Richard Dawkins on Islam, Jews, science and the burka - BBC Newsnight

Dawkins is famous as the author of The Selfish Gene the blind watchmaker and many other popular science books going back decades but he's a controversial figure out and about on Twitter these days railing against fundamentalist religious beliefs and non fundamentalist beliefs in ways that many have found objectionable he has his own foundations for reason and science one here one in the u.s. designed to try and remove the influence of religion from education and public life with religion community relations and tolerance much in the news at the moment we thought we'd get his take in the wake of the Charlie Hebdo attacks we were in the midst of a big debate really are we about the relationship between religious fundamentalists and the rest of society it was interesting that the former Archbishop of Canterbury on Newsnight last week said the debate isn't really won between Christians and Muslims it's more between the secular society and Muslims which I thought was an interesting observation but what do you think the rules of the game should be between a modern liberal democracy between these different groups you have very very different yes I mean I think that's oh that's a very profoundly important question I think the rules of the game are that you should be allowed to believe anything you like and of course that's for that's right but that you shouldn't impose your beliefs on other people and so any creed that thinks it has the right to say not only do we believe this but you've got to believe it too or else I mean that is a very very serious violation of everything that democracy stands for so let's take some examples could burqa bans they have a burqa ban in France you wouldn't be in favor of that I know I I'm not in favor of a burka ban it seems to me to be a violation of individual liberty so it mean when I see a woman in a fall in a full burqa with just justice lit by feel personally offended but it's part of it's an important part of what I believe that what I feel personally is irrelevant it doesn't matter what I feel nobody else should abide by what I feel and that applies of course on the other side as well what about religious schools so a community sets up a school maybe pays for it itself that doesn't subscribe to your views of Education that you've set out today and now is that a freedom of speech thing for them to be able to teach what they want or not that's very difficult because there there were trespassing on the the tussle between the freedom of speech of parents to impose their views on children and the freedom of children to be educated without having erroneous views and we now know that in some cases it definitely is erroneous this is not a matter of opinion imposed upon them but you're not against teaching history and things like that oh heavens no no attractive her very keen on teaching history teaching literature very keen on teaching religion as a matter of fact I mean teaching about religion not indoctrinating in any particular religion because that good right against the spirit or critical thinking it's a tricky one though isn't it because you can't build a society on the basis that you know you're right and you know that other people are wrong can you because the liberal society is we don't have to make that decision no that's your I decide yes you think and you decide what you think but you are really saying that they have to teach children have to be taught in your Creed well no no at night that there is a difference I mean let me use the example you've just used of the the but the burka ban that's a matter of opinion and they're the society it seems to me has no right to impose on other people evolution is not a matter of opinion it's a matter of fact the evidence is as overwhelming as in the case of oh that the Earth orbits the Sun that's not up for dispute you are in the camber as really I probably associated as being one of the most and I think the disparaging phrases militant atheists in the property um what do you think of that phrase what do you think of that accusation and do you if you like revel in that place or do you hate it when people try and if you like put you in the same category as fanatics on other sides of the religious well fanatics religious fanatics are apt to take the law into their own hands on occasion out there and actually threaten people actually use physical violence but you choose to go onto Twitter it's not a scientific a venue for scientific debate you choose to go on Twitter just to take one example a tweet in which you drew a very invidious comparison between the number of Nobel Prizes won by people from Trinity College Cambridge and the entire Muslim population of the world Trinity code College Cambridge comes out on top on that of that comparison now not disputing the factual basis of it why make such an invidious comparison why raise that why raise the issue what is it what's the point of of drawing attention it is a fact that in the Dark Ages and Middle Ages the Islamic world was a beacon of scientific progress and enlightenment and something has gone wrong I had dinner with the then Chief Rabbi Jonathan Sacks a few months ago and learned there the astonishing fact that between 20 and 25 percent of all scientific Nobel Prizes have been won by Jews and I thought that was a stunning fact it really is I mean when you think of the total population of Jews in the world is is tiny compared to really any other of the major major religions so I I wanted to make this point that Islam has stagnated in the scientific field since them since the Middle Ages and the best comparison to make would have been with Jews and then I thought oh no I can't do that because that may really have upset people because of Palestine and I'm very sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinian people in Israel so at the last minute I crossed out Jews and stuck in Trinity College Cambridge but I can think of much more gentlemanly ways of making the intellectual point that Islam has not being a great story country it's just a fact whether or not it upsets people is less important to me than the dramatic nature of the fad which ought to be looked at somebody ought to be saying why but you would agree that you pick an argument with people of religion or religions don't make an argument suggest your way to say thing with the Sun pointed about that religion or those groups of people it's a good point that the best way to convert people is not necessarily to tell them their ideas and I have occasionally seemed guilty of that for example I once wrote in The New York Times that anyone who doesn't believe in evolution is either ignorant stupid or insane now that sounds like an extreme point of view it's actually a factual point of view because the word ignorant is not a disparaging word I make the rent of all sorts of things and so are you I'm sure and we would be quite happy to own up to being ignorant of many things ignorant of music or ignorant of art or what even were to baseball whatever it might be I think a lot of moderate religious people are very turned off by your by your disco well some may be and that's that's a political that may be my political error there are technical error in terms because your job you see your role is trying to convert the world to your point of view I think I mean no I see I see my role as crying to try to persuade people to think for themselves and look at evidence that's I mean if they come round to my point of view as a result of looking at evidence then so much the better have you ever been wrong about anything important oh yeah give me for that what well I'd have to go into sort of rather recondite scientific matters but I've I've been wrong on scientific questions and have said so scientists actually rather like being wrong it's it's it's unlike politicians they get a sort of kudos from from admitting that they're wrong because that's how science proceeds Richard Dawkins thank you thank you very much

Channel: BBC Newsnight

Views: 2,833,468

Rating: 4.6012559 out of 5

Keywords: Newsnight, BBC, paxman, Jeremy, Paxman, Richard Dawkins (Academic), Jewish People (Ethnicity), science, religion, charlie hebdo, Palestine (Region), burqa, evan davis, the god delusion, book, controversial, atheist, atheism, dawkins, interview, richard dawkins quotes, god delusion, richard dawkins books

Id: YAV_0s1c2V4

Length: 8min 39sec (519 seconds)

Published: Wed Feb 18 2015

Reddit Comments

[u/thesunmustdie]

Listening to Dawkins is like listening to the silvery tones of reason itself.

[u/Achilles-Opinion]

Wow, yet again, an example of the low quality of BBC reporters/interviewers. I think Dawkins did well considering how stupid some of the questions were.