Frankly Speaking With Rahul Gandhi - Full Interview | Arnab Goswami Exclusive Interview

Rahul thank you very much it's great to have you on the Frankly Speaking show today thank you very much indeed it's been 10 years and as an MP for you you fought your first election in 2004 and this is your first DV interview your first interview well it's it's not my first interview but it's my first formal interview of this type yeah why has it taken so long well I've done a lot of media interactions prior um I've done press conferences and I've spoken to the media but mainly my focus the bulk of my focus um has been in internal party work and that's where I've been concentrating so that's that's where most of my energy was going or is it that you've been reluctant to communicate more on a on toone pis no not at all I've I mean I've had many many press conferences that you've seen sir I don't it's not that you wanted to avoid touching on difficult or tough issues no I mean I like difficult or tough issues I like dealing with that so now that this is your first detailed and long interview round in 10 years we have a lot of ground to cover sure so I have one request to you right at the start that let's be as specific as possible on the subjects that we deal with today do I have your agreement on that yeah I mean we'll be we'll be specific but um if I if if I would like to sort of explain things in a bit in a broader fashion I think uh okay that would be okay with you and if I want to draw you back into can draw me back as much as you want okay so Rahul Gandhi the first point is this that you've just avoided this whole question about whether you're open for the prime minister's post yeah uh it seems to me yeah Rahul that you're avoiding a difficult contest see um if you look if you look at the speech I gave in the aicc just a few days back the issue is basically how the prime minister in this country is chosen where the prime minister is chosen in this country is through the MPS we the our system basically chooses MPS and then the MPS elect the Prime Minister I said pretty clearly uh in my speech in AIC that if the congress party so chooses and the congress party wants me to do any anything for them I'm happy to do that uh is respect for the process in fact uh announcing your prime minister prior to an election announcing your prime minister without asking the members of parliament uh is not actually was written in the consti you did that in 2009 no we didn't of course you did uh no what what we did in 2009 um was that we had an incumbent prime minister um prime minister won the election he he then went to Parliament the members of parliament decided that that prime minister was going to continue and there was actually a process where he was asked they were you named your Prime ministerial candidate R that's that's that's we had we had we had an incumbent prime minister uh and there was no question of our changing him see ra we can go up and down on this question the fact of the matter is this who else will they choose who else will Congress MPS choose but Rahul Gandhi that's that's up to them right but what what one has to do and I think this is this is Central to what I keep saying is democracy is about respect of processes democracy is about nonarbitrary decisions democracy is about spreading decisions it's not about destroying processes there is a process in the Constitution that process says and it's clearly written in the Constitution it says members of parliament are to be elected by the population and members of parliament are to elect the prime minister all I'm doing is respecting that Pro are you avoiding a direct face off with Narendra Modi is there is there a fear of loss Rahul because this election frankly is not looking very good for the congress party from overall estimates and the belief the growing belief is that if Rahul Gandhi has not picked up the challenge officially that means there is a fear of loss he's avoiding a direct one-on-one battle with Mr Narendra Modi R you must answer that now to to to understand that question uh you have to understand a little bit a little bit about what uh Rahul Gandhi is and what Rahul Gandhi's circumstances have been uh and if you if you delve into that you'll get an answer to the question of what Rahul Gandhi is scared of and what he's not scared of so if I mean the real question right is what I'm doing sitting here uh you're you're a journalist when you were small you must have thought to yourself um I want to do something right you you you decided to become a journalist at some point why did you do that you're asking me the question asking you the question there a conversation because you because I because I like because I like and enjoy being a journalist and because it is a professional challenge for me my question to you is Rahul I'm are you avoiding a direct face off with I'm going to answer the question but I just want to ask you when you were when you were young and you thought about being a journalist what was what drove you once I decided to become a journalist I cannot be half a journalist once you've decided to get into politics and you are leading your party effectively you can't be leading your party by half so I throw the question ra with respect back at you and my question to you is Narendra Modi is challenging you on a daily basis so I I'll I'll answer you're not answering the question I asked you but I'll answer I'll answer the question uh that will give you some insight into what how Rahul Gandhi thinks okay and for that I'll have to expand a little bit about my growing up how I grew up the circumstances I grew up in what I saw when I was a child was my father who was a pilot and because of circumstances was thrown into the political system and all I saw when I was small after after my grandmother died was my father in constant constant combat with the system uh in India and then I saw him um I saw him die actually right in my in my in my life I've seen my grandmother die I've seen my father die I've seen my grandmother go to jail and I've actually been through a tremendous amount of pain when as a child when these things happen to you I mean there's absolutely no there's what I had to be scared of I lost there's absolutely nothing I'm scared of though there's I have an aim I have a clear aim in my mind and the aim is that I do not like what I see in Indian politics it's something that is inside my heart it's like when you know in in our mythology when they talk about when they talk about Arjun he only sees one thing he doesn't see anything else uh you asked me about Mr Modi you asked me about anything I'd only see one thing and the thing I see is that the system in this country needs to change I don't see anything I'm blind to everything else okay I'm blind because I saw people I loveed being destroyed by this system I'm blind because this system every day is unfair to our people I asked you today you come from Assam um you know and I'm sure that you also in your work feel the unfairness of this system and you're not going to answer my question so we're not going to go there but this system every day every day every day every day hurts people okay and I felt the pain that this system can cause I felt the pain with my father I saw him every single day of his life so the question of whether I'm afraid of losing an election or whether I'm afraid of Mr Modi or whether I'm afraid of these things is I mean it's not one second let me is not actually the point what I want to do I'm here basically for one thing I see tremendous energy in this country I see more energy in this country than I see in any other country I see billions of youngsters and I see that this energy is trapped and this energy is trapped for a couple of things and this energy can I draw you back to my question I I will I will go into those areas and I respect what you're telling me about your personal Journey it's not Rahul as if I lack empathy for what you're saying in fact I'm sure many people do too but my question to you is Narendra Modi calls you a shahada now let's be very specific R Narendra Modi calls you a shahada what is your view of Narendra Modi a b are you afraid of losing to Narendra Modi Rahul please answer my question as specifically as you can what Rahul Gandhi wants to do is Rahul Gandhi and millions of youngsters in this country want to change the way the system in this country Works what Rahul Gandhi wants to do is empower the women in this country wants to unleash the power of these women I mean we talk about we talk about being a superpower you're avoiding my not avoiding a question my question to you is what is the Congress vice president's view of the bjp's Prime ministerial candidate I think we'll defeat the BJP in the next election and what is your view of the bjp's primee ministerial candidate the BJP has a prime ministerial candidate the BJP believes in concentration of power or uh in the hands of one person I fundamentally disagree with that I believe in democracy I believe in opening up the system I believe in the RTI I believe in giving power to our people we have fundamentally different philosophies what is your view would you like to expound your views the Prime Minister the your prime minister accuses Narendra Modi in his press conference yeah of priding over and I quote the Mass Massacre of innocent citizens on the street of Ahmedabad Mr Rahul Gandhi my question to you is this do you agree with your prime minister when he says that well I mean what what the prime minister is saying is a fact I mean Gujarat happened people died but the real issue as far as I'm concerned how do you accuse the Mr Narendra Modi of it no Gujarat happened people died the real issue at hand here how is Mr Modi responsible for it uh he was chief minister in Gujarat happen the fact remains that Narendra Modi has been given a clean in the gulberg massacre Case by the sit and the the court Mr Gandhi my question to you is can the congress party sustain its attack on Mr Narendra Modi on this issue when he has been given the clean chit by the courts in the Gujarat rights Mr the Congress par is the congress party and the BJP have two completely different philosophies our attack on the BJP is based on the idea that this country needs to move forward democratically it needs to push democracy deeper into the country it needs to push democracy into the villages it needs to give women Democratic power it needs to give youngsters Democratic power it is about opening the doors of the congress party about empowering the youth is nendra Modi responsible for the Gujarat rights when the courts have given him a clean Chet politically your party stack is to criticize Narendra Modi and draw him into the Gujarat right our political party is fighting an ideological battle against the BJP and let me draw out the two pillars our party believes that women should be empowered that democracy should go to every house that the RTI the Nara Paradigm should be further expanded the BJP believes that power should be extremely con uh concentrated in this country few people should run this country and the large mass of people in this country should should have no voice but specifically speaking how is Narendra Modi your party criticized him for the 2002 Gujarat RS how can you do that when he has been given a clean sheet in the gulberg massacre by the sit at the court he was challenged in the court the court upheld the sit findings and therefore te legally speaking Mr Rahul Gandhi you cannot draw Narendra Modi into the Gujarat rights implicate him personally do you believe that strategy of your party is fundamentally wrong the strategy the strategy of my party is very simple everything that we have done over the Last 5 Years okay 10 years in fact if you look all the way back to the Freedom Movement every single thing we've ever done is Empower people people okay we impart people in the Freedom Movement we impart Farmers by in the Green Revolution we impart the citizens of India uh when we did the Telecom Revolution we've imparted millions and millions of people through frankly the most powerful the most powerful legislation that has been that has ever been has taken place in this country called the RTI right to information things that used to be closed things that were in closed doors that nobody knew about I'll come to that but you haven't answered my question Gujarat RS Gujarat RS is the question you your party has consistently wanted to put Mr Narendra Modi on the back foot on the Gujarat right he says he says the courts have given me a clean chip and and I'm asking you today is your party's argument about putting him on the back foot on the Gujarat RS flawed given the way the courts in uh the Prime Minister stated his position on the Gujarat RS the Gujarat RS took place people died Mr Narendra Modi was in charge of gu Gujarat at that point I'm bringing you to the real ideological battle that is taking place here the real ideological battle that is taking place here and the one we are going to win and that has always been one in this country is the Battle of empowering people in this country of course there is uh your point about the Gujarat rights and it is very important that people who have taken part in this type of thing are brought back are brought to B but the real issue at hand here is empowering the women of this country giving them true power we we talk about uh superpower we talk about super power India being a super super power uh we can only be half a superpower if our women are not owered right what I want to do going forward is basically focus on three things focus on empowering our people truly empowering our people giving them giving them Democratic rights within the political party I want youngsters who come in and really really push democracy in the party I want to empower them and I want to make India together with everybody taking everybody together I want to put India on the man manfacturing map I want to make this the center of manufacturing in the world I want to make this place at least as much as the manufacturing power as China Mr you say that Narendra Modi was chief minister during the Gujarat riots the BJP was in par the BJP was as much in power in Gujarat during the riots right as akilesh is in power in utar Pradesh or for that matters the congress party was in par when the 1984 anti-s riots happened now let me quote you spoke in one of your speeches of the anger of your grandmother's death I think it was on the campaign Trail in Rajasthan you spoke about knowing the people who killed her and you spoke about anger and managing your own anger and quelling your own anger and drawing it into strength elsewhere now that speech of yours became a subject of controversy with Narendra Modi posing a series of questions to you 84 and he said the following and I want to quote him and I want your categorical and specific response he says he's crying for the assassination of his grandmother but has he shed tears for those killed in the 1984 riots I want to ask the shahada and he remember Mr Gandhi he's constantly deriding You by calling you a shahada whether your party killed siks in Anger when your grandmother died so following from this I have two questions my first question is do you acknowledge the role of Congressman in the 1984 riots B will you apologize for the riots as your party demands an apology from Modi for the Gujarat RS well well two things uh in 1977 um when my grandmother lost the election we went um and lived in 12 bill in gring and the the people who came with my grandmother those people who stood by my grandmother were six uh pretty much everybody had deserted my grandmother but the siks were standing with my grandmother okay uh I think the siks are probably one of the most industrious people in this country I I admire them we have a prime minister who's a seik see I don't have the same uh world view as my opposition what those two people did to my grandmother right was two individuals I don't turn around and take my anger which existed then frankly doesn't exist now and brush it onto an entire Community U that's just not mean I'm sure you don't but my question was my question was do you acknowledge the role of Congressman in the 1984 acts because there must be Justice Mr Gandhi there has to be finality the Gujarat riots cases have moved forward and many people have got Justice if I just compare that to the 1984 riots you can look at the status and case history of what happened with sajan Kumar Jagdish titler hkl bagat damash shastri and the one one story which you hear there is that the cases are endless they go on for the longest period of time I'm asking you again Mr Gandhi before you seek an apology from Modi would you apologize for the 1984 RS would that be something you consider I was I do not take my anger which existed on two people two individuals who did something uh evil and wrong and overlay it on millions of people I think that's that's criminal okay uh did the seek riots take place in Delhi absolutely were they completely wrong absolutely were Congressman involved did innocent people die absolutely were congressmen involved some congressmen probably were involved but have they been has Justice been delivered to there is a legal process through which they have gone you admit some congressmen were probably involved I mean some congressmen have been punished for it in that case why don't you apologize for the 1984 rats no so I'm the congressman who you are talking about are still fighting their cases and in 2009 if I'm not mistaken Jagdish titler Mr Rahul Gandhi was going to get nominated as a congress candidate it was only following the media media furor that his nomination was taken back Mr Gandhi I'm asking you this question with with all seriousness do you feel that congressmen were involved and two do you believe that you personally if you apologize for the rights there will be a final fact the fact of the matter is that innocent people died in 1984 and innocent people dying is a horrible thing and should not happen Okay the difference between Gujarat and 1984 was that the government of Gujarat was involved in the riots the government how do you how do you say that I mean the chief minister of Gujarat has been given the clean by the courts the the government of the difference between the 84 riots and the riots in Gujarat was that in 1984 the government was trying to stop the riots I remember I was I was a child then I remember that the government was doing everything it could to stop the riots in Gujarat the opposite was the case the government in Gujarat was actually abetting and pushing the riots further so there's a there's a huge difference between the two things saying that innocent people dying is absolutely wrong explain that government of government of Gujarat was aiding and abetting the rights is what you just said explain that I mean it's not me it's it's large numbers of people who were there it's large numbers of people who saw actively the government of Gujarat uh being involved and you keep that line despite the chief minister getting a clean shet from the courts I mean people saw it I'm not the person who saw it your colleagues saw it your colleagues told me they saw riots they didn't see the government of guat they saw the administration they saw the admin rtion actively attacking minorities are you saying the government of Gujarat was what what are you what is I'm saying is that the there was a difference between the 1984 riots and the riots in Gujarat the difference was that the government in 1984 was trying to stop the riots was trying to stop the killing whereas the the government in Gujarat was allowing the r if you how was if the government in in in in in Delhi and in the center was trying to stop the riots in 1984 then tell me how is it possible that sajan Kumar was named in FS on grounds of inciting violence in outer Delhi leading to the murder of ss the status of the case is known how is Jagdish titler accused of inciting the mob at pul bangash leading to murder and rioting in the area how is the late hkb accused of inciting violence and you know that appeal in the Delhi high court was closed after his death how did these Congress leaders do what they did allegedly if the government was so strongly and proactively act there a process there's a there's a legal process and that process is on there was an sit finding it was challenged by Zakia jafi it went up there and the courts upheld what the sit found are you questioning the wisdom of the courts Mr all I'm saying all I'm saying is that there is a difference between the 1984 RS and the Gujarat RS the simple difference is that in 1984 the government was not involved in the massacre of people in Gujarat it was the question is why do these type of things take place why is it that the Gujarat riots take place the Gujarat riots take place frankly because of the way our system is structured because of the fact that people do not have a voice in the system and what I want to do and I've said it and I will say it again what I want to do is question the fundamentals over here what I want to do is ask a couple of questions I want to ask why uh candidates that are chosen in every single party are chosen by tiny number of people mhm I want to ask why women have to be uh scared to go out in the street I want to ask these questions these are fundamental questions I I appreciate that you believe in transparency I'll move away from Gujarat though I must say that I not found this comparison between 84 and Gujarat rights that there are two different cases u i mean I can't take this at face value Mr Gandhi and the reason for this is because in both cases the government the accusation is that the government could have done a little bit more but at the same time I want you to once more if you can substantiate you stand by what you said that you believe the chief minister and the government of Gujarat played a role in abetting the RS you you stand by what what I'm saying is there is a difference between the 1984 RS and the Gujarat RS the difference is that the government of the day in 1984 was not aiding and abetting the RS that's all so you don't need to apologize for the 84 rats if someone seeks an apology from you will you give it your prime minister has apologized for the rights Express deep regret will you do the same the first of all I wasn't involved in the riots at all I mean it wasn't that I was part of it on behalf of your party I think I think the riots were uh uh were not as all riots were a horrible event now frankly I was not uh in operation in the congress party Mr Gandhi uh let's move on to the RTI which is the single big legislation to combat corruption which you said in your speech uh at the AIC uh that was uh something that you were speaking about now I would I find it uh ironical that a party which has 99.38% of its funds from cash between 2008 and 2012 89.1% of its money in this period comes from unaccounted sources unnamed sources why would you not say charity begins at home and let's put the congress party and its funds under the scanner of the RTI I mean why would you not bring the same freshness of perspective in this case as you brought when you dealt with the issue of the ordinance I think political parties should be under RTI if political parties feel and it's a law that has to be passed in Parliament if political parties unanimously feel that that is the case it should be the what will be your view on it my position my position is uh that the more openness the better your own view personal view is that political parties should be under the RT the issue is this laws in this country are passed by parliament what one needs to do is pass a law in Parliament that brings RTI into the political party I have a personal view on it but you have to take that view through Parliament I have a view also for example on the six bills that are sitting in Parliament I'll come to that but my question is on the RTI I want your view on it Mr rul Gandhi you are a very influential politician you you you have you have demonstrated some of your actions in the past that what you you say and do can influence decisions in government and in Parliament so my question to you is very significant you said that on in the aicc you said we enacted this revolutionary law to hand you power knowing fully well that it would place our own government under severe scrutiny I agree with you what about placing your own party under scrutiny so are you open to that I am I am I the first person who has been saying over the last uh 5 years talking about transparency in the party I have made the youth congress and the nsui fully elected Bodies Okay uh I have spoken about the six bills in Parliament I have spoken about uh the loal bill and I have pushed the local Bill I'm I was involved in the RTI we worked together to bring the RTI so as far as transparency in the political part is concerned I am absolutely for transparency there is a question there is a question about there are questions about the RTI that need to be discussed and thought through the real question is that are our system is based on different pillars and the question is which ones of these pillars should have RTI because if you if you only put RTI into one pillow and you don't have rti in for example the Judiciary and the press and in other areas then you might create an imbalance am I for opening up am I for bringing RTI into as many places as possible absolutely am I for creating an imbalance and weakening the legislative structures of this country no I'm not how does placing Pol politicians how does putting polit political parties under the purview of the right to Information Act how does that actually weaken the legislative process it brings in transparency no it brings in transparency but it changes the balance of power how because you you the Judiciary does not have RTI the Press does not have RTI other components of the system do not have RTI the Press does not rule the country no it doesn't but the press okay the Judiciary does not have RTI so there are so you have to you have to have a a you have to have a complete thinking so if you if you want to bring RTI you want to deepen RTI you have to think about it in a composite manner you cannot just say okay let's you know put RTI here put RTI you have to have a strategy to put RTI and open the system together and as far as opening the system is concerned you're willing to let a discussion happen on bringing political parties course you're not opposed to that no I'm not opposed to any discussion ever but on this specific on all subjects but one has to one has to take care that one is not creating imbalances in the in the system and that's something that uh one has to discuss as far ASC do I sense that you were almost committing yourself and then pulled back no no no I've said that I'm happy to have a discussion you're happy to have a discussion on on bringing political parties under absolutely okay M Mr gandi um but let me let me let me just go back and let me give you um let me give you a little let me go further than that okay the main issue if you look at the the real serious the central question in all this the central question in all this is who chooses political candidates and how right the central issue in all this is what is the power of the Member of Parliament the power of the MLA and the power of the pradan in the political system if you look at the legislative power of a M of parliament you look at the legislative power of an MLA today and you look at the role that he plays in Parliament and the role that he plays in the assembly he doesn't actually make laws he presses buttons okay if you look at go to a state like utar Pradesh and you look at actually the lawmaking U the the law making done by the mlas extremely limited you can't talk about bringing people into politics you can't talk about opening up the system until you start to empower these people understood was it part of the empowerment was it part of the empowerment of people that Ashok chaan was protected in the others Camp despite the fact that the judicial commission actually said that he was uh involved in a quid proo a chief minister an ex-chief Minister forced to go because of one of the most uh one of the biggest scamps which was by the way Mr Rahul Gandhi played out greatly on times now is being protected the CBI is not getting permission to prosecute why now what is you you can you can say all this Mr Mr Rahul Gandhi about the legislative framework to fight corruption but my question to you is more fundamental you have not shown the political will to use your tremendous influence to ensure that Ashok chawan faces Justice you said a little bit and you moved back what why are you still protecting as chaan I'm sorry the congress party wherever wherever we have had issues of corruption we have taken action on every front we are the ones who brought the RTI which is the single biggest single biggest weapon against corruption and we got it ourselves we are the ones who delivered RTI to this country and it is RTI no I'm not your cabinet your cabinet rejected your Maharashtra cabinet your in rejected the judicial commission report on other right you made it and after that the governor refused to give prosecution to go against Ashok chaan one minute sir none of this was part of the empowerment of the people you said you're not for it after that in some kind of tardy if I may say so partial acceptance of the report the bureaucrats are blamed and each and every politician including Mr Ashok chaan gets away I want to ask you Mr Rahul Gandhi you said you will not compromise you will not make small compromises how big a compromise was it for you to continue to protect Ash Chan why you protecting asan I made my position Mr Ash Kumar Ash Chan absolutely clear I made it in front of a press conference I made it absolutely clear exactly what I thought about that issue let me go back again to the issue at hand the issue at hand in the issue at hand is bringing in youngsters into the political system opening no no opening the doors the chief minister the chief minister sort of did a partial acceptance which basically means bureaucrats are faulted in the report they are penalized indicted politicians get away Mr Rahul Gandhi I'm asking you this because you know you've come come up on the issue do you have the political conviction to push this through what will you say to the people watching the interview today who will say you know what you said it but you're not taking responsibility the man still gets a his C free why should a bureaucrat be punished and a congress politician be let let what I will say is that in the congress party anybody who does any Act of corruption will be taken up and punished what about Ash cha every single person okay what I will say what I will say is that there are six bills in Parliament that are sitting there bring them in pass them what I will say but your words are not not matching your actions Mr Rahul Gandhi you you are saying it but yet the politicians they all got away scotf Frey including not just Ashok chaan there are several other the NCP ministers all of whom tried to interfere and meddle in the process they used the name of Carill Mr Rahul Gandhi to give themselves private profit if you say this and you have the conviction why are you not following it through I have made it absolutely crystal clear right in front of the press what I think about this isue but nothing happened what you nothing happen as Chan faces not what all I'm saying is that anybody regardless of who he is if there is any corruption done by any Congress person we will take action you like to we have we have punished our own ministers we have put the most powerful bills in the Parliament House please get those bills passed that's what I tell the opposition I'm giving two examples one ex-chief Minister one a presentent chief minister V badra Singh my question to you is we have papers which have shown that a chief minister takes money from a company uh which his government does business with and he takes money large amounts of money are put in and then he says you know I just took the money as a personal loan because I wanted to do Renovations in my Palace my question is my question is uh Mr Rahul Gandhi and this is really fundamental because you have taken a position of Corruption of late do you think it is appropriate for another chief minister of a state to be deciding on a fate of a company that he is revealed to have close links with and by not speaking on it because you've not spoken on it aren't you missing on yet another opportunity to address the issue of corruption V badra Singh as far as any corruption done there is a legal process and that legal process should be followed and concluded as far as my personal views concerned anybody who is corrupt should be brought to book was the legal process completed when aaja was asked to leave the C we took we took we took actions on the DMK ministers but was the legal process completed when Mr kalmadi was asked to leave a secretary of the Congress parliamentary committee we took action we took action we took action on the corrupt ministers we have passed a bill in Parliament the local Bill the most powerful thing we have got your RTI and we've got six bills sitting in Parliament House you want to we have to change the way the system works we are always talking about peripheral things we are never talking about the core reason the system is corrupt the core reason the system is corrupt is because there is too much concentration of power in the system and people on the peripheries do not have power the people on the streets do not have power and the reason that happens is because our political system our political parties are shut we need to open the door of the political parties we need to move carry out more legislation like RTI and we need to change the system are you open to taking action on Ashok chaan and V badra Singh have you seen the papers yourself will you examine it Mr Gandhi look will you examine it anybody who is corrupt should be punished I am not uh a judge so if there is a legal process and there is a uh result of the legal process absolutely they should be punished I'm not I'm not a a person who there no Cas being followed up on there's no case being followed up I know that but I'm saying that it is not my job is where I see issues of corruption arising take action that's what I do but M Mr Gandhi now you see the other the other question is should you have spoken up much much earlier you know you didn't the everyone wants to know today why didn't you speak up during 2G why didn't you speak up during Colgate why didn't you speak up I think it was June 2010 that times now broke the cwg scam and railgate you could have spoken up and you can't take the defense that you were not very actively there you you have been for some time effectively be in charge of the 2014 re-election campaign my my position was that I report to the Prime Minister whatever I had conversations with the Prime Minister whatever I felt about these issues I made it abundantly clear to the Prime Minister I was involved in the legislation RTI legislation and now I have passed the uh help pass the loal Bill I'd bring you back the real issue here is participation of people in politics it is bringing youngsters into the political system it is opening out the itical system that's where nobody wants to talk everybody is perfectly happy with 500 people running the entire system in India nobody none of you want to raise that issue the fundamental issue how do we CH choose candidates do you feel you do you feel you undermined yourself by remaining silent you did not use your immense Cloud I want to ask you this Mr Gandhi when this whole pan Kumar B bansel and Ashwini Kumar episode happened for 6 days the government battered back everyone said this is unacceptable 6 days the parliament was washed out do you feel in retrospect that's a very specific question do you feel in retrospect that you could have spoken out earlier Mr Gandhi please be frank with me on this do you feel you should have spoken out earlier what I feel is that this country needs to start looking at the fundamental issues at hand the fundamental issues at hand the fundamental political issue at hand is that our political system is controlled by too few people and we absolutely have to change the way our political system is structured we have to change our political parties we have to make them more transparent we have to change the processes that we use to elect candidates we have to empower women in the political parties that's that's where the meat of the issue is but I don't hear that discussion I don't hear I don't hear the discussion about uh you know how are we actually choosing that candidate that's never a discussion discussion is once everything is over it's again it's a discussion I'm asking you how are you choosing Ashok chaan that's a discussion I'm willing to to have how are you choosing V badra Singh they elected representatives they hold clout absolutely does their clout make them oblivious to public accountability and their Cloud does not make them oblivious but the real Point here is the system behind them that has no processes no systems and we just assume that the thing is going to work what you have to do what we have to do is we have to open that up we have to open that and bring that bring youngsters into that and that no one is discussing Mr Gandhi a lot of people felt when you say I will not make compromises you got a round of applause when you spoke up on the ordinance now there are many people who faulted you for your Technique and said this is not the right way to do it he could have chosen a slightly more discreet or polite way to do it not that I suggest that was impolite but I want to take that extend that further Mr Gandhi and I want to ask you will you make compromises Mr Gandhi are you willing to make compromises for politics the for polit for political purposes alliances or convenience my long-term my long-term view on this is that we need to take the Indian political system to a different place we need to bring in youngsters and we need to move away from this concentration of power unfortunately the political system today is at a particular place and I cannot simply ignore the fact that the political system is at that place so certainly there are points at which uh you might have to take a decision um where you're not 100% happy with it but the the long-term idea for me is to transform the system is to bring in is to bring in youngsters and to make sure that they are empowered Lalu Prasad has been convicted on the 30th of September 2013 uh for the alleged fraudulent withdrawal of cres of rupees from the chaibasa treasury in the 1990s a case you are completely aware of my question to you is Mr Gandhi will you make that compromise despite this case to enter into a political Arrangement because when you spoke about the ordinance there was the backdrop of the Lalu Prasad case which was also coming up will you make that compromise we we are these decision in the congress party um are made by senior leaders you're the boss yeah yeah coming to it they made by senior leaders our alliance in Gujarat in um Bihar is with a political party with an idea it is not with an individual we're making an alliance and it's not uh certain that we are going to make an alliance we are in the process of talking to people uh and our alliance is with an idea with a party it is not with an indiv if I were to take that further and challenge you Mr Gandhi in saying that there is talk about possible alliances with the DMK possible alliance with with Lalu Prasad and if you are uh accused please don't take it that I accusing if you are Accused by others and your political opponents of saying you know he talks about not making small compromises but he agrees to enter into convenient alliances with parties for a short-term political purpose how will you justify yourself we are fighting an election uh we're going to win that election uh there are Alliance partner there is our alliance partner in Maharashtra there is our alliance partner in Bihar we have Alliance partner jarand and we are we are making an alliance with their perspective their view we are not making an alliance with an individual leader of the party is Lalu Prasad hence you're making an alliance with an individual no we're making we making an alliance with a with a political party indivual but these are not settled alliances yet but you're open to them yeah uh Mr Gandhi the the other question is that of price rise you got a round of applause when you spoke about the LPG cylinders and you told the Prime Minister quite charmingly that Mr Prime Minister please make make things more you know less difficult uh for for households now Mr R Gandhi I'm not just talking about that I'm questioning your silence for all these years because in this period 2004 to13 wholesale price index of food goes up by 157% vegetables by 350% and onions by 521 per. you don't speak on that when Raj babber says you can get food at 12 rupees per meal you don't speak then when Rashid masud says you can get a meal for 5 rupees you don't speak then the accusation there is and the general feeling is Mr Rahul Gandhi that you've really woken up on this issue after the 4-z drubbing in the last state elections you caned that no um I think women are the backbone of this country I think women need to be empowered and I felt um that price rise is is an issue cylinders were a big issue I went to Kerala and I I got the sense that uh women were concerned about that and I made that view uh clear to everybody in theic s you didn't intervene earlier I've been I've been working with the Prime Minister uh on the price issue I've been I've been in discussions with him and I mean we have taken steps for example in our states um where we've called the chief ministers and we've taken steps that have actually reduced the prices on of vegetables in our states so it's not that I just woke up is that uh I've been working on it I've work been working on it systematically but I think what I really feel again is that we need to start looking at empowering women bringing them in bringing the men and listening to them did UPA 2 let you down on prices well prices I mean prices are a reality we've been did the government let you down when I look back at your comments I find a comment each time 2009 10 and 11 you had a lot of faith in the Prime Minister you always say I had discussions with I still have uh faith in the Prime Minister he's he's does the government's track record prices not make your faith in the Prime Minister shake a little well we are we are working on prices as I said we've spoken to our chief ministers and we have reduced the prices uh in the states where we un so you've not woken up to it only because of political purposes you're not using it right now only for political purposes Mr Gandhi what do you think of the am admi party and why are your views constantly shifting on the am admi party on the 8th of December after the loss you came out quite candidly spoke about traditional non-traditional parties non-traditional parties being those who have involved a lot of people suddenly I find that now you seem to be over critical of the amadm party I presume you were talking of them when you said that there are people who can give haircuts to the bald were you referring to them saying talking of parties over Market themselves which party were you talking of the work the work that I've done in the congress party the work that I've done in the youth congress the work that I'm going to do in the future is about bringing youngsters into this party strengthen in processes strengthening candidate selection processes strengthening policy processes okay uh I made a comment about am admy party where I said there is there are there is something that we can learn from them yes and uh what I felt we could learn from them is that they reached out to people in a particular way that was good uh there are things that I don't think uh we should take away from them um I think we have fundamental strengths in the congress party and it's something that we've been working on um for 3 or 4 years now and the real the real power of the congress party is the is the depth of our organization and you can't actually make change frankly uh by destroying things I understand but in a recent interview Mr chamaram said he felt the decision to provide support to the am ADI party was unnecessary and that opinion was divided on this within the congress party having seen what you have in the recent days and the chaos that has followed in Delhi over the last few days do you agree with that view do you also feel in retrospect Mr Gandhi that that support of the Amad party may have been something you shouldn't have done please be candid and Frank with me on this no I think I think uh as far as I'm concerned the arm admy party won an election in Delhi um and we thought that we would assist them they got less seats than the BJP yeah we thought we would assist them we because our party felt we should give them a chance to prove themselves and uh one can see what they're doing one can see exactly how much they've uh proved themselves what is your view on arind krial he's a he's a leader of an opposition party like many others our what what we have to do as a congress party and again uh in front of us we have an election what we have to do in the congress party is basically three things one is we have to transform ourselves we have to bring in youngsters we have to give them space two is we have to look at manufacturing we have to look at how we can set up we've already set up the the corridors uh north south east west how we can take the energy of the Indian people and build a manufacturing superh house that is what I think really should are you using the aadmi party to split the anti- Congress vote Bank no to keep Mr Modi out of power you you're implying that we have brought no I'm not I'm not implying I'm saying that there is a theory and I want your view on it that the Congress is propping up the am admi party putting them on an extended leash so that they somehow divide the anti- Congress vote you see they had the amadm party not been there the BJP might have done much better in Delhi and maybe at a smaller level that experiment can be exed underestimate I think you underestimate um the power of the congress party I think the congress party uh I don't think the congress party uh could even do that if they wanted to but I think the congress party is an extremely powerful system and all all that the congress party needs to do is bring in younger fresher faces which is what we're going to do in the next election and we're going to win the election you will win the election yeah we win the election you're confident about that reason be if you don't win do you take full responsibility for it I mean if we don't win uh I respons am the vice president of the party of course I take responsibility for responsibility for it if the Amad party goes against Sheila dshit in the cwg scam will you continue supporting them as there are reports they will I mean I've already said I've already said that regardless who do if who the person is if there is an issue of corruption the law should take its own cuse that's my position I didn't choose to be born in this family I didn't sign up and say listen I'd like to be born in this family it happened so the choice in front of me is pretty simple I can I can either turn around and say okay listen I'll just walk away from this thing and uh leave it [Music] alone Mr Rahul Gandhi I now want to understand a little bit on your personal side my first question is that you have faced a lot of criticism how do you handle criticism Mr Rahul Gandhi people say and I'm only putting this out I want to understand you everyone says this about you there he has his heart in the right place but is he a vote catcher they pull out all the recent State elections utar Pradesh Delhi Rajasthan madhia Pradesh and chatis gar they say he has not despite playing an active role achieved considerable electoral success they're questioning your vote-winning ability what would you say to them Mr Gandhi I'd say uh that when we win an election when we won utarak when we won Himachal when we won Karnataka um I'm not involved when we lose an election I'm the cause of it um but once again I think what the congress party needs to do is actually tap its potential what the congress party needs to do is change the way its organization is structured and look at changing the way the politics in this country is structured that's I think where we should head uh questions about whether you know we have supported up or not supported up I mean frankly that's it's a ridiculous notion why supp that we would construct the arm admy party I mean you support them you give them Le of life so that divide the an Congress vot that ascribes huge power to the congress party um I think the congress party strength comes when we open ourselves up when we bring in new people and that's historically been the case and that's what I want to do Mr R Gandhi why do you keep invoking your family name I have seen you refer to your with with respect to your father and your grandmother especially repeatedly repeatedly now Mr Gandhi some would say that you should be careful of doing that because you know when you invoke your family and its achievements from the Congress you can be accused of doubting your family's a background for your own political career that's one the second would be you would be reinen yourself in the role of a dentist at a time when being a dentist is not seen to be a good and do you agree why do you why do you keep invoking the family name and I don't I don't actually keep invoking my family name I have mentioned I have mentioned my family name once or twice and then um people report that um the real issue is I didn't choose to be born in this family I didn't sign up and say listen I'd like to be born in this family it happened so the choice in front of me is pretty simple I can I can either turn around and say okay listen I'll just walk away from this thing and uh leave it alone or I can say I can try and improve something pretty much every single thing I have done in my political career has been to open the system has been to bring in youngsters has been to democratize I I am absolutely against the concept of D Dynasty anybody who who knows me knows that understands that right but you're not going to wish away Dynasty in a closed system you have to open the system Dynasty Dynasty or CH children of politicians becoming powerful um happens in the BJP it happens in the DMK it happens in the SP it happens in the congress party it's a fun it happens everywhere then how are you different you got to go into you got to go into why it's happening you it's happening because dynasties are allowed to proliferate it's because a cindia son is a minister a Deora son is a minister a pilot son is a minister a prime minister's son is the Congress vice president that's Dynasty change is not happening at the top Mr Gandhi change you want change at the bottom there are people out there who are saying we want change at the top yeah we want change at the top the reason children of politicians keep getting um repositioned is because the system is closed you're not going to change that without opening the system you're not going to open the system without having processes the system is not going to open just by waving a wand like that and saying Abracadabra let's open the system it is going to take time it is going to take effort it is going to take structure that is the work I do that is the work I spend a whole bunch of my time doing that is the Revolutionary work I've done in the iicc and the NSU act that is the work that we are doing when we talk about an open Manifesto that is the work that we are doing when we talk about 15 parliamentary seats being chosen by only 15 absolutely because because one needs to set up the systems if I was to suddenly launch into 546 seats being elected being directly elected by people the system would explode what I need to do is I need to set up an idea test the idea run the idea if it makes sense if the thing actually works then move it into the rest of the party um the step we've taken with those 15 primaries I mean uh we get that much of a little of of a little piece in the newspaper but that is probably the biggest political step that has been taken in this country it's a huge huge step and I think I think those are the type of questions one needs to ask and and one doesn't ask them one one asks questions that don't actually re reach to the heart of the issue you're you're talking about you're talking about uh India we've had a we've had a 1H hour conversation here you haven't asked me me one question of how we are going to actually build this country how we going to take this country forward you haven't asked me one question on how we're going to empower our people you haven't asked me one question on what we're going to do for youngsters you're not interested in that that's wrong Mr Gandhi if I was to know that I'd hear a Rahul Gandhi speech but this is not a Rahul Gandhi speech this is a Rahul Gandhi interview my question was again and I draw you back Mr Gandhi I see that you have this Knack of trying to throw the question back at me I can only tell you Mr Gandhi I I'm going to ask the question my question to you is how do you handle this you see the other view is that you're you're fragile person you get affected by criticism now you know um suban Swami M I'm sure you know him he raises all kinds of questions on you may I with your permission of course please subaman Swami has raised questions on your degrees he says why does he claim he has an Mill from Cambridge Cambridge has no record of his thesis you cannot get an Mill without a thesis he says uh yes he went to Harvard when Rajiv Gandhi was prime minister somebody and I won't name gave $11 million to Harvard Medical School Do's quota Harvard has this quota once you enter in 3 months Harvard said to him we don't think you belong here so he dropped out he's questioned both your degrees I want you today were you in Cambridge I was at Oxford you're at Oxford but you spent sometime at Cambridge I was a fellow visiting fellow at Cambridge for a while okay so uh where were you in Cambridge at Sydney susex college so I was a trinity in Cambridge I spent a year there I did my Mill there now I want your response to to a response I mean I want your response to uh to to suban how do you deal with this you want me to show you my degree I can show you my degree no you would you feel like showing him your degree he he's probably seen my degree I mean i' I've written a I've given an affidavit a swan affidavit saying that I've got these degrees now if I'm lying on the affidavit let him take a legal process and solve it it I mean what more do you want me to do you challenge him why should I challenge him why should I challenge he's attacking he's attack my family for for 40 years why should I challenge him I mean I does it affect you Mr Gandhi does it affect you when when you are attacked at a personal level does it affect you and how do you choose not to respond how do you bury your head in the sand and say this is not happening it's happening to you you are being criticized I respond you see I respond by understanding why I'm being attacked I'm being attacked because I'm doing things that are dangerous to the system I'm being attacked because I'm asking questions that are dangerous to the system and I'm not asking superficial questions I'm not asking you know questions over here I'm asking questions over there and everybody understands that this fellow here is not uh superficial little chap who just talks this fellow little over here is thinking deeply and is thinking long long term that's why I'm attacked I understand that right and frankly attack me all you want beat me to death it's not going to stop me I'm going to keep doing it and I'm going to ask the questions that are relevant and you know what I've got thousand people in the congress party 2,000 people in the congress party youngsters who working this stuff they're not letting go and I'm proud of them they're not letting go it doesn't matter keep throwing stones at us that's the point the point is that the people who are attacked in this system the people who are actually attacked are the people who are fighting the system you understand that they're not the people who sit and ask uh The Superficial questions they're the ones who are actually saying listen let's do something about this system they're the ones who are actually going deep into the processes understanding that this is the Crux of it and the Crux of it AR I've told you the Crux of it is how we choose candidates the Crux of it is how we make policy that's the Crux of it the thing is you don't like discussing it you like discussing stuff um you know that's really doesn't go to the coure doesn't go to the court and I'm a serious politician I'm not somebody um you know who who is here to you know get power or make money or something I'm somebody who's here who seen what uh what the system does to people I've seen and I can give you example after example after example after example in my mind and I'm not I'm not going to fight a superficial battle I just am not it's not interesting to me I'm going to fight a battle I'm going to fight a deep battle and I'm going to take the youngsters in this country I'm going to line them up and I'm going to take the system on don't forget that you don't have thick skin Mr Rahul Gandhi politicians need to have thick skin and Mr Gandhi can I say if I don't have a thick skin right now it'll get can I tell I tell you one thing Mr Gandhi yeah say you're a serious politician I assure you Mr Gandhi I'm a very serious journalist and therefore when I interview Rahul Gandhi his first interview in 10 years it's my responsibility to ask you specific questions I'm glad you're taking them my next question to you and I have only two left Mr Gandhi how much have you been affected by your defeats and I when we see for example the visuals of you and Priyanka and Priyanka holding you and after the up election loss that picture almost in a protective manner that prianka is holding you and you're walking away you tell me what's happening in your mind out there do you feel overwhelmed by loss by defeat because you've had quite a few of late how have you dealt with it it all depends on what you're trying to do right I told you that I'm here because I want to use I want to help use the energy of this country I want to make this country powerful I want to project the ideas of this country to do that I think there are basically three things that one needs to do one is changing the way we do politics here uh getting away from superficialities getting away from uh the small issues and moving deeper into the issues right changing questioning the system changing the system things like RTI things like loal things like questioning how we uh choose candidates things like bringing youngsters into policy right the second is empowering the woman of this country really bringing them into the system really pushing them forward and the third is using the energy of the Youth of this country bringing them the type of jobs that they need this stuff is not done in 5 minutes this stuff is not frankly not done um in these type of discussions this stuff is done with concentrated thinking with long-term work um and frankly it's difficult work it's painful work okay if you're thinking about that and you're thinking that that's what you want to do defeat just makes you uh Stronger it wants to makes you want to do it more if you had not been you know I don't I don't think I don't go into I don't go into elections saying oh my God if you lose an election that's the end of the world no absolutely not uh we lose some elections we'll win some elections but the real the real thing is it's a heart thing it's a soul thing why are you here I asked you that question I asked you the question why am I sitting here I'm sitting here because with all my heart I think I think we need to change the way the system works here and and not enough people are actually asking that question will you be open to a debate between key candidates or representatives of the major parties Will you participate in such a debate if there would [Music] be Mr Gandhi my last question to you in the course of this interaction is this your father was forced into politics by circumstances he was in your case as well when you said power is poisoned and you spoke about how your mother Miss Sonia Gandhi came and you know she cried if I put that together together with some of what you've said it can reinforce the image of a reluctant Prince and this is not my phrase I'm sure you've heard this phrase used against you um or to describe you a number of times therefore Mr Gandhi the last question is this had you not been a Gandhi would you have been in politics at all if you look at if you look at my spirit um regardless of what I do uh if I had been born um in India regardless of what I do U I don't like unfairness it just makes my blood boil I don't like it and in whatever I did if I saw unfairness I would stand up against it that's the the heart of my politics uh what I see what I see would you have been in my question was if you were not a Gandhi would you be in politics some say this is a circumstance thrust on you Mr Gandhi you're thrust in this situation you're trying to justify to yourself that you need to do it but Heart of Heart are you a politician and had you not been a Gandhi would you have been in politics at all maybe maybe maybe [Music] um maybe you find me strange because no I don't find you well you you you sort of implied that but maybe you find me I look like an anomaly in the environment I inan maybe that's what you're saying and frankly um in a lot of ways um I am normally in the environment I'm in um the power the the power is poison remark yes oh and I tell this to my sister yes and I tell it to my mother and my mother tells it to me uh I don't get driven by the desire for power I'm just not driven by it uh for me power is an instrument that can be used to do certain things but for me it's not interesting to own it to capture it to hold it this is just something um maybe it's because of my family circumstances what happened in my family U power per se the the quest for power the search for Power The Thirst for power is not there in me what is there in me uh is a is a desire is a very strong desire to reduce the pain that people feel to reduce the pain that people feel as a result of a system that is predatory as a result of System Of A system that need not be there as a result of the system that can actually be changed if we just start to ask the deeper questions and we stop asking The Superficial questions again and maybe the seventh time I want to repeat it to you what are those deeper questions the deeper question is why is power so concentrated in this country why is it that a chief minister of a state has access to any decision in the entire State why is it that our candidates are chosen in closed rooms why is it that our people do not have access to the candidate decision why is it that our policy is made in closed doors with five or six people why is it that uh the perspective of one minister is completely different than the perspective of the gentleman who follows him what that's telling me is that we're not actually taking the voice of the people into policy we're not actually taking the voice of the people into the political system you know you said about arm admy party and you said well you know you uh criticized them and then you praise them yes you did I I I liked the what I saw as far as the representation bringing in people I I thought that was an interesting concept we've we've done that type of stuff in the youth congress uh that was interesting to me is it bringing in people when you when you when you uh when you disregard the legal process and sit on a protest outside real B and then also that you force your decision and your minister is always right do you you avoided my question on the amadm party I'm glad you've come to it tell me Mr Rahul Gandhi were you angry with suil Kumar shindai giving a face saer to Arin kri this was reported it was and I before I W I didn't mean to go back to it you brought it back the accusation is that you're still doing deals with the what I liked what I liked about what I saw in the arm ADI was people coming into their system I like that uh but what's different then between us and them is that we have structure we develop processes MH that I didn't see much of but the the the main thing that no were you were you upset with Mr sushil Kumar shind for giving the Delhi government a way out during the reca do you feel they should have been offered a Face Saver do you feel they should have been ordered a you're going back you're going back AR to specifics no it's not specifics uh it's it's frankly superficialities whether superficial it's completely super it's this is the most relevant question no it's not it's whether shind whether Mr shind thought he should have apologized shouldn't have apologized did this did that is it's a fact it happened but the real issue the the real core issues in this election are are we going to head towards democracy towards deepening of democracy towards opening up the system or are we going to head towards concentration of power that's the first question the second question is are we going to head towards empowerment of women are we going to uh you know be a be a half strong Nation be a half proud Nation or are we going to actually um Empower women those are the questions and those questions you know I mean if you if you listen to the debate that's going on uh about the elections that's not the debate there's nothing in the debate about how we going to move forward on the RTI Paradigm how are we going to move forward on the corruption Paradigm there's nothing in the debate about funding of political parties there's nothing in the debate about how we are going to choose candidates there's nothing in the debate about how po should be made these are fundamental things these are the things that actually have an impact but you're avoiding the debate will you have a debate with Narendra Modi if he agrees to a debate on any of these issues my question to you is direct if Narendra Modi says I'm willing to debate these issues I'm debating I'm debating these issues by building structure in the congress party that's going to transform why should there not be a debate between the key political party candidates on all sides let them talk have a conversation you're you're more than welcome you have to start that debate as far as I'm concerned the debate is taking place I'm willing to start the debate are you ready for it then I can go and ask Mr Modi if he's ready for it you I mean you start the debate but the real issue is doing this stuff the real issue is doing this stuff in the party machine that the only people are doing that is us and frankly we can stick for it I mean we've just we've just said that 15 constituencies in this country in the congress party are going to be chosen based on primaries don't said a word about it well of course it's been mentioned everywhere it's not impressed to many people but no but the discussion hasn't gone there so all I'm saying is that as youngsters as serious um politicians one has to ask the fundamental questions the fundamental questions in this election is are we going to open up the system are we going to close the system what is going to be the role of women in India going forward how are we going to get jobs for youngsters in this country you asked me a whole bunch of questions yes I did you didn't ask me once about how we're going to get jobs for youngsters in this country you didn't asked me once about what are we going to do for women in this country I'm going to tell you what I think but Mr Rahul Gandhi if I was to do that I would listen to Rahul Gandhi speeches I said this is an interview I'm getting an opportunity to ask you specific questions you call my specific questions superficial I with respect disagree I feel my questions are specific and and you need to answer the specific question as specifically as possible you you are more than welcome to ask these questions right but let's also move the debate to a place where we're actually reaching towards fundamentals right um what should be the role of women in this country how can we enhance their role how do we bring jobs to millions of people now for example every single person who comes to me from abroad Japan France Germany America every single person comes to me and says listen we need an alternative to Chinese manufacturing we're very happy with what the Chinese give us but we need another po yes there's Global energy that is basically saying we want to move manufacturing to India the congress party UPA government has built the corridors has built the north south east west Corridor we've built three times the roads the NDA built why are we not having a discussion about certainly I mean I can I can I mean probably no probably the probably the reason is I asked you the question in the course of the interview I asked you did up2 let you down because Mr Rahul Gandhi when people when foreign investors want to invest in India they want a clean investing environment they do not want Cy capitalism they do not need scams they do not need ministers who behave that you know the the government exists on their rent they do not need the a rajas and they certainly do not need airell Maxes scamps the climate Mr Rahul Gandhi has got viated with corruption and therefore the the the answer to that is and I really want you to address this very clearly did you if you had spoken out earlier today and let's bring this interview to a finality Mr R Gandhi if you had spoken on these issues earlier perhaps today we would not be in a situation where know where India would not be the preferred investment destination actually you get my point yeah I get your point actually uh the RTI right has basically changed the game in India what it has done is it has opened up the structures and what used to be hidden can no longer be hidden that's the bottom line okay the bottom line is that large numbers of uh corrupt issues that were hidden that nobody would find out about came out because of the RTI we did that now please go to our opposition States please go to the states and ask them do they have their RTI Commissioners the the issue here is very simple the issue is do you want an open system do you want a system where these things are out in the open or do you want a closed system where these things are hidden I think we should have a debate Mr no I'm I'm I think we should have a debate on this the debate is taking the debate the debate has to take place between the individuals my final question Mr Gandhi will you be open to a debate between key candidates or representatives of the major parties Will you participate in such a debate if there were to be want there is a there is a national debate taking place right now okay the national debate that is taking place right now is the following there is the congress party that believes in openness that believes in RTI that believes in pchi Raj that believes in giving people power and there is our opposition that believes in concentrating power that's the debate that's taking place that's what the election is about we fundamentally believe and the congress party has always believed that this country has to be run by its people can you take that this election have you or have you lost the election before it's begun most of the surveys are saying the congress party will be reduced to its lowest ever tell what would you say to that this country has always been run has always been run successfully when large numbers of people were involved in its decision- making if you look at historically if you look at when this country has done well it is done well when we've involved you know what Modi says to that Modi says you gave them 60 years you give me 60 months I want you to respond to that before he says you gave the Congress party 60 years you give me 60 months he said that in up when he spoke in gorakpur recently I want your response to that uh my response is that over the last 10 years we gave the fastest economic growth this country's ever had my response is that we did more for opening up the system in this country uh than any government before us my response is that we uh have completely changed the Paradigm with our rights-based uh development model we've given we have given manrega which is transform the rural economy we have carried out we are talking about adhar which is going to directly give money to people so to just brush aside the idea that the congress party has been in power we are we are growing at the rate at which we are going growing because of the Congress are you battle ready battle ready of course we're going to win Mr Rahul Gandhi thank you very much for talking to me and for taking specific questions from me on frankly thank [Music] you

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Keywords: Frankly Speaking with Rahul Gandhi, rahul gandhi, arnab goswami interviews rahul gandhi, bihar elections 2015, rahul gandhi interview, rahul gandhi latest speech, rahul gandhi parliament speech, frankly speaking with arnab goswami, frankly, congress, congress vice president, pm narendra modi, modi, modi vs rahul, arnab goswami, arnab goswami latest debate, newshour, newshour debate, the newshour debate, times now, arnab goswami and rahul gandhi

Id: xB_eWW5ttaM

Length: 80min 3sec (4803 seconds)

Published: Mon Jan 27 2014