NEET UG 2024 Controversy | J Sai Deepak On NEET Scam | NEET 2024 Exam Row | English News

[Music] we don't sit often to have a conversation and this is perhaps the first time that we are doing it in this manner but it's always a pleasure to speak to a good friend a very very well- read uh author lawyer thinker and someone who's very very staunchly batting for bhat J saak good to have you pleasure uh so we are also getting into this Avatar of a conversation but let's try and keep it as freely feeling as possible so from various aspects and I have a lot of questions to ask you but let's start with the neat issue because it's right there right on the table and you are in the thick of all of it so where does it stand and what is your understanding of what has happened so the big picture is this I think there are a batch of petitions that have been filed before The Supreme Court at least over the last one week or so the results were announced on the 4th of June um I was engaged as the arguing Council by alak Pand who is also known as the physics Wala his petition was filed on the 9th and U we had to mention the matter before the bench uh court number 12 of the Supreme Court on the 11th for it to be listed along with the other petitions so that it could be taken up as seriously rather as quickly as possible before uh the sense of urgency is lost so the court suggested that we route it through the registry and mention the matter again and on the 13th a matter was listed now there are two sets of broad issues one is the allegation with respect to the leak of the paper in certain centers the second is with respect to the award of compensatory marks uh to what tune and to and at what scale these are the questions now the bulk of the petitions which were filed where with respect to the alleged leak of the paper I think then there were three other petitions including ours which dealt with the second issue of Grace marks as well so in our petition or rather than Mr alak P's petition uh the question of paper leak as well as the grace marks were taken up together singan partners of the council's on record for the matter and I was engaged I think on the 10th night and from what I understand based on the case papers and the material that I've read so far um an F I think at least two F seem to have been registered on the question of paper leag I think one is in Bihar and perhaps the other is in Gujarat as far as the second question is concerned the problem I think arose when people realized that certain scores had been awarded which were mathematically impossible going by the structure of the examination it's say either plus4 or something of that sort so you could have scored 716 or 720 but you couldn't have scored 718 or 719 and that gave rise to questions as to what was the manner of calculation adopted here how how did this even happen and then gradually it started emerging that compensatory marks had been awarded to students and once questions were raised and petitions were filed before various courts that is when I think the NTA came out with its first set of with its first circular uh clarifying that compensatory marks were indeed a it until then there was no statement from the NTA subsequently between the 11th and the 13th that is the day we mentioned the matter on the 11th on that day a set of FAQs were released again explaining that compensatory marks were awarded to 1563 students on the basis of who approached the court as petitioners for on the subject and then when we uh argued a matter on the 13th when it was listed even before we could proceed to make our submissions the council for the NTA volunteered with uh the minutes of a meeting which was rather there were two meetings held on the 11th and 12th of June wherein internally it was a decision was taken by the HBC the high powered Committee of NTA that they would uh cancel these compensatory marks to this 1563 students and they would be given an option of either retaking the test or retaining their scores without the compensatory marks now once that suggestion was made to some extent the issue the second issue that we we raed was addressed in principle but the issue that otherwise had been flagged also apart from the question of the aled paper leak and the need for greater scrutiny on the on the front was that why should this benefit be limited to only those candidates who had approached the court because after all you're looking at students they are not professional commercial litigants they're 18year olds nobody writes and examine the anticipation that they'd have to go against the examination agency itself to court and from the 4th of June till date there's been a flurry of activity on this front yes so we said that even if this benefit is being extended if it is limited only to those 15 63 students it results in some kind of unfairness and to put it bluntly it would also result in article 14 violation correct because if the benefit is being extended it must be extended to all those people who have been awarded Grace marks with our without basis but the larger question typically in these examinations one question that is asked is assume for moment that you grant Grace marks the possibility of Grant of Grace marks that provision must be envisaged in the prospectus of the examination itself saying these are the circumstances in which Grace marks can be awarded the only circumstance that the prospectus of n for this year speaks off where such Grace marks could have been awarded is a circumstance exclusively for loss of time for physically challenged students and nobody else so if there is no basis for that and it's like a contract for all practical purposes where a candidate knows what to expect and what not to expect what are the eventualities in which additional marks may or may not be awarded there is no such circumstance whatsoever in the prospectus and until students went forth to courts asking this question I believe that there was not too much of clarity coming from the NTA that perhaps has led to a significant degree of concern as to why was this not told up front that yes that in certain centers the question papers the currect question papers reach 3 hours 20 minutes l and therefore we have decided to extend this because this was completely outside the scope of control or possibility we couldn't have enar this had they been upfront about it and actually made this clarification when the marks were released or when the results were announced to some extent people would have understood but then it so happens that the number of centers or this uh to which this benefit was extended was initially one I think it was sa mahur and then they added five more centers so totally six centers so the position that's been taken before The Supreme Court is only six centers suffered from this during the course of our arguments it turns out that there were certain other councils who were representing students who too had suffered this and other centers other than the six centers now that issue therefore according to me is still outstanding M So based on yesterday's hearing and the uh record of the Supreme Court of The Proposal of the NTA today a circular has been released wherein they have limited the scope of this particular option to 156 63 students and the retest option is being made available on the 23rd of June for those students correct now let's see whether there is some rethink on the government part because we specifically made the suggestion over and over again and the video of the submissions made yesterday the hearing is available in public domain where we said that this window must be equally made available to all those candidates who are who are coming from other centers but who have not had an opportunity to make a representation before the court because it's been barely 10 days people will take time to uh think and go to the Court correct so that's where the situation is the larger picture being 24 lakh students have appeared this is perhaps the uh the the competitive examination with the highest possible participation of the country so far even J is about 13 lakhs and I'm told that around 571 centers sorry cities with 4 4750 centers that's the cumulative figure that you're looking at and there's been a sharp increase in the number of centers thanks to the inclusion of multiple tier three and tier four centers as of this year's examination so if there is let's say some laps in arrangement I can understand but I think there are two other issues which need some kind of scrutiny so what the court has done is that the question of paper leak Even in our petition and those are the petitions which are specifically on this subject have been posted for 8th of July but the court has not granted a stay on the counseling on the question of compensatory marks based on the proposal given by the government or rather the NTA this solution has been worked out but I think more can be done even on this front yeah and somewhere one would feel that the NTA should come out and say these are the total number of students who have been given compensatory marks and we give all of them a chance to go back and re reappear or or go back with the so I think the NTA is trying to balance two different concerns if if you were in their shows I think that's what they'd be concerned and I heard from a certain other set of Educators also that this could be one of the concerns which is assume for a moment that you make the option available randomly then everyone who's not performed well we'll use this as an excuse I understand that as a possibility take a students may or may not do that that's a different issue altogether but the fact of the matter is there has been an admission on the part of the NTA that indeed compensatory marks were awarded without basis and therefore You' have taken a decision to cancel it if such is the case it makes sense and it would be fair to extend the very same benefit to all those other affected parties as well because you're not going to go exclusively on the word of the student the people who conducted that examination in a particular Center will vouch for the fact you have CCTV footage to decide whether or not there was indeed loss in terms of time those questions can be addressed and today I think with the availability of AI technology it should be possible for you to go through the CCTV footage fairly quickly and take a decision yeah that I think is is a possibility the only thing I think um as and since my participation in this is purely in professional uh let's say capacity and not in the nature of any other capacity I believe that um the larger issues with respect to the examination perhaps will have to be considered by the Supreme Court the decision to not stay the counseling and to take up the larger issue only in July I don't know what kind of an impact it will have on the counseling so assume for a moment that you go ahead with the counseling and the Supreme Court says there has been some issue here if that is one of the possibilities 50% let's say then what happens to the counseling process yeah and assume for a moment that uh you come to the decision yes there is indeed an issue but we will not interfere with the counseling process then what is the point of the entire exercise what is the point of the inter operation successful patient dead patient dead yeah I agree and somewhere let's just take this conversation forward because the rest of the matter is now Sub judice Court is going to listen to it but you know now let's take the professional out of you and bring the Thinker and somebody who's been watching bhat very closely the last 10 years one of the biggest positions or arguments have been even before we get into the results right has been the need to fix the education system correct now when you get into from neat and when we go out are we worried as a nation as to how are we educating the Next Generation what is the education process because one the thought process and how are you tuning them right second what are you equipping them for correct you believe this is going to be the biggest challenge for Modi 3.0 getting the education right if I may say so I do believe that education is one of the most crucial sectors and Battlegrounds and uh space for opportunity it's all three coming together I am someone who believes that you must equip children with three different layers of training one is that they're fundamentals in terms of what they think of their country their society and history must have some solid foundation with basis in actual facts and not fabricated history it is important for a country that is upwardly mobile and aspirational to have a population at least the future population which has a certain degree of confidence and self-esteem not just in people as individuals but also as in as as far as the society is concerned not withstanding the significant degree of symbolism and attitudinal change that I think we have undergone in the last 10 years also because of public efforts and significant independent private efforts I don't think that symbolism and that Vision has translated to actual concrete policy steps which are visible in textbooks which are visible in the manner in which people understand their history the interesting part is and I can say this with some degree of firsthand experience having spoken to Vikram having Dr Vikram s having spoken to Dr Anand rat and others that students Educators and teachers and institutions are extremely keen on uh seeing a change in their curricula there is and I say this because we get invited by educational institutions to speak on the subject so the fact that there is an existing demand Reservoir is clear now what is stopping or what is the sense of reluctance or impediment in actioning this and meeting the demand is a question I think for people to ask of themselves is this not a concern is this not an enough of an election issue is there no electoral incentive and therefore people are not concerned about it well if anything I think I would read the outcome of 2024 as significantly also a statement that more needs to be done on this front on by the thinking middle- class population which has been the traditional supporter of rooted bhat so that's where I would see that second apart from this people might say okay all this is great history culture all this is great what about food well in which case how are you hoping to address an increasingly AI oriented world through an education system system that also has reservations as one of its falcs or bedrocks now whether you can take a position that is fully against the concept of reservation or not I think is a larger sensitive discussion that needs to be had in a calm atmosphere and I don't think politics exactly affords that atmosphere however the minimum question that we are entitled to ask is how much of it and what is the cut off cut off right is there some cut off that anybody has in mind at all and is there any consideration of Merit there exactly that that's the other the biggest filter or are we at least looking at a situation where the scores even for the reserved category are increased a bit Yeah okay say that now perhaps maybe we looking at a better performance and this should be the gap between the non-reserved category and the reserved category in terms of the Merit scores are we at least having this conversation because if you want to compete with China you want to compete with all other emerging countries because today you're not just competing with China you're looking at those countries who are hoping to benefit from the cash rain thanks to China's bungling of the covid period so you're looking at manufacturing opportunities being spread across southeast Asia with Indonesia Laos Philippines Cambodia Vietnam everybody else stepping into the picture including Bangladesh for that matter now where are we helping our ourselves in that regard is the education system focused heavily on producing only engineers and doctors what about the actual manufacturing skills what happens to the I sector now when I spoke to people working in the hardcore manufacturing sector based out of let's say uh traditional manufacturing belts such as Maharashtra tamilnad and others I have enough friends I'm basically an engineer I've come from the background I have enough people working in that in that front and from what I understand the impetus on the I front although has been expressed has not happened on the ground March okay so on one hand you're looking at hardcore manufacturing skills when it comes to the core sector but you're also looking at the other end of the spectrum namely AI three um is uh increasingly the influence of social media on people's productivity starting to impact them right from their adolescent years is taking a serious toll in terms of work ethics screen time 100% productivity social media is a t it's a Time Buster the time that you lose in watching reals 2 hours or 3 hours or whatever it is how is it actually affecting you mentally and what kind of opportunities is it robbing you off with the explosion of information on the internet of both qualities good and bad or even ugly for that matter how are we trying to channel the energy that we have and the demographic dividend that we currently have in the right direction this demographic dividend is not going to be Eternal it has a time limit 25 30 years Max correct if you don't push your hardest at this point you will again look at a Future Vision which goes beyond 2047 H so I'm very clear that I'm looking at history and civilizational Consciousness I also looking at competitiveness and I'm also looking at social media becoming one of those uh seriously problematic areas in terms of productivity and thought control and if anything it's it's I think it's been clear over the last few months that it's possible to spread fake news with a multiplier effective social media with very clear tangible outcomes on uh actual results but then again it swings back to policy doesn't it if you're saying education there is intent but not implementation with social media there are other nations that have been able to regulate they have been able to put a tap on fake news on what circulates and how much and without getting into the Privacy aspect of it the security aspect and the sovereignty aspect has been correct pegged correct so why haven't we been able to do it in bhat I think there is some sense of concern that this could lead to backlash over privacy concerns or it could it could lead to backlash over free speech and artistic content and all that my point is somebody has to swallow the bit Bill somebody has to take the hard decisions and it obviously can only be a government which has the mandate to come back to Power for the third time third time and that to with I may say so not withstanding the results with minimal Reliance on Coalition Partners Coalition and with Coalition Partners who are extremely supportive with Coalition partners with whom you have a long-standing record with Coalition Partners who seem to share your sense of ideological Vision as well as competitive vision for bhat and I'm specifically speaking of Mr Chandrababu and Mr pan Kalan as far as Mr nitish Kumar is concerned I must at least plead ignorance to some extent and I think um compared to the three people that I'm mentioned namely Mr nsh Kumar Mr Chandrababu n and pan Kalan Mr Chandrababu Naidu has expressed a very clear Vision right from the outset and he's had a track record of delivering on that when it comes to undivided and Pradesh right and Mr pan Kalan is an emerging uh let's say youth uh Power according to me at least in parts of the South so therefore with these Coalition Partners each of them bringing what I think 14 seats plus two seats about 16 plus you have to 40 you're not that badly positioned to affect a few changes which are seminal which are tectonic and most importantly crucial and imperative I'm hoping that at least in this term this doesn't become about another round of Elections Municipal pchat District State Assembly can we now focus on serious heart policy which are long lasting I'm not saying that last 10 years have not seen policy changes obviously we have seen different let's say area of digital Stacks being implemented and therefore the benefits have come out but on this front on the education front on the cultural front I'm genuinely of the view that the last decade represents a decade of lost opportunity ities and I say this as someone who wishes well for bhat and as someone who may have a political leaning but has no political affiliation and my position in this regard is bhat first correct I I think for a lot of people it is bhat first now if you were to look back at what happened in Luka 2024 we see the Contour and you've touched upon it and you say that we must push through policy as as a government the government must focus on policy is this also a reflection of us as Society say something do something be something I don't know if it's a representation of us as a culture but it certainly is a representation of us as a contemporary Society I'm trying to protect my ancestors from any kind of criticism for our action when I say this because it's easy to tarnish the entire uh society and it's its past what I'm trying to say is let's say our ancestors not just my ancestors the point is that over the last 10 years for good or bad there's been a convergence of heightened awareness of day-to-day political activity along with the explosion of social media so every day it's like a reality SAS Bahu story that's going on correct right and people are watching it with some vicarious pleasure oh this man said this oh that man said this oh I've got my gotcha moment uh against this person oh this person has been exposed if the thinking population at least focuses on the policy aspects of it there we need to do two things one the thinking population needs to form a strong water base only then you will matter and the load turnout this time has also affected the thinking population you want to make yourself count then you make your vote count you should have done that and second keep harping on it the only way you get things done in this country is by constantly badgering either through courts or outside of it but if you choose to Outsource all those activities exclusively to political stakeholders with no participation between between two different elections I don't think that's going to work I'm not saying that you're looking at an apathetic establishment I'm just saying that it's equally an establishment that is driven by incentive incentive cor or disincentive whatever the case may be there you need to push I genuinely hope that the the conversations that people are having through very thinking deep podcasts translates to Awakening this particular aspect of our society I give up on two different aspects of the society those who are so rich and affluent that no policy change will affect them those who are so poor that they don't care or they can't care they don't have the wherewithal they're struggling for food so therefore this responsibility and this honorous task falls again on the middle class for those who are in the middle there is a new middle also that is now coming in and which is adding to this ex so the hope is that this middle class base grows and the hope is that we shape their thought process to the extent possible and I don't mean in a condescending patternization if they wanted to not just given an opportunity could have gone to or can go to America or some other place they've continued to stay in this country there's a significant middle class base that wants to stay in bat and we have seen a decent trickle down of riverse Bane rain also happening yeah so therefore more and more people are joining here with experience from other jurisdictions I don't think you could have asked for a better set of conditions to cultivate a thinking population now this is the the right thinking population or or or an intelligence here which is there which stands as a counter to an already established left liberal ecosystem or a leftist ecosystem and which is only swinging further left it's it's it's not uh they may call themselves Progressive but they are increasingly regressive increasingly aggressive correct do you believe this is one of the issues which has not been very strongly addressed in the last 10 years the fact that a thinking right and intelligence here percolating all the way down has not been created or not been invested into so that that can go ahead and perhaps counter a lot of the misinformation that's floating around see you and I have had conversations on this in the past in other coners in other discussions also so therefore I'm slightly wary of using the word right okay I would say that the left in bhat is perhaps the left but there is no concept of a right right because those who think of themselves as as right also typically lean left when it comes to certain economic policies that has happened so as people say often there is no right in bhat therefore I'm happy that there is no right in bhat because of its negative connotations outside this country it has serious racist connotations it has serious colonizing connotations so I'm looking at what I call either the indic or the Batwing batwing okay let's say let's say the bhartia way of thought of thought so so on that front a sample snapshot of the last decade or so will reveal a lot of celebratory moments in public Limelight some book launch some book release people suddenly emerging uh in public Consciousness through their efforts or because of social media Advantage all that has happened and therefore it has created a certain effect but you see these effects can be ephemeral yeah they can be transient and momentary it's like a blip in the longer time cycle of History this is just a blip correct anybody who thinks that they've managed to affect a change and which is lasting in nature don't I mean they don't realize what it was to be before this happened and how quickly this can change if there is a change of establishment or if let's say somebody else chooses to cracked on heavily on this development right therefore my conscious belief is that this needs to be entrenched so heavily in the society that it becomes a movement of its own without the need for constant political support so I'm saying give the policy push first entrench it in the society with concrete steps and let the society be empowered to the extent that its institutions are capable of taking the movement forward regardless of who's in power so there has to be a public private participation here that's why I keep saying that when someone thinks that culture is completely independent of religion or faith they don't understand how this works you may love Diwali as a celebratory moment you may love Diwali as let's say a cultural moment but is Diwali independent of faith faith the origin is Faith so there are cultural Hindus who say I love our let's say culture but I'm not particularly religious but you are only the beneficiary of a second grade derivative or secondary derivative of the Prime cause and the prime cause is inevitably religion religion so how are you hoping so it's like saying I want to preserve a particular derivative that comes out of a tree for its medicinal purposes but I'm not interested in protecting the tree nor am I interested in protecting the communities which have a cultural and a religious relationship with the tree how is that possible so I would say empower the society at its core let it not be subservient to the state and therefore it goes back to free temples free temples let it not be subservient to any political outfit or a cultural organization let them be empowered to do this so that this thought is decentralized only a thought which is decentralized and is given empowerment Will Survive and I'm drawing a extensive support here from how the jihadis operate yeah that you know they do it for all the wrong things but they all converge they converge and they basically are individual radical agents yeah it's impossible for you to hope that if you finish one the job is done because someone else will come about that needs to be the way on this side as well but for the right reasons for BH reasons Reas to protect this country you need to decentralize bhia thought Consciousness and hope that your empowering its its its decentralization across States I'll give you a very clear example if you go to parts of Andra or even parts of Telangana for that matter hardcore practicing devout Hindus yeah do you think all of them will vote for the party associated with hinda no no because they believe that well the party that is in my state is good enough to protect my Hindu interest Hindu interest which I think is perhaps the best way forward that you also have a central figure so that have a unifying figure but you also have Regional actors who take up the cause and go forward why because the challenges are unique to each region correct the problems that a Hindu faces in Tamil NAD are very different from what a Hindu faces in Telangana or Coastal Andra Pradesh for that matter or Bengal for that matter or rut Pradesh for the matter you can't have a one siiz fits-all approach that localization is Possible only when people are able to relate to a party that is homegrown from that territory that is why one of the reasons that penetration for National parties has become so difficult unless it's a party that has been across the country right from the beginning namely the Congress Congress because they've had a long-standing establishment of having presence across the country but everybody else who's come after that after them is the second runner in the market and they're also offshoots of the earth Congress they both broken away the opposition broke away and Splinter Splinter Pary so therefore the brand value also gets associated with them that they were previously part of this but but the reverse part can also apply Sak where you can say that a National Party Starts investing in local leadership starts investing and trying to you know develop people from the grassroot who have work with with its perhaps original you know mother source absolutely and otherwise that example is that happening on ground that's one and the second point when you talk about this thought Continuum do you see it actually being invested nurtured and pushed and encouraged do you believe that you would hold this against a party that said that it represent or it will bat for hinda has it actually done that so let me give you one political example and one non-political example okay one of the finest finds of the BJP according to me which boards well for the longevity of hinda and for the thinking population is K namalay not withstanding the outcome correct because he gave it his all if you look at the number of patras that he did throughout the state in the heat of tamilnad and I saw him at the end of that where both of us shared space for a particular event he was standed all across didn't even have the time to cut his beard and he still made time and his energy levels were the same and for the first time in bhat's history ever since the founding of the bhia janata party it is actually a political player of some importance in Tamil NAD in tamad and the credit for this should go to this gentleman and his team and the fact that the population has also responded to it don't go by the outcomes because there are quite a few issues with the outcomes but nevertheless I do believe that the increase in the vote share the public perception that there is an alternative here to drist uh ideology there a separate ideological tent pole it's not two deidan offshoots who are fighting with each other iconography it's two ideological tent poles dravidian and anti- dravidian when somebody speaks of a North South divide parist and anti perista we should say it that way when somebody speaks of a North South divide in tamilnad now they will not go uncontested there will be a response to it and it will be a homegrown response which speaks Chase Tam in a language that they understand that is crucial so that political example is good so I believe that fins young fins such as Mr analay must be empowered further because that sends a message to the youth as well he is more relatable and he has a long Innings ahead of him according to me the other ideological tent pole which which stands out for me even though he was not uh he's also homegrown is Yogi adiat 100% for what he stands for there is no corre you know his standing has always been independent of any organization organization or a political entity altoe he he remains steadfast on that and he would be whatever he is independent of where he stands who he stands and that's the reason why what he does and there is a certain constituency that believes that he's the right man to take this state forward in there there are forget the political machinations and political leanings altogether that's why his investment on the ground is actually so solid and strong that see typically what happens is when you enter politics people will wonder if everything you've done until that point is to enter politics yeah people wonder oh did he calculate all of this did he game all of this even if you ask the most hardcore of supporters of Shri Yogi ad they'll tell you two things one even if he did so what he's ultimately delivered but the Primary Response will be he has been doing this all his life regardless of what the outcome may be he's been the same he's been the same his positions have not changed he's not diluted his position for whatever he's not said I will now dilute my position because I've come to a position of power he remains what he is so that is the political aspect the nonpolitical aspect is here I would believe that the attitudinal shift towards the Hindu society and the symbolism has helped the general Society be much more open about their identity people are much more open I've seen so many people come up to me and say we have started applying the to our offices doesn't matter if it's an MNC I said good very good do it people are proud about it but see these are sentiments it's a good sentiment to have it's a great sentiment to have because that emotion is the starting point of it correct but how are you going to action it on that front I believe that on the non-political front to be honest and to be candid I do believe that not too much has happened not too much has happened whatever has happened has happened organ to the society which is a good thing but what is the point of an establishment or a state that it is capable of creating a multiplier effect and that is the multiplier effect that the Congress neui and Marxist leftist establishment understood so well that the entrance establishment that is spread across the country regardless of whichever region you go to is the is the let's say the the the barrier that you constantly run into run into correct every time you try to do something so when someone says Society alone is sufficient but state is not enough no both work together particularly when you're looking at challenges which are both within and from outside and the challenge to bhia Consciousness is not limited to actors within it is significantly funded by people outside and this is a history of at least 200 years I've documented this there are others who have done a much better job than I have and the origins The Roots and the tentacles go far beyond bat Europe and to other parts of the world so I believe that when you realize these challenges the society does not have the option of taking power lightly and the state also does not have the option of writing of the society to say your job is to only vote and do nothing Beyond and we will not deliver on this front even if you're looking at it purely from a political calculus the success of bat and those political stakeholders who bat for bat lies in an empowered bhia Society it is not just a strategic it's not just a cultural imperative it is a strategic political imperative correct we've run out of time but I want to push this one one last question we take it another three minutes if we can the the the concept of nationhood s see when you say India that is bhat and article one defines us as bhat how many of us identify ourselves as bhartia somewhere do you believe this is something that needs to be addressed irrespective of which political disposition is there because when it it stems from when you don't want to vote when you're okay with doing something for me but it's not going to happen I'll do it here I don't care what's happening to somebody else this all stems eventually towards contributing to that part saying that I'm thinking about myself and I'm not thinking about my country right how do we bring this aspect of nationhood and drill it into the consciousness of the people you know um I had this conversation with a few people who are much better informed than I am and I'll tell you how the Matrix I've I've understood it as imagine you had guruk kulas where bhara is not in bhata is not in question plus you had a joint family setup where culture is an integral part of it where you learn about your ithas from your grandparents correct then you had a very clear Temple goinging population you've lost all of them yeah it's all gone it's all gone it's all gone the foundational fundamental building blocks of your cultural Mings and your religious Moorings and your National Moorings have all been destroyed now what are we trying to do we are trying to create a patchwork Now by hoping that we will invest in One Direction or the other in a skute fashion but you have such a serious problem in reinvesting in the very same path that led you to this in the in the past because I understand okay in contemporary circumstances you may not be comfortable with the concept of a joint family I understand that but what about the other two aspects an extended Hindu ecosystem where no Hindu family feels isolated is good enough according to me where it is connected either to a temple or to a gurukula or to a sad sad so okay on education front you want a concrete suggestion why haven't you set up a Hindu Board of schools is it so difficult an option for anybody to have thought of it in the last 10 years what am I suggesting that is rocket science what am I suggesting that requires an IQ of 160 simplest way forward is an optional you give that elective let people do instead what are you doing okay you've started ik systems but ik systems are like electives yeah you're giving people a flavor you're just giving them a flavor now have you used a full system proper ecosystem system end to end let us see how the system works and I challenge you that these people will turn out to be much more disciplined much more coherent much more focused and much more rooted who can give the best in the world a run for their money even in competitive segments you don't have to worry about whether they'll be ready for the competition of the world I'm confident of the fact that they'll give others around for their money because the way of life that this education will teach will teach them to control their senses instead of being distracted in 100 different directions that is the strength of it if you really wanted to do this and if you're serious about this 10 years was good enough time at least now you should do it you should do it you have been given good Coalition Partners who in principle will not object to this what can what more can you ask for even in the third term true what's your next book it's a continuation so what was a Trilogy has become a tetrology so hopefully I should release it by the end of the year or just about early next year because it's taking longer than I anticipated because the more I read the literature the more I'm reminded of the fact that it is running in parallel the past and the present are running in parallel and I can see a lot of similarities yes so I'm trying to fuse both to ensure that the public understands that this is not an archival study of the past it is a reflection of the present that the past has already played out and we are hoping that we don't make the mistakes of the past mistakes of the so it's taking me some time but hopefully it should be out in about four months four five months what happened between 1920s and 1930s exactly what is actually we're replicating itself between 20 20 and 2030 correct it's just that are we going to do better and learn from the mistakes of the past correct correct are you confident people or are we repeating the same mistakes final question I'm a dharmic Optimist and I believe that ultimately Niti will play itself out I'm not an HST I just believe that Free Will has a significant room in dhic calculus it's not as if everything is predestined there are a certain set of probabilities that time will Point towards It ultimately falls upon pre to see which of these probability Works itself out and becomes a reality that is how you typically see timelines that's how the dharmic approach to time is time is if we continue going down this path with zero investment and increasing apathy because we believe that political success is in everything then I think the next generation will struggle our children will struggle let's be very real our children will struggle but if we actually work on this and put policy let's say uh implements which at least see us through for the next 50 years I'm not over 100 years we still haven't reached a stage where we think like the Chinese for 100 200 years that'll take some time at least 50 years that's a reasonable timeline I think if you're able to tide over the next 50 years which the 25 year cycle is going to be extremely volatile and tumultous for multiple reasons then you will have a better as say set of people to think about the next 100 years correct I just want to see that we survive this 25 year period under any circumstances with our confidence with our demographics and with our resources and borders intact once you you do this you're ready for the next level true there is a leftist Continuum there's a maist Continuum there is an islamist Continuum and the drist Continuum and a drist Continuum but where is the Hindu or the bhat Continuum that's the larger question correct we leave it at that and park this as the peg for the next conversation hopefully soon s always a pleasure thank you so much thank you

Channel: CNN-News18

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Id: Mu3rqNm_AeY

Length: 42min 20sec (2540 seconds)

Published: Fri Jun 14 2024