Nevernight Live Show!

there we are hello everyone welcome to my channel into the never Night Live scream my name is Bernie which you probably know because you're on my channel and this is the other folks would you like to introduce yourselves hi I'm Cindy from redwood Cindy and this is my first time reading never necking I'm cat from paperback dreams what Cindy said first time I'm Zack from Zack tries to read part-time booktuber a full-time fanboy and this was my first reread of never night and I also was rereading never night and didn't quite make it through so you know good times but I'm gonna try to be a good host today and ask these lonely folks what they think about this about this book so before we do that though we should probably talk a little bit about what the story is about so we usually in Cindy does this better than me but you know introducing yourself and saying a little bit about it so let's just do that um but without introducing ourselves because we already with that okay so never night is about a girl named Mia and she is an assassin that's not like other assassins so it's kind of like a 1-up like than not like other girls and in the book she goes to this like secret mountain school and learns how to kill people better than she already knew how to kill people and that's where we spend most of the story at the read Church which is what the school is called there are four contests poison sword fighting seduction and thievery and she has to win one of these competitions to become a great assassin and crazy things happen and betrayal and intrigue lots of death magic that's the end of the book which I most definitely remember the thief knows oh and flexy x would trick oh no the Pirates in bed yeah so I guess that was the time but before we get into like the spoiler be spoilers because it seems like there's a lot of people that thought this was actually gonna be tomorrow and didn't quite finish the book so let's like do a little bit of non spoilery talk for a bit and then we'll we'll let these two people know and we're gonna get into the spoiler en bits so let's just do some like overall impressions what did you guys think should we go with who finish it most recently okay one that tweaked it and you haven't technically didn't Jordan I need to know like how how much I should hold back yes go first Jordan oh well the last the first time I read it I had very mixed feelings because it's the writing is a lot it's slow paced off the top and very stylized and yeah there's some bold choices which I don't necessarily think we're great choices being you know the first couple chapters impossible to get through so difficult like juice level I don't want to continue reading this you know um Yost um so you know starts off very weak but I think as a progresses it gets better and better characters some good ones some cliche ones um and but the plots interesting in the world which I I'm a big world fan I love an in-depth world which is why I really liked it and was excited to read on because um you know in my hopes were that the characters would get better um but I I really liked the interesting unique dark fantasy world of the thing and as I'm reading it I would say that my thoughts are exactly the same thus far what did you end up rating it uh I don't remember I'm really bad at giving like star ratings I think to my memory probably be about a 3.5 but the second book which you know I read afterwards i frickin love because jay kristoff like kind of fixed all the things that i had trouble with in the first book the writing was a lot I think Clara and the decisions he made as far as the writing and the characters I think we're a lot better in the second book which is why I think maybe I'm looking at the first book with a little bit more of a rose tinted glasses kind of thing because I did enjoy the second book so much yeah because you have the context of like what happens in the second book so I'm assuming like a lot more stuff guest develops or like connected yeah and and I think because there's like the two timelines in the first book I think that was kind of just a cheap way to get exposition in but in the second book it all takes place we're stoked some timelines for the all takes place after the first book so you're kind of it's very intense and you're wondering both are very exciting and you're wondering how she gets from here to here you know so it's always keeping excitement up and the suspense has stopped so these things like that which I think we're like improved in the second book but were not so great in the first book with Cindy give me your thoughts I think I felt about this book the same way that I felt about the diviners in the sense where I could understand why other people liked it but it wasn't like my cup of year so I feel like I would probably rate it three stars but from a personal enjoyment level was probably less than that and I talked about this with Zach a little bit too and I think we talked about this on our last live show that I think like the tier of this book so far from what I see is like the world building and then the plot and then the characters and my personal preference when it comes to stories is characters and relationships plot and then world building so that's kind of feel like it was a Miss for me and I also it's I have I still don't know what to make of the writing style because on one hand I'm thinking like oh you know I really like the way that he describes her in things you can tell that you know that he loves to write like - right like he's really into his writing and you can tell he had a lot of fun writing this stuff - but then on the other hand I'm kind of like it's a bit - edge Lord for me which is why I tweeted that tweet that Jay Kristoff ended up seeing yeah so sometimes it kind of like fears too much into you like okay I can tell you're trying to be super super edgy combined with a man writing like a female character that's trying to make her edgy I could really see the prints pressed I I primarily read like fantasy books written by female authors and so this is like one of the rare times I read one that's written by a male author and I could just really tell that it was like not as like authentic I think they're things were kind of like holding me back from fully embracing it it's interesting that you say that because I've read a lot of fantasy written by both female and male authors um and you know with female protagonists and this specifically like there's a lot of times where I think they pull it off really well but I think it's the way he writes about like this female body me and like sex that just it's like you're so clearly a dude you're so very obviously a man yeah anyway and I was funny that like when she is introduced he describes her as like she's not beautiful at all because she's super cool and super spooky and that's not beautiful and I'm like okay J okay I see what you're trying to do yeah okay Kat thoughts okay so fun story I actually finished this book literally like mMmmm 8 minutes ago so I'm not as a sure of how I feel exactly as scindia's but I definitely agree with Cindy about what she said on the like world-building plot character thing and I'm like you with the how I like things to go so I had a hard time with this one I also had a really hard time with the writing so so much so that I had to buy the audiobook so I could like get through it because I have never encountered an author who has said so many words while actually saying so little with the exception of Jordan this is gonna hurt you Sarah J mass oh okay sorry had to be said no it's it's it's about the metaphors in the similes oh he I I'm so on board with you saying that yes no Sarah J Maas does that and he does that too with this and also like the constant indenting and the ellipses and I'm just like he writes like a high school student who's doing an essay and like needs to reach that word count you know I II just oh I listen to it it's fine or well it's better sorry go ahead yeah I also want to add that I too was thought about Sarah Jane pass while reading it and then I don't think they're right they all is the same because it's by to different well but I I was reminded of it in the in the sense where like you really had to go through so much just to like let's do it and that really makes the whole thing a slog in my opinion I think the difference is that while she does that she try to be descriptive I think he can actually pull off being descriptive because despite me having mixed feelings about his writing style there were like a few things that like like just little things where like I think oh I like the way that he described this I thought this was like pretty creative I supposed to like Sarah J Maas where like she just kind of repeats the same phrases so I think they kind of try to do the same thing the difference is like their skill level yeah yeah yeah cuz that's my thing I agree with you that often times it's like overly stylized in a bit too much but that's the thing I think he and he has actually some really original ways of describing things in a not atrocious way where J Maas is like but the the red that's like rose petals of blood and it's like what he's male or female that's why I've heard oh I'm a surgeon but that's not even good at that oh Jesus although I won't say all these paths I put were like every moment where I questioned the writing where I was like hmm this was kind of a weird choice to write I remember when Mia went through the porterie and then he described it as the oinking si has to be a metaphor like you can just say it doesn't have to be a annointing see so those little things kind of like took me out of the book sometimes yeah I agree like he does some good things and he's got skill he's got craft he knows how to do the words but um he needs to take like several seats with how hard he goes right yeah just because you can doesn't mean you should all this wisdom oh hell yeah Zach wouldn't you think about the book overall okay so I guess I'm the odd man out here because I really love this trilogy reading it more critically for this book club I think objectively probably give it close to a four star there are some issues which I'm sure we'll get into when we get into spoilers but enjoyability it's still a 5 star for me and maybe that's a little bit of nostalgia I'll admit that I'm kind of a weird reader I've always joked I'm a give me something I can latch on to reader where if everything is good enough and you give me those few things I love I will love your book and there's a handful of characters I just latched on to and they spoke to me and I love those and I love the plot and I would say I love the action but really I love the violence in this book it's so violent and gory and bloody and like that's what I want especially in a book like this that's that's dark fantasy and so that's kind of what I was here for and it's a lot of what I got which I think really lends to I enjoyed not only this book but the whole trilogy and as far as the writing style goes I do agree it is little me especially the beginning which is definitely a little bit of a challenge at first but I mean I still really enjoyed it and one thing everyone's bringing up world building character plots but one thing I loved I think this book pulls off incredibly is atmosphere when you get to the red church and everything's shrouded in shadows and darkness and there's the ghostly choir singing and everything that just it puts me in a mood where I just want to be in a dark story like this and so that adds on to everything else and so I I love this book wholeheartedly like I said I recognize the house problems and we'll get into that but I guess I'm gonna be the staunch defender here on this live stream I think really good point the atmosphere in this book and that's something that was so I rewatched my review in order to prepare for this since I wasn't able to finish it but it's something that I had said in my review of the book that I did like a year or two ago which is like it feels very reminiscent of like Dark Souls with the monsters and like dark atmosphere and like Assassin's Creed with the actual like you know the second Assassin's Creed with the SEO and stuff in Italy and Venice or Rome sorry um and it's got like all these different elements and the the actual like settings and locations it all feels very original for a fantasy book like I haven't it's such a rich world full of lore full of like I love the different interpretations of the three suns in the different places like the different religions that come from that and I think you know as far as that he's done a really amazing job of crafting the world that feels very rich full of life full of history and as someone who does really enjoy a world for me you know you guys kind of ranked it like character plot worlds for me it's more character world plot and I really do enjoy a rich original world so that's something that really made me want to pick up the second book and really intrigued me with this one because I think the atmosphere was so well crafted and and so original and interesting yeah I personally equate atmosphere to be like part of world building and constructing plat so I think that definitely makes sense why like you to above us value that and so that's why you enjoyed the book better Zack I'm curious what you said that there were like parts about this book that you latched onto which is why you had such like a high opinion about it could you elaborate more and like what parse you latch on to like is it specific characters is it like specific scheme like I just want to know more about why you are than you are yeah that's that's a long discussion but well atmosphere untouched on I love dark atmospheric books especially ones that are fantastical which is why I like paranormal horror and that kind of stuff I also did latch on to certain characters really hard mister kindly especially just he's so sarcastic he's such like a [ __ ] to everyone and like cat can attest to this because we've buddy read things before but I just think some those ridiculous stupid things and like yell at the characters while I'm reading so to have a character in there yelling the things I'm thinking it's just so therapeutic and I'm just like thank you mister kindly thank you for pointing out that like me is kind of dumb and this is all her fault so um but yeah so atmosphere handful of characters and I really enjoyed the plot I mean I could see it's not like the the most detailed intriguing plot but it was good enough for me that everything else took me the distance so cat what did you like about the book it was bloody hey I love me a good disembowelling beheading arm cutting off oh when Mia's arm got cut off the back I texted him right away I was like oh that's so [ __ ] metal like yeah I mean spoilers no oh I forgot you know it's not get things cut off okay it's fine it happens every day and I like it was only cut off for like a little bit okay responsible spoiler with another spoilers basically like it didn't happen yeah no one's know anything there were no repercussions to it a little elbow pain get over it boohoo let me go fall into spoilers I will correct you ma'am I've read this twice and that is not correct just what a scratch one thing because we're kind of still talking about world so yeah we liked about this book was the with the magic system and the monsters um so what are your thoughts on not cat the vampire dude yes I like his situation sure whatever his name is all right can I see you I got red eyes like a goddamn oh I'm about to say like an albino rat so okay yeah hi you guys yeah I've got two times Richard gansley and rodents yeah um I'll say one thing and this is responding to Jordans review is that almost everything is really balanced in terms of magic but I hate that the darken powers like most of them besides the cloak aren't really so they had to throw in basically kryptonite like I hate kryptonite esque things in books and this one pulls that out and I was just like oh no we're doing this granted it does become like a huge part of the plot later on or having to work around it but it's just it's lazy you know suddenly be like oh I have a spoon you can't touch me now like just write a balance magic system damn it and I know he could do it because everything else has like a counter to it so that was like the one aspect of the magic that frustrated me but yeah um sending thoughts um I don't have any new intellectual thoughts to add like I pretty much agree with Zack that I I don't know I think the idea of darken is interesting but I at least in this first book I don't think it could have been expanded as much as it could've I don't know maybe he'll rectify that in future books but yeah that's my only comment with my one brain cell fair enough yeah I mean yes Zack mentioned uh one of my favorite aspects of the book is a magic system and how balanced and because I'm a big fan of hard magic systems it's why I like things like aventure on The Last Airbender where everything all the wit are like set out you know so you know the limitations and then from that you know it's working creatively within that it's so much more gratifying than when the rules aren't established and so you can kind of pull anything out of the magic hat and solve all your problems you know so that's what I liked about this there's there's a lot of very balanced magic as Zack mentioned like if they're if you're doing something with magic and something that looks equally there's a cost to all the things except for the darken um so like that's kind of that's what I enjoy about it and how established and like well thought-out it is also the aesthetics of it I like dark magic mm-hmm you know I just like it I like the vampire guy yeah your tweet about um like if never night was an anime and had like this specific aesthetic and it that's just so on point because I feel like there's they're just things about the atmosphere in the magic system and the way that everything is constructed that I feel like would translate better through animation as opposed to like the limitations of like a live-action okama way um I think because I saw the live-action I mean I saw the trailer before reading the book so I guess I'm picturing um me as Pierrette oh I'm reading uh Kyra's you um so everyone's talking about the book what is the book the library I love English any thoughts about that everyone is saying hahaha it's like one okay but that's exactly what I thought when I read it especially the bookworms I was like oh my god but Glaus like [ __ ] no I okay okay I know no comments though okay climax oh yeah absolutely yeah but the library I was just kind of excited to get there because I finally got to read that line that everyone [ __ ] quotes all the time about like she's got stories in her soul or whatever ain't on the page and I was like I'm here haha I made it got a plane miss line I don't remember anyone later okay look at any like subscription box ever and they put Sarah J Maas clothes on [ __ ] and they put that goddamn quote about how she has stories and her soul on things and I'm just like we get it we like books they like books that's what makes them relatable to us oh god sorry no no I thought the line that everyone likes was sorry my rice is ready so I'm gonna choose the right tarifa live show I thought the line that everyone liked was um the one where she was talking about the difference between Cox and cons and it was like this whole monologue and I'm like okay we get it no I had never seen that before and then we got there and I was like okay girl and then I realized she was 16 and I was like okay girl like we whipping out the word that's a day that's one of my complaints is that Mia does not feel 16 she is not a 16 cause it clearly ain't like none of them or any of them are are they all 16 they're all supposed to be around that age yeah oh [ __ ] I don't believe that at all not for a second yeah I I aged her up in my head oh yeah 21 at least I honestly forgot she was 16 till I started rereading it I thought she was in her 20s I didn't know and then someone DM me and I was like are you sure and then I got to a line where it said something about it being like six years passed when her parents were died died they were she was ten or whatever I'm like oh my god what I feel like I feel like for me it's different to read this compared to like reading six of crows we're like they are both similar in the sense where like they definitely talk way older than they are which I think never Knight is like a new level for me because I see it like I can definitely tell that this is an older edge you do trying to write a young girl and well that's why I like I'm like hmm I don't know as opposed to like six of crows where I'm like you know I'll just age them up in my head and I won't be asked distracted by it I had the HR up just like I had cuz I especially during like the sex scenes and all the parts for J Kristen was talking about how she looked I'm like you sound like Stephen King sir I need you to stop no Mike way worse when he writes sex scenes they're so uncomfortable they're on almost the same level I'm just holding at the sexy were awesome in never night and I was like okay are you talking about this now or like after hours talk I know up to you guys well I just remembered the first time I read this book I was on when I got to the sex like the first sex scene I was on the subway and I was like blushing and I was like this is so uncomfortable to read in public and I don't want to do this older Wow I was using the audiobook at that point and the one complaint I have about it besides the fact that it helped me greatly was that the narrator made a lot of mouth noises and they like showed up on the audio book and so I had to listen to him narrate the sex while also making like those ASMR like and I was like all right take a drink take us take a break yeah I will say I like can't you rest even Kings so I was gonna say like Stephen King rights to sex scenes that feel like borderline clinical like there's there's like no feelings there's like no passion it's just like person and you grab person B and then they embraced and it's just like so weird like at least J wrote like emotions and you could tell they were like really in the mom so that's why I like I appreciate this way more this Stephen King sexy equally gross I see my from raise what ratio that says I hate them every night audiobook narrator with a passion I actually started via audiobook and I like the narrator I usually don't like Mill narrators but I thought this guy was like expressive enough to keep me engaged the only reason why I ended up switching to physical for the rest of the book was because it was very hard to distinguish which part was like a flashback in which part was a footnote because I wasn't indicated at all in the audiobook it's only things were like the way that the book is formatted especially like near the end too he does this thing where like he uses a bunch of dramatic spaces and like you know like yes nerd shadows yeah and so that's that's something that like I I want to see like physically which is why I ended up switching to a physical yeah I don't see this working well as an audiobook I've never tried it but we're matting it's like nearly impossible like to me to think about it I think the only reason that it worked was because I had both so I could look at it and hear it at the same time yeah but I definitely know cuz I when I was like getting ready for today I was straightening my hair and I couldn't look at the book and so I was like listening and I'm like I kept getting confused I had to stop and look at what was happening so no I don't think it is good it's like a full book audio look yeah I was gonna say since we're talking about footnotes fuck'em get rid of them why no why are they there just don't need your unless you're doing the audiobook you don't need to read them they're like extra goodness that you know whoa oh no no no no no they're too old I love them I will fight people on this because here's the thing there's supplementary okay you can clearly see what it's one of the like narrator's quippy witty remarks and that's a fun little thing that you can read if you choose to choose to read the block text or you can choose not to because it's like all supplemental and I love it because I love the world and I think it's interesting that he planned all the [ __ ] out and add so much to the story and it makes it richer so don't give me that I was gonna say that and also if you're really into a scene you don't have to stop until you're ready to if you're ready to you can read it now okay well that's why you should have read the book can I can't read that fast we saw how close I cut it I'm terrible at this we had a whole month we had a whole month that means nothing to me I have not made it to one live show where I haven't read the book on the day of the live show okay I'm bad at planning okay but like it leads to not having like in the audio book it's like that but I've read other fantasy we're like they'll stop a scene dead to give a little bit of context that you don't really need and it's frustrating having the option to do it yeah that's why I'm saying you don't have to do okay okay okay with all due respect isn't having footnotes at the bottom of your page just a more fancy way of info dumping because no you don't have it's optional but that also just means that you're not developing your world in the text and then you because you can't if he can't weave it into the text actually and he's only putting it in the footnotes then either it's not essential or he just doesn't know how to put it in in a way that isn't info dump you so it's like fancy info dumping I rest my case no it's not essential it is footnotes are a gift for world building nerds and not all at all obligate obligatory or necessary story I can't speak Thank You Sophia and her books that's it that's it it's good for you know cuz like here's the thing with worlds building like there are authors that you know like Tolkien and and the guy whose name I'm forgetting right now that like it's it's very dense and like they feel the need to put it in because they did all the work in worlds building and then there's authors who clearly did a lot of world building and you like Sanderson and like flip it in little by little but only show you the tip of it even though you know they've did a lot of other work this is like the perfect in-between he did the work he created this magnificent world I think they're just there for the plot and the characters you can just go off and do that no can't because he makes references to things but he then explains in the footnotes where I wouldn't understand it unless I read it he put he talks about the sons and the footnotes he talks about like did he talk about different places in the world and he makes references he puts similes in his book where he references something in this world that he then takes the time to go and put a whole ass paragraph in the footnotes about what that is that I wouldn't really understand not from context clues what it was unless I read them most of it you can into it most of it you can okay maybe I was dumb men learn that like sure uh maybe a couple things that you like miss out on but nothing in there is like so like you know it's all there's like religious things and stuff that are not essential but like you'll get a lot more from the story if you read those but there's a lot of things that are just like that delicious juicy morsels of like world building information that aren't essential but like fill in the gaps of this world like there's a bit that I just read recently that was talking about like the the whiskey and like fills in some context or like the Walker things the armed Walker dudes and like that's just that's fine because you're like this could be set up for later it could not be it could just be interesting fact but he means he writes it in a way that's juicy and entertaining too anyway anyway well I was gonna say there's two alternatives there's info dumping and then there's what city of brass does which drops you in this world with a ton of political intrigue and doesn't explain any of it and you have to figure that all out for yourself and like that that's a trip like at least with the footnotes a lot of times you can read the like exact necessary information the first line or two and if it's longer than that its bonus content if you love world building versus having to read all the info dump to find where the plot restarts or getting none of it and figuring all out for yourself which old sci-fi does a lot of and trust me it ain't fun so I stand the footnotes I'm standing by this average Joe bring up city brass for what dig it can I speak now neutral third party I I'm the only one that doesn't feel strongly about either way but I guess like if I had to I don't know I I get where Jordan is a cur coming from because it is supplemental information it's not needed so you don't have to read it it's to me I just caught kind of saw it as like if you love will building this is just like a little extra bonus sprinkle upon the cake for you but if you're an idiot like me and cat and then you can just gloss over it if you want so yeah I don't know I I think it was an interesting choice so at that does it work or not I think that just depends on like the readers personal preference I think the fact that it's not required reading is something for him to kind of fall back on as a safety net it's different from info dumping in my opinion because it wasn't part of like the actual text of the book so you don't have to like actually read it if you don't want to I think mmm I kind of wish well maybe maybe he'll expand more on it in the future of books but I kind of wonder is like could there be because sometimes like the footnotes have some kind of personality or snarkiness to them and even like in the beginning of the book and the ending of the book it's like narrator is talking to you and I kind of wonder like is this a narrator we're gonna see in the book or a blue incorporate it in the book I don't know oh you know just you know I want to know the answer to that too but I don't want to read the rest of these bit of mine there don't you can I do think I don't know I I agree with cat on a personal level where I wasn't into the notes because I don't yeah is just like not my thing where it just to me solidified how Jay Kristoff really really likes to hear himself talk but he does but I can probably understand like you know where Jordan is a car coming from like on a practical level and I I do think that like I don't know I think I'm just like in a neutral I'm just I'm just eating my rice okay I'm just eating my rice jay kristoff loving the sound of his own voice can we talk about the first chapter it's so long God hey why was Yost if Bibles ghost how nobody the first time through I thought I was gonna have to read every chapter twice I was like I would have I would have D enough today is that opening prologues like all people got the story all wrong here's the real story so I was like is this what people think the story is versus what it really is like what is this it's open to like chapter three or four luckily I had a friend who wanted me to read it so I was like gonna force myself through anyway because I just went for it and it sorted itself out eventually but yeah that first chapter is just I'm really glad that the the whole book wasn't like that because I sent a picture of my first page to one of my friends and um yeah if the whole thing had been like that I never would have finished it because I would have been too busy making mean comments and the sides about how shitty it was but it takes it better so it's fine literally I did that though I tried picking this book up it was like six of course I tell you I tried picking this book up three times and I couldn't get through after because I thought it was no it'd be like that the entire time and he still clearly thinks so highly of himself is like damn looking so smart reading the same thing but like twice and it's parallel and it's genius look at me go style who is she it's me I'm style and I'm like shut up literally shut up no one cares back bad j-bad anyway I'm glad it like improved you know just me I just love how the flashbacks like go away at like 120 they're just like gone there's like I was kind of wondering about too because I do think he definitely made a deliberate writing style choice in the beginning and I wonder why he slipped off of that later on I mean I'm not complaining but tto know no one can keep that up the literary claim and to get yourself agent and then you write the book that people actually want to read um that's my it was even more confusing listening to the audio version of it cuz actually like which we're like flashbacks and which were not and I'm like wait a minute is she having sex and then also killing him at the same time that's why we yeah again physically to get it so that means I had read that [ __ ] twice I I don't know how people read the audiobook of this book it's just the stylistic choice is like uh it would make it very hard so before I think this is the last question I have I think we should just kind of wrap up the writing bit and obviously if it comes up we'll talk about it but then I think we should move on to plot and character so the last thing is the flashbacks because that kind of mentioned that I personally did not like the flashbacks in this book because it was purely easy exposition like I don't think the footnotes were info dumpee but I do think the flashbacks were info-dump IAM [ __ ] it was like the easy way out of doing exposition for me is like revenge story in past and it's like no you could do it better and like this this is boring like those those flashbacks were so dull like it's mmm okay anyway I had an argument tricks backstory made as much sense as Mia's but it was a page monologue that's all you needed thank you yeah no it's very and that's what did you it wasn't even well done here's my the backstory needs to give you like the emotional context and I don't think it did it was plot context like it was literally setting up like plot things that happened without actual seeing the actual emotional things that you know set up Mia's whole like revenge arc cuz like we don't see her with her dad or her mom really like it's all like jinnah relief like things that happen to them but like none of it you don't get a sense of what the relationship was like so it's very hard to care about the revenge thing when you don't actually have people to care about to revenge you know so yeah that I think was him so poorly and I'm so glad that it was handled better than those in the subsequent books cuz that was brutal the oh sorry go ahead I was gonna say I always tell friends when they're reading I'm like get to the red church like if you can get through 100 120 pages you're good it's that first hundred pages that's that's the challenge because it is it is dull and you're like okay and what something how violent this thing is now action-packed and nothing's happening so Percy the only flashback I cared about was the one where we spoiler the one Laurie found out about like true dark just say that oh sure okay whatever that okay you know it's the only one that's gonna be on one I agree Cindy Potts you're right I didn't really have strong feelings about the flashbacks but I think that's because I felt lukewarm about what was going on in present day two so it didn't make much of a difference um sorry what you say is that I'm seeing a trend I didn't like err yeah so I'm just like I don't know I'm just vibing out here um how's your rice is it delicious yeah well let's know okay it's country star rice like a three-star book or is it better mmm it's I'm only eating what it would meet because I have leftovers and I already finished all my veggies so yeah um what were you talking about again GOx yeah flashbacks yeah I kind of feel like I didn't mind it because I felt like it was a way to give context but I don't know if it added the emotional depth that he would have wants it but like figure out a way to do context matter other people do it all the time and like you the flashbacks have some emotional heart and give us a reason to actually care so just giving us plot things and like context throughs that you know it's like alright I don't care because I don't know so if you're gonna do flashbacks may as well like introduce us to the characters and the relationships what it I mean I guess like it reminds me of like they're books that have done that too with alternating timelines like six approach did that ninth house did that what is it about how those two books approached it then you feel like make it different than never night or better or worse I have it for me at least six of crows the whole duology makes you care about those characters first then the flashbacks start so you're attaching these characters already so you care about why never night throws in this world and it starts throwing you flashbacks like I don't know if who this girl is yeah yeah I don't really care about this backstories I know who she is now what she's doing like what what's happening so that's the difference is there's no emotional attachment yet attachment to the characters and what's happening but also like we're in the first flashback this isn't really spoilers because like that you know we're it's it's early days but in the MIS flashback she's literally watching her dad get hung and like she's with her mom but like and then the immediate want to for that is her mom gets taken away so we don't form we don't get to see what they're related her relationship is like with these like pivotal people in her life so it becomes very hard to care for the revenge story but also it is a wasted opportunity to characterize Mia and what she was like poor hand and how this changed her there's a lot of things that were really big missed opportunities for me I'm a jerk she made her she made me a watch her dad hang yeah I'm like you're easily like don't like her mom oh no I was cool with that like what a bad [ __ ] oh yeah how would you guys try to convey that background information if not with this approach oh another thought I had not that I agree with him but I'm trying to think about like what he was trying to do maybe he was trying to add those flashbacks so that you would have like some kind of emotional attachment to the character because then you can see how awful world I like her life was and then you would like feel bad for her and then maybe want to root for her because she's what like she went through so much trauma as a younger and now you understand why she's doing what she's doing in present day does it work or not I don't know that's where you guys to debate but how would you have wanted to like have it be ridden instead in a in a more natural way said already what trick did he has it like two-page monologue conceived it as like monologues yeah have an emotional moment where she shares it with someone and we see her cries we see how emotional she is we're already attacked by this point yeah you don't spend all this time getting the same information across you go you can have it in like you can do there's so many creative ways that's the joy of writing have that have little context details with like I don't know her the cop-out is like the dream you know she has a nightmare about it or whatever and like be dumb that's not like that's not the correct answer but there's ways to do it where yeah actually like opens up to someone or she you know writes of us is something remotely it was something that she reads reminds her of the past you know look a little like oh well you know this reminds me of that time thing like there's ways to integrate it into the text um that a million other books do completely successfully without having flashbacks but then sana II says it wouldn't feel like it would be believable for her to share all of those details that seem care that counter argue yes but I kind of need to wait for spoilers to happen because actually this is actually one of my biggest beefs with this first look like not the trilogy this book in particular and it's something to do with Mia and how she is but I don't know when you guys want to start spoilers but I will oh can we just do it now I want to hear I think it's time so you guys have not finished this book and I don't want to be spoiled now it be at a time - adios but that was awful and so sorry said that we're just like don't finish it and stay here with us and we'll clean all the beans can we there's two really great comments I agree what Andy said I think in the flashbacks were sprinkled out the book and we're shorter that may have worked I think the reason 400 pages are so des is because Christoph rushes through me us back right I definitely agree with that the book also said I think we couldn't have her go on a Women's Studies read about the c-word she could have cried about her emotions witness truly through the two genders [ __ ] and [ __ ] we gots a turf um yes please go ahead okay so um me in this book like we're told a lot she's this like stone-cold [ __ ] she is the Slytherin she's ready to do whatever it takes full revenge and in rereading this book I noticed like towards the end right before her final trial to kill the kid there's all this you you weren't meant to be here Mia this isn't the place for you you care too much this is not the character I've read this whole book she makes the decision to to show mercy it comes out of nowhere that character is what you see in the second and third book so why wasn't it the character we saw here if she opened up about her emotions earlier it would have been a moment of vulnerability yeah Judas in that she's really a Hufflepuff wearing a Slytherin coat which is what she is in books two and three so it seems out of character because she's not written properly in book one jay kristoff did not figure out her character - a book - there are so many like obviously that happened out of nowhere towards the end well yeah I think hey I hate your decision cuz it's nicer so she's like a soft [ __ ] now I thought she was like a stone cut hard ass [ __ ] this whole time it just fell here at the hado that when he could have better ingrained it throughout the story that the other character inconsistency that drove me insane was the whole like manipulative like oh god a master manipulated you all and look at my magic cunning manipulation it's like no this girl has been so blunt and straightforward she does not have like a drop of cunning in her like character builds you know she's all just like yeah she's like book smart and like tough and that's her shtick but she's not like an emotional manipulator and like a mastermind don't don't try that on me don't know when when she when she leaves out her notes for the one guy to find for the poison challenge that was the most obvious trap ever so it's like she's supposed to a master manipulator you can't show that by giving her like the most obvious trap in the world and then having someone fall for it because they're dumb like that was not a good trap that guy was just stupid I also thought it was weird that whole subplot or whatever theme about like seduction is power but again this is like another case where I could clearly tell it was a man writing that's very much thing from a guy's perspective yeah a lot of times like women are just described as like a femme fatale kind of character and like sexuality is power and that's like how you show you're a strong female character but she I mean okay if that were the case she did Ashley seduce anyone she just had like sex with her a few times and she's like yes this is power so yeah to be fair it comes up more later okay all right yeah that's a problem he fixes in book two like I think it's the opening of book two actually you'd like to see that immediately so it's not important scene so don't yell me about spoilers it's fine we're in spoilers a book - yeah you're fine you're fine um yeah I burnt some very obvious like this was written by a dude you're trying to be quirky and edgy but like it doesn't work so well on a 16 year old girl you know it's like very very obvious and not um also why we're on this track like I find it weird that Mia like her seduction technique is to bite the living [ __ ] out of tricks lifts where he's bleeding like that was her first move in the first sex scene and I'm like I would kind of be like what the hell are you doing there were a lot of like little detail powered I'm looking at your room if you bite my lip hard enough to draw blood her getting a boob job is what makes her a power not just a boob job a magical boob job just i/o can we talk about the fact the referred to as BAPS in this book deeply upsetting this is like wow you really worked hard on that fake slang there Jay holy [ __ ] feels like I appreciate that they have like what the best instead of what the hell like that's a nice little world building thing that's just kind of buried in there but like yeah I'm like okay you took a similar-sounding word for the same thing um wait I'm gonna switch to a new topic if we're okay with that yeah what are your thoughts on trick Zach you like trick he's my boy lady I love the trick about what happened to Train cuz I was like oh yeah no I only asked tattoos but you know he seems like he could be that's like his one flaw his classes were just like a mess what you know you didn't have them cuz magical makeover moment okay exactly is like as none of it matters um but yeah I feel like he was a good balance to Mia so we're not stuck with her the whole time and then when you know that thing happened I was like god damn it good if I can no way they didn't hide his body they didn't find his [ __ ] body weight I stabbed it hold on that's your prediction for books to him yeah my prediction cuz it was good that his body was never recovered after all she's wrong abyss just saying that's what happened that's why you can find it's okay but in any fantasy book ever if you don't see the body hit the floor and bury it right then in there they're still alive have you ever watched Supernatural like that [ __ ] happens all the time well I guess you'll have to read on and find out what you really don't I'm just gonna spoil myself on Wikipedia it's okay um if I can go on my rant here about trick yes I appreciate trick because if I have to read another [ __ ] bad boy archetype I'm gonna shoot myself and finally you had this guy who's like goal oriented and focused but also like kind of charming but he also has like softer moments that are feel like they're earned because poor t'v and stuff like throughout the book so feels like an actual layered character and he's not just I am miss 60 mandolin uh and then he just really has rage problems which is what a lot of male characters in fantasy I read about are so that's why like I grabbed on so hard a trick and it's why I grabbed on to the male characters and six of crows because I find especially on booktube a lot of popular fantasy books on here just have bad boy chiming man archetypes and it's just so boring as a guy I just hate it some like this doesn't feel like a guy I know yeah I know he's like this where's trick I'm like oh I could see this being so-and-so in a fantasy setting so that's really what I appreciate and I think people will say maybe you shouldn't have murdered a kid if he's really soft inside but I think that was him showing like I have a soft side but I'm also dead serious about my goals and so he does it and that adds another layer of like which side is gonna win that's off side or that rough side so there we go I love trick I enjoyed trick um I just think there is a lot of wasted opportunity in general but also specifically the trick in the character both playing it took a very long time it's not really until yes as the monologue that I started to really care for him and that's like too late in the game you know there are a lot of opportunities that were missed out on uh for character building through his and Mia's relationship especially in the whisper race yeah I'll give you that least two weeks just chillin on a tower and it's like he watches her sometimes when she reads and it's like wow I love character that's um Edward Cullen [ __ ] right there honestly it was like that's the thing like I feel like if I that needed to be established way earlier for me to care as much as I should have you know like there's a lot of you know yeah world building and character building through the relationship if we had seen more of it and I get that it's already slow when you to it takes a hundred pages for it to pick up and whatever but I think that is a better use of a lot of the time that we've spent rather than and you can still establish me as a bad yes Marty and whatever like and you don't need as many flashbacks to her dumb past and you don't need the whole time that she's like a fat Danny odes or whatever chilling in oh god yeah does that take forever she's just like yeah I'm gonna find a horse and like I'm just chill here like I don't know what to do so much at meander around it's like no spend that time like with her and trade getting to know each other yeah I I would support you in saying that the monologue should have been switched when he's called coffee for the first time that would make more sense and get you attached early on so I'll give you that I think I love this book but it has problems I think good Rumia oh for sure um on the topic of a snow chinked ashen Mia I shipped that [ __ ] so I thought stop there kids yeah leagues better Lee sir did you read the end of this book what acted what no no no okay ready ready me is evil but she's got a soft inside part with the heart and everything ash is all like cheery and golden on the outside and she's fun and she steals [ __ ] and then she's [ __ ] evil your dating life is full person is like the optimum match here know what we're all killing people in this book now it's not like her evil is any worse than killing a child trick killed a kid oh [ __ ] an innocent child at that no one in the red church is innocent they're all assassins so I don't feel that bad about it oh I don't know what is over to you it's just i think they hadn't were chemistry than tricking me and did anyway Jordan's new zoom on Phil let her go Jordan go I um I don't even know what I can say no it's fine I can't see anything I can't see Jordan I know what you're thinking yeah I mean that they get together just tell me that it's okay I can take it I'm ran out of prediction I won't scream I want that to be a prediction can it be a prediction I want to predict your predictions child well I know what I'm predicted if it's gonna be wrong because then I'll be sad but yes I want it to happen make it happen can't come back and laugh about how right or wrong you are I am I am once again in the middle of just not hearing either way however if we want it trick and Bo to be together I'd be like yeah I'm down for that but if cat was like no Mia and I should be together than be like yeah I see it I see both sides okay I'm I feel like tricking me I have more of like a friend bond I don't know like a like a like a brother-sister kind of thing I mean obviously I'm a like for that but that they you know start it out together and so even though the assassin school is like so terrible and she ain't kind of like a cult basically we're like usually anyone I like that they still have that bond so I thought that was nice I didn't hate them like they're set up to me I'm a it make sense but I just thought that they didn't have it felt kind of like a cop-out it felt kind of like jay kristoff was like we have female character she has vagina we have male character he has penis woo put them together we have a [ __ ] and we have a [ __ ] what do you do slap them together I have vaccines that objectify 16 year old women oh yeah let's put some more since ash spent the whole book putting on his persona for it to be fake how do you know that the ash you rooting for is real when you love someone like Ash loves Mia you can't help but be real around them because that is so bad real full of it tonight you know that I definitely feel like trick like Tamia way more than she likes him I want to talk about how with the character without attaching her to like any other character because I think as an individual I did like her character and also like whether you ship them or not I liked her banter with Mia and I felt like it was a good setup for the betrayal because the way that they bantered made us seem like they would be such great friends and and she just seems more likeable so I feel like that was a good build up to how conniving she ended up like turning out to be so when she did SAP check I was like oh [ __ ] well I I was like damn respect though divorcing myself from books 2 & 3 thinking back to like where I was in book 1 yeah I I liked me or I liked to ash as a character up until the betrayal but at the end of this book dads that's your question who is she really so that that's my thing of like cats like so supported I'm like you don't really know who she is because I know in my heart I just know her I will read book two and three just to prove you that I'm right I think about what she is really like in boob 2 & 3 but I we will say that I appreciate the persona that she put on in book 1 and I feel like her ability to do that so naturally speaks to what she's kind of like as a character so yeah I I feel like that was a very it it was a betrayal that wasn't so obvious and I respect that it surprised me and I liked that fight that's like what the darkling wanted to do but darkman could never the dark girl if you wanted to make them evil you need them a white girl named like Ashlyn they're like that's how you get the hub well like yeah I think Cindy you nailed it on the head like to me Nia interesting villains and interesting antagonists are the people who are very emotionally smart and emotionally manipulative and I think that's why she's such a good foil for Mia who's very in my mind very blunt and very straightforward and it's all about you know bravely charging towards battle whereas Ashlyn is definitely more the type to you know plan and hatch ideas and strategize and then manipulate people so I think it's something that me has not necessarily prepared for which is I think why it's such a good twist and it's also such a good antagonist and I think jessalyn is such a wasted opportunity uh as far as antagonists know can we talk about that so stay mean girl so stereotypical oh my god I am praying if I do read this just the rest of those free in series I'm not committing to it but anyway I hope that they have some kind of like Redemption maybe a friendship possibly no I'm seeing I'm sensing and though from that view just as like kind of like the zoya of the Grisha trilogy where like she's made out to be like the mean rival girl but that mean we're gonna have to wait until jessamine gets a whole ass spin-off duology of her in order to characterize her I'm not waiting for that um I was gonna I was gonna say real quick for ash I'm not saying she's not a well-written character cuz that trails well done it's it's a question of liking versus appreciating I can appreciate that she's a good villain because she can play the deception card so great I just don't like her because she killed my boy yeah that's that's the build I'm in where I appreciate how she was able to hustle so well so like the grind rise & grind baby Wow looking up characters there was a comment from Cassandra who said yo speaking of hush what was that we offer his Nikken around thoughts he was just there I like them because he had no teeth he gave the book to Mia that she needed to solve poison and then to figure out what was happening so that's plot wise why he's there and I think he just wanted a mysterious character that sneaked around but there's no like freezing maybe he just likes to do it I feel like a hush and Jess were red herrings just so that you would suspect them and then you would be surprised by ash later yeah yeah I think just land gosh I don't remember that much so I'm gonna clearly read before I can speak to him but I think Jocelyn was a wasted opportunity because she that's another one that's another one where she could have revealed things about her past - jessalyn if this was written better and we did wouldn't even dam flashbacks because you know they have that like tie of like her dad died under her dad and someone that's such an interesting relationship that was not fleshed out at all there's no resolution to it and it could have been such a good way to like house that that past bit in a way that's not just a dumb flashback yeah um okay so reads with Rachel come into the while back who's everyone's favorite instructor Cindy since you haven't taken a strong stand yet you got to go first yeah I literally don't have any favor say what did you reckon teach me uh so oh wow Trek cuz he taught me a sword fighting or whatever give it up okay I like for a le trick to be for the future he's my racially ambiguous King um yeah I like I like the the instructor that um taught me how to seduce lef yeah yeah oh wait wasn't see the one I texted you about this deck but she basically said like live love laughs yeah she says before they go to the masquerade ball yeah yeah she was like you'll live you'll love and you will laughs yeah I like spider killer cuz she let her students die yeah again another bad [ __ ] got a thing when you walk in and they're all poisoned she's just like figured out it was like damn professor snake could never oh what a softy and the fact she's like really nice and like makes jokes but is also the real stone-cold [ __ ] like it's so great I like spider killer and I like the thieving one whose name I can never remember is you mouthing is that him okay Masur yeah I like those two I think those two were very good and the other ones rook bombing was not only the one that they always that teach a sword fighting yeah you know I respected the fact that he cut her arm off but that was about it he was boring after that yeah he has no personality besides being gross and blind Oh Yang's blind anything to a character how does how does he sorted by the peace of God things like is a very detailed book we should have some explanation how he can do it I mean like I don't doubt I clearly he can do it but like I want it I want to know why or how with all the elements there should be something you know well you don't even need magic to fix the blindness because you don't need to but you like didn't they mention that he was in that prison thing that I can't remember the name of yeah he's in the descent yeah I want like a whole like angry teacher monologue about how I worked my ass off every day training myself to fight even though I can't see any you little shits and I could okay yeah I got lost halfway through okay other characters we need to talk about mister kindly earlier like I'm just kind of a grumpy [ __ ] when I read shouting things of the book and suddenly a character in the books voicing it for me and it's glorious and like it's obvious to me that he actually does care about Mia but the fact like he never shows that he just inevitably has some sort of sarcastic wit like grumpy characters that are actually soft like that's my thing and so like mr. Calus is great dance that was my strong sense I think he's cute okay I think the idea of him is interest yeah the rice never is I I think it was an interesting idea to give Mia like an animal companion and have this be a cat that's like not a cat but also it eats like her fears so I feel like that was one of those things where it kind of made me more likely believe that she was like a 16 year old girl who has like you know an animal companion that she goes on these adventures with and so I kind of felt like that helped Mia as well but not have any strong feelings about the actual character but I do have to say I hated that every time he was mentioned as a cat Christophe had to write a cat that's not a cat or a cat that's made of shadow like I get it he's not real think yeah okay faith gets it what came at us like part of the atmospheric part oh my god know it if you want suffer with the word counting again thank you I didn't mind I didn't really notice a cat that is not a cat being repeated I got tired of don't look oh yeah oh my god don't know there's a lot of repetition okay we don't need to go back to the writing we've already covered that it's fine but let's be honest the payoff for it it's worth bit that was a cool scene I did like that um what do we want how much you join your thoughts no okay I was gonna say do we want to talk about your dark mascar now and how awesome that was uh Mia just kills everybody oh yeah you like that really annihilated aliens no I I didn't realize that that was the same thing as the true dark massacre that kept getting reference to the whole time I did not put that together okay anyway what were your dog cat not a what a bad [ __ ] okay what's the murder everyone yeah I think good for her I mean anymore so I don't give a [ __ ] anymore just let her have it Jordan my piece on this new you thought it was good yeah I said I loved it it was like the big gory oh man yeah yeah it was the only good flashback yeah yeah okay yeah violence like I said like this is the most violent moment a book and there's like oh oh [ __ ] it was like the moment I actually was like scared of Mia yeah yeah I wasn't scared if I wanted to give her a hug she's a support with shadows she could try right is there anything we've met oh we have a gun [ __ ] marry kill I'm ready I got answers okay where are the characters who are the characters okay wait let's wait a sec let's have people vote in the in the comments who we should do but in the meantime can we talk about how lovely eclipses oh yeah clips of Eclipse you know you don't really see her prolonging this one do you know it's booked two and three ah well she's lovely take my word for it oh and mr. Kylene eclipses dynamic really I loved oh yeah I liked what we got to see of them at the end like they're little they had like one little like banter session I was like hmm I like that okay okay I think for these three I will [ __ ] true obviously um I will kill ass because I don't trust her like I respect her as a character but I wouldn't want her near me because she will literally stop me in the back or in the front knowing her style and I'll marry Mia but like I wouldn't be super close to her because I don't care either way but I don't like I don't think she would be as untrustworthy compared to ash because apparently Mia is like a softy as we discovered in the last hundred pages of the book why would you not marry trick why would you [ __ ] trick once instead of for a lifetime that's what I want to know okay I really don't want to [ __ ] either of them I feel like Mia wouldn't be good and asked it's like too scary for me all right okay fine I will I will endear [ __ ] Mia just for um just so that I can trade in like a live I'm what Shrek but as long as my sex with Mia is not paralleled with another scene of her killing someone that crossed a lot more that's good point I would suck trick kill Mia and marry ash because she stole things from around the school she also stole my heart well I'm gonna I'm gonna marry my bro trick we'd have just a great relationship I think personally gonna [ __ ] me and I'm gonna kill ash because I hate her and will never forgive her I hate you okay so marry trick [ __ ] ass yo Mia why cuz I feel like I don't know in this book especially in later books that might change but specifically for never night I feel like a ash might be a little bit more like fun in the bed you know point yeah you guys is a bland [ __ ] um ash might be interesting thinking [ __ ] which I'm not saying I am but you know could be could be fine and and you know I feel like also I you know she's got this like dark side to her but like she's nice I'm like I'm with that no um I don't like her as much as Kat does but I feel like her you know a one-time saying why not yeah just like a wham bam thank you ma'am um so someone said but I've lost it oh okay oh okay I would do [ __ ] the the third person cuz she would she would be best at right yeah that's the clear choice I would kill a spider coil there cuz I don't want him to poison me she knows she oh she Mary Mouser yeah like a bad George Clooney in my head you know yeah I was like sorry cat go ahead I would [ __ ] Alea obviously and then I would marry spider killer and then I would kill Mouser I didn't like him he bothered me everyone would go to the wedding were you in spider killer and everyone would get poisoned there just I I was gonna say like I'm actually kind of up in the air like I would definitely marry Mouser cuz he seems just like a genuine dude like he'd help around the house I think as long as he's not stealing my [ __ ] and like uh-oh I feel like [ __ ] a Leo be weird she's like way too perfect but also spider killer might kill me exactly like yes I'll just get over the awkwardness and a Lea and kill spider killer because I don't trust her I feel like a Lea would take care what's happening she's like oh we had a good time because you're dying now no I feel like spider killers like she's like uh the guy from Fifty Shades of Grey that's what I imagine that she's like the Jamie Dornan character Christian Grey literally Christian Grey firm nothing like nothing like personality I imagine that's what she would be like and you know you would have a drawer full of great I'm going would she say things like I like to suck or what is it oh no I forgot it something about her mom being the crack [ __ ] her mom the crack [ __ ] yes you know the one yeah he's like I like to beat up women nevermind me my mom like little brownie hard goes because they remind me of my mom the crack [ __ ] oh I just realized I said [ __ ] Mia which means I have to get my lip like half bitten off yeah I'm telling you I don't think it would be good she we saw first hand she where being like a pillow princess or you way too much heart beats so I mean at least we'll be quick yeah that's true that wine made me laugh I loved it was like okay I see you J oh I like let me see if I can find it I'm gonna read y'all my favorite line okay hold on I'm not gonna be able to find it now but and then after I have sex with Mia she's gonna bore me with a monologue from the Women's Studies class about the in smokers kind of violence oh yeah smoking is a cigarillo come on close oh okay why did your edgy at the end of the third sex scene sorry like the last line was and then he kissed her tenderly as if her sex were her mouth and he were saying goodbye for the very last time I had another line from that like trick goes Elia gave me some pointers I was like oh again symmetric right there true you never texted me back [ __ ] [ __ ] Cindy it's on page 253 253 yeah oh my god okay there's flexing use the word suckle in it and I was like this is some victory EL James [ __ ] I got real like flashbacks there I got very upset oh my god okay the live show is me just hard cut wait what what book are we gonna be reading on cast Channel oh well we're complaining earlier Kat you didn't give a star rating oh yeah how do you turn to what yeah you know I I might do it to ya mean join me I know I'll compromise 2.5 I'm not doing Jordan in the right opinion me on Instagram and she was like how is it and we were like lesson by exact to the live show we can't we got to invite someone with brain cells and to help I just go to we're gonna argue so let's get Zack on like oh my god woo it's not you it's me because we're done babbling yeah I read the first like a hundred pages and iMessage Cindy I was like we need to do something about it yeah so jack is just a good guess when we need more brain cells to compensate for yeah for sure also cuz you and Jordan tend to have the same opinions and Cindy and I do and yeah you're good at shutting our dumbassery down yeah well that's saying earlier with the well thanks for H with the the fact like Jordan I read like hard science fiction and dense fantasy so like yeah cuz I was like is it really that dense and I was like yeah I guess it is I'm just the weirdo I feel like this was a good balance back being like an artic defender me like actively criticizing some things cap being like this is dumb me being like I don't really care that was the news contribution that's gonna be a meme of this episode I just gotta get a bunch of it I am as gonna be a meme at some point the OH Martina asks did you guys wash pears web series I did I did no I haven't yet cuz I could have just finished it but I will people class up to the red church and that's like my least favorite part of the whole trilogy of that first hundred pages so I'm just kind of like we don't have the budget for the red church okay it's not her fault I'm not saying it's her fault but I'm sorry Jordan yeah our taste is garbage it's not like this is news to you we've been doing this for a while now to be fair Cindy did trash cats pick on her chip miners yeah yeah I was really a mess for these past two books but thankfully will be better and better and the choices into the drowning deep by Mira grant it's got oh oh oh [ __ ] you're prepared holy hell okay I don't even have it yet it's got an F F relationship killer mermaids horror I think some sci-fi for you smart folk out there hopefully that doesn't deter me and Cindy but it's cool and also if it sucks you can blame Zac cuz he's the one who told me to pick it wait um okay so Kat you haven't read it before no but Zac you have oh then what she recommended I don't know why did you and Kat was asking for her recommendations like when she picked pretty girls and so I dropped it and I'm like I got a guilt trip for it too picky this book for me yeah um all everyone's fears I own I think like seven Mir grant books into the drowning beeps the only one labeled fiction not sci-fi so I think that's down I think so hold me do that I have no idea what it's about so I'm gonna go in a blind but I'm looking forward to it we better I'm gonna choose it sometime well I was gonna say idea enough of the first time you should just book me because if it's hard science fiction like I've heard I feel ever gonna be back in this exact same situation anyway thank you for tuning in to this live stream I appreciate it thank you so much to our hosts and of course our special guest Zac who is becoming less and less special as he joins me over and over on this channel because I need support uh should we just should we just invite this man back cuz he's the one who know yeah oh yeah I was gonna ask anyway I'm gonna come back full disclosure the whole time I've been convincing Kat to pick this book I'm waiting for her to be like yeah and you should be on it but I didn't want to be that guy really like later tonight so um want to come back yes I would well do great can we do that is basically I'm facto backup yes and president of the fan club all right Wow token male yeah yeah I said I was the odd man out earlier and you know yeah we're not wrong but we're lovin for it yeah um anyway uh I'm ending this it's been way too long it's an hour and a half this is a long one but thank you guys so much for tuning in and thank you ladies for suffering through the bag do you hate it oh my god okay maybe I'll like the second one yeah you're gonna like the second one Cindy it's like just so basically we did this like book exchange at Christmas and this is before we have like read a couple books this year that gave me a bit of a keener sense of what Cindy would or wouldn't like um namely like diviner there's a few comments that you've made in the past couple live shows that I'm like oh no cuz I didn't Cindy never night and I was like I think she might like this it's fine it kind of gives me like six of crows vibes that it can like atmosphere maybe she'll like it and I was like oh no which is like ya know world's hate her like I like characters I'm like but no no I'm I'm glad I read it because I feel like I know a little bit more about you and about Zach too because I think you can tell a lot about like you know some what someone's like favorite series or book is so it just helps make me learn more about you and your interests try to figure out this is a good thing like I'd know more about sec all right you guys so much and yeah I think for all the comments and questions and the live chat and I click send and it's not on me it's never gonna end we're here forever

Channel: Jordan Harvey

Views: 31,270

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Id: 2xA8YZDj5Iw

Length: 86min 2sec (5162 seconds)

Published: Sun Apr 12 2020