Comparing 4R70W, 6R80, and 10R80 Transmissions (Silver Bullet Part 2)

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Alright, a few differences between the 4R70W and the 6R80 and the 10R80 that you'll have to address during the swap are first of all the mount is different. As you see, this has your conventional mount that bolts onto the extension housing and usually has studs on the bottom with bolts going into it. And then one other small detail are the bellhousing bolts. The bosses on the 4R70W are relatively short, and the bolts are shorter for that transmission because of that. And then the bolts for the locations where the dowels are have to be longer because of the dowel the threads are further into the block. And then the Crown Vic shift linkage is kind of a weird setup on these. It has this range sensor which is spaced differently than most of the other ones and the linkage comes from behind and you adjust it down here. And the bracket attaches here for the cable. Well that's completely different, so we're hoping we can rework the shift linkage. We'll find out if we have room for it when we're actually in the car. We'll see if it works, hopefully it will. By comparison, the bell housing bolt bosses on the 6R80 and the 10R80 are the same actually. And they're a lot deeper, so you need a longer bolt like this one, actually longer than this. And one thing that they did which was interesting, the dowel hole location bolts, they made the boss shorter, which allows you to use the same size bolts for all the bellhousing bolts. So what we did was bought all new bolts for a 2018 F-150 from Ford, but they would also work for a 6R80 because it's pretty much the same length bolt. They kept a lot of things the same between the 6R80 and 10R80 because the goal was to package it in the same vehicles with a minimum of re-engineering which was nice. You notice the trans mount setup is just like a 6R80 pretty much. And dimensionally, it's about the same length from the bellhousing, if not identical, from here to here. So if you have a crossmember that works for a 6R80, as far as I can see, should work for a 10R80, so that's a very good thing. And the flange on the back is the same as a 6R80, it's the four and three quarter bolt circle which Ford uses a lot now. And of course that's in contrast to the 4R70W that had a slip yoke so we need a telescoping drive shaft. We're hoping to use one from a 2006 Explorer which is an aluminum telescoping drive shaft which I think is the right length, we'll find out. Cooler lines, dimensionally these are the same as the 6R80 I believe. But they're turned 90 degrees, the 6R80 ones are vertical, these are horizontal. We opted to buy a 2018 Mustang cooler line set and hack it to bits, but honestly, probably the easiest way would be to buy a fitting, such as the one by Power by the Hour, or somebody else, and use -8AN lines would be a lot less headache because bending steel cooler lines is not much fun. Shift linkage is actually a different ratio than the 6R80 which is also different than the 4R70W. So we will need different linkage for all three transmissions, unfortunately. And the D shaped hole on the lever is different, as well. We'll cover that more after we get it in the car and see how things stack up. And as you can see, the mount on the 6R80 and the 10R80 isn't the traditional bolt up from underneath. It actually has bolts that are basically in sheer like that (course that's not the right bolt) that hold the transmission up and the mount goes in behind it. So that's pretty much the same setup for the 6R and 10R, but that was a relatively new thing in 2011. And one other thing about the 10R80 versus the 6R80, the length from bellhousing face rear of engine block to the flange is about an inch longer. So you need about an inch shorter drive shaft, though the mount is pretty much at the same spot, the drive shaft will have to be about an inch shorter. You'll notice the back of the 10R80 is quite wide, and the wide part goes back further than it does on the 4R70W. Fortunately, the panther tunnel is pretty generous and we don't anticipate any problems with that, but we'll be watching out for that. You need probably another half inch or so for this over a 6R80, and I believe the wide part goes back further as well. It's about nine and a half inches from here to here, and it's about eight inches from here to here. In the 6R80, the wide part is a little lower, so it's a little bit more tunnel friendly, but there's not a huge difference in fitment. One other difference with this particular 10R80. This is a 2018 F-150 transmission which just happens to be what somebody wrecked first, and it is different than the Mustang transmission. It does have the cable mounting bracket holes for the Mustang on the truck, which on the 6R80, the truck 6R80s did not have the Mustang cable bracket holes. But on the 10R80, they all have them, so that's an interesting side point. But one thing interesting about the truck transmission we discovered. Unlike the Mustang, the truck has the engine start stop feature, where the engine shuts off when you come up to a stop light. No big deal, but they changed the starter slightly, I think to make the gear bigger and change the ratio. In my left hand, you'll see the truck starter, and in my right hand, you'll see original starter from the Grand Marquis, and you might notice the gear's bigger on the truck starter, which I think is to increase cranking speed to get the engine started faster when the light turns green. So anyway, no big deal, but what you'll notice is this is the traditional modular and coyote three bolt starter pattern that we've had since 1992 with Fords. Well, this one puts us back to a two bolt starter, but not the one you're thinking of that was used on the small blocks prior to the modular engine. It's a different bolt pattern, but I believe to accommodate the different gear and the starter had to be out further, they had to redo the bolt pattern. So it fits on like that. So that was an interesting change. We had to change the block plate. As you'll see, the original block plate has the three bolt starter holes and the new one has two, and one of them I believe is in the same location as one of the original three. But the other interesting thing about this block plate is there's no inspection cover, so you have to put in all the converter nuts through the removable rubber plug they have in modular engines, which is not a big deal, just an interesting point. The only bad thing about this setup is, with the adapter we're making to put a 6R80 behind a small block Ford, it can't be used with a two bolt starter 10R80, so you'd have to have a three bolt starter 10R80. One other small change we have, there's actually like five different breather assemblies for the 10R80. This particular one is out of the truck it came in and it would probably fit in this car, but it would push on the firewall blanket and be a little close. So we decided to switch to one of the Mustang ones. I'm honestly not sure off hand if this is the V6 or V8 one, but we'll find out. We'll be posting the part numbers of all the parts we use so you know what they are. And a lot of this stuff, not necessarily this, but many things are applicable to 6R80 as well, so we'll cover them. We'll change the breather out to this one because this will fit really well and has a clip that will hook on to the coolant tube up there I believe. So we'll use this in the swap.
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Channel: US Shift
Views: 22,540
Rating: 4.9422383 out of 5
Keywords: us shift, usshift, usshift.com, transmission, automatic transmission, electronic control, baumann, mercury, grand marquis, panther body, quick 4, quick 6, 10r80, 6r80, 4r70w, transmission swap, ten speed, romeo engine
Id: _rkfSzjceDw
Channel Id: undefined
Length: 9min 50sec (590 seconds)
Published: Mon Oct 29 2018
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