24 hours left were told. that the oxygen supply might be dwindling even further. There was only about 96 hours at least that was a conservative estimate. We were told at the very outset of his story. When we first heard that Titan had gone missing, let's bring into the conversation. dr. Selmer colleano. associate professor of history at Campbell University. an expert in this and we spoke with him last night. Thanks so much last night. with us yet again. I know you are very busy following all this kind of like we are as well. but I wanted to First up ask you as well. We now know the search area has doubled in size since you and I spoke at this very time. last night. when you think of that, does that bode well? or not? It does that leave some pessimism. in your view since they have expanded the area of this search. I want to put up this tweet here from the Coast Guard. Guard because This is kind of hard to decipher. I don't know if you can help us make out this map here. What are we looking at? basically, laying track lines. So they would have initially scoured that area in the upper left and what they did was. look at the area from where the submersible dropped and understand it is and feet to the bottom. this submersible doesn't have a lot of propulsion and you're right in the Gulf Stream. So you actually have to let the submersible drop. Upstream from where the Titanic is. because the Gulf Stream will push it. toward where it is now. if it aborted, its launch and came back up. you wouldn't really quite know where it is on the surface. and even though you search an area of the ocean you have to come back over it in search of Again, multiple times. because you may have missed the point where the sound was being omitting or where the object is. and what they're doing Now is moving, probably a long the drift pattern of maybe where the submersible was, if it was either on the surface or just below the surface. that's so interesting because we do know so that the, search is in the air. The search is also about two miles deep, but also on the surface level itself and I want to talk about the assets being deployed, Sal, but both, you know, US Navy assets Coast Guard assets but also what the Canadian side is doing to and I want to see if you're familiar with this. system. it's called The Fly Away deep ocean Salvage system otherwise known as fa DDOS. SS. It's apparently a motion compensated lift system designed to provide reliable. deep ocean lifting capacity for the recovery of large. Bulky. and heavy. undersea objects in the Navy has deployed. this have you heard of it? Yeah, it's a, it's a salvage system used by the Navy and the idea is you go down. and you would attach it to an object. and there are two ways to get objects up from the deep ocean. and one of them is to attach these lift bags. that basically are like big balloons and you inflate them and you bring them up, but you have to be careful about that. because just using those lift bags, you can flip the object, you can turn it. You can actually lose it and the system, the Navy's develop is a designed to be attached at multiple points and you can basically Basically. control the lift. coming up, so it is a salvage. system that be used. the worst-case scenario would be like trying to attach a cable to it and hoist Ting it up because then it's dangling at the end of literally, a big fish hook, And this is a much more controllable path system because you don't want system object being dropped again. okay? Because apparently from some reporting out there, it suggests that it might not get there or be operable. in time to even make a difference. If you seen that it may not it's going to take time to get out there and they have probably other Salvage equipment. that's on. site that got there. So they would have, you know, be bringing that in and if they can use it, they will. If not they'll use the systems, they have at hand. should they locate the submersible? okay, but Sal, let's get to really the news of the day and item that everyone has really latched onto. about these quote, unquote. Sounds banging noises. That's what the Coast Guard is Describing them as and you were watching the latest press conference from those Coast Guard officials. And from my view they didn't seem to give much Credence seem whether or not the sounds would give them any indication of where the vessel might be, but they did. literally re Center and refocus some of their search efforts on where those sounds were coming from you know, I reach out some of my Coast Guard sources to see if you know, we could get some type of audio. file or something. Just so we can. hear what they were hearing. Do you have any more information? on that? specifically today? Because it seems like turning Aloft from that idea. They don't want people to get their hopes up just from these noises. Well, as you showed on that chart and you saw the the area they're covering if you think about it think about the number of sonobuoys that they're dropping in the ocean they're not as many. There's not enough ears to be listening to them all the time. And so this the through computer systems and and they listen for sounds. And then what they'll do is they'll go back and listen to them with human ears, but then they have to crunch the numbers. and that's why the represented from Woods Hole was talking about the data it's really important that because even if you here, a metal on metal sound from one, sonar buoy that doesn't really tell you where anything is it gives you may be a direction you need to be able to triangulate that from multiple sources at the time? and again, the oceans allowed noisy place There's probably things banging up against the hull of Titanic. There are other wrecks down there from the graveyard of the Atlantic from World War one and World War Two. And, and so it's really difficult to be able to pick a noise out. someone uses uses the idea of picking out one instrument, from out marching band. That's what you're trying to locate. Okay, so that was news to be, I guess today, maybe some other viewers that the ocean is a very, very noisy place. And I think we've established that how you know at what level of depth do we know. even if these noises these sounds are coming from. Well, that's the other element you have, I mean, the ocean has a gradient this temperature gradient. And so you got to get down below that. thermal layer to be able to hear it. So, again, you're operating in three dimensions here, because your sonar buoy floating on the surface, or toads, array, has to be able to give you a direction It it doesn't just give you a flat two-dimensional directions. I could be that. Three-dimensional Direction And so it's really hard to do it in Plus sound gets bent in the ocean because gets water salinity. and density and things like that. Sound doesn't travel in a straight line. and so you have to basically adjust for that. And so what you're always doing is readjusting and trying to triangulate and fix on to a position. It's really difficult Again, I go back to the issue that most movies you've ever seen with, with navies and submarines those submarines operate in Fairly shallow water than this less than thousand feet. of water when you're down to 13,000 feet, that's a whole new area. It's like trying to pick a sound out from the bottom of the Grand Canyon. Well yeah. and we have been talking to submersible Pilots. and in the extent, you know, their experience. They only go 15 2,000 feet. below the surface. This mission feet below the surface, this mission was attempting to go twelve. Thirteen thousand feet below the surface as well. You know, I want to kind of pose a theory to some of our other experts. to some of our other experts about this. One of them had kind of put forth, the fact that and this is a theory you've seen circulating out there that maybe the structural Integrity of the vessel itself possibly the hall was compromised and then it went from there. Have you seen that swirling around? Is there Credence to that? You think?I have when you listen to the way, Ocean Gate talked about this. you know, they didn't do the standard survey of the hull, you know, when they would use measurement devices to ensure that the hull is at a constant, you know, thickness throughout they were using basically, sound and and you know, eyesight to be able to determine this and the problem you have is as you go deeper and deeper in the water that pressure increases and what happens is, if there's any flaw any Ripple, any deficiency? What So, so much the pressure is going to act on that surface. inordinately and what it will do is create the rupture. And that's the fear here. Is that because they were operating with this. Again, the reason he didn't want to get Get a classification. Society, the reason he didn't want the American Bureau of shipping. with their 273 page. manual on submersible operations to come in. is because he built this submersible in a much different way than other submersibles have been built. It's not a large metal sphere. It's a tube built out of this kind of a unique material. and so to get material certified and how to regulate it, and how to ensure. There's no deformities on it. would require a whole new system in place. And so that was the other thing. and there's been so many questions raised about you know, the nature of how Ocean Gate kind of operates this. if this was all aboveboard and I could think I had asked you last night on whether or not, you know this specific very Niche industry. needs to take a good hard look internally at themselves about whether or not this is going to be safe going forward and What needs to change because so many questions are being raised. well, that letter, you you showed from um, the maritime society that does submersibles the big fear does the industry right now I could tell you is that you know, legislation is going to come down to basically make it much more difficult to operate. submersibles. when submersible operation until you listen, we're following rules. and regulations, very stringent ones. We have to be able to operate in the commercial environment. for offshore drilling. for laying of cables and pipes. And what they would say is ocean gain, isn't, you know, it's the abnormal way of operating that's not the way. we do business. Yes, and that's one of the reasons you saw that critique come out from MTS. They really wanted to ensure that Ocean Gate was following rules that they were using these entities out there. I think the other element here Beyond Ocean Gate, Horizon Maritime, which operates the polar prints which is a outfit that operates. deep support vessels You know they launched this vessel off a Canadian flag vessel with a Canadian crew out of a Canadian port and I think there's going to be some issues about why Canada wasn't doing oversight over this was their inspections of this submersible being done by the Canadian Maritime transport. areas that do ocean serve at a do ocean inspections of vessels. Because again, there's a lot of questions being raised now about the operation of this vessel. in the kind. Of. international waters. Yeah. I mean at this point in time we do know the hours are dwindling. and the race. to find this. is getting quite minimal eye. There's not much time left is what I'm saying and so there are kind of three options right now find it from the air. find it from the surface or find it somewhere a little bit below the surface. What's the best mode If you can even assess that right now, that you think that because you've been following this, do you think there is a chance? in one of those three areas? more likely than the other? well, I think again, you know, if they were able to shed their way and pop to the surface that is the best. the best scenario right now, because that's the quickest recovery. operation, they can basically go Fish it out, pop the hatch and get everybody out. That's the thing. If they find them on the bottom and they're intact, you still have the whole process of trying to bring them up. and you're racing Against Time. at that point. If there's somewhere in between there, you know, they weren't able to shed their weight but again, the way this submersible is designed it goes up or down, that's it. Okay. you know, it should be somewhere in that be somewhere in that area but I think because you're seeing thaton the ocean, they're still trying to cover the ocean and once they reach that point, then you get into a recovery operation. And if this submersible suffered a catastrophic failure to find a crush submersible is going to be really difficult, okay? Yeah. And there was a just thought of this now because there was another theory kind of also percolating out there. that the submersible The Vessel itself. might have gotten Not in the wreckage of the Titanic. and it's stuck. Have you seen that Would that even be possible? Because from what I understand, you can't get that close to it, right? Well, I mean it's like dropping you know, know, a ping-pong ball from the top of the Empire State Building and landing in a cup. I mean, that's the, that's the analogy there. It's really good to I mean, this, this submersible had a hard time finding Titanic when it was on the bottoms at some point. Say no, know, he's find it it's not easy to locate at times and the idea that they fell and landed on the Titanic. I think is very unlikely at all. All right, summer colleano just lastly, I mean, we're getting down to the wire here. A lot of people we have spoken to are quite resigned to the fact. This is not going to be A happy ending here that many have kind of been speaking as if the five. onboard have already. perished because they have been there since last Sunday. Is that how you feel right now or do you have hope still you know there have been submarine rescues in the past. you know, the squalus off a Portsmouth in 1939 in 1939, found crew on Pisces three, and nineteen early. 1970s to Personnel on board. It was a deep submergence. vessel. They were only down at 1,700 feet. but they came up with less than an hour's worth of air left. Again, I go to the very end until the point you reach where there's no potential for life to exist. you still treat this as a rescue operation. It's and we like I said, always appreciate your Insight and
