Breaking In: Tales From The Screenwriting Trenches - Lee Jessup [FULL INTERVIEW]

Lee what trends have you seen in the screenwriting business in The Last 5 Years well it really depends on TV versus film right because in film we really had a period of going away from original content um going more towards IP so we see the studios going more towards IP based screenplays um however this last summer has been a huge game changer because this summer while it was on par with previous Summers so far as box office is concerned it was mostly Indies that really were able to prop up the summer box office it had not been for Indie successes like bad mom and some horror films that came in and changed the landscape we would have been behind about 25% in our annual box office so that's changing the landscape again so far as what people are looking for in content we also saw the bubble burst um as far as the superhero movies and so we are veering again more towards original content that's where scripts like bubbles by Isaac Adamson that was on top of of The Blacklist at the end of 2015 really gets to shine because it's such an original unique story story of Michael Jackson's chimp um and so we are seeing the search for truly original work again in on the film space on the TV space we're moving away from procedural which was really the broadcast network cashow now that we are at about 450 programs scripted programs per year in the original space we're seeing a lot more growth in the pay cable and the basic cable and in the digital streamer space those lean on serialized narratives a lot more so than procedurals so we're seeing that skew as well as well as half-hour comedy becoming less funny haha and a lot more interesting relationship comedy things like casual transparent which is really a a drama um so we're seeing a lot more exploration of the half hour space in a less traditional networking kind of manner and do you think that it's all all cyclical and that at some point we'll revert back to sort of these as you said Network sort of Blockbusters I don't know that we will ultimately if we're looking at television we are in the time of peak TV Peak TV was expected to max out at about 450 shows we're now anticipating that this peak will last through 2019 um and we'll get up to 550 plus now even in that case networks will will be responsible for about 150 of those shows so there's only so many pro procedurals that will be be made the bulk of the growth that we're seeing is on the basic cable front on the pay cable uh front and on the digital front and those are really finding their footing with serialized dramas with more exploratory content um as far as Studios what we've seen happen in studios as far as the Blockbuster goes the summer blockbuster the superhero movie this is something that has been in the works since the mid 90s when most Studios were purchased by corporations that put in some brand strategy to develop these big Brands and to really build up to box office success that has now evaporated what's the next step for the studios that's for all of us to find out but certainly has changed and it will continue to change what it'll change too is the big question what are some of your favorite episodes that you've seen come out in terms of the serialized content oh gosh there's so much good serialized content out there um I'm a child of the 80s so stranger things to me was is so wonderful um I'm a big fan of everything from the affair to Broad Church which is a British series Rectify on Sundance that's about to be done kind of heartbreaking um you know I think Breaking Bad is the greatest thing ever created for television Sons of Anarchy um the list just goes on and on and on I also love documentary Series so the Jinx making a murderer I think there's a lot to be learned from those um but there's just so much good content right now I'm catching up on the crown which is really fantastic um I I don't have enough time to view everything that I want and need to view because I have a lot of writers on a lot of these shows um but that's kind of the pleasure of our time right that uh you get sick you lie in bed for a day you can start catching up on something you've been wanting to see and it's going to be a highly satisfying and very unique experience um you know shows like the night of Westworld everybody loves Netflix and HBO these days they're doing great great stuff and it's really inventive and developing you know we're we're Chang in year after year we're seeing new contents we're seeing new Explorations we're not rehashing things right now which is just so exciting right and really pushing the envelope oh yeah you know you talk about being a child of the 80s as I am as well and and just nothing was sort of pushed that far in terms of some of the content and subject matter and absolutely and I and I think that Netflix specifically Netflix Amazon um as well as FX and some of those smaller homes that a tours have found really allowed creators to create 12 episodes to tell their story so creators really went out and told their story with that much more confidence in the through line as opposed to just trying to sell a pilot which is the experience on network you try to sell a pilot you try to put it into development you try to have the pilot shot you try to have the pilot picked up but you don't really get that through line of 12 episodes right off the bat um so we're really seeing aurs hit their stride and really take you on a journey that they're not t tentative on in any way shape or form and that's really exciting it seems like to the flawed character as the hero now more so than ever or maybe I'm wrong we we certainly are seeing that and I think there's a move away from the likable hero to the relatable hero um we like I said earlier Breaking Bad is my favorite thing ever so I find myself talking about it a lot Walter White wasn't necessarily likable but he was highly relatable a lot of people in this world feel that they've settled and it was his quest to be the best version of himself even if that version is Heisenberg that really rallied an audience around him so we are no longer in this place of you have to be Mary Poppins right you have to be beloved and darling and Flawless but rather relatable and I think the relatability um is what's drawing audiences and where different people are finding different homes um you know this this lack of perfection has been refreshing to say the least for a long time we were in a place in TV and what we call dark and getting darker um I think that we've moved away from that a little bit um shows like Penny Dreadful that was a great show was one of the height of those like how much darker can we go here we saw that happening and still see it happening in Walking Dead that's still on the air and then fear of The Walking Dead but I think that we are now moving back into more of a serialized storytelling as opposed to an exploration of of the depth of Darkness does the screenwriter really have to live in Los Angeles it depends if the screenwriter wants to write for television the answer as much as people hate to hear it is yes television is a all Hands-On deck kind of business so you really do have to be here for a writer to get staffed for a writer to sell a pilot there's going to be an obscene amount of meetings that precede that there's an obscene amount of networking so a writer really does need to be here for television unless they are brought in by their agent their manager just to sell a pilot um and they're able to come in for weeks at a time for meetings that said if you want a staff on television you have to be here people are not going to take a chance that you'll make the move once you get the job and they're going to give more consideration to writers who are available to walk into the room in two days I can tell you most of my writers who've gotten staffed um for the first time on a show usually got the word five or six days before um it's not one of those things that you know weeks and weeks and months in advance you hope you have suspicions you're told by the showrunner but you don't have your paperwork in hand until a few days before the room opens um and so you have to be available to not only be in the room when the room opens but also Network Executives want to meet with you it wasn't expected but here they are it's now 10:00 on a Wednesday morning and they want you in at 3 and if you can't make it you don't have the job so you have to be available for all of those things I find that showrunners and executive producers are less willing to take a chance on writers that they don't know to be available in that fashion now for film writers I find the situation very different as a film writer you can be anywhere in the country the world is a little bit more difficult because we do want you to be available for meetings be available quickly um so I do find that a lot of people are a bit more forgiving as far as geography is concerned for feature writers the most important thing about living in Los Angeles is that it's a sign of your commitment to this career um I work with a great feature writer who lives in Colorado who met a manager who wanted to sign him and the manager knew that we had worked together and so he called me and he said how do I know this guy's really serious he's in Colorado and so I had to step in and say no no no I promise I swear I've read more than one piece this writer this is the career this is what he's doing it's not a hobby um so the move to Los Angeles is not so much for availability on the film site even though that is important so I don't want to discount that you have opportunities to network and meet and not only meet Executives but meet your class of writers but it is an important sign of commitment to this is the thing that I want it is not a hobby it is not a thing that might or might not turn out to be um it's something that I'm banking on um you know a lot of people talk about coming to Los Angeles because this is where movies and television are made and if this is what you want to be a part of if you can you should get here now as a mother of Two and a wife life I certainly understand that if my life was elsewhere and I wanted to be a writer maybe moving is not that available to me um if that is indeed the scenario then the writing has to be that much stronger so that it does get noticed through the shorer channels of the big big contest so if you're a feature writer you want to get to semi-finalist in the nickel Fellowship not necessarily just the quarterfinalist you want to really have your work surface in a way that it becomes undeniable and undeniable is a word that you're going to hear me say a lot because it's a big key term for the industry work that is undeniable writers who are undeniable that's who the industry wants to work with so let's take a hypothetical and tell me if this might work suppose I'm a writer I live in the Midwest and I have a relative or a friend that has an LA address and so I'm telling these Network Executives oh I'm in LA and I'm trying to make it work and squeak by can that really happen suppose I say yeah I live in LA I can I can what time do you need me there I take a flight how realistic is that I'm going to be able to keep that up until I'm hired it's possible not probable I've I've gotten calls for my writers by somebody saying hey you work with such and such right it's Friday it's 11 o' I want this person in my office at two I want to sign them before the weekend's over get them over here and if you say they can't do it that becomes a problem wow um and also there's an issue of honesty right you want to be as honest as possible now I have a good friend who's in Seattle who is a television and feature writer who comes down on a regular basis and takes meetings I have writers in New York New York I do find to be an advantageous location because the industry travels to it a lot so they opportunity to meet with potentially your agent or your manager when they're visiting New York um you know you want to be as honest as you can about it while being entirely available so the thing is to say I'm in Seattle if you let me know by 8:00 in the morning I can be there too H okay right so aside from the honesty part still being being able to travel and making it work and being able to move here if you get the job it probably sounds like it wouldn't work well the thing is that writers who are remote to Los Angeles should expect regular trips to Los Angeles at their own expense um initially before the rer is repped it's going to be to come out here to potentially attend conferences or classes or events start to get to know their writing class then when they when they are repped come to meet their reps um and then start going out on General meetings that their rep sets up for them so you know when I have ERS coming in from the East Coast sometimes I don't even get to see them because they're literally booked from Monday morning at 9:00 in the morning all the way through to Friday at 5:00 P pm. sometimes into the weekend with back-to-back meetings and that's something that any writer who's not in Los Angeles should expect to take on should their material hit and that's really what we want right because the way that a writer breaks today is not quite as linear as write a script sell the script get the money it's write the script use the script to introduce you to Los Angeles introduce you to the industry in the context of General meetings so that's where the writer will get to go out on a lot of generals meet with a lot of people and for that you certainly want to be able to do that do that consistently sometimes do it every few months um you know when things get really really hot then potentially do it every month um those are the things that a writer needs to be able to deliver on and agents and managers tend to look for those red flags that signal whether or not the writer is going to be available to be in Los Angeles as much as it's going to be required in order for them to get a career off the ground okay another hypothetical and that is someone has a family trip and they're going to come to LA and they want to get a feel of the landscape they plan to be pitching scripts they may even come and move out here what would you say is a good self tour for them well I always tell writers who come into town from another location and occasionally I'll have a writer from Australia saying I want to come to LA with a family or without uh but come to Los Angeles how do I do it best the way that I usually advise Riders to do it is to plan their trip around an event so that they have a natural destination in which they can go they can meet other writers they can potentially meet industry people so whether you are coming for one of the big pitch events that take place in the summer or you are coming for a conference like the produced by conference that puts you face Toof face with the industry you want to plan a visit around that and then look for other networking events that are happening around that get to know the landscape that way um but have those anchoring events that that really inform your visit as opposed to show up and go I'm here anybody um so yeah so i' like to have visits anchored by events as many as possible and then you know usually the the good thing about Los Angeles is that we do have networking events that are happening all the time so in any given week you can find Isa Thursday night social you can go to that happens once a month we have script writers Network that has Friday night drinks we have Blacklist that puts on events so final draft does all of these organizations put on networking and socializing events for writers as well as what happens regularly at the WJ Foundation that puts on great panels um and the list goes on and on so you really want to Anchor your trip with an event and then find networking events around those so that you can start to get to know not only Executives that you want to work with agents and managers you'd like to have rep you but other writers who are themselves breaking in who may have amassed a little bit more information than you have so fun so far and really help you learn the lay of the land okay so let's take this screenwriter who's arrived in town maybe they found a networking event on Twitter eventful something and they show up what are they doing how are they not being too parasitic and creepy how are they being not too introverted what's the right balance you know I'm going to take this back to an anecdote um a friend of the families um of mine and my husbands as a director and my husband's not in the industry and and this director sat down with us for brunch one day and told my husband how he was going in all these generals this is a director who's done a big movie for Fox etc etc and my husband said to him I I don't understand what do you do you go on all these generals what do you do what what's the point and he said my point is to get these people to like me and that is what networking is all about it's to get people to connect with you and like you so it's not about getting to know everybody it's not about meeting every last person it's not about giving your business card to every last person but finding a few people to connect with to exchange experiences with to be real to be interesting because the interesting thing about this industry is that it's not just an industry it's also a lifestyle people who participate in it participate in it often times 24 hours a day seven days a week so they want to work and help promote and help boost other people that they like so it is about making those genuine connections with people who potentially will help you along will give you some information potentially in the beginning they'll only read your script and give give you some notes but then they may get ripped and then they may offer to introduce you to their agent to their manager so it really is about building relationship networking I think has gotten a bum wrap um it it has the sticky icky feeling of you know I have to sell myself somehow it's not about that it's about connecting with people it's about forging relationships and doing it effortlessly usually the best way to network is in the spirit of generosity what can I do for you what can I offer you what may do I have that could be interesting to you forget what you can do for me so finding those relationships finding people that you can talk to and potentially whether you offer them and you don't have to offer everyone to everything always but whether there's information life experience that you can share that will inform something that they're writing that will inform something they're producing that goes a long way so it really is about listening a lot inquiring a lot um learning about that other person and building those bonds so that suddenly when that one networking event is over that person that you just met met emails you later that night and says oh by the way there's another Meetup it's people don't really know about it but if you want to come had a great time meeting you tonight um so it is about building those bonds and building those relationships I was talking earlier today to a client of mine who just sold a a show to NBC and this client was speaking of all the people who' have come out of the woodwork that she hasn't talked to in 10 or 15 years who just dropped her an email saying hey I heard you sold the show would you st me oh nice and uh we talked about the fact that nobody would staff somebody they haven't talked to in 15 years or they've only met once but they would stff or they would at least consider somebody that they know and like so the fostering of relationships is really what networking is about in this industry building and maintaining relationships with people starts with one or two and it grows from there um it's about having five six 10 meaningful relationships as opposed to knowing everybody in town and not having them know you back yeah I think we've almost lost the art of that a little bit because it's so easy to look someone up on social media or online just find out what they do and then just go ride in for the pitch instead of just being human so it sounds like just still remaining human remembering that it's a person they're ordering drinks or food or whatever and you're still in this little bar or wherever it is an event absolutely and not instead going for the big ask or the big pitch I prefer you know I always tell my clients I don't want you to ask for anything if people like you they will offer if you ask even if they say yes they're likely not going to deliver because they're not invested but if they like you they will offer all on their own you know agents and managers talk about it a lot what their networking is like because they're in breakfast lunch dinner drinks daily nobody likes to be sold to right nobody likes that experience of I'm just selling you something now and then go on to your next meeting and where you'll be sold again so it is about remembering the details about the other person on the other side of the table and agents and managers will speak to that they will sit down they will talk for an hour about how's the wife and how's the kids and what are you doing and are you still hand gliding remembering those details and really building those relationships then permits them at the end of that lunch after the hour had passed to say and by the way there's this one writer I really want to talk to you about at that point there's an exchange that everybody's comfortable with because there's enough of a foundational relationship that allows for that to occur what a lot of writers forget and what a lot of people forget because of the nervousness that networking inspires is that your job is really to connect it's to build relationships you don't build relationships with an ask you build it with a give and often times you build it from learning about the other person rather than just informing them about you what is the screenwriting path to failure I love that question oh good okay I actually adore that question cuz I think everybody has this idea of failure but nobody knows what it is right I'm going to fail and it's going to I'm going to go down in flames and you're no you're not the only failure in screenwriting is a not writing I wrote a script five years ago I'm running around with this one script I haven't touched a typewriter or computer since then for any creative purposes that is screenwriting failure not writing new content not generating new content harping on Old content not getting notes huge huge huge in the failure of things if you are tunnel visioned and this is how it has to be and anything short of this as I saw it on the page arrives on the screen then it will be my failure you will fail in that because this is while writing is solitary this is a highly collaborative industry so the road to failure is not writing not writing new material not getting notes wanting to be perfect there is no perfection in this industry it is all about getting notes learning from notes getting notes that you hate figuring out what to do with them um because other people are people are going to have to buy in so the road to failure is really being stunted stinted stunted stinted um well what is I'm sorry to interrupt you what what is being too perfect because I think a lot of people that try to be too perfect they don't realize it so what is that um it's always thinking that it can be better and you know most work can be better but there is a point of diminishing returns right there is a point where you are just switching around your word smithing and you're really the returns are you improve it by a percent by half of a percent that's not going to do it so when is the work ready when is it strong enough when do you believe in your work and a lot of writers feel very very confident writing but not confident at all getting the work out there so at some point you have to understand okay this is what it is this is what I wanted it to be I'm a big believer in feedback so getting feedback from people that you trust um who who have some experience and knowledge in the industry be they other working writers or Consultants like Michael heg or Jen granti that You' have talked to um or script readers that are known for being really hard on the work when they say you know what it's good get it out there at some point you have to let go at some point you have to say yeah I can fuss with it forever and you can I promise you that you can and I've seen writers do it and I've had fights with writers who've done it who just would harp on the same script you have to accept it for the potential that it has you have to question whether or not you've realized that potential did you do what you wanted to do with the script did you write the story that you wanted to tell is it being received in the manner that you wanted it to be received so are people getting it are they connecting with it are they enthused by it if the anwers to that is yes then you get it out there as much as rejection is part of the job and it is part of the job you are going to get rejected and so you better grow it or develop a tougher skin you will be rejected get it out there the point is to get that yes and you have to get through a lot of no knows to get that yes but you have to get the world out the work out there it does no good for you on the Shelf it does no good for you sitting on the computer with without anybody seeing it of course you want to scrutinize that the work is up to par right you you want to make sure that the work is strong and you're getting the feedback that it's strong enough for people that who don't have to be nice to you um and that's a really big thing so it can't just be your friends who are concerned about maintaining friendship right um who are going to be a little bit more forgiving because they understand your intention they know what you went for you didn't quite get there but they saw it enough um but people who will scrutinize your work and be demanding of it are telling you it's good get it out there get it out there that's how you build a career you don't build a career with one script that you're precious about you build a career writing great script after great script and getting people getting a fan base that's excited about you that's excited to read the next thing that knows that the next thing is coming and want to be the first on the list to get it from you well I think you've talked before about this industry wants to be able to work with people that are easy to work with so if someone's receiving notes what are some tips that they're resistant whether it's in their body language whether it's keywords they're using and vice versa showing that they're open you always want to really listen during a note session it's not your time to defend the work it's your time to listen to take the physical notes to jot down thoughts don't defend the work um you know I've I've had occasions where writers were given a note and an executive called out something it was a problem and the writer went it's not a problem I don't think it's a problem do you think it's a problem I don't think it's a problem it's not a problem that sort of thing is an obvious giveaway that the writer is not listening um it's listening to the notes it's listening to the note behind the note um if there is something that truly truly truly you think the executive the person giving you notes didn't get you can say well I tried to illustrate that with this in this particular scene was that not clear you want to always ask those leading questions to find out where you miss the mark because ultimately the Mark was missed can we assume that once in a while an executive will miss something yeah and usually they're pretty open to oh I didn't realize that this connects to that maybe we can do that better um it's usually very easy to tell when a writer is resistant to notes uh when the writer is instantly defensive when the writer becomes sarcastic or passive aggressive um and there's a lot of passive aggression that can come out in a note session that like well I thought not but fine um so you know i' I've seen it in in notes sessions with my writers and I've and I've given some brutal notes and there have been people who just sat down and jotted notes and said okay let me go back and think about it and there are people who with every not would say well I don't know that I necessarily agree with that but fine um so you have those little cues that you know you know in a minute body language first um dismissal there can be a judgment of the individual giving notes well you you're a woman so naturally you would think that I've certainly gotten that that feedback um or any anything that has to do with your you're a woman you're a mother um I've gotten that well you're you're a mother so clearly you couldn't relate to that no I'm a human being um try for a writer taking notes try not to dismiss the no Giver um because ultimately all that does is sabotage the relationship because what you're saying is yes you took the time you did the work you read the script and now you're giving me your thoughts but I'm going to dismiss them because suddenly something about you makes you not good enough to give those notes you're a mother you're a woman you're white you're black you're whatever you are but it's really important not to dismiss the not Giver especially not in front of the not Giver um so that there can be a dialogue often times a writer can receive a note and be perplexed by the note but the thing then is to look for the note behind the note okay you gave me a note about X but does it really have to do with why is this what's bothering you and you can certainly explore that in a conversation you want there to be a dialogue and you want to build a kind of trust where the note Giver knows that you're listening you're paying attention you're taking those notes so that when you say you know there's one thing here that's bumping me can we talk about that a little bit that's not defensive that's thoughtful saying there's the one thing I I agree with your list of 20 other notes totally hear you we're good but there's the one thing here and it's bumping me can we go back to that for a minute what was it about this character this scene this pivot this escalation that bumped you what what was it that felt inauthentic was it that could it be something else that to me is dialogue and it's differentiating between shutting down the note Giver which can be done physically just you know I'm no longer interested it can be done verbally um or getting into a more collaborative environment which is what Executives want to work with they don't want the writer to be a yes person there's a difference between being a yes person and being collaborative being collaborative will require some push back on occasion and that's okay but you better be really thoughtful about your push back you know that is somebody that people want to work with I didn't you suggested X I didn't do X because ultimately I thought it would affect the script this way but the note behind the note implied that y would work so I tried that this time that's being collaborative that's not being a yes person and the truth of the matter is that a lot of writers think that they're given notes and the executive just wants them to implement the note verbatim I find that to be very rarely the case um if that was it the executive would be a writer um you know they're giving they're throwing out ideas they're trying different things and they want you to try them on for size and see whether they work or they not they don't work so if there's a note that they gave on a previous draft that you didn't Implement they want you to be able to answer why you didn't Implement they want you to be able to say well I tried that and the way that it affected the script was this and because of that I realized it didn't work and I took it out but I did something else to offset your note wouldn't they want a yes person no why because they want the writer to bring their creative juices to it that's why they hire a writer with a specific story sensibility with a particular skill set with a particular taste level for a particular project right they want somebody who will bring their unique sensibilities to the project otherwise hire a typist get the script hire a typist and have the typus type in whatever needs to be typed in they want and of course there are the few executives that are known around town for being really locked into their notes and they want their notes implemented the way they want them implemented and that's it and it's not a conversation but by and large I find that the creative execs executive producers producers development execs are all looking for a creative partner as opposed to just somebody to execute on the page they can get their assistant to execute on the page they don't need you for that they would be much better off giving the material to their assistant who has a bachelor's in in English Lit to implement some changes then going back and forth with you they don't want you to be a yes person they want you to provide your unique story sensibilities your unique writerly touch to make their notes that can be quite shitty come off sing singing off the page how are you softening some of the screenwriters that you're working with or maybe you're not that are either too defensive or they're too to mayi pami of a yes person um it it is a balancing act so I think that once writers start getting notes and a lot of notes they they learn they learn because you're going to get notes that are outright offensive to you for what you've written but you learn to take the good with the bad um you you know I always tell writers as they prepare for the industry go find people who will hate your work those are the people whose notes you want you don't the people who tell you how brilliant you are and how perfect it is you're not going to learn anything from that you're going to learn how to take notes from getting notes that are really offensive and finding something in there that you can use what is the core of that what is the what is the little kernel inside that note that you can take and do something with and really move the material forward with and listen I remember this from my days of being a writer getting notes and just getting infuriated and coming back and going okay there was something there what is that thing that's there what is the note Giver really saying so you want to really teach writers to take notes to be receptive to finding that kernel that truth that is in every note or in most notes you also want to work with writers and the way that I work with writers is not giving them the answers when they're going okay so there's this note and I'm going to execute it that way is that good no figure out your way to execute that note and I get writers coming back to me there there was one note that said this how do I implement it you figure it out you're on your own I'll sit with you and I'll brainstorm with you once you have the direction but it has to be your direction and that's where you have to listen to your inner writer right you have to really Foster your talent your sensibilities of course it has to be malleable you have to be able to work with other people's sensibilities but the key to being a great writer is taking other people's ideas and making them your own and falling just as in love with them and being just as invested in them as you would be had the idea the concept originated with you because the reality today is that you know 2014 1800 people WJ members made income in the film industry roughly 132 scripts sold what does that mean that means that over 1,600 people made their money writing Pages doing writing assignments so how do you become that writer who does writing assignment Simonson does it successfully you're able to take a kernel of an idea and make it your own and fall in love with it and really take it and run with it in a way that makes other people want to work with you what do you say to screenwriters that are afraid someone will steal either their idea or their finished script this is really so unsexy get over it it's it really there really is nothing for the industry to gain from stealing work if you're a brand new writer and you wrote something that is the greatest idea ever the industry is much better off you're not a wga member buying that script from you for 25 Grand 30 grand maybe 50 Grand and doing whatever they want to with it as opposed to potentially getting tied up in lawsuits it really doesn't pay anybody to steal work in the industry and you can't come at the industry from a place of mistrust you can't come at agents and managers saying well I'll send you my work but I'm really nervous because I've heard about how scripts get stolen because then you're coming at it from a place of I automatically do not trust you the industry I am the writer you're going to victimize me nobody wants to work with that nobody wants to deal with that and the reality is that when bridesmaids came out I can't tell you how many writers came to me and said oh my God I wrote that exact same script there are ideas that are zyy there are ideas that are in the moment um and those ideas tend to manifest in many different places but it really does not serve you in any way to think that the industry will steal your work your job with your script that you have if you're writing outside of the industry and all likelihood if you have a feature script the job of that feature script is to get you an agent to get you a manager that's its job it likely won't sell as it is to the industry we're in in Industry the 2016 we are likely to sell less than 100 specs that's not a big number if you're aiming for that Bullseye that is a narrow narrow narrow Bullseye you want to use that script to get your an agent to get your manager to introduce you to the industry to get on the prestige lists that's what you want that script to do for you and in order to do that you have to expose the work so get over any idea that somebody will steal your script because that's just not going to happen and and the rare rare rare rare occasions that it has the writer usually got their their own success in their own way well let's continue with mistrust because I think on your screenwriting blog for your website Lee jess.com you have a post entitled screenwriters leave your mistrust at the door M and I know some of us are way more trusting than others some are maybe more on the naive scale but you talked about some some things that a lot of people I think would be afraid of like they want me to sign a release form I mean that's scary that's that that's a little scary or um I think this one we're kind of touching on that screenplay has the same concept of mine somebody stole my idea wouldn't they rather cheat me than pay me so how do you work with someone that's already coming with those set of fears and make them so that they're little more workable um but not naive not not a doormat I always tell my writers that I'm the same the safe space so you can let out all your neurosis and I'll put you in your place so I actually wrote that particular blog post after a writer of mine um had finished a script the script had made had had been entered into one contest hadn't placed um and another script with Eerie similarities sold Eerie Eerie Eerie similarities and the writer came to me and said what am I to make of this and we had to kind of sit back and say okay here's where the script was here's the writer who just sold a script here's there is no as much as I understand their Eerie similarities let's talk through what the probability would be of this writer an established writer with the summer blockbuster would have of stealing your script let's talk through it so I always tell my writers I'm a safe space we need to talk about it but at some point a writer either wises up or not so I worked with a writer for a while that I no longer work with who refused to pitch any ideas talk log lines or anything as such in a public environment so in a coffee shop in a bar which is where a lot of Industry meetings take place mind you the writer refused to do it because somebody would listen and somebody would still his steal his idea and it became uncomfortable and so at some point I had to say to the writer listen you're going to have managers meeting you there was a manager that wanted to meet with that writer in a coffee shop so the manager is going to ask you what else do you have what are you going to say I can't tell you here I'll send you an email doesn't work that way so at some point even if you have it innately you have to set it aside you have to because this industry works the way that it does with the idea of trust and respecting the creative mind the creative brain the originator of content if you originated a great idea a great script a great story why would I steal it from you why wouldn't I just take the thing that's already done and do something with it wouldn't that make more sense for me if I'm a producer or an executive why would I steal it get somebody else to write it potentially for more money because they are already well known either they execute it well or they don't maybe they don't or somebody else does the same thing before my script is done why wouldn't I just pick it up from you the the creator of content who came up with this great concept what incentive do I an executive have to steal it from you and that's what a lot of writers have to despite how frustrating it can get have to look at and that's ultimately what that writer and myself had to look at when a script with Eerie similarities to his sold there was no way for the manager who sold that script to get that script there was no way that an industry executive had read that script it had been submitted to one place 3 months before there was just no no reality in which the script was stolen Rewritten what the writer had to acknowledge was that ultimately if I'm the manager right behind the script sale and I here I got let's let's assume I got a completed script that is great that I think I can sell and I have this writer who just had a box office success what is my best way of making the most money my best way of making the most money is getting the one script that I just got that's ready to sell and selling it and booking my writer who just had a big box office success on a writing assignment and making more money why limit the ways in which I'm making money by having the writer than take the script and try to make money off of it rather than monetize both so those are the equations that writers have to look at is it really in the industry's best interest to steal content I really don't find that it is I think this is another blog post of yours but I wanted to expand on it sure so writers are great it explaining in someone else's story but what about their own especially when it comes to presenting themselves to the world to the studio system what is that refining of Their Own Story what is too much how truthful do they be you want a writer to be truthful when they talk about themselves but you have to also remember that a writer's first story is their own so if they don't know how to tell their story it's going to be tough to trust them with other stories so you really have to figure out where where is the juice in your story it's never in chronology or very rarely in chronology if you travel to space sure chronology is just fine um but it is about finding a way to connect your Human Experience for lack of better words to the person who's sitting across ring to become interesting to become unique to tell them a story they haven't heard that is truthful and yours and it can be completely anecdotal um you know I've certainly talked to people who start out saying I have I've never done anything interesting in my life well then what's your point of view on the things that you've done what have you made of your experiences um to find those stories that really speak to who you are as a person and a writer um to tell something interesting and unique so that a month later a month after a general with an executive be it in a production company or a studio that executive looks at a piece of work and says hey what happened to the writer who the writer who had that experience I can bring into this one um you know so it is about sharing the those experiences those points of view um and finding a way to tell that personal story that is Meaningful and that is connective and that isn't tied up in a bow doesn't have to be pretty it has to be memorable and eloquent you have to be comfortable talking about it so it can't turn into a therapy session um you know but it has to be that story that nobody else has to tell so you know for a while everybody was talking about writers who would go into networks and talk about how television was their only friend we've heard a lot of those stories so those stories are no longer unique every writer every person has an experience has a point of view that is uniquely theirs you don't have to take half an hour to tell to tell it in fact we want it told in 2 minutes in three minutes the most but relate to us something that we can remember that speaks to who you are because that's who we want to work with you know I have a writer who is super talented lovely lovely woman very very shy who came to me and said I don't know what my personal story is and I can't really talk about it and so I had to bring in a lot of anecdotes there were a lot of different stories and they all came out kind of sad and the problem was that she's a comedy writer till one day she brought me a story about her mother she's Korean she grew up naturally with a Korean mother who was obsessed with not wrinkling her face so she taught herself how to laugh without moving any of the muscles on her face so that she would never age and so she told she taught my client to do the same thing fast forward 20 years my client is a comedy writer what does that tell you of course she told it with a little bit more flare and detail but those are the kind of stories that stick that are unique that are memorable that nobody else has those are the stories that you want to share with the industry because they'll remember you that way okay so if someone's envisioning their story and how they may EXP explain it first off how will they or in what arena will they be telling this story like when would it ever come up to say hey you know what Lee tell me about yourself I've seen what you've written but I want to know your deal in every general meeting an executive will sit you down and literally say so tell me about yourself just like that um we talked earlier I I was doing a lot of interviews for this book that I just written and in that environment I'd gone in to meet with agents managers Executives I've never met with before I can't tell you how many times folks that I was interviewing would sit down with me and say so Lee tell me about yourself those are the moments that it's asked and it's in every General it's in every opportunity who are you is there anything for us to connect on is it the story that you tell is it the way that you tell that story is it the sensibility with which you see the world so it's in every general meeting every last general meeting tell me about yourself other than what else do you have it's perhaps the most popular question in this industry Lee where would someone actually be telling their story and how deep do they go how light do they keep it can I Envision the scenario as to how someone's going to be asking about me sure um often times it's going to happen in a general meeting it niceties bottle of water tell me about yourself can I get you something to drink tell me about yourself it's very blunt and upfront and do your show um you know I have writers who have different versions of their stories um so I have one writer who suffered a traumatic event in her childhood and if she is meeting with somebody that she feels an in instant bond and trust with then she will go deeper she will go darker with others she will leave the nitty-gritty out so you tailor your story a little bit to see what in how dark you want to go wear but the rule is never make it a therapy session never bring in a story that you're not ready ready to talk about openly without breaking down without having a moment of tears all of that is unnecessary because a lot of specifically in TV TV really looks at what do you bring into the room right it's not just what your writing is but what personal experience what themes speak to you what what do you bring with you into the writer's room so they want to know that you're capable of talking about whatever it is you're bringing comfortably that it's not going to be a therapy session that there's not going to be suddenly an elephant in the room that makes everybody UNC comfortable so you want to have those layers to the story comedy writers tend to really look for the lighter fluffier happier stuff or the really dark stuff told in a very funny way uh you know tragedy via comedy um but drama writers tend to have those more layered stories that they choose How Deeply to go into um you know so if it's being abandoned by your father is it you know the life of petty crime you're forced into a 12 and how cute you were getting away with it or was it the nights that you spent alone and when you didn't have money to pay for electricity and what that felt like and what it felt like when Social Services showed up and tried to uproot you from your home those are different ways to tell the same story um so writers really do pick and choose and it's important that you assess your environment to really determine which version of which story you're telling um ultimately it's always going to be the same story because you're going to get known for that story and then there'll be other anecdotes that will come along with it um but it really is about finding that core story and taking it out there and getting the industry to know you through it okay so different versions maybe have an A B and C version yeah you have you know you have the kind of deep version where you where you really kind of drill into the story and then you have your more for lack of better words shallow version of it that is less confrontational less demanding of The Listener less uncomfortable potentially um it really is how you look at it some some writers prefer to not expose any sort of wound when they talk about a personal story they're perfectly happy to stay surfacy and and just allude to a wound but it really is about planning it and rehearsing it and exploring it so that when you go into a room that's not when you're Excavating your own story and figuring out what's what works Lee I finished my screenplay very excited about it I'm ready to get it out there what am I supposed to do so it's going to be different for reped writers and rep writers vaguely the same steps but different mechanics if you will um for a rept writer you the one the one kind of Step that will happen for both a reped writer and unrep writer is that you want to really vet the work so you want to get people looking at it whether it's writers in your writers group who are all working writers whether it's a consultant that you pay a fee to or a reader you want to really make sure that in my world I don't want a rep to see a script that hasn't been vetted I'm just not comfortable with it um so you really want to vet it make sure that it's holding up that enough people are having the right response to it as opposed to saying well it's a pass for me but here's what worked about it if it's a pass for them across the board it's a problem so you want to really vet it make sure that it's holding up that it's really strong um now if you're a rept writer let's say you're looking for new representation you're going to give it to your other writer friends you're going to give it to agents and managers that you've met previously see how they respond to the work if if you're an unrep writers you're going to give it to your circle of friends see if any of them gets inspired by it you're not asking them for an introduction you're asking them for a read you can also go out and build pedigree for it which means you're going to answer the question why should I read the script so how do you answer that you answer it with some element that certifies your script as ready for the industry that can be The Blacklist the website that can be spec Scout which is another website it can be a big contest all of those are filtering services that are in place for the industry to filter through thousands and thousands of screenplays that are registered on a regular basis but how do you find the great scripts among them that's where contest comes in that's where television writing fellowships come in screenwriting Labs come in um and websites like The Blacklist that are able to provide evaluations and rank the script um so you try to build some pedigree specifically if you're an unknown writer in order to answer the question why should I read the script I have 120 scripts sitting in my queue you just queried me about one I've never heard of why in the world should I read it cuz it's good as just not good enough so having the ability to say well this was a nickel semi-finalist or this got an eight on The Blacklist or I was just a finalist for the ABC Disney Fellowship all of those things are the reasons why one should read the script in addition to that once you have a little bit of pedigree as an unknown writer you want to start getting the work out there so you want to to get it out to your friends who can potentially help you get the work to agents managers you want to pitch the work so whether you want to participate in live pitch events that happen in Los Angeles in Austin also a little bit in London or do online pitching that's stage 32 and road map writers provide year round you want to start talking about the work and getting it out there that is your job your job is to get reject rejected if you don't get enough rejections you're not doing your job if you're afraid of that no stop being afraid um but really your job is to use that script to build relationships for yourself yes you want to enter it into contests because if you're not able to get any interest pitching the material in 6 months time if you're able to place well in a contest it will give your script Second Wind um I have one writer who was just a finalist in Austin now was a finalist for final draft was a finalist for page um he had written a script that his agent ultimately didn't respond to at all put the script into a bunch of contests placed well in all those contests now there're suddenly interest for management other people want to talk to him about it he's not writing for an audience of one he's no longer just writing for an agent to say yay or nay um so you want to take that script and use it to build inroads to opportunity okay let's suppose I've put it out there either I'm repped or unrep and there's no heat on it then you have to take a look and say okay where where is the problem sometimes the script just will not get hit the heat that it requires because who knows um you look at something like Nick Yo's um a letter from rosemary Kennedy that was a semi-finalist in the nickel and then nothing and then I went on the The Blacklist website and was a featured screenplay and nothing until somebody discovered it now the writer is with WME Emma Stone is attached to the material to Star um you know at some point you have to have conviction in your work one of the managers that I love working with is a guy by the name of Ross and one of the reasons I love working with him is because once I asked him I love him for many different reasons but once I asked him if you send a script to 50 people and everybody passes what do you do and he said I find the next 50 people and you have to have that level of conviction in your work if you the work is vetted if you know that it's being received as intended so if people in the know have read the work and said yeah it's great it's really great I love it you have to fight for it um and listen there's some great scripts that you fight for that nothing happens with and then that that other script that you think will never be as good at is the is the one that hits but you have to fight for the work you have to believe in the work nobody's going to believe in it more than you and yes some scripts will come up short we don't know why we don't have the perfect explanation you know I have a writer who wrote a great feature this is a rept writer um wrote a great great great feature script very dark um that had to do with police violence and ultimately then Dallas happened and so everybody looked at the writer and said yeah really good script congratulations not going to do anything with it those things happen and that's okay um but you have to fight for the script as much as you can unless there is some sort of impediment that's stopping it from proceeding forward like that meanwhile while you're fighting for the script you better be writing your next one so that if it does open that door and people say great I read it love your writing what else do you have you have that thing to give but you have to fight for every script you have to pitch it because if you don't believe it in it enough to pitch it to fight for it to invest in it why should anybody else continuing on with fighting for the work suppose you're working with someone that come to you and you either have someone who's very sort of uh self-deprecating almost mousike or someone who's more of an overconfident bragger either one's probably detrimental getting their work out yes so what are your rules for sort of either breaking down the bragger or maybe you're not or boosting up the mouse well with with the mouse I just talked to one such Mouse this morning um who takes every failure every know as as a testament to her own lifelong predestined failure and so I have very hard brutal conversations about the fact there there will be a lot of rejection there will be a lot of NOS at every level at every level of this industry nothing's ever perfect nothing's ever just handed to you and so it's important to me to have a lot of candid conversations about learning not to take the nose with quite as much weight uh because if you do it's just never ending right it's it's just a recipe for disaster um so we talk a lot about conviction in the work believing in your work believing in your potential not needing to rely on other people for your own selfworth because really that's what it boils down to um and so we talk about that a lot and we talk about fattening up people's lives um so making sure that my writers who are mousy um have their sources their Dependable sources of fun that it's not all about the writing all the time because the other side of it is if it's just the writing if it's all about the writing all the time and nothing else eventually they'll have nothing else to invest in the writing itself they'll have nothing to bring to the writing so it's really kind of filling out their lives and making sure that that they're fulfilled on many different levels and it's not just the writing that defines them because if it's only the writing that defines you a you will become a very boring writer and B it will never be fulfilling enough ever and I've seen that a million times Hemingway committed suicide you know there's something to learn there um and so the ones who are tend to be a little bit more braggy um tend to be a little bit more egotistical um a a bit more full of themselves we'll talk a lot about how their behavior is coming off and I will do a lot of meeting prep with them and talk about you know the way that you're talking about that to me comes off a certain way and you may want to pay attention to these things that's why I'm here I'm here to reflect that and be a mirror to those things um and so we'll certainly talk about how those things come off and that we can't afford that um nobody wants to work with somebody who is just completely full of themselves I had recently a conversation with a manager about a a client of mine that he represents and he says you know I think this client is just couldn't care less about my opinion and I said well actually I think it's quite the contrary I think that he's desperate to impress you and I think because of that he may be coming off a little bit bigger and more boastful but it's out of desperation to get you on his side to get get you to Rally behind him it's not for lack of respect it's because of respect that he's behaving that way so many times writers don't have me as a go-between um to communicate to their agent or their managers or the executive that they're working with so a lot of it is me talking to them about listen this is how I'm reading you right now I know it doesn't sound fun and I'm sorry to say this and I love you and I know what a great person you are but this is how I'm reading this is this how you want me to read this CU if you're fine with it keep going but I'm reading your behavior as that of one who is smarter than anybody else in the room nobody wants to work with that can I hear some examples let's suppose conversations with the self-deprecating writers conversations with the bragger because maybe this person doesn't recognize who they are um a bragger the most obvious and overt ones are the braggers that will come in and say and these are usually not professional writers because professional writers don't do this and have learned better and have broken because they don't but it has happened this is the greatest script you're ever going to read that's a big statement I am the Michael Jordan of screenwriting whoa hold on I've had these are things that have been said to me for the record you know this this is the script you've been waiting for take the script somebody told me once take the script on vacation this is my vacation gift to you oh how kind read it I want you to sit at sunset read it on The Veranda because this will make your vacation great um so those things have been said to me um you know you want to steer clear of this is the great this is the best script ever you can certainly say this is the greatest thing I've ever written I'm really proud of it I've worked really hard at it you know I have eight scripts behind me and this is my best one that's not bar braggy that is genuine but somebody coming in and saying oh my God this is so much better than anything else out there I had one writer working writer no longer working writer um who used to be very very successful had fallen from Grace a bit not a great deal um but who used to every year write a list of all the screenplays that were nominated for Academy Awards and then write Arguments for why why his script was better and send it out in Christmas cards oh yeah wow okay not a good idea just not a good idea if you're saying to me that your script that's unproduced that nobody wanted to pick up that has been read by everybody but nobody loved it is better than Argo you're H it's a problem um so that's you know that's the baggery side and and of course the examples I brought in are a little bit on the ex extreme side of it but I think you get the tone of it um you know the most the more self-de defeating writers it usually is conversation about I got this rejection I know that I will never be the person I want to be there's usually a direct connection about what rejection means about the person not about the script or the person reading the script I I'm not going to make it as a writer I will never be happy I will never be fulfilled I'm just a loser I didn't make it in this contest I can't can't tell you the rhyme or or Reason of screenwriting contests I've been in this industry forever and I still don't understand them and I have writers saying oh I I didn't make the quarterfinals in the nickel I'm a loser I know that I'm a loser now I'm a bad Rider hold on there's going to be lots more rejections there's going to be lots more opportunities to be a loser don't jump at the chance so quickly but for a lot of writers it's very real and don't me wrong every writer has a moment or 15 of being self- defeatist you know I have one writer who's a working writer who always says that if you're not thinking about quitting at least twice a week you're doing something wrong and I believe him I I think it's very very true I think every writer thinks they're failing at a moment every writer thinks that they're not good enough every writer thinks that they're never going to be able to recreate the past success that they've had I think that's perfectly part of the deal but seeing everything as a failure as an indication that you are just a loser or you are just a bad writer or you are just a bad person that is what I see in the more self- defeated defeated writers and the problem is that nobody wants to work with that nobody wants to be in a room with that nobody wants to pick up your script as a validation to who you are as a human being they want to pick up your script because it's a great script and they want to bring you into the room because they think you have something to contribute not because they think that you need the room and that's that's a big distinction so are you giving these people pep talks or that's not really what your job is about oh I give people pep talks I'm I'm Israeli I'm married to a New Yorker so there's a lot of tough love in the picture um you know admittedly I get a lot of tears from a lot of people and I want to be the safe space to that and the place for writers to voice frustrations and I certainly try to support them through it you know they're writers where if I see that we're getting to a place where every time we meet it's just horrible and the writer is in pieces I will ask why in the world are you doing this it's more important to be happy than to be a writer what are you doing um so I will I will have those conversations there are pep talks there is tough love um and there is a shoulder to give I recognize that this is a really really hard profession you know I was talking to a writer this morning who was really frustrated with a set of notes that she had was given an Implement on a pilot that she just sold but the draft that she turned in she was wasn't delighted with and it took a toll on her because she really wants to do the best at everything and it brought her to question why am I doing this and this is not her first time to the rodeo and you know should I really keep going because this happens every time and I said to her you know what the day you sold this pilot you called me on the drive home after the pilot sold in the room and you told me that this is one of the happiest days of your life now you're having a bad day this is not one of the worst days of your life and because of that you're going to keep going and that's the truth of the matter we're all going to have bad days here and I'm here to support my writers through them but it's about understanding when they're some bad days and when it's all bad days Lee I think you've said that feature writers should have a new readyto market feature script every six months or so and that TV writer should have a new original pilot every like 3 to four months in a perfect world yes okay is that a lot of pressure though it is a lot of pressure I find the most features go 6 to 12 months you know the truth of the matter is if you take 14 months and you come out with a great sample I'm not going to hold it against you um you know the the important thing for me is that you keep writing and you keep finishing work uh for pilots in a perfect world I would like to see two generated in a year um sometimes it happens that it's only one sometimes it happens that it's three it really depends on the writer so there isn't one set course that you're supposed to follow but it really is about doing the work and then getting the work out there sometimes you'll work on a script and you'll say you know I've worked on this for eight months I've tackled it every which way it's not happening so it's also knowing when to let something go not for all eternity but potentially to come back to it later when you've had a stroke of Genius that informs you how to take the work how to make it better um you know but the point with having those broad goals is to just do the work and get it out there rather than spend years and years and years tinkering with one screenplay that then you're at the risk of after three years and I just went through this with a writer tinkering with the same script for three years and then going oh it's not good enough it'll never be good enough I'm not going to get it out there and then starting another script and spending another two years on something and then going oh but it's still not good enough I'm not going to get this out there that is the challenge that we run into that so because of that you really want to expose the work early and often so that means from concept you want to run the concept by people in the know whether they're members of your writer's group or in a class or whatever it is have people look at your outline and really don't be afraid to expose the work to get feedback to have questions asked I was just sitting with a writer of mine who had written a script a feature script um with the guidance of his manager um and they had been on the script for a year and a half and then he gave the script to a few writer friends and he got some massive notes back and what he said to me is if only we'd given it out on outline which is what we all were pushing him to do but he felt loyal to the manager he didn't want to expose it and I understand I understand the choice that he made it was in in a tough spot do you listen do you serve the one master or do you open yourself up I generally prefer to expose work early and often because I think it just saves you a lot of time in the end is someone writing for themselves or for the industry that's a good question somebody's writing the stories that they love that they are passionate about I don't believe in writing to the market because ultimately you'll always be behind um you know what you're writing now if you're writing with what's you know whatever is happening in the industry right now in six months it's going to be dated so I think writing to the industry can be a losing battle um while you should write with an awareness of your audience who your audiences whether it's television or film who would watch this show where does the show belong what season does this film get released is this a summer blockbuster is this an endof Year movie is this a February movie is it going to be a movie for 16 to 24 year olds or is it going to be a movie for 49 year olds and older what are we talking about you should be aware of all of those things but you shouldn't write to them I think the moment that you try to engineer your work towards something it loses its Brilliance I know somebody a manager who for a long time was working with his girlfriend to engineer script for The Blacklist for the list The Blacklist ultimately that script was never finished because it was engineered and then the manager then came back and said to me yeah we we tried to engineer it clearly a bad idea um so you have to you have to listen to your heart's song in that sense you have to really write the original exciting material that is Uniquely Yours that that is the story that you're dying to tell with some awareness of how the market will or won't receive it so if you want to write a script that is going to be full of singing and speaking eels it's likely going to be a challenge um but if you have to do it do it um but write it in a way that is true for you write write the story that you want to tell in a way that is exciting to you but that can be digested by the market that it's for Lee can you share some stories of writers that were unrep that went to then become repped and worked in television of course um there too many good stories there is the problem um but one of my favorite stories that that is a story something happened to a client of mine this past year um this is a client um a writer whom I met through UCLA um we started working together he then started taking classes at a program called Script Anatomy that I'm a big fan of um really perfected his work wrote a fantastic pilot that ended up actually coming um in second place in the prestigious UCLA contest um using this pilot he found a manager who decided to shop the pilot which is highly unlikely today to shop a pilot from a brand new writer um but he found a manager a very well-known and well respected manager um who took out the script they went on a bunch of meetings and a bunch of networks ultimately at that point nothing had come come of it um but he continued to network pretty aggressively and in a pretty focused fashion he is Latino and he went to a panel of Latino writers and had prepped for the panel before it had happened um and so he walked in knowing a little bit about each one of the panelists he tried to communicate with three of the four um those three he couldn't really make any sort of connection with but the fourth writer he really HIIT it off with um ultimately he felt like he didn't want to stalk the writer he didn't want to be the guy going can you read my script um so he befriended him on Facebook and Twitter and that was was the end of it few months passed and he realized that this writer was teaching a class at writing pad um which is a writing program um and said you know I'm going it's it's a prep class for the television fellowships I want to go sign up for the class because as part of this class this writer is going to have to read my work the writer read his work called him up and said hey I think I know of an opportunity for you it turned out the opportunity was Staffing on American Crime season 3 the most prestigious show on network television based on the writer's personal story the writer went on to meet with the executive producer of the show and then went on to have a call with John Ridley um he had no in the room experience he was then called in to meet with ABC Disney's inclusion Department which subsidizes the fellowship um they all signed off on him and three days before the room opened he got the call that he is Staffing on this show um I I really love this story because I feel like it takes the onus of getting that first job out of the agent or manager's hand the writer is now signed with CAA um writing feverishly seeing him tomorrow at 8:00 in the morning um you know hard at work he he just finished his season of American Crime where he had a co-write so he had a he had a co-written by credit on his own episode EP um you know just as euphoric as can be love the experience but it's a writer who really made it happen for himself rather than saying okay I have an agent I have a manager I'm going to sit on my hands and wait uh for something like that to happen so I particularly love that story um because it it just shows you what a writer who is smart about networking can do for himself um and you know he went from a complete unknown taking classes in UCLA to a rep and working writer so that's interesting because I think a lot of people that are signed are going to feel like they're that's where their work stops in terms of them having a search so can you dispel that myth supposed absolutely signed by one of the bigger agencies and they feel like okay now I've arrived but really not the interesting thing is that most writers who get repped right even in the bigger on the the kind of bigger landscape with a bigger agency CA WME UTA I if they truly stop and ask their agent and manager or their agent so are you going to get me a job most of them are going to tell them getting you your first job is not my responsibility that is the truth of the matter so writers have to continue to network to get themselves out there so for example I had a writer who was won the UCLA contest on both the feature or the the TV original TV pilot and spec front as you do um got an A manager through that then went on and got into two fellowships in one year got a manager and an agent ultimately got her job through her Fellowship but her management was instrumental in introducing her to her showrunner who then paid for her out of pocket which is pretty non-standard when it comes to the writing programs that are supposed to subsidized some of these staff writer roles um so I find that writers when writers get repped especially with a manager but it's also true with an agent there's always ongoing work whether it's networking whether it's doing showrunner meetings not getting the job and then getting the the you know the the all the gift that is the freelance the freelance script on the TV season um so there's a lot of work to be done by the writer it's rarely just sit on your hands I have a writer who um was in a showrunner meeting today I don't know how it went yet um who is always out there who's always networking who is at every event who is on a board with the wga who's on a board with the PGA who is just always out there working for himself and getting himself out there and yes his agents at WME are carrying part of the load but he is doing a fair share of the work now the important thing to remember is that your agents and your managers they're collecting 10% getting a writer his first job is not 10% of the work it's going to take a lot more than that because of that writers have to always be vigilant about getting out there and working their contacts and communicating with their people and getting to know showrunners and doing everything that they can if not to get the job then to inspire their reps to work even harder for them okay so now I'm repped now what where does the real work begin now now the pressure is on now the real pressure is on because ultimately you got repped on a script you got repped on a contest win or a fellowship placement now it's about continuing to impress your rep it's no longer about the one script that will get you that one person's attention now it's about staying front of mind for your rep so it's continuing to generate work not taking too much time between scripts but making sure the scripts are up to standards it's about continuing to network calling into your agent's office and saying I just met with Yad y can you send them the script it's about you know I have a writer who just got signed got two months ago um and she is constantly she's a master networker she is constantly out there meeting with people and calling her manager and saying I just met with this person who wants me to work on that idea please please pick it up and run with it um so it's working even harder working with a greater sensitivity to your manager your agent sensibilities what they will or won't get out there it's about showing them your hunger not not in words but in actions um it's about managing your communication it's about understanding that until you've begun to work they're working for you for free so you better be nice about it it's uh it's really not the time to puff up your out your chest um you know but really respecting the relationship and respecting what they're doing for you often times for free for a long period of time while continuing to impress them you want them to continue to bet on you and for that you have to hit the bullseye every time so the writing has to be that much stronger you have to deliver you have to be great in meetings they have to get calls from their friends the executive saying April was just in here oh my God I loved her she is so great I want to develop something with her keep me in mind for her next script you have to impress you have to impress at every turn and you know often times most writers by the time they get picked up for representation have the capacity to do that because they've interfaced with enough writers they've met the industry they've worked on their personal story they want to be collaborative they want that push and they understand that this is a hard industry to crack but once you do it's it's really great it's really fun um and so they're willing to put in the work but the work only gets more demanding I don't know that harder is the right work word but more more demanding as you go along as you get an agent as you get a manager as you meet Executives as you impress Executives as you build your fan base that wants to read the next thing and the the next thing you always have to get better you have to get stronger does the screenwriter find themselves an agent or does the work find them the agent in a perfect world the way that we'd love to see it work is your script comes in as a finalist for the nickel every manager and agent in town reaches out to you boom you have a manager or an agent right you win the UCLA contest very much the same scenario Austin Film Festival that is not always the scenario the scenario for most writers is that they're going to work pretty hard to find the rep it's usually going to be manager first because managers really today serve as talent scouts for the big agencies um and it's going to take a lot of work a lot of diligence and a lot of consistency to find that rip so for example one of my writers who just got signed a couple months ago had this list of the managers and agents that she would approach every time she would finish a script and it was vetted and she knew it was ready to go she had placed top three in final draft some years ago but nothing materialized rep wise and so she had finished a new script that she was really excited about and we were sitting across from one another and going through her list and she said ah do I have to send a script to this manager again I've sent him like five scripts and he doesn't like anything and I said yeah you send it to everybody that's just what we do and 3 weeks later that manager became her manager who's now sending her out on an extreme amount of generals and showrunner meetings um because finally the thing came aboard that he felt okay I knew you a writer I knew you were good I know that you're consistent now you wrote something great um so often times it ends up being the writer finding the rep rather than the rep finding the writer um even though we'd like to think that in a perfect world a you know rep would come knocking on your door in truth it's a referral business so the best reps and the best relationships are forged through referrals where somebody will say hey my friend Joe just finished this great script you should read it um because really that's what the industry trust we're we're highly social industry um so if you can get those referrals which is why you Foster relationships those are Priceless um it's much easier to get a rep through a referral than it is through a contest placement unless you're winning that contest um or Through The Blacklist unless you get the coveted nine rating on The Blacklist um so really it's about working those relationships so that those referrals will be in place when you have that script that that's ready to share let's talk about inconsistency for creatives versus the people that maybe they're so on the nose and so precise but maybe they've lost some of the creative flare I happen to see a lot of people that are inconsistent be incredibly creative and actually have brilliant ideas they just don't follow up on them yeah and then on the flip side the ones that actually do follow up sometimes the creativity or the Flare still needs to be flushed out so how do you nurture both types well you really have to look at writing as a job rather than a muse right it's um Larry Carusi and Scott Alexander talk about they they wrote um people versus OJ Simpson and Larry Flint and and a whole bunch of biopics and biod dramas and they talk about this is a job and we go into work even when we don't feel it and some days the writing is great and some days it's horrible but it's the work sometimes you have to write through a lot of horrible pages to get to some good P pages and I'm a big believer in that um you know sometimes you have to try something different um you know so it's staying agile and open to the different ways to access creativity uh sometimes it's rejecting creativity and just going for inspiration and through inspiration getting back to creativity but you have to accept that what works on one script will likely not work on the next and so you always always always have new tricks to try in your writing new ways to access the work new methodology to follow new things that will inspire you you know and if if nothing else then you know you go and do something for fun uh because fun be gets motivation um so whether your fun is dancing or hiking or jogging on the beach or whatever it is you usually come back pumped up and excited um that said you know creativity is tough to always channel so a lot of my writers rely on meditation on regular workouts on tracking systems to set their expectations for what they're going to create and when um you know a lot of self journals a lot of goals and targeting um so that at some point your your system begins to understand that you have to show up whether you feel like it or not what are those tracking systems that's really interesting um there's something called self journal the lot of my clients use that is a planner um a task driven planner um with short-term goals and long-term goals a lot of writers rely on systems like Pomodoro um that requires 25 minute sessions um so really varies depends on the writer um but every writer finds their path so some writers write for page count some writers write for our count um you have to find what is your comfortable space to write three pages at a time or six pages at a time or three hours at a time what can you meet what can you meet consistently because it's kind of like going to the gym first few days are going to be really really hard especially when you haven't been in a little while on day 12 13 14 you're going to hit your stride and if you keep going then you're going to be fine um and it's the same with writing you just have have to keep doing it in order to get comfortable with it um the beginning is always going to feel Rusty and clunky by the end you're going to be hitting your stride Lee you mentioned earlier some planning and tracking software I'm wondering in terms of uh screenwriting programs can it really teach someone to be a better writer no um you know truly writing is inspiration writing is a craft if you get a hammer it's not going to teach you how to be a better Carpenter and may make the cre creation of carpentry easier just not going to teach you how to be a better writer um you know it is a craft it's a craft that has to be practiced um sure there are tools like dramatica to help you etc etc and save the cat and all of those um but you know I've seen writers take on Save the cat and not get screenwriting to save their lives um it's not paint by numbers and you know if you're colorblind painting by numbers is really not going to work for you and that's pretty much the equation so I think that all of those things have their uses and I think that they can be very important guides um for the mechanics of your work but you the writer are going to have to master the craft I'm a big believer in Malcolm gladwell's 10,000 hours um you shouldn't be shy of getting those um you know for most writers the first script is not going to be the script the second script is not going to be the script you're going to have to really get better at your craft and there's no shortcutting that even if you filled out the you know 40 beats of save the cat perfectly that's does not mean a perfect script ever right it's like Malcolm gladwell's the outlier terms of environment fostering genius or genius already being in someone but environment either hindering it or getting it out there have you seen that where oh certainly listen there has to be a kernel of Genius there you can be a technically proficient writer but if you're not able to invest some soul in your work if you're not able to really get feel the way that that it sings then it it will always feel mechanical you know I had a girlfriend growing up who really really wanted to be a great pianist she never felt it so her playing was entirely proficient but entirely cold and the same thing happens with screenplays there has to be some whether we want to call a genius or anything else Talent something innate that you're able to invest in the work that makes it uniquely your own or else it just becomes a perfectly technically executed screenplay but not a great screenplay and I do believe that that's the difference between good and great it's that extra thing and certainly environment can nurture or destroy it um but I've seen I can tell you sadly that I've seen Writers come to screenwriting and really really really want to get it but they don't and you try it every different way I was I was speaking recently to a friend who's a UCLA instructor who said you know I always I always believe that anybody can be taught how to write and then once in a while somebody walks in my class and reminds me that no that's just not the case there's some things that either you understand them innately or you don't I think most people that come to this come with some innate understanding of screenwriting with the flow of screenwriting um with the general structure the general rhythm of screenwriting um but I think you certainly want an environment to nurture it to promote it and to help you rise to your very best criticism makes our best work absolutely listen I I believe in kind criticism so I don't believe in cruelty for the sake of Cruelty but I don't believe that we learn much from compliments I think they can certainly boost our ego and make us feel good but the learning happens from criticism or the learning happens from where we can improve what we can do better that's how we grow while you know flattery and compliments feel great we're not going to walk out a better writer tomorrow because of what we learned from the compliment we're going to perhaps be more self assured in what we did originally well which is great and I'm not discounting that but criticism is what teaches us and challenges us to become our best what was the internal dialogue that you had when you decided that screenwriting for you sitting down writing a script maybe wasn't what you wanted to do but you wanted to coach people you wanted to bring out their best for me it was really in the development process when I realized what a foolish child I was thinking that you can write a script and then fast forward six or 9 or 12 months and see it brought to the screen and being on set while watching your vision come to life um I understood that I came to it from a very naive point of view uh from a fantasy based point of view that wasn't the reality of what it of how movies get made and what the writer's experiences and I ultimately realized that that wasn't the experience that I wasn't I wanted to have or the experience that would make me happy or fulfilled in my day-to-day life and I was lucky enough to have discovered that at a fairly young age at the age of 23 um to say whoa that no not for me I'm not enjoying this this is nothing about this is exciting or motivating for me um that said I always loved story and I always loved writers so from there I went to development and really realized my heart was with with the writer the writers were my people um more so than the directors that I never really got or the actors that I dated but never really got um so my heart was with the writers and so I wanted to Foster talent I wanted to support writers and it's funny because today if I watch a tennis game and somebody wins the person wins and goes out and you know jumps up and down they're so excited the person I identify with is not the tennis player the person I identify with is the coach that you get like one second of um who's just so proud and so and feel so rewarded for what their player had done and that's for me that's the most fulfilling experience being able to help others and being in a position where somebody comes to me and says I need help I think that's a highly privileged position to be asked to provide help in in an area in which I can help have you seen people that have the no whether it's to be a great pianist or to be a great writer but in terms of the daytoday actions that they're going to undergo it's actually not what they're suited for oh absolutely and and what what are those what is that temperament and what is it just it's being alone it's being self-driven task oriented it's not just that I know a lot of writers and these I'll put in quotation marks who talk about writing all the time who talk about what they want to write and how much they want to be a writer and how much they want to be in a room and how much but never make time for the writing itself so to me those those are the writers that will usually bring me to the conversation of do you really want to write because you're talking about it all the time but you're not actually doing it and if you are a writer who is not writing then what are you in terms of this career you have to have the discipline you have to have the desire you have to have the drive and you have to be willing to make the sacrifices that most writers do that it takes in order to become a writer and that means waking up in the morning early if you have a day job sorry um or writing on the weekends or writing after hours rather than running around partying with your friends there's a lot of for Mo most writers most writers are not independently wealthy right they're not going to be able to sit around all day and take four hours a day to ride and then go party and then go run around then go travel the world so most Riders are going to find themselves in a situation where they have to have a day job potentially they have a family they have a partner they have friends they have relationships they want to maintain and so writing is going to demand some level of sacrifice I had a writer that ID worked with for a number of years who we would meet every three or four months and every three or four months she would sit down and tell me the list of excuses for why she didn't write the previous three or four months so the job was too hard and she had to work out because she wasn't healthy and she wasn't sleeping well and she had to move apartments and she was fostering dogs and there was always something um and she I truly believe that she wanted she believed she wanted to be a writer but at the end of the day if you're not engaging in the thing right whether it's writing or playing piano or any one of the things you cannot claim the thing as your own you have to engage in it in some consistency and you know similarly I meet writers who wrote a screenplay 10 years ago and haven't touched it since but they're a writer but you have to actively engage in the thing if you want to be taken seriously as an owner of the thing Lee let's talk about writing Partnerships sure and is it like finding a good roommate is it nothing like that no it's like buying a house together and committing to living in it for the rest of your life okay um writing Partnerships are mostly tragic they mostly end in divorce um you know I do work with a couple of Partnerships that have been consistent Through The Years um that have been successful but it's two writing Partnerships that have lasted from the dozens that I've seen break up over the years some of which were quite successful together um so if you choose to participate in a writing partnership you have to really understand what it means to you to your body of work um effectively the moment that you are that you hit with a script written partnership with another person everything else that will be expected of you will be expected in cooporation in partnership with this other person because you and this other person have been able to create the secret sauce that made a great script the birth a beautiful child if you will um and so when you consider writing Partnerships you really want to consider what it means for your body of work are you willing to discard your previous body of work or not do anything with it should you hit in a partnership um are you will willing to write more than one project with that writing partner um because an agent or manager is going to take on the partnership not an individual writer oftentimes they're not going to want to get involved in the drama of a partnership breaking up that can be very unattractive I have a writing a TV writing partnership that just broke up that the agent told the two writers who broke up either I take both of you on individually or I take neither one of you on individually so even broken up the writers both had to make sure the other impressed in order to keep the agent for both of them or else they both lose because the agent just didn't want to get involved in the politics she didn't want to have to choose um so you really have to consider whether you and the writing partner want to write the same sort of material if you have the same vision so if one wants to write film and the other wants to write TV and that's all you want to write that's going to be a problem the times that you can really vacillate in and out of a partnership is if you're writing together on television but you're writing alone in film then you have a little bit more wiggle room but in general I find that reps want to either rep the team or the individuals not both um it's the same with producers sorry um who want to work with a team who brought them a a beautiful previous project um you know so you really have to consider what the partnership is what the partners bring into the partnership so you really want to think about how does the the partnership balance out are we good with the distribution of work are we going to be good for the next 10 years because if one writer is doing the heavy lifting and the other is is just giving notes are you going to feel okay about it in 5 years when your writing partner is collecting 50% of your money just for giving notes um are you do you have a common vision for what it is you want to write in 10 years in terms of genre in terms of the space you want to be in all of those things have to be thought through you certainly want to get the terms of the partnership on paper um you know because the truth of the matter is most most Partnerships do go self I'm thinking of what I like to call the two Steves wnc and job so you look at if it was two Steve Jobs it wouldn't have worked but because they both had these different skill sets it worked yeah and so two writers have almost got to be Polar Opposites don't you think for it to work they have to complement one another they have to supplement where the other is weaker they have to bring the best out of each other they have to push each other they have to be able to fight um you know certainly you don't want two writers who do the exact same thing together right because then is the partnership the sum of its parts or is it less than that um you know so you want writers who compliment one another one another where the other is weak right right interesting do you think people really know that when they first no meet someone no um a lot of writers that I find tend to look to writing Partnerships because they don't want to write alone anymore because it's just comforting to have somebody waiting for pages on the other side of things um because they're finding that that it's getting tougher and tougher for them to push a script through so why don't I do it with a writing partner um I find that most writers go to Partnerships that way without taking a step back and saying am I really ready to step into a creative marriage here some of them do most of them don't um you know I've had Partnerships Who Sold multi-million dollar scripts and then broke up um because the relationship was so difficult why at that point because the writers can't stand each other at that point because they hate each other because they couldn't think less of each other's creative talents um because it was never it was never a positive relationship to start with potentially you know I had one one relationship where that had a feature film get greenlit where the two writers just could not get along one was incredibly abusive and condescending and kept insisting that he was doing all of the work when the other was really doing the brunt of the work um just didn't want to go through that again um so I've seen WR writing Partnerships break up with a lot to lose and I think it's not for nothing like I said I've also seen writing Partnerships succeed but I think it's where the Partnerships come together with a point of view of doing this together for the Long Hall as opposed to let's try it out really thinking about it um as a long-term relationship as opposed to we'll test the waters and then consider what about choosing an agent or manager I mean it's great to have one of the big powerhouses want to rep you but how do you know if that person's really for you the same temperament the same the truth is that you never know um you know there's a lot of selling that happens with when agents and manager Court Talent um but you certainly want to query your agent manager verbally when you meet with them um what is it that they do do they believe in general meetings do they not believe in general meetings are they going to get you your first Staffing gig do do they not believe in it do they want you to do fellowships what do they want you to do what are they going to do for you um do they give notes do they not give notes do they sign off on log lines do they just want you to write blindly and either they like it or they don't um so you really want to ask those questions um not in a disrespectful manner but just to understand what this particular rep is willing to do for you with with managers the bigger qu the biggest question is do you develop do you not velop those are two different approaches to management um do you are you for agents are you not for agents are you going to help me with Staffing are you not those are things that you want to understand so that you don't get an agent or a manager and then six months later go wait you're not going to help me get my first TV job wait you don't develop and I'm just going to keep writing scripts and either you love them or nothing happens to them they go back on the Shelf so those are things that you really want to inquire about with the people that you're meeting with just to understand the dynamic of the relationship is it advisable to try to switch agents within the same house of representation it's rarely promoted or allowed um you know the usually agents will move clients as opposed to clients will fire One agent for another so for example I had an um a client at CIA whose lit agent went two Talent so she was assigned another agent um within the agency because the agency didn't want to lose her um but it's considered fairly difficult to change agencies or agents within an agency without burning some some relationships um the one thing that I do see happen is say you are with a big agent in a big agency and they're just much too busy servicing their big clients that's when you can come in and say listen I know you're really busy servicing JJ Abrams is there any way that I can be assigned a junior agent for the day-to-day um to potentially bring somebody else onto the team um to help you out in just submissions getting you out there uh be it for assignments for Staffing anything like that um that's when you can have Team growth as opposed to just be changing hands Lee what do writers need to know about writing for television a lot um writing for television um it's it's a corporate job really in a lot of ways it is a morning toight regular in-office job granted every office is different so you're going to have some rooms where you're in the room for 40 some odd weeks you're going to have some rooms that convene for three weeks after which writers go off to write their own episodes um it works differently with every show some shows writers from staff writers will end up on set producing their own episode and others they won't it but it is similar to a corporate structure in that you rise up in the levels from year to year um if you are writing consistently doing a good job you're expected to see bumps from year to year so staff writer to story editor story Editor to Executive story editor on and on and on um they say that television is significantly harder to break into but easier to create a consistent income in so easier to make a living in on an ongoing basis uh film on the other hand is easier to break into um you know but television really is all about character theme and World it really is about exploring those and examining those in an ongoing basis film tends to be more plot driven um but things like pitching in the room being able to present ideas in the room being able to politic properly within a room in order to promote yourself all of that comes into play in the world of Television um it's highly competitive therefore highly social um you really have to keep your showrunner relationship your executive producer relationship and your relationship with a network if you're working in a network environment um fresh and fostered um it's really a 365 day a year job it doesn't have the freedom of film um where you really are kind of sent off to do your rewrites even on assignment um you are constantly working in harmony with others um and it's a world where people easily lose their job get new jobs etc etc um so it's a demanding world it's a growing World we're seeing you know roughly 4,100 WJ members collect income from television per year and I'm not talking about residuals um it's also a high reward kind of world because as you rise in the ranks you will get more and more and more financial reward um and it is a world where you can build a living right you can buy a house and assume that in five years you'll unless you really mess up in some grotesque worry you will be able to maintain a living that said I've seen writers mess up in grotesque ways in TV and continue to work once you're in you're able to sustain a career it's very tough to break into there are two paths that are seen as kind of the the more sure bets to break in in a world where nothing is certain so those paths are the television writing programs that are offered by the networks um as well as a few additional organizations such as humanitas Sundance HBO um Cape nhmc those kind of writing programs that Foster new Talent um that's one way to break in another way is to go the assistant route um so become a showrunner assistant become a writer's assistant even start as a PA in the room that said there are other ways to breaking in the web has been very helpful we're seeing people like Issa Ray um really make their Mark transitioning from the web to television of known writers to um write web series and from that get staffed um it's highly competitive but the majority of wga sanctioned jobs are in television today um and it's a growing industry what is shrinking is the size of the room um so as we go into more basic cable and digital rooms we're seeing those rooms get smaller so I have writers in network rooms where I have 18 writers in a room you're not going to see that on an Amazon show on a Netflix show on a Hulu show you're going to see significantly smaller rooms that are very tour driven um but certainly it is a growing industry where everybody's looking for great new voices let's talk about finding the culture of that room and respecting the culture and being able to fit in the culture is different with every room so you know I had this year I had one writer in one room that opened at 11: closed at 3: was open for 3 weeks and was done the writers had lunch together everybody got along it was a bit of a Kumbaya um you know I've had writers in rooms that it was pure tyranny um where the showrunner ruled the room with a heavy hand um where there was a lot of persecution of the writers who didn't fit in and that's where I think it's very similar to corporate structure you can have great corporate environment and you can have a poor corporate environment um but it really is about learning your place in that room so if you're coming in as a staff writer learning when to pitch when to sit back when to support when to shut up um what to get involved and what not to get involved with so of course you have lists of no NOS um you know you don't want to step on somebody else's pitches you don't want to write a dead pitch you don't want to engage in office gossip you don't want to write anything about the room on on Twitter ever especially if it's negative um so you have those things that are the the kind of codes of conduct that said every room is different so I've seen writers get away in some things with in some rooms where in another room forget about it um you know but it really is for for new writers it is about finding your place being able to be useful being able to not melt into the background um and really contribute to the room from g day one because it's a kind of job where you have to perform from the first day there is no learning curve you don't have the time to ramp up well it sounds like also do you have to make it work within your room with those I mean sometimes you're going to be there what 15 hours a day with people absolutely um you know comedy rooms tend to go longer just because things are funnier at midnight than they are at 2 o'clock in the afternoon um but you do have to make it work or else you'll be cut with a first Cuts you know nobody is picked up for a full full season for television so usually you'll get a first contract with a back number of weeks right so 10 weeks with a back 10 20 weeks with a back 20 and then the show will have the right to exercise your option to bring you back for that extra set of 20 weeks extra set of nine weeks whatever it is um and that will be dependent on whether or not they feel that you are a value um they may decide not to exercise your option and just let you go they may opt to not exercise your option and replace you um so you have to be useful at every step of the way um you have to be productive you have to help others and prop others up if you want to keep that job um it's in some rooms you get your episodes and you just focus on that when you don't have your episode you're done you sit and wait for your episode assignment in other rooms you're going to be at the board um or you're going to be helping out when the writer who's assigned to an episode is at the board you're going to board an episode you're going to break an episode together you're going to help research um so you really have to make yourself indispensable to that room what's the fine line between pleasing the showrunner but not stepping on the toes or threatening the other writers in the room that's where the politicking comes in right because you want to find your upper level allies right whether it's your showrunner or the coep that's usually the number two in the room you want to have those allies who are rooting for you who are fostering you um but you want to remain friendly with everybody else um so you really have to make sure to not be boastful um to not be arrogant to be grateful for whatever it is that you have whatever whatever responsibility you are given to take input from others at every Jun juncture at every moment at every step of the way um because that will continue to ingratiate you with the other writers that you ultimately have to rely on and in every room there is that moment where somebody can be thrown under the bus and you just don't want it to be you so you have to remain in good favor with as many people in the room as you can okay so let's take the situation of you are thrown under the bus how do you keep your character in good standing and not let anger come through but still fairly defend yourself or maybe there's not a way to do that um it's a tough thing to do and that's why you want to have allies in Upper levels who will stand up for you because if you're a staffy who's thrown under the bus there's only so much you can do for yourself um if you're able to continue to impress your showrunner or your number two there will likely be somebody coming to your rescue if there's any decency in the room and that's why you want to maintain those channels of communication um you know the truth of the matter is you want to avoid being the person thrown under the bus to start with and that's why you want to Foster those relationships on a regular basis while not throwing anybody else under the bus um because once you're under the bus it's very very tough to get up from under in that show you may be able to resurrect on another show um and it's very very much possible on TV is an industry where you fail up which is a great luxury um but once you're thrown under the bus it's a little late um so you really want to proactively instill the relationship ships really fortify the relationships that will put you in a situation that if you're thrown under the bus and fired everybody will come in and apologize to you and that does happen

Channel: Film Courage

Views: 13,741

Keywords: breaking in, tales from the screenwriting trenches, career coaching for screenwriters, lee jessup, screenwriting, screenwriting consultant, screenwriting teacher, screenwriting tips, getting it write, screenwriting career, movie script, screenplay, story, storytelling, film courage, filmcourage, interview, filmmaking

Id: 3THQ5N2KO30

Length: 113min 2sec (6782 seconds)

Published: Wed Apr 12 2017