Bake the Cake OR Go to Jail! Interview with Jack Phillips - The Becket Cook Show Ep. 25

hey guys welcome to the becca cook show i'm becca cook and today i have a very special guest jack phillips you may remember him you may know of him he's the owner of the masterpiece cake shop in colorado and he's just written an amazing book called the cost of my faith how a decision in my cake shop took me to the supreme court welcome jack and his lawyer is joining us as well jonathan scruggs and welcome you guys thank you becca i'm honored to be here today and just so my audience is aware why is your lawyer with us on this on this uh interview well we are still in court we just finished in the end of march um our a trial in our third lawsuit and so we are currently waiting for the judge to announce his decision on that and so my lawyer is here to help you know guide and protect me and make sure that i don't say anything that right okay good good um and so for those who don't remember kind of the who are fuzzy on the details tell us what remind us what happened on july 19th 2012 when two gay men walked into your cake shop and asked you to design their wedding cake yeah it was a beautiful july afternoon sunny and bright and a couple girls working for me they were busy in the front and so when these two gentlemen came into my shop sat down at the wedding desk since they were both occupied it was my duty to go over and sit down and and uh talk to them and so we went over made introductions and the one on my right said i'm david on my left charlie and what can i do for you guys we're here to look at wedding cakes it's for our wedding and i said no sorry guys i don't do cakes for same-sex weddings it looked to me you know like what i'll make you birthday cake shower cakes sell you cookies and brownies but i don't do cakes for same-sex weddings at which point they go stumped out of the store swearing at me flipping me off and like whoa i wasn't expecting that i just told them i would serve the mother anything else in my shop but i just couldn't create that particular cake because the iconic nature of a wedding cake was that the first time that a gay like a gay person asked you to design a wedding cake um no it's actually the fourth or fifth time and the other ones we are always able to discuss it and make it clear that you know it's not your sexual orientation it's just the uh nature of the cake the message of a wedding cake is pretty simply understood and create anything else but i couldn't create that yeah and you talk about this in the book you say what other kinds of cakes for example would you not design well before we opened my wife and i many discussions about what the cake shop would look like but we decided before we opened it we wouldn't do cakes for instance and celebrate halloween or cakes it would be un-american or racist or that would degrade or denigrate other people um including people who identify as lgbt and we had guidelines that we just couldn't cross and then after charlie and david kind of stormed out of your your shop you started getting uh basically legal notices where you found out that they were suing you right right um they stormed out of my shop and i started getting hateful phone calls and emails in like 20 minutes by the time i came in the next morning i had a couple hundred emails in my in my box you know just all hateful and phone calls the phones were ringing all day long and i'm not sure how long it took before i actually got the notices from the state i think it was october from july to october but i was aware that there was a complaint filed until right right at the beginning right and when did you realize that the legal troubles were getting really serious um right away um the the two gentlemen came in on a thursday and by the following tuesday four days later i had been connected with attorneys from alliance defending freedom and uh i knew that uh i wasn't gonna have to hire my uncle to help me defend myself or anything like that and i'd be regretting it forever because adf alliance defending freedom they're the best at this and they have been right beside me all the way through and guided me and coached me and advised me and it's been a wonderful relationship yeah and many people as you say in the book many people have asked you why not just bake the cake and because a lot of christians i feel like today in our culture would just kind of look the other way maybe and just make a concession and sort of just you know look i don't want to get into a bunch of legal problems and trouble like i'm just going to bake this cake and it's not going to be a big deal and i'm going to look the other way why didn't you just bake the cake um like i said there were a number of cakes different kinds of cakes that we knew couldn't create halloween cakes that comes up every year and we have to uh decline to create those because of my my beliefs and so that was actually a good practice when these other cases came up other cake orders came up that uh this was a line in the sand and i already knew how to approach that line and cross it and try and be as gracious and kind as i could and uh i just couldn't couldn't cross the line it's basically what it was yeah and you mention in the book you talk about romans 13 and your decision to fight this in court romans and i'll just remind our audience what romans 13 says it says uh and you're and this is taken from your book too let this translation let everyone be subject to the governing authorities for there is no authority except that which god has established the authorities that exist have been established by god consequently whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what god has instituted and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves give to everyone what is uh owed to them if you owe taxes pay taxes if revenue then revenue if respect and respect if honor then honor so tell us how your decision to fight this kind of comports with romans 13. yeah well in the first places i've been asked that before the government gives us the option to go to court to defend these things as well as the fact that in our government we have a constitution that our government is supposed to protect and protect our rights among them are the right free exercise religion and this is what that was it was a speech right uh because i didn't want to create that message of the wedding cake and it's also a right to freely express my faith so our government is supposed to protect that right and when they weren't there's also steps in in our constitution state constitution and u.s constitution where we are able to uh go to a court system like this and and fight through these things and i think you're in the book you said your legal defense was a quote unquote rights of conscience defense can you sort of explain what that means on the rights of consciences they're asking me to create a message again that's part of the speech but it's they're asking to make me create a message and a cake and to me the wedding cake is an iconic symbol it's a message in and of itself if you were to be at a hotel and walk into a conference room you were there for a business meeting and you walk into a conference room and you see a three-tier cake or something like that in the corner you know it's not a business meeting you know without having to ask anybody it's a wedding so that wedding cake is a message and to create that wedding cake um the bible defines it a marriage is between a man and a woman and so this cake would be a message that would go against my biblical belief so it's asking me to violate my conscience to create this cake and create a message that i can't do and what is the distinction between you talk about this too what is the distinction between freedom of religion because people confuse us a lot and freedom of worship um the constitution declares it is to be freedom of religion so um a lot of what the freedom of worship is is to find you know at least promote it as what you do in church freedom of religion is what you do in your life in my case um i want the government to protect my right to freely exercise my faith when i'm at the cake shop when i'm at the grocery store when i'm at the park not just when i'm in the halls of worship in any church right and the so the colorado civil rights commission which is a panel of seven gubernatorial appointees they ruled against you right and then you chose to appeal to the colorado court of appeals what was the crux of your appeal um the same thing that uh the state was forcing me through the uh arm of the civil rights commission to create cakes that went against my conscience and so we're asking the court of appeals to reverse that decision and allow me to um obey my conscience and create cakes that are in line with that and you talk about in the book you talk about there's there was this kind of there's a double standard because there was another denver bakery who did something almost identical to what you did can you but they they did not uh right they were not persecuted or in any way so can you tell us why that happened or what that was about yeah there was a gentleman here in denver who went to at least three different bakeries and asked them to create cakes with uh they were shaped like a bible with a message on there um like a red circle with the extra um with silhouettes of two men getting married and it was a message on a cake that said that homosexuality or homosexual marriage is wrong and so he asked these uh bakeries to create those cakes and they all declined to do that because they disagreed with the message of it and uh that's exactly what we were doing we were willing to serve these people the two men that served me the first time and the the person that's selling me in this third lawsuit second and third lawsuit but we can't create all cakes and so the civil rights commission said they're not turning you away they're only turning away the message and they have that right but i did not have that right yeah it's a bizarre bizarre double standard um and the the commission said some very hateful things about you and you said you mentioned that this one of the most painful things about it was talk about this a little bit because your dad was in world war ii correct and he was actually in buchenwald the concentration camp which is is crazy so tell us what was so painful about hearing what the commission was saying about you one of the commissioners um we have recorded on tape um that it was that religious freedom is a despicable piece of rhetoric and people have used it to do all kinds of things like uh you know slavery and the holocaust and so she was comparing my decision not to create a cake that went against my faith to the holocaust and that this woman either doesn't know what the holocaust is or is ignoring the facts of the atrocities of it just on a basic level but then again like you say my dad served in world war ii and he landed on normandy and he gets me every time hang on he fought through france and he bought through germany he's in the battle of the bulge he was wounded in a mortar attack a big jagged scar across his back and a purple heart they sent him to england they patched him back up and sent him back into combat again and from there he ended up being part of the group that liberated oprah wald uh prison camp concentration camp and he spoke of the you know the horse and that and the smells especially i remember mentioning that but if you look up broken bald the pictures are horrific and for this commissioner to compare this decision to that it's just lucas yeah i've been to book involved and it's uh it's very disturbing and so what was and tell us what the outcome of that appeal was the court of appeals ruled three to nothing in favor of the colorado civil rights commission meaning i lost and the commission's ruling against me would stand part of which would be that i would need to retrain my staff i changed have to change all my policies start creating cakes that go against my faith and retrain my staff and the errors of my way and report to the commission quarterly for two years on that and the retraining i was funny because it's a very small shop and my wife and i own it my daughter works for me you know various relatives including my my mom who was in her 80s and she walked up to me one day and said by the way i won't be re-educated and so i thank you mom i love you i appreciate that so um for them to do that that's what the court of appeals initially or came back and said that those rulings now stand so our next step would be to appeal to the colorado supreme court state supreme court right and i mean that sounds very like mao's cultural revolution in china uh the re-education camps um and so the government you you you talked about this before but the government was essentially ordering you to to violate your conscience now was there ever a moment through this kind of first tier or second tier of this where you were like sort of wavering and kind of wondering if you should just give in and do you know do what they said or or just not you know or just bake the cake no i would i would close the cake shop down before i would you know start creating cakes like that that was never in question well the question was you know how far could we go would adf be able to you know take us to the next step i learned that the colorado state supreme court and the united states supreme court have discretion in which cases they take and the state supreme court declined to hear my case and so i thought it was over we were done but there was only one option left that would be the uh to appeal to the united states supreme court and so yeah we were willing to do that but was the court willing to hear our case that was the big question well apparently the court was willing to hear your case and tell us what the odds are of the u.s supreme court hearing your case the odds are extremely small that you will be heard you know they are petitioned with 8 000 to 10 000 cases every year and they will only grant 70 or 80 of them and those cases have to be you know usually like uh two circuit courts ninth circuit and the fourth circuit ruled differently on two different things and so that's called a circuit split and so they have to justify that you know the constitution can mean one thing in california and another thing in florida it has to mean the same thing all across the board so they're dealing with larger cases like that and from my case we came from not a circuit court or district court or any large thing it was kind of a standalone case and the uh basically we were coming from a court of appeals so we didn't make it to the state supreme court but the odds then are incredibly against us you have to have for the justices agree to take your case so they all or at least four have to go over every aspect of your case make sure it's worth their time and worth their effort and the energy they would take to to you know take this case to uh court and we got that yeah and what was it like when you found out that you were going to the supreme court what was that what did what were you feeling that was one of the craziest days of my life um there's a website called scotus blog and skoda stands for supreme court of us and it's a website that you can follow any case that you want to that they're looking at i followed my case for months going up to it as it was relisted which means that they had it in front of them they talked about it and said it's not the site this week let's put it until next week let's put it off let's put it off and so i knew that it was being conferenced or talked about every week and it was drawing to the end of the court session where they break for the summer and it was the last week of the court and i was watching my computer and i had scotus blog turned on confident that we'd get a decision whether were denied or the cert had been granted and what i saw on the screen these five words masterpiece cake shop has been granted it gets me still this is like six four years ago five years ago and still i can't breathe i couldn't breathe and i had to text people and the only one i had to uh talk to the only one in the shop besides myself was a homeless man who comes in and so i turned to him and i said hey i need to go to the supreme court and he looked at me and yeah i got to go to court on wednesday yeah but i don't need a parole officer just to understand the gravity of the united states supreme court you know people say i'm going to sue young take this to the supreme court don't understand how it works and for them to grant it was just an incredible thing and was the i i can't remember i think you mentioned this in the book that was the essential uh point to take it to the supreme court was it about freedom of speech we asked him to uh reverse the case based on both the speech and the religious components of it right and then uh and then june 4th 2018 you won yeah you won at the supreme court and it was a seven two two ruling ginsburg and sotomayor dissented of course but uh what was i mean obviously that was an amazing occasion what was that like when you won that was just as emotional a day as the day that they granted cert and i was even more surprised because this was three weeks before the end of the session and i was pretty confident that they wouldn't make the announcement until the last day like they granted my cert on the last day the year before but i happen to be watching this scotus blog then too and it's you know we have masterpiece wow yeah it looks like they win and it's seven to two i'm sitting at my computer i'm like yeah you know what just happened immediately the phone starts ringing people are driving by my shop they're honking they're waving and it was just incredibly it's like a david goliath story it's amazing and and then you mentioned in the book what was because this was interesting what was one of the keys to winning the case according to the supreme court why did they rule in your favor one of the key factors was the hostility that we talked about before the commissioner comparing my case to the uh to the holocaust it was i forget how they phrased it um impermissible hostility clear and impermissible hostility or whatever and then the other component one of the other main components was the inequity um that they would that the commission would come after me for my case and leave this other these other three bakeries for their um denial of creating cakes that went against their conscience and those two things were two of the keys to that whole whole decision right and you mentioned that the commission's actions violated the free exercise clause what is that what does that mean again the free exercise clause that congress shall pass no law establishing a religion or prohibiting that's not right word prohibiting the free exercise thereof so in essence they were saying you can have your religion you can do whatever you want to you just can't you know exercise it in your cake shop you can only do it in your church so the establishment clause and the they weren't establishing but the exercise clause said that i can't exercise my faith and they were openly hostile to that and then you had three weeks after you won you had three weeks of kind of calm and normalcy again but then suddenly you were right back where you started because um a local denver attorney named autumn scardina transgender attorney named autumn gardena walked in to your cake shop and ended up filing charges against you uh what was that like okay so on the timeline um this attorney scardina called us the first crazy day when the court granted cert my average day i would take 25 30 phone calls you know for cake orders whatever that particular day i'm looking at records we had somewhere around 300 phone calls and this cardena attorney called us that day the day that the court granted our case and requested another cake which essentially was a message that we couldn't create it was a cake that would be blue on the outside and pink on the inside and those colors were to celebrate this attorney's uh gender transition changing from a man to a woman so again we told this attorney you know we'll create any other cake that you'd like but not any other cake but we'll create other custom work for you and you're welcome in our shop and all that but i can't create that cake so then fast forward then to the day that the three weeks after the court ruled in our favor then we got noticed that the civil rights commission had taken up the complaint that this attorney had filed the year before and said that there was probable cause to pursue an almost identical case again well that's what that's what i don't get and you talk about it in the book but i still can't process it in my brain if the supreme court ruled in your favor how could this happen again well i'm not sure how good of analogy this is and john can correct me here but uh it's like if i were speeding down my street and i get a ticket and i go to court and beat it they're saying i'm speeding down the street again or i ran a red light so i'm getting a new ticket i'm not being i'm not able to base my nuke ticket that i will or you know i already beat that speeding ticket last year you know no now you have a new one so the cases were similar or identical in nature but two separate charges so yeah the court's duty is then to you know file a complaint see if there's probable cause to commission like i said it's a an appointed body appointed by the governor they decided that they have probable cause to perseverance and how did that that first case with autumn scardina and how did that case two years ago in march we were ready to go into a deposition and as we sat down at the conference table with their lawyers on one side and our attorneys on the other and court reporters and videographers photographers ready to take down every word as this attorney tries to you know basically destroy me in the next six hours um they said we need to have a meeting and asked the reporter and the stenographer to leave and the meeting then was to say this isn't the vehicle that we want to use so we're willing to dismiss the charges against jack if we had a lawsuit against him also in federal court then you dropped a suit and it was really based on the fact that we had a recording of the same commission this new commission saying that they embraced the hostility of the first commission and so if they were to go forward they would not be successful they knew they would lose and so they would rather drop the case than than go ahead and lose yes but and then but it's still not over because on june 5th 2019 autumns gardena filed a new case against you and i don't know how much you can talk about but why why did that happen and where is where is that where are you in that case yeah so this attorney had an option of appealing the commission's uh decision to dismiss the case but rather than appealing that waited um whatever the time period was over 90 days and then file a civil lawsuit against me so now this is not the state suing this attorney saying personally and just this past march just a few weeks ago we were in court via zoom just like this the the judge was in his chambers in denver and i was in the offices there in scottsdale with alliance defending freedom and so we were put on the witness stand my wife and my daughter and myself and the attorneys gardena and a couple other people so we had that trial you know direct examination cross-examination all those things and then we are now waiting for the judge to announce that decision wow and how soon how soon will you know that decision there's not a timeline it could be this afternoon it could be next week it could be july so we're just waiting you know waiting and waiting yeah and are you in the meantime are you still able to create custom cakes we are um we've just decided through all this until it's fully resolved that we won't create wedding cakes or anniversary cakes things you know in that field and there are practical reasons for that as well as you know emotional reasons logical reasons but until those are resolved this is our biggest time of year with graduation cakes and birthday shops birthday cakes shower cakes all those we do those all the time and you mentioned shadrach meshach and abednego and daniel um and them being in exile in babylon and i actually mentioned them and i i do a whole chapter in my book on shadrach meshach and abednego but how you mentioned in your book how did you draw inspiration from shadrach and his friend's story um in a couple of ways for one they weren't in their their home village they weren't in jerusalem they had been the whole nation have been captured and carried off to babylon they were slaves and they had to do what the what the king wanted them to do and this king nebuchadnezzar was an evil wicked ruthless man and if you didn't do exactly what he wanted you were dead that's all there was to and it wouldn't be you know a sleeping pill or anything like that it could be a gruesome death but they were willing to stand and do what god wanted them to do what they knew was expected of them from the law in israel and to obey and honor the lord god jehovah yeah they basically and i say this in my book they they refused to bow down to culture basically exactly what they were doing and they were willing to go into a fiery furnace rather than compromise their convictions like just like you did there was no fiery furnace but it's basically they also said you know our god is able to deliver us but if he doesn't we still will ban and we're going through the courts and if we win great if not we're still going to do our best to obey him and you talk about also you just in a personal on a personal level you talk about how the cake shop over the years brought you and your father closer together because i think you said that when you when you were young you weren't really that close with him and there was kind of a distance and but the cake shop really brought you closer tell us how that happened well it wasn't a distance like i never saw my dad you know he never came to baseball games i didn't play baseball anyway but we would play catch out in the field and and he would take me fishing but he had a job to do and i had friends and so we just didn't have the opportunity to be really close but i loved my dad a great deal and he loved me but then when we opened the shop um i was nervous actually to tell him that i was going to go into business for myself because he was a meat cutter and he hated working with the public and he said i don't care what you do for a living sun just don't work in the public and so working in a bakery is fine i'm in the back doing all kinds of things then when i decided it was time to open my own cake shop it's like how am i going to tell my dad that i'm going to do this and i'm going to be working not only with the public i'm going to be the one who's in charge of everything and so when i finally told him he's like that's great when where how do we get going he came in the very first day when we unlocked the door to the shop and was here every day since then and let me uh hang this up here they've got the phone upstairs so you can see how many phone calls i get i've been here with you for a half hour and that's the first phone call and then the day that scardina called and the other day that the court credits her it was like ring hang up ring hang up but anyway my dad then came down helped me do the remodel the tenant finished up he was here virtually every day he we opened in 93 and he passed away in 96 so those three years were valuable to me because he would come in every day have muffins and coffee and he was he's a gregarious guy who though he said never worked with the public there wasn't really anybody who would ever come in the shop that he wouldn't try and be friend right off the bat so it was fun having him around and getting to know him a little bit better i mean how has all of this drama for the last nine plus years i guess it's nine years almost almost nine how's this all been on your family it's been good it's drawn us all closer together i have a sister who lives in indianapolis and i talk to her regularly another sister who lives across town here i see her two three times a week and they pray for her and they support us and you know my mom just passed away in november um but she was here working up until i think she was 88 89 years old and so she you know the last three four years she wasn't here but it's it's been great my daughter works for me and that's helped her to uh this whole case wake up really um the bible jesus talks about a tells a parable about 10 virgins who were waiting for a wedding feast and they were all asleep because it happens in the middle of the night in that culture or whatever and they said you know bridegroom's coming all 10 of them wake up five of them are prepared for the wedding ceremony and five of them are not and that's you know a great parable but it also in my mind spoke to me that i was asleep too just like all 10 of them were asleep five of them were prepared and god had prepared us for this battle but until that day came i was asleep and talked this over with my daughter and she says the same thing she had a wake-up call and it just changed this whole thing has changed her her life spiritually even though she was a follower of jesus before that now she's a dedicated follower jesus that's awesome that's amazing yeah and this was an interesting factoid from your book how did you come up with the the name masterpiece cake shop what where what was the story when i graduated high school i needed a job and a man that lived across the street from me owned a large wholesale bakery you know like 100 employees and conveyor belts full of donuts and danish and he was gracious enough to hire me and i fell in love with baking you know it took a while to get acclimated to actually working for a living because i worked in pizza parlors in school and these just show up um but after i got acclimated to that i thought this is a job that i could do i could do this you know long term and later on i thought i'd like to own my own bakery then one day i found out that this the owner of the bakery had bought out another bakery and brought in cake cake decorators and i'd never seen that so rather than making 100 cakes at a time these people were making one cake at a time and it was one custom cake at a time and i have an artistic background that we go through in the book also the cost of my faith um and i knew at that point when he brought them in that's what i was going to do with my future i was going to open my own bakery someday and it would be a bakery where i would use the canvas of the cake and turn it into hopefully art to help people celebrate and i came up with the name almost immediately and and i'm not generally that creative with words i'm created with you know the other physical media sculpting painting those kind of things but the name came to me right away masterpiece cake shop and masterpiece in my mindset our cake shop says cake that means you're not going to walk in there thinking you're going to get a loaf bread or a pie hopefully you're going to get an artistic cake and been part of the masterpiece also in my mind master the first syllable first part of that phrase reminds me of jesus sermon on the mount that no man can serve two masters as i come into the shop i think who am i going to serve today and as i write out masterpiece on any piece of paper to this day i pretty much always think master you know i see that word embedded in there and who am i going to serve and i want to live my life and run my shop in a way that honors jesus christ that's yeah that's a great that's a great name and so you you mentioned that in the book that part of the reason you're you did all this fighting and that you fought in court is for future part of it is for future generations what do you mean by that well one of the main reasons i wrote the cost of my faith when i was first approached with the idea was i wanted to put it put down a writing a story details of what happened especially for my my kids my i have three kids my daughter works for me i have a son in california and another daughter in canada and i wanted them to be able to understand and know exactly what happened and further than that i wanted my grandkids to be able to have an account of it because you're not going to find everything you can find any version of it you want online and i wanted them to have mine but also realized you know three four or five years ago however long ago that this is not about jack phillips you know let's fight for him so he can start making cakes again this is for every american to be able to live and work freely according to their conscience without fear of punishment for the government and so we were hoping to continue to fight for everybody's defense we're even defending the rights of the people who are suing us because they may not value all of those rights now but at some point they might and they would wonder what happened to them well let's fight for them now exactly yeah and the last chapter of your book is called lessons learned and what what was one of the most important things you learned through all of this i think that's that's one of the most important things that this is not about me this is about everybody but one of the most important things for me is that i need to remember who the master is and who i serve every day as i go through every every phase of my life when i'm whether i'm working whether i'm mowing my yard whatever the christ is my lord my savior and god is in control over over everything and his decisions and the way that he runs the universe is good yes and i know i mean i'm sure i know the answer to this question but i'm just gonna ask what knowing all that you know now and all you've gone through the last almost nine years would you still make the same decision back in 2012 absolutely if i sat down with those two men that day in 2012 knowing this was ahead of me i would have said everything i said word for word i wish i would have had more time to talk to them to explain it to them but what i said to them in in 19 words in 20 seconds was i will serve you but i can't create every cake that people ask me to create because of the message generally that it's involved and that i would be more than willing to fight for this for their sake for my sake for my kid's sake and what so and what's it like to be because like you mentioned this in the book you're you're known as the guy who wouldn't bake the cake what is that like to have that kind of out there i wish it was the guy who rather wouldn't bake the cake but the guy who would serve everybody but wouldn't create that cake because of that message but it's still it is what it is but people sometimes recognize me when i'm out in public and say hey you're that guy and it's like it gives me the opportunity not only to explain the case but quite often to share my faith well guys i highly recommend this book the book is the cost of my faith how a decision in my cake shop took me to the supreme court with it's jack phillips and jack i thank you so much for being on the show and and it's so encouraging i really recommend this book because it's so encouraging i think it will edify people's faith as you as it did your faith this whole experience and your daughter's faith and i think it will encourage people i think it will help people strengthen their own convictions about certain issues of the of the christian faith and so uh god bless you you're a trooper and uh thank you for being on the show and uh we i i'm excited to i look forward to hearing the outcome of this latest case well thank you mr cook it honestly is really such an honor to be on your show today thank you jack yeah thank you and thank you jonathan yep thanks so much have a great day guys youtube all right see you hey guys hope you enjoyed this episode please consider donating to my ministry there are links below to paypal and to venmo and even five to ten dollars a month would be super helpful so thank you very much and i will see you next week on the becca cook show

Channel: Becket Cook

Views: 15,499

Rating: 4.9654088 out of 5

Keywords: LGBTQ+, Free Speech, Custom Cakes, The Cost of My Faith, Colorado, Small Business, Christian, Jack Phillips, Masterpiece Cakeshop, Colorado Supreme Court, Transgender, ACLU, Autumn Scardina, Denver, Colorado Civil Rights Commission, Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Sonia Sotomayor, Conservative, Cake Decorating, Wedding Cake, Romans 13, Alliance Defending Freedom, WW2, Buchenwald, Purple Heart, David & Goliath, Faith, Gay RIghts, Gay Marriage, Freedom of Religion, Rights of Conscience, Bakery

Id: Aqe66ghCn5I

Length: 38min 30sec (2310 seconds)

Published: Thu May 13 2021