"I Don't Want To Invest In Your Side Project" | Dragons' Den

first into the den is Michael horel from leads with a business born from bitter experience so I'm a heating engineer by trade and I was getting regular copper pipe theft from just outside my own front door so I know firsthand how devastating van crime can be the alarm will go off any second now Michael's hoping his product can make enough noise to alert the dragons to an opportunity today we're bringing in an Innovative design product to help protect the fabric of a van from Criminal damage and I hope the dragons are going to love it so can this van man drive off with a [Music] deal hello dragons my name is Michael horsefall and I'm here today to try to raise a £45,000 for a 10% share in my business currently in the UK there are 4.2 million vans that are registered on the roads with this figure though it also brings with it some Sinister statistics on average there are 28,000 reported cases of Van crime thefts from Vehicles tools and assets reported each year I suffered a spare of Van crime incidents that actually changed the course of my life what I realized was that factory fitted van alarms are designed to go off after the doors open which is too late this is why I Dev vanguardian a preemptive early warning alarm system it activates on contact to protect the vulnerable commonly targeted at risk zones on and around a van we've sold up uh nearly 500 units since we went live so if I'll just alarm our product if I now try to come to the vehicle and instigate the first thing of door tampering our alarm lets off a 2 second beep if that is ignored and the perpetrator goes into it again it will then activate continuously for for 30 seconds drawing attention to the criminal activity around the vehicle now bearing in mind that 62% of criminal activity is is undertaken uh from outside the home you become your own security guard effectively now I'm not saying you come charging out of your house to protect your van simply putting a light on and alerting to somebody that you're you're actually aware of it can be all the deterrent that he needs an early warning alarm system designed to protect both Vans and their contents from theft is the brainchild of Michael horseall T A look so you can set the cover off Peter that's designed to come off and then it's just it's velcroed no it's stuck on it's glued on that's glued with the 3M it easy Michael is seeking £45,000 in return for a 10% share in his company would you like me to set the alarm because the alarm goes off if you touch it yeah set the alarm if you tap anywhere on the van he'll go off the ethos behind his invention already appears to have struck a cord with Tuka sulan I'm a great believer in prevention is better than cure absolutely so what I want to know is what have you got unique to your business that makes you different ref to other alarms so in our pattern we've developed um a base with a 3M ibond contact adhesive tape the 3M adhesive tape is all that's needed to attach the base to the vehicle you just mentioned IP yes so what is your IP and show us exactly what you mean by your IP um sorry just elaborate you said that you have you have an IP pattern a patent patent you say you have a patent so the patent that we've got starts with the base so building up the foundations from the base from the attachment to the vehicle was fundamental towards a p you're losing me so you said you have a you have a patent on this I do have a patent what is the pattern that you have on it so the subtlety of our pattern to get a product like this to Market was the foundation of the base so that base must be flexible to follow the convex version of a back door right so so we've got 3M tape to to create that we've also instigated the possibility of powerful magnets Michael you haven't told me what you patn this what have you got a pattern on I think he's try to tell you I think it's the glue on the convex shap oh is it is it the glue no it's the we have a patent for the base that's flexible so our patent covers the flex of a base to attach to a convex area on the exterior of a vehicle Michael's failure to clear explain his product's protection has flocked the dragons and left Peter Jones wondering whether his invention is really an improvement on what's already available I've got a lot of fans in our supply chain business and they're all alarmed and the alarm will go off when you open that door the alarm goes off yeah but they're already in there Peter and we're trying to keep the outside well the minute they are in the alarm will go off so but it's too late Peter the is done well that it it's probably too late as well with this because if I was going to break into there I'd be in there in seconds the alarm would still go off so I'm going to no Peter I'm I'm sorry that's not the case because what what because with door peeling and cutting panels out it don't activate the door don't activate a fact fated allarm you have to open the door yeah but if I'm going to steal something from the thing I need the door open don't I no un how am I going to get something out that I want to get you not obvious come across door peeling where they actually bend the door down and it don't activate the alarm you can also have tamper alarms inside Vans if I want if they're fitted if they're fitted and they wired but that's your option I'm offering about an off-the-shelf fit yourself option for anybody on a limited budget our products back door side door is £145 Michael is standing his ground despite Peter Jones's concerns about the efficacy of his product now Deborah Meen wants to drill down into to the details of the [Music] business so you talked about you've sold 500 since you started when did you start so in Earnest we start say in Earnest because we've been doing this since 2019 and so with that period bearing in mind we ended up in a covid pandemic could have come at a worse time because at that time I had visions of looking at retailers and trying to get into retailers into that market and uh and seeing if that was going to be so since 2019 you've done 500 sales but within that there was a lockdown period so you you were restricted on what you could do so what I did then uh deorah to to compensate for what were going on with the pandemic was to look at online and deciding to set up a website where we could do online sales okay and where else are you setting them we went into retailers and asked them if they were interested in stocking this product I'm saying five six seven local retailers in the leads area um I offered them a 20% margin to introduce the me your best I cut across you only because you do have a habit of spreading the question into other areas so tell me your best retailer and how many they have sold so one of the problems we found with retailers your best retailer your it's it's a name and they have sold this many our best retailer would be let's have a think um an iron mongers that we Supply um in armlin how many have they sold currently they'll have sold two £ 2,800 worth of units how much do they cost you to make so the Dual alarm is £32 and the the other one is £22 so for an individual unit how much you sell that for that's £100 okay this one bought it singularly £55 but we sell it as a twin set so what is £45 which is what that combination because we have a flexible system when people invest in our product and buy more than one unit I reward them with 10% discount so we kind of want to encourage them to spend more money and buy more units so if they get the dual alarm and a single this is this is standard business stuff it is all you need to describe is we sell it in bundles bundle that sell 145 and it costs us54 to make buy them just talk just describe that but in all of your words you lose the key points about this business and this is really concerning for an investor right because um trying to get to the bottom of what is a really simple and quite small business at the moment yes and I've presented this today to captains of industry to try and guide me in the right direction and maybe you know show me the the sort the way forward with this Michael takes a firm stand on his need for a dragon but has Steven Bartlet heard anything which could prompt him to invest I think I actually do you know what I really I really applaud you for creating this product because I've seen over and over again the Heartbreak yes and how life shattering it can be for people when they have their van broken into so I think you know any effort you've made to try and solve that problem is to be commended thank you however I asked myself why didn't he have that determination and that that ruthless dogged ambition to sell more units no that's a very good point and I can answer that because I'm also a plumbing and eating engineer I've been doing my trade for 30 35 years and I so this is a side project it's effectively what a side project I don't know if I want to invest in your side project no it's not a side project no more we're now creating a business because that we've reached that point now where I've invested and my time and can see the potential of this product that we need to give it 100% I'm going to tell you where I am there's no evidence here for me that you've demonstrated the tenacity that's required to make this a really really big business so with that said and because I feel like the burden of would be so great on me versus the return I would get I'm going to say that I'm out but I wish you the very very best a setback for Michael who has lost his first dragon the entrepreneur has already gone toeo Toe with Peter Jones but has he persuaded him his offering has legs Mike I think that this is not a musthave product this is a nice to have this is what I would class as a very small Market within a small Market which is a considered purchase for those that want a tamperproof alarm system I I disagree obviously um but I do value your opinion I'm really sorry as much as you might not want to hear this because a lot of inventors don't yeah I think you will sell quite a few but I don't think that this is the answer to people breaking into Vans and for that reason I'm sorry but I'm out I don't think the market is as big as you probably think it is but I agree with Peter you're going to sell enough to make a good business my problem is that you can't tell us really straight and simple questions without just chucking words out there and and I'm I'm really sorry Michael but that that shows me a life invested in you yeah of spending way too much time trying to actually understand what you're trying to do or or unpick the the real drivers of the business right and not enough time saying okay I get it so I won't be investing all right thank you D I'm out Michael I actually think the product's really lovely thank you we have a lot of vans in our business I understand the problem you're selling and when you stand in front of me and explain it to me I think yep I might buy one of these my problem is I've got no real understanding of how you're going to turn my investment into a greater return for me so I'm want to wish you all the best and say that I'm out but I look forward to watching your journey from afar right three more cold shoulders for the heating engineer turned entrepreneur and four dragons have now bowed out only tuas suan is yet to deliver his verdict Michael Toka how you feeling look I did say to you earlier on I'm a great believer that prevention is better than cure yeah and you have something but I don't believe that this is an investment that I can make any return on my investment at all in the short term so for that reason I'm going to say good luck but I'm out thank you thanks Mike thank you thank you very much sadly for Michael he must leave with nothing the dragons may have blown out out his hopes of investment but failure in the den hasn't left him too deflated it was disappointing result but a great experience what else can I say onwards and [Music] upwards

Channel: Dragons' Den

Views: 224,754

Keywords: dragon's den, dragon's den uk, evan davis, deborah meaden, peter jones, touker suleyman, tej lalvani, business pitching, entrepreneur, game show, reality tv, shark tank, sarah willingham, pyramid scheme, shark tank full pitches, dragons' den full episode, dragons den, dragons den 2022, dragons den worst pitches, sidemen dragons den, dragons den full episode, dragons den best pitch

Id: lG1gGX6vhEs

Length: 13min 58sec (838 seconds)

Published: Mon Feb 05 2024