Getting The Love You Want - Harville Hendrix & Helen LaKelly Hunt - Smart Couple Podcast #227

what's up and welcome back to another episode of the relationship schools smart couple podcast I'm your host Jason Gaddis and I'm psyched to be here sitting outside of a event that I'm leading with the relationship coaches here at the relationship school I'm doing the intro from here they in Boulder Colorado okay this episode is awesome I did an interview recently a live webinar with Harville Hendricks and Helen Hunt who wrote the famous relationship book called getting the love you want and they just re-released it and it's updated and it's very good and this interview is all about the two of them digging into that book and I quote some quotes from the book and we get into a great conversation and because it was a live webinar we had listeners on live asking them questions and there were some really good questions and their answers were awesome they have an amazing story around a sunset that Helen saw and wanted Harville to see it and there's just some really sweet moments that for me as a listener when I was interviewing them it just really caught my cut my hearts attention so I think you're gonna really dig this and pay again special attention to how they interact on the video it's just fascinating watch I always love watching couples how they include each other how one of them sometimes talks more than the other one of them chimes in just how considerate they are I really want to encourage you to go by their book getting the love you want it's on Amazon the link is in the show notes it's a great book it's a classic it's gonna help you they've got some great exercises in there so I just recommend that plus they want to help getting on the New York Times bestseller list and I'm like yeah let's buy some copies let's do it okay and as always stay tuned to the end for your action step because we like to take action here speaking of which the smart couple will be taking a short hiatus a short break coming up soon not to worry we'll be back we're just going to recalibrate and retool some things and come back swinging you know to help you okay and again as always just stay tuned to the action step at the end thanks and here is Harville and thank you both again thank you good to see you yeah thanks for making the time and your busy schedules and thanks for writing this book oh well and updating it I wouldn't have gotten it written without Helen who's my co-author yeah totally many many years yeah I you know I read the preface actually if we can just dive in we're gonna everybody listening we have people from all over the world here excited to you know talk about this book and hear from you all and here's some tips and tricks and techniques that we can do to improve our partnerships and I and then we'll take some questions along the way everybody you're welcome to type questions in the Q&A box or you can just type it right in the chat now Harville and Helen can you see the chat box or is that just me yeah okay you could just pull that up people are just arriving saying where they're from and a feeling words thanks everybody and so what's cool here is when I got this book the other day and just started diving in I read the preface and that was really cool to hear just your journey of with this book together like Harville writing at first and then Helen obviously influencing and then coming in co-authoring this and just all the amazing work you guys have done and so I just wanted to acknowledge you like the journey you've made my wife and I often get in these conversations about collaboration yes well is this my thing or this your thing or is this our thing and so oh I appreciate the modeling a collaboration is more work than doing it all by yourself but it's but doing it all by yourself you don't do it nearly as well because the co-creation brings two minds together and their difference is what produces new stuff so it's our potential in the palais there's a potential in the polarity if it doesn't go to conflict but to creation then it produces something outstanding that can be produced by itself yes you can't have a baby without the partner you can't actually produce that's right without the co-creation so one thing before we get started is Helens word she's gonna have to leave about yeah about 15 minutes early okay 15 so we'll conclude with creating a relational civilization which is folk we're about okay awesome that sounds wonderful okay and I have a ton of questions you know just for the listeners here on this live webinar we're watching the replay when this comes out and we will send a replay out so if you have to check out early or something that's fine we interviewed you here at the smart couple podcast a while back and we covered that was episode 199 if anyone wants to go check that out and we cover I just want to mention a few things that we covered we're gonna dip back into a couple of them but not cover all of them we talked about understanding connection what does a mago mean your response to a imago criticism your how you your own journey which was amazing and how you turn your relationship around the zero negativity stuff and and much more so that's some of the stuff we covered last time and I still want to touch in on some of those but I just wanted to acknowledge that you know if someone wants to listen more you can go to that podcast you can certainly go there website okay so I just want to start with like this this question of why couples fight and early in the preface you say we believe couples fight because they object to difference and they put each other down emotionally and sometimes physically because they are unconsciously competitive this comes from the cultural value system that directs them to compete for the emotional resources in the relationship and to be the that is right will you say this is awesome statement oh he say more about that well yeah we and that question what a couples fight actually began our conversation in 1977 when we first met because we are both divorced and we were sort of puzzled about why we were divorced we thought we were quote good people whom somebody would one live with but we had questions about it so I'm kind of an academic so I look at personal stuff and then asked universal questions about it and that question became a research question that actually produced getting a love you want its first edition in 1988 and we at that time didn't know what we now know we were pretty much in our own journey separately at the time and that later on together trying to figure how come we were divorced and therefore why is anybody divorced and what is conflict all about and we at that time we're locating it simply an unmet childhood needs and so we were with that for a long time as a paradigm until we began to collect people's reports about why they fight and we began to do a factor analysis on them and discovered that actually everybody fights for the same reason they just don't agree there's there's a difference and it is the fact that you know when I say what time is it and Helen says well it's 10:05 and I look at my watch and it's 10 of seven I have to correct her so then so that that minor differences like that is it cold in this room or is it hot well to me it's sort of warm for Helen it's jealous she needs a sweater so difference is endemic in the human situation oh and as we we began to a few years ago begin to consider how quantum mechanics might help us understand human situation better and we discovered that in the quantum field difference is the givenness of nature there is no such thing as sameness in the universe and so when when you get back down to couples and they are fighting all the time and you ask them and you notice them they are actually fighting because they do not see things your way you do not see things their way and difference shows up and it's like I now have to compete to win I have to compete to be the one who is right and therefore I have to annihilate you I have to say you're wrong I have today you're crazy you don't see the world and so and we think that that competitive dominating response is not only psychological but then that's fed by the cultural value system of competition control domination and winning somebody's got to be right and two people can be right over the same thing so that's sort of where it comes from and no one has to come in I love how Harville talks about couplehood is an instance of nature and and then other kind of times I hear you talk about nature is dyadic and so we do approach couplehood as you're drawn to someone very different than you that we call the turtle the the minimizer of their emotions is always drawn to a Maximizer and every Maximizer is drawn to a minimizer and I just thought I would say a little something artful at the beginning of this and that's the Native American blanket that's behind you yeah is the yin and the yang tucked up the black and the white and and the hope would you hold up the book cover it's the same colors is that native-american blanket and guess what we have a Native American blanket almost exactly like that's a hard one was saying that's amazing his room but that's it and so here's all this difference in your blanket and if you're different you shouldn't get along right I mean your partner should be like you and so that's one of the things that if a couple will understand they were drawn to someone very very very different every yin seeks out a yang every every dark seeks out a light and they're different and in you that's the beginning point of learning to work with difference and that's the paradox as you're drawn to difference and then object to it totally you picked the person unconsciously and and then you're mad at them because they're white they are yeah absolutely so so that leads me to this next part of your book here in the in chapter one which I everybody's getting that's sign up for this web class and I just want to thank you again for how generous that is to give us a little trailer of the whole book in case someone wants to check it out first so you talk about a core idea which is basically a mago and you say the core idea is imago therapy is that under the line cause of most couples discontent lies buried beneath the surface superficially partners argue about household chores money Beauvoir outside their awareness however each is being compelled by an unwritten agenda right a forms informed early in life and then you say although the specifics of each person's agenda is unique the overriding goal is the same to experience with a partner the same sensations they experience with their caretakers and they assign their partner the task of making it happen this is where we get set up right partner I expect you to satisfy the unmet emotional needs I brought from childhood and that seems like such a tall order like to to put that on someone else right you guys say more about that well yes so we call that the imago match or the selection process and that it is from our perspective and from all we can figure out looking at it for 40 years it is what happens is that are you in childhood experience the limit on the satisfaction of your survival needs that just they you get some of a met otherwise you couldn't show up and be on this TV show or be listening but you don't get some met with just why you're interested in this discussion about love and relationships at all because if if everything were satisfied then people will be doing something else today yeah so that unmet need continues throughout childhood and into adulthood because the conditions usually do not change that is the parents character and their behavioral patterns don't change so the need doesn't get met through childhood and adolescence and into adulthood so your unconscious mind it's trying to finish this story trying to close that gap of the unmet need and it's also imprinted with the need has to be met from someone or in the brain from the person with whom it should be met ie the caretaker yeah but there's a apparently something we don't understand there is a parent Lee is sort of not it's more like a a what is that an impressionistic painting the caretakers image is more like an impressionistic painting than a photograph so the brain works with approximations and also with the behavioral and emotional behavioral patterns and emotional energy in the search and vine mission and when the brain unconsciously sees an energy pattern and certain character logical features across the crowded room the brain says there she is and what the brain means by that is that there is good old mom and dad or he says there or she says there he is good ol mom and dad so the the the neural chemistry changes and you're flooded with endorphins and dopamine which blinds you to any accurate perception of reality yeah so you move across the crowded room and you carry with you or your little pad saying hey mom and dad you know that thing I didn't get in childhood enough hugging enough attention I contact rubbing tucking me in showing up after school you know all those things mom and dad okay I want them now and it's all out of your awareness you're just simply anticipating this is gonna come from you and so you fall in love with the expectation of needs satisfaction then you go in your honeymoon and you start thinking well it's going to start now right well 95% of all honeymoons are disastrous because you know both people want the other one to pay out and oh it doesn't happen and so you come back and recalibrate say well you know the marriage was stressful but we'll get over it and going into life but that the gender is in the background of every conflict especially if the conflict the accurate thing is of every repetitive conflict that agendas about like you're late you didn't pick up after yourself your toothbrush is out oh whatever it is that shows up repetitively is a current statement of an archaic wish that things were different and and the difference is gotta be by you and then that would meet the childhood need and we want to say more later on about what that need really is because we've discovered that there not a diversity of childhood needs us actually only one and we'll get to that but Helen wants to say something okay so yes I do how'd you know I looked at you looking at me okay I'll throw another three other points right through the first I have to get Jason's permission so Jason is it do I have your permission to give you some feedback in front of your whole audience hell yeah okay yes please so it's just I was charmed by the way you said oh you got to work on each other childhood wounds like that's a pretty tall order to ask someone to heal from anyway it reminded me of a way a minimizer might say that huh you know you've only got so much energy am I gonna have to write and imagine cuz their response it also doesn't work so you're not alone so I just thought that was sort of dear that's a tall order so I'm just gonna mention that um sociologists talk about the history of marriage that merit the concept of marriage has evolved throughout the centuries that there was pair-bonding and people for in the cave people's time they they they came together because there's safety in numbers and they they were called proto know one got legally married but you bonded to be couples for safety then couples and families and then came arranged marriages for many parents picked who you would marry that's the new kind of marriage and then after that people got sick and tired of their parents telling him who to marry and they bought it to do it they it was about them they wanted to pick their partner and marriage is all about me getting my needs met I want to have fun I won't have romance and that's the kind of marriage most people know that you pick someone that you'll enjoy and our theory is different there's a new kind of marriage emerging and it's called the conscious partnership and that's where two people know that they're drawn together for unconscious reasons as well as conscious ones at that includes human the childhood issues are going to come up so period three phases romance power struggle and real love and the third stay to get to the third stage is when you commit to listen to your partner about why it is they feel the way they do or why it is they want what they want and they learn to do something that is extremely important extremely important but also extremely difficult to do which is to love somebody else equal if not greater than themselves and that's a sacrificial love and it's it is very very very hard to do you like it's very hard and of course your partner has to make has to engage you in the right way or you're not going to do it because because no one does that naturally but in in learning that the last thing I'll say is the Jewish mystic Martin Buber said that most people have I it's relationships that I exist and if I'm in relationship with you you're supposed to do something for me you're a utility an utilitarian part of my life yeah in but if a person can shift from an I it to an ID ow where where you become a you're an i and you become a servant to the DAO mm-hmm person that you want to be a servant for that the universal energies of love begin to flow through the to people and then to the space between them but that's where love comes from 20 no that's beautiful Christian religion it's called agape love loving someone equal if not greater that that's what you're supposed to do the Buddhist and Hindu have comparable words around compassion for others at all cost totally what does it take for a person to commit make that commitment because that that's like a leap in a partnership to be able to say all right I'm gonna go I vow instead of I it and I'm gonna commit to just loving you as you are and being there for you in service of us and you know greater love here like that seems like a leap so what do you think what have you seen from your experience over the years of well what do people have to do to get there well I that's a really good question which of course we have been mulling over all the time and and we may be wrong about this because we're limited to our own experience um but I I would say that nobody gets there are hardly anybody gets there naturally mm-hmm that are our unconscious and our self orientation self involvement or as a result of our own needs keeps us in a position of deficit and of saying that what we want is out there and we have to go out there and get it so the only way I think Helen and I would say we have see people do this is they have to get some information and the information has to come to them in a context in which they can receive it which are obviously dispensing of information is like with you right now or with workshops that we do across the country that Omega crapola Esalen and therapy and writing books we consider I think that that book is now sold over 4 million copies so a lot of people are looking for something and John Gray you know brought his books on the shot-blocking limiter for my rosemary book sold 40 million copies he's outsold us and droves but but people buy books because they don't have the answer inside themselves this is one of the great things to know is all the oh yes I know that our culture has been based on the fact that that the inside of us is rich and full of treasures and we need to go in there and find it all but if you go in there look around there's nothing in about how to how to be joyful how to be happy take care of yourself love yourself soothe yourself solace yourself in it doesn't work people I would still wind up depressed and empty it has to come from somewhere else but I say I think education is the thing that's putting information into the public domain about the fact that you have to shift and and then what to do when you discover that the answer is relational it's not individual it is rooted in the quality of relationship and we can talk a lot about what that quality has to be because we've seen that when those features of a relationship that we talk about are present then life changes dramatically your psyche changes and your chemistry changes your hope changes your body changes your you'll live longer and you don't get as sick as much so there's something about it about relationship that that really works yes yeah and if I can throw out one is to not do something that most couples start doing which is shame blame or criticize that anything that's you just have to eradicate anything that's a shame or blame or criticism of your partner and learn to ask for what you want that's the zero negative thing and then ask for what you want in a way that doesn't land negatively totally it's called sender responsibility that your partner maybe maybe longing to to be there for you but if you talk to your partner in a way that puts them down they're gonna go away yeah and hide and so it's and it's not easy to ask for what you want right that sounds simple but often hard well we'll talk about how men are double defended against knowing what they know are knowing how they feel the page he sort of or even know what they want and totally and then women too or not men and women but more than minimizer and the Maximizer maximizers yeah they they just way over function and they're helping everybody else and they're busy busy busy but they don't know what they want either so so that's a real achievement and they can language exactly what it is and we help couples do that know what it is that makes them feel loved and cared about nice and we grew up in families where maybe it wasn't okay to have a want and express it right so then we have this history years decades of like I don't have needs I don't have a want here it's okay and yes it is that in the couple of things that come up this what Ellen was talking is that and I'm gonna say it's a little bit differently I think men don't know what they feel then women know what they feel men don't but neither knows what they want so it's not it's not actually we shouldn't say that it's not a gender thing but the Maximizer it's just that the numerically more womens seem to be maximizers than men but it's just two ways of handling feelings one is expressive the other is retention and that does come from childhood mm-hmm and it sound good allows you to express and you have to select unconsciously which side of the autonomic nervous system is going to discharge your effect will it be your sympathetic side or your parasympathetic side and you learned that if you do one and you get a good response you'll do it again and then you become adapted to like the sympathetic side you expect yourself and but if you express yourself like I did nobody responds that night they shame you then you go to the parasympathetic show up yeah you don't show with your feelings nor with your wishes and especially if you know what you want you're not gonna say it yeah you you're gonna get put down but people don't know what they want oh I think for the fact that what we really want is so on the one hand subtle and on the other hand so obvious that is hard to put into words and this is again we do it we have done over the years of distillation process of like we did was 120 couples fight it's not for 25 reasons for one reason and that is they fight about difference we think that and you you time in if you if you disagree with this but I think we've said this so often what people want is really very simple which is when I'm with you I would like you to be there present just be proud don't be knitting don't be on your phone don't be cooking don't be distracted I want you to be there be present to me that presence is what I need the most because presence means I exist if I'm experiencing you experiencing me that I can experience me yeah as being in I we human beings have to have affirmation it's not like we just like it it's like if we don't get it we don't know yeah it's food it's yeah it's the food of life I'm wanting you to be I want you to be present for me it feels so good yeah so that when we are you know in a working marriage a conscious partnership that hello has talked about the fundamental thing is not that I have to rub your back or run errands or pick up after myself or I have to give you next number of appreciations I mean we'll do all that but if I do all that and I'm not present yes doesn't work appreciation and not present so but what when am present who you tried to just booze it doesn't work with just why you can't have a list of the best 25 things to do because you can do them all and it'll be better than not doing them because at least the environment isn't toxic and there's some nice things around but if I am present and you know that at any moment you can do a signal and I'll be present and I won't be distracted and I'll clear my mind and be present for what's coming out of your mouth or what's how you look in your eyes you're not gonna ask me for a lot of stuff because all the stuff you asked me for are substitutes for being present yeah so over the years we've gotten really clear it's really very simple yeah in childhood caretakers were not present yep even at impact and and it had an impact and that's what's missing childhood wound for every human being on the planet is the missing caretaker whether they caretaker was in the room or not so whether the caretaker was at work or in my case dead no I didn't not my care takers are all gone when I was six that so I had substitutes who my sisters who took me in um in fact my loveliest memory is that my the youngest girl who was 17 had already gotten married took me in when I was seven oh and later I went to live with two other sisters but this a sister who was 17 for some god-awful reason and I don't understand at all was present to me um she seemed to read me and like she would turn down the cover and we lived on the farmers cold in the winter she would you know put a warm blanket on the mattress before I went to bed and turn it down and so I got into a warm bed on a cold night and she would you know she was really Brendan whatever would you like to eat and she didn't say here's some food or you know the stuff on the stove or just put it out she was present there and she had no idea what she was doing I mean she was just that sources instinctual for her yeah it's thankful for her and I had two other sisters with after her and both neither one of them was present service like where am i with in this family I knew I'm intruding in your family and you're taking me in I'm not in an orphanage but could we talk and go I just became competent I moved outside I mean they were my anchor I moved outside got an education and Here I am talking to you oh so there's a good thing about the fact that I had sort of something yep but what what is there and what didn't get clear in my first marriage oh there was no ZnO presence so in Helena in the first 20 years of our life we didn't know about this so we weren't present but once we figured this out it's like a transformation you know walking around hungry all day long because you know if you get hungry for hug excuse me go get it it'll be there it'll happen so I think that we can't emphasize enough the Newmont's and subtlety of the word presence now in a lot of literature on on care on effective care taking has to do with their book the attuned caretaker caretaker and presence as a John Donne Dan Siegel uses the word a lot and his work around parenting so it's really there but it's a very special artistic subtle sweet thing that's what meets the need totally don't have to have long list yeah and then it allows for what you write about in your book here around safety right you're like safety is paramount it's like one of these core needs and if I'm present with you and your mattoon to you and what's going on you're gonna let down you're gonna feel relaxed and held right in your experience exactly presence creates the conditions for safety would you agree well I think it's a little reverse I think safety creates a condition for presence hmm this is where you have to have a kind of technology to practice with which we called the dialogue process yeah when I say something to Helen she mirrors me back there's a structure there she's present to listen in to mirror accurately and to say did I get it and here's more about that that makes sense they can imagine how you might feel well you know that technical mechanical thing is creating safety because I have predictability and so therefore presence shows up as the quality of that interaction yeah and if I have to listen hard to you you're my partner that actually kind of brings me into presence right I have to like do the technique or do the tool and it's like forcing me to pay attention what you bring presents okay nice I want to in a minute Helen I'd love to hear from you I want to just give everybody a heads up listening that we're gonna get to some questions here in a minute for Helen another bowler okay I could take on yeah please do I just think you're both right that presence creates safety and that safety creates presence I think that there's no Sun isolation between this really if you sure want people feel safe and it make it safe people can show up I think you should tell the story of the know of the still face presence don't you did that would be a great instance oh yeah Navin seem to still face but I'm happy to try well oh yeah I think it'd be great story okay just briefly say well I guess there wasn't still faces briefly yes I do you want to check with other people or should we do this now I'd say we do it now cuz we're on safety and then and then we'll open it up to some questions here um folks the still face is and then you can have well the still face is a about a two-minute video done by head tronic at Harvard yeah it's amazing actually you've seen the so face oh yeah and it's basically a mother and a child in what would be called attuned interaction they're flowing back and forth with each other and and copying each other and mimicking each other and pointing and the mother follows the baby when the baby points and the baby follows the mother when the mother points may be so joyful mom's relating their joyfully allies oh and then the mother has asked it asked the mother to turn away and he doesn't put any value on the turn away I do because that's what happened to me in childhood I think after all that I think your problem in childhood was the face without an expression mine was no there was no face no they had turned away but that ended in any case in this particular one the caretaker turns back well model it and she goes into Harville is an infant and I'm and then I just turn away and come back with this still face with the stupid it's kind of a flat-out fact you know expression yeah baby goes into panic and anxiety is just triggered and the baby tries to get this mother to do something your mother is just still face and then at some point her head says hey baby god sakes it's really emotional to watch this by the way and the and and then the mother smiles and then the baby looks for a minute and then they go back I start relating so the connections repaired right connections repaired so Helen is a story about using that with us and it's just that hardl brilliantly took this three-minute video of researchers documenting the socio emotional quality of that's good for caretaking because the pave URIs said that it doesn't matter how parents treat the kids the kids grow up and so this was a contribution to the mental health field that the they had documented that the baby feels so much more joyful in life with resonating parent and so you brilliantly put that at the front of every workshop but also every everywhere our conversation or meeting or show up in a classroom he puts it on or two two-hour lecture it's always at the beginning I just think this guy is brilliant around how to teach relationship and yeah like you said it's very powerful to see so I've seen it for how many years thirty years and about eight years ago we were at a very busy I'm and we had to do a workshop for very prominent people and they had a suite for us at the hotel on Miami Beach where we did a workshop and we arrived Friday night I had a family commitment with one of our kids Harville got there earlier leaving from another city set up the thing my plane got me there right on time to race and go right into the hotel area where we were doing the workshop so I got there right on time Joe Friday night two hours we went to the hotel room they had for us and fell asleep and the next morning the alarm was set but I got up about twenty minutes before the alarm went off and I tiptoed into the suite of the hotel and to get ready for get organized for that day I had a lot of work to do walked in and there was the Sun rising over the ocean on Miami Beach well I didn't want to go to work without going to the rend Oh and watching the Sun Rise and all these birds were like swooping down and look you know saying good morning give the fish it looked like and all these little crabs were on the crawling around the beach and the Sun was rising and all these birds and it was and there were no people on the beach it was heaven I haven't seen a side like that for years but did I needed to go get my Berk and so I was down on the floor hey 20 papers in front of me I was trying to organize Hartl the alarm goes off Harville steps into the suite and says hi hi hell and I go Harville we need to work on this i had organized all the tasks we needed to do that day or at least half of them but then he didn't want to talk to me he wanted to go over it he went oh my goodness Helen look at this the Sun is rising and we usually get up that early so I hadn't seen the sunrise in a long time and you know I'd seen it I mean we had rusher and vendors on that so I started to say yeah I've seen it listen when you're ready let's start and then I thought oh my goodness I'm missing the chance to be by Harville as he experiences this sunrise and the ocean I don't think I have time to go up and stand there oh maybe I've got time so I had this little war inside and I decided to put down my papers get up go over and go ah yes the Sun is rising oh how cool and I didn't mention I had already been standing at the window uh-huh I just decided to be there for his experiencing of it and every time he said something I'd be good look at this I go yeah look at that and look at that and so I I practiced being the animated face yeah of the mother and I decided it was so much fun that I wanted to do that every time I'm with Harville I just if he's excited about something or if he's unhappy I'm gonna stop what I'm doing and be a witness to his experience and it is a lot of fun to do of practicing presence it puts me in a different part of my brain and it's a real fun thing to do and he is a happier partner totally well what an inspiring commitment you know and practice the early fat and so just so much about what presence means is that you resonate with the energy of each other and I remember that scene with vividness it's just a scene of looking out of the window at an ocean but because of Helens affirmation and joining me in that experience is like a double whammy in my memory system so that I want her to tell the story over and over again what's beautiful and it just illustrates why we want to share our lives with someone why that is so meaningful right you can enjoy your sunset on your own but together it's like wow you were sharing this experience and that in itself is an interesting phenomenon isn't it it totally has sunset but you look around see gosh I wish I could share this with somebody you know if you're out hiking whoa nobody was here to see this with me we need to have that resonance we need to be there that's a human they nest on a John that's a human thing and my last comment is I decided to make this a spiritual practice hmm Wow right of going off and having a spiritual practice on my own I mean I could make her marvel my spiritual practice yeah he's got chills I be humbled in a closet someplace when I could work at being humble or or or practicing being present for my beloved maybe that's what I'm born to do yeah to learn what it takes to down here for another person like this if I could be do that for one person maybe that's my calling in life is successful relationship like you're having me tear up over here this is just really really amazing learn to keep love in my life instead of what we used to love each other but it went away right oh maybe my job is to see if if we could live love and and begat for each other no incredible well so everybody listening like type in what you're feeling right now I'm just feeling my heart just blast open person that was thank you for that transmission there and it's particularly like this notion of like what if I made that my spiritual practice what if I made being present with my partner or spiritual practice and just like wow again just big big insights okay everybody just make sure you purchase this book and get out Amazon and get on your website you have a preference yes yeah and the website is Harville and helen dot-com available there plus our schedules but I think the fastest way is Amazon because they don't send it the next day we probably won't get it to you for a couple of weeks yeah so make sure you make sure you get this and again you've got the free chapter here I think it's either been sent out or will be sent out in the replay email and it doesn't come with the rug but you get the book same colors the smart couple podcast is sponsored by the relationship school now enrolling the nine month deep psychology of intimate relationships course check out what Stephanie had to say about the impact of the course from a parenting perspective the value of this is so huge the children are the the next generation they're the future and so I do feel like as a mother that is my biggest job in the world is to teach my children so that then they can carry on the the wisdom as well and that ripples out into the world so it feels big it feels like the work that I'm doing is mother might just be one person but I'm passing that on to my children and their children children yeah to find out more about the deep psychology of intimate relationships course visit relationships cool.com slash DPI are now back to the discussion with Harville hendrix and helen la kelly hunt okay i want to take some questions from the listeners and I can read them just so you guys can just kind of relax you're welcome to kind of scan through the chats if you want so guys again listeners throw in your questions if you've got something for these amazing this amazing couple here so faith is saying how to restore safety after betrayal infidelity and content deception in the face of representation of wanting the marriage to work how to assist my husband to engage and work on personal change so a big way is to say that you're trying to learn to change and that you're interested in what you can do different in y'all's relationships so that he could be or your partner could be happier and and that might take going to workshop to learn what you need to do or read a book and if you talk about if you make it all about them changing they're not going to be as motivated yeah yeah yeah I would certainly elaborate on that that I don't know of any person who's ever gotten their partner to change 40 years guys listen to that that's a that's a bold statement and it's probably true yes well if I want you I want you to change then that means you're not okay right so I'm starting one down so now I have to you know do something and usually I I'm feeling bad because you you know you don't like me or whatever so what what really what really does work is just amplify what Helen says which is I really want to be a better partner for you and I don't know how I've read a book I've done XY and Z and I just want to be a better partner for you and and what what I like to do is become a better partner with you at the time and and I'd like to go to a workshop where I can learn what to do and we can learn it at the same time and and well are you trying to get me to go to a workshop you know because no no no I I just want you to be there while while I'm learning all I'm doing the changing but you have to mean it be a strategy to get your partner to workshop so that they will change and you remain sane and and it often is the case that that is how do you get your partner involved is that you're probably engaging unconsciously and without intention and behaviors that prevents them from being involved because they don't feel safe and so they have to feel safe enough and so if you if you take on the responsibility of self change right yeah more than I can't guarantee it still but more than likely if you start behaving differently like even after today if you said to your partner you know I learned something oh no thing today on this seminar I went to and it was about listening and it had to do with me rowing and so I just want to try this I want to say if I'm getting you I want a mirror back what you have I'm getting you or is it is you know like you need to make an appointment if you want to talk to somebody should always say it's now a good time to talk instead just barreling in it's called a boundary violation and I'm gonna practice this you don't have to do any of it I just want to practice on you so am I getting you blah blah blah mm-hmm tell me did I get you or didn't I get you just tell me that but you don't have to me or me back so I'll start practicing and when you start taking positive initiative like that something happens in the partner's brain anyway when you mirror them the brain has a set of a neurological network of mirror neurons and when you say back to somebody with authenticity what you heard them say those neurons are activated and the brain becomes very interested now in you because they feel seen they feel there's a there's an interaction here and so that's going to route some curiosity most of the time sometimes causes anxiety and the person goes further away but most of the time it arouses curiosity and then they said well main oh that felt really good where'd you learn that let me try it on you but don't count on it in the first transaction yeah several days before something happens cool thank you a couple more thanks faith anonymous says it's the three stages were for you romance power struggle it was the third phase will real love real love hello great real thing that's when we get to a place you guys are talking about right yeah yeah someone here's a question from someone NP saying how to heal insecure attachment you know well secure attachment there's there's practice yes the right name it yeah well insecure attachment means there's no predictability and reliability and what I can count on in a relationship so you have to create a situation in which there is some predictability the brain has to predict to it dan Siegel I probably now is pretty famous for saying do you know why meditation works and people say well it's because of the mantra or it's because of the you know the point of focus and the discipline and he said actually meditation works to Center you and relax you because the brain knows what's gonna happen next well what is that oh well you're gonna breathe out then you're gonna breathe in the brain knows oh the next thing is an out breath the next thing is an in-breath and the brain can now predict that and relax because it knows what's coming mm-hmm brain does not really mix when it doesn't know what's coming and when you're in a relationship and you don't know what's gonna happen when you walk into the room and the kitchen or wherever your partner is you don't know what's going to happen you're gonna be anxious yeah security with your your shield up and if your partner when you walk into the room says hey hey are you doing I was glad to see you I'm sorry can't talk any longer I got to go back to work but they saw you you know and you know that whenever you look at them they're going to say something like that little little tiny flood or a little big flood oh then the brain knows what to expect next time so there are a lot of books out on marriage for a long time this guy is a genius know that structure but I learned it all from you and know this you or the struck directly hydrant I had studied a lot of psychology and before we met and we were dating and after I proposed but so I knew a lot and I was interested but I didn't have any structure you brought so much structure into this system an example is two people listing their caring behaviors that is letting each other know what is caring to them but may be loved and cared about and then a couple deciding that every day they're gonna do one caring behavior for each other or before going to bed at night give each other three appreciations like we are filled with structure which is genius it's just because so many marriage theories are very murky and vague and they want to help couples but it's just wonderful how structured it is and that helps move to secure attachment as overcoming insecure yeah yeah things like agreements and actually reading a book together doing practices right the structure itself can start to create some stability and sun security well and yes and and I would say it's the structuring guide that without structure you never get to security because how security requires is I said earlier predictability I know it happen and become insecure because you don't know back when you were little and a child you didn't know what your parents are gonna do next you couldn't predict you couldn't predict them or you knew that they were going to not be present next and so you had no affirmation the security comes with presence that is affirming and whether that's a child situation or adult situation the brain doesn't doesn't change us needs it just grows up with the need from it's a relational brain and it just needs predictability of relationships yeah cool totally when you're talking about security another person I saw it just kind of zoomed up site I didn't catch the full question but the basic question was when one partner is dysregulated how do you help them get regulated together well the primary thing is to not tell them hey regulate yourself or you're getting upset calm down that'll really just regulate the the major thing is that mirror wing is a good thing some that you can mirror I'm experiencing you right now feeling really upset and I want to be here for you and you stay regulated it was just hard to do in a dysregulated energetic field but if you can stay coherent and connecting while this person is and and mirror them two or three times even though they will say stop mirroring me you know know what you know blah blah blah blah blah say so you're really wanting me to do X Y & Z and you not become dysregulated with them and begin to be the other side of that dysregulation the mirroring actually has a calming effect because it's an attempt to activate the prefrontal cortex and so to move you then out of the amygdala out of the amygdala where all of the emotion is taking place but if I'm mirroring you I'm actually addressing the prefrontal cortex and the preformed cortex actually hears it and that's different from me joining you in your dysregulation because then the amygdala just amplifies the energy but I'm regularly making it coherent rather than chaotic by the mirroring process and that makes really sense it should be really mad right now I really get that and anything else about that that you want to say and you'll just see that the the energy will begin to quiet quiet you have to stay with it oh well I'm tired of trying to regulate you you know and go deal with yourself too long do it yourself not gonna be here anymore yeah I totally agree with our goal it's a great question whoever asked that it's a great question and just to totally let your partner do what your partner thinks is smart at that time and don't criticize and certainly don't engage but then in a calm moment suggest that you both go to a therapist and see if there's a way if the same thing comes up again what should you both do so like especially if the yelling is heard by the kids or neighbors you don't like it you know you can suggest you know two days later or yeah but so later yeah not doing the dysregulation but just say listen we go when X happened and dad I got so upset can we sit with someone and make a plan if that happened again how might we both handled that differently then because I want to handle it better for you and I want what to be a more regulated person for you happy as always I want to own us to have a but the thing that that concept that he'll and I evolved several years ago was and this was again our finally waking up from the cultural trends that sees every person as an individual and even sees married couples as two individuals trying to live together and that never worked because that always had a kind of negotiating stance to it when a quid quo pro type of therapy or even mutual self understanding so what we finally began to understand years ago in our own relationship is this it's our relationship that's the centerpiece the relationship is more important than me or you because the relationship give gives birth to us said it nourishes us and so if I want to take stuff out of the relationship ill diminish the relationship and therefore I won't get anything because it won't be much in the relationship so I have to see the relationship as a garden and we're partners in the project of Co caretaking of this garden yeah we both take care of this and we're more committed to the garden than we are to ourselves and it's a little bit disjunctive because we know that if we take care of the garden it'll feed us yeah so it's kind of a self the self and the paradoxical thing is that self-interest is best served by being interested in something other than the self right that's such an important distinction here and it really goes against flies in the face of the independence in this culture right oh absolutely me first know my needs what I'm doing with my life so here's it here's a tie-in question to this which from Halima sanch how can the concept of true love and sacrificial giving be practiced by someone who values 100% freedom in a relationship My partner values freedom from expectations and only wants to give love when he has the organic desire to do so what would you say to her or him well I would say that sort of has its own answer built in that there's no love their commitment to the self is not is not love you have to love is self-sacrifice not in the sense that you go into pain and suffering it's that love is the sacrifice of 100% self investment an investment in something else not in your partner this is the paradox about it I'm not 100% invested in Helen I'm invested in the space between us and the relationship to Jeff and if I take care of that by keeping a clean of negativity and when I engage discover difference go to mirroring and dialogue instead of criticism then the quality of the interactive space and the energy there's going to be nurturing and fulfilling and I'm going to walk around safe all the time but if I go to me then her brain will be triggered to go to her and now we're in a competitive situation in which we become objects for each other but we want to be subjects for each other and that subject hood arrives out of it's a paradox I'm just amazed at how much in life is paradoxical that if I take care of me then I will not be taking care of me but if I take care of the not me I am taking care of me the best thing in the world you can do for yourself is to love your partner unconditionally I would I two things came to my mind first interesting that someone would say that what was there growing up like for them that that's how they feel like how you picked a really interesting person to be connected to so so maybe maybe something was so painful about commitment or whatever but anyway first I'm sort of reeling with the wonder of it that that's what that for some things and and the second thing I would do is to consider doing is Valentine's Day is a month away and as a Valentine gift ask your s the sky to sometime in your head y'all go to a workshop and learn about things about relationships so you can both really enjoy the relationship to the fullest or you know go to a workshop or read a book or get it why don't we have three sessions with a therapist to learn are the ways we can prove or whatever but Valentine's Day you can ask for a gift you know I love it I mean it speaks to this person is not valuing the partnership right and this person's not seeing that actually by what you're saying horrible of like that the partnership if I put that first I'm gonna get the freedom I want I'm gonna actually get like the fulfillments I'm gonna get a lot if I put that first okay so Jennifer asked an important follow-up question here I thought which was but do you need to fill or look after yourself first like do you need to fill yourself up or look after yourself first no no you can't here's the great tragedy of the value system of Western civilization which is focused on the selfish center yourself is ontological the self is his priority that's a cultural value system it has nothing to do with psychology but it has been transported into psychology as a psychological reality that I have to have to look after me and and it just amaze out everyday you know I look at my the ads that come when you're doing email how many you know those things offering courses seminars workshops all of them are about yet amazingly you can have more potential if you come to this workshop you can learn how to take care of yourself better and how to optimize yourself and blah blah blah you seldom ever see you more and more see them but they're very infrequent a an ad to come and learn how to be a lover right rather than how to get love so that that if you decide it's the same thing we were just saying is that if I we are social creatures and this is also a thing that we only learned in what around 2000 that the brain is a social brain it's not it doesn't grow inside the skull other its own native DNA the brain evolves in the skull Alban infant as a result of the infant's interaction with caretakers yeah you get a brain because you're relating and if that interaction is chaotic you've got a chaotic brain and if it's cohesive you'll get a coherent brain so somehow the kind of brain you have is a function of the quality of the interaction so we are filled up because we're social creatures only from in and only from positive interactions nurturing interactions so we never say go to therapy get well then go look for somebody if you're single this is go look for somebody get in this hellish thing called a relationship with them and get some information about how to make it work yeah and you know your brain and heal your brain because you can't heal your brain without a relationship I think this Helen talked about me being so structured I think some years back I grew up in the psychodynamic world with Freud as my early mentor and psychoanalyst as my early therapist and I must say after 12 years of analysis I was still very neurotic and that they that the good thing happened was marrying Helen with whom the change occurred that I was trying to get done by not interacting with another human being except the analyst and you can't learn how to interact with another person without interacting with another person yeah it's sort of like and so the thing that hit me was when they Jason was and Helena I've talked about this a lot is I finally had to accept the fact that my analytic background which had to do with qualities of feelings and insight and interaction and transference and countertransference and all that I finally had to admit the fact if couples have a good relationship they're gonna have to learn a skill and they can analyze their dreams all they want to they can analyze their childhood all they want to but if they can't talk to each other without polarizing with each other they will never have the relationship with their dreams so we got to teach them how to talk yeah yeah it's very basic and ascendant hit me because I play a little golf once a year and you know what happens when you play golf without a lesson you suck you lose a lot of golf balls and you wandering in the woods trying to find them then you discovered a lot of other balls in the woods too because a lot of people didn't but the thing that's the one that's touched me the most is tennis like you you take a tennis requires you training one particular set of muscles in the front of your arm to move counter-intuitively to hold this racket counter-intuitively that you hold it sort of at the ground in order to hit the ball up and your brain says that won't work but if you don't train your brain to do that when you hit the ball the ball would either go to you know to the ground or off the court marry just like that you have to train certain muscles and one muscle is listening accurately let me see if I got that and you have to do that and then you have to listen enough to over and over and over again after a while you are trained to be in relationship through going through these technologies and you're speaking my language now every time anybody learns how to be in a relationship they have a good relationship because if the REA if it comes serene don't know how they know how to put up the umbrella yeah but you know you can't analyze the umbrella away you can't have insight into it and you can't dream about it and get the umbrella you have to put up the umbrella and you have to know how umbrellas work so most where at the time Helens got to step off here in a minute and Helen I would love you to share you know like a next step or what you guys are up to or whatever you wanted to share here and remember guys by the book everybody Amazon or karbolyn Henricks yeah I was gonna mention that we were told it was an hour uh the last couple days and only this morning did we we're told us hour and a half so I'm so sorry I have to leave but yeah one thing I just thought I would share before was how shocked I was that I I was divorced in my first marriage and then Here I am with Harville in my second marriage and we were so compatible so I thought we'd have a great marriage I mean we were compatible we had compatible interest and my first husband I didn't but we ended up equally miserable and gave up trying with therapists the last one called us the couple from hell you know fired us because we had fired all the others and then when we went to divorce lawyers and announced our family and our community of therapists that we didn't know how to do this ourselves and and we share this at a workshop just so people think oh it's easy for them to do it but it's hard for me and so and it was really hard for us to learn to do it and I just thought I'd share my issue was I didn't really see what I was doing wrong because I was so committed to Harville and I wanted I wanted him to succeed in his desires and I I'm really good at technical assistance with helping other people like improve things so I devoted my life to improving horrible and then you got a good job I fell no I was constantly he could be pointing at his wardrobe me says his that was not a funny joke last night socially that fell flat and he offended the people at the table the night before and he his parenting skills like that's nurse it's whatever and so I was trying to help him succeed by improving him and that's you know I finally one time I figured out Harpo just won me to ask him questions about how he's feeling and how he's doing in his life and he wanted me not to know stuff instead of knowing stuff and I was trying so hard to be a helpful wife by getting answers but he knows the answers or other people will tell him if he has spinach between his teeth it doesn't have to be me I love living a life of just wondering about him like you know he is so much happier so with that I just okay but Harville has a lot to say in the quiz thanks so much Helen great to see you again guys you want more a Helen and Harville here grab their book again it's books it's one of the best-selling relationship books of all time right oh it's certainly among them I assisted a John Gray out solders oh yeah yeah sure but again this was on the bestseller list for a long time and they just came out with a new version so I recommend getting it it's really cool and I love how you guys grow and you keep changing and you keep improving on what you've learned it's so so powerful thank you thank you well we're looking for it was on the mess aloneness it's this sort of a ego thing 11 times and so we're shooting for number 12 that's right let's do it people to buy it three weeks everybody can everybody can help here with just buy the book you know it's 20 bucks all right a few more questions and then we'll step off what guys were winding down yeah normally sorry about the miscommunication it sounds like there was a miscommunication about how long this was going to go so maybe the listeners or you or your wife so are bad on that but will wind down it's just a couple more questions that sound okay horrible sure that's great okay yeah so just a quick thank you for Mirage here saying I just wanted to sincerely thank Harville and Helen I've read all of their books and my now wife and I were deeply impacted by their workshop in 2007 we are in the real love phase and Oh a debt of gratitude to you both thank you thank you Wow makes my day yeah that's powerful okay here's one from Beth I like this one what are your thoughts on codependency is it the product of a Parenthood a patented non reciprocating well yeah what codependency is sort of it's just what that is is codependent one person when persons needs dominate another person taking care of them and both of them have adapted to the need exchange in particular way I learned from Marian Solomon who's a great couples therapist out in California yes I think that she says and she sort of punchier than I am she says well there's such a thing as positive codependency and that's when you both decide that you're going to take care of each other so that I had not heard codependency reframed as such a positive thing before but I thought there was a great deal to think about that that there are that you do have different functions in a relationship that are in which you are dependent on each other for the conduct of the marriage in the conduct of the relationship so that there's is such a thing is pasta codependency but I think they can most people know about is where it's destructive for both persons involved cool yeah and what is the difference would you say between that and say a co-regulation a more popular term now co-regulation or interactive regulation oh well I think to read that's I don't know how all those terms are defined but co-regulation seem to be would not be codependency but would be some sort of positive interdependency and it's kind of like you and you and the exam of the story helen told of you to at the sun sunrise writer yes is like she's marrying you and she's there with you and there's a there's a beautiful experience an exchange between the two of you yeah and if I come the other thing Helen does if I come out of the morning and sometimes I'm grumpy and so she's says hey yo here's your cup of coffee and I'm sensing a little bit in grumpy today anything I can do for you well I'm not grumpy anymore after that I mean how can you be grumpy in the face of a cup of coffee and somebody who says I accept your grumpiness and is there anything I can help you with uh-huh that's co-regulation yeah that's beautiful that's cool then sex is a good Co regulator as well you know yeah each other's feelings and I think the thing that's really new to us and new to Western culture as a result of the AZ of relational psychologies and and also the slow emergence into the mental health field of quantum field theory is the whole idea that we do influence each other I know that in the in the in the model of individualism is that well you know I can't make you feel you know you're feeling that because you're choosing to feel that and we now know that's simply just you know physiologically not true I can make you feel I can call you a jerk and say something negative to you and I'm gonna generate without your being able to control it your cortisol level and you're going to feel anxious and scared and then probably cover that with anger so I've made you feel so we have to really understand what kinds of feelings do we want to generate in our partner one thing we say a workshop says think about memories what kinds of memories do you want in your partner's mind about you create those memories yeah thanks partner thinks about you you know in the way you would like to be thought of and so you walk in and say I love you honey or or you do something and you're creating a memory so that when they think about you they'll think about because fundamentally life is memory and so you have to decide what memories do you want people to have a view and then create them for your partner yeah outstanding that's a quote of all there for sure I love that distinction of no we're learning now with the brain and the way the nervous system works is you do make me feel because we're our nervous systems are bouncing off each other all the time so that's a that feels like a big shift in sort of psychology to be able to recognize that and start teaching people that oh it is a big shift and and to understand you do have a responsibility every second of every moment of every interaction with an individual for how that interaction goes yep and so it and therefore you are Co responsible for its outcome yeah okay a question from Emile Emilia which I know some more than her are having this question okay which is a really common question I'd love to get your response which is when only one of you is willing to do the work is there any point yes absolutely point and years the years and years ago I would have said no most of what I know and Helen knows most of it not all of it comes from couples who taught us how to answer that question and so I got trained by a woman who came to therapy this was a time when I would see you individually there was a time when I now only see couples but this time I was was seeing partners and this woman came and she said my husband wants a divorce he's moved out I don't want a divorce she was crying she's this and I don't know what I can do and I just guess I can't do anything so we talked and talked to talks in I commit her commiserated with her and finally I said well listen you really want your husband well let's figure out what can you do and so that's what is he loved it anyway we worked it out so that she created a set of rituals whenever he came over to get the kids on the weekends of how he would be received in the house and one of them was she didn't like him smoking this was back in the old days when smoking wasn't all that bad yeah and and but he smokes cigars and so she didn't want the cigar smoke in the house and so he had always smoking cigars outside in the yard or on the porch so she said you know what I'm gonna do I'm gonna get his box of cigars and put him in the refrigerator so I can keep them cool that's where he likes to keep them so when he comes over he always goes and gets water I drink a glass of water I don't know why but he always gets water I'm gonna put the cigars right beside the water so for three weeks he comes over gets this water sees the cigar says nothing fourth week he comes over and he says what are my cigars doing beside the water in the refrigerator and she said well you know I'm so glad you asked all the years we live together I always rejected your smoking in your cigars in another house and I discovered I made cigar smoke more important than you and I have changed that you're more important than me and if you want to smoke cigars you smoke cigars you can have the box of cigars you can smoke one here you can smoke in whatever you want to there are a lot of other things that I said you can't do or you have to do that were just more about me than about you and I'm changing all that you could still stay away and have a divorce but I want you to know I've learned my lesson I would like for you to come home and so and he said well ok you went away didn't say much well it's interesting he started coming over a little more frequently and then one day he did take a cigar and he did smoke one but he said you know what I know it makes the house smell I'm gonna go out on the porch and smoke and come back in and talk well at about 6 months he moved back so the thing I learned was sure you can make a difference but you have to be different yeah you have to send different signals create a different energy field one in which the person and but it's simple in which a person feels safe rather than judged Helen likes to use the word and I love it curiosity rather than judgment and you create safety and therefore you have engagement yeah we'd say yes one person can change one person can change the world certainly one person can change the relationship that's awesome and I kind of the bottom line there I got was yes it there is a point and but for the first move for you Amelia or anyone like you is to accept your partner as they are exactly right otherwise if you reject them they're not coming home yeah yeah that's big and that's that's challenging to do right it's back to that conversation around it we had earlier around love like how hard love can be to love someone yeah well it is and what what has to happen at the psychological level is we call it shifting from symbiosis to differentiation because symbiosis means I made up made you up you're my partner and I've saddled you with my picture of you and therefore my picture of you expect certain things from you and you don't do them so we have to know that any triggering we have of our partner is a triggering of our partner because they're not matching the idealized image yep you have to let it go it's called differentiating until your partner can emerge from the cloud of our own constructions so we can see them face to face as they really are and be curious about them and value them and and see the wonder of them have every every partner every person is amazing just the fact that your human being is amazing just think about it you you and I are looking at each other right now through in each other's eyes through a technological process isn't that amazing it's amazing every human being is amazing and if you look at your partner with curiosity and see them as a wonder then something happens inside them and simultaneously in you right because we are so Co interactive that whatever you do for your partner is done to you at the same time whether it's negative or positive yeah Wow huge okay that's a great note to end on why don't we wrap up with just sharing a little bit more Harville anything else you want to say about the book just any final parting thoughts here well I think the major thing we would would say is that we are decided that the book would not be changed too much because it had the fundamental structure but but we did emphasize that the concept of connecting as our true nature then joyful aliveness is the experience you have when you're connecting gets kind of filtered through the book and mitigates a bit of the things that we're a little dated in 1988 that was more focused on the individual so that we really made the relational piece of it now clear enough that it's hopefully presentable and we are looking forward to having it back on the bestseller list that would be fun for the 12th time and the we change some of the exercises at the end so that they actually help people think more about how to be in relationship rather than how to take care of yourself and because we found that's the way you take care of yourself is the relationship and a relationship huge yeah and there's a ton of exercises in here everybody it's really awesome it's chocked full of stuff to practice that's real street level stuff horrible man thank you and Helen I just really appreciate the the tremendous value you bring to the world around love and connection and relationships thank you very much for having us on this was fun always fun to see you oh and we take care and we'll see you down the path and enjoy that rug okay thanks man everybody you can catch the replay we'll send out an email that'll be up for a few days and remember the web site Harville and Helen com remember to buy this on amazon.com I should be able to get it anywhere yes right all right thanks árbol bye thank you bye bye okay Harville and helen amazing they are legends in this space and lots to learn from from these two action steps go by their book getting the love you want the newest version check it out leave them a review if you like it if you actually practice and use some of the exercises in the book and then I loved what the action stuff was the last time we met with them and I want to reiterate it go zero negative we didn't talk about it in this interview but it's a great practice to just say honey you and I were just not gonna blame and if you're single you do that just in your own head and with your friends like look I'm just gonna set down blame and I'm not going to blame my closest person in my life instead I'm going to look in the mirror okay no blame just try for one week right kind of like our five day challenge hopefully some of you got a lot out of that okay last call for enrollment in the deep psychology of intimate relationships nine-month training this is the class you never got in school but should have do you want to be a relational follower or a relational leader in your family in your home in your community well if you want to be a relational leader you got to do the work okay you can't continue to think you know about relationships and then when you under stress you just go back to your childhood patterns of what you learned right okay if you want to apply there's still time okay relationships cool.com /dp ir that's where you can read about it and apply but we start at the end of the month and we are on our way this ship will have left the harbor and the next time you can join us is in the fall okay thanks again for your ears and again a heads up and I thank you the heads up is that we're gonna take a little breather from the podcast there may be one more episode there may not be we'll be back I'll be back for sure just need to recalibrate there's some new things that I want to talk about and a new way in which I want to talk about it and it's exciting the what we're doing here at the relationship school and again thank you so much for listening if you can leave us a review on iTunes that's super helpful for us I like to read those from time to time and just also want to thank Hannah who's been our podcast producer for quite a while now so Hannah thanks so much for all your hard work here and is moving on to greener pastures and I wish you well thanks again okay everybody here's to a awesome relationship day make it so hey thanks so much for listening relationship school fans and smart couple listeners please subscribe to this YouTube channel alright do us a favor subscribe share one of these videos with a friend alright we want to help the planet get their act together around relationships and you are one of them so thank you

Channel: Jayson Gaddis

Views: 24,763

Keywords: marriage help videos, how to fix your marriage, how to fix your relationship, Getting The Love You Want, Harville Hendrix, Helen LaKelly Hunt, Smart Couple Podcast, relationship advice, couples therapy, webinar, the relationship school, imago therapy, imago, jayson gaddis, how to have a better marriage, self care, interpersonal neurobiology, neurobiology, relationship help

Id: yC17dUwWyCw

Length: 93min 57sec (5637 seconds)

Published: Thu Jan 24 2019