Damien Hirst: full C4 News interview with Matthew Cain

you've said that this isn't a greatest hits show it's more a map of your time as an artist what's the difference so I think you know you know it tells a story I mean there are you know I mean you know as I've gone through maybe I was a little bit wrong so knack so that there are like you know a lot of the top pieces in here there are the ones that get the headlines and all that stuff yeah there's some embarrassing stuff as well I mean that I mean I think like in that room there's a piece made with the pounds that the gloss painted and I think when I make that I definitely thought I was doing something like Picasso's bike seat and handlebars you know which is going to change the world and looking at it now all it says to me is car boot sale I think well I think what you like a great artwork is something where you know you kind of end up with a mathematical some week and one plus one equals three whereas you know that's probably one that got one plus one equals two or one plus one equals one you know it's like but you're looking for kind of magic in some way and I think a lot of the works when I made him you know they achieved more than I expected but then there are a few in here that achieve less like the poems but when I look at some of the early work like the only spot painting I wonder whether there's more of you in that than they're raising one of in some of the later ones they're technically more accomplished yeah and I think that's what you try and do is a nice I mean I think you I think it's a nice book you know I think I think you start off putting yourself into the world I think in the end you want to put the viewer into the work so you don't really want yourself in there I'm it's like you know I mean I always think about that thing when Morrissey sings a song and says no one loves me everyone sings along whereas if you say a party you got some you saying that they all run the other way I think that's the difference between art and life so it's not necessarily I mean it's great in terms of this show to see works like that of mine where you go oh yeah is you know is like you know anybody else when you do that sort of stuff but you know my successful works and the ones where there's no trace of me whatsoever but or maybe there's a little glimpse of it so that you did you think oh this is what the guys like but it's not really me so if there's now none of you in how do you get the warmth and the humanity I think every artwork anybody could have amazed I'll make is always a self-portrait in some way but I think you know you're looking for you're not looking I'm not looking for things that are personal to me I'm looking for Universal triggers I want to try and switch everybody in a one on one basis so I think you know I mean if I say you know I mean like you know everybody loves butterflies so it's like you know I'm looking for things like that you know not my personal loves you know I mean I like quirky things you know so I don't want to put in something that there lose everybody I want everybody to just connect so the idea is that we invest I mean I had a collector come up to me looking at one of my artworks and said to me you believe in God and I was like no I don't and I've called the piece and the Lord God made them all he says you ain't do and he said I think that's good that you would get a viewer arguing with you about your beliefs because of an artwork you've made when it's not really a self-portrait because I don't believe in God so the idea that is we as viewers the reason that the warmth from the heart comes across is because we're putting it yeah absolutely I mean I think in all art with us what happens and that's the trick that's how I you know as an artist you you know you trick people into you know into putting themselves into it you know I mean I've had arguments with people about my what my work is about I mean I didn't I grew up with somebody in a barrel I said you know the fly piece is about death and they go no - no it's about life you know you get people really upfront they will argue with you and even when you're the eyes but do you like that yeah because I don't really know I mean I don't have an opinion I just I just hold the triggers together so I go you know I mean I'm I always have both you know I think well you know I think this is you know I think life is brilliant but it's also fragile and so I've always got I've always got the two views on everything really you know I mean like I look at the butterfly paintings I think they look happy and bright and optimistic but then I think oh my god it's insects trapped in pain and I sort of go both ways a swing both ways where do you say things like that and you mentioned tell you about the butterflies you everybody loves butterflies do you think when you're creating work what is going to please the greatest number of people not pleased necessarily but I definitely want to get their attention I mean you know I think you don't have to please people but I think you do have to get their attention I mean I always think you know the saddest thing in an artwork is if you walk past it you know it's like you just walk past it and then people go did you see that you go walk and you have to come if to send them back whereas I always think we can you know I think it's a great achievement if after somebody looks as one of your things they're thinking about an hour later if you can get to the point where it's like a day later or a week later then that's genius so is that what constitutes a successful piece of art for you not necessarily Beauty but it's getting the public's attention well it's like you know it's like a little mini drama you know it's like you see you know it's like yeah I mean I mean now all art it's positive you know it's not negative so it's like you don't want people to leave the gallery in want to kill themselves you want to leave the gallery and want to live you know and live in a better way than they came into the gallery take something away with them that's you know that's that's that's what I want to achieve and this streak of kind of showmanship of spectacle that wants to do the work is that what this is doing is that trying to get attention where'd you get this comes from I mean I just you know I love art that does that I mean I always have I think all art does though I mean I think all arts about life and death I think that's the drama you know and I think that you know I mean it's funny that in art people say your work sensational and it's a negative thing whereas in life or you know somebody said do you look sensational you're not gonna be upset by that are you you've motion detection and obviously you get your fair share of negative attention as well do you think I mean people can't often concentrate on the money side of things that do you think when critics talk about how much money you own it's a way of cutting you down to size and reminding you of your working-class roots I don't know you know I mean I think money is an important key in the fact so you know but I think you know I think I think I use anything to get people's attention and I think the money is something that does that as well you know I mean I think you know I've learned that you have to respect money because it's you know it's a big thing and there's a lot of people who don't have it but you know it's I mean Pete you know I guess people say you know your works only about money or your works only about getting attention and it's like and they're basically saying there's nothing underneath that you know I mean probably cuz it's gone from so little money to such a large amount of money you know but I think you know I think I think money is difficult to deal with and I think it's difficult for us all to deal with it's difficult to see you know things that you know sell for lots of money how relevant is it know for quite a talk about the fact that you started with no money and you were working class boy in 2012 is it relevant to your work it's the American dream except we're not in America no I mean I thought I mean you know I mean that my you know my stories are amazing really you know it's like you know I did have no money when I was young and I've grown up and it's like you know I've money I mean it's what what's strange is like you know I've got kids who have got money so it's like you know wait in a generation it's like you've gone from having no money and you know not knowing where your money's going to come from to kids who don't have to worry about money I think there's a as a parent that's difficult for me to deal with but you know it's like I mean you know I mean loves imposes in partners money so you just you just got a balance everything so how does it feel to be constantly reminded at the fact that you started with no money I mean I don't have a problem with them and I think it's you know you've looked money love everything in the competition I think you've got to be careful you know I mean I had a business manager a long time ago said to me you've just got to make sure that you using the art to chase not not using the arts to chase the money using the money to chase the art which i think is great you know your motivations have got to be art not money and I think that's the criticism is that they say are you sort of my own veered off that path and now you'd only doing it for the money you know selling out isn't it it's like we all want artists artists are our heroes you know whether they're rock stars or musicians or anything you know it's like we just want them to go for the Arts the moment they stop is you know it's disappointing you know when you see Johnny Rotten doing butter commercials you depressed you know it's like me it depresses me but you know hopefully I'm not gonna be doing the butter commercial anytime soon and how would you feel if your work stopped selling for quite the same amount of money I think you have to not have you know in the way that that's not the motivation you have to get all ice off to go through those periods you know I mean mines you know its prices are less than they were and you know people who want the early work they don't want the late work so I think he just got get through it you know I mean you know you suppose you do of I mean you know the fear is that the work is no good the fear is not that people aren't buying it you know it's like people can not buy it and it can still be good you know you just got I mean I think it's a lot easier on a treadmill but I think it's a lot easier to make art when things are not going so well and I think you know when you're an ice especially when you come from no money it's like because you have a belief when people throwing money at you and going you're amazing it's tempting to believe it but you shouldn't believe it you've just got to keep looking at it like it's got nothing to do with it I think fashion is a good way of looking at mean I've always you know I mean my favorite artists you know I love their whole careers you know and they go through ups and downs and all these periods and it is like a map of their life you know you kind of you know you know look at someone like Willem de Kooning who did these black paintings which I love called excavation paintings they made like 10 at the beginning of his career and everybody wanted him he stopped making them and did something else anything you know that's what I admire is people who've got the foresight and the belief to do that kind of thing an immense career retrospective is typically at the time when you do get negative critical responses of an artist does get negative critical responses well you kind of prepared for this yeah I mean I like what Warhol said you don't read your reviews you weigh them which I think it's good advice but you know you've just got to give me you've got ignore it really coffee brilliantly I want tell you Bob and I think when asked this question actually but the Wallis paintings why aren't they in there this show stops really because we couldn't fit everything in into that we excluded my early collages and we stopped in the 2008 really with the auction because we were speaking with Nick subsidies we agreed we're trying to a bit leaner not do you know a huge show that was that period was an interesting development instead I think it's too recent it's like you know that I've did that showing about 2009 or 2010 a convenient 2009 yeah and so I mean this show I think the you know we pick the auction as the end point we said look this is you know 25 years of work I mean the 2009 work I think in the show there's some late of things but they're all related to the auction so we missed out my fact paintings which I've been working on for like 12 years and their paintings of photographs and we missed out the biopsy paintings you know they start the early ecology so there's quite a lot not included you know we've kept it aside that's for my that's for my next show but if things did what you were saying earlier about trying not to put too much of yourself into work because you could argue that the paintings that you did when you stepped back from the way that you had been working you were putting more of yourself in there and I thought they were interesting though no I think that's just another tree I mean it's not you know then you just think that you have a met you know but you know great art you don't really get the artist in there that's why it's great I mean it has it wouldn't work on a universal level you know if you do that and I think it's just another trick to make you think it is I mean the thing is the reason why I didn't in my early paintings I did and the reason why I like the new paint is because I don't this work is just another trick that's what critics are going to pick up on isn't it just about tricks and showmanship so you dislike the egg people oh no I mean I think you know it's like looking at those paintings it's like you know like I said we all love butterflies we're all frightened of skulls but it's like you know it's not my skull it's not your skull it's a universal skull that you connect with and it frightens and you think the darkness you know it's like you know you be want artists to go into the darkness you know like in those blue petals you want artists to go into the darkness so you don't have to and they want to show you a little bit of what they discovered when they went there and that's what's frightening but you know I'm not everybody else I don't want to go back into the darkness so I've got to get close to the darkness and paint it and present it to you you know but it's like it's you know it's not my darkness it's our darkness on that level that which do you think is the most significant piece in this show mm well I mean significant pieces I mean I find it difficult because I can go I can look at it from the wide picture or a straight picture i mean significant in terms of you going into the darkness I mean I'm actually you know I mean I've always said I always when I was asked which pieces I'd take from the burning building if I had so it's like I was think I was getting far I chose the diamonds gold the golden car for the shark and the thousand years to fly piece and in the show I've got three of those which is the shark the diamond skull and the fly piece had to pick one I don't know at the moment I'm torn between this Diamond skull and the fly piece maybe the diamond skull because you could get it into your arm be difficult to get out the building been in building with the fly piece when David Hockney opened his show there was that line on the poster all the work is being created by the artist himself the dig team in your use of assistance I don't know well I mean you know it seems to me to be I mean it really amazes me that that kind of thing comes today you know it's like there's no way I could have created the things I mean you know you try and make art that's a reflection of the world that you live in and in the world that we live in everything we're involved with is made by other people so I don't see how you can make a comment about the world that you live in I mean you know you have to go in the woods and pain there's no way you can like to sit you know I mean I always remember people sort of say to me your works a factory like it's a negative thing and you just think factories make amazing things they don't just make dog food you know they make Ferraris I think it's wrong I think I think it I think it's romantic I think people need artists it's that and it's an illusion it's like people need you I got sent to go into the darkness they need to think that you've got a backpack on and you're going out there and you're bringing something back for them and you go and I made this and it's for you you know it's like you know it's like you'd never go you know you'll never you know you'd never walk out in a suit was falling to bits and say my wife made it for me you know and it means more but it looks like crap like we won't we're perfectly made suits and they're made by other people and we don't really have a problem with it you go you know you'd never go up to new cheer problem going you never meant that soup I think it's because we all personally believe that's why I think that's the illusion I think that's what you have to do and it's like that is that's the trick I mean it's like because you know and I think even when it was the guys painting on the cave walls I think you know I think they weren't putting themselves into it you know I think that's what art is not what eyes do eyes and magicians and now it's magical you know it's magic but you know we don't have a problem with David Blaine you know we we want to believe everybody wants to believe and you know I hijack your belief and present it back to you in a really generous way

Channel: Channel 4 News

Views: 40,530

Keywords: Damien Hirst, Tate Modern, Matthew Cain

Id: XmvViy_qDI0

Length: 15min 4sec (904 seconds)

Published: Mon Apr 02 2012