Claire Saffitz: Dessert Person

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today's program  with pastry chef claire saffits   we're here in honor of her new book dessert person  recipes and guidance for baking with confidence   she'll be in conversation today with emily  peters ceo and founder of uncommon bold   and a member of the inforum advisory board if  you'd like to ask either of them a question   during this program you can do so in the chat  section of the live stream that you're watching   the commonwealth club has temporarily suspended  in-person events but we are dedicated to keeping   you informed during this pandemic we're going  full speed ahead with the full slate of live   online programming most of these conversations  are currently free to the public so we do   ask that you consider donating to the club  to help us continue our work please visit us   at commonwealthclub.org online to learn more and  you can also text the word donate to 415 329 live   during this program you can find this information  and more in the description box below now   please join me in welcoming claire saffits and  emily peters to inforum thank you so much crystal   good evening everyone welcome to today's virtual  program with inforum at the commonwealth club   i'm emily peters ceo and founder of uncommon bold  and a member of the inforum advisory board this   evening i'm excited to be in conversation with  claire saffits claire is a food writer pastry   chef and she was also the host of the extremely  popular bon appetit digital show gourmet makes   she joins us at inforum today to discuss her new  cookbook dessert person recipes and guidance for   breaking with confidence at any point if you'd  like to ask claire a question please ask it in the   chat or comment section we'll try to get through  as many as possible by the end of this program   and let's get started so thank you for joining  me this evening claire thank you for having me   i'm so excited to be here and to chat with you  i know i'm so it feels amazing to me that i get   to talk to you for an hour tonight because  i have i'm one of those people who's watched   every single one of your videos and this  is like getting to sit down with a big bird and hear all about it so i am so excited to hear  all the different things that we're going to cover   and how much we get to learn about baking at this  moment that feels like really baking is having   having its moment in the sun right yes yes well  thank you so tell us to start i want to hear   about the process of creating this cookbook um  and specifically creating this cookbook at this   exact moment um you know it sounds like  you started this process over a year ago   is that right i started the book process more  like two plus years ago so i i was a full-time   food editor at bon appetit for many years and then  i left in the summer of 2018 and it was really in   that next fall um that i started thinking about a  cookbook and starting to think about it seriously   um and so the cookbook kind of took shape um like  winter starting winter of 2018 and i wrote it for   basically a year and that was a year of what was  for me like intense intense recipe development   and creativity and brainstorming and  i didn't set out knowing exactly what   the book was going to be um but i i sort of knew  i i don't know i guess i just sort of had faith   that in the process that like i knew what i wanted  the recipes to be and i sort of knew i would get   there eventually and i'm glad that that was the  process and that i didn't have this really um   detailed outline or proposal because it it let the  book kind of take form organically which is not   really how i like to work but it's kind of what  happened um so i really wrote it from like winter   winter of 2018 to winter of 2019 and then lat this  past january we did all the photography and um and   then the book really got edited um in as we went  into quarantine starting in march so the editing   process was relatively quick it was from march  into like this past summer and then the book   writing process is just so weird it's like i was  used to working in magazines with very different   kinds of deadlines and i didn't when i thought  about writing a cookbook and knowing that the   process basically takes two years from conception  to publication date i was just like what takes so   long like why does it take so long and then having  done it it was like at no point did i feel like i   had enough time you know like not even two years  before knowing the book would come out did i feel   like it was enough time so now i really get it um  but it's just it in a lot of ways it felt like a   marathon and a sprint to to to to create it and  then it's a little strange like to be doing this   book tour now it's so it is very fresh in my mind  but it also was something that i now have distance   from which i think is really helpful it helps  me kind of see dessert person the way i think it   really is um whereas like when you're in it like  you you you're just you don't have any perspective   so it's it's very cool to experience the book  as this entity that's now out in the world um   because you know when you're writing it  it's just like none of it makes sense and   it's just you don't know how it's going to take  shape so it's it's very cool to be talking about   it now with that um a little bit of distance from  it we um your viewers are fairly obsessed i would   say with watching your process was there ever an  impulse during the cookbook writing process to   be like i should be on camera and showing people  what this is like and how hard it is and how yeah there is that generally no actually like i  think there is that because the process is so   messy sort of like literally and figuratively  um and it's can be very stressful and um and yet   at the same time it is such a fascinating process  and it's a process that still fascinates me after   hundreds of of recipes and um i i developed this  book at home in in my apartment and that that is a   different way of working than i was accustomed to  at a place like bonaparte where we were in a test   kitchen working in a different kind of environment  and being able to test something at home   really i think was an asset to writing  the book because it just got me   like i did you know i didn't have anyone to do  my dishes i did my own dishes and so it'd be like   okay can i make this recipe without using  my food processor because i hate cleaning   that thing you know so it did lead to i think  um just greater consideration and sensitivity   for home bakers and home cooks so that was that  was really positive um but to sort of more answer   and answer your question more directly like  there were times where i was just like yes   this has been a really cool process from a to b  um you know or from like you know point point a   to p point b being sort of like where the recipe  started and where the recipe ended up but um   i'm glad that it hasn't been documented because  there were a lot of recipes where i spun my   wheels and i i got frustrated and some of some  of the recipes i just abandoned all together   and others i i had to sort of put away for a  while and then come back to because i wasn't   getting anywhere and and just one thing i learned  from gourmet makes is like a little bit of time   away from something can can help a lot when  you just feel like you've hit a roadblock   so it was i still love that the process you know  it didn't it wasn't diminished at all because you   know in writing this book so um but it was i i  i've made really good friends with my neighbors   because i gave them a lot of the tests lucky  neighbors like lots of pastries all that process   yeah a recipe that really stood out to you that  either did or did not make it into the final   book that was really just like the skittles okay  you know yeah was there one that was the hardest   i had you know i it happened most often with  the simplest recipes and some of those recipes   made it in like i made that um there's an almond  butter banana bread i made that banana bread   like 15 times you know and it was starting to  really bug me because it's like this is banana   bread like this shouldn't be that hard but it's  recipes like that where there are relatively few   ingredients and the proportions are so important  it's like because there's so few ingredients that   it just was like you change a little something and  you add a little more moisture or a little more   baking powder and the whole thing changes and so  that was that one was surprisingly challenging   and i had the same problem with like the brownie  recipe um which i had to like put away and then   come back to because it was just like this is  not getting you know it was just moving like   laterally it wasn't moving forward um there was a  recipe for basically like a kind of gingerbread a   kind of sort of date almost like a sticky toffee  pudding or date cake mixed with gingerbread and   i loved the idea and i just sort of like never  really got it to a place that i liked it um and   actually i revisited it over the summer because  i was putting together um along with my editor   and our publisher uh a pdf of like bonus recipes  and it was kind of a like a little bonus for um   for people if they pre-ordered the book and  we sent it out and i revisited the recipe then   after having not made it for like months and  months and kind of came up with a version of   it that i really ended up liking and so that made  it into the uh into that pdf of bonus recipes so   it's just like you just need that time away from  something i think um and that helped a lot but   yeah so there were definitely recipes that i cut  because it was like this isn't good this isn't   where i want it to be really yeah and speaking  of time away after you finish that process of all   that recipe testing did you need to kind of take  a break from baking for a while or no it didn't   it's not like i needed a break from baking  but i needed i needed time to go back to   cooking it's like i totally abandoned savory  cooking while writing this book for a year and   i just really missed cooking for myself and  and for my husband like he i would bake all day   long and then i would just like flop over on the  couch at 7 p.m and like he would make dinner and   because i was just like i can't you know like  i've eaten sugar all day like i can't be in   the kitchen anymore my feet hurt i've done  you know three loads in the dishwasher um   and i was very lucky that he would make me dinner  um and but i missed that so i i like felt like   when i really put the recipe testing process  away i rediscovered just like the pleasures of   of cooking dinner you know and not having  to write down what you're doing and   measure like it was just nice to to reconnect  to that which i think is a great transition to a   line that's at the very beginning of your new book  that i think is somewhat contentious where you say   you get a little frustrated when people say that  they are cooks not bakers and myself and i um   my friends who are watching tonight we're all like  i very much use that line for myself that i think   very much like i am a cook you know i wanted to  get all crazy and to go in different directions   and have no recipe and when i try to bake i have  to you know get like incredibly focused it's so   different for me but you're on a crusade you're  changing this right yeah i i am and that idea like   i've heard that so many times for people who are  like oh i love to cook but i don't bake you know   and i think that when i hear that what i'm hearing  is people who have been indoctrinated into this   false way of thinking that like  they're two very separate things   um because that's kind of how that's just kind  of like a paradigm i think of thinking about   cooking over here and you're baking over here and  in my mind they're not that different they're not   fundamentally different they're just sort  of like there's just degrees of difference   and they kind of exist on a spectrum it's  like you got you have yes you have some   cooking on this end and some baking on this  end but they're super interconnected um and   baking just has like more more rules i think um  and but i think it's also like a misconception   that like cooking doesn't doesn't have rules  or that you don't have to measure or something   um and you do it's like there's there's  principles in both um but yes baking   as opposed to cooking requires like i think  just stricter adherence to certain principles   um but it can be just as creative and seasonal  and inspiring and in some ways improvisational as   cooking and that's what i want people  to take away from this book is like   you can be a baker even if you don't think you  are a baker you know like everyone who has any   desire to be in the kitchen and to and to create  something can be a baker and that's what i hope   this book delivers is i want to kind of introduce  people to that way of thinking about baking it's   like it all exists on a spectrum and this book is  really about giving people the tools and knowledge   to to become a baker if they're not already and  yet if you are already a baker there's lots there   too because there's recipes of all different  requiring all different levels of skill so   there's like every amount of buy-in like from i  was just texting with a friend of mine who bought   who like got my book in the mail and was like  i've never turned on my oven what do i make   i was like you can make the brownies like  there are recipes for the people who have never   turned on their oven and there's recipes for  people who are like you know basically like   you know many professionals or  something so um it caters to all i think   and you have that interesting grid where you  actually map out and organize all the recipes   by how many hours and by skill level was that your  idea of how to like help us enter into your world   yeah that was that was my idea of just sort of  like making it more user-friendly and that's how i   thought about the recipes in the book myself it's  like i want i want the recipes to sort of fill   that matrix so that there's every kind of recipe  um and that called the recipe matrix so it's   really a way of sort of plotting difficulty versus  time and and that's those are the two factors that   i always consider when i think about a recipe  um and so there's like the recipes that are   quick and easy like a brownie or a  blondie or um or like you know certains or   loaf cakes for example um and those are at the  bottom left corner and then there's recipes where   they maybe don't require a lot of active time and  aren't very difficult but they require maybe an   overnight rest in the refrigerator and so they're  on a different corner of the of the matrix and   then there's the croissants which take a long time  and are very labor intensive so um this was really   about letting people choose the kind of level of  commitment that they that they wanted to make um   when they pick a recipe and so it's like everyone  yes i love being in the kitchen but i also have   other things to do and everyone has a schedule  and time constraints and so this is just about   letting people know what they're getting  themselves into and having the right expectation   for the recipe from the very beginning which is  maybe a shout out i saw that the clock is ticking   on fruitcake yes so i think you should make a  pitch to everybody why we should be starting   on a choosing to make a fruitcake  why we should be starting on it today   yeah yeah a friend of mine also like put like  a thing on his instagram story being like shout   out to claire who put a recipe in like a um  general baking book that takes two months   so yeah i sort of slipped that one in um but yeah  so this is a fruitcake recipe i i actually got   the the recipe that it's based on is a recipe from  a friend and colleague named joe um who is she's   british and she has this like family fruitcake  recipe um and i was kind of unfamiliar with the   realm of these sort of very traditional british  like aged cakes um but it's a really fun recipe   and i think it will dispel i hope it will dispel  people's negative associations with fruitcake   i mean it is like there's certain words to  talk about desserts that are have very negative   connotations but i don't think are necessarily  always bad like dense for example like it is a   very dense cake but that doesn't mean it's not  a bad thing it's um it's like a super flavorful   really kind of um spicy like just really deep  flavor um like cake with a ton of dried fruit   and a ton of brandy so it's um it goes through an  aging process where you bake the cake you wrap it   up in parchment you store it in like a cabinet  and every week you take it out and unwrap it and   pour two tablespoons of brandy over top and it  preserves the cake and ages it and actually i   have one from last winter that i made that's still  preserved so after it's after it's done aging you   like cover it in marzipan or jam and marzipan and  then royal icing and it is hermetically sealed so   like yes if you want to make it for the  holidays you should probably bake it like   soon um you know like if you're not really too  late but um i'm like you can have it anytime   especially after you see it it's it's great so  um it's like become actually a favorite recipe   of like certain family members who expect it now  every winter um i just love that like i was able   to put a recipe in the book that takes two months  but so yeah the project right now right to keep us   counting down to the end of this year feeding the  project yeah it's like having a low maintenance   pet basically every week yeah the matrix has that  fun little arrow that's like it goes off the page   in terms of the time that it takes um yes i i  think anyone who like has dread dreaded memories   of like some terrible fruitcake or something like  try this one it's it's delicious and like anything   it depends on the quality of the ingredients so  it's like try to seek out high quality dried fruit   and like it's delicious and also to me seems like  a recipe that's very historic and i learned in   the preparation for our conversation that you  actually had a history degree and you studied   food history and um this seems like a moment  in american history and global history that   um historians you get to be part of the thing  that the books are going to be written about   so what do you see as a historian a  food historian that's interesting about   this moment you know everybody doing their  sourdough bread yeah yeah yeah i i hope that it's   i mean i think that's the sourdough phenomenon  especially in late this past winter um   is super interesting and i love that it is  sort of a gateway for people into understanding   bread technique and sour dough and  fermentation but like particularly   flower i think um i think having i have a  so i have a master's degree in history from   mcgill university and when i and i  i focused on like culinary history   um of france and england in the early modern  period um which basically just means like i read   old like old cookbooks um and household manuals  and like fascinating texts so it would definitely   see recipes like fruitcakes and puddings and all  these things um and it gave me such a long view   of of recipes and the idea that like there's very  little true innovation it's like every recipe is   just kind of a version of one that came before  it and so i think having that perspective is   is really important um and super informative um  but with with the pandemic and all the baking   that's going on i think i i hope that it's sort of  a window into that and to get people engaged with   the history of baking like one what i love about  sourdough is it's so kind of elemental it's like   there's you know your starter your natural yeast  from there and it's water and flour and salt and i   think that's one reason i love it is like it's so  tactile and it's so kind of um foundational it's   just like this is you know flour comes from wheat  and like learning to bake bread like this is what   makes us human in so many ways so i hope that it  got people in touch with that kind of long view   of a food history is there a historic recipe that  you think serves this moment very well but maybe   a lot in the book or is in the book uh that's  a good question i mean i think the fruitcake is   particularly um sort of relevant because it  takes that amount of time um i'm trying to think   if there's other recipes in the book that were  informed by um sort of like my my um my studies um   i mean not so much in this book but um  i'm like recently kind of begun some light   work on a second cookbook which is focused on  like really simple desserts and i think about   a recipe like uh blanc monge which is like a  british there's so much like cross cultural   british french kind of um cuisine and uh it's it's  like it's all it's kind of like panna cotta like   it's you know it's like these things that we think  maybe seem super contemporary really aren't and so   um i think about that a lot it's like i'm  making kind of cut of it really it's like   a black mons or something like that so um  yeah i think the the there is a lot in this   book that feels really contemporary in in  dessert person but all of it goes back to   these you know certain styles of recipes that  people have been making for like centuries   it's interesting to think of it baking will get  more complicated or more simple right because we   have all this time now right like are we all going  to be making these extremely complicated recipes i   mean sourdough is pretty complicated in terms of  time right yeah and with sourdough it's like you   are on the sourdoughs schedule like not the other  way around like you you know um of course you   can you know once you become sort of skilled and  more knowledgeable you can control the variables   um how you want to but i don't know i think  that like there's always going to be a demand   for things that are simple and straightforward and  delicious you know i think those recipes that kind   of over deliver on flavor and texture because  they were simple to throw together so um like   as much as people are spending time at home and  you know and close to their kitchens it's like   i still don't want to do a bunch of dishes  or you know or or do something that's super   overwrought so um i feel like banana bread is like  still a very good sort of recipe to have you know   in your back pocket is there something that's been  your go-to as you've been you know staying home   pandemic time oh i'm trying to think i've  done i have done a lot of sourdough um   a lot of galettes over the summer um like you know  if a lettuce or like a croissant same thing like a   you know for anyone who doesn't know like a single  crust open face kind of free formed heart um   like just super simple stuff like that  you know that that's kind of the stuff   that i'm making at home um i went through in a  in the like late winter early spring kind of a   chocolate chip cookie uh journey of like trying  to make something that felt kind of whole like   wholesome and like with a lot of seeds and nuts  and um and like you know whole wheat flour and   that kind of thing and that was very like it was  like a very educational um project and so i was   kind of on a kick up for that a little while um  it's like i don't know i just i always feel like   childhood cookies are like it's always  the right thing to bake you know   you can't go yeah you also mentioned in your  book that you and i want to read the quote   of this exactly um that citrus fruits are your  natural antidote to seasonal affective disorder   so we are definitely entering into winter now um  is that where you're thinking now like getting   into oranges and lemons and limes yes absolutely  there's i mean so like you're in california where   like you have this incredible selection and  variety like an embarrassment of riches when   it comes to citrus not so much in new york but  like even over the last couple years we have   certainly seen like so many amazing new varieties  of citrus and like it is totally a thing that i   think to myself when i like walk into the grocery  store as it as it's getting cold and dark and   i'm just like thank god for citrus because like  where would i be without this exciting new state   like you know fruit fruit to have and to play  around with so um you know winter fruits are   like you have apples in paris and you have them  for a long time and it's just so nice to see   sumo oranges and beautiful tangerines and kumquats  and you know limes like it's just meyer lemons   like that gets me excited and it like it gets me  excited to bake and right hold on sorry my um i   was charging my computer and my charger fell out  of the face so i'm just gonna go plug it back in   a second well admire your very well organized  effects that we talked about before you jumped on   okay there we go i'm back i think that's a good time to transition i want  to talk more about your time as youtube celebrity   um i think there was a survey  recently right with kids where they   it actually has now surpassed astronaut  as like the thing that kids want to be   is a youtube star oh my god oh my god that's  slightly terrifying so tell us about that   what was it like going on that journey do  you miss it do you want to go back to that   it's i don't know that i miss it because i i  don't it's like there's this i hope it doesn't   come out the wrong way like it doesn't feel  like there's anything to miss because it doesn't   it didn't change anything about the kind  of like daily workings of my life i guess   you know i certainly there were well and i don't  think anyone ever becomes accustomed to this or if   they do then like might be a sign of sociopathy or  something but like to be to like you know stop on   the subway or on the street or something to be  like aren't you that girl that like makes that   those things and i'm like yes that's yes that  was me making the twinkie or whatever but um i   yeah like that would happen and was always sort of  like a mixture of being strange and kind of freaky   but also kind of cool you know and and um it's  allowed me like wonderful opportunities but it   having the success of the show on youtube like  didn't necessarily feel like it fundamentally   changed my life and so i sort of still you know  still live in my apartment and hang out with my   friends and it's just as it was before um but  of course with like greater opportunity so um i   think i'll miss gourmet makes because it was just  a great period of my life um and i i love the crew   that i got to work with and they made it so much  fun like there would be moments during shooting   where dan the director would be like claire we had  to shoot this and i'd be like dan i'm talking to   the you know mike the sound guy and kevin who's  holding the camera like god shooting gourmet   makes us really getting in the way of us like  hanging out even though we were at work but um so   i'll miss that um but like i am i'm a millennial  and i don't you know like youtube star wasn't a   possible career path when i was growing  up or even in college so i sort of feel   like the demographic to whom you youtube is  a is a really big presence like it's just   not my it's just not i'm not part of that um so  i in some ways and like find the whole thing kind   of strange and fascinating and weird um and then  like kind of disconnected from it which i think is   for me like the way i would like it to be and just  you know kind of just go on living my life but   um i don't know if that answered your  question but yeah like i think i'll miss   just i mean i'll just miss the kind of the  people that i made that show with um because   they were great but i don't i don't i don't miss  having to like spend four days making skittles i think it was partially your reluctance to  sort of be dragged into these challenges was   something that made it extra charming right i  think if you could wanted to eagerly bound in   and make skittles it would have been  a very different show potentially   i mean like that was something  about the book is like i my sort of tastes as a pastry chef never leaned toward   the the gourmet recreations of snack foods like i  just want to make cakes and pies and tarts so um   so that's where i think the reluctance came  from it was like if i'm going to be in the   kitchen i'd rather be making something we  can like all enjoy you know rather than   like for skittles or whatever so um that the  book was great because and i think the writing   of the book was great like the the things  that i was doing while i was writing the book   it was just the development process and gourmet  makes and i think in some ways they were really   complimentary because they used such different  like muscles and skills and so um to have be   able to do both of those things simultaneously i  think was really helpful but i really did channel   so much creativity into the book in terms of  like the kinds of recipes that i wanted to be   making because i knew i was never gonna get to  to make them in gourmet makes yeah so yeah the   reluctance is like a nice way of putting it i  think people also really appreciated that you   failed and tried and tried and failed over and  over again right and i think that the part you   know going back to the baking versus cooking side  you know that idea of perfectionism and baking   and kind of maybe busted that open  a bit right yeah for sure i think   it was really helpful to me like in  a personal sense because it it was   i've never even thought about it or framed  it this way but i think there's a way of   that i experienced it that was almost therapeutic  and like helping me get rid of or shed   that that perfectionism and that that  tendency um to learn that like good enough   is is like almost better than good enough you  know like perfect is the enemy of the good um and   it just taught me so much about the process like  i think i guess that another way like it just made   me realize that the process is the important part  not necessarily the final result it's like before   it makes i maybe didn't nail the thing in the end  but i learned something really fundamental about   a cooked sugar technique or or chocolate  or something like that um and so that the   skills became additive and so um like in a  very unexpected way gourmet makes made me a   better recipe developer and a better a better i  think pastry cook really um which i did not ever   anticipate or think about but but it really did i  think for me too as somebody who was working from   home before even the pandemic started and then  especially when we went into shelter in place i   think it also highlighted how it's the people that  you get to work with more than the actual work   often right and you know there's there's obviously  been a ton about the the troubles and the toxicity   you know that was behind the scenes at bon  appetit and you know you're speaking to a   silicon valley audience here that's not something  that we're unfamiliar with right um but it seems   like that was a really big theme of it too is  like the fun of getting to create things together   yeah i mean i think with  gourmet makes especially when i   came back as a just as a freelance video host  after i had left my um full-time editing job   i did get to experience kind of the the what was  like good and pure about the test kitchen which   was the kind of like idea sharing that that that  happened there um and i do feel like that that was   captured accurately and and that that was real um  it was a lot of things and there were a lot of um   certainly like shortcomings and failures about  that environment but fundamentally it was still a   place where like talented passionate people got to  exchange ideas work together sometimes you know um   to bit debate oh here's felix guys um he's so mad  at me right now because i kind of ignored him um   he's gonna say hi but um but yeah i mean i  and that's something that i miss about recipe   developing at home it's like i actually like love  being alone and i love being solitary and i'm an   introvert and um there's like when i'm at home  with just felix like in my kitchen i'm so happy   but i i miss i miss the idea sharing you know i  it's it's you get to where you want to be faster   when you have you know more brains so now  now he's messing with my my ring light so   if all the lighting goes away it's because he  knocked it over he's looking for his moment yeah   he loves oh my god he oh he's literally knocking  it down right now he loves he loves the camera do you have a favorite moment  from your time in the test kitchen   that maybe wasn't part of a youtube series i  mean it feels like we got to see everything but um yeah i mean i had so many years as an editor  um of being in that environment uh and like you   know most of that wasn't captured um in any kind  of direct way uh on on camera i'm trying to think   i mean what was great about that environment  when i was an editor is it was a place where   among many things like real experimentation and um  exploration was encouraged and and i mean not just   permitted but was encouraged and so that's where  like i learned how to make sourdough because i   wanted to learn how to make sourdough and i was  like well i'm already in the kitchen you know no   one's gonna be upset if i use a little flower you  know and have this project going on on the side   so i i missed that and i missed kind of  all the resources that were that were at my   fingertips um for just experimenting and it was a  place where like to a certain extent you you could   because experimentation was encouraged like  failure was also kind of encouraged you know so um   yeah i mean it's just i i will miss that  collaborative environment how annoying is   this cat should i get rid of him sorry i he's  gonna climb up on my shoulders now he does this   all right we'll let him hang out as long as he'll  do this it's up to you i think he's very charming   all right well good i i might i might  get too annoyed with him and like   and then are there things from that  experience because most of your professional   life was in that kitchen um that now that you're a  little bit further away from it and i can speak to   this from my own experience of working in places  where you know i developed amazing friendships   and relationships i did incredible work and now  a few years later i'm like what even was that   and like how did we accept that as the way that  that was the way that things were gonna go right   yeah i mean certainly look like my frame of  reference in within the industry is super narrow   because it was really just unempatee um and so  i i lacked that kind of perspective that i think   a lot of my colleagues in other places in the  industry have because they've worked in multiple   environments and um certainly it lived up to the  reputation i think of condensed brands which was   like it was hyper competitive and um there was  like tons of competition for resources and for   for space you know on the page and online um and  i do in so many ways look back on it and say like   i shouldn't have accepted that that was  sort of the the way things were done here   you know which was kind of kind of the um the  party line about it um and so and i i really   am glad to have that realization now  because it means that whatever i do   going forward like i'm gonna take  that with me and realize that like   the culture of a place is created by the people  that comprise it and and i and i know that like   if i have an opportunity to create a  culture for myself and others like it's   it's going to be different yeah at the end  that process to me is a nice parallel with the   process of of testing and trying and failing  and making things better and we're all going   through this together as a society of what is  and is not acceptable and what we want for the   future right things are changing so quickly right  um i would love to hear and we have just you know   not too much longer before we go into question uh  questions from the audience but um i would love to   hear about what happens maybe for you next from  here you know as a baker as a you know somebody   who likes to have a plan and a recipe you know  who has had this you know two-year period that   has completely upended i would imagine everything  right i mean your entire professional life has   changed you have this book you got engaged  you got married you have this beautiful cat so do you have a road map or a recipe for where  you're gonna go from here or you know have you   kind of given that up at this point it's such a  good question and the this period looks so much   different than i would have imagined six  months ago or eight months ago um and so   and for so long i was just like oh the  fall is like when the book comes out   and i at least had that and now that i'm here and  i'm in that period i'm looking into the future   being like oh my god like what am i gonna do you  know like there's this was a thing i was looking   forward to and now here we are and now the future  is is is something else and like what does that   even look like i'm not sure so i am figuring  it out and i'm actually surprised that i'm not   i like i thought i would think i'd be more  anxious not having a plan actually than i am   um but i'm also someone that like loves i love  detail i love like discreet tasks that's why i   like baking i mean one of the many reasons it's  like oh i can do all these things and then i'll   have this result and like all i have to do is like  pay attention you know and like and i will have   this thing and so it's them i'm really good at the  micro that's just how my brain works the macro not   so much so it's like when i start thinking about  like do i want to do a youtube thing or do i want   to i'm just like i get like a little overwhelmed  and then i just i'm like oh i just might go bake   something you know so i am trying to train  my brain to think more concretely um about   like what do i want the next six months to a year  to five years to look like um so i'm at the moment   like enjoying this period of the book coming out  but and i'm trying to figure out what i'm going to   do next and i didn't think i would be so glad to  be kind of a free agent but i am um but i think so   like as i said i'm working on a second cookbook  and just beginning work on that and that's   really exciting because like i love i know  what that is now and i'm excited about it   um and i think video will be something that i  continue to do but i'm not quite sure like what   that will look like but yes i i think video is  such a wonderful teaching medium and that's that's   the value that i see in it and so i i hope that i  will continue to do it it's wonderful do you feel   like you're an entrepreneur like you're out  there now yourself starting all these things   a a very reluctant one i don't i  wasn't would not apply that moniker yet so like i don't know maybe ask me in like a year  i don't know i don't know i i guess i can just   i guess it's exciting that i can decide to do  that if i want to um but i don't know i just   i'm really bad at tolerating things that i don't  want to do which you probably saw in gourmet makes   and so it actually is a good it's a good sort  of quality to have because it means that i know   exactly when i'm like not on the right track you  know so um i have a pretty good gut so i'm just   gonna follow it and like as long as i'm enjoying  what i'm doing and i can make a living from it   i'll consider that a success i think  it's pretty impressive for the thing   that you think you're not good at that's the  thing you got most famous for you know doing   things that you didn't necessarily want to  do generally i like things that i'm good at   but i don't like all things that i'm good at i'm  trying to say i'm like there was some kind of   like weird corollary there but i didn't quite  get to it but it's like i dislike things that   i'm bad at i don't know it doesn't always it's not  always a perfect like one to one but but thank you   yes um okay well we have a bunch of  questions coming in all over the spectrum   of like technical baking questions and then  big philosophy philosophical questions so   let's make sure we dive into this i  think a little bit early okay so um   let's go with a bigger question and we'll  kind of work our way down to the spatulas and so the first question comes from james and  he says at a time of so much cultural division in   america um do you see baking as a way to  bring people together and build community   and i would add on to that maybe also using  your historian lens to think about the context i do and i i yes um and i think to your point  about the historical lens like i think it   runs deeper than just sort of like the proverbial  breaking bread with with others i think that it's   about like building food systems and having that  be based on a community model like i think about   particularly with bread about flour and how flour  people think of it as just like an ingredient in   your pantry like anything else but it is it  comes from wheat it is a plant-based product   freshness and terroir are so important  and like you know what are the   i think that building a system where wheat can  be grown sustainably locally and milled locally   and um and distributed and shared within  that community through farmers markets and   throughout through other models is is is like it  is the key to so many things not only building   community but like increasing sustainability  and getting away from factory farming models so   i think that like looking at it sort of vertically  um and not just about like baking something and   sharing with your friends which is wonderful and  yes we should all be doing that and that's how   i experience communities is by doing that  but i think it goes much deeper than that   okay let's keep going on these questions  there's so many uh which recipe would you   recommend for your cookbook starting for  the novices you mentioned the brownies   you mentioned yeah maybe one that's like a little  challenging yeah okay uh the cover recipe is like   i think a really nice like it's approachable  but it's got you know it's like you you have to   you have to have some some wherewithal i think  for that recipe um so that's a blood orange   or an olive oil what i mean what is it even the  title it's like a olive oil blood orange upside   down cake or something like that um you see  for winter we got it a slicer you could use   a different kind of citrus too it doesn't have  to be blood orange um like a beautiful tangerine   or something would be great um but that's a  really really nice one that's maybe more like not quite novice maybe more like beginner  possibly intermediate um i think for someone   who's a true novice the chocolate chip cookies is  a really nice one and that is not it's not like   you don't a robot couldn't make it i mean  you have to brown butter there is some   technique there but i think there's some great  opportunity for learning but also like there's   no hat there's no mixer involved i think it is  really approachable um there's a halva blondie   which is really lovely and i think could introduce  people who have been aren't familiar with hollow   which is like a sort of a sesame candy um there's  al there's like always little points of of i think   learning in all the recipes so um those are good  places to start for the holidays there's a uh   one of my favorites is it the chewy molasses spice  cookie like really really easy really good um   just like a just you know a great recipe to have  sort of in one's back pocket and so next question   from stephanie is about your wedding and how that  all went in the pandemic and i would love to hear   specifically too about your wedding cake i know  there's a recipe for funfetti cake oh yeah that   you made for your sister's wedding yes did you  repeat the funfetti did you do something different   i did not repeat the funfetti um and we so we  were planning like a not really even a proper   wedding but more of a bigger celebration in may  which obviously did not go off as we planned and   then we decided to kind of pivot um and had us  just our just our parents basically and immediate   families um in like a little ceremony and so i  made a cake like a regular sized cake because   we only had you know like 10 people um and so  i actually used harry's berries which i'm sure   our california audience is familiar with we like  new yorkers like go absolutely insane for them   when they appear um and in fact i've had people  be like stop taking all california's berries sorry like when i see them i buy them um so we  had some like beautiful harry's fairy strawberries   and um i made like a super light eggy sponge cake  uh and like vanilla pastry cream lighten with a   little whipped cream i just basically made like a  there was something almost sort of taiwanese about   it um just because the texture of the cake  was so fluffy um and i was like oh i made a   big layer of a sponge i split it i  soaked it with some strawberry syrup   using a technique that i actually learned when  i was working at a restaurant after culinary   school where you like take strawberries  and just like sprinkle them with sugar   and cover the bowl really really tightly and  let them just like sit in a warm place even on a   double boiler and it extracts this like almo it's  like a strawberry consummate it's like a super   clear strawberry syrup and then the strawberries  it's like making chicken stock with strawberries   like the strawberries all the flavor is now in  the syrup and not in the strawberries anymore   um so i soaked it with that sorry this is  now a very elaborate description of this   when i soaked the layers i think i also put some  i put some um elderflower liqueur in it because i   thought that was like i don't know just like  i was like why not um soak some layers put the   cream in put a layer of berries oh so sort of  like a freshly freshier that's also like this   this classic sort of french strawberry cake um and  then i decorated that put the other layer on and   then decorated the top with like a very elaborate  strawberry um concentric circles like the slices   and then i unmolded it and as soon as i cut it the  whole thing just like smushed and all the cream   came out the salad so it wasn't it wasn't super  successful but it was delicious it tasted amazing um a question from jeremy are there any recipes in  the book you consider sentimental for one reason   or another i know there's that poppy seed cake  that's a recipe that predates you even being on   the planet yes there are many sentimental  recipes i actually found out so i spent   this was i so like not this past summer and summer  before i spent like a month at my parents house   with my mom and i like every day they have like a  marathon baking session because i was super behind   on the book and so i took a month off from  shooting video and just was like my mom and i   intensely baking constantly and and then i  dedicated the book to my mom she was so such an   instrumental part of that process and just  also taught me my whole life about baking so   she told me during this month that something  i never heard before which is that my great   grandfather on her side was a baker that was  his profession i was like this is information   i did not know why did no one call why did  no one talk about to maybe have brought up   a little early i know i thought it would have come  up previously um but it happened uh but it kind of   explains like why in my family and my mom's side  we have a handful of these family recipes mostly   you know they're ashkenazi jewish recipes that's  my heritage um so there's a couple of those in   the book like my aunt rose's model bread which  is really my mom's rose's model bread um and   one of the recipes also which actually was not  from my family going back generations but was   a recipe that my mom made growing up was that  poppy seed cake that you referenced and that's   such an easy recipe and it's so good and when we  shot the book that was everyone's favorite thing   that they tasted like was the incredibly easy  super simple poppy seed cake and not the more   like elaborate you know layer cakes and this and  that because just like the simple things are are   the best and so i i love that poppy seed cake  it's it's just like tender and flavorful and   there's like a ton of almond extract and it's just  it's perfect in every way so that that one is near   and dear to my heart and i just ate it as a kid  a thousand times was that your cake like did you   have a cake that was your birthday cake every  year the poppy seed cake was so ubiquitous it   was just like that was just like we had it around  all the time i feel like my birthday cakes were   i know my mom made our birthday cakes  but i can't quite remember like what i   would have requested i probably was like  can you buy me this cake from the store but oh she always make a carrot cake my mom  has a fantastic care cake recipe and she   makes a delicious carrot cake so that  was probably a birthday cake growing up   very good alright we have a couple more  questions uh raquel and someone else asking   what's an uncommon kitchen appliance that you  think everybody should have an unsung hero well i mean in terms of appliances i  try to rely on just like the trifecta   of like blender food processor mixer  um and beyond that i try not to get too   specific you know it's like and even with  a blender it's like you can get by with a   hand blender i was i was careful in the book that  like and anything that called for a blender a hand   blender would also be a or a stick blender would  also suffice um not related to baking but just as   a thing to have i love my rice cooker it is just  like and and it is versatile you can make other   grains in it and it doesn't really have anything  to do with baking but it is just so it's like if   you're at home baking all day it's nice to know  that you can at least like make some brown rice   you know walk to eat for dinner or something  while you're like you know otherwise would   have only eaten cake so um rice cooker is like  weirdly i think that's a good challenge for your   next youtube your return to youtube is that you  could have to make something in a rice cooker   people have baked i know you can like it's steam  so you can make like puddings in it i think that   steamed puddings which is like kind of a category  of dessert i've never really ventured into but   like i it yeah i i i'm curious all right i  think we have time for one more question and   then we're gonna do our big official question  that we always do so let's ask um somebody asked   louis said what's your favorite place to eat  when you're back in st louis my favorite place   in st louis i have a couple so maybe i'll well so  there's one in particular that's still around it's   like a lot of the places i grew up with are not  around but there are certain things that i crave   um there's this such such a good vietnamese  restaurant called miley that is now i believe   in a different location than it was when i ate  there growing up but my family would go there all   the time and get get carry out from there um and  i remember like as a kid with again without like   a frame of reference it was like i didn't i hadn't  eaten at like tons of vietnamese restaurants and   it was just like this place is awesome and as an  adult now like i'm living in new york i'm like no   that place is awesome and i went there the last  time i was back in st louis which was maybe a   year ago and like it is delicious that place is  so good and so i'm just like yeah st louis we   had just a handful of like just such good places  that we would go for dinner and so yeah miley is   such a good vietnamese restaurant and they have  that delicious like crispy vietnamese pancake   that i am obsessed with and to this day is  still one of my favorite things to eat so   if anyone anyone is i mean i'm sure  people in st listen know it it's   lots of people's favorite place but yeah  all right so let's end with our informed   traditional question to ask all our speakers what  is your 60-second idea to change the world god   this is a very daunting question um and i'm afraid  that like my answer will strike many as being   like perhaps painfully unoriginal but i  think access to like earth and the things   that come from it is is so fundamental and is  so missing even in my life personally so i think   places like edible schoolyard it's like the  ideas already exist i'm just in some ways late   in realizing that that these ideas are already out  there and are being applied but i think the idea   of being able to grow food and harvest the food  and to cook that food and to be involved in that   process from start to finish is is so grounding  and so wonderful and to the extent that people   and young people in cities you know again like  with organizations like edible schoolyard can   participate in that it's just it's it's just sort  of i think consciousness raising um and i think   to have people be connected to the earth in that  way is is just so important so um it is like my   life goal to be able to sort of engage with that  process and to to grow things and to to be able   to feed myself and to cook from that so um not my  idea at all and like an idea that's been around   literally forever but um it's just i suppose i'm  i'm i'm realizing how fundamental that is for me   so i i wish i had sort of a more original answer  to that question but i think that's a great answer   and thank you so much claire for joining us  tonight um from new york to join us at inforum for   this commonwealth club event we'd like to remind  our audience that claire's new book dessert person   is available now at your preferred bookstore  and it is beautiful if you'd like more virtual   programs or to support the commonwealth club's  effort in making virtual programs please visit   commonwealthclub.org online i'm emily peter thank  you and stay safe thank you for having me emily   it was a pleasure thank you claire i'm gonna  get on that fruitcake there you go start early so you

Channel: Commonwealth Club World Affairs of California

Views: 4,437

Keywords: CommonwealthClub, clairesaffitz

Id: Kj7l9TPKOhQ

Length: 63min 46sec (3826 seconds)

Published: Mon Nov 16 2020