His Highness The Aga Khan

Oh distinguished guests ladies and gentlemen good evening my name is chase friend and I'm the director of the National Building Museum it is my distinct pleasure to welcome all of you to the museum and to this very special program this evening I'm also greatly honored to welcome the distinguished individuals who are on tonight's program I will now invite them up to the stage by their name to take their seats each of them will receive a more complete introduction later in the program allow me to invite Robert IV editor-in-chief of architectural record Charles Korea and internationally acclaimed architect from Bombay India Martin filler and architecture critic based in New York City and our honored guests His Highness the Agra Khan tonight we will celebrate and explore the many contributions of His Highness the Agha Khan to promote design excellence urban revitalization and historic preservation in countries where Muslims have a significant presence in recognition of his sustained and successful efforts to improve the built environment in the Islamic world the museum organized a gala ceremony last night to present his Highness with our highest award the Vincent Scully prize established in 1999 this prize is named after the illustrious and influential Yale University professor Vincent Scully the prize recognizes exemplary practice scholarship or criticism in architecture landscape design historic preservation planning or urban design previous recipients are Vincent Scully himself Jane Jacobs Andres Duany and Elizabeth Plato's I Burke and Robert venturi and Denise Scott Brown as you will learn over the next hour and a half His Highness the agra Khan also richly deserves this prize the museum is deeply honored that he has accepted it and now I am delighted to inform you that Professor Scully is here with us this evening he now will pay a brief tribute to his highness thank you very much your highness ladies and gentlemen i met his highness the alga khan for the first time last night and though I've known his work and admired it for a long time it was only last night that I came to realize what a kind and gentle man he is so this is especially happy occasion for me His Highness the Agra Khan honors this prize by accepting it and further and Noble's the cause of architecture which he has already served so well architecture itself is a mediating art it mediates between humankind and nature's implacable laws and it shapes the communities in which we live together the awards so generously conceived and supported by the Agha Khan do much the same thing they encourage architecture and city building at their best to mediate between the cultures of east and west bringing the most beautiful buildings and the most humane urbanism of contemporary islam forcibly to Western consciousness and admiration they and everything they stand for shine as bright lights in a darkening world they embody the hope of well-intentioned people everywhere for civilization itself for mutual understanding decent Brotherhood and peace for this the Agha Khan deserves our profound us gratitude and we take this occasion to thank him and to assure him that we share his faith in architectures grand and healing role Thank You professor Scully for those insightful observations about the contributions made by his Highness to the improving the built environment and coming from the person for whom the prize is named they carry very special meaning this year the National Building Museum is celebrating its 25th anniversary and what better way to start our celebration than to have his highness with us tonight according to the act of Congress that established the museum in 1980 as a private nonprofit institution our mission is to present exhibitions and education programs interpreting all aspects of the world that we build for ourselves today we are recognized as America's premier cultural institution examining architecture planning engineering and construction and now a word of explanation about tonight's program first there will be a short video that focuses on the AG Akane speaking of this award the world's largest such prize I should inform you that our Museum shop which is located right over there has specially obtained advance copies of an informative book about the current Agha Khan award winners and stories about his Highnesses views on architecture and you may obtain copies of this book after the program following the video his highness and then Charles Correa will give brief remarks they will then engage in an extended dialogue with Martyn filler and Robert Ivy the museum is extremely grateful to monsieurs Korea filler and Ivy for agreeing to participate in this program and we have very special thanks especially to Charles Correa who has come all the way from Bombay India just for this program Robert Ivy has graciously agreed to moderate tonight's program he is an architect in his own right as well as a highly respected writer and editor as I already mentioned he is editor-in-chief of architectural record in early 2002 he published an extent interview with his highness in architectural record since he assumed leadership of this periodical several years ago it has grown to become the world's largest professional architecture magazine in 2003 it earned Publishing's highest honor the National Magazine Award for general excellence ladies and gentlemen please join me in welcoming Robert IV to the podium good evening mr. Rand your highness fellow panelists and guests tonight what a splendid occasion and what a splendid space we find ourselves in we're gathered in and I think in an unusual occasion to celebrate a man whom we collectively admire his Highness the Agha Khan congratulations your highness on your recent honor the skully prize and what a wonderful moment to have mr. Scully here with us tonight for all of our admiration however we share a unique opportunity to engage his Highness any in a frank discussion building on the work that he has done over these years and examining that work and the programs that surround it while his own religious community is Islamic residing on four continents what relevance might the programs that he has established have for our own countries cultures for our own communities what meaning can we draw from it I have had the privilege as mr. Wran mentioned of interviewing His Highness at his headquarters at egg Lamont outside Paris and I can tell you that you're in for a treat because he is frank and open and intelligent in a way that I think will astound you a component of this evening is exploratory and some is didactic all of us can learn more about the specific programs that have led the ARCIC on to this moment and this evening he was awarded the skully prize not only because of his own awards program which we will learn about but also because of an interrelated network of programs and initiatives that affect the Muslim world including an educational component a historic cities program economic development and more we hope to learn more about all of these but let us say that they put what contemporary governments might do to shame to achieve these goals the museum has assembled a thoughtful small gathering on stage and it will engage in a discussion we're going to attend to make this the grandest public space in Washington as intimate as possible and have a frank and open conversation even though we're all admirers we will not quite wash because he wouldn't want us to nor would we will steer our discussions toward reality and the realities of the world so to begin we'll learn more about the Argo Khan award for architecture and the programs that it engages which is now fully described in a video that will see the argick on award for architecture was founded in 1977 to focus attention on the architectural achievements of Islamic societies the award seeks out excellence and heightens awareness of the rich and varied Islamic architectural tradition it celebrates a broad range of achievements from social housing and community improvement to reuse conservation and contemporary design the award is part of the argick on trust for culture that focuses on the physical social cultural and economic revitalization of communities in the Muslim world to qualify projects must be designed for or used by Muslim communities they must also have been completed within the past 12 years and have been in use for a minimum of one year prior to entry up to $500,000 the world's largest architectural prize is awarded to project selected by an independent master jury appointed for each triennial cycle the nine-member jury is chosen by the award steering committee chaired by the argick on the steering committee also set the criteria and thematic direction of each award cycle because of the broad range of issues and locations involved professionals from all backgrounds and religions are appointed to the jury it chooses a short list from several hundred submissions unsightly viewers then visit these projects returning to present their findings at a final meeting this is when the winning projects are selected issues raised by the awards generate enormous debate amongst the jury and beyond ultimately it is this vigorous discourse that is the key purpose of the awards this is extended beyond the jury rooms to publications and sponsored seminars that in turn stimulate thought-provoking ideas about architecture in the wider world the first cycle of the awards in 1980 established themes of social responsibility and sustainability controversy followed when an award was made to a self-help community planning program the camp une Improvement Program in Jakarta Indonesia prior to this spontaneous building was largely considered to be outside of the realm of architecture but with the first award the architectural community was encouraged to reappraise its definition of architecture over the past eight award cycles there has been a concern to encourage sustainable building types that provide solutions for new or improved housing the Grameen Bank housing program in Bangladesh is an example of how a community can be empowered by very modest means as well as social schemes excellence in private housing has also been recognized the Salinger residents in Malaysia is hand-built using traditional skills it has a strikingly modern presence the awards have a long-standing tradition of rewarding conservation many cities have a wonderful heritage that has disintegrated with the right approach and skills entire towns can be brought back to life awards were made in 1995 for the conservation of old Sanaa Yemen and for the conservation of Mostar old town in bosnia-herzegovina in 1986 juries have recognized the social and cultural importance of historic monuments and awarded projects that restore such buildings the great Amaury mosque in lebanon dates from the late 13th century the 1989 jury saw its reconstruction as a beacon in a tortured land the restoration of the 14th century tomb of shah rukh nyalam in pakistan is one of many projects that have seen the rediscovery of long lost crafts and skills contemporary pressures on the built environment mean many old structures can no longer be used for their original purpose the awards have therefore encouraged imaginative adaptive reuse of buildings this building in Qatar was once a ruined palace but is now the National Museum in 2001 an award was given to a scheme called new life for old structures in locations throughout Iran here the country's unique built heritage was preserved through the adaptive use of private and public spaces the question of how to regenerate urban areas has been an important consideration for the awards solutions include the Great Mosque of Riyadh and old city center redevelopment in Saudi Arabia that won an award in 1995 for reinterpreting styles of the past to create a meaningful dialogue with the present other approaches include innovative landscaping schemes like baggy fed dozy Park on the outskirts of Tehran the context of buildings is important whether in relation to the setting in which they are built or the use to which they are put the 1998 jury commended the design of the Lepus hospital in cop Todd Toluca India for creating an attractive and friendly sheltering Enclave within a barren and hostile environment in extreme contrast is the 5-star data hotel built in the rainforests of langkawi malaysia the award in 2001 was given in recognition of its outstanding environmental sensitivity the ARCA carnivores have promoted examples of architecture where the construction technology has seemed wholly appropriate the Hajj terminal in Riyadh was designed to house the million or more pilgrims who make their way to Mecca every year this prompted the design of the largest roof in the world the 1983 jury called the design brilliant and imaginative in 1980 these elegant water towers in Kuwait City were awarded for the ways in which they integrated modern technology aesthetic values functional needs and social facilities in a public space throughout its 25-year history the award has celebrated outstanding excellence in contemporary architecture examples include vid hanbok van the striking state assembly building in Bhopal India designed by architect Charles Korea and awarded in 1998 and the National Assembly Building in Dhaka Bangladesh designed by Louis Kahn awarded in 1989 the building is now widely regarded as a masterpiece as a recognition of lifetime achievements the special Chairman's award was established there have been just three recipients since 1980 the first was - Hassan Fatih an Egyptian architect artist and poet an acknowledgment of his lifelong commitment to architecture Iraqi architect refat Chatterjee was presented with the Chairman's Award in 1986 for his work in synthesizing elements of contextual architecture with key principles of twentieth-century design in the last cycle the Chairman's award went to the sri lankan architect jeffrey Bawa his striking use of interior and exterior space put him amongst the great international architects despite these many areas of recognition the award is still searching for exemplary solutions to certain building types these include affordable mass housing hospitals work environments and industrial spaces as the search for excellence continues the jury of the ninth cycle of the argick on award for architecture has selected a diverse range of building types from different parts of the world in the 24-year tradition of the awards the jury has chosen seven agenda-setting projects that provide yet more inspiring and thought-provoking solutions to the compelling questions in architecture today and now it is my pleasure to present his highness the agra calm honored guests ladies and gentlemen I would like to begin my comments this evening by thanking the National Building Museum for the occasion of this seminar I would also like to thank professor skully particularly warmly for having used this occasion to pay compliments to the work that I have done in the past years I have taken an example from your book people have often asked me why I created this award for architecture and I think the video has shown you some of the examples of the issues that have faced people in the developing world in particularly in the Islamic world as their physical environment changes I was concerned that much of the building that was taking place in the Islamic world had lost its sense of direction there was a hiatus in cultural continuity there was a lack of clarity and precision in the educational institutions that were forming the young architects of the future I profoundly believed that architecture is not just about building it is a means of improving people's quality of life at its best it should mirror the plurality of cultural traditions and the diverse needs of communities both urban and rural at the same time it must employ modern technologies to help fulfill desirable aspirations for the future in Islam the Holy Quran says that man is God's noblest creation to whom he has entrusted this to ship of all that is on earth each generation must leave for its successors a wholesome and sustainable social and physical environment for the reefs for these reasons are bad began in 1977 working with leading architects philosophers artists teachers historians and thinkers from all religious faiths to examine issues in the built environment and to establish an award for architecture the task was extremely difficult and some thought impossible we sought to reshape and reposition knowledge and taste and to change the behavior of those who have an impact on the built environment that meant not just architects and their clients but government's planners granting organizations village organizations educational institutions and builders large and small in urban and in rural areas if we could achieve this there was a real chance we could launch a process that would become self-sustaining to help bring about the truly profound change that we sought that led us on a long journey of inquiry and action based upon a premise which strangely enough was never put formally in writing we were interested in architectural achievement not just in design but how good design could help improve the daily lives of the unit users and beneficiaries it was from this service perspective that the award parameters grew one example was the definition of architecture the users were largely in developing countries so we pushed our definition far beyond the so called architected building and into self-built environments many of them in rural areas most of them poor it was from this notion of service to people that we were led to search for best practices we sought examples of best practice for vast at different local situations from the ultra poor in rural environments to the ultra rich cities and towns of oil-producing States the solutions we found ranged from restoration of historic buildings to the new high-tech buildings of modern societies the criteria for best practice varied to reflect conditions poor communities for example do not have the resources to replace buildings every few decades so he looked to best practice that emphasized efficient and creative refurbishing or to new construction designed for a much longer economic service life than in industrialized countries as the inquiry process became more widely known in the communities where we were focused they responded to us with two basic requests first teach us how to do things differently and second show us examples of best practices in real world situations in response a number of parallel programs were spawned to teach these best practices such as the program for Islamic architecture at Harvard and MIT and the online arch net resource which supports global dialogue and research we were challenged with finding ways of making these best practices available to broad segments of the population in order to have a continuous and positive impact in the developed world that would mean reaching the middle in the developing world it meant making these best practices accessible to the poor we have had some success in this regard through our historic city support program which we launched to develop best practice models in the real world that program has been applied in some of the poorest settlements many of them in rural areas we have shown how human and material resources can be applied to deteriorated and underused cultural assets the result has been new economic activity and a better quality of life so I am pleased that 28 years later we have had some success in achieving our original goals we are gratified that so many others are now engaged in the cause we have created a momentum that has become a self-sustaining an unstoppable force for change in the human habitats of the Muslim world and I'm most pleased the principles we have established are having an impact in much of the developed world as well but there is still much to be done quality housing remains the most essential need for societies everywhere both in rural and urban environments industrial facilities and workplaces are not at a level of excellence that makes them exceptional rapidly expanding urban centers throughout the world lack public parks and open open spaces problems of transport congestion and pollution have too few solutions emerging the growth of slums the consequence of the relentless forces of urbanization has not stopped or even slowed down and although many fine examples of rural projects have been represented in past award cycles still there are not enough I'm also concerned that there is still too little attention being paid to design for communities to protect residents from the effects of earthquakes many of them in remote rural areas 2 million people died as a result of earthquakes in the last century and 100 million were severely affected there are vast populations that live in Seesmic sensitive high mountain areas where we must focus attention and the massive devastation of the Indian Ocean tsunami has taught us a terrible lesson that the destructive power of earthquakes can reach far beyond the initial disturbance it will no doubt lead to new thinking and new approaches towards seaside construction so we are by no means at the end of our task to quote Churchill we may be at the end of the beginning I hope next quarter century of the award will contain as much innovation and surprise as the first to the extent that it does it will be thanks to the many hundreds of capable individuals who have given so generously and continue to give of their time their knowledge and their talent to all of them I am enormously grateful thank you thank you your highness will now hear from an architect who is seated on the panel and who happened to speak last night his name is Charles Correa and as a measure of his interest in this program and this and of the agakhan work he flew from India to join us in these proceedings over these days he is an Indian architect who is internationally known he's a planner he's an activist I first heard Charles as many architects have in public forums in a darkened room somewhere in the United States I have no idea when that occurred or where but I remember being mesmerized by a man who sat there with uncommon common sense he seemed to be able to take problems that existed in everyday life in India and translate them into poetic structures not a small accomplishment and he continues to do that today not only in housing for which he became extremely well known low-cost shelter for the third world became something of he wrote and articulated about in 1985 in a book called the new landscape he's been awarded most major prizes including the AG economy texture in 1988 the premium Imperiale the International Union of Architects gold medal and Reba's gold medal ladies and gentlemen a man of uncommon common sense and poetry Charles Correa thank you Robert well good evening friends and the are begun I think that the outset I want to try to establish something is that and that's this that the award is the Agha Khan Awards in architecture are not something in another box very far away from the world in which we live let's say for me in India it's very very easy to relate to the issues one of the issues which we were talking about with his Highness just spoke about it is architecture as design architecture as development architecture is as identity architecture is not neutral it's not even politically neutral you know you put a Churchill Churchill said something else I hate to quote Churchill but I must say this he said I don't know how we're boarding church over anyway maybe it's a room that makes us for Churchill anyway he said we build our buildings and then our buildings build us and that's a profound statement we have to be careful of what we build because it's going to affect the people who live in it now that's something I can relate to in India it comes really the central concern I would think of the awards I think it's something which you in America can relate to aren't you concerned about what's happening to environment if I jump back to an architect like Frank Lloyd Wright's home of course professor Scully has written much about when it's amazing what right did he faced exactly the same issue how do you invent the way Americans are going to live for a whole century whenever I go to Chicago I go to Oak Park and if ever I saw a brave new world it's oak bark it's a whole century ahead of a young country and young self-made millionaires and it and right show them the way that's what this award is about he built buildings which built Americans differently than they were built by Stanford white who made them like European law made them Americans the way Whitman made American poetry it's not such an unusual challenge it's not just something an exotic challenge with the Islamic world poor things face it's a challenge which we all face and that's what I think is important about this award and that's why I think I can relate to it and I think any architect or any human being relates to it now how did the award get involved in these questions and I think here there are two things first of all I think right from the beginning for some reason your highness you insisted that it should be not for a lifetime's work but for individual buildings and yesterday we discussed this a bit that was a profound decision and it's what change makes it different from all the other major awards which are given in a mob what should I say it's a more generic you can just see this is a very wonderful architect and he deserves this gold medal now in this award you have to look at the building you have to know why you are giving it this award you have to ask questions about it what are the issues exactly so in asking those questions it's exactly what right what Frank Lloyd Wright what Louis Sullivan and all went through you question what you build you question why you think it's valuable and I think this is why this award continues to grow continues to grow in stature and will continue to grow and I think now although it doesn't really apply to them it doesn't address build structures in the West so much I don't think any building in the Western Hemisphere has been awarded except in Paris there's of course so what am I saying there was the the Arabs for the the world demand Arab in Paris there they have been buildings but in in spite of that I think it has tremendous relevance to this to the to these the issues because of the parallel it has now anyway in in trying to find these issues the award then had to learn what people who lived in these parts of the world were concerned about and this is when a whole series of seminars started which took on a life of their own and again I think what is unusual about this award and it's very much thanks to His Highness that whenever you are thinking about something a possibility opens up like a door at the other end of the room and you don't know if you've got the courage to walk through that door because you know you're going to find like Alice in Wonderland another door room with another door you know and that's how I think this grew because there was the the how do you say the courage and the integrity to know that if we have to go there we go there so through these seminars which was remarkable it started in the late 70s on the 18th and still goes on a whole lot of people in different parts of the world starting with the Islamic world but now it's best fast spread elsewhere would meet and discuss what they thought concern them and these were all people who were doers these or not they were architects but there were lots of other people who were social workers social scientists and the issues which came up as his Highness just said but quite staggering people were concerned not only with architecture as and the metaphysics of building but also with issues of urbanization issues of squatter housing these are very big issues and the award had to decide is it going to go into that room into that area because when you go into these fields you will find that the the problem of housing is huge and intense but the solutions the perfect solutions do not yet exist what exists is what I think leucon used to call the first acts and for someone who understood an axe is a stick with a sharp edge and you can you don't doesn't have to be just a stone there's a lever arm so the award they would realize that we have to look at how do I put it it's like you can reward the finest fruit of the top of the tree but you can also realize the importance of new roots which one day will bear fruit now that's very remarkable for an and and that's how the award could proceed into all the squatter settlement resettlement programs etc and it's very unusual for a major award to stick its neck out I mean to go where no award is dared to go kind of thing and none of them do it they play it very safe but we realized that again with encourage with the absolute encouragement and energy of His Highness we went into these areas and and I say we I meant a whole series of steering committees and and master juries which have involved as he said hundreds of people right across our profession and I think to that extent it has changed our profession it has had a big influence I think on that and so I was going to say that really in a way the whole experience and but to the extent I pass twopence participated in it was really a journey into darkness it was it will you had to have the enormous faith that there what it was going to work and I'm so happy and proud that for his Highnesses sake that it has worked that in in less than three decades all this has been accomplished in the field of the of the built environment and also yesterday as we heard for Wolfensohn in the field of human development thank you your highness and now we transform this klieg lipped stage in front of all of you into an in more intimate setting in which we're going to engage in conversation and I think to add to this conversation we have another member of our panel Martin filler you know facts are everywhere today data is cheap opinions are a dime a dozen but an informed opinion is worth any price and Martin filler provides the world with informed opinions he is an architecture critic par excellence who will tell us what he thinks he has done that for the New Republic for house and garden for 20 years and he's also contributed to the New York Review of Books regularly you may have been to a museum show that he has guest curated seen a film he has made or heard one of his lectures he's one of three living Americans in the American Academy of Arts and Sciences as an architecture critic Martin welcome thank you your highness Charles we have things not to solve but to explore here this evening and your highness I must begin with you rarely would we have a chance to chat in public like this you eloquently described many of your programs and your hopes but we find ourselves in a period I think internationally where government is retreating from the social sphere in this country that is true we've seen it in Russia as well large countries small countries and there's been a return to sort of the individual the rational individual is as someone who can manage their own affairs and their own lives you represent a large religious community scattered throughout the world and I'm interested in your perspective on how architecture can work how your programs can interact through a program that is non-governmental how what is the interrelationship if you will of this large and vast network of programs that you have and government today I'm not sure that there's a interrelationship with government as government I think the interrelationship is with the entities of civil society and I think it's the entities of civil society which are going to be the carriers of change in the years ahead in fact this program is attempting to invest in the carriers of civil society it's an education it's in community organizations it's in financing agencies it's in fact it's affecting the pillars of civil society I think which will become the anchors of change so rather than relying on your own abilities you are transforming communities and aspects within communities worldwide and those changes are then broadening out yes we're trying to assist organizations of civil society to set new standards to look at cultural history to look at proper use of resources to look at what people are looking for from their buildings because you made the point yourself that the ultimate validation of a building is the way in which it is used and appreciated by its users we find ourselves Vin Scully mentioned that we're in a perilous moment in the world we've had natural disaster political turmoil we find ourselves at war it's a moment that's fraught with great danger in a sense and and a very serious one and yet we're looking at architecture we're examining architecture we've we've just emerged from the emerge agency in India well just informational e is your organization engaged these are communities that you serve in what ways and now we're engaged in a number of situations were engaged in post-conflict situations such as in Afghanistan we're engaged in situations where directed economy's becoming liberalized economies were engaged in new development capacity particularly in areas such as microcredit so that we're engaged in a number of areas which are impacting the quality of life and the way change occurs and we're looking at countries in the developing world which are exploring new forms of government but exploring new forms of government alone could be a perilous exercise and that's where the there is such necessity to build human capacity to underwrite the processes of change and that's what I mean by civil society I said with the awards themselves let's broaden this to the group now and talk about the Archon award for architecture I think we're all here are admirers of the program that that is a given but is it possible to characterize these projects as collectively and I throw this to the group Charles Martin as well as your highness is it is it possible to characterize these as a group they seem remarkably disparate in scale scope type Charles what what's your opinion of them is a well at the collection yeah I would think that's actually a virtue because it is the pluralistic world we live in the architecture addresses many things technology it addresses history but it addresses aspiration mm-hmm you know and and people have different aspirations he and and I think they have and and you get a great variety of of of architectural projects or planning of housing and I think I think that's very good that we don't have a kind of approved style I mean obviously you wouldn't want to do that right yeah yes in thinking about that I think as a journalist it's it's there's here this group that is quite varied in its scale and scope Martin from your perspective as a journalist writing about and thinking about these projects I'd be interested in your perspective on them as a group what what strikes you about the program or the group of projects well I think it's the very diversity of the awards that I find so encouraging Alfred Barr the founding director of the Museum of Modern Art once said that if 10% of the works he picked for the permanent collection of the museum stood the test of time he was ahead of the game and I must say looking back over almost three decades of the iconic architecture award the percentage is vastly superior to that inevitably any critic will look at any year's prizes and say well how could they have given it to that and not to this one quite frankly I think in the last cycle there was some of us who felt we could really not see perhaps the justification for the Petronas Towers what this particularly has to do with Islamic architecture be that as it may even if one looks at it at a very well-known culture awards such as the Nobel Prize in Literature would look over a century of awards and you think more in terms of who was missing from that list then who was included in it the other thing that I think is so extraordinary about the awards and I think it's a parallel with the icons own very strong personal belief of avoiding a cult of personality around himself is that this is an award not going to star international architects but to projects honoring in many cases patrons the architects of course the these represent them and I think this is running captain a cultural phenomenon of out-of-control international celebrity I've written very caustically about my opinions about the Pritzker Prize by far the the most celebrated of the architecture Awards which to me seems to be confirming the obvious in many cases and it's quite interesting to me that in the 19th late 1970s just about the point the icon award was being founded the Pritzker gave its very first award to the man who they said we must give it to because we must establish credibility for this award unless we give it to this man no one will believe we're serious and it turned out to be full of Johnson people's soul and I think looking back now that seems rather shocking be given the subsequent history of architecture so I think in a way it might be easier for lazy journalists to publicize star or celebrity architects the dumbing down of architectural discourse the soundbite the quick news image feeds into that it's not easy to summarize the accomplishments of this award but once one has a few hundred words extra in your column I think it's quite easy to to to explain it well it is interesting though because every every almost reverse the terms every project has a story and the they're not chosen simply for their formal characteristics which most awards programs recognize which often are based on rather superficial or quick takes by a jury they there's this triennial three-year very careful appraisal but it seems that everyone has a story and I'm interested your highness in your own interaction with the juries and how actively you are engaged I've heard you talk about this but I think they'd like to know how much or little do you know about what is going on is these as these stories are unfolding and over the over a three-year period well let me get back first of all to why the award has got such a variety of projects which it looks at when the award was founded the question was asked what are the processes of change and who who is being affected by the processes of change and the decision was taken I think correctly to say that the award wanted to cover the widest spectrum of processes of change in the developing world and the processes of change are not restricted to the wealthy they're not restricted to architect built buildings they're not restricted to urban environments the majority of the population in many of these countries is rural therefore we took the decision that if the award wanted to impact the processes of change then it had to have the opportunity and the ability to make decisions on all these different levels of activity and this was a decision that was taken after considerable discussion and I hope and believe time will show that it has been correct with regard to my own involvement yes I am involved but the jury is totally independent and the steering the relationship between the steering committee and the jury is a very interesting one because the steering committee has a three year mandate the jury comes in every three years and looks at what's happening and this interrelationship between the continuum of involvement of the steering committee and the one time analysis of the jury keeps the award very much up to date and on its on its feet so in a sense I'm involved with the steering committee and I'm involved with obviously knowing who the jury members are but I'm told about their decisions at the same time as everybody else for good or less good or good or real this year there were seven winners and just to reprise for the group they included the grand library at Alexandria in Egypt which is a bold new building very contemporary very strong powerful formal and also theoretical a primary school in Gondo which was a modest school that I think sort of caught people's imaginations with its own formal story and its human story a sandbag shelter prototype building that could be built in a number of locales restoration of a mosque revitalization of the old city of Jerusalem a very powerful house for two brothers in Turkey and the Petronas Towers in Kuala Lumpur this is about as diverse a group you say pluralistic this defines that in architectural terms let us say Charles among those is there a particular project among those that that you think summarizes ideas that you have understandings that you've seen over the years this program but luckily I wasn't on the jury justify what they did but I'd like to ask you a question Robert yes you know what the point I was trying to make that what's important about this award is what it how relevant it is to so many societies around the world including this man right here yes sir and I'd like you to comment on that if I may ask you and and Martin to I mean supposing we have the equivalent in America that I think just now agh you said I forgot exactly what you said you said I think the switch went out oh yeah it's okay yeah sorry now I forgot what I was saying anyway the relevance for our society society and you have different income groups you got different lifestyles and some of them have wonderful ideas but they get lost in the shuffle because of all the old media the superstar thing wouldn't you be wonderful if you had someone here in this country or in this society or we had someone in India and there are people here for the MacArthur Awards which I suppose do throw a big net and find the best people it seems to me that we all need this we all need to understand the nature of change the vital role of architecture as an as an agent of change as a catalyst because it touches on all these things it's much more than just it's much more than the bricks and the mortar we see it's the passion and it's all the implications of culture etc I would think that's what I find interesting about the award it's not something that's happening in in a kind of Disneyland which is exotic when worth watching and commenting on it's something which you can passionately connect with where we live and I would like you to your I think that part of the attraction for me personally you ask you turning the tables here on the moderator and that's okay but is that yes I knew for instance about several of these projects in fact they had been published in the pages of our magazine we had written extensively about the Library of Alexandria and the Petronas Towers for instance however I had never seen the primary school in Gondo burkina faso met the architect who had designed that school and I happen to be from the poorest state in the United States by birth Mississippi which phases if not analogous situations but there are very strong challenges there and I saw what this individual faced and I was moved by but also informed and encouraged in the sense that real architecture could change someone's life in a small town macand fundamental story the challenge there I think is the tree falling in the forest and that is the icon Awards now through there how many years is this your highness is this twenty eight twenty eight have built up a reputation that does attract media attention but the communication of the ideas is part of the challenge it isn't merely that the award is excellent it's how are those ideas conveyed and how are they perceived Martin well the other thing that I think is important to stress about the icon awards is that they do not look at architecture as an isolated aesthetic phenomenon that's true not only of the awards given very diversely to contemporary design to urban planning to the stark preservation but they're part of the larger icon network in which architecture as it correctly should for all of those who believe in the sociological approach to architecture of Lewis Mumford that it should be part of an economic political and social fabric of society and I think one of the things that make so much contemporary architecture so shallow is that it is focused so so thinly on style and yes there has been a breakdown with the great architectural patience of the past the state is no longer doing that except perhaps in France when you get a president with a with a money yeah you know but you know the great patrons of the Renaissance of the Baroque period of neoclassicism do not exist in the same way to say nothing with what you were about the the retreat of the state worldwide from social issues so I think by seeing and promoting the idea of architecture as something integrated into larger social developments that you can't have architecture without education you can't have education about health care you can't have health care with that architecture it becomes a unified sense of architecture and therefore the works that emerge from that point of view I think are more resonant yes we want beauty do want things that are attractive and are aesthetically pleasing but not to have that as the final goal of architect even your highness in a previous conversation you mentioned in your initial four-way foray into the world of design and the design process and that it led you and I think still leads you if I as an observer into inquiry you seem to be always asking questions yourself what are the questions you are asking today what are the questions we should be asking today what are the relevant questions that continue to confront you and that you confront others with right I think from the awards point of view the inquiry processes have not been able to cover all categories of building and that in itself is a source of concern let's keep in mind that the economies of these countries are changing as they change more and more development physical development will occur under private initiative corporate initiative single initiative and I am concerned that those processes of change should be analyzed and validated so that workplaces become places of quality that's not the case at the present time so industrial buildings commercial buildings the categories types of buildings which we I think need to do a lot more work on public space there's enormous pressure in these cities on public space and yet it seems to me that by tradition the Islamic world has preemie ated public space it's been an area of real importance and I would like to see more of that occurring so I think that in looking to the future there are two areas of concern one is a critical mass of knowledge of good buildings in rural in rural environments for example so that we can say 10 15 20 years from now we understand the processes of change in the rural environment we have enough information to share with rural communities so that we can help them improve those processes of change and then of course there's the economic issue of Industry commercial buildings and housing frankly housing infill is a major problem in our part of the world I want to take those up separately and distinctly perhaps in a moment let's just take the issue of housing for instance Charles you face in India for instance a burgeoning population that will soon be the world's largest what is the role of architecture and how there and how is it addressing as sort of this immense growth that is occurring right under your nose you know it's a huge problem I don't think it's an architectural one necessarily though Architects are absolutely part of the solution I mean we have to bring such skills as we have of organizing space and layouts what-have-you but the reason we have such a terrible shortage of housing in the third world is that with the distressed migration from the villages and this goes for Rio de Janeiro for Brazil it goes for Indonesia for India etc although we knew that the population the urban populations would grow we did not increase the supply of urban land so people became squatters and so the solution is very much has to do we goes way beyond designing a house for someone in fact I I always feel it's kind of insulting you know like if if there's a famine in India and then I run around writing cookbooks telling people this is how you you know it implies that they they are starving because they don't know how to cook they're starving because it's a game and which I'm on the winning side and they're on the losing side and that's true of housing too so it seems to me that if you really want to do something about housing and this will be trying to do even in Bombay you've got to increase the supply of urban land on a scale commensurate with and we're trying to do that with a big mill land in the center of the city which is being contained now when I say urban land its land which has jobs or access to public transport people are coming to the cities not for housing they've got houses but they are coming for jobs and where those jobs are located how you generate them how you tie them back you know in a city like Bombay which I think you saw it's a long linear thing you've got the railway systems which go up they really going up north and but people started to live around the railway stations and that's how Bombay still works people can jump on a train and go up and down it's like Bogota now if you subsidize the the Train you are indirectly subsidizing housing you understand you make the housing affordable so it's things like that that open up land so architects a part of this is out of these they should we should all help with the solution but the real thing is this business of reefs of opening up the structures of our cities we've been very lazy about that we you know here in this country this sentence of go west young man is the most politically profound statement of all because it it really says don't hang around this place use less use space as a resource and we haven't done that enough that's why you get squatters in these cities and Rio de Janeiro but but this gets to one of those fundamental questions about housing and gets back to the program in a sense because housing we know is a confronts the contemporary civilization at the economic the social as well as the areas that affect directly affect architecture planning and so forth the program engages a number of those things that you've described for instance job creation I would assume through historic cities program could you comment on that how you see this interplay affecting ultimately something is discrete as architecture well I I would start by saying that I still think there's a significant disagreeing between quality of life in rural environments in many of these countries and the perceived quality of life of urban and unless there's a better equilibrium which is built into the development processes we're not going to see our village urbanization slow and I don't think it couldn't be stopped but I think it can be slowed by better balancing between the two environments the second thing is that the historic cities traditionally have been transit spaces for newly urbanized populations and therefore they are very often the very poor coming from the countryside going through historic spaces that are degraded by the process of changing hands arrayed two three four years and I think what we found is that if you invest in those cultural spaces you can actually turn them into economic generators and when you turn them into economic generators you stabilize the population that is in them and you stabilize the value of the cultural asset now that does sometimes mean you have to reach reutilize the cultural asset for different purposes and that's sometimes sensitive but certainly in areas like Cairo and I think now burgerbob or in in Kabul we are finding that we can through investment in these cultural environments bring a totally new economic context to in the case of Cairo 200,000 people bagi before it probably will be even more so these cultural liabilities become cultural assets and economic assets if you invest in the most well-known of these situations I think was muster and Mosta was the case study situation which taught everybody else that you actually can convert these cultural liabilities into cultural assets now it's quantifiable that's what's interesting about it it's not that you can't measure the improve in longevity access to education disposable incomes and all those issues Martin this is not the way we normally talk about architecture yeah I was very pleased this summer to have attended the rededication of the muster bridge in which the icon foundation along with World Bank and world heritage helped restore the famous 16th century bridge that marvel of pre-modern span masonry engineering now what interested me as a journalist to go there but it's the very oversimplified story is the bridge symbolizes the the the rapprochement and Christian and this war-torn section and it was almost a cartoon-like oversimplification things when you go there you see still the terrible social divisions that exist there that this is not a quick and easy fix that it's going to take you know many many years of you know concerted economic development the mere fact that there was such a mass migration of the populations there during the war to all parts of the world in Scandinavia to to Texas in the United States a large must our community people who will probably never return there who will replace those people what will be the industries that will replace the light industries that were the major source of employment were destroyed these are many things that tend not to get covered in the general press coverage I mean when we're talking about the oversimplification of architectural criticism you just look at the kind of newspaper coverage of the aftermath of the war and must are itself what was wonderful though was to see the painstaking quality with which the restoration around the bridge took place what the icon foundation did wasn't just to do the bridge which in fact I think was largely an effort world bank which by the way departed from its traditional format of doing dams and other kinds of infrastructure and deemed this thanks to Jim Wolfensohn a special case it was it was restoration but it was also a bridge so they can get it in under that rubric but to see what was being done in the areas around the bridge where the historic structures which will become restaurants shops employers to help revitalize tourism coaches that come now on day trips from the Dalmatian coast with tourists now will be encouraged to stay overnight to pour some more money back into the local economy and this isn't a solution for revitalizing the entire town but the fact that the icon foundation is looking at the the whole context and by the way restoring those historic if not you know architectural masterful buildings in the immediate environment with a care and the precision that they would a masterpiece of Islamic architecture all that gets to another point that you raised earlier and that is that the level of contemporary debate and discussion in fact the other awards programs tend to focus on relatively simplistic ideas style for instance which seems to be the word in coinage right now there's even been a book written called the substance of style in which style has its own value and its own validity yet these awards clearly as you've demonstrated engage something deeper Charles what is the relevance of a word like style in in an say East Asia or in Asia what place does that rather ephemeral sound sounding word have in a place where needs are great and populations are changing I think I think to design so to to create something elegant is a reward in itself I just I mean just because people are poor they don't have to read ivory lives in fact the irony is that some of the poorest societies in the world but use the most beautiful handicrafts as you know Mexico right next to Napa India other places no I think it's it's I don't think they live with ugly things I think in spite of there is you know they do very well so I think there is style there mm-hmm I think what I was saying about housing I just like to return to that is that I was talking about squatters when it comes to to housing for people who can afford let's say a three or four storey building which means break and stuff I'm not wrong but a huge building that's really the middle class and I'm very happy to see that all over the third world including the Islamic world there's a lot of effort made by architects to deal with housing and and that's gone out of some of the best certainly gone out of America to North America and that's a great shame I think Robert the the whole modern movement as you know was fueled by the issue of housing everybody whether the score boos Ava that was the Futurists what-have-you and he gave the energy now so first of all there was an idealistic now today we the the great they're really the most important buildings are museums and airports these are two buildings which are totally culture free there they are greenfield buildings they are unconnected with society housing is something developers do and you despise it that's very sad when you design housing it seems to me when you designer and I'm not against museums at airports I think I think is wonderful but we must recognize it's like producing a beautiful word it exists in isolation housing is connecting words because housing means syntax it's a completely different process it's it's the ability to connect things and and therefore it informs the rest of your work in your office if you're doing some housing it's going to change the way you design that museum it's going to all and the other way around too so I think it's very sad that that practices of architecture which has this big range have becoming slow you have to gradually become very much about this one one-off special object it seems to be and that has a huge implication in this part of the world it and but not in Indian not in in most of the Muslim world not in China you know where people in schools of architecture they teach a lot of course is about housing but it's really what I would call middle class housing it's housing which which people can afford really walk-up apartments and stuff like that so housing is an area that's ripe for the awards focus yes very much and other areas that that you want to see covered or preemie ated through this process housing certainly work bases workplaces industrial buildings I think commercial buildings office buildings is an area that we will need to be looking at also and that is something which might might call urban coherence or urban form but I find dismaying about India and about much of the world is that our cities are getting uglier and uglier mhm and people and adapt to that they don't seem to notice you know and and that's really scary because people are learning to live with very ugly things buildings are built meaninglessly and we have to build up some sort of notice a coherent way of creating those words mm-hmm language yes and and speaking of language there are a number of words that form a sort of lexicon that surround this program that I've plucked here and there from of the publications that surrounded and the conversations that we've had pluralism is one context is another the disparity of urban and rural cultures is another your highness what about this word pluralism you this seems to mean a great deal to you and something that you care very much about and that you discuss could you talk to us about what that particular word means to you in the context of ours yes well I I think the nature of the Muslim world is pluralist its broadest in terms of its civilization its poorest in terms of its language languages its prowess in terms of its physical environment and it seems to me that the cultures that have developed in the history of the Islamic world our culture's that deserve to be respected and not washed aside by some normalizing process and therefore keeping value to historical continuity is an issue which the award I think is felt was was important and therefore this notion of pluralism is really an ocean of respect for cultural identities in in a pluralist form that's the name the notion of pluralism in this environment and it's played out in the very diversity of the choices that we saw on the screen tonight and that have been celebrated in the awards themselves in other word is context that seems to be a word that arises it's been obviously in coinage and favor for a decade but here context what what does context mean to you today it's interesting to me that at the time the award was founded in the late 1970s was a sort of high watermark of this idea of contextualism yeah that was rising up in in reaction against the hegemony of the international style which was imposing a very bland Universal approach to architecture in all kinds of places without regard for local building traditions and even worst local environmental conditions what I think a real complaint could be made and there are fashions we're talking about styles and architecture but their fashions in architecture as well and the pendulum has swung in recent years away from the idea of contextualism which often could get very literal in terms of vernacular very you know and the worst kind of Toytown vernacular architecture now swinging completely away from that towards the dominant dominance of theory and the architecture schools in an architectural practice which in general I would characterize as an imposition of certain intellectual constructs that completely ignore the artifact they completely ignore the object and visual aspects of the art form I would hate to see some of the very important affirmations of context that the award defined in its early years certainly with with awards such as the Masters Awards particularly to Hassan fatty and to the Jeffrey Bawa and to move in another direction I know there's always the fear we want the award to keep up with the times we wanted to reflect current developments we want to encourage younger architects to submit and to to to make their work available to us but I think that idea of context especially in the Islamic world where there are very very sound reasons for the way building forms emerged very practical very environmentally intelligent and sustainable ecologic Lee that would be disastrous if they were lost if the pendulum goes too far in the opposite direction let me bring one final question to the group because the hour is drawing on and this is a word that is much reviled in contemporary discussion and the word is beauty it's one that's whispered among lovers perhaps but I think it has formed a component of Islamic architecture I'm interested in the group's perspective of that word you said it it's an important part of the life of regular people so what is its place in contemporary society this word that I don't know but let's say the architects life it's very very important in what it's what motivates you to design yeah but but in that process you realize that there are other issues involved of development etc but you certainly would like to do something which is very which is very elegant very beautiful and and there's so many examples of it I think awesome parties work is a great example where just using mud he made things up absolutely I mean ephemeral beauty in its most beautiful things your highness what works of Islamic architecture move you what do you love oh that's a difficult question to answer but there are many buildings and and many public spaces which I find very very powerful and it's today the absence of public spaces in the Islamic world is something of major concern to me and Charles you were talking about City Planning I think we are generally speaking in the Islamic world still very weak on landscape architecture planning we still need to do a lot more than number of architectural schools actually are linked to schools of engineering and that in itself tends to bring a form of architecture which may not necessarily be what we would be looking for I'm not criticising that but I'm saying what used to be a great strength in Islamic design seems to have disappeared and one of the issues that we're trying to develop now is to restore value to these traditional and keeping in mind that these materials in these forms are not without meaning in many many cases their symbols symbols of interpretation of the faith symbols of viewing of the future and so on and so forth so I think it's very important that this notion of beauty should be respected and developed now taste changes so I think we have to be careful not to try to take the sense of taste of the past and stick it on an airport or stick it on a modern building I mean I think we have to live in our time and live in the future also and that's why the award has been very careful and and in fact the master juries have watched this never to ignore modern building in all the award cycles that I can recollect there has always been a modern building which has been created dealing with modern issues well with that final remark I think the panel has concluded its work for the evening thank you both thank you your highness and mr. ram the evening goes back to here your highness thank you again for honoring us with your presence and your wisdom it's been a wonderful evening for all of us mr. filler mr. Kriya mr. Ivey thank you for such an engaging dialogue it was really quite wonderful thank you so much and thank all of you for joining us here this evening for this extraordinary program now this does conclude our evenings program but I would ask you for your cooperation and please remain seated while his Highness departs of the National Building Museum thank you for being here have a wonderful evening good night

Channel: National Building Museum

Views: 75,624

Keywords: islamic, design, scully, islam, architecture, aga khan, khan, building, museum, washington

Id: GBMy_AUjyjs

Length: 88min 13sec (5293 seconds)

Published: Wed Apr 25 2012