Rocker Pat Benatar on InnerVIEWS with Ernie Manouse

she began her vocal training as a child studying classical and theater music at 22 she began her professional career singing the music she had always been passionate about rock and roll eventually she would become one of the top-selling female recording artists of all time with hits that included love as a battlefield hit me with your best shot and heartbreaker hello i'm ernie manouse coming up on this episode of interviews our conversation with multiple Grammy Award winning artist Pat Benatar do you ever get used to the fame I don't know that's hard to say I think that your life is this and you you're used to always being scrutinized and that people will say hello to you in that part you get really used to but the object of it you know why and all that kind of stuff now you just nothing changes you know you're still you with a really cool job you know so you're still the person that grew up on Long Island and it doesn't really change that much it's just you got this great gig and it's good you know so was it what you always wanted to do besides being a sex educator I heard you wanted to do that yeah my um I think I always wanted to sing I think that would happen in the middle somewhere when I was studying to go to Julliard was that um I just panicked and thought that you know why would I think that just because you know everyone says I'm like a really great singer for a kid and all that why that would translate into the big pond you know so I think at that point I thought I would be more practical and I would you know go to college and teach school and ridiculous and my kid gone mom you would be the worst teacher no patience whatsoever but um but I don't know you know it's in there and it's like breathing and I can't imagine not doing it ever so when you mention that sense of an insecurity mm-hmm does that ever totally go away are there times when you have the number one album in the country it's gone platinum when you think to yourself am I really worthy of this do you ever know it's not insecurity it was practicality there I don't have any insecurities exactly never the issue it was never like oh I don't think I'm good enough kind of thing I thought I was absolutely good enough I just thought the probability of it happening was just numerically ridiculous you know what I mean it just didn't make any sense that out of all the people that were trying there were so many people that were really great and y-you know that kind of thing I don't have that I don't have that inside and it's not it's not being immodest it's just that I'm I'm a an implementer that's my real gift I have it's not so much that I think I have great talent but I really know how to put one foot in front of the other that's what I do really well so it doesn't matter I just put my head down and go so it never was a question if I chose it I would do it and it would be exactly where I wanted it so it wasn't ever an insecurity like that I just thought that you know that's kind of ridiculous you know why would you you and the thing strikes me funny when we talk like this is the fact that not only are you successful they say you're one of the top recording female artists of all time it's not just that you had success it was monumental yeah but that's just that's just fate luck and a lot of you know good things things have to line up you know what I mean um you can only take credit for some of it you know you got to do your part but the rest is the universe you know it's got it it all has to line up so I just am grateful because you know all the things just went into place at the right time true or false one of these things going into place at the right time it was Halloween you were in the remains of your Halloween costume went on stage and everything changed for you that moment exactly that is true that is true explain what happened I had been I had moved back to New York in 1975 and I auditioned a catcher izing star which was um you know one of the comedy clubs in the group of comedy clubs like The Improv and the Laugh Factory and all that kind of stuff and I just got online like everybody else and and my number was at 2:45 in the morning my number was 27 and I was like it that they call it open mic no it wasn't that glamorous is open when tonight you just gotta got up there and and um you know you gave the sheet music to a piano player you'd never seen before in your life and you just did it so I admit Rick Newman who owned the club and um you know we were kind of working and it was it was about 1977 and I had worked with you know songwriters and we just kind of started I explained to him that I wanted to do this thing I wanted to be this female version of Robert Plant you know that's what I wanted to do and everybody was like you know they really weren't going for it but he went for it and you have to understand that for the past eight years of my life before then I studied classical music only so the transition vocally for me was huge trying to get stop singing like Julie Anders who I adored and start singing like that you know like me now and it wasn't it wasn't that simple but I tried to use everything that I had learned and just me the end-product change and it was going well I was doing really well at night you know in the clubs and everything like that but something you know you could still see that something was missing and I kind of looked like Gidget this kind of thing and so I dressed up for this for Halloween and there's this horrendous movie called cat women of the moon I think Ava or Zsa Zsa one of the Gabor sisters stars in it but it was all about these women on a planet or on the moon I don't remember exactly must be the moon obviously and they had big eyeliner in and they wore these little suits and like tights and little boots and I thought I'm gonna be that for Halloween so I got a ray gun and I got in totally dressed I when I put this big makeup eye I'm gonna wore makeup but not like that and um we went to down to this place called cafe figurin they had a Halloween contest and I won so then we decide all let's all go up to catch it with all of us you know the comedians and everybody were all together let's go back up to catch and go on in our costumes so now you know it's like late it's like in the middle of the morning you know not you know two o'clock one o'clock in the morning everybody's you know New York is still jumping it's going crazy so we all just started performing one after the other and when I got up I did the same songs that I did every single night that we're doing well yeah but now it was unbelievable the response was insane and I'm thinking myself hmm look at the fit out and I'm thinking I can't be like it's just that's ridiculous so I said let me just do it one next day I did it again same thing never took it off ever why was it cuz it just it was the combo you know now it was all that singing and all that looking gave a visual to the music it just went together you know didn't kind of go before I was looking you know like Rebecca of Sunnybrook farm and singing like no a train so now the two things went together but I've also heard you say that that persona now on stage kind of is its own separate person icon well her oh yeah so what does she like compared to you are great and she'll do she's great she'll do anything she is fearless and I'm much mellower and as a human being as a personal person than she is she's nuts and I love her you said though but she can't go grocery shopping she doesn't have to go grocery shopping she could go but ya know it's just it's just you know what and it's really I think everybody does it unconsciously I think everybody has a line between their personal self and their professional self mine's just really clear you know it's it's the delineation is very very clear yeah I mean it's perfect because I call it suiting up you know I don't really want to be here every day this would be exhausting you know I can have this hair this eyeliner this like you know this constantly I always say that if if I had to be a politician or if they made us not be able to point onstage I'd have no career because my whole thing is about yelling at everybody appointment you know if I had to do that like politically correct thing I really so yeah she's great but she has her place you know so you've you've come to the realization that a certain look with your sound is going to work you're moving forward in your career I have to think that there's something in the message of your music that's connecting with the youth of that time that's what really all gelled that you somehow tapped into what was going on we have to understand that it wasn't it's not an individual person you have to remember where the country was at this point this was 1978 79 1980 the women movement was in full force we were the daughters we were the first generation of young women who grew up indoctrinated you know what I mean now we were adult women we were gonna put this into practice this was not on paper anymore and you know in my house where I grew up my father worked you know two jobs sometimes three jobs when he came home from work he ate his supper we watched a little TV together we said our prayers that was it you know what I mean the man worked he didn't do a lot of stuff around the house all I ever remembers my mother and grandmother paint in the house mowing the lawn doing all that kind of stuff so in my world it wasn't even an option to MIT there was no way that women were not the same as far as I was concerned and possibly superior as far as I was concerned so that's how I went into the world and you know what I remember the first couple of times when people looked at me like I had two heads when I told him what I wanted to do I was like what's the problem you know what I mean because they were just like you can't do this one woman can't sell out you know Madison Square Garden and you know you you can't be on the road like that you're gonna die and all this I'm like what are you talking about it never occurred to me that it couldn't be done which was great because I was so naive and and you know that just you're blind and you just go you know you have no fear what was your parents reaction to this while my mother was not surprised cuz she thought I would be a stripper so she was so she was very happy she was happy it's one that's away you know she said you never wonder wear any clothes anyway Jesus yet I like this kind of thing so um and I was always you know like a Jack Russell dog I was this big and this big you know and fighting with everybody everything all the time I lived on a street where there were old boys and I just wanted to be in the club and they would squash earthworms on my leg that would be the initiation I would just so I just you know she she was just happy I wasn't you know getting killed or taken what clothes off somewhere I guess I don't know what do you think was the pivotal moment you realized it was all working that you had was it the first single was it the first album when did you think yeah it's happening I think when I met Spyder for the first time because even even when I got signed I got signed pretty shortly after maybe within 2 years I got signed to chrysalis and we actually began making the record I didn't meet Spyder yet I didn't know him yet and you know I explained it to them and I as a matter of fact Elliott Randall and Paul Shaffer actually played on the original record that we started recording and so we had all these like studio guys and everything that you know it just it wasn't what I meant it just wasn't edgy enough it was just kind of poppy and I was thinking okay that's not it this is not what I mean they're not getting there sir giving me the watered down version of what they think a girl should be doing they're not getting this and then we switched gears and and we brought in Mike Chapman and Peter Coleman and my chapman's I went I was sitting with him when I found one of the first meetings I was explaining it to him and he was intrigued he thought that this was a great idea cuz he was he was doing I think blondie at the time so this was a female singer he had lots of success I guess doing this with women and he was really open to it he was he was kind of excited about doing it and he said he said yeah yeah but I goes I understand what you're saying I told him I wanted a partner I didn't want to be like a solo artist girl singer with an innocuous band behind me I didn't want that to happen faceless people I wanted a partner I wanted it to be like Robert Plant and Jimmy Page or you know Keith and Mick I wanted it to be like this because I got this kid he's 22 years old he's playing in rip derringers band but he goes I think he's about done let me send him down to you and he walked in the door and literally it was like like getting hit in the face with a two-by-four I saw him and first of all on a personal level I was in I was like oh my god I just I just I did and I was trying to control myself and I was looking at my manager and just like I don't care if he can play he is in the band so he's been ugly the Pat Benatar career might not ever happen I don't know I because the minute he played it was so exactly what I meant but look in the way he did that way and it was incredible because we really it was instantaneous for both of us it was exactly what I was talking about and he was so thrilled to be with with somebody who was fresh and new and had no preconceptions he was like the old leg player even though he was younger than me but because my experience in that kind of music and that genre of music was so limited he was so experienced I mean he was like hanging out with Iggy Pop and doing all this kind of stuff and I was you know doing the South Pacific you know so the combo was absolutely perfect okay I brought him into the middle and he pushed me far to the left yeah that love of that style was that always with you oh yeah you knew you could do the hard even reversing in the Opera and the cabin I never honestly when I was growing up it never occurred to me ever to sing that I never even like pretended with the hairbrush in the mirror I was completely ready to be a classical singing an opera singer that's what I plan to do because that's my voice was suited to that and I'd never even thought it was possible to change that but I loved it I mean there were you couldn't get a guitar loud enough as far as so so it was it was when I figured it out it was it was like yes do you think that that past training helped support the voice that you were on that's a mature reason I can sing I'm 57 now and it's the reason that I can sing I have more power today than I ever had and my voice is people I mean this is what they say they tell me that it's stronger and fuller and richer than it ever was which should happen because if you're trained that's what happens as you get I mean you're when you're singing classical music you're reaching your peak in your 40s and in your 50s that's what happens sorry so it was truly a gift to be able to to know all that and say you know I saved it I didn't smoke I didn't drink I didn't do any of those things because it wasn't allowed you know my ID I hadn't my voice teacher my choir teacher Georgia rule she rolled with an iron fist and there was there was no swimming if it was below 70 degrees outside yeah mm-hmm she was that she was just the best once fame took hold it happened very quickly for you it once it started going that ride was going fast in hindsight ever wish it had built slower no I mean it was very exciting and um you know you prepare your entire life for that moment it's what happens after that you're not ready for you have a lifetime to get ready for that first thing you know and then it accelerates and you're just you're running after it for a really long time but I wouldn't change it because it was very exciting and you know it really lent itself it helped me to toughen up because I really was just from a small town I was a nice girl you know and they were ready to chew me up and spit me out and you know in defense it I used to call it the gauntlet because every single day every single day was some new thing it was completely uncharted waters there was no handbook it wasn't like I mean it's not that women didn't go before me of course they did that's ridiculous to say that they didn't but not in the same way I had to go in this genre of music we're only Janis Joplin went before and Grace Slick but you know it wasn't exactly the same thing this was gonna get wider that was a narrow group in a narrow genre this was now gonna be a rock and roll thing that was gonna spread out into a pop market and it was gonna get much bigger than yeah so there was no one to like you know mentor or me or anything like that and literally every day I had to make it up as I went along but it was good because it really made me hard and strong and really tough yeah cuz they talked about those other artists and yes they had recognition but you also had MTV coming along the south that's what I'm saying the word it's just they were monsters they I mean I wasn't interested in doing what they were doing I really wanted to do what the men were doing that's what I wanted I didn't want it to always have that I wanted the label to go way I didn't want to say wow you rock great for a girl yeah you know what I mean this is a band this is it that's I forget the gender thing that's what I was going for and what I meant when I said is that it was gonna about to get bigger and wider was because they were wonderful women they did amazing work especially it's like the person who invents electricity now computers are great but the guy who made it up wins okay so they win because they made it up but I got to be the next thing and make up that section yeah and an MTV changed everything you know you had a now it wasn't about like just singing good and you know being live and doing all this kind of stuff now you had to like do great on video and you how to do all this now it was magazines and now I I dread the thought might both my children both of our daughters want to be musicians and I the idea of what they had to do now I noted it like be good is like I'm so not there okay I have to ask when you say videos love is a battlefield an iconic video so many true or false you really weren't comfortable with the dancing it are you out of your mind I'm so uncoordinated now this to 16 hours of rehearsal eight hours each day and I was crippled I they said we're gonna have to bring a guy and they had they brought in like a Mis masseur masseuse whatever he's called from um the ballet he came in and he was working I mean my toenails were hurting I was just you know I can like get up there and do my little thing but you know this was like ridiculous stuff and you know all these dancers they do this all day all night and I could do one thing at a time I could dance when they said to dance but when I had a lip sync and dance together no this is not working so this took a really long time when you see that video or any other videos from that period what do you think what do you feel when you see them back um I join them yes it makes me laugh I love them because they're hilarious I mean it's just it's just hilarious and I love it because it captures the era right to a tee you know like there forever if anybody has any questions about what it was like look at that cuz that's exactly what it was like and it's just really fun it's like looking at you know uh pictures from kindergarten you know you love them they're cute you just laugh because it's it's absolutely ridiculous and poor spider you know the rest of the guys they were absolutely opposed to this because you know this was like a new thing too you know it's okay for Michael Jackson it it is kind of sub button like not us you know and I remember we were doing you better in the the juror and that was just a live performance and they were flipping out we're not doing this you know and you know they're going crazy and we don't want our songs on a video we want people to interpret them themselves you know and I because I had no I wasn't tied to this like thing that they were all tied to I was like it's just like a character let's do it you know there's a kind of thing they wanted to kill me but I remember that part of me still was not into that play-acting thing with your songs you know and that the guy turn on this big win fan during um you better run he said okay now just go and I remember looking at him going I don't go like this and that's that face is on you they're filming it now I'm so pissed I'm just like you know the whole time so it was weird but um after we did shadows of the night historical costumes were banned for bad they drew the line we're done now that's why they're not in battle when you talk about the different sounds of your time - I think that's one thing that I really enjoy about your catalogue of work is the variety of sounds it's not just I think a lot of people think oh it was hard rock at the time right there's such a variety that's spider that's all him because he's just he's really the visionary I mean you know I write the songs - and I do all that kind of stuff but he's the one who who pushes to go further than I'm willing to go I'm happy I'm good you know he's like no no no you know I'm always like come on back I'm always trying to reel him in but it's really good because he really pushes all of us to do that kind of stuff that's that's him all the time he's the one battlefield was like a ballad yeah you know it was just like on a guitar you be go big amazed and he just you know he'd start playing with that drum machine and actually the the afternoon that we were gonna record it he didn't tell us he I knew what the song sounded like cuz I had the the demo from Holly and Mike but the rest of the band had never heard it and he set us up in the parking lot of the studio where we were playing to rehearse and then he played the drum loop and just said play anything that comes into your head they're like we had no idea what it wasn't oh there was nothing and that's how the whole thing got the whole the bed of the song was built because they had no idea what the chords what they've never heard the song so he got all the bed of it going and then we went inside and he played the chords so that they could hear what it was so I mean he would do such crazy stuff like that all the time before we run out of time - you married him pretty early on in the career yes so you guys have done all of your work pretty much together married children people say you should never do that how do you make it work well it's the only way we know I'm not so sure that people should do that it's just that it works for us that's how we met it's the only thing we know and it works I sometimes I think we're actually the same person split in two do so it actually works really well but he's really easy he's really nice and I'm the one who's like a lunatic and he isn't so that big gang thing is like it's perfect you know and he's just he's like he's a great father he's a good man and musically we're just you know where's one person together so so what direction are you going now musically what can we expect I don't know you know he's he's way more interested in continuing than me you know I love singing I love it but I you know we've done this for a really long time and I like to burn it up and then be done you know what I mean he likes to keep going and I just want to like do it to death and be finished you know so I'm really interested where I'm about to write an autobiography and I'm really interested in writing books now and I want to do that and novels things like that um I don't know you know I'd like to fan out a little bit performance I've performed to deaf you know what I mean I don't think that I could ever stop singing but he'll come up with something though to make it interesting for me you know cuz I just I get bored I just get ok I've sung how many more times can you sing heartbreaker I probably sing it for the rest of my days but there's something that you can't you know um I don't know but he will come up with something because he knows he's always thinking that's his job his job is just you know he's not the foot like this that's not what he does he's he's supposed to be over here making a mess you know my job is to like gather it all together and and make it so humans can understand it yeah and would you be bothered if he came in and said listen I've got a great project for the girls no I tell them every day okay I've had enough how about you carry the torch what do you say well we are thankful for all the torch carrying you've done the great music all the wonderful years thank you so much and we're thrilled to have you here thank you Pat Benatar to order a DVD of this episode including a bonus interview with Neil Spyder Geraldo please visit Houston pbs.org

Channel: HoustonPBS

Views: 38,657

Rating: 4.8800001 out of 5

Keywords: KUHT, HoustonPBS, InnerVIEWS, with, Ernie, Manouse, Pat, Benatar, Neil, 'Spider', Giraldo, Music, Musician, Singer, Songwriter, Invincible, Love, is, Battlefield, We, Belong, Hit, Me, With, Your, Best, Shot, Hell, Is, For, Children, The, Legend, of, Billie, Jean, 1980's, MTV

Id: FrnDOPFOhzI

Length: 26min 49sec (1609 seconds)

Published: Tue Oct 06 2009