How To Get Into Tech Product Management With No Tech Experience?

welcome to my new series called talk  tech with tiff where i am sitting down   with industry professionals to hear about  their career journeys and current roles i   created this series to hear from people  who are established in the tech industry   so that we can all learn what these individuals  do in their day-to-day jobs and the type of   opportunities that are out there okay let's get  started today i am sitting down with serena who   is a product manager at zoomer media hi serena hey  tiff how's it going it's going good how are you   good yeah thank you thanks for being here today  thanks for having me i'm really excited i'm so   excited i was reading a bit about your background  and your journey to product management and it's   so interesting because it's not necessarily  a straight path which i think is pretty cool   so i'd be interested to hear more about your  current role as a product manager yeah um so right   now i'm working for a canadian media agency um  we basically do things everything from television   to radio print magazines events um things like  that so i work on the digital team there and we   manage about 30 30 or so websites and apps um and  yeah so for me i'm more concerned with day-to-day   development operations so everything from you know  sprint planning making tickets things like that to   you know dealing with clients designers everyone  from everywhere in the business wow that's   really cool it's i for dealing or not dealing but  interacting with my own product managers at work   i can say honestly i think product managers have  one of the toughest jobs because there are so many   balls in the air at all times and you're wearing  so many different hats yeah it's definitely true   but i think i find it pretty fun i think it would  be boring to just be doing one thing every day so   yeah the chaos can be overwhelming sometimes but  it's mostly just exciting yeah you gotta thrive in   the chaos exactly it's gotta ride the wave i like  what happens that's awesome but i know you have   you actually haven't always had a path to product  management or it wasn't just a straight path   you uh you went to school for international you  have an international relations background right   yes yeah so tell me and i know you've  been in uh a media background as well   and i know zoomer is obviously media as well but  what was your path like to product management   now um yeah so i've always had an interest  in you know the performing arts and film   and things like that so my whole life i kind of  expected that that's the route i would take um   the decision to do international relations in  university was honestly a random one i made when   i was 17. um i don't think i ever really planned  to pursue it or or anything like that but uh   yeah after graduating i started working in film um  and i did not like it as much as i thought i would   okay so yeah um i really did enjoy the  creative aspect of it of course um but i   found the i found like the organizational  habits of a lot of people in the industry   maybe just don't align with my personality so  when the opportunity came up to work at zoomer   which is still you know media very creative yeah  but in a tech role um yeah i jumped at it that's   really cool that's good and i know going back  to you so casually said too which i think is   super interesting how international relations is  what you have a background in but even when from   my understanding when you were even going through  it you knew maybe you wouldn't be doing it after   i get asked a lot from people who went to school  for something different than what they want to   pursue and it stresses a lot of people out  but you're so casual about it you're like   yeah i went to school for this but during  school i knew i wasn't going to use it so   how give me your experience or your advice as to  how important is it to go to school for something   i mean okay i'm not talking about going to school  to become a doctor or you know what i'm saying   here but to go to school for something and then  switch into a different role or different industry   um i think it really depends on what you want  to do so for example when i wanted to go into   the arts uh as long as i was pursuing that on the  side for me i felt like that was fine yes like you   know you can manage your schedule so that you  know you can do that main degree and then still   pursue your interests and passions on the side but  yeah i don't know i think it definitely depends on   the person but i would say if you have an interest  which is not aligned with what you're studying or   working on full-time just do it in whatever  capacity you can and the experience i got   just doing stuff on the side was probably far  greater than the experience i would have gotten um   if i'd studied production or something i mean  i can't speak to that because i didn't but   yeah yeah exactly but real world experience  versus you know sometimes just relying on   sitting in a classroom which is important but that  real world experience is something that is i think   so valuable 100 yeah like you know talking  to friends who did study i don't know acting   or production design and things like that  obviously their experience is very technical   they're super knowledgeable but i mean for me  to just be like i'm gonna go do a film i'll   catch up on my classes later yes it was great  like i learned so much and you just learn it in   the moment you have to be reactive exactly exactly  so essentially do side projects or do internships   and what you're passionate about or take on all  those opportunities and even if it's not what   you're going to school for yeah absolutely i would  say so i love that kind of going back more to   your current role as a product manager um  i'm going to brag about you for a second here   i know you transitioned from a digital digital pro  sorry digital products coordinator to a product   manager and i believe it was three months yes  yeah that's amazing yeah that's really amazing   i i don't know about that but um yeah it was  easier than i thought it would be because   i'm lucky that i had a really good team to back me  up they were so willing to help me with everything   and i think the reason i got the opportunity is  because they were short of product managers so   they were like hey i think you can figure this  out do you want to just do it yeah yeah that's   really cool hey they could have hired from outside  so the fact they you know that's still huge and   i know uh with com becoming a product manager  it also comes with learning a lot of new tools   uh so kind of two questions here one is what  are some tools that you use on a daily basis   and the other is what are some tips for someone  who is considering or wanting to become a product   manager how do you quickly pick up new tools um  so for your first question in terms of tools i   use every day you know jira is the main one we use  at our company um they love like the whole google   suite so you know google docs spreadsheets excel  like there's nothing i use that's super complex   um but that being said getting familiar with  wordpress was one of the things i had to do   um learning about jenkins learning like what is  vs code i really started from knowing absolutely   nothing so yeah i think learning new tools  google's your best friend it is it really is   i think you've said that in so many of your videos  but like you just have to google things you do   you really do so for you mentioned jenkins and  vs code those are all really technical tools   so for i know it varies product manager to  product manager but how technical would you   say your product manager role is um for me the job  description is not very technical i don't actually   need to know a lot um but that being said knowing  more makes your life a lot easier yeah you know   because you are working with developers at the end  of the day so if you could speak their language   everybody's just going to have an easier time so  that's so true yeah like i'm still learning like   i'm still so behind on like all the things i want  to know and need to know but it's just a process   oh you know what listen i feel like i'm still so  behind i feel like everyone in the tech industry   feels so behind right yeah it's changing every  day and there's so much coming up but it's just   it's impossible pretty much yeah and it's  just like i feel like for me anyways it's   embracing that just recognizing that hey i'm  never gonna have it all figured out it's just   constantly learning exactly and once  you become okay with that like it   takes the pressure off a little bit it does i know  when i first started i would often think okay i   need to learn this today and know this tomorrow et  cetera and the pressure it puts on someone is just   first of all it's impossible and second of  all it's just it's the pressure too much   yeah like if you put that much pressure  on yourself you're never going to do it   exactly it's like you know exactly i agree so  going back to working closely with developers   what is some tips that you would have for other  product managers or people looking to get into it   who might be a little nervous for that because  a lot of developers or some developers anyways   just want to focus on the technical parts and  not necessarily uh focus more so on the client   or the task the bigger picture when it comes  to the client so how do you how do you find   communicating with developers and how do you what  are some strategies you use to be successful um well at the end of the day they are just  people yeah so if you can explain things   high level to clients the developers might  find that a little more frustrating when you   don't know exactly what they're talking about  when they get super technical but um i think   putting an onus on yourself to try to constantly  learn and if you hear a new word and you're like i   have no idea what this is looking it up and and  just trying your best to meet them at the same   level yeah is probably what i would do um but yeah  i think definitely depends on the team depends on   the person depends on your personality it's hard  to say it's true every team's so different every   product manager role every developer every role  really depends on the team too how it how it's   kind of run yeah exactly for sure that's really  cool okay i have another question for you around   getting into product management i get asked  sometimes they are considering getting into   product management but they don't really know  if it's for them and i know it varies person   to person but what are some skills or some of  your favorite things about product management   that maybe someone can go hey i like that  too maybe product management is for me   yeah um you have to like dealing with people um  all kinds of people that's probably a big one   just being comfortable with that um organizational  skills definitely help and like that can come from   anywhere yeah so you know like for me i've  always been like that kid with a color-coded   agenda so for me that was that was very helpful  to have but um in terms of getting into it there's   so many courses available online um like udemy  linkedin even like where you can learn agile and   scrum and things like that so i found that very  helpful personally but also there's um courses   like you can do a csm or a cspo course and i did  one recently and it was so helpful like super   helpful even if it's things you think you know  just terminology and theories yeah yeah yeah it's   so true i've heard i've heard really good things  about the csm uh it's a certification right yes   yes yeah yeah i heard it's quite difficult  um i did cspo which is um very similar but   the spo is for product owners rather than scrub  masters okay um and i wouldn't say it's difficult   okay but it's taxing it's um typically done over  two days and it's like a 16-hour crash course so   it's um grueling but you know they break it down  for you and if you have any familiar familia   familiarity with any of the words already or terms  then it's a lot better yeah that's really cool and   so we're talking a little bit about what you enjoy  about it the organizational side what are some   things about it that are your least favorite  or you dislike so the chaos is a blessing and   a curse for sure there's days where i'm all  about it and like loving it but then there's   days where i'm like okay like this like nothing  makes sense why is this happening you know but   but that's life um i would say managing deadlines  is a really hard thing to do um planning and like   sprint planning especially in my organization  because it's media so things change very fast   and there's a lot of creative decisions that  change quite a lot yeah um you know planning   a sprint saying okay this is what we're going to  be doing this sprint and then having someone be   like hi i need this up in two hours otherwise  we're dead so just kind of balancing that is   something i find a bit frustrating sometimes but  it's okay exactly and as and as the opposite side   of that as a developer i think it's been honed  it's been pushed on me so much to be like tiff   from other developers never give your product  manager timeline which i know you're gonna hate   from used to say so i'm sure you have to deal  sometimes too with developers being like well   it'll be done soon but yeah no definitely but i'm  really lucky my the devs on my team are so great   that i'm like okay somebody's breathing down my  neck right now just between you and me what are   we looking at yeah exactly the more authentic  and and candid conversations you can have with   other team members i feel like is is the way  to go 100 like you know they're my team at the   end of the day so having that relationship with  them that's just between us like it you know it   helps because they know that i'm looking out for  them they're looking out for me and it just makes   everything a lot easier and a lot less stressful  when you have someone you know is like actually on   your side oh like one thousand percent i remember  having some product managers who it was a very uh   very work-related work work relationship i  don't know how you would say it but it was very   they ask when they need something and that's  kind of it and it can definitely make for not   the best communication whereas if you're working  closely with someone especially a product manager   that you feel like really has your back and  wants you to succeed as much as they want the   product to succeed and it just makes for such  an overall better work environment and i think   better quality of work overall that's produced  definitely i completely agree yeah for sure   that's really so for someone who is watching  this and wants to get into product management   management but has no background in it prior what  is some advice i know this is a very big question   but what is some advice or tips that you would  give to them of where to start whether it be   networking or just finding different opportunities  networking 110 i don't think i ever would have   found myself in this industry if it weren't for  networking um like talk to anyone talk to everyone   the best piece of advice i have ever gotten  like on an actual networking call was   after the call always ask the person that you're  talking to is there anyone else in your network   who you might be willing to connect me with and  like it changed my life because you go from like   you know cold reaching out to people on linkedin  and maybe they'll respond to getting one person   having them connect you with three people and then  three more people it's game changer for sure yeah   i've never heard that piece of advice before but  i'm always going to do that now exactly and like   nine times out of ten they will connect you with  someone it's like as long as they like you even   if they can't really help you or help you get a  job but yeah people are people are cool that way   they are and i find especially too i mean i can  only speak to fashion and tech but in the tech   industry that people are so i was very shocked of  how willing people are strange complete strangers   that are willing to help you they're just excited  to have you in the industry they want to share   their network like it's a very big community  which is pretty cool yeah no it's great and   it's very welcoming which is so nice yeah yeah i  think people from the outside looking in think oh   this is going to be it's hard to break in it's  very intimidating there's this like wall up but   once you just start networking and putting  yourself out there it's it's pretty friendly it's   true absolutely yeah i just gotta kind of take  it in and like just do it exactly yeah what about   coming from a background that necessarily yes it  was in media but not around uh product management   how do you make your resume stand out when you  are applying for this job now i know networking is   the biggest tip to anything but what are some  what's some advice you would give for people who   don't have a lot of experience  for the role they are applying for   yeah um the main thing i would say is just  because you have experience in a different field   or different industry does not mean that those  skills you have won't apply to your new role so   whatever it was that you were doing before there's  definitely going to be some commonalities and some   skills that you have that you can transfer over so  definitely highlight those whatever that may be so   for me i guess coming from film production  to product management was like organization   managing schedules and deadlines and things  like that so that's a big one um and also just   like general resume tips just make sure it's not  more than one page if you're early in your career   i have been roasted for having like a long  resume so just don't do it yeah i've been   there too i hear you because you almost want  to overcompensate yeah exactly but i feel like   leaving enough space in your resume that somebody  actually wants to call you back and talk about it   is helpful and that's like one of the things  that helped me because you want to make sure   that you're putting enough information down that  they want to talk to you but you're not giving so   much that they're like well i don't need to speak  to them i already know what i'm getting wow i like   that that's good leave them wanting more in a  way exactly yeah always leave them wanting more   i love that last question i have for you is what  is some advice in maybe one or two sentences that   you would give to your younger self oh i'm putting  you on the spot yeah um chill out i love that like   actually relax stop trying to over plan do what  you need to do to get to the next step but also   take opportunities as they come and just say yes  yes i love all of that that's great serena thank   you so much for chatting with me today i feel like  this has been so valuable and i've learned so much   from listening to you thank you thank you so  much for having me this was really fun thank you

Channel: Tiff In Tech

Views: 26,504

Keywords: Tips From a Product Manager, Tiff In Tech, TiffInTech, Product Management, product manager coaching, product manager resume, product manager day in the life, how to become a product manager, product manager role, product management interview, what is product management, product manager interview, self taugh programmers, how to get into tech, women in tech, code with me, self taught software engineer, learn programming asap, Self taught programmer

Id: 3zsU0-2Q99Y

Length: 18min 11sec (1091 seconds)

Published: Tue Mar 29 2022