ALL RIGHT. WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A BREAK. LET US DO THAT. WE WILL COME BACK WITH MORE OF YOUR QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS. PLEASE STAY WITH US. (GUITAR THEME MUSIC) (GUITAR THEME MUSIC) >> BEFORE WE GET TO MORE OF YOUR QUESTIONS, WE WANT YOU TO BE SURE TO TUNE IN TO EWTN DURING THE FIRST WEEK OF JUNE FOR WHAT WE'RE CALLING "BLESSED CARLO ACUTIS WEEK". JUNE 1ST THROUGH 5TH, EWTN WILL BROADCAST A NUMBER OF SPECIAL PROGRAMS ABOUT THE LIFE AND EUCHARISTIC DEVOTION OF BLESSED CARLO ACUTIS WHO DIED IN 2006 FROM LEUKEMIA AT THE YOUNG AGE OF 15. AFTER MANY TESTIMONIES AND A MIRACLE ATTESTED TO BY THE VATICAN, POPE FRANCIS CONFIRMED THE BOY'S LIFE WAS ONE OF HEROIC VIRTUE. CARLO ACUTIS WAS BEATIFIED ON OCTOBER 10TH OF LAST YEAR, 2020. FOR MORE INFORMATION ON BLESSED CARLO ACUTIS GO TO EWTN.COM/CARLOACUITS AND GO TO EWTN.COM TO CHECK OUT THE BROADCAST SCHEDULE FOR "BLESSED CARLO ACUTIS WEEK" ON EWTN, JUNE 1ST THROUGH 5TH. THIS YOUNG MAN IS GOING TO BE THE PATRON SAINT OF THE INTERNET I UNDERSTAND. WE NEED A LOT MORE SANCTITY ON THE INTERNET. SOME GREAT HOLY STUFF ON THE INTERNET. I LOVE IT. A LOT OF MY FAVORITE HYMNS ARE ON THERE. BUT APPARENTLY THERE'S A PRETTY BAD STUFF TOO. WE NEED A GOOD PATRON SAINT. I HAVE AN EMAIL. WRONG ANSWER, GEORGE. THE HOLY SPIRIT IS NOT ABANDONING THE CHURCH. IT IS JUST THAT SOME PEOPLE IN THE CHURCH ARE ABANDONING THE HOLY SPIRIT. NOW IF YOU REMEMBER WHEN I STARTED DOING THIS SERIES ON HOW TO LISTEN WHEN GOD IS SPEAKING, I 1ST SET UP THE OBJECTIVE NORMS FOR DISCERNMENT. AND THOSE OBJECTIVE NORMS, THE 10 COMMANDMENTS, WHAT WE SEE REVEALED IN SCRIPTURE, AND IN THE TRADITION OF THE CHURCH, THE CHURCH'S MAGISTERIUM, THESE ARE WHERE YOU START OFF WITH. THAT IS THE FRAMEWORK WITHIN WHICH YOU DISCERN. YOU DID NOT NEED TO DISCERN CERTAIN SINS, WHETHER THEY'RE SIN ANYMORE. ADULTERY IS STILL ADULTERY. THAT IS A MORTAL SIN. OUR LORD MAKES IT VERY CLEAR THAT YOU CANNOT HAVE DIVORCE AND REMARRIAGE. THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN CLARIFIED BY THE CHURCH, AND IF SOME OF THE BISHOPS ABANDON WHAT THE LORD TAUGHT AND WHAT THE CHURCH TEACHES, THEN THEY ARE ABANDONING OUR LORD JUST AS THOROUGHLY AS THE APOSTLES ABANDONED JESUS IN THE GARDEN OF GETHSEMANE. WHETHER IT IS JUDAS WHO BETRAYED HIM WITH A KISS OR WHETHER IT IS THE OTHERS WHO RAN AWAY FROM JESUS IN COWARDICE BECAUSE THEY WERE AFRAID OF THE WORLD LIKE SOME OF THESE BISHOPS MIGHT BE OR WHETHER IT IS PETER WHO DENIED KNOWING JESUS. DO NOT FORGET NOW, HAD THE HOLY SPIRIT ABANDONED THE CHURCH? NO. THE CHURCH ABANDONED THE HOLY SPIRIT AND ABANDONED JESUS. AND REMEMBER WHEN THE 12 APOSTLES ABANDONED JESUS, OUR LORD, AND DENIED HIM OR BETRAYED HIM WITH A KISS, THEY HAD JUST BEEN ORDAINED THE 1ST 12 BISHOPS. MAYBE WE CAN SAY THAT SOME THINGS DO NOT CHANGE. WE HAVE TO PAY ATTENTION TO THAT. THIS IS EXACTLY WHY I WROTE MY BOOK WHEAT AND TARES. I WOULD URGE YOU, GEORGE, TO GET A HOLD OF THE BOOK. I GO THROUGH WAYS TO PRAY THROUGH THIS SO THAT WE DO NOT BECOME FOOLISH AND THINK THAT THE HOLY SPIRIT IS ABANDONING THE CHURCH. SOME MEMBERS OF THE CHURCH HAVE ABANDONED THE HOLY SPIRIT AND THE CHURCH'S TEACHING. MY JOB IS TO STAY FAITHFUL. AND I WILL LET GOD TAKE CARE OF SUCCESS. I AM HERE TO STAY FAITHFUL. SO ARE YOU. LET US DO THAT AND MOVE FORWARD. WE HAVE ANOTHER EMAIL HERE. THIS 1 IS FROM MARTHA IN DELAWARE. MARTHA, A COUPLE OF THINGS. SHE WANTS TO CHANGE HER NAME. GO WITH THE NAME. BUT AT THE SAME TIME THERE ARE A FEW OTHER THINGS YOU HAVE TO KEEP IN MIND. ONE, THESE ARE VERY SENSITIVE ISSUES AND THE WAY THAT A PERSON PERCEIVES HIMSELF OR PERCEIVES HERSELF IS A VERY SENSITIVE ISSUE. YOU DID NOT GO RIDING HERD ON THAT AND TRAMPLE THEM DOWN. YOU DEAL WITH THIS GENTLY. THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT. SECONDLY, I REALLY FEAR THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE JUMPING INTO THESE ISSUES, EGGED ON BY THEIR SCHOOLS WHO ARE USING IDEOLOGIES, AND THEY ARE EGGED ON BY COUNSELORS SOMETIMES USING THE SAME IDEOLOGIES, AND WE ARE SEEING VARIOUS PARTS OF OUR SOCIETY GETTING DIVIDED INTO TRIBES OF DIFFERENT SORTS. YOU HAVE TO PUT A LABEL ON SOMEBODY AND THIS TRIBE OF THE TRANSGENDERS AND THE HOMOSEXUALS AND LESBIANS AND ALL OF THIS AND WE DIVIDE UP MORE AND MORE. AND THIS IS VERY MUCH PART OF WHAT IS GOING ON FOR A LOT OF YOUNG PEOPLE. "I HAVE TO FIND OUT WHICH ONE I AM. I GOT TO JOIN 1 OF THESE TRIBES SO THAT I HAVE FRIENDS. SO THAT I AM 1 OF THE COOL KIDS AT LEAST WITHIN MY TRIBE. THIS IS A DIFFICULT THING. YOU ARE GOING TO BE COMING UP AGAINST A LOT OF IDEOLOGIES THAT ARE BEING PUT AND THEN YOU ADD TO IT THE INTERIOR SENSITIVITIES. I DO NOT KNOW HER. I DO NOT KNOW YOU. I DO NOT KNOW WHAT ALL IS GOING ON IN HER LIFE. 1 OF THE BEST THINGS YOU CAN DO IS TO SIT BACK AND LISTEN. DO NOT TRY TO ARGUE WITH HER. YOU WILL IMMEDIATELY BE PERCEIVED AS JUDGMENTAL. YOU WILL BE IMMEDIATELY PERCEIVED WITH DEFENSIVE REACTION. LISTEN. ASK HER TO TELL HER STORY OF WHY. JUST ASK. HOW IS THIS GOING ON? TELL ME ABOUT IT. THE REALITY IS, SHE APPARENTLY HAS NOT YET HAD ANY KIND OF SEX CHANGE OPERATION WHICH WILL SIMPLY SERVE TO MAKE HER NEUTER. SEX CHANGE OPERATIONS NEUTER PEOPLE. THAT IS THE REALITY. SHE APPARENTLY HAS NOT DONE THAT, SO FIND OUT BEFORE SHE MAKES ANYTHING THAT RADICAL INTERCHANGE, WHAT HAPPENED? "TELL ME ABOUT IT." JUST LISTEN. AS YOU KEEP ON LISTENING AND LET HER TELL HER STORY, SHE WILL ASK YOU WHAT YOU THINK. I ALWAYS TELL FOLKS THAT I THINK LIKE A HUNTER. I SIT AND I WATCH THE ANIMALS IN THE WOODS. I WANT TO SEE WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THEM. WHO IS OUT THERE? WHAT IS HAPPENING? WHAT ARE THE PATTERNS? I LISTEN CAREFULLY AND I WATCH CAREFULLY. ALL THE SOUNDS AROUND ME. ALL THE DIFFERENT TENSIONS. WHEN THEY SENSE SOMETHING NERVOUS, COYOTES AND ALL THAT - PAY ATTENTION. AND THEN I WAIT FOR THAT MOMENT WHEN I CAN GET A HEART SHOT. THAT IS WHAT YOU NEED TO DO AS WELL. BE ABLE AS YOU LISTEN TO HER STORY, LOOK FOR AN OPPORTUNITY TO SAY SOMETHING THAT GOES TO HER HEART. LETTING HER KNOW THAT YOU LOVE HER BUT AT THE SAME TIME YOU GIVE A POINT THAT SHE MAY NOT HAVE THOUGHT OF. IF YOU STAY ONLY ON THE IDEAL LEVEL YOU WON'T GET VERY FAR. BUT IF YOU GO FOR THAT HEART SHOT WHERE YOU LET HER KNOW IT IS A SHOT OF LOVE LIKE THE LITTLE CHERUBS OR WHATEVER HIS NAME IS, CUPID, THAT IS WHAT YOU WANT TO DO. THAT WOULD BE MY SENSE. LET US SEE HERE. THIS IS FROM GUY IN TORONTO CANADA. GUY, I DO NOT KNOW IF YOU HAVE BEEN IN ANY BIG FIGHTS OR BEEN IN ANY BATTLES OF WAR OR ANYTHING BUT WHEN YOU ARE IN A BATTLE AND YOU TRY ONE TACTIC AND IT DOES NOT WORK, YOU CHANGE TACTICS. THAT IS JUST MILITARY THINKING, SO SATAN DID NOT WANT JESUS TO DIE FOR SIN. SO HE TRIES TO GET PETER TO PREVENT IT. THAT DID NOT WORK. SO THEN HE GETS AND TEMPTS 1 OF THE 12 FIRST BISHOPS TO BETRAY HIM FOR MONEY. AND WITH A KISS. AND IT ENDS UP UNDOING HIM BECAUSE NO MATTER WHAT TACTIC THE EVIL ONE DOES, GOD CAN TURN IT AROUND. BUT SATAN IS IN A WAR AGAINST GOD, AGAINST GOOD PEOPLE, AGAINST THE CHURCH, AGAINST EVERYTHING THAT GOD STANDS FOR. AGAINST VIRTUE, HOLINESS. HE WILL CHANGE TACTICS. BECAUSE HE IS A CLEVER FIGHTER. BUT WE JUST HAVE TO BE MORE CLEVER. LEARN FROM JESUS AND CONFRONT HIS BAD TACTICS. HIS EVIL TACTICS. WELL, WE ARE OUT OF TIME. THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US. MAY THE LORD BLESS YOU AND KEEP YOU AND CAUSE HIS FACE TO SHINE UPON YOU. THE FATHER, THE SON, AND THE HOLY SPIRIT. AMEN. AND MOTHER ANGELICA THROUGH DISCERNMENT WAS INSPIRED TO START THIS NETWORK SO THAT IT WOULD BE BROUGHT TO YOU INSTEAD OF BY COMMERCIAL ADVERTISEMENTS. FOR THAT REASON SHE ASKS AND I ASK THAT YOU KEEP US IN BETWEEN YOUR UTILITY BILLS. THEN WE WILL BE ABLE TO PAY OUR BILLS ALSO. THANK YOU. (GUITAR THEME MUSIC)
