Jeff Gothelf - Hacking your tractor with black market code - #NUX6 - @jboogie

to be quite honest Jeff probably doesn't even need an reduction if I said that is the author of lean UX everybody will probably know the book and who he is Jeff is a superhuman he's super talented and super experienced here I gave a case study and sharing the story of John Deere people may or may not know but if I see the next bit I love a good tractor please welcome Jeff to any work six [Applause] hey folks what's going on once again it's me infront of beer all right we could do this is a good story though you're gonna like this story I love telling this story and I think you're gonna like it and there's a lot of stuff to take away from here this is really a we found this to be a fascinating case study in thinking through all of the implications of product development and product design and how the the elements of culture the elements of Technology the elements of the law the elements of economics of product development of design all come together to create what is seemingly an amazing experience and where some of the challenges rise in that amazing experience and so call the story episode to the farm awakens like any good story it has these components six acts six separate acts we have a hero with an empire and we have an unlikely ally it comes to our hero's aid and then hopefully we have a little bit of a morale at the end of that story so like any good story we're gonna start with a little framing mechanism in to set the tone and in this particular case we could start with one of the more popular framing mechanisms for people who make digital products and services and that would be the product requirements document no I'm just kidding it's not gonna be the product quirements document it's gonna be the more modern version of that and it's gonna be the hypothesis statement you've heard a lot about hypotheses over the course of the day today and this is the simplest framing device that we've found that I've found when it comes to thinking through the thing that you're gonna build or make for your customers and for your users right we believe we don't know there's humility in there right there's unpredictability and uncertainty and in digital product development we believe that meeting some kind of a user need right something that users trying to do with a set of features or a product or a service will create some kind of a business outcome that we care about and we'll know we're right when we see this evidence that we're gonna use this friendly mechanism going to keep coming back this as I tell you the story we're gonna keep coming back to this hypothesis template and we're gonna fill in the blanks and we're gonna see if we can get to a hypothesis statement that actually makes sense at the end of it okay so let's start with the user need or as any good Friday afternoon conversation should talk about the brutal economics of wheat farming sure you you know what you signed up for today but we're gonna talk about wheat farming today wheat farming is fascinating and to talk about wheat farm we have to meet our hero our hero is a humble farmer struggling to eke out a living you know in a hostile environment it's not that guy it's these guys though it's it's the farmers of in this case the American heartland right and the thing that's really important to remember about farmers and particularly wheat farmers is that farmers don't market wheat right they don't take ads out there's no Google AdWords there's no billboards out on Interstate 70 in Nebraska somewhere that says you know wheat it's what's for dinner right none of that stuff is actually there in fact the market doesn't even consider how much it costs to produce wheat when determining the price the only thing that the wheat market cares about is how much is being demanded right and how much the consumer will pay for that wheat that's it that's all that matters now if you're the wheat farmer at any given moment you're doing you know this this is your landscape right at any given moment a farmer can easily have millions of dollars in the ground waiting to be harvested it's just the right Bowman we're talking about seed labor fertilizer chemicals you name it right equipment costs everything is in the ground and all of that's money that's in the ground is at risk it's at risk from whether it's at risk from insects and fungus and weird crop circles that may come up every now and again right all of these things are putting that invest that that wheat farmer put in the ground at risk now to give you a sense of how much risk we're talking about here nothing better enough Friday afternoon then to do some math let's do some math for a second if you don't know much about wheat farming uh we'll get through this very very quickly I promise a bushel of wheat which is the unit of measure is 60 pounds 60 pounds of wheat now we took which we try to find a kind of an average farmer particularly in the u.s. heartland this is a wheat farmer in Grant County Oklahoma tries to get about 50 bushels of wheat out of every acre of land and the total cost to farm that acre is two hundred and seventy four dollars again that's seed labor finding a fungicide chemicals that type of thing and so it costs you two hundred seventy four bucks to farm that you're trying to get 50 bushels out of every acre that means your breakeven price is five dollars and 48 cents a bushel you need to make that to break-even to make no money when we wrote this talk the market price of wheat was five dollars and 59 cents that means the profit margin on a bushel of wheat is 11 cents 11 cents right now you multiply that times the times per acre profit per acre by number of bushels is 550 and the average farm size in the u.s. about 438 acres you're looking at an average total profit from a wheat harvest of two thousand four hundred and nine dollars all right that's a razor-thin margin right all of that effort all of that investment in the ground and your average profit is $2,400 and that leaves a ton to chance that means you're harvesting everything and you're maximizing the productivity of your land right now we talked a lot of farmers when we came up with this talk and we learned a lot of really cool things that farmers say for example they talk about rain makes grain right so when it rains that's really good for farmers and that makes the wheat grow but if it rains too much right you end up with this condition called the wheat wet feet which essentially are the conditions that allow for fungus to grow and you're threatening the crop again and so the timing of getting the wheat out of the ground is crucial it's absolutely critical that you get the wheat out of the ground harvested when it's ready or before it gets too wet or before harvesting comes in fact as we try to talk to farmers during this time he became an issue we interviewed some farmers in fact one of the guys we talked to was this guy named Steve fit stick he's a farmer out in the American Midwest he said look I can't talk to you this week because it's planting season right I'll talk to you next week timing is everything right you can't wait for anything to get things out of the ground because if you wait too long the crop dies and you're razor thin margin evaporates plus the investment that you put in so what are our user needs well our user needs are lower costs as to cost me less to produce this crop I'd like more efficiency right I'd like to do this faster better smarter right so my profit margins go up and I need to obey mother nature's schedule I cannot wait for anything to get in the way of this right now so we come back to our hypothesis template and we fill it out right we believe that helping farmers meet their cost and efficiency goals with timeliness concerns will help us build a great product that's act 1 act 2 or as we like to say meanwhile back at headquarters right that's not headquarters I mean it's it's of them being harsh right this is headquarters right this is what what kind of the the equipment manufacturers look like this product managers and designers and engineers industrial designers right and mechanical engineers building products and systems to help farmers out and there's no company that's doing more interesting thing in the agriculture space than John Deere John Deere is literally the harley-davidson the farm equipment they have been around for over a hundred years and the farmers that buy John Deere products love these products they're so loyal to this brand they call themselves a Deere operation were a deer farm right they've been using these these Deere John Deere products for decades right to show you how far that loyalty goes and I don't recommend scrolling any further than this I'm joking proceed at your own risk right those are some disambiguate catches out there chief there's a really big and this look there's good reason for this right these are the biggest the baddest the greenest machines out there it's really cool this was a really fun project to to work on and learn about these are amazing amazing machines that can do things that you never actually imagined and a level of efficiency that never thought possible before and it's not just tractors right they don't just make these tractors and these combines John Deere makes what they call precision agriculture technology now precision AG technology is everything you see up here it's all the hardware and it's all the software and it's all the data collection and all the analysis and all of the kind of the feedback back to the machinery and to the farmers right it's a suite of products hard-lined software designed to connect and automate multiple pieces of farm equipment and operations and then help farmers make sense of all that data all of this stuff has sensors all over it they have GPS satellites they have weather satellites and they aggregate all that data along with historical information to feed it back to the machines and to the farmers so that they can extract the maximum harvest from the land and so if you look at it that way you can see that John Deere is a hardware company they make tractors combines screens sensors telematics you name it and they're also a software company right they make data collection software they build api's you know there's a thousand people who work at John Deere's headquarters in the American Midwest simply on displays and telematics and customer-facing web just a thousand people alone on that right and so they've got lots and lots of software engineers building amazing products they have an annual API integration conference for all this data because it's it's highly valuable and it's used all over the world and they do product discovery they know their customers they spend time in the field literally in the field right they they farmers love to give feedback because again they're so loyal to the brand they want you to know how well or how poorly this particular thing that you're putting out there is working for me and the farmers are out there there is a strong early adopter segment and they're always willing to give feedback now the fascinating thing and we you know we learned as we were doing this this research is that these tractors aren't cheap they're not cheap at all in fact they have a they've a tractor wizard like build your own tractor kind of thing on the john deere website they do and this is the starting price for these things four hundred grand and by the time you you kicked the whole thing out with gps and and you know am FM cassette whatever else comes with it right but what seriously by the time you get this thing wherever you need to go and all the service does it ends up being close to nine hundred thousand or a million dollars right it's absolutely amazing what these things can do and how much they cost given those profit margins that we talked about at the beginning right so the question becomes what is the business problem that these guys face seemingly at the top of their game well the brutal economics of wheat continued again particularly in the united states there's a move from single operations to the least operations so very few farmers actually formed their own land they lease it out to big corporations who have these massive tracts of land right about half the farms in the US or rent it out to a farmer who takes care of kind of all of the kind of a massive tract of land at once which frankly is the only way to generate any kind of meaningful profit as we demonstrated with our math lesson just a few minutes ago now that big operation is a big expense seed labor chemicals right all of those things and so it's this technology that john deere makes that helps farm larger areas with less labor which reduces costs right increase efficiency increase profit margins write less labor the downside of less labor is a you fewer farmers and if you have fewer farmers you're actually selling less tractors right darn as many people you don't need as many machines to do as much of the work and so the business problem that john deere is facing is that equipment sales are down alright the sale of the stuff the hardware that they're making is down in fact they're talking about five percent year-over-year and roughly about eight percent overall which translates into billions tens of billions of dollars in lost equipment sales which is a significant business problem for John Deere so they find ourselves in a position where they have to reconsider their business model right we can't be in the hardware business alone there has to be another option right we sell software we sell services we aggregate data we provide all this information is there a better way to monetize everything that we do and we know about the wheat farming business and so the business needs less reliance on equipment sales our business with the world is changing we got to figure out what to do differently we have to protect our margins I like to stay profitable most importantly we cannot piss off our customers right because they're so loyal that as long as week is if we can keep them oil whatever we put out there they will consume so we cannot do that right so we're back to our hypothesis statement and we start to fill it out and we believe that meeting the farmers needs of cost and efficiency of timeliness right with some kind of feature set product set whatever it is right will create less reliance on sales higher margins and maintain loyalty okay we're getting there got more to go act 3 right the promise the offering you can't refuse so we're here we've got user need and we have a business need now the amazing thing about this equipment as we've talked to farmers over the years is the fantastic advances not only in the efficiency of these devices of these machines but in the user experience of these you know up until it kind of amid sick these this is what these devices machines look like and at the end of the day you ended up essentially frozen to death or melted or indefinitely covered in dust no matter what and over the years right they get better and they improve and they start to have enclosed cabins right and they start to get literally like entertainment systems in there so you can hang out in there all day until you get to the point where they you know they look like this and this is the kind of work that they actually do right they're enclosed they can run all day they're comfortable you don't end up there they have air conditioning they've heat and all of these components that you would you'd expect to have in a car they have in these tractors and in fact that same farmer that we talked about earlier he said look I can farm 2500 acres easier today and I could farm 500 acres 40 years ago right that's the kind of efficiency that they're looking for an effect it gets even better one of the most amazing things that I learned and while doing research for this is this check out who's driving that tractor no one is driving that tractor alright someone is driving that combine up there on the left and they've harvested the wheat and they need a hopper to come over so they can unload the the harvest from the combine so they can keep rolling so they don't have to stop and drive back to the farm he pushes a button through GPS and automation the other tractor just pulls up alongside they fill it up and it goes back and the farmer can just do essentially the work of two people without stopping all day long right artificial intelligence GPS automated farming big data all of that stuff is happening right now this is this is real footage right now to make all this happen you have to buy this equipment and there's one catch there's a license agreement right you have to agree to a license to use the software that's embedded in your nine hundred thousand dollar John Deere tractor and when you sign that license it says look this is an implied license right essentially you're renting the software for the life of the vehicle to operate that vehicle so you own the hardware but you rent the software you don't actually own the entire thing that you bought right and so if we look at the features that we think are going to meet the user needs and meet our business needs we're talking about more efficient right amazing efficiency more capable more comfortable right increase our services revenue we can start to figure out how to sell more data back into this and help farmers be more productive and a license agreement right as a feature that we think will be valuable and as we start to plug in to our hypothesis statement it starts to look very interesting right cost efficiency and timeliness concerns with greater efficiency and capability and a license agreement will help create less reliance on sales higher margins and maintain loyalty and that sounds great right until you run into some problems in act 4 our hero encounters a problem now the wheat is ripe it's time to harvest member I told you you can't wait fungus sets in you're done you lose the crop and there's a problem for our hero that's not the problem this is the problem tractor broke down right normally you call your local repair guy to come over and fix the tractor he'd be there quickly an hour or two away or maybe you fix it yourself right get you up and running so you can harvest before losing the wheat but today the problems are different a lot of the breakdowns aren't mechanical these days often time there's software and even if the breakdowns are mechanical and even if you as the farmer have the part to fix it you can't slop the part out without first accessing the software and because you signed that License Agreement you are not allowed as the farmer to access that software you can't circumvent the copyright protection of the software to allow the part swap or whatever it is only a certified John Deere mechanic can come plug their laptop in authorize the part swap put it in and get you up and running now that's okay if there's a certified John Deere mechanic in your town where you live right but if you live in Great Falls Montana where wheat farmers live your nearest John Deere dealer it could be 500 miles away and in the time that it would take that person to get to your farm plug in their laptop and allow you to smoke the parts you could lose the entire crop now farmers have a culture of self-reliance I can fix this myself I can do it but by agreeing to this implied license by buying this advanced hardware and software this Internet of Things component right there no longer allowed to fix it themselves right you have to either be a certified John Deere mechanic right or you have to get the machine to that mechanic to make it work and you simply can't fix it yourself right because of that License Agreement that's the reason now how can this be right how can it be that there's a license agreement that says hey I paid a million dollars for this tractor why am I not allowed to fix it well in the United States we have a thing called the DMCA it's the Digital Millennium Copyright Act it was enacted in 1998 20 years ago at the time it made it unlawful for users to circumvent copyright protection on software right so you can't circumvent copyright protection to access or modify software and it was intended to fight computer software piracy and DVD piracy and that was cool in 1998 right but in the 20 years since then software has eaten the world software is a part of pretty much every device in every component that we buy today right from our coffee machines to our cell phones to our cars and to our tractors and so consumers find themselves in a position where we're buying products and services we feel like we own them but we don't have the right to repair those services because again modifying those objects requires access to information to the code to the service manuals to error codes and diagnostic tools but by providing that publicly right in any way shape shape or form you're accessing that you are violating your license agreement and the Digital Millennium Copyright Act Cory Doctorow talks about this a lot and he says look there was a time where you could buy something and if you could manage to extract any extra value out of it for example you buy a buy a blender right and you turn it into a paint mixer all right you get to keep all of that value right today you can't do that right any extra value that's added to the thing that you already buy gets kept by the manufacturer because of the technology that's within it that's inherent in making it run and so is the makers the designers of digital products and services when you find yourself in a situation like this you have to ask yourself are we solving user needs or are we exploiting user needs both will make you money right the question is which side do you want to be on which business do you want to be in right you want to be in a solving user needs business or the exploiting user needs business now before we continue the story I want to just take a brief a brief interlude here and kind of kind of note something that's really important to this particular conversation right when we're making digital products and services right how do we know what works right how do we have any sense of what's actually going to work right the reality is that we don't and it's primarily because of one big reason right it's humans right humans interacting with our products in an unpredictable way for all of our design talent and all of our expertise we can design the most perfect experience right the most perfect set of features customer experience interaction model whatever it is and we can refine it and plant it in great detail and think that it's going to work beautifully right and then we put it in the field and we see what happens right and the things that happen we can't predict because human nature and culture change the way that people interact with the products and services that we create out there they never crash we clash this for a while goes on for a while it's amazing actually it's really amazing right but you could never have predicted this by building this intersection no matter how well you planned it you could not have predicted this human behavior and despite how well you think you know your audience right doesn't happen doesn't matter how well you know your audience it feels like you think you know what combination of features and services and products are going to change their behavior but you don't account for people right this is Massachusetts right somebody's job was to fix this intersection and they said I know what I'm gonna do I'm gonna put up a sign that says stop and no left turn and of course people will obey it but this is Massachusetts right and if you've ever been there we have a special name for these people that the drivers in Massachusetts anybody knowing I didn't say on video right look there's a good chance you're going to be wrong right and that human factor is the key right figuring out how humans are going to behave what they're going to do is the key you've heard that throughout the day-to-day understanding your customers and figuring out what the motivations are and how to improve it how to continuously learn and move that forward and when you put products and services into the world that try to circumvent human behavior and try to circumvent traditional practice the way that your target audience works culture is always going to win all right culture will always beat your best product design idea because people know how they want to live their lives and you're not going to tell them how to do that right and so the faster and the sooner that we get these ideas in the market right we ship ideas we sense and then we respond we learn from how people are interacting and we optimize that experience over time to move that forward and so with that we come back to our hypothesis statement here's where it is today we believe right that meeting the cost efficiency and timeliness concerns of the farmer with greater efficiency capability and a license agreement will create less reliance on sales higher margins and maintain loyalty pretty good right how will we know well we have to get evidence right the only way we know that that hypothesis is true is if we collect evidence that shows that people actually are doing the things that we expect them to do and so in act 5 we find our hero once again there he is right the weed is ripe needs to be harvested and the tractor is busted right who are you gonna call close enough Lando you're gonna call Linda you're not gonna call Lando you know who you're gonna call you're gonna call this guy Ukrainian hackers sell cracked John Deere software and hardware on the black market to American farmers so that they can fix their own tractors here's an example this is a black market John Deere it's a hack - Jon crack John Deere device farmers buy this for a couple hundred bucks they can plug their laptops in and access the software right they sell cracked software right online that farmers install on their machines and are able to bypass the security on the software so that they can swap out a part or fix their tractor so they can harvest the wheat and make their profit now the takeaway from all of this is this when you enforce bad policy and that's what you're doing here right we're enforcing out business policy right people will work around that policy right people will find ways to do the things that they need to do to get the job done to live up to their culture right this culture of self-reliance in the farming industry is critical right the ability to self determine when I can harvest my wheat is imperative to me being a farmer and when you put policy in my way that keeps me from doing that I'm gonna figure out a way around it regardless of what that is as long as I can get the job done and so then how does our story end right because this is our current hypothesis that's the evidence that we've collected how does this story end and I hate to say this to you but ultimately it's up to you as makers of digital products as designers of experiences of digital products and services right you have a choice to make the laws that govern technology will never in any country keep up with the pace the continuously changing nature of technology right its makers of digital products you have to find the right balance between the law between business models and between customer experience and customer needs because again the legal structures that support your customers are ill-suited for our current reality they just simply can't keep upright legislation will never move as fast as technology and so inevitably they're going to be these gaps between what you can do and what you should do and when you find yourself kind of sitting at that gap wondering if you should design this thing or build the service or make it that thing right the question is is then what are you gonna do are you gonna use those gaps to serve customers or are you gonna use those gaps to exploit those customers because again both will get you paid the question is where do you actually want to play right where do you want to work what's the kind of work that you want to do in addition to laws not keeping up with technology technology will never get ahead of culture right you're not gonna change people's imperative to be a farmer right if it's specially if it's generational right my father was a farmer grandfather great-grandfather but if that's what you do right you're not gonna change the way that we do things how do you complement that how do you support that how do you make them more successful because again when you enforce bad policy people will work around that policy now you see the reaction to this I showed you the Ukrainian hacker thing there's a broader reaction that's happening across the United States as well it's called the right to repair movement and it's it's a it's a it's a kind of bipartisan which is rare these days right so bipartisan cross kind of cross state venture where people are rising up ascension in they're saying look we are going to start to collect the elements that we need to be able to fix our tractors our coffee machines our iPhones whatever it is there are little manifest manifestos that talk about how this is a sustainable practice this is a green practice it's a creative endeavor teaches children self-sufficiency it teaches them creativity its uses them design and you're seeing the rise of sites like iFixit org which is a repository of service manuals and repair codes that aren't publicly available so people can fix their cars right and their digital toasters and whatever it is that broke down that they spend a bunch of money on and they can no longer fix right and so this is the evidence that we're collecting about the kind of mixed hardware and software experiences that we're creating and it's up to us to determine what we do without information without evidence and how we start to restructure and redesign the experiences that we're building and so to bring this all home as you kind of contemplate everything you've learned here today and take things back with you to work on Monday first and foremost remember this no matter what you do no matter what you make no matter what the product or the services that you ship or how long you've been in business you are first and foremost in the software business it is the only way to compete it is the only way to scale in the 21st century now the amazing thing about the software business is that it unlocks new business models you haven't this amazing opportunity but in the tractor business for a hundred years all of a sudden you've got this amazing big data play right that's essentially what it is big data into efficiency right all of sudden you've got services API integrations all these opportunities to build new business models and think those through the code that you write the designs that you make the products that you manage will enforce the policies of your employer and they'll enforce the policies of your business right you'll write that into the code you'll write that into the design you'll didn't Union kind of mold that into the design of the products that you built but the culture of the people that you make products and services for will always trump that policy so if you don't take that into account they will find a way around it or they'll simply abandon your product so you have to make sure that the customer is always centered there now to learn that if you don't know that as a company if you haven't been around 100 years right build in these feedback loops talk to your customers you heard about that test new ideas right get those ideas out there build those regular interactions with your customers to reveal those cultural aspects that are going to get in the way perhaps of what you're currently thinking the experience you're currently thinking about designing and then lastly and perhaps most importantly it's this frame your success in user centric terms right it's not enough to sell tractors but did you make customers successful we heard earlier about not making a better camera but making a badass photographer same thing here you're not making a better tractor right you're making a badass farmer thanks very much for listening [Applause] so a photo is taken of your talk in this light that was always the technology cannot get ahead of culture or that's late the question is how do you complement in support this rather than exploit users exactly that's my question to you right essentially that's I think the only way to to complement this is to understand that culture now if you're going into an industry like farming for example right a generational traditional business or some or any kind of a practice that's been around a long time and you're not a subject matter expert it's imperative on you to to learn that culture to understand the motivations and to see how that how that's going to affect the interactions with your products and services i-22 actually anecdotes that I have related to that the first is I gave this talk two weeks ago in Silicon Valley down a mountain view california and in classic Silicon Valley sort of point of view I guess one one one guy raised his hand after I gave the talk and he said why don't we just automate the whole thing right like just cut the humans out of it right which again front from a purely engineering or a computer science kind of point of view I can see the logic behind it but the suggestion is that we end farming right by humans completely right something that's been going on for tens of thousands of years right you can't do that right there that you can't that's not the right approach in my opinion to solving this particular problem right is understanding that and in fact complimentary to that anecdote was when we were talking to farmers and researching for this talk we asked that kind of question we said look at some point where is this all going it's going to full automation and and what does that mean and and every farmer that we talked to said that means I don't want to get out of bed in the morning anymore I have nothing to wake up to do anymore and I don't know how to do anything else right and so you have to understand that culture embed yourself in that culture and make sure that you're solving even for the edge cases right like this to make sure that people can do what they need to do or you start to break that trust to break that oil T in terms of John dealing with the Ukrainian I guess and how our John Deere trying to respond to that why is their response in guys trying to uh cordon sell something that can stop them from doing their work is that make sense look I mean I would look at it this way right that's your competition right the Ukrainian hackers are not your competition right there they're providing something that your customers need to me that's market feedback that's market feedback that we are not fulfilling our entire brand promise or the value of the of the system that we've designed and that there has to be more that we can do to fill this we certainly don't want to leave this to the Ukrainian hackers and just like I adds an edge case and let them do it because realistically we have no idea what code is actually going into those devices and neither do the farmers who are downloading it and ultimately as these things do get more automated you know they're big machines it's dangerous to have a combine sort of running on its own with black market code sort of coursing through its veins right so this I think this is an issue for John Deere and they need they need to address it see it as the competition and figure out why that behavior is even happening and it's obvious why it's happening it's this is not a new thing for them they know this is happening and figure out how to deal with this in a way that allows them to maintain the integrity of their business and yet still meet customer needs yeah I think if we kind of swap that wrong from tractors randomly to Adobe for instance and the fact that you know a door before shop another stone and the whole huge package that we used to have before something like creative clowns gear out where what Tim is a subscription you were talking about 750 pounds is $8,000 for the software package people got pissed off they didn't want to pay the price they start hacking the software and then you push a group of people who need something far enough and then you end up with something like sketch sketches now out how to adorn be respond to combat with Creative Cloud but that takes innovation and obviously they're trying to now push other pieces of software out in terms of organizations Ava and John Deere and other organizations other people here might be a part of as designers and other professionals we've gotta kind of get in they to try and get that innovation to kick off is it again their case of trying to get everybody in the right room to make sure that the trying they focus on the user needs and then keep going from that point I think it's I think it's it's the only way to ensure that you're succeeding is to make sure that your customers are succeeding right if you find yourself in a situation where the price of your of your product has gone to the point where people aren't buying it anymore and they're looking for cracked versions on the market and we've all done that right particularly right it's that's evidence right that's not evidence that you should tighten the protections on your software it's evidence that you can should reconsider your business model and kudos to Adobe really dramatic but it took them a little while maybe I may be a little late but they did it and they did it fast

Channel: northernux

Views: 7,342

Rating: 4.8867927 out of 5

Keywords: usability, user experience, ux, nux, conference, design, nux6

Id: 5McyyI41UcY

Length: 41min 11sec (2471 seconds)

Published: Tue Jan 02 2018