Jordan Peterson On The Meaning Of Life

the next one act so that you can tell the truth about how you actually kind of ties into the stock sure sure sure pursue what is meaningful not what is XP dry tats rule 7 in the book so well so here's a here's a here's a strange idea but this is another example of I think where the physical and the metaphysical touch so we talked about what reality might look like there's a material reality let's say that's what it is but then there's the reality of what could be that's potential it's something like that and so potential has this weird existence well here's another strange thing you might say well huh what's the best way of conceptualizing reality at the highest level of abstraction what is reality there's this old Taoist symbol yin and yang simply so there's a black serpent and it has a white dot in it and there's a white serpent and it has a black dot in it and they're tailed to tail and that whole symbol is Dow and Dow means a bunch of things it means potential it means the way of life so to live in Dow is to live in the proper manner and you kind of live on the border between the black serpent and the white serpent and then you say well what are those two things well they're the two they're the two ultimate categories of reality yin and yang how would you translate that into English well masculine feminine that's one translation but a better one I would say is order and chaos say what's order and what's chaos well order is when you're where what you're doing is producing what you want to have happen okay so why is that orderly because you can predict it you do a and you want B to happen and B happens so what does that mean it means you know where you are you know what you're doing and things are working and then you're calm because there's nothing to be nervous about and you're moderately happy because you're getting what you need and want and there's evidence that you are competent because that's why things are working that's order now everyone knows that order can be shattered into disorder at the drop of a hat you can be walking down the street and you're all happy and you're with your part and you know she makes a mistake and steps off the curb and a bus hits her it's like in one second you are not anymore in order like the bottom is falling out of your life and that's why there's a black dot in the white serpent it's like the poor little as it is look the hell out because your life can be flipped upside down in a moment okay well then sometimes you're in a dire straight state and everything looks absolutely hopeless and you get a new realization and bang you know everything snaps together and so that's when you're in chaos and order can reveal itself okay so order and chaos you can think about it as you the ice that you skate on with the with the water below that's another way of thinking about it now you say well is that real is it really that the world is made out of order in chaos well here's something weird you have two hemispheres right and hypothetically they were selected by the processes of natural evolution right they were selected by reality well you have a right hemisphere and a left hemisphere so it's kind of like well reality must have two elements because why would you need two hemispheres otherwise and they do have relatively separate consciousness those two hemispheres think well oK we've been selected to have this bifurcated view of reality well what what are they specialized for turns out the left hemisphere is specialized for those places where your routines work that's the left hemisphere and the right hemisphere is specialized for all those places you go when you don't know what you're doing so the left hemisphere is specialized for order and the right hemisphere is specialized for chaos and so then you might think well does that mean that the world being is really made out of order in chaos it's like well if you use the Darwinian logic that's what it means okay so what is meaning signify well here's what it is as far as I can tell so imagine imagine that you're watching a gymnast and two gymnast we'll start with the first one and the gymnast pops out on the floor and does her routine and she's like she's on it man like you can tell this girl has put her $50,000 in and every single thing impossible things she does in succession is flawless right and at the end she you know what would you say blades yeah voila displays yourself to the crowd right in the crowd is like wow that's so impressive because they think wow she's human and look what humans give you isn't that so cool and they're so thrilled and you know the judges go 9.8 9.8 9.8 it's like because I think it's 10 points for gymnasts and and it's like well now what is the next gymnast 2 because how do you talk perfection right because you can't but that's not true you can so the next gymnast comes out and she goes through her routine too and it's perfect but it's more than perfect because you can see that with every bloody move she makes she's pushing herself right to the ragged edge of disaster like she's she's risking the performance of her life and that means she's risking a big mistake because you risk that when you do the performance of your life and you can just see her straining it's like when you hear a great violinist or a great a great guitarist play something and they Bend on and twist all the notes so they're kind of rough and ragged and they know how to do it perfectly and they put this vicious edge on it's like you just love that and so the gymnast is out there just stretching herself right to the limit of her ability right and then she does voila right and she's sweating and it's like triumph and the whole damn crowd just leaps to their feet because she was better than perfect she was perfect in the way that will make her more perfect in the future and that's meaningful and that's why the crowd leaps to its feet and that's she's on that border between chaos and order and that's meaningful and so what I would say is what your brain does for you is tell you when you're in the right place at the right time by infusing your life with significance and engagement and it's saying look you've got the cosmos is lined up around you it really truly is you're right in the right place at the right time you're you're in your domain of competence but you're stretching yourself so that you're actually improving at the same time and that's perfect it's absolutely perfect and so I think for a long time we've we've cast doubt on the reality of meaning that's part of the death of God there's no real meaning in life it's like no no it does not look like that's true it looks like it might be the case that there's nothing more real in life than the sense of meaning I actually think you can make well I do make that case in 12 rules for life I think you can make a completely coherent case that meaning is an unerring guide there's there's limits if you're going to allow your sense of meaning to guide you you don't want to lie to yourself because you pathologized the instinct you know because if you keep filling your head up with nonsense you're gonna the meaning generator is going to become corrupted and it's going to make things shine for you that shouldn't shine they'd only shine for someone who's corrupt so if you're going to be guided by your sense of meaning then don't fill your spirit with garbage that's and that sort of applies to the first few rules don't lie don't do things that you hate right don't make the thing that guides you ill so you think that meaning is that living on the border of chaos and order that that's the DAO that's the doubt that that's where you are if you live in doubt it's on the lie it's okay sand won't reverse or on the other end you say not what is expedient mm-hmm so so how how do you confuse those two things what are those two things look like okay how do you not come no problem no problem look so I came in here for this discussion today and I could be thinking I want to tailor this interview so that I sell as many books as possible so like I have a goal I'm gonna come in here and if you veer off on some topic that I don't think is relevant to my goal of selling books then I'm not gonna participate I'm gonna steer you back I'm gonna mention at every chance that I get because what I want to have happen from this talk is that I make more money it's like okay so then I'm gonna come in here and I'm going to manipulate the conversation to facilitate that goal okay so that's that's expedient but then I could say no no let's let's not bother with that that me not because there's anything wrong with that I mean it's not a problem to have a goal it's a problem to manipulate people but but you know I knew we were gonna talk about the book so it's not it wouldn't be like out of you wouldn't regard that as incomprehensible if it started to happen if I said something well can we direct the conversation back to the book you wouldn't take offense to that not in any real sense but what I would do and what I want to do instead is come and you guys like to have open discussions and like what we're doing when we're having an open discussion is we're trying to elevate each other's spirits and so that's like rule 9 right assume that the person you're listening to knows something you don't it's like there's things you need to know there's things I need to know there's things you need to know if we actually have a talk maybe we'll all come away less stupid and since if you're stupid you wander into a pit then maybe it would be better if you weren't stupid and so I'd rather come on and say well let's let's engage so let's occupy that place of meaningful conversation let's trust it and see where it goes and then let's assume that whatever happens is the best thing that could have happened it doesn't matter like it because maybe the right outcome for this podcast isn't a particular percentage of increment in book sales maybe it's the fact that while we got along and we decided to do something else together in the future and or maybe five things in the future or maybe it's more inspiring for the listeners and so there's also this idea this it relates to the idea about truth there's a real fundamental idea that's really deeply rooted in Western civilization which is that the most daring possible approach to life and I would say the most meaningful approach is to tell the truth and let whatever happens happen it's an adventure it's like so I could come in here and say well I'm gonna craft this conversation so it's about my book and it's kind of predictable and know what's gonna happen yeah but but it's way more engaging to say no no let's just have the best conversation we can have and then wait and see what happens well that's way more that's that's super interesting that's way more interesting so a meaning for almost almost in other words like short-sighted mmm expedient that's right that that's that's the problem I don't think there's anything that has longer vision than that sense of meaning okay so I'll tell you something that's so cool it's just bloody well blew me away when I learned it this is from you me as well so we talked about the idea of the self right so the self is every you are and everything you could be across time okay but here you are caught in this little fragment of time but there's this you that has the potential across time well and it's it's it's something that you're trying to grow towards to maximize your potential right so then you might ask well how does that potential manifest itself in the present so that it can be revealed well the answer is through the instinctive meaning so that that was Young's answer I thought wow that's that's just mind-boggling that idea it's like okay you could be more than you are obviously that's obviously the case how does that manifest itself in the moment well that which you could be tells you where to walk by making that path meaningful Wow it's like really could that be the case what else would make what you're doing meaningful if I come up with a different explanation if you want see if you can come up with a better explanation because I don't think you can't walk in the path that's more challenging hmm yeah because you need to be optimally challenged right because you're not so here's a couple of things that we've learned recently so I could say well why do we grow in a conversation that's genuine well it's because we're sharing information right and then we build each other out of the information we build ourselves out of the information so that's just a cognitive approach but here's something else that we've learned recently it's like let's say you go pick up a new like a physical hobby like you go you start weightlifting or maybe you do jujitsu or something like that and so you're in a new environment and you're faced with new challenges genes in your brain turn on that weren't on before and they code new proteins and they build new structures and so inside your genetic inside you're inside the genetic structures that that underlie your physiology are all sorts of physiological potentials that won't manifest themselves unless you put yourself in a new situation and so by challenging yourself constantly you're turning on parts of yourself that wouldn't otherwise be on you could say well life is horrible and tragic and bitter and and and cruel and everyone is suffering from being persecuted and from evil it's like yeah yeah okay it's fine fine so how are you gonna deal with that turn yourself on you know you go everywhere and click everything on and then maybe you're you're maybe you could handle it so I'll tell you a wonderful story so in the shark cathedral the cathedral is across okay so the cross the center of the cross is the center of consciousness it's the point of maximal suffering okay the cathedrals across now on the floor of the cathedral is a maze a big maze and you can walk it so you go into the maze at the bottom quadrant and then you walk all the way through the bottom right-hand quadrant completely walk through it and then you get to the top right-hand quadrant and you walk all the way through that then you get to the top left one and you walk all the way through that and the bottom left one and then you come to the center it's a symbolic pilgrimage so what it means and it's the map of the world north south east and west so it's a symbolically the world so the idea is that you have to walk through the entire world in order to get to the center so you have to go everywhere and do everything to turn yourself on enough so that you can handle what's coming towards you and you do that voluntarily you open yourself up to the challenge it's like well I read all that I thought so and you know it's true because you know all you do if you shrink from life the more you shrink the smaller you get unsurprisingly right yeah and the more you move forward confidently and willing to take on the challenge and then the potential danger then the stronger you get and then you might say well what's the upper limit to that strength well you're really good for you that would be good you're really good for you and your family at the same time it's like cool bargain you're really good for your family and your community at the same time and then you're really good for all of those in a way that gets better and better across time it's like well that would be the ultimate expression of human possibility it's like well that's a hell of an antidote to chaos [Music] [Applause] [Music]

Channel: H3 Podcast Highlights

Views: 585,758

Rating: 4.9432716 out of 5

Keywords: h3 podcast, podcast, h3h3, h3h3productions, ethan klein, ethan and hila, chaos, daoism, jordan peterson, order, meaning of life, jordan, peterson

Id: rU64s0_38AE

Length: 15min 44sec (944 seconds)

Published: Thu Feb 01 2018

Reddit Comments

[u/Ryestar]

To answer your question, you'd want to look into functional neuroanatomy, and cognitive neuroscience, and focus on work in the biological bases of behavior in humans.

That said, this interpretation of hemispheric lateralization is somewhere between antiquated, and willfully ignorant. At it's very best it is a wild oversimplification of what each hemisphere does, but just for some immediate and irrefutable examples: your left hemisphere supports sensation and motor control for the right side of your body, and the right hemisphere supports this process for the right side (they do the same thing, not order vs chaos). This is broadly also true in vision for example.

A more specific example of this division falling apart is that many cognitive processes (with some notable exceptions, like language processing) suffer from damage to either hemisphere. Or to even more distinctly address the order/chaos approach, you might look at memory processing in navigation, in which it is (somewhat contentiously) asserted that there are (at least) two memory systems for navigating, a controlled (maybe more order-y) effortfull route planning system which you use when you are calmer and less threatened (supported by frontal regions and the hippocampus), and a more habit based automatic system which you use when more when under stress (maybe more of a chaos-y system). However, these systems are not left vs right, they each utilize different sets of neural structures (each uses more than two structures). (Goodroe, Starnes, Brown, 2018: The Complex Nature of Hippocampal-Striatal Interactions in Spatial Navigation).

​

There ARE some major bifurcations that people talk about in cognitive processing (Dorsal vs. Ventral Stream Processing in vision, Declarative vs. NonDeclarative memory, Arousal and Valence in Emotion) but none of them would really support the point that he seems to be making in this video. It would be similarly valid to say that there are four lobes of the brain, and four elements in nature, and since fire has a lot of light, occipital cortex is for processing fire - Therefore, there are four natural elements.

An easy read summarizing some of the current literature is the wikipedia article on hemispheric lateralization (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lateralization_of_brain_function) and if you'd like to go deeper here's a psychology today article talking about how we don't really think this in neuroscience anymore (https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-theory-cognitive-modes/201401/left-brain-right-brain-wrong). Or if you want a more comprehensive refutation of this idea, here's a meta-analysis of lateralization of creativity (Mihov, Denzler, Forster, 2010) https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0278262609002371

TLDR: The field would be functional neuroanatomy / cognitive neuroscience, but the claim he's making is old timey thinking about the brain that hasn't been taken seriously since the mid nineties.

[u/kildoents]

Complete bullshit. This guy is talking out of his ass. Bilateral symmetry has nothing to do with order and chaos. Neither do our left and right hemispheres. Dude has a pop psychology view of cognitive neuroscience and doesn't seem to understand evolution either. Nothing must be because we've evolved this way. "Evolution is nonrandom, but not progressive." Evolution does not have a goal that it is "working" towards. There is no such thing as a higher or lower species. Radially symmetrical animals exist too by the way. He took the left hemisphere's "interpreter" nickname and popped it into a black box of confirmation bias until this pseudoscienticfic, pseudophilisophic psychobabble spewed out. If you ask a right hemisphere lesioned person what letter this is

H

H

H

H

H H H H

They'll likely say that an L. That is because the left hemisphere is specialized in global processing, it tends to look at the big picture, make inferences about cause and effect. The left lesioned patient would say its H because of the right hemisphere's tendency to do local processing, pays more attention to the details. Yeah its not great at inferring the temporal succesion of events. But apparently our right hemisphere represents chaos because of that? Oh shut up.

Its much more complicated than that too and if someone needs me to bring out Gazzaniga's cognitive neuroscience textbook I will.

There's tons more lateralized specializations found through split brain and lesion research but the point is that the OGs of split brain research R. Sperry and M. Gazzaniga would rip this guy apart if they heard him misinterpreting their work that way.

I'm sorry for this rant but damn I hate this pseudointellectual nonsense that never gets challenged by the people who actually could point out his bullshit. Lets get an evolutionary biologist and a cognitive psychologist to publicly put him in his place.

This dude comes on a podcast with Ethan who knows nothing about neuroscience and exploits it to have a platform where he can spew a bunch of raw, unimpeded, sewage. He knows no one in that room will stop him.

[u/microglial-cytokines]

He's being a science communicator. In science citations and evidence are required to come to any determination. The brain is so poorly understood, that simplifying it in the way he does isn't actually possible. There have been procedures (neurosurgery) that have indicated that physically severing connections between the two hemispheres of the brain produces strange behaviors. Furthermore, introducing anesthesia into one hemisphere of the brain helped human beings determine the location of Broca's Area (motor speech area) which has been found to often exist on only one hemisphere, statistically on the same side in most humans. These types of experiments/diagnostics/studies help humans reverse engineer the design of the human brain (trauma is also included). For example ataxia has been linked to the cellebellum through those mechanisms. So to say, one half is for this, and the other for that is a misleading oversimplification in my opinion as a student. Hope that helps!

[u/ThatFlyBlackGuy]

In terms of information processing of mental operations, Cognitive science. In terms of the the world being chaos and order, philosophy.

[u/onemaybe2]

I would also say functional neuroanatomy, but yeaaaaah it's mostly just pop science