without objection the chair May declare the committee in recess at any point the purpose of this hearing is to receive testimony on President Biden and secretary may aras's open border policies and how these failed policies have had profound and devastating impact throughout the country this is the first Hearing in this committee's impeachment proceedings regarding secretary meus I now recognize myself for an opening statement good morning today is a solemn occasion as this committee begins official impeach proceedings in the matter of Department of Homeland Security secretary Alejandro marus and his handling of America's borders since taking office in February 2021 I wish we weren't sitting here today I wish these proceedings were not necessary I wish our Southwest border was Secure I wish that our government was enforcing the laws passed by the Congress and doing its job to keep the American people safe unfortunately sec secretary Marcus has done none of these things for almost a year the house committee on homeland security has conducted a comprehensive investigation into the causes costs and consequences of the unprecedented crisis at our Southwest border our evidence makes it clear secretary mayorcas is the architect of the devastation that we have witnessed for nearly three years the findings of our investigation available to the public at homeland. house.gov coupled with the secretary's refusal to change course on The Reckless decisions facilitating this crisis have left us with no reasonable alternative than to pursue the possibility of impeachment the secretary's actions have brought us here today not ours since early 2021 we've watched in disbelief as historic numbers of inadmissible aliens have poured across our borders both at official ports of entry and illegally crossing the thousands of miles of our borders on secretary Marcus's watch Customs and Border Protection has recorded more than 8.1 million encounters at America's borders including more than 6.7 million at our Southwest border alone for comparison CBP recorded just over 3 million encounters Nationwide from fiscal year 2017 to 2020 Jay Johnson President Obama's former DHS secretary previously said that a thousand encounters A Day quote overwhelms the system end quote on secretary Marcus's watch encounters have never averaged less than 3,000 per day even going as high as 10 to 12,000 per day just a few days ago internal CBP numbers leaked to the media showed another 302,000 encounters at the Southwest border alone in December by far an all-time record that's nearly enough people to fill the Rose Bowl three times in just one month in addition to these catastrophic numbers of the record 1.8 million known Goda ways who've entered the country on secretary amicus's watch individuals that border patrol agents know slip across our border but are not apprehended in large part because the cartels overwhelm the agents with large groups of coyote paid and escorted migrants the agents see them and they count them but they cannot apprehend them but the numbers are most certainly far worse as agents are moved to Crossing sites to process migrants and the border is completely unmanned there are no agents present to count the known Goda ways the number of unknown Goda ways is no doubt enormous thousands of Agents have been pulled off the front lines to process and release into our country record numbers of illegal aliens who know they will be released into the country and given a free bus or plane ticket to the city of their choice I ask you to watch this video a border shutdown in elb Paso Texas as hundreds force their way onto the Bas de Norte international bridge title 42 has officially expired Homeland Security officials say illegal border crossings topped 10,000 per day this week the highest levels ever thousands of migrants in central Mexico continue to travel on freight trains and travel all the way to the southern border arriving here in Eagle Pass outnumbered and out resourced border patrol agents say they are struggling to keep up with this massive influx of migrants descending on our Southern border border patrol clearly does not have the manpower to process the thousands of migrants here so the situation is pretty dire hundreds upon hundreds of adult men who have crossed illegally waiting here in the Arizona Sun for border patrol to apprehend them and they hope be released into the United States somewhere sources telling news nation that agents have been pulled from nearby checkpoints to assistant processing that thousands of migrants Crossing into Eagle Pass every day this is all by Design the Smugglers realize that this particular area is vulnerable what Americans must understand today is that these historic numbers the chaos you just saw on the screen are the result of a much deeper problem and that problem is not instability in other countries it's not poverty it's not climate change it's not supposedly broken immigration system all of these excuses have long predated secretary Marcus's tenure and yet we've never experienced a crisis like this as even the New York Times admits and I quote push factors don't explain the entire Surge and maybe not even most of it there have been no recent Wars in Latin America and the Region's poverty rate has been flat end quote the New York Times I'll also note that uh two of the 16 cities in the world with the highest murder rates are right here in the United States now this crisis has been intentional secretary me orcus was made aware of testimony given by President Biden's attorney general Merck Garland where the AG admitted the current policies are being exploited by the cartels yet secretary mayus turns around and implements additional policies to expand the Catch and Release measures empowering the cartels and killing Americans after nearly 3 years of watching this unfold what other conclusion is there but this is an intentional crisis secretary May Arcus has brazenly refused to enforce the laws passed by Congress as and enacted policies that knowingly make our country less safe what we're seeing here is a willful violation of his oath of office taken by secretary meus let me repeat that a willful violation secretary marus has used Mass parole to Rel release more than 1.5 million inadmissible aliens into the country despite the immigration and nationality act stating that parole is to be used only as an I quote Case by case end quote and quote temporary basis for a quote significant benefit or urgent humanitarian reason end quote the chief Patrol agent of the board patrols Laro sector told us last June that historically parole and I quote was used only in extreme humanitarian instances if a child was sick had to go to the hospital we'd parole the parent in a some or in or something like that but that was very rare it wasn't an everyday thing end quote this Porter Chief is right the scale of secretary marcus' Mass use and abuse of parole is unprecedented and has been declared inconsistent with the laws passed by Congress by multiple federal judges but remain a central component of secretary's agenda the immigration and nationality act also requires that illegal aliens apprehended crossing the border be detained pending their removal proceedings secretary meus has ignored this law in fiscal year 2013 according to dhs's own numbers the Obama Administration detained 82% of illegal aliens from the moment they were encountered until their case was decided and another 9% were held for at least some time some portion of time after that that's a pretty good track record and under a Democrat Administration and secretary mayus his first year on the job that 82% number dropped to just 10% illegal aliens not detained at all jumped from 9% to 64% in fy21 in a court opinion earlier this year federal judge Kent weatherell wrote and I quote the evidence establishes that in late January or early Fe February of 2021 DHS made a discret change in detention policy from Lease Only If there is a compelling reason to to release unless there is a compelling reason not to end quote the deputy chief of the boorder of patrols Yuma sector told our committee in September quote the belief that they are going to be released with no consequences is certainly something that many migrants tell our agents end quote on secretary Marcus's watch that's a pretty good bet and under his leadership individuals guilty of violent crimes and even some of the on the terrorist watch list have been released into this country just Monday multiple sources confirmed secretary meus admitted that released rates of illegal aliens are currently around 85% all told DHS numbers indicate that well over 3 million inadmissible aliens have been released into our country on secretary marcus' watch factor in the 1.8 million known Goda ways the UN qualifiable unknown Goda ways that's roughly the population of the state of South Carolina now only has secretary maricus refused to detain these individuals in accordance with the law but he has also made it nearly impossible for immigrations and Customs Enforcement to remove them his policies have largely restricted the ability of ice to detain and remove the population of illegal aliens ice removes ice removals dropped from more than 267,000 nfy 19 to less than 60,000 in fy21 and 70,000 in 22 the FY 23 numbers were better but were still more than 40,000 fewer than the lowest year of the last Administration which largely occurred in the midst of Co the covid pandemic criminals as a percentage of all ice arrests went from around 90% in fy2020 to just 43% in FY 23 the secretary is not even living up to his own flawed standards that supposedly prioritize threats to Public Safety the former sector Chief in San Diego told us in May of 2023 that he didn't think the consequences of being removed from the country was being utilized enough to deter illegal immigration even Texas Democrat Mr quar has said and I quote if you don't detain people if you don't send people back then the Border becomes a speed bump end quote on top of all this upon entering office secretary Americus immediately began dismantling effective policies that had secured the Southwest border despite being warned by experienced border security Personnel the consequences that would result that coupled with his consistent decision to double down on his own unlawful policies indicates an intentionality to this crisis and I must note with great emphasis these are not simple policy differences this is a yearslong pattern of refusing to enforce the laws passed by Congress our investigation also uncovered the fact that secretary meus has VI violated the authority of his office secretary meus has directed a department to create numerous new unlawful Mass parole programs that have allowed an unprecedented number of individuals to enter our country who otherwise would have no lawful basis to be here and to incentivize migrants to make the dangerous and sometimes deadly travel to our Southern border he has also effectively told ice officers not to do their job in enforcing America's immigration laws according to his own guidance to ice and I quote the fact an individual is removable should not alone be the basis of an enforcement action against them end quote and quote our Personnel should not rely on the fact of conviction end quote for a flatly deportable crime but must consider quote mitigating factors that mitigate humiliate in favor of declining enforcement action end quote he has even overseen The Reckless and irresponsible use of federal law enforcement Personnel to sweep under the rug the messies made at the Southwest border border patrol Agents from the northern border have been deployed to the Southwest border to assist in processing and releasing illegal aliens into the interior hundreds of law enforcement professionals from Homeland Security investigations have been pulled from serious investigations like sex crimes child exploitation and other atrocities to perform administrative functions at the border one whistleblower claimed that his team was told to shut down its investigations and were then sent to the border to make sandwiches the secretary has abused his authority and put Americans at risk secretary morcus has repeatedly lied to the American people and to the United States Congress our investigation undercovered more than 100 instances where secretary morcus misled the public notably he claimed in April 2022 to hearing to have operational control of the Southwest border as defined by federal statute this was false he then told another uh Lie by claiming in subsequent hearings that he does not use the statutory definition of operational control despite doing so in that 2022 hearing watch for yourself will you testify under oath right now do we have operational control yes or no yes we do and we have operational control of the borders yes we do and Congressman we are working to list what operational control defined in this section the term operational control means the prevention of all unlawful entries into the United States including entries by terrorists other unlawful aliens instruments of terrorism narcotics and other Contraband do you stand by your testimony that we have operational control in light of this definition you and Congressman I think the Secretary of Homeland Security would have said the same thing in 2020 and in 2019 that's the definition ofer the definition you have sir up there no we don't don't have operational control no sir with respect to the definition of operational control I do not use the definition that appears in the secure fence act do you admit that your policies have led the country farther away from operational control of the Border as defined by the Congress Congressman no I do not if you will recall when you testified here in front of me when I asked that question when you very clearly stated we do have operational control when presented with the actual definition of operational control you didn't hesitate you said I do and you in fact then referred back and said I believe that my predecessors would have said the same thing you looked straight at the American people straight at me straight at every every person on this committee and said we have operational control why Congressman two points one you did not let me complete my answer two hold on it's give me your second Point go ahead thank you two two the secure fence act defines operational control as not a single individual crosses the bo I'm aware I read it and I read it to you and you read it and in fact you said I do you didn't hesitate you didn't say I do I need I need to explain what I mean by I do you said I do over and over again secretary Americus told this very Committee in September 2021 and I quote the border is no less secure than it was previously end quote CBP recorded more than 192,000 encounters at our border that month alone compared to around 58,000 the prior September it was clear the Border was not secure so why did he mislead Congress another video please is the Border more secure under your leadership than when you started uh Congressman the border is secure we're executing our plan and I've been very clear and unequivocal in that regard M Mr secretary the question is is the Border more secure now under your leadership Congressman it is no less secure than it was previously we have a record number of retirements historic level of Narcotics that have come across the border and you still stand by statement yes or no that the border is secure yes he even stood at the White House podium in September 21 and falsely accused mounting border patrol a mounted border patrol agents in the Del Rio sector of whipping illegal aliens crossing the border earlier that same day DHS emails showed that his staff had informed him that an eyewitness said no whipping occurred yet he Advanced The Narrative at the highest levels anyway way one sector Chief told us and I quote we never whipped anybody it was never really cleared up and that takes a toll on our agents end quote please play the video we are very troubled by what we have seen uh one cannot weaponize a horse uh to aggressively attack a child we know that those images painfully conjured up the worst elements of our nation's ongoing battle against systemic racism uh first of all uh the images as I expressed uh earlier uh the images horrified Us in terms of what they suggest and what they conjure up in terms of not only our nation's history but unfortunately the fact that that page of History has not been turned entirely and that means that there is much work to do and we are very focused on doing it and email obtained through a records request reveals that DHS secretary Alejandra mayorcas was privately alerted by DHS officials that the whipping narrative behind the infamous horseback border patrol photos wasn't true but at a press conference hours later my orcus didn't stop or dispute that narrative this is just a taste of secretary marcus' misconduct however I want to close by reminding everyone that we're here today not only because House Republicans are determined to hold secretary Americus accountable but because more than 200 house Democrats voted on November the 13th to refer articles of impeachment to our committee we're now acting in a bipartisan way I suppose in taking up those very articles and I briefly want to make it clear to the American people secretary Marcus's refusal to follow the law is sufficient grounds for impeachment impeachment proceedings the Constitutional history is overwhelmingly clear on this subject the founders designed impeachment not just to remove officials engaged in criminal Behavior but those guilty of such gross incompetence that their conduct had endangered their fellow Americans betrayed the public trust or represented a neglect of Duty according to one scholar there is and I quote a settled understanding Beyond dispute that impeachable offenses are not limited to prosecutable crimes rather the framers of the Constitution understood and the House of Representatives has consistently concluded that the impeachment power reaches all manner of gross misconduct in office that does serious harm to the US political system the US constitutional order or the people of the country the actions policies and statements of secretary meus easily meet the standards in quote over the next few hours you might hear a lot about process and procedure and after a thorough year-long investigation this committee is following the Constitution and procedure as directed by The house's vote this past November make no mistake mistake attacks on the Integrity of the process are meant to distract you from the deadly consequences of our open border unprecedented cartel control of our Southwest border with record amounts of fenel flooding across between ports of entry and into our communities killing tens of thousands of Americans every year over 300 individuals on the terrorist watch list apprehended illegally crossing the Southwest border since FY 2021 compared to just 14 from FY 2017 to 2020 families devastated by violent criminal aliens who have committed murder rape and assault to say nothing of the vehicular crimes committed CBP and Ice Personnel losing faith in their in their mission they and their families bearing the brunt of this Onslaught at the border the human costs of this crisis are very real the dollar costs of this crisis have been astronomical as well New York City alone projects that it will have have to spend 122 billion dealing with the flow of illegal aliens into the City by 2020 25 and it is even cutting the police force to pay for it one County in Texas had to cut salaries to afford be to afford burials and cremations of illegal aliens found dead in their jurisdiction these costs will be felt for years to come as I stated when we started this investigation almost a year ago we will follow the facts we have done just that and the facts have led us here I look forward to the testimonies of these distinguished Attorneys General who have watched this crisis play out unabated in their states for the sake of our homeland security and the well-being of the people of the United States Secretary mayorcas must be held accountable I now recognize the ranking member the gentleman from Mississippi Mr Thompson for his opening statement thank you very much Mr chairman Mr chairman in April before this committee even began its so-called impeachment inquiry chairman green promised donors at at a campaign event that he'd bring an impeachment case against Secretary of Homeland Security Alejandro mayoras according to a recording of his comments obtained by the media the chairman went on to tell those deep pocket contributors to quote get the popcorn and quote is going to be fun the chairman may have thought that only those in the campaign event would hear his remarks but the truth has a way of coming out his promise to a room full of donors tell the American people all they need to know about why Republicans are hellbent on impeaching secretary mayorcas the promise of impeachment was made at a campaign event and shortly afterwards Republicans began their so-called investigation into secretary mayorcas it is now campaign season and Republicans recently rolled out their impeachment proceedings against secretary like a pre-plan predetermined political stunt it is this is not a legitimate impeachment Republicans want to throw political red meat to their base and keep that campaign Cash Coming they know they already raiseth in majority is slipping away and think impeaching secretary mayorcas even though there's absolutely no basis for it will keep them in control of the House Republicans certainly aren't going to win votes based on their abysmal legislative record this has been the most unproductive dysfunctional Congress in memory they kicked their own speaker out and then couldn't agree on a new one they paralyzed the house for weeks while they fought among themselves they've struggled to keep the government funding and are continually on the verge of shutting it down a member of their party was expelled for lying about practically everything in his life extreme Mega Republicans have created this impeachment circus Sideshow in part to try to distract from their own failures they took their Sideshow on the road recently traveling to the border to stand behind a Podium making canned speeches and posing for photo ops but for all their border security Bluster Republicans oppose funding necessary to secure the Border they tried to cut money from Customs and Border Protection personnel and have refused to take up the president's supplemental funding requests chairman green himself recently pinned an OP Ed saying and I quote not another dime to DHS unquote until the Republican border bill is signed into law even though he knows full well that disastrous bill has absolutely zero chance of being enactive it should be Unthinkable that a chairman of the committee on homeland security would threatened to defund DHS but that's exactly what happened this is funding our Frontline border and immigration agencies need to better secure the Border Republicans have tried to excuse their opposition to border funding by claiming that border patrol doesn't want more funding but that is blatantly false in interviews with the committee border patrol Chiefs unequivocally supported more resources Republicans know that they were in the room and they have the trans transcripts but let me refresh their memory Jason Owens currently the chief of the border of Patrol said we always need more agents Chief Molin in Tucson an agency we need a lot more a lot more people from Chief Hani in San Diego we always need resources and Technology from Chief B O in El Central the additional resources is the correct technology assist with control of the border and finally from Chief sez in El Paso providing support for critical positions and Resources by Congress really does impact positively the deployment of agents to the front line every one of these Chiefs told the committee that having more resources would help them better secure the Border Republicans go to the border and dress pants and polo shirts to pose for pictures but then leave the hardworking agents and uniform and work boots behind without the resources they ask for Democrats want to give border agents what they need to secure the border and Republicans do not the truth is securing the Border isn't really the Republicans top concern if it was they provide the people with boots on the ground at the border what they need to get the job done Republicans would rather exploit a challenging policy issue for their own preed political gain Republicans disagree with the Biden administration's border and immigration policies they're angry that this Administration won't take babies from their moms or put kids in cages like the last Administration you cannot impeach a cabinet secretary because you don't like the president's policies let me say that again you cannot impeach a cabinet secretary because you don't like a president's policies that's not what impeachment is for that's not what the Constitution says Republicans are willing to do grave damage to the Constitution they claim to hold dear because they think it will benefit them politically and in doing so they're targeting secretary May orcus a public servant who spent his distinguished 30-year career serving our country as a federal prosecutor and in leadership positions across the Department of Homeland Security the facts show secretary mayorcas is doing his job across the Department's many critical Homeland Security missions including border security and immigration enforcement despite what Republicans would have Americans believe secretary me orcus is enforcing immigration law according to a recent analysis by the KO Institute someone who crosses the border under the current Administration is more likely to be removed from the US than someone who crossed under former president Trump Republicans don't care about that this impeachment sham clearly is about isn't about facts it's not about the law it's about pure and simple politics just look at those whose impeachment resolutions have been referred to this committee consider what kind of back room deals Republican leadership must have made with the most extreme Mega members or as one Republican member recently put it and I quote we are simply accommodating our least sensible conference members I certainly agree Democrats are doing everything they can to hold the line against Republican chaos Democrats want to strengthen border security we want to keep fenol off the streets we want to keep communities safe this circle Sid show impeachment does none of that Mr chairman let's drop this baseless impeachment and start doing the real work of securing the Homeland for the American people before I yield back however Mr chairman I have some parliamentary inquiries you're recognized Mr chairman isn't it true that there is no language in either rule 10 or rule 11 that grants the committee on homeland security jurisdiction over the impeachment of any Federal Officer that is not a valid parliamentary uh inquiry you need to state the rule and how it relates to this proceeding uh that's why it's an inquiry because I'm referencing either rule 10 or rule 11 that grants the committee of Homeland Security jurisdiction or over impeachment of any officer there was a vote on the house floor actually the motion made by the Democrats to move impeachment articles to this committee uh that trumps the rules uh and it passed the house floor and we are proceeding in accordance with the demands of the United States House of Representatives by vote of the members forther parliamentary inquiry gentleman's recognized is a chair aware that of the five resolutions impeaching secretary mayorcas introduced in the house so for this Congress just one house resolution 863 has been referred to the committee of Homeland Security and that four others have been referred by the speaker to the committee on J judiciary again uh I need to know the rule that you uh think this is in violation of so it's not a um correct parliamentary inquiry I I didn't I didn't understand your you ruing not a valid parliamentary inquiry further parliamentary inquir Mr gentlem recognized would the chair inform the committee of which rule our president supports the idea that the motion to refer overrides house rules on committed jurisdiction particular over a constitutional matter that should have been referred to the committee on Judiciary it is that is not a valid parliamentary inquiry further parliamentary inquiry the gentleman is recognized has the Full House authorized this impeachment inquiry such as it did on J January 14th 1876 for the investigation of then Secretary of War will W bellnap are such as the house did on December 133 2023 for the investigation of President Biden again not a valid parliamentary inquiry the House of Representatives voted to send this to this committee further parliamentary inquir gentleman is recognized is a chair aware that the committee on the Judiciary adopted internal rules of procedure for the conduct of its impeachment inquiry of ex-president Trump in 2019 and does the chair intend to follow suit and adopt additional committee rules to ensure due process for secretary mayorcas in this as yet unauthorized inquiry again not a valid parliamentary inquiry uh further parliamentary inquir gentleman is recognized and in reference to the secretary's right to do process I have the following parliamentary inquir Mr chairman does the committee intend to follow the secretary to be represented by Council during these impeachment proceedings the committee will follow the rules of the house on that measure so so do I understand that Secretary of May orus will be allowed counsel the committee will follow the rules of the house on that further parliamentary inquir gentleman is recognized does the committee intend to allow the secretary's councel to be present at all hearings and deposition the committee will follow the rules of the house additional inquir gentle the gentleman is recognized does the committee intend to allow the secretary is councel to present evidence and object to the admission of evidence the committee will follow the rules of the house is that a no the committee will follow the rules of the house so do the rules allow it that's that's that's my point we will follow the rules of the house as they are written um and the question isn't pertinent to this Committee hearing today well I think we'll we'll get to that at some point Mr chairman but I just want to go on the record in pursuit of this is that when former president Trump had impeachment uh matters brought before uh Senator Lindsey Graham made sure that he was afforded counsel and questions and everything and I'm just trying to make sure that that we follow some kind of order in that as as I stated uh Mr ranking member we will follow the rules of the house all thank you um further the Parliamentary inquir does the committee intend to allow the secretary's counsel to call and cross-examine Witnesses again the the committee will follow the rules of the house further parliamentary inquir gentleman is recognized does the committee intend to give the secretary's Council access to and the ability to respond to the evidence added by the committee the committee will follow all of the rules of the house thank you Mr chairman with that I you back thank you ranking member other members of the committee are reminded that opening statements may be submitted for the record I'm pleased to have disting a distinguished panel of witnesses before us today and I ask that our Witnesses please rise and raise their right hand do you solemnly swear that the testimony you will give before the committee on homeland security of the United States House of Representatives will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you God let the record reflect that the witnesses have answered in the affirmative thank you please be seated Ed I would now like to formally introduce our Witnesses Mr kudon Austin kudon was sworn in as Montana's 25th Attorney General on January the 4th 2021 prior to that he was elected to the Montana House of Representatives in 2010 from 2015 to 2019 he served as the speaker of the Montana House of Representatives gner Drummond was sworn in as Oklahoma's 19th Attorney General on January the 9th 2023 Mr Drummond's law experience spans nearly 30 years and includes Service as an assistant district attorney and Pony and us how do you pronounce it oage counties and as an attorney in private practice Andrew Bailey was sworn in as the 44th Attorney General of the state of Missouri on January the 3 2023 Mr Bailey is a veteran of the United States Army in which he served in combat as a commissioned officer following the terrorist attacks of September 11 Mr Frank Bowman is the University of Missouri's curators distinguished professor emeritus and Floyd R Gibson Missouri endowed professor of law ameritus at the University of Missouri school of law he has also taught at Georgetown University Law Center Washington and Lee University Gonzaga University Indiana University's mckin School of Law Wake Forest University and the University of Denver and in Spring of 2023 was visiting fellow at Oxford University's roir American Institute I thank all the witnesses for being here today and I now recognize Mr kson for five minutes to summarize his opening statement thank you Mr chairman members of the committee chairman green ranking member Thompson members of the distinguished committee my name is Austin newon Montana attorney general as the attorney general and chief law enforcement officer for the state of Montana I'm grateful for this committee's attention to how secretary Alejandro mearis failed leadership has impacted States like Montana the southern border certainly presents difficult challenge for any Administration but secretary mayorcas and the Biden Administration have absolutely poured gasoline on this fire the southern border and the drugs flowing across it into community large and small across our nation are ultimately the reason that I am the Attorney General of Montana today I'm from rural Montana where I was a private practice attorney until two drug dealers sped past my kids' school one shooting at the other out his vehicle window in broad daylight after that incident I became our elected County prosecutor where I saw what I thought were the absolute worst things possible babies born addicted to drugs kids thrown into foster care because their parents would rather buy drugs than take care of them young girls sexually assaulted by family members on drugs people murdered over $20 drug deals gone wrong so to say that I was encouraged by the previous administration's progress in securing our nation's border is an understatement it's also an understatement to say that I was horrified to see this Administration under secretary mayorcas lead leadership begin to erase that progress and systematically dismantle policies and programs meant to secure our borders the most devastating impact of the open border on Montana has been the massive quantities of Mexican cartel Fentanyl and methamphetamine in 2020 drug task forces in Montana seized 6,663 dosage units of fentanyl in 2021 the first year of secretary Marcus's watch at the border that quantity exploded tfold to 61,000 dosage units of fentanyl in 2022 Montana tripled that seizing nearly 190,000 dosage units of cartel fentel the numbers aren't finalized yet for 2023 but I can tell you that as of the third quarter of 2023 Montana is on track to have seized nearly a half million dosage units of Fentanyl and another 200 lb of meth and the cartels trafficked 100% of that Fentanyl and meth across the southern Border in just one week during March 2022 17 people on the black feed Indian Reservation overdosed on fentanyl four of them died I spoke with a woman later that Year from the fort peek Indian Reservation which is where I'm from she was was Raising her grandkids because both of her sons were killed in two separate fentanyl overdose incidents Nationwide indigenous people suffer the highest rate of fentanyl overdoses in Montana the opioid overdose death rate among Native Americans is twice that of white people the devastation of secretary morcus refusal to Faithfully execute the laws goes beyond the deaths that causes and the anguish families left to pick up pieces these drugs cause people to do absolutely unspeakable things a suspect in a current drug case in Montana was taking delivery of drugs that were being supplied directly from the cartels in Mexico she kept her minor daughter living in a yard shed and allowed the man delivering those drugs to sexually assault her daughter as part of that drug deal in another case last year a young mother who was homeless was able to finally find a bedroom in a house not knowing that that room had been recently occupied by a fentel user shortly after taking residence that mother found her 11-month-old child not breathing fortunately medical and law enforcement Personnel responded quickly enough to administer the lock Zone before the fentel from the prior occupant killed that infant child the Trump Administration overcame Fierce opposition at every turn and was able to gain control of our Southern border as no previous administration could but all of that progress has been destroyed secretary mayorcas is the architect of that destruction the American people are watching they know that our border was Secure just a few years ago they see the devastation metastasizing in our communities from drugs and human trafficking the conclusion is clear secretary morcus has violated his oath and I urge this body to impeach thank you Mr chairman thank you Mr I I now recognize Mr Drummond for five minutes to summarize his opening statement good morning chairman green ranking member Thompson and members of the committee thank you for inviting me to participate today in this hearing on this critical issue I am gner drumond and I was elected Oklahoma's attorney general in 2022 as the chief law enforcement officer of Oklahoma it is my duty to protect the people of my state I'm here to testify about the dangers my citizens face due to a porous border and the failure of our federal government to enforce its laws in the early evening of November 20 2022 law enforcement responded to a quadruple homicide after a Chinese National allegedly entered a garage on a 10 acre marijuana Farm in rural Oklahoma according to investigators the as salent killed three men execution Style with gunshots to the back of their head and one woman with two shots to her abdomen the Carnage of that that day is but one tragic example of a failed system plagued plagued by failing leadership throughout Oklahoma law enforcement comes into contact daily with foreign Nationals who have entered our country illegally or who remain here illegally or both this is all too common in Oklahoma's illegal marijuana grow operations the voters of Oklahoma legalized medical marijuana in 2018 while that legalization led to the legitimate can business related businesses throughout our state organized criminals have overtaken the industry our law enforcement Partners report that the foreign Nationals most often involved in these illegal Enterprises come from China and Mexico the one thing these criminals have in common is that they have no regard for our laws or Public Safety criminal illegal immigrants are not content with growing only black market marijuana they also produce and distribute fanol and they engage in sex trafficking and labor trafficking Oklahoma's law enforcement Community fights a constant battle against these evils the Oklahoma Bureau of Narcotics and dangerous drugs the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation and scores of local law enforcement agencies deserve much praise for their great and heroic efforts while there have been many great successes the ongoing border crisis ensures a NeverEnding flood of illegal foreign n Nationals who continue to perpetrate crimes that endanger our people when I was sworn in as attorney general I pledged to the people of my state that I would do everything in my power to protect them from these dangerous criminals I petitioned our legislature for greater resources and broader authority to combat the threat they responded with millions of dollars for equipment and personnel and they granted my office more power to fight this criminal epidemic being fueled by our border crisis in response I established the organized crime task force the first of its kind for Oklahoma and it is needed primarily because Federal officials have failed to enforce the laws and to secure our border in the short seven months since its creation the organized crime task force has investigated and is Prosecuting more than 50 complex multi-jurisdictional criminal cases the vast majority of these cases involve Mexican or Chinese drug syndicates these illegal foreign actors burden my state with additional costs it cannot be fully Quantified for instance the Oklahoma Department of Corrections reports that it is currently housing more than 500 illegal immigrants convicted of various violent crimes before those criminal aliens were sent to the Department of Corrections they were in custody of our local jails which have their own costs for housing likewise there is a significant cost for law enforcement in the investigating of these crimes and for the prosecutors who prosecute them the unsecure border contributes to cost beyond the criminal justice system as well while it is not possible to ascertain the exact amount of the costs it is easy to understand the magnitude illegal immigration cost Oklahoma taxpayers more than $750 million each year with a minimal offset return Mr chairman members of the committee I believe it is time for accountability the people of Oklahoma don't deserve to live under constant threat from Criminal foreign Nationals we don't deserve to have our communities flooded with illegal drugs that were smuggled across an unsecure border and we don't deserve to have our loved ones ripped away by those same drugs I ask you to remember the people of Oklahoma as you did liberate remember the murder victims remember the drug overdose victims and the families who mourn them and of course please remember the law enforcement officers who risk their lives every day to protect us from it all thank you thank you Mr Drummond I now recognize Mr Bailey for five minutes to summarize his opening statement distinguished members of the committee thank you for the opportunity to appear before you this morning my understanding of border security comes from direct hands-on experience securing a nation's border it was earned on a Barren desert Battlefield half a world away from the turret of an M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicle in 2005 as a newly minted second Lieutenant the United States Army my platoon deployed to the Nineveh Province Iraq under the command of thin Colonel HR Armic master was tasked with securing the border between Iraq and Syria our mission was simple close the border and that's exactly what we did we did not capture people and release them into the interior of the country we did not hand out citations and ask individuals to report back in 10 years no we closed the border to ensure the country was safe since 2021 more than 8 million illegal immigrants have entered the United States and that is more than the population of my home state of of Missouri these numbers are not an accident there is only one reason 8 million people illegally cross a sovereign nation's border because they know that they can get away with it and why wouldn't they in the last three years of secretary marcus' Reign there have been there has been an orchestrated lack of enforcement of our nation's immigration laws he has failed to do that which is most fundamental to his mission protect our border that failure has not only led to today's impeachment proceeding it has given rise to an unprecedented level of State actions necessary to fill the vacuum created by the secretary's refusal to do his job I'd like to highlight for you a few of the actions my office has taken as we fight to secure the southern border one of those is our fight to force him to finish president Trump's border wall in an interview last Wednesday on CNN secretary May orus stated we need additional resources and we need them now our lawsuit proves he already has funding he just refuses to use it in fiscal year 2020 Congress appropriated funds explicitly for the purpose of constructing barrier systems at our Southern border order to keep unauthorized individuals out of our country in the appropriation Congress will explicitly stated the money shall only be available for the construction of barrier systems along the Southwest border secretary me orcus and his administration refused to comply with congress's command Missouri immediately filed suit DHS attempted to argue we did not have standing to challenge its refusal to use the funds but the fifth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that states can indeed bring such a challenge that ruling cleared the way for our lawsuit against the secretary's refusal to finish president Trump's border wall and it allowed the lawsuit to move forward so while we battle in court over secretary M's refusal to use taxpayer dollars in the manner Congress explicitly prescribed we have little sympathy for his pleas for more resources rather than find ways to secure our border secretary mayorcas has been busy enacting policies to make it easier to enter our country illegally we filed suit again against M secretary mayus for allowing hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants to be paroled into the United States every year parole allows non-citizens to physically enter and remain in the United States for up to 2 years or even longer while their application is reviewed without lawful status we also filed suit to Halt secretary mayor's attempt to implement a rule that redefined what had previously been considered an illegal border crossing as a lawful pathway rather than acknowledge the root cause of the influx of illegal immigrants pouring over our border the secretary tried to define the problem away by simply making something that was once illegal something legal without Congressional authorization mayor's process would allow vast numbers of illegal immigrants to enter the country and receive instant work authorization under bogus Asylum claims secretary marus has enacted illegal policies that are akin to posting a come in we open sign along the southern border without taking responsibility for the consequences of his actions states are then forced to Bear the enormous cost of secretary Mor's failure the states should not need to do the federal government's job for them secretary mayorcas swore oath to Faithfully execute the laws of our land in Missouri we remove officials who do not do their jobs because we have seen firsthand the catastrophic toll it takes on entire communities my office was forced to take action to remove a Soros spack prosecuting attorney from office for her refusal to do her job that resulted in The Killing and maming of countless missourians since we took action order has been restored to the city of St Louis it is rightful for Congress to consider removing a government official who refuses to do his job for the same reason to restore order we have reached a point of no return we're doing everything we can at the state level to rectify This Disaster but Congress has a role to play for accountability while we battle in the nation's courts Congress must use every tool at its disposal to obtain accountability for the American people I thank the committee for its time and welcome its questions thank you uh Mr Bailey I now recognize Mr Bowman for five minutes to summarize his opening statement chairman green ranking member Thompson members of the committee I'm honored to address this committee and I'm also pleased pleased to share the witness table with three distinguished elected officials one of whom immediately to my right Mr Bailey I last remember seeing around 2011 as a seconde law student in my evidence class at missou um as Attorney General of Missouri He's Surely come up in the world um congratulations to you from an old Professor I on the other hand remain simply an old Professor I understand this to be the first in a series of hearings on whether constitutional grounds exist to impeach Homeland Security secretary Alejandra mayorcas the testimony so far has focused on the performance of secretary my orcus and the Biden Administration relating to immigration policy and enforcement I'm not an IM an expert on immigration policy I will not comment on it here I have however been studying constitutional standards for impeachment for over 25 years I've written numerous articles uh and a book on the history of impeachment from its origins in England 1376 through the two impeachments of President Trump my subject therefore will be the Constitutional standard for impeaching a cabinet officer the key point about the about impeachment on our constitution is that it is not supposed to be a routine tool to resolve ordinary public policy debates even very passionate ones uh debates between political parties or between one house of Congress and the executive branch it is instead a measure of Last Resort reserved as one framer put it for great and dangerous offenses in other words for official misconduct which is extraordinarily serious in degree and critically of a type that corrupts or subverts governmental processes or the Constitutional order itself that the framer's intended impeachment to be rare is obvious from their decision that conviction requires two-thirds of the Senate that they intended to rule it out as a weapon of ordinary political debate is plain from how they defined impeachable conduct the Constitution provides that the president vice president and all civil officers of the United States shall be removed from office on impeachment for and conviction of treason bribery or other high crimes in Miss demeanor a cabinet secret secretary is a civil officer subject to impeachment but a cab cabinet secretary like the president is not impeachable unless he's proven to have committed treason bribery or other high crimes and misdemeanors there's no suggestion that I'm aware of that secretary my my orcus say committed either treason or bribery hence any article of impeachment against him must establish that he committed High crimes and misdemeanors the framers chose the English parliamentary term of art High crimes and misdem minors rather than other possible ter terms like maladministration because they wanted a flexible term that could reach unanticipated new forms of grave official misconduct but equally and critically because they did not want an impeachment that would be the equivalent of a vote of no confidence in modern parliamentary systems a vote that could remove the president or other executive branch officials between elections whenever the legislature disapproves of administration policy for over two centuries students of the Constitution have universally agreed in the word of the great impeachment scholar Charles Black that whatever may be the grounds for impeachment and removal dislike of a president's policy is certainly not one of them to be properly impeachable official conduct must meet a very high threshold of seriousness it must also be of a type that corrupts and subverts the political and governmental process and it ought to be plainly wrong regardless of legal technicalities the most commonly encountered cat ories of impeachable conduct are official corruption abuse of power betrayal of the nation's foreign policy interests and subversion of the Constitution there is no serious allegation of which I'm aware that the secretary has done any of those things now some might mischaracterize the secretary's implementation of the president's policy priorities as an abuse of power but impeachable abuse of power involves employing the powers of office for illegal or legit or illegitimate ends particularly to gain personal political or financial advantage to benefit personal or political allies or to injure political or personal enemies and especially when the abusive exercise of official power undermines constitutional values following the policy directives of one's elected Superior in pursuit of that superior's policy aims is simply not an impeachable abuse of power finally impeachment of a cabinet secretary over policy agreements is not only contrary to long-established constitutional understanding but useless as a practical matter if the official actions of the officer are in accord with the directives of his elected Superior the president removing the secretary changes nothing if members of this committee disapprove of the Biden administration's immigration and Border policies the Congress G the Constitution gives this Congress a wealth of legislative powers to change them impeachment is not one of those Powers lead dis agrees thank you Mr Bowman uh members will be uh recognized by order of seniority for their 5 minutes of questioning an additional round of questioning may be called after all members have been recognized I now recognize myself for five minutes of questioning U this is for the three Attorneys General do you believe that secretary mayorcas has failed to enforce or has subverted laws passed by the United States Congress and we'll start and go left to right thank you Mr chairman yes or no yes or no yes sir he has failed to perform his duties and is culpably inefficient has he failed to enforce laws passed by the US Congress he has yes sir he is secretary morcus is acting in violation of the law and in violation of constitutional order by negating congress's Appropriations Authority and directives in the Appropriations Bill and undermining the rule of law by perverting the Plain text of the statutes as it relates to the appr process and its promulgation of the circumvention rule thank you uh do you believe that secretary Mar Arcus again we're going to hit the three of you uh do you believe that secretary Mar Arcus has defied court orders issued by the United States courts which I can cite if you want me to but I'm sure you're probably aware of them do you believe that Secretary of mcus has defied court orders issued by the courts federal courts yes Mr chairman yes yes and it should never come to having to go to court against secretary mayorcas because he should be following the laws enacted by this body thank you uh in testimony to chip Roy before the House of Representatives you saw some of the video there the secretary said yes to the question of whether DHS possessed operational control of the Southwest border is defined by the secure fence act I might add act meaning the constit or the Congress passed it in subsequent testimony to the Senate secretary May America stated that no one has ever had operational control of the border and that he does not use that definition of operational control as defined by the secure fense act given these statements do you believe that secretary mayus misled Congress while under oath in describing dhs's operational control of the Border again gentlemen the three of you yes Mr chairman I do I believe he politicized his answer and failed to be authentic yes absolutely uh attorney general Merrick Garland acknowledged in testimony to the United States Senate that drug cartels were exploiting the current mayorcas policies in order to traffic humans and harmful drugs into the United States Secretary marus on March 2823 stated that he was unaware of this now we of course informed him now armed with this knowledge Amicus continues the same policies in fact doubling down with newer policies that even exacerbate the same horrible outcomes do you think secretary mayorcas is doing this with full knowledge that these cartels are exploiting his policies Mr chairman there's no doubt there's ample evidence out there that human trafficking and drug trafficking are increasing at an exponential level at the southern border yes Mr chairman based on my testimony today and the facts that are well known by the secretary there's a porest border that's feeding constantly illegal actors in Oklahoma Mr Bailey yes his unlawful Behavior as it relates to the circumvention rule and subversion of the parole process exacerbate and encourage the cartels and Seed control of the border to the cartels in ways unimaginable prior to these policy positions thank you where impeachment is concerned the scale is very important how would you describe the scale or compartible size of this border crisis based on your law enforcement experience and we'll start with Mr K thank you Mr chairman based on my prior Prosecuting experience I can tell you since 2020 def fent F and human trafficking specifically well Fentanyl and methamphetamine trafficking have increased in my state there's no other word than meteoric I can tell you about the first fentanyl case that I prosecuted in 2019 um that was a relatively small amount for by today's standards but at the time we thought that was a large bust and again that was in 2019 our our seizure numbers from our various drug task forces our V our various Federal Partnerships bear that out categorically fentel in Montana is by far our largest public safety issue and it is it's just exploded under this Administration our seizure numbers bear that out I'm I'm going to go ahead and sort of interrupt my own question because my time is running out I know Mr Bowman mentioned the term great and dangerous threat to the United States I'll ask the last two of you do you feel that the hundreds of thousands who've died def fental overdose the crime that's exponentially increased the uh increase in Terrorist activ ity or you know terrorists coming across the southern border do you think it's great and dangerous Mr D it is great and dangerous we have collision between Chinese and Mexican cartels M Mr Bailey very quickly yes absolutely uh the Missouri State Highway patol a single law enforcement agency in the state of Missouri last year seized 12,500 grams of fentanyl it's enough to kill every Missourian uh thank you and uh I yield uh I now recognize the ranking member for his five minutes of questioning thank you very much Mr chairman uh Mr chairman I've been on this committee since its Inception and have served as a top Democrat since 2005 during that time Democrats and Republicans have engaged in Spirited debate over policy both uh with each other and with various administrations at the end of the day however we always came together to make the homeand more secure for the American people this has been our committee's reputation and as a point of Pride for me and all my Republican counterparts uh from chairs and ranking members today marks a dramatic shift from the committee's record of sensible bipartisan policymaking we used to come together to resolve policy disputes but now Republicans are trying to use the awesome power of impeachment instead the Constitution doesn't let us do that the constitution require re Ires High crimes and misdemeanors Professor Bowman has secretary meus uh in your opinion committed High crimes and misdemeanors to meet that requirement based on all the information available to me I have not found any indication that he's committed High crimes and misdemeanors now uh thank you over the weekend we observed the third anniversary of the January 6 insurrection during which thousands of angry Trump supporters who had whipped into a frenzy by Donald Trump March from the White House to the Capitol to obstruct the Democratic process and let's be clear those individuals were acting on the orders of Donald Trump who told them quote we fight like hell and if you don't fight like hell you're going to not have a country anymore unquote that night most of us were unified in our disgust over the attack on the Capitol and the Democratic process almost immediately however that Unity eroded in the end only 10 Republicans voted to impeach Donald Trump for engaging in high crimes and misdemeanors by inciting violence against the government of the United States Professor Bowman as a constitutional expert would you agree that inciting an Insurrection to obstruct a peaceful transfer of power is an impeachable offense I do agree and I think it's notable that not only did 10 members of this body vote to impeach Donald Trump but when the case went to trial in the Senate uh seven Republican members of the Senate voted for that precise proposition there was indeed a majority for conv icting Mr Trump of high crimes and misdemeanors albeit not the two-thirds majority that was required under the Constitution and yet only 10 Republicans uh voted to impeach Donald Trump for conduct that is clearly an impeachable offense but today Republicans are attempting to impeach secretary meccas where there are clearly no grounds Mr chairman this impeachment is a sham and the height of hypocrisy on the part of my colleagues across the aisle I urge Republicans to put politics aside and get back to the work for the American people I yield back the gentleman Yi I now recognize the gentleman from Texas the chairman of the Foreign Affairs committee Mr McCall thank you Mr chairman uh this is a PM U occasion uh probably the most serious obligation we have uh in this committee on this committee the last time a Cabinet member was impeached was during the administration of ulyses S Grant uh many years ago in my experience so as a deputy attorney general for criminal justice state of Texas is a federal prosecutor charged with counterterrorism and National Security uh and as chairman of this very committee I've never seen this border more out of control my Arcus took an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States in my judgment he has violated that oath federal law provides a government detain and remove aliens convicted of crimes and those who are issued removal orders by immigration courts this is a very issue that my state took up on appeal to the Supreme Court he has violated this on day one he res sended remain in Mexico migrant protection protocol direct cause and effect opening the floodgates I marked that provision up on my committee Foreign Affairs it's now part of hr2 but he took that power away from his law enforcement officers and I have to quote I don't quote former Texas congresswoman Barbara Jordan very often but she said quote for the system to be credible people actually have to be deported at the end of the process and let's look at the numbers they speak for themselves 8 million encounters under this admin ministration 2.3 aliens in the interior of the United States with no legal status enough to fill up 13 states just last month we had over 300,000 trying to get into the United States over 300 on the terror watch list have gotten into the United States when I chaired this committee that was a big red flag and the FBI director said so and he testified as well over 200,000 Americans have died from fenel I personally went to a funeral last Saturday one of my children's friends died from XX LA with fentel 200,000 Americans that's more than triple the number of Americans who died in the Vietnam War to put that into perspective the secretary has an embolden a criminal Enterprise and the biggest human trafficking scheme in my lifetime he terminated MPP Chief Ortiz noted that had a direct cause and effect and when marus went down to the Border they turned their backs on him because quote sir you have turned your back on us my state has spent almost $4 billion just uh this cycle we've allocated 9.6 billion to operation loone star my Governor bust illegals to Sanctuary cities and states around the country to Showcase what we are experiencing and you are as well in your States every single day and the damage was clear the Supreme Court did note the damage but said that that this had to be resolved outside the courts in other words they said that Congress had to address this either through Appropriations oversight and in Sam Al's decision yes through impeachment this is a legal justification for these proceedings the founders believed impeachable offenses included corrupt admin Administration neglect of Duty and official misconduct at the Constitutional Convention they said this Alexander Hamilton asserted abuse or violation of public trust was impeachable justice story Supreme Court public office is a public trust and a violation of public trust is sufficient I find this to be a profound violation of public trust Alexander Hamilton stated in Federal's paper 65 the subject of impeachment are a nature which may be denounced political as they relate chiefly to injuries done immediately to society itself my God what about the injuries done to society that we've seen to our three illustrious Attorneys General please tell me the injuries done to your societies back home and do you think this secretary merits and that impeachment is warranted in this case thank you representative um I think the most powerful statistic I can give you from my state is our confirmed State Crime Lab fentel overdose death rate since 2019 Montana's confirmed fentanyl overdose deaths have increased 1700% Congressman I think that is the absolute strongest indicator we know where these drugs are coming from it's not a political statement of mine it's not an opinion of mine to say that 100 % of that fentanyl came from the Mexican drug cartels we know that to be true we get that from our federal Partners in the DEA we get that from all of our drug task forces all all the law enforcement agencies that are under my purview and just real quickly General Drummond and and Bailey just very quickly we have witnessed a a mass collusion between Chinese Nationals coming through the southern Border in concert with Mexican cartels 1,500 fentel deaths 40 3 children dead from accidental poisoning from exposure to FAL $114 million born by taxpayers and increased healthc care costs thank you I yield back the gentleman yields I now recognize uh Miss Sheila Jackson Lee of Texas the gentle lady from Texas for her five minutes of questioning Mr chairman I thank you for yielding I almost don't know where to start and certainly will find the five minutes to be underwhelming in terms of the time that I need I do want to uh express my solity and humbleness and expression of appreciation for having the honor of serving on this committee even in the midst of the horrific 911 it seems that this committee always Rises to the occasion to be the problem solvers and I clearly am someone who has lived the immigration story coming from Texas and I would certainly have a different view than my friend and colleague who has just spoken about the actions that have been taken as children and families have been manipulated as if they are inhuman I do think that one of the highest callings of this committee is in fact to do the bidding of solving the nation's immigration problems and as a member of the Judiciary Committee I have over the years introduced comprehensive Immigration Form legislation year after year after year and so I am certainly willing and able to be part of the solution for the three attorney generals of which I am in a lawyer certainly served in uh capacities to realize the important work that you do but I must join in the sadness of this day uh the sadness of this day because it is not constitutionally grounded it is not constitutionally sound it is not going to save any lives uh at all and there is nothing that you have put forward today that evidences uh in any way uh a impeachable offense by secretary marus the first immigrant to serve in this position a dislike of the president's policy is not is not a basis for impeachment the basis for impeachment is corruption abuse of power betrayal of the nation and that is of course allegations you as Witnesses I am sorry to say Mr chairman have borne no testimony that indicates that secretary Marcus has done any of that so I thank the ranking member for his earlier eloquent words on this shameful fraudulent impeachment inquiry where we are not fixing the immigration issues that my constituents in Houston need at the onset I'm reminded of the words of the representative Barbara Jordan complete difference from what I heard her quoted before I know that she did an excellent job in trying to frame the immigration issues of years past my predecessor represented Houston like I do she endorsed me glad to say a mentor like her my faith in the constitution is whole it is complete it is total and I'm not going to sit here and be an idle spectator of the dimunition the subversion the destruction of the Constitution because the Constitution said to create a more perfect union to instill Justice that is what this inquiry is a demun a subversion and a destruction of the Constitution of the United States I cannot stand for that Mr chairman impeachment is one of the absolute Powers Congress has to ensure against an executive might as James Madison explained at the Constitutional Convention quote pervert his administration into a scheme of speculation or oppression the men present in Philadelphia some 236 years ago were deliberate they were intentional they were exacting in their draft of the Constitution that has guided us forever these are their words and the words of our constitution the legal standard by which we are solemnly consider whether to exercise this extraordinary power Article 2 Section 4 guides and I quote the president vice president and all civil offices of the United States shall be removed from office on impeachment for the conviction of treason bribery or other high crimes and misdemeanor that is outstanding treason bribery High crimes and misdemeanors Professor Bowman in your review of the con of Congressman uh Green's impeachment resolution which referred to this committee and in your review of the various reports by committee Republicans have you identified any actions by secretary mycus that reach the Constitutional threshold of impeachment treason Bary other H crimes and misdemeanors Professor no in all of the reports have you seen any evidence of such the reports you've been able to secure or the reports that I brought your attention to I've seen lots of reports about arguments about policy I've seen nothing that rises the level of an impeachable offense and so Mr chairman the Constitution is to be our guide we must end this political stunt that seeks to impeach an office of the United States because an extremist minority of the House of Representatives does not agree with the policies of this president or that he carries out let's work with these attorney generals to solve the real problems to not incarcerate children to separate them from their family treason bribery and other high crimes and misdemeanors is our legal standard it is clear that is the basis from which we must proceed that is the Constitutional bar you have failed to reach we created this book as they say to create a more perfect union and to establish justice gentlemen you have law degrees and have taken an oath as I have and you've taken an oath to procure the rights of your citizens please sit with us to establish just for all of America for the work you do and for those who come to seek a better life however they come we may perceive in a different light but let us do it in perceiving Justice you hurt me you hurt my heart you hurt what Barbara Jordan stood for you diminish this book and these words by sitting here today to suggest that secretary my Arcus must be in fact impeached because of policies that we disagree with may God continue to guide us in our work so that we can do what we have been assigned to do with that I yield back General lady Ys I now recognize Mr Higgins the gentleman from Louisiana and the chair of the subcommittee on on the border thank you Mr chairman my my my Mr Bowman I wasn't even G to ask you any questions today but I'm going to give you an opportunity to clarify it for record and I do believe that according to your resume you're a professor of constitutional law sir is that correct I am an Emeritus professor at the Missouri school of law you're a smart guy you got alphabet behind your name on your business card so is it your position that you're taking today as a democrat's witness that the that the founders intent with the term High crimes and misdemeanors was designed to restrict the power of impeachment to a violation of specific written statute is that your position we're listening yes and and that is your position okay and you're excuse me excuse me Congressman you said yes it's a simple question I'm going to I'm going to move on the excuse me Congressman it clearly was not reclaiming my time it clearly was not the intent of the founders to limit the power of congressional impeachment over the Executive Branch to to limit that to violation of written statute that's quite correct Congressman I've written extensively than but you just said you just said something different but that's all right we appreciate you being here today Mr Bowman and representing uh University of Missouri sure it's a wonderful law school on this committee we've carried out our investigation secretary may orcus I sit here today tell you we're going to impeach him he's going to be impeached and he should be he is the executive in charge of the Border policy for for President Biden now President Biden has the right as a chief executive to hire men that that that don't have the skill and then figure that out down the line and replace them President Biden also has a right as a chief executive to have wild policy in mind but it but the executive that sits on his cabinet that's in charge of actually enforcing those policies that has the law enforcement experience to know when those policies are going to bring injury upon our country that executive has a responsibility to advise the president that his policies are not only not working to secure the Border they're actually bringing injury Upon Our Country the United States Constitution is is the law of the land that we swear our oath to secretary mayorcas has brought generational trauma Upon Our Country hundreds of thousands of American lives destroyed hundreds of thousands dead millions and millions wave upon wave of human misery coming across our Southern border we're losing our country down there my God my colleagues you've got to recognize this we've got to stop this arterial bleed it's not about money we spent less money in 2019 than we did in 23 a lot less through DHS and we had the border under control it's policy that has changed and who is driving that policy secretary mayorcas so who shall be impeached quite rightfully so secretary mayorcas Mr nudson from your position sir and I'm sorry for what your you and your people in your community and your state are going through sir on behalf of this Congress that has been unable to take action as of yet I'm sorry for what you're going through do you concur with the things that I've spoken on and shared I absolutely do concur Congressman I think this body is completely within its constitutional legal right to bring in proceedings here Mr Drummond I also concur Mr Bailey I concur the secretary's abdicated His official duties he's in dereliction of Duty and should be held accountable I appreciate all the panelists for being here today I thank the chairman for his leadership on this issue he has been calm and patient and judicious in our procedure we have laid out the case for the impeachment of secretary may orcus we have promised American people we would fulfill that somber Duty and we shall Mr chairman I yield the gentleman y i now recognize Mr Payne the gentleman from New Jersey for his five minutes of question thank you Mr chairman well today's hearing would be a joke and and let me just put something out here with in reference to fentol it it is something that is is really damaging our country our young people obviously but I remember in the 1980s when the crack epidemic was prevalent um the first lady Nancy Reagan told folks you know just say no so I think we need to incorporate that into this epidemic why is spent andol killing so many of our folks because they're consuming it we have to look at the demand for it as well we know we have a problem in stopping it and we are all hellbent in doing that but we also have to look at the demand or as Nancy Reagan said just say no but back to the topic at at hand uh as I stated this would be a joke if the stakes weren't so so high and serious for the reasons laid out by my friend M Jackson Lee I'm embarrassed for my Republican colleagues they pretend that their fraudulent impeachment against secretary marus is about high crimes and misdemeanors that's because they know well as we do that this is this so-called impeachment is nothing more than an extremist Maga takeover of the committee in this Congress just look at just look at who is in on the driver seat of this fraudulent impeachment it's not the chairman of the committee it's not even the subcommittee chair it's an extreme maggot back venture who proverbially speaking shoved her leadership out of the driver's seat and now has the Reigns of the Congress and about ready to drive us all off the cliff chairman can Proclaim that he is Led this year-long investigation into secretary marus leadership that led to today's proceedings but we all know that this is false we are here because a member of Congress who believes the anti-semitic conspiracy that Jewish space lasers coming down to earth caused the deadly wildfires in California in 2018 someone who has called black people like me slaves to the Democratic party a woman who believes serving this great country in the military is throwing your life away someone who supports insurrections who tried to destroy American democracy who wants to defund the FBI and someone who mocked survivors of a tra traic School tragic school shooting a member of Congress who truly all who believes all that is brought us here it is not chairman Green's impeachment resolution that was referred to this is committee to this committee chairman green has not even introduced an impeachment resolution and it is not chairman green so-called investigation into secretary Mor that got us here we had an impeachment resolution before us weeks before the Chairman's alleged in investigation even concluded Professor Bowman do mere policy disputes between members of Congress and a cabinet secretary constitute impeachable High crimes and misdemeanors Congressman they do not I think the conclusion iion is universal among those who have studied this question has been so since since the time of the founding that policy differences no matter how severe no matter how heated um are simply not grounds for impeachment thank you Mr chairman I'd like to request unan consent to submit an article from CBS News titled margerie Taylor green backs off forcing vote on second Alejandra mayor impeachment resolution dated November 30th 2023 without objection so order in which representative green is quoted as saying we need to do this we need to move forward so I got guarantees so we will move forward with impeachment and with that I yield back the gentleman yields I now recognize the gentleman from North Carolina uh Mr Bishop for his five minutes question Mr Bowman I it strikes me that how much your opinion has changed in just a few years I I was pointed out that in your 2019 book entitled High crimes and misdemeanors a history of impeachment for the age of trump uh you have this passage no Congress since that time referring to the impeachment of belnap the uh cabinet person that uh that Grant had dismissed before his impeachment but you say no Congress since that time has either moved fast enough or thought it worthwhile to actually impeach a subordinate executive branch official neverthe nonetheless the latent power to do so remains important and here's the key sentence not only is it useful as a signal of legislative displeasure with Administration personnel and policy but the undoubted authority of Congress to impeach subordinate officials carries with it the associated powers of the house to investigate potentially impeachable conduct and of the Senate to try the allegations In Articles of impeachment now frankly sir I agree with you more today and not then um that is to say I don't think pure policy differences is the basis for an impeachment neither is that what's happening here it is exceedingly apt for that reason that the majority Witnesses are three State Attorneys General gentlemen I look forward to joining you in 2025 but let me point this out a lot of people would saywell American people are interested in hearing something about a legal case I think they might be last June two of your colleagues in Texas and in Louisiana had sued secretary mayorcas saying that guidelines that he issued to his Department blatantly violated commands of Congress in statute to detain any Criminal Criminal Who had committed certain crimes and was and was released from State custody were required the Attorney General then the Secretary of Homeland Security later by amendment required to detain such persons until they were deported and persons subject to a permanent order a final order of deportation required to be detained contrary to that order secretary my orcus dismantled the detainer process completely he said he said that that was going to be subject to discretion only in cases where the department or he deems it to in imperil our national security or security from additional crime would it be done attorney general Su and here's what the Supreme Court said you don't have standing we can't hear from you we can't settle this here's what Alo said in descent the Congress to put the point simply Congress enacted a law that requires the apprehension and Detention of certain illegal aliens whose release it thought would endanger Public Safety the Secretary of DHS does not agree with that categorical requirement he prefers a more flexible policy and the Court's answer today is that the executive's policy Choice prevails unless Congress by withholding funds refusing to confirm presidential nominees threatening impeachment and removal Etc can win a test of strength in other words the Alo in defense went on and said I don't think this is a wise decision for us to make but that is the decision the majority made that if you want the law to be followed you're going to have to impeach somebody you're going to have to as Justice Alo said the Congress is going to have to go to war with the executive Mr kudon what about that isn't that right isn't that what the Congress is put to to decide whether to do our duty as the Supreme Court has said we can't do it it's up to the Congress and you guys have been have tried to do it you've succeeded in other areas you're continuing to Sue and you're succeeding Florida has enjoined some practices I think the Supreme Court just granted an emergency uh relief from the DHS cutting Texas border barrier what about that Mr kudon I didn't leave you a lot of time but I'm sure you can add more wisdom in 30 seconds than I did in it I'll be brief Congressman uh thank you for the question yes I absolutely agree not only with Justice alito's descent but the I would point out also in that case that the majority also pointed out uh to your point that Congress possesses an array of tools to analyze and influence those policies and those are political checks for the political process that's exactly what you're dealing with here you folks have got an ex executive versus legislative branch War here so much of this Mr chairman isn't about even policy discretion that's granted to the admin Administration it is about Square violations of Law and they will either be they cannot be remedied in court they will either be dealt with by this Congress to vindicate the rule of law or we will surrender rule of law to a rule of man I yield the gentleman yields I now recognize M chairman Mr chairman point of order point of order the point of order you're recognized uh I think we all heard the colleague say he's running for another office uh but that violates the rule 23 uh and and I won't ask that it be taken down I just ask that if he's going to run just go run just don't run when the committee is in session gentlemen uh has made his point of order and I now recognize Mr swell the gentleman from California and our ranking member on cyber security subcommittee for his 5 minutes of question I want to thank the Attorneys General uh for participating uh today thank you for your service to your States I was a prosecutor before coming to Congress I missed that job uh my father was a cop my brothers are cops and it seems like we've got a pretty educated group of Attorneys General here Mr canuteson uh you went to Montana law school right yes pretty good Law School uh Mr Bailey uh University of Missouri is that right yes and you served our country after September 11 as well thank you for doing that uh Mr Drummond uh you went to Georgetown is that right I did that's a good school I was rejected there twice uh for law school and then as a transfer uh that's a very good school um I just want to level set where we all are on what's a crime what's not a crime because uh the three of you have offered testimony to my Republican colleagues about what is an impeachable offense and I just want to go down the list here of some of the potential impeachable offenses uh that we've seen in in the history of the Congress uh bribery Mr kutson would you agree that's an impeachable offense I would Congressman Mr Drummond would you agree briber is an impeachable offense I would and uh Mr Bailey would you agree briber is an impeachable offense yes same as extortion Mr kudon yes Mr Drummond extortion yes Mr Bailey yes how about obstruction of justice would you agree that that's an impeachable offense Mr canson uh if there was a conviction yes okay Mr Drummond yes and Mr biley yes how about inciting violence against police officers uh what would you say Mr kson again if there was a conviction of a criminal offense I think that would certainly rise to the level and Mr Drummond how about incitement of violence yes and Mr Bailey incitement of violence would need more facts to make that legal determination I think that's a bar of sufficient facts and Mr Kus I just want to drill down a little bit because you said if there was a conviction um so are you saying that Mr Mya should be convicted criminally before he could be impeached Congressman no you I'm simply speaking to your example of would inciting violence against a police officer rise to the level of an impeachable offense I my testimony was if there was a conviction for that crime then yes okay and and obstruction of justice you said the same thing right correct but you think for Mr myus he does not need a conviction to be impeached well as this body has done in its past I think there's certainly precedent no I do not believe there has to be a criminal offense High crimes and misdemeanors as it was understood by the founders as it was understood in the English common law does not necessarily mean there has to be an actual crime committed in the summer of 2019 former president Donald Trump used $300 million of taxpayer dollars to ask president zalinski of Ukraine to get dirt on his potential uh primary political opponent uh Joe Biden uh and he was uh impeached in the house uh for that should he have been impeached for that Mr kutson Mr chairman I'm excuse me Mr chairman representative I'm not a member of this Congress I'm not privy to all that information I I certainly haven't seen a lot of those reports uh this body chose to go forward with those proceedings as is its purview Mr drumond it's outside Lane I'm just the simple attorney general from Oklahoma Mr Bailey I believe President Trump was acquitted of all charges and that's beyond the the purview of my testimony today on January 6 he incited and aimed a violent mob at the capital six police officers would later lose their lives one lost a finger one lost an eye the president was uh impeached 10 Republicans voted for that impeachment uh Mr cansen should have been impeached for that yes or no Mr chairman representative he was okay okay Mr drumond he he was impeached for that and should he have been I I don't have an opinion on that issue okay Mr Bailey what do you think about that he was acquitted of those charges okay so what's interesting to me and again I respect that you all are here is that when you've testified to Mr my oris's conduct and you believe pretty clearly that he can be impeached for his conduct but when we go through pretty egregious conduct of using taxpayer dollars of inciting and aiming a mob having the greatest attack ever on this Congress Capital our constitution you don't want to comment on it at all and I I think what we're really seeing from the majority in all of this is that they're not interested in finding any solution On the Border in fact what we have seen is that there's a 2014 deal in the Senate bipartisan they walked away when they were in the majority speaker Johnson has said that he will refuse any additional funding for the border and and now we have witnesses who again want to comment only on myor but don't want to comment on President Trump Mr chairman respectfully I just see a party that wants that does not want to fix but only wants the fiction uh and with that I'll yield back gentleman yields I now recognize the gentleman from Florida Mr Jimenez for his five minutes of questioning thank you thank you very much and I was fascinated by my my colleague's um you know questioning line of questioning um somewhere I was going to go to maybe not as quite as eloquently as him I'm not running for attorney J or anything um Mr Bowman um you say in your testimony written testimony and some the foundational requirements for impeachable high crimes and misdemeanors is that they must be extraordinarily seriousness and and ought to be of the type that corrupts or subverts governmental processes or the Constitutional order and I find that you know I I I I underline that specifically because I wanted to ask you do you believe that the that the death of of 200,000 Americans from fentanyl overdose is that is that extraordinarily serious it's certainly an a serious matter and one that has to be addressed by this body by exercising its constitutional legislative powers to work with the leg with the executive branch um to address the policy the problem that you have that you're confronting here that's that's that's that's good I'm going to I'm going to reclaim my time now that you've answered the question thank you very much okay and then and it ought to be of the type that corrupts or subverts governmental processes or the Constitutional order now you know I'm not a con you know I'm not a constitutional scholar Etc but I do believe that the the the Constitution is set up to have three distinct branches of government you have legislative you have judicial and then you have the administrative branch and and the founding fathers wanted a balance of power is that is that what you get from the from the Constitution and the founding fathers what they wanted to do the balance of power Mr Bowman indeed okay and so the it's it's up to the legislative branch to actually create the laws and the will of Congress is supposed to be then carried out by the administrative branch is am I off on that or is that what the founding fathers thought should have happened in general yes okay and so we have this issue of policy versus law and and if I read if I get you right you believe that this is a question of policy but I don't believe it's a question of policy I believe it's actually a question of violating the law the law clearly states that people coming into the United States or or people seeking asylum in the United States two things happen to them they're either detained by here in country or they're they're detained in another country waiting the outcome of their of their Asylum hearing that's what the law says um the law also says that the the executive branch actually has the right to parole but on a caseby casee basis not mass mass mass uh parole and so the the mayorcas administration the Biden mayorcas Administration is actually violating both they're they're not detaining people coming in EI or they're they're not keeping them in a third country and they're not detaining the United States and they're also allowing mass m Mass parole which violates the clear intent of Congress is it your opinion that the only that that this is a policy issue and that the the uh the bid Administration has the right to clearly subvert the will of Congress my opinion congressman is that disputes over the exercise of discretion by the secretary um are difficult they're being resolved in the courts um and I must say that those disputes have not yet been finalized indeed the only cases involving those disputes that have made it up the Supreme Court have resulted in rulings in in favor of the secretary and of the president essentially this is an ongoing legal and policy dispute um and it is it is not therefore the kind of thing for which uh impeachment should be used well I I believe that you know that we are at a Crossroads here because I do believe that uh we Congress have given way too much leeway to to the administrative Branch if that's the case this is clearly the intent of of of Congress was uh people coming to the Border need to either stay in a in another country or they need to be detained and it's clearly was that parole was to be done on a case-by Case basis now I don't believe that there's an issue of policy it's an issue of violating the law and that violation of the law has actually caused has actually led to mass suffering U ing in the United States uh 200,000 Americans dying because of fentanyl overdose and I disagree with my with my colleague on the other side that says it's a question of of voluntarily stopping using drugs actually a lot of these deaths are caused by people they don't even know they're taking fentanyl they're thinking they're taking something else uh and it's laced with fentanyl uh and so you know if if it's it's we're down to that where every single time that there is a that that the administration decides to violate the law that we have to impeach somebody I guess then we we need to impeach somebody and so with that uh you know I yield my time back the gentleman Ys I now recognize the gentleman from California Mr CA thank you Mr chairman and I kind of agree with Mr godinas and some of the comments he made um before I get into my uh presentation like to present a uh article submitted for the record titled 203 2023 year in review secretary mayoras Champions Department wide efforts to save lives prepare for the 21st Century Security challenges without objection so moved and I want to thank our Witnesses for being here today I'm glad you're here talking about those things that are important you spoke passionately about fentol the damage that's caused to our communities I'm with you on that one back home on Main Street a lot of deaths a lot of pain because of fenel my investigation of this issue 90% % of fentol more like 95% comes through our Port Sentry and 65% comes through one Port of Entry the sanra Port of Entry and most of that the majority vast majority is smuggled by American citizens and green card holders that's why I support additional funding for our ports of Entry technology more Personnel more drug sniffing dogs more techn technology and Mr chair again I want to thank you for holding this hearing because Homeland Security is an important issue for all Americans for this nation so let's look at the facts here today let's be clear about what we're looking at today on a worldwide basis some of the Nations that are dealing with this what I would call worldwide Refugee challenge the United States Europe Germany Italy Greece Colombia Colombia is holding 3 million Venezuelan refugees right now Costa Rica Mexico these are among some of the Nations looking at this Refugee challenge let's good let's look at some of the causes of this migratory pattern covid-19 and secretary mayoras did not bring up covid-19 Co you know C de mayoras is also not responsible for the robberies gang violence extortions in Central America and secretary mayorcas is also not responsible for the government collapse and violence in Haiti he's also not responsible for the challenges the economic collapse in Venezuela secretary myeras is also not responsible for the human rights violations economic collapse in Cuba he's also not resp responsible for the economic collapse human rights violations in Nicaragua Peru Ecuador the invasion of Russia of Ukraine the economic collapse going on in China today secretary myeras is not responsible for these things to the contrary he's working to manage the challenge and provide Frontline officers with the resources that they need even Senate Republicans get it Senate Republicans are working with Democrats right now and the White House to try to address these challenges so in the last minute and a half that I have I'm going to ask Professor Bowman is secretary in mycus executing the law the full extent of his abilities with a limited resources Congress has given him is this an impeachable offense sir sir no sir it is not and I should point out also in addition it's critical to note that if we could impeach cabinet officers or presidents for that matter anytime there are legal disputes about the application of the law or their exercise of discretion then every president and every cabinet officer would be impeachable in the previous administration that of Mr Trump there were repeated lawsuits against Mr Trump's immigration policy um some of which he won some of which he lost if the mere presence of heated legal disagreements about the legitimacy of presidential immigration policy were impeach impeachable Mr Trump would have been impeached for a third time to do such a thing would be profoundly anti-constitutional and profound profound disruption of the Constitutional separation of powers so sir are we looking essentially at political public policy debate here as opposed to an impeachable offense that's certainly my interpretation Congressman thank you very much Mr chairman M Mr chairman I have a unanimous consent motion here do you want to do it now or wait till your turn I'll do it now if I could okay I want to introduce the January 10th um 2024 Washington Post article where the chairman is quoted as saying that our investigation made clear that this crisis Finds Its foundation and secretary mayorcas is decision making and Congressman Norman talks about needing to impeach my orcus because of quote bad judgment okay uh with no um disc consent or disagreement we'll admit it to the record now I recognize Mr fluger the gentleman from Texas for his five minutes of questioning thank you Mr chairman it's sad that we're here sad that we're in this position earlier um it was said that this is not a legitimate impeachment I I guess that's something Democrats know a little bit about uh and our witness just talked about um the impeachment of Mr Trump so I disagree with that and I really I take no pleasure in the significance of this effort I've wrestled with the appropriate constitutional response to what has become a complete failure to enforce the law to adhere to Congressional directives to secure the Homeland the and the failure to secure the homean has been so significant so catastrophic that Congress must use its power to provide accountability we must be the check and the balance against such an extremely egregious breach of public trust and that's what this is and if not this effort then I asked my Democrat colleagues what effort where is your answer to accountability where is your article one authorities to check the the executive branch will the gentleman yield to answer the question no the answer from the other side simply cannot be that we're powerless and I asked rhetorically if not this effort then how do we hold this failure and you'll have your chance to to wax poetic on that let's just go through the numbers fiscal 23 27,000 pounds of fentel was seized that's that's what was seized that's not all that entered this country Mr chairman the speaker of the house has put together a document and it goes step by step for the actions the Administration has taken taken since January 20th of 2021 President Biden terminated the national emergency at the Southwest border President Biden issued an executive order further entrenching DACA program Biden unveiled the US citizenship act which would provide amnesty the administration issued an executive order ending limitations and restrictions on immigration without certain countries associated with terrorism then secretary myor has delivered remarks effectively explaining the border is open for illegal immigration by stating that dhs's Focus would be on processing on and on and on myor has issued a memorandum prohibiting enforcement of immigration laws in certain areas including schools Healthcare and Facilities mayorcas terminated migrant protection protocols mayorcas issued a memorandum that states the fact that an individual that an individual is removable alien should not be the sole basis of an enforcement action I want to enter this with the unanimous consent into the record Mr chairman like to se unanimous so ordered so what what sorry what is the document as I mentioned the document is from the Speaker of the House a list of actions if we can pause the time please because this is Administrative this is a list of actions that the administration is taken step by step since January 20th of 2021 and it goes in order chronologically of the actions that the Administration has taken that have weakened us including those that secretary my orcus has taken created by the gentleman is not recognized right now okay uh and I I it's his time okay you trying to enter it that's why I'm asking he's I object to the entry of this document that was okay all right that's that's we'll uh vote on it I suppose then okay are you asking for a vote unanimous consent was just disagreed to are we going to vote on this yes okay all right we need to clear the witnesses get the clerks in here and we'll vote on it stop the clock also that's not M Tam M Tam okay okay it's just okay my apologies it's just objected to and there is there is no vote so my my misunderstanding Thank you I'm assuming that's what you were to CL thank you ranking member the gentleman is recognized okay and I think and we I'll make up the time two two minutes and 15 seconds or two minutes and 20 seconds when you're recognized thank you um earlier this year director Ray sat here with secretary my orcus and told us told this committee that there were still known and suspected terrorists at large in the United States that we knew had matched the terror watch list that came into this country illegally and that we didn't know where they were and right next to him Sat secretary Mari orcus and I said what is the policy of DHS when you know that somebody matches the terror watch list this is the reason we're having this hearing because he could not explain to this committee that DHS actually has a policy to detain those people he couldn't explain his policy that's why we're here because there are people on the terror watch list Mr Drummond or attorney general Drummond can you tell us the extent of the damages that are being done in Oklahoma as a result of the illegal immigration to 8 million people who have entered this country illegally we shut down an illegal grow every day in the state of Oklahoma where we detain and arrest upwards of dozens of people they're refilled the next day with those who cross the border from either in a Mexican cartel or a Chinese syndicated crime organization it is ceaseless do you believe that the Department of Homeland Security under the leadership of secretary mayorcas is upholding the laws that we currently have on the books to stop the to stop illegal immigration into this country I think that there is a failure to enforce the laws on parole removal requirements detention and the like I couldn't agree more uh it was earlier said that we Republicans are going to the Border in polo shirts and khaki pants or something to that effect well at least we're going to the border and at least we're asking the questions because when you talk to the border patrol agents they will tell you that there are no consequences the consequences do not exist deportation doesn't exist The Catch and Release policies are allowing people to flood into my community of St Angelo Texas Midland and Odessa and the fentel deaths alone that have been catastrophic to this country over a 100,000 people should be the sole reason that this committee comes together I I hope that my colleagues on the other side of the aisle when given your time will examine the facts the facts are that over eight million people have come into this country illegally the facts are that the Secretary of Homeland Security has not secured our country against terrorism against fentel against criminal gangs against traffickers against sex slavery against any of it he is complicit in fact he is willfully complicit which is why he needs to be impeached I yield back Gman yields I now recognize Mr tadar the gentleman from Michigan for his five minutes question thank you chairman green um and thank you to our Witnesses for being here today uh Professor bman uh would you say that secretary America's done anything that rise to the level of high crime and M demeanor no Congressman now we know uh our immigration system is broken for decades there is not much work done to reform our immigration system and secretary marus should not bear the blame for the inherent flaws within the system system he has inherited and my appeal uh to my Republican colleagues here is that rather than getting bogged down in an impeachment process that seems needless and devoid of constitutional Authority let's fix shift our Focus working together in fixing our broken immigration system our broken immigration system is causing our nation a loss of billions and trillion dollars in economic growth I uh when I was 24 years old um living in India having gotten admission into a PhD program here and I made many trips to the American Embassy in Mumbai to get a student visa and the embassy kept denying me my student visa they denied my student visa for four times and only on the fifth time I got my Visa rude because the counselor who was who had denied my Visa for the four times had gone to America for her vacation I mean there is no doubt the system is broken we are losing businesses keep telling me that they can't find uh qualified uh skilled Workforce that they need to grow the businesses Australia and uh Canada has taken advantage of our broken immigration system to attract uh highly skilled workers that our businesses need to grow and stay on top of innovation we we know uh immigrants are 60% less likely to be incarcerated than uh their native counterparts I just want to take this time to appeal um across the aisle to let us spend our energies and our constitutional authority to solve the problems to fix the broken immigration system that we have not dealt with for decades and and uh let's not blame the secretary for our broken immigration system but let's fix it to help our economy create jobs and make things better for all thank you the gentleman Ys I now recognize the gentleman from New York Mr Garbarino for his five minutes of questioning thank you uh Mr chairman thank you to Witnesses for being here today you know I've heard a lot of the statements coming from my colleagues and they're acting like we're we've come here on a whim we're not here on a whim this is you know we haven't come here lightly this hearing today there have been problems at the borders at the border for years and now uh every state in the nation every state in the nation is seeing those effects negatively uh I just look at my own state in New York and and and the costs and of dealing with the crisis at the border and we have been begging the Administration to do something for years nothing has been done we're not we're not here on a whim something has to be done so that's why we are here where we are if leadership can't follow the laws of the land follow the laws of the land it's not just policy there's laws there are written there are laws on the books and they are being ignored right now by the current Administration and the current Secretary if they can't follow the laws that are on the books we need to find someone who will so I think I think we have uh taken the time and necessary steps to arrive here in a proper manner it's taken a while in our country has been at disservice because of that it's taken so long uh but we're here today and uh I appreciate you all being here and um I'm going to start with Mr attorney general Drummond you've described Oklahoma's challenge with the explosion of unlicensed and illicit drug Manufacturing in the state following Senate the secretary marar is becoming the leader of Homeland Security can you describe more about the challenges of Oklahoma law enforcement that Oklahoma law enforcement faces in confronting this illegal activity especially for Rural police and Sheriff's departments who have limited resources let me give you a tangible example representative uh one recent drug bust at an illegal grow operation our agents were processing those who were committed felonies and detained and those that were simply being trafficked in labor and sex and one of those was identified as a individual on an HSI detainer for illegal entry he was supposed to be in Flushing New York he was supposed to have on an ankle monitor when we contacted the field representative in HSI they said you know charge him with a felony we'll come pick him up but he in fact had not committed a felony then we were instructed to say please direct him to turn himself in to the nearest HSI field office and so we did that and let him go that happens day in and day out across Oklahoma where we don't have the resources afforded to detain those that we know are illegally in the state committing crimes or complicit in the committing of crimes you would like in New York we have laws that actually direct that they automatically be released and we see Crime After Crime After Crime be committed by the same person and we and in New York big state like New York you think we'd have uh have the ability we do have the ability to keep people in prison and stop crimes from happening our laws direct us not to but at least in Oklahoma you would uh you would like to be able to to to make sure that these criminals are not released back out now New York has one fewer we have good um another crisis Mr attorne General uh that has resulted from the unprecedented chaos at the Southwest Southern border is the explosion of fentanyl poisonings in this country we have seen many far too many in New York from 2018 to 2022 Oklahoma experienced a 735 per increase in fenal debts according to the Oklahoma Bureau Bureau of Narcotics Oklahoma has a unique status sitting just north of the Texas and right along major routes routes away from the Southwest border for both drug and human smuggling can you talk about how the fentel crisis over the past few years has impacted your state so we um with with the legalization of marijuana in Oklahoma it's not become the drug of choice choice to cross the border fentanyl is now the drug of choice and I take exception with the representative who said it is just to say no it it is a crisis in which we find fentanyl laced in many drugs such that we instruct our young children to test every pill don't if you think you're taking a pain pill it probably lays with fanol and we can trace those back to uh the porest Border through which the f product comes in concert with the Mexican cartels and the Chinese syndicated organizations this is for any of the Attorney General's um have you we get a lot of unaccompanied Alien Children in in New York have you witnessed in your state these children being used for purposes of sex trafficking or other forms of exploitation anyone can jump in and grab it I I will jump in quickly with an example we uh busted uh a grow in Northwest Oklahoma City and in which uh there were two minor young women from China uh that were being sex trafficked and we've intercepted Communication in mainland China where they're effectively posting jobs to come to Oklahoma uh quote uh as massage spa quote able to endure hardships quote good hygiene and yet these young women are being exploited and we don't have a remedy to take care of them and quickly I know Missouri now ranks fourth on the list of the states of the highest rates of human trafficking uh in 2021 there were 1100 reported cases detected cases of human trafficking in the state of Missouri 327 victims identified Congressman human trafficking has increased in my state multiple hundred% since 2019 I think that answers your question yield back gentleman yields I now recognize the gentleman from Rhode Island Mr magazine thank you chairman I I've been listening to all of my Republican colleagues throughout this hearing and I'm still struggling to understand what high crime they believe the secretary has committed I've heard that he hasn't achieved operational control defined as not a single person crossing the border uh illegally no Administration has met that standard I've heard them say that he has failed to detain everyone who is undocumented who has come across the border no Administration has uh under the Biden Administration secretary morcus uh has removed 3 million undocumented people from this country so when I hear my colleagues say that deportation does not exist I can think of three million people who would disagree with that he has continue construction of a border wall that many of us questioned the effectiveness of and when the secretary and the president were asked do you think that the Wall Works they say no we don't think it works but we're building it because the law requires to do it they're following the law we Face difficult challenges at the southern border there is no question instability in other countries has driven people to come to the United States and it has created a chaotic situation but unfortunately rather than working with us and the president and the secretary to address these challenges too many of my Republican colleagues are focused more on partisan Grand standing in campaigning including this impeachment theater so here's the real truth President Biden and secretary my orcus have taken steps to try to secure the borders but House Republicans have tried to obstruct them every step of the way because they want a campaign issue more than they want to fix the problem here are the facts in 2022 Democrats passed and the president signed $86 billion for enhanced border security more Personnel more funding for ice additional technology 200 House Republicans voted against that funding including every single Republican member of this committee who was in office at the time this year in 2023 House Republicans passed their so-called limit save grow act which would have cut the Department of Homeland Security Budget by 22% eliminating 2400 CBP officers every Republican member of the the house voted for that bill a 22% cut the Republican limit save grow act I guess is to limit border patrol and grow chaos this year this past year President Biden requested $84 million in his budget to help states and cities with the costs associated with incoming migrants House Republicans propose cutting that funding to zero so to the state officials who are here who are coming from states that are having challenges with the migrant crisis I've got bad news for you our Republican colleagues are trying to zero out the line item in the budget to help states and cities I'm a former State Treasurer myself and that is deeply deeply distressing and of course most recently in October President Biden requested $14 billion in supplemental funding for Border enforcement that would add 1,300 border patrol agents a, CBP officers but House Republicans have not called a vote on this funding and they'll say well there's other things in it that we don't like you know there's a growing Pro Putin Wing in the house Republican caucus that doesn't like Ukraine funding they don't want more Asylum judges even though that's part of how we solve the problem at the border fine call a vote on the parts that you do like the CBP agents border patrol you've been sitting on it for 3 months if you really truly cared about solving the problem you would call a vote instead they've been sitting on it for three months then went on vacation for a month while secretary my orcus was meeting with Senate Republicans and Senate Democrats to try to come up with a border plan and House Republicans were Mia and I know what my colleagues are going to say they're going to say well we did hr2 we are trying to do something don't forget what's in hr2 all right hr2 would require nonprofit organizations to verify the citizenship of the people they were serving or else they would risk losing their Federal funding it would request coffee shops all across the country small businesses to do citizen checks citizenship checks of their employees zero out the funding for legal assistance for minors so that once again we'd have 5-year-olds going into court and standing in front of judges without no lawyers and we tried to negotiate with them we tried to put in amendments to make that bill better but of course they wouldn't work with us so let's not forget what's really going on here the secretary is trying to do his job House Republicans have been obstructing him every step of the way and are now trying to impeach him because this is about politics for many of them it is not about solving the problem at the border which is what we should be doing with that I yeld back gentleman yields I now recognize the general lady from Georgia Miss green for her five minutes of questioning thank you Mr chairman uh I'd like to bring up that nothing spells impeachment theater unlike the uh or you know the last impeachment of our former president of the United States Donald J Trump that was quite a political uh sham impeachment but today we're talking about a real impeachment that needs to take place there have been over 20 occasions that secretary Amicus has claimed that the border is either closed or secure starting even back in 2021 when he is on record stating the border is secure the border is closed again the border is closed the border is secure he stated to Fox News Peter Ducey the border is closed then he stated again uh to Congressman fluger here on this committee Congressman fluger asked him said the border is secure we are we are executing our plan as he stated to Congressman fluger secretary America said I have been very clear and unequivocal in that regard Congressman the border is no less secure than it was previously he also uh stated to Congressman Michael guest on our committee when he was asked by Congressman guests do you maintain today in light of the statements made by Chief orz that the border is secure secretary morus replied Congressman I stand by my prior assessment because indeed I Define it as maximizing the resources we have to deliver the most effective results his results have been quite effective here are some of secretary mayor's effective results approximately 10 million illegal border crossers from over 160 countries have invaded the United States since President Biden took office and secretary morcus started his job this is uh a number com combined with over 8 million encounters and over 1.8 million Goda aways in September 2023 over 341,000 illegal border crossers invaded our country surpassing all national records secretary mucus is bringing the results in fiscal year 2023 there were over 3 million illegals who invaded the border the highest number of yearly illegal alien encounters in US history that far surpasses uh those that were supposedly deported there have been approxim approximately 73 ,000 special interest aliens arrested our border those are the ones that we know of ladies and gentlemen there's over 1.8 million getaways and we have no idea how many in that 1.8 million or more are terrorists are from terrorist Nations we don't know where they are what they're doing and what their plans are for the United States of America including the states that you're working very hard to protect these are some some impressive results most impressive for American taxpayers is the total federal expenditures and this is this is just in 2023 stands at 66 b 449,000 but let's talk about total state and local expenditures stands at 115 b68 M 730,000 the total National expenditures for border crossers for 2023 stands at 182,780 th000 that is an unbelievable expense for the American people and the American taxpayers and what are the results from secretary mayorcas is job performance he's violated the secure fence Act of 2006 by not maintaining operational control of our border he's violated the immigration and nationality act he has violated the inii by implementing Catch and Release policies when federal law specifically mandates the detention and removable of inadmissible aliens he's violated the inii he's violated the guarantee Clause set forth in article four section four of the Constitution which which requires the federal government to protect States against Invasion and I'd like to just finish with asking each one of you um in your position and your experience and the problems that each of you were dealing with do you believe that secretary mayorcas is actions and refusal to enforce the laws warrant impeachment absolutely congresswoman he has failed to perform and is culpably inefficient yes the secretary is acting in violation of the law and constitutional order thank you very much I yield back my time Mr chairman the general lady yields I now recognize Mr RZ uh from Illinois for her five minutes of questioning thank you chairman after a year in this room after more than 15 hearings and approximately 45 hours of talking and talking and talking about the Border we come back to committee not to address 30 years of failed border policy and political inaction that's created a humanitarian crisis in our borders but to pursue a base less impeachment today marks the 16th wasted hearing on the border Mr Bowman give me a yes or no based on your knowledge and expertise on impeachments do you agree that historically impeachments have been an important tool to ensure accountability in our Democratic institutions yes or no yes thank you and Mr Bulman if you could be concise with just one sentence are you aware of any federal offense secretary Yas has committed that could amount to an impeachable offense no thank you and for the record because I think you've had to answer this a couple times yes or no in your expert opinion is there a legitimate basis for this impeachment no and in your opinion in today's hearing is this an effective use of committee resources yes or no I don't know that's a question I'm an expert in answering I think that's a question for the committee let me answer that I believe it is not the right use of our time here because I think that we should be here identifying ways to address Solutions so this impeachment proceedings demonstrate that some of my rep seriously they're willing to take impeachment an important tool for accountability and make a mockery of it for political gain this is how I know that they're not taking the humanitarian crisis within our borderers seriously because impeachment will not make our borders any safer for our communities or for Asylum Seekers and it will not address the conditions across Latin America that motivate families to migrate across jungles and deserts to our Southern B border so if they were serious they would be taking up any of the topics on this list of 16 16 possible policy Solutions and 16 legislative actions that require US Congress people to advance including today we've wasted 16 herance on political theater that could have been better served considering policies on 16 actions right here behind me let me read them for the record we could be expanding work permits we could be increasing border Personnel to expand assistance to new arrivals we could be modernizing legal Pathways to citizenship we can be granting immigration perau instead of fighting fting it we could be addressing and preparing for climate migration we could be investing in economic development of Latin American communities we can end the Monro Doctrine we can allocate resettlement funding for displaced populations we can lift and reform time-based immigration bars we can modernize definitions standards in our Antiquated system we can establish humanitarian standards we can improve upon adjudicatory processing capacity we can inrease Personnel to reduce us CIS backlogs we can Implement Federal coordination of resettlement to Interior cities let me take a breath now let me go to the 15th we can strengthen democracy and combat corruption Latin America we can pass hr16 the American dream and promise act and because fenel is in fact an issue in this country let me add a 17th one since if we wanted to work we can actually get things done we could actually fund technological resources to prevent fento from being smuggled through our ports of Entry by us Americans so let me say to you as a proud daughter of immigrants the wife of a dreamer and the representative of Illinois 3 I'm here to get things done we have to get serious about addressing every policy opportunity listed behind me today we could start by Expediting work permits because let's just be honest to me Congress this institution this chamber represents a sacred responsibility to come together to realize the solutions and problems impacting our constituents and let me tell you the persecution of immigrants and secretary mayoras it's not going to change the price of milk in your District it's not going to address a shrinking tax base in your district and it's not going to fill the vacant positions of Industries in your local businesses action will action will address the historic labor shortage it will increase our Revenue through taxes it will reduce Supply and distribution chain challenges and it will grow our GDP by what 1.7 trillion over the next decade so if we are serious to have to address this border issue then let's actually get to do the work that addresses border policy because policy in action speaks louder than the 16 hearings and the 48 Hours of talk and talk and sound bites and photo ops at the border I have been to the Border my mother crossed it I was there with her I am serious about the work we can do here are you thank you chairman and with that I yield back the gentle lady yields I now recognize the vice chair of the committee uh the gentleman from Mississippi Mr guest for five minutes question thank you Mr chairman and uh before I begin my question I have something I'd like to submit for the record uh Mr chairman I'd like to submit for the record a post uh from January 15 2019 titled the case for impeachment of Donald Trump part three uh written by Mr Bowman one of our Witnesses today in which he takes a very highly a view of impeachment uh in which he says says that then president Donald Trump could be impeached over foreign policy differences uh and I quote from that article it said surely we can impeach a president for needless shattering a basket of good treaties and entire intricate web of foreign relations they support consider Mr Trump's rolling destruction of America's foreign policy and goes on to say there's powerful evidence that the framers included conducts and damaging to the US policy a category of impeachable behavior I think that that contradicts the testimony that we've heard here today uh Mr chairman from Mr Bowman uh and so I would like to submit uh this article uh for the record without objection so ordered uh thank you Mr chairman to our Witnesses thank you for being here uh today uh we see the numbers on the Southwest border continue to grow exponentially each and every day uh as our attorney generals know you are more aware of these num numbers uh than we are because you deal with the after effects those 300,000 that came across the border just last month many of those will end up in your communities your testimonies as I've read them says that your communities your States your cities that you'll be responsible for housing for feeding for educating for health care you talk about the strain that this is going to be placing on the criminal justice system and then you also talk about the total lack of response from our federal government and so first I want to apologize to you uh that you are not getting the help that you need from the federal government and the help that you need is not us sending you money after these immigrants have come into your community the help that you need is us stopping the immigrants from coming across the border what we saw is we need policies similar to what we saw under the previous administration where we were able to stop immigrants from coming across the border the last two witnesses on the other side try to place blame on this on the Republican party that we need to be doing more and I know that our attorney generals know and I hope those watching on television know that this Republican party has done our part we have passed hr2 the most comprehensive immigration package that has been made through the the the the at least the House of Representatives in decades would substantially overhaul the crisis that we see in addition to that we passed Our House Appropriations Bill dealing with Homeland Security in that House Appropriations Bill we added additional border patrol agents we added Merit pay bonuses for those agents who had been there for a while we put money in the budget for technology and we even said hey we got to get back to building the wall something that I think many of us will agree is a has to be part of that comprehensive package and so for my friends across the aisle who want to place a brain on Republicans that we haven't done anything look at our bills that are sitting over there on Chuck Schumer's desk that he's not taken up in the Senate as they continue to sit there as they continue to fiddle Rome Burns and you were having to deal with the aftermath of that and so I have a question for you and margorie Taylor green talked a little bit about this we've repeatedly had the secretary here he's come here time and time and time again and every time that he's been asked a question by me and my colleagues he has repeatedly said that our Southwest border is secure regardless of the facts and figures and anything statistically you show him where that is not the case that is what he continues to hang his hat on that this border is secure and that there is no crisis well we know there's a crisis because you see it and so my question here in the last uh just 30 seconds that I have and I'm going to ask all of all four of our Witnesses a very simple yes or no question do you believe that there is a crisis at the southern border and is the border secure so I guess I'm going to ask each of you two questions is the border secure we'll start there and the second one is do you believe that there's a crisis attorney general kutson we'll begin with you congressman the southern border is absolutely not secure and this is far beyond a crisis at this point similarly it is not secure and we have a crisis General Brahman General Bailey the border is not secure in the crisis of historically epic proportion and Mr Bowman as I said at the outset I'm not an an expert on immigration policy I don't have any any opinion on those question what's your personal opinion my personal opinion is that there is uh as there has been for decades and indeed probably a century and a half in this country a lot of controversy about immigration policy there been there's controversy about the way in which immigration policy is being administered at the southern border I think at the moment we seem to have more problems in that area than we've had in some past eras yes thank you for your very politically correct answer so with that I yield back thank you the chair now recognizes Mr Ivy of Maryland for his five minutes of questions thank you restor chairman uh I want to thank all of you all for coming today just briefly I wanted to respond to the comment about um legislation sitting on Senator Schumer's desk you know with respect to hr2 um I I think it was clear before it was pass frankly as we came through the committee here Democrats offered amendments all of which were rejected Republicans put in poison pill language especially with respect to not only abortion on some of these bills but cutting off Federal funding to uh agencies and you know social social support groups like Red Cross Christ Catholic church and the like so the fact that you send it over there knowing it was DOA I think is not um much to uh praise uh for the effort but more importantly all of speaker Johnson sit all of us home three weeks early um the Senate stay and the Democrats and Republicans were actually working on bipartisan legislation to trying to address the Border crisis working with the White House and yes secretary mayorcas to try and find an agreement meanwhile the House Republicans instead of working with that group and joining in those negotiations did a road trip to Texas for a photo op opportunity to talk about the issues at the border so if we want to get serious about it oh and by the way President Biden sent uh supplemental legislation man I think it was in September with for additional funding no response from the Republican colleague so if you can uh um so you know part of that what's one of the minor things addressed in this article behind me worst Congress ever that goes to the ineffectiveness of this Congress under the house Republican leadership to get anything done that's critical we've probably gone through the issues of pending legislation Israel Ukraine fisa all the things that haven't got done that need to get done the border is another one I hope my Republican colleagues will get busy on that uh with respect to the the actual uh issue of impeachment from a legal standpoint I went through the testimony that the generals provided I only saw two paragraphs in all three of your testimony with respect to that and none of it actually spoke to the language in the Constitution um with respect to treason bribery High crimes and misdemeanors uh and and I thought that was interesting I I I you know Professor Turley um who is not necessarily my favorite but Republicans seem to like him he testifies a lot in fact at the opening hearing for the impeachment hearings against Joseph Biden uh the oversight committee uh leadership called three experts to testify Turley was one of the three and one of the things Turley said like he's saying here is that there's no basis for impeachment has taken this position with respect to secretary mayorcas um and you know the fact that none of the witnesses that have been called today by the Republicans actually have that kind of experience with respect to impeachment and expertise and I thought was interesting I I'll I'll add this too you can put it down um we want to add to the record a couple of documents one is um the turly letter which I'll offer in a moment but the second is a letter uh an oped that was written by Joshua matz and uh Norm Eisen who are members of were former members of the House Judiciary Committee who've actually worked on impeachment hearings before and they talked about about the absence of evidence to support impeachment here and a couple of of respects that I think are important that we go through one is the issue of maladministration so the framers when they put the the provision and they went through different iterations of it but they ended up with the language they've got but excluded a term like maladministration so that we wouldn't have impeachment hearings for policy differences because and this is James Madison if we did that the Senate could be picking and choosing and throwing out people just on policy disagreements we're really that we should leave that to the president president gets to make a selection pick his cabinet or her cabinet hopefully one day and make the decisions on who should be ruling there um the issue here and that's pointed out in the Eisen letter uh and with respect to the group of uh professors led by Lawrence tribe and others who point this out this is just a maladministration dispute my colleagues over here are talking about the borders run a muuk and all of that and I you know I hear that point but that's just a policy difference I haven't the in the testimony that was given points about bribery treason crime High crimes and misdemeanors don't seem to have been made there's no legal violation there's no criminal act there's no basis that the framers were looking for to remove a a a Cabinet member from Office that's a very serious step and by the way I got a print out of all of the impeachment legislation that my colleagues have put together I I think Miss Taylor green alone just has eight impeachment resolutions in this Congress eight uh three I think against secretary mayorcas so if we're going to be serious about this let's let's try and get to the issues with respect to the actual legal piece and I apologize Mr chairman but I I'll conclude there and I look forward to actually having a debate and experts who can speak to this uh from expertise or scholarship on the issue of the standard for impeachment the gentleman yields U the chair recognizes the gentleman from New York Mr Loda for his five minutes of questions more than any other cabinet secretary in America's history secretary mayorcas is failing America but don't take my word for it 68% of Americans disapprove of the Biden administration's handling of the Southern border 68% 75% of Americans see the Border situation as either a crisis or a serious problem 75% so while our country is divided on so many policy issues there is overwhelming support from across America for secretary me orcus to finally secure our Southern border 68% and 75% yet the administration and my colleagues from the other side of the aisle won't change their border policies secretary morcus won't change his policies or approach the admin Administration won't reinstate remain in Mexico and blue cities won't repeal their Sanctuary City policies um secretary me orcus won't change his border policies all while tens of thousands of Americans are dying from the fentol being smuggled across his open border secretary morcus won't and can't properly vet the tens of thousands of migrants he has paroling into our country from nations with whom America is adversarial so here we are so what do we in this Congress do when somewhere around 75% of our constituents and by the way from Blue districts and red districts and purple districts want accountability 75% what do we do when tens of thousands of Americans are dying what do we do when potentially hundreds of terrorist sleeper cells are being hatched every day inside of America's borders what do we do do we do nothing do we wrap ourselves in some sort of bureaucracy and find some sort of legal reasoning not to do anything or do we act and let me State quite clearly that I do not take impeachment lightly impeachment is meant for the most serious grave circumstances when there is a true failure and willful dereliction of Duty has occurred and this case secretary morcus has committed three specific violations which warrant impeachment he has neglected his duty to secure our border he has abused his power to exercise proper discretion over America's immigrant ation process and secretary morcus has breached America's public trust and no matter what the secretary or the president say the numbers speak for themselves since President Biden has been on office there have been 4.5 million migrant encounters at the Southwest border in addition to over 1.2 million goway who evaded US border patrol agents in the last two years those numbers are larger than the population of Los Angeles the second largest city in the United States and let me be abundantly clear this is not the failure of the hardworking men and women who are out there every day in the front line of this crisis this is a failure of leadership at the highest levels right up to secretary mayorcas and President Biden and while there are at least three criteria which Merit secretary mayor's impeachment and removal today I would like to focus on just one of them secretary me orcus neglecting his duty to secure the Border ten Attorney General kson good to be with you here today sir and thanks for your hard work keeping your residence in Montana safe uh in October sir you joined a coalition of 27 State Attorneys General in a petition urging secretary mayorcas to end his uh policy of mass Catch and Release and I was hoping that you could Define sir for Americans who may be watching from home today and maybe not so familiar with this topic what Catch and Release means sir thank you Congressman I can so generally speaking uh Congressman under under 8 USC 1225 the law is very clear the the secretary has a duty to detain every single alien that enters the country period hard stop shall be detained uh there is one exception there's a caseby casee exception listed under Section 1182 which allows on a caseby casee individual temporary basis for either humanitarian or for for public Justice reasons uh an exception under secretary May oris's Direction uh that basically has been turned into not a caseby casee analysis but rather a mass catch and release uh where those individuals are no longer given an individual investigation an individual notice to appear in front of a judge uh they were given a notice to report that appears nowhere in the Federal Register that appears nowhere in federal law and was basically used as a mass catch and release program so that's what we're talking so would you agree that the mass Catch and Release that is not done on a case-by casee basis is inconsistent with the laws passed by Congress and signed into law by both uh by presidents of both parties absolutely Congressman there is no legal Authority anywhere in federal code for Mass release of immigrants into this country thank you I'm out of time I yield back the gentleman yields uh the chair uh now recognizes the gentleman from new New Jersey Mr Menendez for his 5 minutes thank you Mr chair I'm frustrated that Republicans on this committee have chosen to engage in this political exercise and are proceeding to willfully misinterpret the US Constitution and every precedent from the past 250 years by impeaching secretary my orcus last week one of our Republican colleagues said he was not likely to support any compromised border bill because quote I'm not willing to do too damn much right now to help a Democrat and to help Joe Biden's approval rating I will not help the Democrats try to improve this man's dismal approval ratings I'm not going to do it why would would I end quote why would he because we need to work together to address the critical issues that our committee has jurisdiction over because we owe it to our constituents and our communities to meet this moment but that's not what this hearing is about because when you talk about approval ratings and not wanting to help Democrats not wanting to help this Administration not wanting to help our president you undermine the seriousness of what is being discussed today and you make clear what this has always been political Pursuit speaking of politics I'm a few or no questions for the three attorney generals here today you are all elected officials is that correct yes I was appointed to my office subject to election by the people understood and you are all Republicans is that correct yes and lastly in 2016 and 2020 president Trump won in the states that you serve as Attorney General of yes yes so it's fair to conclude that it's politically beneficial for you to be supportive of the former president and his policies and oppose President Biden's policies as is the case for all of our Republican colleagues here on this committee but constitutional law is clear on this point policy political differences are not appropriate grounds for impeachment Mr Bowman is that correct yes or no it is thank you House Republicans have said they will not support quote another dime end quote for DHS until the enactment of hr2 their extreme anti-immigrant border bill that would severely restrict our legal immigration system a bill that would endanger migrant lives by denying Asylum Seekers their legal right to seek protection in the United States and reinstating dangerous policies that Force migrants to remain in unsafe conditions such as remain in Mexico but Republicans know that hr2 is so cruel and unworkable that will never become law but that's what they use to say we're doing something here that's what we're doing on this committee and this Congress instead Republicans could support president Bay's request for funding for more CBP officers and Fentanyl detection technology to increase cbp's capacity to identify Bad actors in drugs at our Southern border but no they won't support this funding or any solution that would help this Administration carry out border security efforts because it would weaken their political talking points that's been their strategy this entire Administration in this committee we have real opportunities to work on substantive issues together across the aisle said my Republican colleagues are distorting this committee and its mandate to safeguard our nation's Homeland Security into a vehicle for false narratives about migrants and the board order Professor Bowman let me ask you a question is it appropriate to impeach Secretary of my orcus because of policy disagreements no is it appropriate to impeach secretary mycus because Republicans refuse to properly fund DHS and allow him to do his job well I don't want to characterize um the actions of the Republicans but certainly don't you don't impeach we'll take your first part of the answer Professor Bowman is it appropriate to impeach secretary myor is because Republicans would rather Nate a crisis to score political points then work with the ad Administration to strengthen the security of our border it's certainly not impeach it's certainly not appropriate to impeach a cabinet officer over political or policy disagreements I agree uh attorney general Drummond um thank you for your testimony your in testimony I went through it I appreciate it this day and age we deal a lot with sourcing and uh citations I noticed there was a single Source in yours and it was to the Federation for American Immigration Reform uh are you aware that the Southern Poverty Law Center has designated the Federation for American Immigration Reform as a hate group whose leaders have ties to white nationalist I am not yeah um completely understandable I would just let you know that a lot of the sources that have been used and all this investigative materials and reports have been put forth by the majority have relied on farri right anti-immigrant um think tanks and groups that are not aligned with what I believe our country morals and values are and that's a problem with a lot of the reports that this hearing that this impeachment process and procedure has been based on um and that's where this all falls apart for me uh I really wish we were engaging in a thoughtful uh exercise I really wish we were trying to solve some of the challenges that we're facing but that's not what today is about and with that I yield back gentleman Ys uh yes Mr Goldman referenced two articles uh Turley uh and Eisen and the clerk has already collected them but it was just a unanimous consent to inclement a record actually Mr I it yeah I think I was watching back there I saw it was Mr iy so yeah so ordered and thank you Mr chairman and thank you all for being here today and providing this important testimony uh um uh let let's be clear about this the Biden Administration and secretary Mar orcus did not inherit the crisis at the border they created it ignoring the desperate pleas from affected and scared families Nationwide secretary mayorcas has intentionally disregarded the law leaving the Border open to an endless stream of migrants drug and cartel members my time as a sheriff and uh if I wasn't neglecting my duties to enforce the law it would have cost me my job the secretary should be held to the same standard uh Mr Drummond uh your story about the illegal Chinese National who executed a three men that's really stuck with me uh the reports are clear that terrorist organizations are exploiting the vulnerability of our nation's border it is simply irresponsible that secretary mayorcas continues to ignore the significant threat to our national security do you believe secretary May orc actions have embolden terrorists around the world and is it fair to say he has intentionally ignoring our nation's current laws that should make it harder to enter our country illegally I think that it is indisputable that we have uh terrorist terrorist organizations invading my state we've identified numerous gangs numerous syndicated crime organizations and they only grow on a daily basis Mr gudon and Mr B would you care to comment on this as well I would point out that uh the two lawsuits that we have pending right now dealing with the parole process the abuse of the parole process secretary mayor's violation of the plain text of the statute as it relates to parole and his promulgation of the circumvention rule have been described as engaging in a child trafficking delivery service so it's not just that he's emboldening the enemies of the United States he's actually actively participating in some of the harms by using support networks to allow for illegal immigration that used to be considered unlawful through the stroke of his pin without Congressional Authority Congressman I wholeheartedly agree I mean I can tell you the The increased gang activity in my state I can tell you the increase in firearm crime in my state increase in officer involved shootings uh we can tie this all directly to the the cartel drug problems that is flooding my State uh We've we've seen fentanyl seizures in my state Rise by some measurements up from 11,000 per in my state just since 2019 U those are numbers that we were not seeing prior to this Administration change I I think that's pretty staggering thank you Mr Drummond and your state and many others we've had taken steps to safeguard our communities because we we cannot rely on this Administration to protect us for example Mississippi my home state has set up a fental strike force uh to tackle the influx of drugs I know notice that the state of Oklahoma has also formed a uh similar task force uh can you elaborate on some of the findings of that task force yes then we have created an organized crime task force with the explicit purpose of coordinating with other state agencies to tackle this uh endemic of illegal immigration in the state of Oklahoma and the drugs and the and the detriment that they drag into the state and uh it's come at an extremely high cost for the state we've allocated an additional $3 million from my office just to staff that and the toll on human uh it's just remarkable are there any recommendations the task force findings uh that you could recommend to the Congress to consider uh implementing on a federal level it would be very helpful if uh the terrorism category if cartels would be listed as foreign terrorist organizations right now they they fall outside that immigration admissibility uh definition and if they they were designated as such it would give us strength in deportation also in your testimony you pointed out that smaller law enforcement departments are outmanned outgunned and ill equipped to address the threats coming across our border particularly the threats from the Mexican and Chinese drug syndicates uh I can sympathize uh with this and certainly understand the stress that is placed on our rural Law Enforcement Officers when dealing with such a riseing crime as departments are forced and stretch their resources uh addressing pressing issues uh can you talk a little bit about the Ripple effects and the gaps it leaves in our critical areas of law enforcement uh and safety for our communities it it has truly taken the attention of all law enforcement in the state of Oklahoma toward this issue where we have uh you know a shell owner buying a prop piece of property pushing up BMS of dirt with bulldozers Manning those with uh semi-automatic weapons at the top very intimidating for our local law enforcement they're outgunned outmanned and our limit our our resources are stretched in the state thank you Mr Drummond and the other witnesses as well for your input today once again the committee has shown that secretary Mar orcus Bears direct responsibility for the chaos at the border I will not tolerate the overlooking of real threats that are jeopardizing innocent lives his failures demand Swift accountability Mr chairman I yeld back gentleman Ys I now recognize a gentle lady from Nevada uh Miss Titus for her five minutes a question thank you very much Mr chairman thank you to the witnesses you know it often I see my colleagues across the aisle brandishing the Constitution like a sword you love to quote it you love to cite it you love to talk about what the founding fathers intended that original intent but it's kind of like Shakespeare in the Bible those who talk about the most have seldom read it and really may not understand what's in there you know if you talk about original intent uh you you're saying what the founding fathers intended now that's a smaller country smaller population smaller budget we had no AI we had no drones how do we know what they intended well often we don't but in this case we know exactly what they intended all you have to do is look at some of the notes from the convention of the Constitution by Madison who did not want to include the uh Mal admin administration because it was too broad and policy oriented look at Federalist Paper 65 by Hamilton conservative at the time who did not want to uh include this broader interpretation of impeachment now you've also heard Mr Bowman's arguments a respected scholar who you have demeaned his expertise by insinuating oh he's just a democratic uh witness uh but he is not alone in this position Mr turley's letter was mentioned uh there is an article in the hill about another letter from legal Scholars this is a group of legal Scholars who wrote a letter to our chairman and the leadership of the house uh speaker Johnson that says their proposed grants for impeaching mayorcas are the stuff of ordinary policy disagreement in the field of immigration enforcement they go on to say that uh this is inappropriate they admit they have varing views on the wisdom and success of mayor's work on the immigration policy but they say you cannot have impeachment based on this policy it is a I quote Stark departure from the Constitution now these legal Scholars included in this letter are Donald air who served as us Deputy attorney general under George HW Bush Stuart gearon who served as acting us attorney general during Clinton and also served in the Justice Department under Bush you have Mr Turley also included in this there's even a quote by dtz who says that this is inappropriate use of impeachment so Mr Bowman in with his expertise does not stand alone in condemning this use of impeachment for political reasons now I look at this resolution that we're supposed to be considering that was offered by Miss Taylor green and aside from the fact that it's got some punctuation and grammatical errors it lists some ways that the uh the secretary has been effective in the amount of fentanyl that has been seized at the border the number of people who were caught on the terrorist watch list before they came into the country those are all evidence that he is carrying out his duty what I don't see anywhere in this resolution nor have I heard from any of my colleagues nor any of our Attorneys General is how impeaching the secretary is going to solve all these problems how's it going to get rid of these illegal Grove places in Oklahoma how's it going to get rid of all the terrorists who are coming into Missouri how is it going to solve the fentol problem uh in in these other whatever other state oh Montana uh because we've gotten rid of Mr moror if anybody can add that and tell us how getting rid of him is going to make a difference I'd like to hear it we hear over in the Senate Mr lford senator lford who is a republican saying well you can just switch one secretary for another it's not going to make any difference so perhaps we could talk about how getting rid of Mr morcus through this uh impeachment process is going to make a difference I hear nothing did you want does the Gent lady yield no I'm not going to okay all right so since I gave you I'd gladly i' gladly answer the question I gave you an opportunity I gave you an okay I'll y okay all right well in in my previous testimony I've shared that the policies that he's implemented has allowed the cels actually mer Garland agreed with this that that they're flooding The Crossing sites tying up the border patrol causing them to concentrate and then the the the fenel and the other things are coming across the border outside now I get the argument that's often made what's captured is mostly captured you're not answer I take my time back chairman you're not answering my question how getting rid of my yorc us is going to solve these problems what you really want to do is get rid of President Biden you want to get rid of President Biden and then perhaps you can put your own secretary in there that will come up with different policy but just impeaching mayorcas we we'll have another appointment of another secretary who follows the policy of the administration and you won't like that either so thank you Mr Bowman for your expertise and I Y the Gent lady yields I now recognize a gentleman from New York Mr Diaz bazito for his five minutes question thank you Mr chairman and it's clear that uh the disapproval of the policies of Joe Biden and secretary mayorcas are not just specific uh to Republicans or conservatives the numbers that were shared by my good friend from New York Mr Loda 75% of people have said that the border is the biggest issue facing this country you talk about numbers fiscal year 21 since fiscal year 21 8,542 th000 people have come across our borders over 3 million in fiscal year 23 in November 308,000 and change 242,000 at our Southern border 312 Terror terrorists who have come across on our Terror watch list in fiscal year 21 1.8 million Goda aways that we know about and many more that we don't it's cost cities and states throughout this country $451 billion doll with a B there's been over 70,000 Americans killed by fent and all that have come across from cartels we've been asked the question is this about policy or is this about the things that mayorcas has committed well if you ask me all those numbers is a complete betrayal to this country we talk and has been mentioned by colleagues that again this is political theater this is Republicans conservatives using the Border as a narrative as we go towards an election this isn't a narrative it's not one created by the Republicans and I'll I'll take us back to my home state of New York where you have Democrats our governor has said flat out there's no room left in New York there's no room at the Inn don't send migrants here anymore we've heard a Democrat city mayor mayor Adams who I disagree with virtually everything about but this I actually agree with he has said that the migrant issue in New York City will destroy New York so this doesn't seem like it's political theater it doesn't seem like it's a narrative that's been created by Republicans and conservatives because you now have Democrats in these blue States and and Sanctuary states and cities who agree with us just last night we had children told in New York City that they can no longer attend school in person they have to do it virtually because their school is now being used to house migrants now just think about that for a second we want to talk about the failed policies this isn't just a policy this is intent May orcus has intentionally intentionally betrayed this country people are claiming that they want to come here for a better way of life for democracy for a chance at that American Dream for a better education and yet children who came here correctly children who were born here last night were told that they cannot go to school because there's no room for them because it's being used by migrants that's the height of hypocrisy and if you ask me it is a betrayal of this country Mr gner Drummond in the in your testimony you talked about how smaller law enforcement agencies feel that they are ill equipped to handle the threats stemming from the border crisis can you talk about how the Border crisis impacts the resources of smaller police agencies and what the officers in those departments are feeling well certainly it strains the resources and it is wildly intimidating to our local law enforcement where they have maybe a a police force of three or four in a community of 2,000 and yet they have four or five illegal GR that are populated by illegal immigrants Mexican cartel members Chinese syndicated crime organization members with semi assault semi-automatic rifles abundant and they are unwilling to go in and I know the answer to this but I want to ask it so it's on the record because I think it's another clear indicator of mayor' failure of his oath and the fact that he's betrayed this country do you know or have you experienced law enforcement agencies to your knowledge that have said that they have lacked notification and information and intelligence sharing from federal Partners when it comes to uh migrants I I would say the cooperation with our federal agencies is high in Oklahoma we have an excellent reput working relationship so I commend the federal agencies working with Oklahoma I think it goes at a higher level and that's the implementation of the laws of O of the United States right M Mr nson do you want to comment on that only to I completely agree with my colleague the level of cooperation with with Federal DEA with our us attorney's office in Montana has been very very high and very excellent uh customs in Border Patrol am my Dad we're a Northern Tier State we work with them a lot but certainly the message has come down from secretary May arcus and from onh high that uh we're going to just flagrantly ignore portions of federal law and and that is really the point that I was trying to make he has made it very clear that he wants to ignore federal law there are uh you're lucky in your states to have great Communications but there has been and there have been testimony In This Very uh Committee of people who led local law enforcement agencies who have said I mean take for example uh the airport and JFK where they were housing migrants where there was Zero Communications between law enforcement agencies uh because they just didn't want to share the information uh with that my time's expired Mr chairman i y back gentleman Yi I now recognize Mr Goldman the gentleman from New York for his five minutes questioning thank you very much Mr chairman I find it really difficult to sit here listening to my colleagues on the other side of the aisle slander personally a cabinet secretary who has committed much of his life to this government and our Public Service he was a US attorney he's worked multiple stints in the Department of Homeland Security and you're certainly welcome to disagree with how he executes his job you're welcome to criticize him you're welcome to make the case to the American people as to why secretary mayorcas in executing President Joe Biden's immigration policy should be removed from office at The Ballot Box but to come in here over and over and over again and to personally attack and slander without any evidence a cabinet secretary who has committed so much of his life to this country who himself comes from a Cuban family escaping difficult circumstances in his country it was an immigrant immigrant family himself you should be ashamed of yourself it's enough you want to talk policy let's talk policy I agree we have problems at the border let's talk about how we can solve them but instead of actually going over to the Senate this committee which has the committee of jurisdiction over border policy that is being negotiated right now by a bipartisan group in the Senate with secretary mayorcas instead of actually engaging in those substantive negotiations to reach some sort of a bipartisan agreement to address the problems we are sitting here with a charade of a sham impeachment hearing with expert impeachment Witnesses who are Republican officials uh political officials suing the Department of Homeland Security another hearing it's the same hearing we've had 10 12 times same Pig different lipstick because we're now going to call it an impeachment hearing so who do we have here and I am sure all three of you are excellent Attorneys General um but I have never heard your names mentioned in the category of Mr Bowman who is a legal expert on impeachment and as far as I can tell you none of your States actually are are on the border so I don't understand why we are sitting here in a quote impeachment hearing with three Attorneys General from different states who are Republican officials and have absolutely no expertise on impeachment the reason is because the last time the Republicans did that and they brought in their so-called experts on impeachment for the first and only oversight public hearing they were embarrassed because their own experts acknowledge that there is insufficient evidence to impeach President Biden so who do we have here we have Attorneys General who are suing secretary mayorcas and the government to stop him from implementing his policy to address the issues at the border that's right so one one rule that uh the department has implemented was the Asylum processing rule which would allow Asylum officers rather than immigration courts to decide Asylum applications for those placed in expedited removal to significantly expedite the process that might reduce the backlog that might create a disincentive to come that's something that secretary mayorcas did to address the Border no you sued him to stop him from doing that how about the circumvention rule well that is the circumvention excuse me how about the uh the Asylum circumvention rule which says that you have to either appear at a Port of Entry or have first sought Asylum from a neighboring country that would reduce the people who could apply for Asylum no you sued them you sued them to stop them from doing that and how about trying to address the uh parole decisions to allow some people to come in and be able to actually have work authorizations so that they are not just sitting on the doll no you sued them so this is what we have we have Republicans suing secretary mayorcas to stop him from implementing his policy to address the issues of the border and now we're going to impeach him because you say he's not addressing the issues at the border which do you want I yield back gentleman yields I now recognize Miss Lee for uh the gentle lady from Florida for five minutes of testimony thank you Mr chairman much has been said today by our colleagues across the aisle about this hearing and the purposes for it it's been called a waste of time it's been called a charade it's been suggested that it's repetitive or unnecessary to suggest that this hearing is any of those things or to suggest that this hearing is tantamount than nothing more than a discussion of policy differences is to fundamentally deny the seriousness the scope the scale of the catastrophe at our Southern border and the testimony of these Witnesses who are here today and every witness that has come before them to testify in front of this committee about the seriousness of this crisis we are here today because secretary Alejandro morcus has en intentionally gone around and subverted the immigration laws of the United States of America we are here today because secretary Alejandro mayorcas has repeatedly defied orders from courts directing him to cease and desist certain policies which he continues to utilize we are here today because the Department of Homeland Security has defied inquiries from Congress trying to get to the bottom of the scope and the scale of this crisis and we are here today because secretary mayorcas has defied Congressional directives related to spending Congressional directives as to how money was supposed to be spent we are here because there is an unchecked flood of illegal immigration in our Southern border that is destroying not just border communities but communities around our country today alone we have heard extraordinary and compelling testimony about the utter lawlessness that is occurring and this Administration attorney general kudon shared with us that he perceives a refusal to Faithfully execute the laws of the United States and shared stories from his State about human trafficking and Fentanyl trafficking and the devastation that has occurred because of our wide openen Southern border attorney general Drummond commented on the failure to enforce our laws and how that has affected his State he also shared the extraordinary Ary cost that it incurs at his State because we are not enforcing our laws in our border and attorney general Bailey touched on the issue of parole which has become an absolute farce and workaround for following our laws he's said perverting the plain text of the law and indeed that's exactly what is happening in my state Florida we too have been forced to sue the Department of Homeland Security security to attempt to achieve any semblance of lawful behavior and policy United States District Court Judge Kent wetheral in an order directing that secretary mayorcas vacate the parole program said quote secretary morcus has turned the southern border into a meaningless Line in the Sand and little more than a speed bump for aliens flooding into the country with with that backdrop attorney general Bailey I'd like to turn your attention specifically to the question of Parole Authority on July 26 2023 before the house Judiciary Committee secretary mayor has testified the Department of Homeland Security has used our Parole Authority consistent with the law and consistent with past practices of different administrations he also claimed that his department is using the Parole Authority uh consistent with the laws still in your opinion is secretary May oris's implementation of the parole statute lawful and is his implementation of this policy affecting the security of the United States his policy implementation is unlawful in violation of the plain text of the statute thereby forcing a lawsuit from several like-minded State Attorneys General because of the DraStic terrible harm that's occurring on the streets in our communities attorney general Drummond you shared some of the devastating effects that failure to secure our border is having on your state in your opinion are these policies affecting the security and safety of your state and of our country the laws of the immigration nationality act are clear and unequivocal and they are not being upheld and attorney general puden would you share your perspective on the harm to your state and our country that is being posed by failure uh to follow our laws 1 1700% increase in fentanyl deaths confirmed State Crime Lab fentanyl deaths since 2019 congresswoman uh 11,000 per increase in fentanyl seizures multiple 100% increase in human trafficking investigation since 2019 those numbers speak for themselves thank you Mr chairman i y back gent lady yields I now recognize Mr G you're up are you ready or you want to go ahead with somebody else okay recognize Mr Garcia for his five minutes of testimony thank you Mr chairman um just want to just reiterate that I it's been said this very many times today by our our uh colleagues here um on the house side on the Democratic side that we all know that this impeachment inquiry this effort to try to impeach the secret secretary is a complete political stunt in sham and I just want to reiterate that we all know it's a political employ that's not grounded in the facts truth and has been conjured up for just one simple purpose and that's to score cheap political points against the Biden Administration we also know that we've had articles from The New York Times and other Publications just really laying out that this is all about uh this pursuit of impeaching mayorcas uh it's about this kind of effort that's been started quite frankly by even a member of this committee uh for many many many months um that's all just really about hurting the president now Professor Bowman Republican leaders have been quoted promising donors that they would impeach secretary mayorcas and fundraisers back in April of 2023 do you believe this committee has uncovered any evidence of high crimes or misdemeanor since that time not that I'm aware of and thank you and let's let's be clear what we're moving ahead with today is because extremists including some folks uh that are in this committee have demanded it over and over again now I want to give a couple quotes from some members of the house uh Congressman Andy bigs told Newsmax that Republicans quote have nothing to campaign on Andy said that he was embarrassed by this now Congressman chip Roy has said and I want to quote I want my Republican colleagues to give me one thing one that I can go to campaign on to say that we did just one end quote and in fact this last Monday he went on TV to call the Republican conference and I quote a continued failure theater end quote so I understand that we're trying to throw red meat to an extremist base but we're wasting the Public's time and we know that the Senate will laugh off all of these charges and let's remember the bigger picture some of my friends on the other side of the aisle don't want to really govern they're not serious about solutions could actually become law and they're obstructing $4 billion in emergency supplemental funding they voted against hiring hundreds of additional border patrol agents and of report Port of Entry and have opposed the Incredible S resources that we've try been trying to send around technology supporting organizations on the ground support for border patrol agents and many other types of funding and I also want to remind the committee and the public that President Biden on his first day in office sent a comprehensive immigration plan to Congress which Republicans have refused to act on I also want to note that secretary mayorcas has continued to try to negotiate a bipartisan sensible and Humane Humane approach to actually fixing our immigration system and trying to actually address the issues that remain along the border because Democrats agree there are issues and challenges along the border and we want to see those fixed now as an immigrant myself I also I've always belied this is a nation of immigrants we should never forget that this country was based on so much hard work and labor of immigrants that now live all across this country and our immigration system won't be fixed by this impeachment process and it certainly won't be fixed by their proposal which is hr2 and let's set the record straight about hr2 the bill would end Health and Human Services funding for legal representation of unaccompanied children in Immigration proceedings it's it would essentially send children to detention camps and the bill subjects all unaccompanied children to an accelerated removal process as we know in horrible conditions at these facilities that we have seen over the last few years and quite frankly we know this is not just solu not a solution but it's inhumane and cruel to demonize some of the most vulnerable people that are coming to our country we want to address the root causes of migration we want to ensure that legal pathways are followed we want to make sure that that folks receive the support they need back in their home countries and we certainly want don't want to fund organizations like Catholic Charities that would rip away Aid to communities and to migrants across across our country and along our border the idea that are border problems which have needed a a partisan solution for decades would be solved by hr2 is just not true it's an anti-immigrant policy and we should reject it thank you and I yield back the gentleman yields I now recognize Mr Latrell for the gentleman from Texas for his five minutes question thank you Mr chairman thank you all for coming here today Mr Bowman I I appreciate and respect your opening statements where it's probably the most educated I've been on where it comes to constit constitutional law and the process that we're in right now so thank you for for that education U qu I have my first question for you sir is can you give me the definition of a high crime and misdemeanor I think no single definition is satisfactory in every case but I think Charles Black is a pretty good general statement that is to say high crimes and misdemeanor should be ex extremely serious offenses in the way that serious crimes like treason and bribery are extremely serious so second from that let me go off with that one sir that's a great point is the selling of fenel inside the United States causing hundreds of thousands of deaths over the past years considered a high crime in your opinion I'm unaware that the secretary has sold any F no no no no no I'm not directing that to the secretary I'm asking you is the selling of fentel inside the United States killing hundreds of thousands of Americans over the years considered would be that be considered a high crime if you could establish that's a yes answer all day long you don't say did that possibly all right so let me ask youw of no evidence that that ever happened there there's no there's no evidence that hundreds of thousands of people over the past few years have died from fentel overdose I'm unaware of any evidence that secretary Marcus has ever sold I'm not talking about secretary Marcus I'm talking about F that's what we're here to talk about are we not Congressman secretary you'll allow me to finish if you'll answer my question I'm getting my point it's your time so you can with you know all right so let me ask you this since we're we're unhinged on the fentel Des do you consider slavery a high crime is there any evidence that secretary mayor has has enslaved anyone this is getting a little bit more complicated than I thought it was going to be I want to know if I'm supposed to go back to the folks in my district and tell them that the individual responsible for securing the American borders is falling short because the United States is one of the top countries on the planet for sex slaves we lose a 100,000 people a year to fental overdoses and the individual responsible for protecting us is Mr mayorcas that's where I'm going with that the fact that you didn't jump on top of and say that those things were absolutely involuntary the worst things ever is graphically disturbing to me I pitched that one up as a softball buddy and you failed miserably I'm from Texas I feel this every day and my colleagues and I we have our disagreements and I went down to the border with my with the other Republicans I didn't have a polo on I didn't get behind the podium I talk to everybody down there that works down there I talk to the ranchers the citizens and they tell me every single day that we are overwhelmed and Miss Titus brought up an amazing Point yes if we move remove Mr mayorcas Mr Biden will put another Democratic member in that spot we know that I'm here for this reason I'm sending a message that my people can no longer take it we are dying by the droves every year I have to look at the mother I look the mothers and fathers that lost their kids for I look at them every single day when I'm out in the district and it's all coming across our Southern border through the ports of Entry yes I got it but if you're responsible for securing our our borders then you better act like it and this individual is not and that is the problem sir period in a discussion these atrocities that we are seeing you can't explain 40 million people are enslaved on the planet 40 million and America is leading up top with that problem and you ask where they come from they come across our Southern border and our northern border and that sir is the responsibility of the secretary and since he has failed to conduct his job for the past few years we need somebody else now I'm not I'm Mr mayorcas I I've chatted him up he is a family man he's a good man and I'm going to be crucified going back home and saying that I've tooken him SP face to face and I he he I I bet he adamantly disagree would disagree on the fact that slavery is horrible the fentel disc are horrible but there was a mother sitting in front of this committee months ago last year that sat there and looked at every single one of us she lost her mother and her daughter to a CO running through the town killed them both she had to she had to stand there in the emergency room while her daughter died she looked us all in the face as you guys are absolutely doing nothing you're doing nothing so when we go to Mr May orcus and say hey we need to act on this and nothing's happening sir that is an absolute problem I yield back gentleman yels I now recognize Miss Clark from New York the gentle lady from New York for her five minutes of testimony thank you Mr chairman and good afternoon uh let me first start by thanking our Witnesses for joining us this this afternoon uh today uh you know it's clear that Maga Republican attempts to impeach secretary mariaras have nothing to do with his performance and everything to do with the Loyalty oath most of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle have sworn to Donald Trump after the house twice impeached Donald Trump once for attempting to bribe an ally to investigate his political opponent and interfering us elections and again for inciting an Insurrection against the capital to steal an election some of my Republican colleagues want to settle the score by impeaching someone anyone in the Biden Administration secretary mayorcas was sworn in on February 2nd of 2022 less than six weeks later Senator Lindsey Graham floated the secretary should resign during an appearance on Fox News in May of 2021 Congressman bigs appeared on the 1 and said that secretary morakis has got to go and introduced articles of impeachment the secret of the secretary in August of that year the secretary had not yet served six months other Republicans piled on that call in the months that followed in April chairman green fundraised off his planned impeachment efforts telling his donors to quote get out the popcorn un quote but secretary marus is hardly the only member of the Biden Administration Republicans have disagreed with and then tried to impeach Congressman Perry filed articles of impeachment against attorney general Garland in October of 2021 congresswoman Taylor green filed articles of to impeach the Attorney General in August of 2022 FBI director Christopher Ray in May of 2022 and multiple articles of impeachment against President Biden sometimes more than one time in the same day Congressman Norman filed articles of impeachment against secretary blinkin in August of 2021 and Congressman Mills filed articles of impeachment against secretary Austin in August of 2023 meanwhile Republicans have filed multiple resolutions to expunge the impeachments of Donald Trump I'm concerned that my Republican colleagues failed to understand the gravity of impeachment so uh Professor Bowman the founders engaged in robust debate when defining the criteria for impeachment in your view did the founders intend for impeachment to be a frequently used process to coerce the executive branch into policy decisions or a rarely used tool reserved for Extraordinary behavior that meets the definition of high crimes and misdemeanors certainly the second congresswoman I mean the key Point here is not only that impeaching secretary morcus will will affect absolutely no change in Border policy border legislation but even if impeaching uh a cabinet secretary could really accomplish something consequential it would be terrible for the country because it would overthrow the basic principle of separation of powers in which uh on which the Constitution and our system of government are actually based Congress and the executive are supposed to work together to solve the country's problems they're often going to disagree about how to do that but in our system the solution is the hard work of legislation of negotiation of compromise of Coalition building uh impeachment is not and never has been the answer and it is quite clear that the framers intended it not for that purpose whatsoever ever they intended it for the most extraordinary circumstances and simply to resolve you know a a a a partisan political debate or to change policy is not it thank you um for your response and Mr chairman I yield back gentle lady yields I now recognize Mr strong and uh for the committee room Mr strong will be the last and then we'll go vote and come back at 2:15 so Mr strong you're recognized thank you Mr chairman attorney general canson um I was glad to see you mention in your testimony that Secretary of my orcus has regularly hidden behind the concept of prosecut prosecutorial discretion I like how you said that because that right there is one of the big issues today specifically we have talked about secretary Marcus's abuse of prosecutorial uh discretion in the uh enforcement and removal of illegal aliens in the United States I want to highlight again secretary Marcus's 2021 memo in which he stated the fact that an individual is a removable alien therefore should not alone be the basis of an enforcement action against them he went on uh to list factors that ice agents should wave when deciding whether to pursue enforcement and removal or not uh attorney general canuteson as a former prosecutor yourself does it make uh make any sense to give Credence to mitigating factors when considering whether to prosecute someone that has already been proven to have broken the law when they crossed our border illegally Congressman certainly not especially when there's specific directive in federal law that requires that person be detained and be prosecuted the the idea that individual prosecutorial discretion suddenly means you have the right to blanket on mass pardon people or or or parole them into the the the heartland of the country that simply does not exist in statute I I agree with the concept generally of prosecutorial discretion on a caseby Case basis and indeed that's what the federal law allows but that's not what's being done here it's being just implemented on a mass scale wide open on mass and that is simply not justified anywhere in federal code thank you I must say I was disappointed to see that the factors in favor of uh removal didn't include this uh uh significant financial and human cost to American citizens our hospitals are inundated with illegals schools are overrun with non English speaking setting other students back and now New York is sent teachers and American students home uh and turning public schools into bunker houses for illegal aliens this is totally unacceptable uh attorney general Bailey and conon you both specifically mentioned in your testimony that you uh do not view the crisis at the southern border uh as a resource issue in other words you both AG each explain to the committee uh why this is the case certainly that's what our lawsuit about his refusal to build the border wall is all about he is flaunting the commands of this body he is nullifying your constitutional authority over the power of the purse and when that Authority is no longer effective impeachment is the last option and I would point out that what we have here is not a policy disagreement it's a willful violation to carry out a an explicit directive of this body and an abdication of His official duties Mr chairman Congressman I I would add that you know that resources are being moved down there regularly I I mentioned I'm a northern border state we have nearly 600 miles of border with Canada in my state there's a large Customs and Border control border control contingent in Montana most of those individuals have told me they've been they've been cycled down to the southern border the problem is not the number of Agents down there the problem is they are being instructed by secretary mayorcas to stand down and to not follow federal law that's the issue here thank you on September the 6 2023 the DHS office of Inspector General released its report titled DHS does not have assurance that all migrants can be located once uh released into the United States that title alone should concern every single person in America this investigation reviewed nearly 1 million migrant records and found that addresses for more than 177,000 migrants were either missing invalid for delivery or not legitimate residential locations that uh that's nearly 20% uh if you you if you look at this and that right there is totally unacceptable we talk about leadership by the Secretary of Homeland Security well you think about this the first thing that I saw at the southern border on one of my many visits is I noticed 20,28 border wall panels in storage I came back to DC and found out that those 2,288 uh panels being stored in three different states costing the American taxpayer more than $300 million this This Is How They solve or try to work to solve the problem at the southern border this is totally unacceptable and this is uh another reason that we're here Mr Bowman you're a constitutional law expert should president Trump have been impeached for a Russian hoax where the steel dosier was created and paid for by the Clinton campaign what do you think about that should that should that have happened what were you teaching in your classroom go go ahead and answer the question and then we'll that'll the gentl chairman I'll uh I'll yield to you I know he doesn't want to answer that question no you do you not want the gentleman okay all right the the gentleman y we will recess now until 2:15 we have two votes I need to chat real quick with the witnesses just to make sure that you guys can stay we're in recess 215
