Not Shutting Up: Jerry Saltz in Conversation

yeah hello now is that the camera we should see them so without further ado and now I give a completely unnecessary introduction to Jerry Saltz Jerry's career as a narcotic is stretched over three decades he's been a senior our critic at New York magazine since 2007 prior to that he was senior art critic at the Village Voice he has been a contributor to magazines ranging from fries to parkette to art in America and before winning the Pulitzer Prize for criticism this year he was twice a finalist in 2001 and 2006 he's the recipient of the 2007 Frank Jewett martha award for art criticism from the College Art Association he won the National Magazine Award for columns and commentary in 2000 in 2015 and was a finalist for the same award in 2011 and at last count which was at 324 p.m. this afternoon you had 280 thousand followers on Instagram boom I thought it was more well known a half-a-million on Twitter ah and 88,000 684 precisely on Facebook and we're all to have you thank you thank you and follow me for God's sake tell us about the Pulitzer how did you how did you well I'm just meeting Morgan nice to meet you I've heard a lot about you and I I'm I actually thought I was walking into a very small boardroom with him to talk to like the real high mucky-mucks of Sotheby's and we're gonna yell at me and and whatever so I'm just being real to see all of you here I'm really grateful that you would come out for an art critic what's wrong with you I was sitting at my I my wife Roberta Smith who's the art critic one of the art critics for the New York Times who I think is the greatest art critic writing today honestly I'm not just saying that I've instagrammed that I've tweeted it many many times the last time I was a finalist for the Pulitzer I was I had actually given up and I actually wrote at some point a few years back white men pretty much got all of them for the last 47 years on and off and as much as it hurts I wrote something like that's it it's over you so it's just give them to other people and I suggested Roberta and so I live with Roberta Smith my wife we rent a house around does anybody know where Kent Connecticut is it's up in the northwest corner of Connecticut we rented year round and we have no life you need to know if you're gonna be an art critic no life so we were doing Morgan what we always do we were sitting there at our desks I was looking at her over my screen she was looking out the win they're cows outside and we're in our totally boring life no life just this right and I got an email on my machine at 307 that went pulitzer from my editor and i wrote back congratulations because my editor is a guy named David Wallace wells who wrote the best story I've ever read it was a cover story on climate change for New York magazine has set all sorts of records for readers then from where I was seated I kept seeing all these in-house New York Magazine emails who said Pulitzer Pulitzer Pulitzer they were emailing to each other and I thought that damn David he did it good for him and then Roberta got a phone call three minutes later from the New York Times she put down the phone and she said they want to talk to you and I said put down the phone we have to freak out and get happy and hug and stuff like that that's how I found I was a good way to find out you must be very popular at the magazine it's the first point it's New York magazine's first Pulitzer I think it shatters something of the ceiling where magazines haven't been eligible until very recently because there's not going to be many more newspapers so we have to figure out how to keep recognizing writers and of course the first years they were giving them just to The New Yorker because it's cool they have two ads in a week and I love it of course I love it so I was thrilled that our magazine got one and I'm glad it was me and right before we went to bed we googled it we both looked at each other on the pillow and what is there any money with this ten thousand ten thousand I checked it's 15 right boom so it's all good and for the critics in this room you know that's like selling a painting for like a half a million bucks like boom and my wife already spent fifteen hundred dollars so I don't know thank you for asking me a softball there are many more don't worry um you didn't set out to be a critic one of the articles the Pulitzer jury commanded you for was recounting your life as a failed artist and I wondered whether so can you tell us what led brought you from being a failed artist to being it I have no degrees so is huge losers as you are you know like you woke up this morning going loser loser bigger okay I can beat you probably okay I was a long-distance truck driver till I was 41 probably the only Jewish one mind you because I am Jewish that these were not 18 wheelers I don't think we're allowed to drive those they were it was a 10 wheeler which is a lot for a Jew and I was doing this I wanted to be an artist I wanted to be in the art world in the worst way I was making art that's too long of a story to go through but many of you in this room who are not artists I would raise your hand if you started as an artist look around look around at your fellow demon speakers jibon spoke to Christine what's your name meanness demon spoke to een s you raised your hand over ear what's your name Amanda listened to the demons behold they tell you what they tell me I'm now 67 and it never changes never changes this morning before I got up to work it's like yeah you don't really know what you're doing right you don't have anything new to say you didn't go to the right school you can't schmooze you don't have enough money to really hang out in this world you don't even have time to do it your ankles are too fat you know my hair is no good and you know that's what all of us here all day and I would say get used to it punks get used to it it's not gonna stop it might get easier and then harder harder then easier but it doesn't stop that voice in your head will not go away the voice of my head spoke to me but the same messages you can't draw you don't know how to paint you didn't go to the right school whatever it is right you said you didn't you felt you didn't have the character to be I mean it wasn't some look like it wasn't sort of technical or technical failings it was that something about your character you just felt was was was flawed to be an artist so what is it about being a critic you've got the courage to be a critic but no no I like my character I'm not sure what it is but none of us are sure what we are right I surprise myself every day and online I really surprise myself who the hell is that guy what's he on about but what I meant when I wrote that I quit being an artist and in retrospect it was only later when I quit I thought I was a genius and that I was a great artist but I had given in to Satan basically but it was only much later that I realized that I didn't have the character meaning I'm looking at a kid there one guy in a hoodie his name is Jonathan Gillette how old are you now Jonathan 38 I met you when you were like 23 or something he was a skid at the Art Institute of Chicago I looked at his work I loved his work but more than that I never told you this I believed he had the character to be an artist and what I mean by that Morgan and Jonathan is that you have the ability the possibility of solving the problems that are eventually going to present themselves in your work that I could see or my own work then you have the character to do that without getting too defensive too delusional - ish you know male painter ish you know what I mean and I didn't have the character and I also didn't have the character to be alone enough I liked going to galleries and I liked being out what does it take to be Chrissy well character well you never get out much that's the irony right what does it take to be a critic you really want you're an art lover first of all above all else you love art I think about art all I talk about is art I'm very boring when I go to a dinner and I never ever go I haven't gone to a sit-down dinner since 1998 because I'm very boring what I would do is sit down next to you and I would say what shows have you seen it's a killer what it's a killer it's a killer and and and if he said well I haven't been around the shows then I sit like this for two hours I don't want to just talk about bad Trump and I'm not talking about movies anymore and so critics it takes you have to be an art lover you have to really believe in artists I believe you must make an enemy of cynicism cynicism if any of you ever met Jeff Koons yeah you've met him do you know tell the truth doesn't Jeff believe what he's doing who else is mad him and wants to confirm the horrendous truth you over there say it out loud even Jeff Koons believes what he's doing nobody wakes up in the morning accept a certain president it says I'm gonna really pull the wool over everybody's eyes I'm gonna fake you out he believes in what he's doing all artists really believing what they're doing and I want you to believe that when you're in crappy shows that this crappy artist may be unoriginal derivative they may be repetitious they may not have any technique that you can see that's original but they really mean what they're doing so I think a critic needs to be open to everything and not have a theory about what you're going to like may I keep talking or do you want to ask I'm gonna try and jump in okay no I'll shut up there's a lot to say it's fine it's cool how did you start we you got a job doing you didn't launch yourself into a full-time job with a magazine did you get a few gigs while you drive the truck no writing in your cab while I was driving a truck I was burning with the envy I'm dying from envy like you and that would be the first thing I would tell all of you before the night is over make an enemy of envy it will eat you alive because your eyes are always turned out never at yourself your characters not being tested rather you're saying that oh she has this he has that they have that I want this they have a better apartment I was burning I couldn't walk around Manhattan for without hating every apartment I looked at for years on end it was a nightmare anyway so and this is all true and I was bitter about not being an artist I gave up but I'm the genius and this bad artist is still showing and and she's showing and he is so in the truck I started reading thinking well what would be easy if I can't be an artist what would be easy and I thought I bet being a critic would be easy now how many of you in this room have ever tried to write the worst thing in the world it's the worst art the worst you rather do anything on the earth until it's going then it's as great as all the other creative acts but so anyway I started to read this thing called art form and I didn't understand a goddamn word of it I was going nuts this is in the 1980s and I'm reading it it's going to Lake commodified object of the simulacra finds a neo-marxist placation of and I'm going right on man right on but secretly not understanding any of it to make a long story short like you I hit a bottom and I realized that no matter how afraid I was no matter how intimidated poor uneducated stupid afraid afraid of being rejected no matter how afraid I was being rejected would be better than what I'm doing now and I started writing I started writing terribly until the thing that is sent from Hell by heaven but via heaven which is something we call deadlines a deadline snuck up on me and out of nowhere I wrote what I thought and if for the first time in my life it felt good instead of trying to be smart a third piece of advice for you give up your attachment to being smart please don't rule out any dumb idea there's no idea dumb enough for you to rule out think about Jasper Johns waking up going I dreamt I painted the American flag he did that so I started writing long story short you know making no money living crapoly you know and then I started writing and deadlines keep you honest and editors make you good and that's why a lot of blog writing is just it's great it's fun watching people go batshit but a lot of it's just like out of control and you want to go this should be about 100 the length and the other advice I have for the critics if I may would you mention the artist's name in the first or second goddamn sentence you don't have to give an X Oh goddamn Jesus on the loose or Derrida or Baudrillard you can make your idiot points later get to the art and I started writing you right from New York Magazine now and it's got a very young readership as I realize just how old ooh 44 going on 60 I think you're 44 I had just started writing when I was 41 your big baby babies you can do this it's so easy I can't even tell you how easy it is but you feed the secret you've got the voice for a right young readership I see that I mean you contributed recently to their STONER canon I couldn't isolate exactly you had contributed to this panel but you speak you speak the language of the young I do yeah I think I don't understand art anymore honestly when I go around to galleries I think there's been a kind of a shift that it's giving me a problem and that would be namely did you get to see one of my favorite museums the new museum has a show they do once every three years this one is called the triennial and they show artists under 35 yay I want us all to know that language the same way I want you to know the language of artists over 35,000 years old and I am really not kidding about that if you don't know about your art from 25000 BC get the out of my life that's art that's contemporary art dopes anyway I find that too much of the art we look at in your dumb biennials which are these big circuses they're long labels on the wall and just to give you an example I was in a gallery not long ago and there was pictures of clouds just the clouds and I looked at the dealer and I never liked it when the dealers talk to me I love when they say hi talk to me at the desk they're friendly but I really can't stand it a few guys are gonna work in galleries or anywhere don't do your sales pitch on your Pierce it erases me it hurts me it makes me sick it makes me hate myself and it makes me hate you a lot and one of them started doing her sales pitch on me and I said well those are nice pictures of clouds if she said oh no those aren't clouds I said what are they and she said the artist went to Ferguson Missouri and took pictures of clouds and I I lost it I said those are not about Ferguson Missouri those are just clubs and she said well she looked around said that's probably true but look I believe in theory we wouldn't have gay liberation women's liberation black liberation Jewish anything without thinking this through I get that so I'm not anti reading an T theory and D writing for artists or anti caring but I am saying job one for the artists embed thought in material Duchamp did when he made the dumb with the called the urinal you're my fountain say the Sotheby's kids fountain which means that's water giving back not water going in but whatever you even your mom and dad would look at that and go what the hell is that honey right that's the thought the thought about fountain is what category is this do you see that thought that he embedded in there that's not easy Koons can do it occasionally embed thought and material without touching it Ruben's was able to do it Tintoretto not so much you could always see him in there like that anyway I'm all over the place and I apologize let me ask you don't like if you didn't show yeah that's what we were that's it it's too much on the label and not in the work is all I'm saying that's all and I want us to get this evened out a little bit more go on so what is how would you define your taste what do you like okay this is a really good question how do we define our taste I don't know I really don't know until I know it's the way I thought this was an outfit about an hour and a half ago I didn't know I thought this was an outfit you think I haven't worn this shirt my wife bought it for me but I I did think it was an outfit and that was my taste right then you have to keep your taste wide open always forever forever do not deny your taste anything if you like sewing it's sewing better be part of your taste you still not taste it well I don't know I write about what I like and what I don't like every single week I'm an open book we surely you should know I mean you know what you like and you know what you don't like your job as a critic perhaps is to put that aside I don't know beforehand though I never know beforehand like - tell me what you like I could tell you what I do but it's too easy I like campaigning a hell of a lot I don't think mammals have ever been rendered better in the history of our species I like I just was really thrilled to see those drawings those 90 88 drawings of site wombly at Larry Gagosian who we all complain about but thank God the show was God it was great and it was free and it would have taken MoMA six years to put it together and they would have it up by ignoring oh so I Trombley fell off at the end so we did not include his walk and and I'm saying just show us the work we'll decide you ever seen a ends or show they all stop in exactly 1900 because the idea is answer was no good after that all the academics say Picasso after Hugh BISM except for Guernica please get out of here every review they were I we don't know what we're gonna like until we're confronted with it the horror the horror of liking something imagine Philip Guston this guy that was making pretty like Monet feels and like he's the first generation abstract expressionist he gets to be drunk and it's all good right and he wakes up one day and he wants to paint people in clueless Klan hats with driving around smoking cigars and you know doing the horror that but he followed his taste and I want you to follow your taste what happens of you'd like bad stuff you better be able to try to make a case for it what do you like so I say that and I get yelled at but we all like all kinds of everything we like everything from our secret pornographic tastes of like MCA she looks at me and MC escher I was going to say you have better ideas or even that moment you have with Norman Rockwell or at the moment you cannot have with certain artists that you wish you could have the moment with who's that artist with you for many decades for me many and it hurts me to say it it was Rembrandt and over and over you there's a few people nodding I would walk past them ago they're kind of brown they're kind of brown and it took of all stupid things the Rembrandt that's right here on the corner at the Frick a portrait and then I went in and got lost I got lost it took me too long on Cezanne and now Cezanne is a towering epic to me and it has some of them let me can bring the conversation right down am I really ruining it from Rembrandt says I'm okay I talk about social media what's the point I don't know what the point is I know this that one of the secrets of pleasure is an extraordinarily important form of knowledge it's very frowned upon in the West right it's not good to be doing things you love to do or stuff I know that I am so alone so much of the time that how social media started for me with some kid like you giving me this thing on my phone going you're on Facebook and I went what is the Facebook and one day I wrote instead of writing I'm tired today my shoes don't fit very well you know how we all used to first use Facebook when your you kids were in like grammar school I don't you want to know I wrote these words done this is the irony because I just saw her show today I wrote the recent work of Marlene Duma it's really only photographic realism you know smeared and then I made something critical and within an hour ten thousand people had torn me a new one and within one second I knew what the point was you know what the point was let me tell you what the point was and I'm really not kidding about this and you're in it I know I'm a blabbermouth and I'm alone a lot okay I came into an art world that was shaped like a pyramid and so we pretend it still is but that game has been up for a long time I'm telling you that game is over I know the top of the pyramid they're like me okay of the one with critics of the one critic speaking to the many do you see that in one second on Facebook I understood suddenly that instead of the one speaking to the many you could have the many speaking to one another if you only made two rules to rules I realized it in a second I said to everyone I will block you if you yell at anyone else here you can scream at me and call me names that's the second rule you better have elephant skin if you don't have elephant skin really frankly get out of the art world not everybody it's gonna like what you do you don't even like what you do quarter at the time you go to Chelsea you only like 15% of the shows max max it's not that's the point to communicate and not be alone and have seconds like three or four seconds on the end of pleasure but it's no communication is it I mean there's a lot of barking and shouting well you've been on my thing only I get barked and shouted that but that doesn't make it a day donation I mean you know there's conversations yeah there were lots and lots and lots of conversations on Facebook to the gut boring because it got conservative and so many people my age what they suspended you access that's right I've been kicked off of all three and you'll be shocked and what I got kicked off for well Kenny Schachter said that Kenny Schachter did a profile he's my good friend I know this is what your free yell at each other right he said that you were posting abouts private parts naked ancient eight nature no naked ancient greek girls and boys animals being administered sex from every entry point imaginable tits penises balls vaginas arses in every shape and form let's not forget guerrilla sex too and this is just one month recap of Jerry salty that's not what got me kicked off of Facebook you want to know what got me kicked off Facebook then I'll address that a great one of the greatest sculptures made in the late 20th century by a guy named Charles Ray called American romance do you know what that is describe it please it's for people naked a father mother sister brother all the same size all about the same height and it never occurred to me because we're so up in the art world that they that was full frontal nudity and that was children even though I took the picture at MoMA it never to me as for Kenny's explanation of what I was posting back then truth all of those are masterpieces yes I posted a bat penis from 17th century Ottoman illustration that is quite extraordinary that has never been seen and has now only be it's not just the penis what he missed was a bat is this long in a watercolor when was the latter than that guy Walton Ford who's who can make a great bat the other things were like 12th century 11th century art that was just being rediscovered by digital media so I thought the art world was open but it turns out art world you're very conservative you missed masterpieces because there was like somebody giving somebody else an enema you don't think those people were alive you don't think they wanted to portray that they did you're not posting that much material I mean you're posting all kinds of things these days not sometimes about art and sometimes about other things but there is less of that did you did you feel you made a mistake yeah first I fought the art world I fought the law and the law won I did I implored the art world love this work this is extraordinarily important work no one's ever seen this these Greek paintings that now they're finally photographing but that wasn't the envelope that was that was Facebook that was making you know about no that's what I and I wrote about this no Facebook wrote to me and said you have not violated Facebook community standards but we are getting endless letters from your followers our world that your taste is offensive and I fought it I fought it I thought and then I you know what I thought I accept you our world I love you I don't have another family I hate family sorry stop talking to your parents so much how often do you talk to your parents oh Jesus I want it down to it twice a month you've got to individuate you kids you really they're loving you to death granda truth Peter you don't feel that that material was it is provocative you you didn't say now you said that some people believed it was sexist misogynistic or abusive and racist right I'm homophobic every but you don't think it was the art world he felt that was too conservative well Facebook was fine with it and they did not kick me off for that right and nor did Twitter nor did Instagram it was only for that one mistake I made without thinking for Charles Ray and I accept that I don't want naked kids pictured on the Internet it just I thought it was a sculpture so I know this sounds like I'm being disingenuous but really I do love that work okay and it wasn't the right time for me a white male to be posting that work and it was the wrong delivery mechanism what was the wrong time because my time is over our time is over time's up I got more time than you mmm time's up now time is up and we all know liberal space is changing liberal space needed to change the normal space not changing Gary I'm gonna keep you on topic okay time sorry there isn't there is an issue about the there is an issue about tone and the mood in the country and the mood in the country is poisonous but it's not about the mood in the country it's about the it's about the attitudes or the responses of people who did feel that that work that material was offensive and I accepted their judgement I did I stopped okay I'm fine with the - I love the art world I'm not going to violate them ever they're my first family it was a when we know we were talking about the Pulitzer and he was saying how you know you commented on the fact that your wife had not won well it's not enough women had won in that category I wrote that on Instagram that only won one Emily Jan our who you don't know yeah you said as you said on 20 he said to name only one my wife the New York Times critic I believe is the best our weekly our critical life that was after I got it and wait to you wait you should have been there on the phone call that I got from the Pulitzer but we can all agree with those sentiments but at the same time I think these were women out there who felt that in the light of the in the light of the controversy over what you were posting that that wasn't good enough and yeah you it was it rankled that that you won I want to quote Margaret Kerrigan in in the observer owned by a person that blocked me on instagram name what Donald annoyed kerchner what what Zevon is name Ivanka's husband Jared Kushner blocked me which I'm very proud about it's and so did Donald Trump jr. and I'm very thrilled about this I'm going for the big hoon but ever since that other guy that the Kushner guy blocked me they but they've always been coming at me but so here that with that a tiny bit of understanding but I do agree with what she's writing go ahead well she said in the time when American politics has been profaned by the purely personal whims of one might want one white man the celebration of another doing the same in the arts raises some red flags for me and I heard her and I even wrote I I see the red flag juicy and the whole second part of her article was fantastic because it was all about her Roberta Smith should get it and the Guardian wrote an article saying they love me but they thought that Roberta should get one and I see both points I really get it I you guilty you another piece the planets the jury commanded was a her article about Balthus is to raise dreaming which the met the met stood by their decision to exhibit despite the controversy I wondered if that you know your attitude to that was that it it should stay on the wall regardless of the offense it might cause I wondered whether you felt that you were you were in the same camp you were I did it against you carry on what you if you were causing offense it was it was the people who's the father it was the problem for the people who offended but it was a problem you know what happened at the met they wanted the Baltar's painting down this does come up every about every fifteen twenty years this has been happening and I accept that that is a frickin creepy painting the guy's a freaking creepy painter let's not kid ourselves first of all I wrote that going in and I have no problem writing all the context stuff you want on the label only thing I said in my article something to the effect of if you start removing sexually offensive work or explicit work you're going to take out the entire Indian wing because Indian art has only animals having sexual people at 40 at a time Japanese art have you ever seen when they get going when printmaking they're out there fantastic right greek-roman that's got to go the Impressionists out Picasso forget it and probably not Matisse in a lot of cases when that okay Picasso just sold the other day for 105 million by the way I would have bought the 1905 Kandinsky I'm not a big Kandinsky guy but this is when he really was still anyway let me ask you obviously makes an impact with people it gets a lot of makes no impact any more criticism doesn't have impact I know you're disagree with it go on you have more impact on social media well that's allowed a platform than your regular columns they're the same to me there's no differentiation I did get kicked off one of those top 100 lists you know you get on these Power 100 List you hate them before you're on then you get on you go kind of cool I'm one ahead of Jasper Johns and then I got I know I was number 53 were used excuse me I think you did but here's what you wrote about me in the earlier days this was yummy it was beautiful because it was true though I'd fallen a few notches then fallen a few more and I was still going to parties pretending I didn't care if I was in them or not but people would go oh you're in you're one of the hundred most powerful I go oh really no and then the last time I was ever run they said but his antics on social media could get him like really disrespected and he would maybe disappear from all of this and I was gone so you were right I got kicked off drummed out voted off the island don't get on those goddamn lists do you do you feel sometimes feel I mean they're people obviously people are annoyed at you on social media or perhaps annoyed at you elsewhere does that ever do you ever are you ever greeted with that in the street or the guy yes yes I am often first of all I google my name once every couple of days you Google I Google myself and it hurts it does hurt but I have a belief that there's a grain of truth in every criticism that's leveled everyone in other words maybe not the person is right that I'm an right a lot of comments will begin you and then I will now write dear mr. or miss juju 69 I'm sorry you think I'm an but when I wrote that about Marlene Dumas work I was trying to say that what she did with the opaque projector and how she painted the image didn't transform the image enough from its original source and then inevitably they will calm down it does hurt to be criticized all the time but I do think there's a grain of truth to every bit of criticism and I'm always every time I read something I think two things and I want you to think this to one you could be right they could be right that something you've done is left an opening to make them misunderstand what you thought you were doing and two this is important for you all nobody can say anything worse to me about me then I could say about myself and I've said it twice three a hundred times today right you got a woman up man up grow a pair of whatever's don't be big damn baby stop calling your parents so much love you all but really this is not a popularity contest people this is life this is everything this is about trying to have a life lived in art which is better than the life lived out there let me tell you I've been out there it's hard tell us what it is like in a house with two critics how is that one of them is much smarter than the other one of them so is going god I wish I thought of that we'll ask a specific question well it's fun it's fun wooden and how does she fare and yeah that mean okay I'm gonna let I'll give short answers I apologize okay I'm just curious about how it works out you you are are you reviewing the similar shows do you talk about that before you write do you choose not to you swayed by her opinion and vice versa we talk about shows all the time we don't go to them together that often we tend to go together on Saturdays we go to a neighborhood or two and then split up and keep criss-crossing and then at 6 o'clock while you're all getting ready to go out for drinks or coffee or dinners we scuttle home and like go make something in the microwave and start writing no life we're not part of society you think we are it's really ecstatic to live with somebody that does what you do and we try not to write about the same shows Morgan but with museum shows it is inevitable and with more and more these big shows I don't know if she wrote on Twombly but had she I wouldn't have stopped I do try for any smaller artist to give to get out of the way and let them have Roberta that's I'm telling you secret that I've not said out loud before I always think this is a rite of passage for a young artist and I want to really let them hear from a real critic a great critic it's got you lots of I mean both of you a lot of respect in different ways but it hasn't made you rich I see you posted in April on Instagram for all those who suppose that our two full-time weekly art critics each employed by a major publication are doing okay financially each of us is almost a hundred and the combined earned income on our to savings accounts is twenty dollars and twenty four cents so not dismay you do you feel aggrieved no you don't know anything I think that nobody really gets in the art world for the money not even Jeff he'll go broke a few more times [Music] how's it it's got worse though hasn't it yes it is worse because last 20 to 30 years yes there is more pop and film coverage and that moves aside classical music coverage first art criticism later and and then you know poor souls like yourself are spoken by there didn't have to be less criticism work and it's your fault I'll tell you why there was never money and criticism never unless you're like Greenberg which is smart or even my friend Rob the late Robert Rosenblum you buy Jasper's work or he gives jasper gives you a painting and then 15 20 years later you sell it get a place in the Hamptons retire I'm fine with critics to do that but Roberta and I don't roll that way we just don't believe we should collect your work if I own your work I'm not writing about it but let me get to the bigger point there was never money in criticism there never will be so that means there's nothing to lose you're free and to many critics are not accepting the freedom I think that academia has scared the crap out of three generations of critics and made them do something deadly one afraid to have opinions - they write in a mandarin jargon that you really don't understand three well or they only write descriptive they will not put a judgement you don't like every Goa that you saw at the Prado you were in the greatest painting museum right in Spain at least and you walk past a few of the goiás so the blog's now do 15 best artworks I freeze I don't have a problem with covering freeze but I actually think you could do 15 artworks these seven were good these are and let me say one more word about negative criticism he's laughing at me I feel like I'm just trying to give okay being critical of art people is a way of showing art respect okay when you watch your favorite sports team you don't love every play you don't love every meal you have you don't love all the clothes and you're even in your stupid closet you can wake up every day and go I can't even go out tonight right I got nothing I feel pretty okay about this but living with the critic is great I just wish more critics would see their free their free blogs you could start your own art magazines online if you build it they will come I would have thought they had more freedom now because they are less read they have more freedom and they're being more like servants to the market the market doesn't have anything to do with their world no it doesn't but who has the power now if it's not critics and who would you like to see have less power well the popularity contests we're talking about over and over the same 55 white usually male or female artists I live through dstingle I love Christopher wool those are my guys III merge with them I love them right I wrote on them enough enough I'm sick of all the read discoveries and galleries it's become a niche market I want to see what your generations have to say now I want to see your bad art now who has the power you do you have so much more than you can possibly imagine if you would just own it what if I could do this don't you see it aren't i showing you by example if you just if you tell your own story Louise Bourgeois said your work will be interesting that's all you have to do don't lie don't kiss up don't try to play don't try to work at like Larry's you probably won't get a job there if you do I would be thrilled for you honest to god I think it's a great place to learn stay up late with your peers every night every night without date drummers so since Jerry's a dispensing advice why don't I open up the floor a little bit sorry would anybody like to ask any questions yeah okay I've got somebody to pass back the mic I'm sorry Morgan I do not apologize it's been it's been a while right it's all the rides are not over our Lancers briefly now don't where's the mic okay speak up did you all hear it is it not dangerous to write bad things don't they get upset it might they physically hurt you yes first of all when I write in here's one thing about being a critic if you're a critic in a big city you can afford to lose about 50 friends each week but it if your writing say in Baltimore then you don't you don't attack artists because you're a vampire click together and you must protect each other in your smaller cities in New York when I have a negative I have one right now it's out in public and the artist ignored me it hurt my feelings but you know what I thought well I hurt her feelings and she did her work I did mine one artist almost hit me I'm gonna grab me by the elbow I will tell you if I ever get really drunk not in the face one almost did hit me a boy almost hit me in the face he even was in like Iraq and I thought he's going to gatech me but one woman artist did yell at me she looked at me when you're destroying my market and then she said everybody knows you're fake and I did the worst kind of arguing you do with your mate when you don't know what to say to your mate I just went everybody knows you're a fake and I but I didn't get hit it's healthy to do it for the system because again we all know the deeper truth 85% of the shows out there you don't like what makes the art world so interesting is you're 85% is different than yours it's different than yours and in this beautiful overlap extraordinary things can happen anybody else what do you place to pass the microphone over to introduce yourself yeah I love no new er that was the girl when I said some of the woman when I said about porn - she went yes sorry I don't consider myself an artist anymore but what was your first name Alexandria is right you get the problem in a lot of schools which have become a sham not this Institute I hope in art schools is there only getting positive responses from their teachers especially if you're a woman or an artist of color or Asian you see the problem they're getting afraid to say oh your art is bad and when I've done it believe me any time I write negative about any of those categories you should see the names I'm called and it does hurt it hurts to be called a racist because if you defend yourself then you really sound terrible right so I'd say more critics should be doing it it's up to your generation there's no reason a fogey should still have this job honest to god why do I have this job let's pass it off next oh you had a question hey no you can't do it too part okay quick oh yes I have been wrong with the artist where I thought that a certain work wasn't good but it was or vice versa I'm having a hard time remembering right now but I've tried to support artists who I thought were really great in what I my motto is I will stick with you for three shows four shows five shows if you're a young artist and I'll keep saying I think you're great but after that you're kind of on your own if you can't you have to be able to convince one dealer to critics for collectors if you can't friggin convince seven people you're halfway decent it's not my problem but but I have been wrong many a time and I try to go back I once got pippilotta wrist very wrong let's let's speed like refine round the yeah who's got the mic yeah oh sorry yeah over here got one here then whatever so who storm hi what did she say what about what do you think about an autistic studies business fine whatever you have to study you study art is not a business business is not in art the art market is not art the stock market is not the economy you get it it's great to know things you could study locksmithing no really anything you know will make you twice as smart as 90% of our world we don't know anything Joseph Kossuth got to be our philosopher back in the 60s because no one had read philosophy at the time so you know it's like you want the job do it and by the way on activist art just because it's on the good subject does not make the art good and you better friggin start waking right you know I see you downtown okay and I see a lot of your faces in galleries and we're gonna be talking to each other for the next 15 years you'd be shocked at how many people from these rooms were you think oh my god I met Sotheby's let it end up here right uh-uh a lot of you end up in the art world a lot it's shocking and we have got to solve this problem that just because you're making good intervention to start about Beirut does not make your art good and no critic will say that and every time I do it you'll get there some of my questions good there's a mic speak up great thank you Alex yes yeah okay I'm out there and I'm looking at all of you I've probably looked at you have I ever liked anything of yours no have I ever liked any of your posts in this room you see how frigging weird is that did you see about 15 people you don't think I'm stupid and crazy this proves it I'm Morgan ask me what do you like I only know when I see it and I'm looking if I see you interacting with me I will go back and look at you I want to be seen we are dancing naked in public people let's be frank your parents are content to dance naked in private but there's something a little screwy about all of you you need to do this in public and so do I so I will look wherever art is I want to say very briefly Christianity is the only of the monotheistic religions that has only certain people must live aside from the rest of the culture and they can perform the magic rites of turning Christ's body into whatever it is food I don't know what you do but I love the story and no other religion do you have to have a specialist making the religious thing rabbis live with people they got businesses they got kids Iman's live with them Zoroastrians are like out there we have become too in cidery and it's gotten too narrow art is too defined it's always something that's at 53 inches at about right in the middle of a wall that hangs flat art you will find it if we call them outsider artists we have to call ourselves insider artists look everywhere take you to where your taste goes no matter how shitty your taste is that's not a couple more questions I love it I can go on I'm like Bruce Springsteen they made hello I will not leave - you leave I use the mic you have to there is people listening yeah art fairs can't live with them can't live without you no can't live with him can't kill them they're absolutely necessary they're absolutely impossible for me they're not great ways to see art because they drive me insane I'm not socially well-adjusted and I get nervous at them after the first hour I'm like does she like me no she hates me why am I here and I can't and also art fairs are now so expensive they cannot afford to take chances at a hundred grand booth or 40 grand booth plus 30 grand more that's $70,000 and you bring her work that costs only 10000 and yours it's only like 12 and I sell it out I've taken a gigantic loss in my gallery will close unless I am a trust fund person and God bless you don't hate the rich love the rich we need them they need us it's all good we are all one I don't have an answer to the art fairs but you guys are they're broken now and we got to fix this and they will be fixed like America is broken art fairs are broken okay this is going to change it's just how and when we don't know just take the ball in your own hands you will fail fail again fail better two more questions some hundred more questions Elena what you post about any insider question let's get the last one from way over there okay yeah go ahead Megan hi student here hello future from the past how many articles can you write a week one or two that's good so your question is okay I'm gonna say a few mean things okay do you mind or will it hurt too much okay be gentle deadlines are a disaster I hate them I too hate them okay and I can only do so much just like you but if you're writing or article a week that's great if you can write to that is phenomenal these are people that write for most of the magazines they can write one a year it's pathetic it's like I want to go you needed that much time to never even write about the work you're doing just great what I would say stay up late every night meet other artists I don't care if you're not social you have to do it I'm agoraphobic you wouldn't know it but I cannot go out I can only be in groups of people that's why I'm so eager to be here too you all leave and then I'm totally alone and I won't see another person from stay up every night hang out put yourself out there show up grow a pair of whatever keep writing write your opinion and work work work work work work and take good care of your teeth last question you can stay and ask lares the I will not move here until you're done because this is the only now I have please and make it a question hi Jer hi what's your name hi Rachel great question Roberta and I see mainly shows in New York that is a truth and I don't fight it a lot of people yell at me online and in person Oh Jerry I you know I have a show in Brazil you should see it I've won an Oscar by Jean you should see this and I'm like yeah I should see it when I go to the Venice Biennale I go only for two or three nights that is how that is as long as I can get away on a weekly deadline my species is dying there might be a reason for it if there's no necessity for a weekly deadlines fine so I only see art in my city can you make it in other cities absolutely but they better be a City vampires must live and show and dance among other vampires a vampire dancing alone kind of a sad thing kind of freaky except for the photographers who they need to go to like Kentucky integral and we're all taking pictures of like the Hillary movement where were where were our people taking pictures of Trump and his supporters only the news did that we would not look at it we must look at our time we're obsessed with trying to impeach Trump okay well we probably won't was he guilty probably I'm old enough to know it takes too long to impeach him anyway he'll be gone by then the truth is we have not come to terms with the impossibility that we'd actually did elect him we will not face that he was the candidate of a major party and this is happening in countries all over the world right now babes nationalism is back religion is back maybe it's because modernity just didn't work out for people maybe it's only a blip the truth is probably the future is China Brazil Norway Canada and Russia am I forgetting a big country probably India will like administer it because as the polar ice cap melts who are the people that will be able to communicate Norway and those countries obviously it China will like build everything in Japan will take care of it and America maybe ends vampires are not beautiful but they make beautiful things we get a win do that cuz we've got to trump and vampires and I'm I don't know how we go this [Applause] and I will stay here if you want to ask me anything or you want to take a selfie with me if you post it online and I find it I'll come and show you some love

Channel: Sotheby's Institute of Art

Views: 14,511

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Id: lqk-7JtLINA

Length: 71min 25sec (4285 seconds)

Published: Fri May 11 2018