Michael Franzese - Untold Stories of the Mafia

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well in my world you can't be disrespectful on that life ever never you lyin through your teeth lyin every other word is a lie and if you can master that technique then you can get just about anything you want in any negotiation I don't care what Paulie says I don't care what do you accuse you up I don't care what names he calls you you don't open your mouth and you don't answer unless we answer for you what we tell you to answer if I call you a liar I lose the argument automatically if I get upset with you and lose my temper I lose the argument automatically you could be the least smartest guy in the world but you got to make them think that you're smarter than that and he says well I want to kill Jerry Zimmerman I said well then I got a clue your brother-in-law so what are we gonna accomplish it he pounds his hand on a table he says I want them dead [Music] for some of you that are wondering why I brought a mobster here or former mobster who lives a completed for life right now is because in the world of business there's a lot of dirty place a lot of power place and if you don't know how to play those plays games someone's going to eat you up alive without being said please help me bring up Michael Franzese they're good so it's good to see you yeah Michael good crowd yes good crowd they've been looking forward to spending some time with you you know we're talking aback I'm like Michael what do we talk about that we haven't already talked about how many guys have seen the interview about who anybody's seen the interview so that's the challenge few people yeah few people have seen the interview so why don't we take in a complete different direction today you and I won power place that maybe were you know told on you and probably the stories I wouldn't mind if we can get into is maybe early on when you're coming up somebody that was able to do a power play on you that you were kind of sitting there saying wow I can't believe Doug actually pulled it off on me that helped you learn to become better yourself on the street and then later on we can talk about reading people in rooms and negotiation rooms many of the guys here sit when investors competitors buyer sellers vendors partners how do you read the room who's really the decision-maker who's the EF Hutton who's not but having said that let's go back to power place so coming up in the streets of New York I mean these are the times of the 80s these are tough times these are competitive times these are times it's about territory you've got to be able to stand up and in our world worst thing that can happen to us go out of business in your world worse than that can happen to us you're out of life it's a complete different ballgame right you could get killed so what were some stories or examples you had of power played played against you and power plays that you played against somebody else that was in a more stronger position than you were you know early on I got a great education you know that's that could be a very treacherous life obviously people you know that and when I was a young recruit recruit meaning I had just been proposed into the life and I now had to prove myself to get my stripes so you had to do anything and everything you were told to do and at the time I was just feeling my way I had gotten in trouble I had a few indictments so I was I had really gone through it and I had a couple of businesses going I had a market you know like a market we have all different stations you got me you got got the whole thing so we had a meet division there and Paul Castellano who was the boss of the Gambino family at the time he had a lot of people involved in the chicken business he's a wholesale chicken guy so one of his relatives were selling me chickens we had to buy from him because he was the budget business it was legit yeah I think so so so anyhow I was buying all my chickens from him it's Memorial Day weekend the anniversary is actually coming up and I buy a load of chickens for him and I'm selling them to people who wholesale in the given away Memorial Day were a beautiful weekend so we sell to this one woman on Tuesday she comes back and she said you sold me bad chickens I says what do you mean well they were all filled with maggots now they were only in my freezer for a day right so couldn't have been us so I said take him back I gave it back the money to hold bitch so I call up Pauly's guy and I said listen I'm not gonna pay for these chickens because it was something wrong with them there was maggots he said no you're gonna pay me for the chickens I said no I'm not gonna pay you we go back and forth these thoughts cussing me out I start cussing him out and so on and so forth he says you know who I am I said I don't care who you are you know I'm a young brash guy at that time and I hang up the phone on him next thing you know I get a call from my boss at the time he was a cop regime and and he just get downtown right away I got to see it so I jump on my car go downtown I go to you know downtown Brooklyn I said what's the problem did you have an argument with somebody on the phone I said yeah I said over these chickens and I explained the story to him he said you realize who that guy was and I said I know but he still sold me bad chicken so I have to pay you know so he said you're in a lot of trouble that's Paul Castellanos nephew it got back to Paulie he's the boss of the Gambino family you got a lot of trouble here you're not supposed to get out of control with a guy like that you always keep your temper alright so what are we gonna do he's we're gonna have a sit-down with him he says but here's the deal when we get to that table you don't open your mouth I don't care what Paul he says I don't care what do you accuse you of I don't care what names he calls you you don't open your mouth and you don't answer unless we answer for you or we tell you to answer that's the rules hey you got it without hold us my life I was 23 23 23 years old so we get to the meeting and I'm getting abused Patty's abuse call me all sorts of names you know who I am who do you think you are I know who your father is but that doesn't give you a right to talk to my nephew like that on and on and on and on and on and I'm not answering they were answering for me right so the bottom line is he says do you want to buy chickens for me anymore and I looked at my guy said can I answer he said I said no I don't want to buy chickens from you I mean you would have thought this was like a the biggest deal in the world right a couple of pounds of chickens it was always over that so but you know in that world everything is very technical they make a mountain out of a molehill and you know that think Patrick at that meeting what wish would happen at these sit downs the old-timers were very technical for instance rules of a sit-down let's make you on a you and I a made guys we're having an argument you'll lying through your teeth lying every other word is a lie if I call you a liar I lose the argument automatically if I get upset with you and lose my temper I lose them the argument automatically you got to know how to keep your mouth shut you got to be able to outsmart that person right and don't let him make you fall into a trap because a lot of times if an old-timer was wrong he's trying to get you into a trap so on technicalities you lose so I'm starting to figure this out here so I said look I don't want to buy chickens from you anymore it's just but I'm gonna do whatever my boss tells me to do he tells me to buy him I'm gonna buy him I said I'm a good soldier in that regard back and forth back and forth I took all the abuse and at the end of the day I didn't have to pay him for the chickens but I had to continue buying chickens from that was the compromise right so now I get in a car and they turn around and he starts yelling at me for a minute and there all of a sudden everything is silent there's the boss and my capo regime and they crack up laughing like this was the biggest funniest thing he said you Paulie I said I never seen Paulie get so mad over chickens he said you happen to do that bubble bud and they were all will at a good time over but what I learned at that point I learned just about these technicalities and how you got to keep your head a meeting like that you got to learn to outsmart people you got to be able to read the room you know I learned that whenever I went into a meeting like this I tried to learn that the personality the character of the person I was up against John Gotti for instance you can never let John Gotti think that you want an argument his ego wouldn't allow it so you had to figure out a way to outsmart him to make him think he won but you actually got what you want and when you can master that art you'll do pretty good and you know whatever I did in my whole life I was able to apply that to business in life now so that was my first but you know they got over me a little bit but we kind of compromised but it was a big lesson for me because that was my first major sit-down against a major guy so Michael let me ask you this so in my world I'm in obviously a lot of times you'll be in a board and you're negotiating with somebody and you know somebody in the room isn't telling the truth what is the benefit of not calling that out well you know or is it a different world than the world you were in well in my world you I mean you can pay serious consequences you can't be disrespectful in that life Patrick you know two made guys two guys that actually took the oath you can never disrespect one another never I mean you know they were made guys could never disrespect never nice respect so what does this respect mean calling a guy a name calling him a liar raising your voice to him really yeah a made guy cannot - a made guy no that's that's a major because the life allegedly is built on respect so you can never disrespect anybody it can never outwardly do it like I'll be honest well I had a I had a meeting what another made guy wants and he's trying to get involved in a gas business and I'm trying to keep him out he was a guy from my own family but he was trying to make a deal with God he to bring them into the business and I didn't want so I said can I talk to you a minute and this guy is doing life in prison right now so we go in the other room and we get in the other room I called him every name in the Sun when we walk out we shaking hands you're the best guy in the world I wouldn't let anybody see it because now if he told anybody I called him that I call him a liar so they had to believe me you mean the same way they had to believe him so he would never try to challenge that but no in that life you can never be disrespectful to one another no matter what it is you add it just bite your tongue and and try to outsmart the guy you know one thing I learned Patrick in a meeting and you know this you're the master of this that sometimes you could be in the meeting and you could be the smartest guy in the room and you don't want to let anybody know that let everybody talk levar we think that's smaller than you but you really know what's going on there's other times when you're in the room you could be the least smartest guy in a room but you got to make them think that you're smarter than them and if you can master that technique then you can get just about anything you want in any negotiation I found out to be how do you size that up like what what what things do you look for is the similar to like a game of poker where you know the guys still think he's frustrated after he loses he goes all-in are you looking for signs to kind of read everybody or have you done your due diligence before meeting how does that take place when I'm able to I do my due diligence I want to know the personality the character of the people I'm in with but there's times when I'll test somebody I'll throw out a word or two that I know is false and I'll see how he responds if he wants to make me think I know what I'm talking about say something has nothing doing anything or it's totally absurd and we'll see how they answer and sometimes they'll try to they'll give you an answer and you can start to it you know they'll indicate to you what kind of personality they are and really what you have the main thing is just let people talk first try to get as much out of them as you possibly can and then you can kind of figure it out like with gaudí a couple of times I had to sit down with him I knew that he could never believe that I was winning so in the midst of the argument I had to figure out what he really wanted and how I can get what I want letting him think that he got what he wants now know if I'm explaining that right but you know it's it's all about how you you you carry yourself it really is but you got to be prepared so so again like I'm thinking about for ourselves or versus yours it did you did your world Michael did everybody pretty much know everybody's character like wasn't like hey Tony I'm about to go sit with Vinny tell me a little bit about or did you already know who Vinnie was or who you know Johnny was because maybe in our world like if we go into a meeting and we don't know somebody you know outside of that like if you're saying you know you're the smartest you're not the smartest you know make yourself the opposite or whatever you are was there other methods you used to be able to read people in the room is there any other thing you did or to look for I'll give you another another story I got stories fern you know I had a big automobile dealership and I had an office that was on the second floor it was over looking at carlile big Chevrolet dealer one of the guys who work for me was out one day in the lot and I see him having an argument with somebody yeah I went back and forth arguing arguing arguing I don't pay attention I go sit at my desk few minutes later he comes upstairs his name was Jerry I said Jerry was that argument about he says some guy says we sold him a lemon he wanted his money back and he's going back and forth you know he called me a name I called him a name he says and then he mentioned that he had a connected uncle a brother-in-law I'm sorry connected brother-in-law I said what do you mean connected he said I he he didn't have anybody connected he was just mouthing off he said the guy's name was Mario he said so I told him go F Mario a nephew and I said Jerry I told you don't talk like that this is New York you never know who some he didn't know anybody I said well you know somebody right don't talk like that no I don't worry about he don't know anybody okay next day I get a call another made guy a guy by the name of Tony Tony to gawk we call him his big guy and he says Mike I got to see you please come into Brooklyn so I just happened to say Jerry I don't feel like driving I got to go into Brooklyn girl on Long God ride me so we go into Brooklyn we had a meet at a place called it was the it was on 18th Avenue it was called the 19th hole there was a Chinese restaurant next to it so we're going to back at a Chinese restaurant now here's what happened the guy that I had to meet was another made guy but I never met him as a made guy so if you're a made member of another family I can't just go up to you and say hey I'm Michael Franzese I made with the Colombo is your so-and-so you're made with the bonanno's we had to have somebody that knew us both introduced us got it right Michael amigo Nostra so-and-so and then we can talk as made guys so tony was that guy so we're going to back to the room and is a big old-time guy big guy there and he's got two guys with him and Tony says Michael amigo Nostra mean a friend of ours Mario I said Mario that sounds familiar right so I sit down I'm a young guys and all the guy and it says Mario what could I do for you is you got a guy by the name of Jerry Zimmerman with you I said yeah I know Jerry he pounds his hand on a table he says I want him dead that's all I said now I'm putting it together Mario the scene so now I'm thinking it's okay Mario do me a favor I got to go to the restroom I had a long drive in from Long Island because here's the deal if they knew Jerry was out there and they bring Jerry to sit down before I could prepare him and he says something wrong I can't save him because I'm a made guy as a made guy and we always had the right away so even it was somebody unto me if he would have said something wrong he's in trouble in bed truck what-what-what can't can you do anything to change that or no no not if he was if he said the wrong thing and he was disrespectful in any way or he answered wrong I can't help that's just the way it goes so I said man I gotta go a restaurant so I go outside Jerry's by the bar I said Jerry Mario's in there and he's not happy I said get out of here go up the street that had Dinah wait for me right so he goes up to the street for the diner now I'm relaxed I go back in I says Mario what could I do for you and he said you know this guy was very disrespectful this is my brother-in-law and so on and so forth and he says you know he he said eff me and all this kind of stuff and I said Mario I gotta understand I'm I'm gonna lie I said Mario your brother-in-law is not telling the truth I said I was sitting by the window I heard the whole thing I said Jerry never said that your brother-in-law was lying how could you I know my brother-in-law 20 years is why I know Jerry 20 years you know we're going back and forth and he says well I want to kill Jerry Zimmerman I said well then I gotta kill your brother-in-law so what are we going to accomplish it you know this is how it was literally this is this is literally I mean you would have thought we were it was a nuclear explosion this was this was over he's well I'm gonna put him in a hospital well I got to put your brother-in-law in a hospital so what are we going to do we're gonna go back and forth with this thing right I'm telling you Patrick this went on for three hours because she was an old-timer he wouldn't budge not budge an inch right now I'm saying man this is gonna go all the way up to the boss we're gonna have a whole production I said Mario tell me what you want what do you want out of this I said no don't even tell me I'll tell you what I'm gonna do I'm gonna give you a brother-in-law a new car tell him you won the argument you want I'll give him a new car and I'll take care of it Jerry well I want Jerry and I should stop the hospital so I'll take care of Jerry he's my guy take the new car tell your brother-in-law you won you know whatever it is you got it made that's how I finally resolved it right but listen to this I go out and I'm yelling at Jerry and everything and they said Jerry I don't trust this guy I don't trust them less you happen to be walking down the street as safe falls on your head I can't do it so here's what I'm gonna do you say what as you got a brother out in California I just go out to California for a while go relax out there when I think everything's all right I'll call you back so and you guys stand Mario resented me because I'm 30 years younger than him I'm a new guy so he already don't like me for that reason alone so jury goes out and about two months later he calls me up he says hey chief he says we're gonna be in a movie business that's what do you know about movies I don't worry it's easy we got a script and all this kind of stuff don't worry buddies just send me eighty-three thousand you'll be my partner ice all right so I sent him eighty-three thousand dollars and we produced this movie called mausoleum which was a horror movie right PS the end result is a million dollars later we produced this movie a horror movie that didn't scare anybody but me I'd be honest with you but but but that's how I backed into the movie business and then from there I realized right away I'll tell you what you remember Golan and Globus anybody remember that name Peter Guber would have told you all about them there were two guys they had a company and they were doing all of these you know kind of exploitation films so I spent a million dollars on this film so I go and see them they had offices in New York I said hey I got this film we spent a million dollars and he said okay he said we'll give you 25 grand I said I don't think you heard me I said I said I spent a million dollars on this he said I will give you 25 grand that was it so I said no thank you so I'd take the film it but that's when I realized you had to be in the distribution business so I bought a distribution company at that point and how I started to get involved in the film but in this way back when on an accident on a mistake because I didn't pay attention I just sent them the money I didn't look into anything and I didn't research anything I just trust the jury and you know I almost got destroyed on that film did it end up being profitable sheriff yeah so saving Jerry's life made your money yes a lot of headaches but it made me money yes it was worth saving his life like with Michael let me ask you this you know running a business a lot of people who run a business here you wonder who supports who is sales whose operations who's this who's that in your world you would tell me you guys got soldiers you guys got earners right what is the difference between a personality of a soldier and an earner and did you ever have a situation where a soldier also was a great earner but was there equality for each we had about at that time we had about a hundred and fifteen made guys guys that actually took the oath out of the hundred and fifteen Patrick 20 of us were earning that's it 20 of us the other 95 who had a you know a gambling problem we gave him a union job we tried to do our best to support him them but then they did a lot of the you know the heavy work the street work because you know it's like anything else you want to protect the Golden Goose so the guys that are bringing in the money you try not to jeopardize them and the other guys that are just capitalizing on being part of that life we made them do the work you know most of the time was it was there a personality difference or no like was there was there a trend amongst the 95 soldiers that they were now at business savvy there were not communicators they were now leaders what maybe there were tougher guys maybe there were not what was the difference between the two yeah I mean you could tell almost immediately you know you talked to a guy a few minutes you know if he's got a head for business and hot and then you know some of those guys they're just thrilled to be part of the life and they want to do whatever they got it but they don't have to earn I mean they really don't you got to give him a job you got to support him looking at life we were always shy like in money you know it's Shylock I mean lending it out in your jury's rates every one of us were in that business so what I did with the guys around me that really couldn't earn on their own I would give them money and turn to put out on the street so we learned a couple points a week I'd give it to them and then you know that's how you made guys earn back then it was a little a little easier you know because you had that kind of thing going and you know back then in the 80s Bank money wasn't easy to come by so we had plenty of customers that wanted money by the time I lent a lot of business people money back then you were making what 20 half to five points boy yeah it would go from two and a half to five points you know and then sometimes if you you know I'll be honestly if you wanted to take the business over you you know you give the guy you make a little harder for him to pay every week so he'd pay five six seven points but you know it's easy you come to me at twelve o'clock you got the money at 2:00 there's no application no nothing you don't want you go about your business but it was big business at the time like a lot of the names that we know you know the god heed your father who's legendary yet what he did within that world and Persico paul castellano all these guys their names that we've seen all across Hollywood who were some of the names that were earners we don't hear the names like guys who you would say that guy was legit this guy was real i what he was doing but it's not commercialized like some of the other names Castellano was legit he was a big honor he had a good head for business he was you know he had a lot of legitimate things going and if you're a boss people are sending your money all the time you know Patrick when I went into the gas business I'll tell you how it happened you know I backed into that too you know a lot of people have the impression that mob guys sit in their social clubs and this is important for you to know there's sitting there's social clubs and they target businesses they said we're going to go after this is going to go after that doesn't happen that way 90 percent at a time it's somebody within the business that has some kind of scheme to make a little extra money and they'll come to us and present it to us because they figure if they need financing we can give it to them if they need you know so muscle we can give it to them and we're never going to tell on them so they come to us that happened to me so often people I wanted to make a few extra bucks that come to me and that's how I get involved that's how I got involved in a gas business so you know Marya legitimate guys Persico for instance she was a pretty good earner when I found out what I had with the gas business I went to him and I said jr. here's the deal I'm gonna show you more money than you ever saw in your life but and he right away said no drugs we don't get involved in drugs because we didn't get involved in it we got involved in drugs we got killed we weren't a lot big fallacy out there that mob was pushing drugs back then not true some guys were doing it on a sneak but as a business we didn't get involved so I said jr. it's not drugs he's what is it I said it's gas what do you mean I said well it's a tax thing that I was that I created I said but here's the deal everybody's gonna want to get involved in this from all five families they're all gonna want to get involved as soon as you open that door we're gonna get in trouble I said it's going to be the same thing that happens all the time I said you got to make me win every argument you can't play politics don't sell me out I told them just like that as you do that you make me win every time cuz I'll be right and I'm going to show you more money than you ever had let me see at one point in time after probably six months I was bringing him in almost two million dollars a week now in that life two million dollars a week buys you a lot of loyalty trust me I never lost an argument in the gas business never lost and I went against God II and went against Castellano I went against everybody that wanted a piece so you know does that apply to the real world look when people are making money with you that are happy I mean that's the way it is you know what they're happy I mean money buys a lot of loyalty in business you know people don't want to disrupt that and it's true on the street I think it's true in real life too I've seen that you know that powerful that's very true so when you make money or partners vendors everybody's happy you continue doing business and they do additional things for you you you had a lot of issues I mean within your career whether it's government or lawyers or any of that stuff how do you yourself see the court system that we have and outside of the court system you know today like in a marketplace of being an entrepreneur building a business what do you think are some things business people need to look out for that has to do with lawyers that has to do with the government and regulation subject there but you know listen you know and I wrote this in my book look I made a lot of money illegally a lot of money you know I had this gasoline tax fraud case I mean deal that at one point in time we were pulling in seventy eight million dollars a week okay a lot of it cash a lot of it I had a divisor system to send money through wires overseas to various bank accounts we did different things to try to hide the money that we are earning when I finally got in trouble when the government came on me with these racketeering laws that are devastating you don't ever want to get involved in a Rico very very hard to defend and of course to millions of dollars even if you're innocent doesn't matter just defend these cases are very difficult and you know in in all my cases like Giuliani and Deitz me on a case I had a million dollar bail I paid my lawyers almost three million dollars I spent seven months in a courtroom every single day on trial it took me a year and a half to prepare I was found not guilty but it cost me twenty million dollars Wow twenty million dollars to be found not guilty yeah so at the end of the day all right I didn't go to jail but look at the devastation risers how many people can handle that you know and pay those kind of that kind of money me I don't like a lawyer unless I absolutely definitely hope there's no lawyers in here no offense there are a few but but unless unless I absolutely need them I try to avoid them that's and I've been through lawyers my whole life but III tell you this you know you cut corners legally that's fine but it absolutely doesn't pay to do anything that's gonna bring you heat with the government of the IRS it took me literally when I got out of prison I had a hundred and three million dollar fine from the IRS 103 million dollars I'll tell you how my partner in the gas business became an informant and he started to testify and all the gasoline trials right there was probably seven or eight of them every time witness got to understand it so I gave Francie's five million I gave Francie six million next thing I know I get a letter from the IRS they assessed me that when the guy was saying it from the witness stand even if the guy got the case was acquitted they still assessed me with it and then they used to say if you want to pay by credit card or whatever so I used to write my credit card and say hit pay right I used to get these notes in prison so I get out I got a hundred and three million dollar fine from the IRS now how do you get by on that I'll give you a little secret I used to go to try to buy a car and he said to me are you kidding me you got 103 million dollar fine this year but let me tell you the flip side of that if I ordered government 103 million dollars you must know I'm pretty good owner so give me the car they said okay you got it I swear to God I see what are you worried about the credit report I own 103 you know I can make money okay they gave me you got to be kidding same way I bought a house that way one time at the bank I said don't worry about that I'm gonna pay when you launder Street you learned some of that dialogue but anyway so every year I'm going to court in Brooklyn on this 103 million I said look if you claim this money someplace go and get it they wrote a books that I got money buried all over the world and it investigated me like crazy and making me sign statements I don't have money in foreign banks every year I'm going back every year I'm going back 20 years I finally get in front of the judge I got mad with my lawyer says you're not solving anything for me here they keep coming I'm not paying him so I told the judge you know I live in California I see why he's making me come here all the time I'm saying the same thing I live in California change the venue he was so tired of the case he said I got it's good idea I'm sending it out to California right so he sent it out to California this money about three months later I get a call from the agent he's coming I got to see it so I walk in he looks at me he said I gotta ask you a question he's got about 20 file boxes in the back of he says what is all it is I said well didn't you people tell you what this is he says all he did was send me boxes and say you owe 103 million I said I've been fighting the case for 28 years we're gonna fight it for another 20 years unless you make a deal and settle with me now he's okay 20 he says 103 million he's how about we settle for 10 million I said I'll take you here I'll have any money we're not going to settle for anything bottom line is were back and forth I settled it for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars yes no way you gotta hit a vest so he says you're gonna write me a check I'll give you 30 days I said you didn't hear me I don't have any money I said you got to stretch this out over five years I'll pay you every month right he stretched it out over five you gotta be kidding my god so I said I'll let you want to keep investigating he just wanted to get rid of me - he said that let you settle this thing 103 down a 250 five-year payout that was it we got a couple of construction company guys that are very good at shoveling and digging for money aren't there any hidden spots you want to advise them going digging for some money well here's what they tell okay here's how the IRS gets you the statute of limitations is over on any money that I might have stolen back in the 80s right but here's how they get you they make you sign a statement under the penalty of perjury that you have no money in farm banks you got no money here they go down a laundry list like you got no money in your bathroom in your closet in a shoebox they go through the whole thing and there's a ten years that your limitations on the perjury you know so they don't get you for the money to get you for the perjury right so I was talking a few people today we at lunch for today yesterday I remember at lunch and the last statement I signed I have 19 months to go before I have to sign another one so now I was talking to my lawyer I said look if I refuse to sign another one what are they gonna do he said well probably when you have a year left they're gonna tell you to come in and sign another one I said well if I say no what are you gonna do I said let's take them to court let's argue with them a little bit I said because if we get a lapse of time and there is any money there and I'm not saying there is but just case there is you know I don't know who's in this audience but just in case there is we're just looking for cross streets than me that's all we want maybe that lapse of time I can go grab a few bucks if there's anything there until I sign another one but then it's too late for that

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Channel: Valuetainment

Views: 659,553

Rating: 4.8441458 out of 5

Keywords: Entrepreneur, Entrepreneurs, Entrepreneurship, Entrepreneur Motivation, Entrepreneur Advice, Startup Entrepreneurs, valuetainment, patrick bet david, michael franzese

Id: zc1YM9fNATQ

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Length: 32min 23sec (1943 seconds)

Published: Fri May 17 2019

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