Ajahn Jayasaro Q&A with Stanford Community

you I'm really curious about your work with education and I we've been talking a lot in our kind of weekly discussion groups about applications of contemplative practice engaged Buddhism it's a kind of a general but very diverse category so I was wondering if you could tell us a little bit more about how you apply Buddhism within that kind of an educational framework yeah it's a really big big topic I'll try and very succinctly as I can so I'm working with three schools to schools that Robbie mentioned and then one in in Chiang Mai and the the philosophy the Buddhist [Music] philosophy of education as it were is based on applying the threefold training of sila Samadhi and bunny on which I don't know feel familiar without that sort of telescoping the Eightfold Path into a training of sealer and then smarty Bunya I found that the difficulty with using that terminology in educational sphere is that many parents wary of that approach because it sounds too much like like a seminary or that their children might end up wanting to become monks and nuns which is not what most parents want for their kids and that's not the the idea of the school or this system either so I I I looked through the the Buddhist discourses looking for another way of expressing these same principles and they came across a teaching what called the for power nah that's BH a VA in a or kinds of four kinds of development which is basically just recasting the same principle but it's expressed as an education or a development of the relationship of the human being to the material world and then secondly the relationship with a human being to the social world and then the third is the education of the heart and of the emotions and a fourth the education of wisdom faculty and I found that that provided a more modern way of talking which wouldn't lead it to be a very kind of narrow or elitist kind of approach which would put off many people who are let's say they're Buddhists but they're not really devoted meditators or practitioners and so wanting to make clear that there's no real real rift between an approach to education which is based upon Buddhist principles and and more conventional education but that it's one which fills in the gaps that conventional education has allowed to manifest and particularly in the in the attention given to the to the heart and the emotional development of children and using that four fold framework then the subjects which compulsory as through Thai law can be integrated within that and so the sciences would go into most of Sciences into the relationship between human being and the and the material world so a divided from that basis then further developed that so in the first of those four categories the development of the relationship between the human being and the material world the first would be a relationship with human being and their physical body so that would include things like nutrition or sex education and and biology and sports and and then expanding to relationship to those elements of the material world with which we are most familiar which we have to do it in everyday with technology and possessions and money and and so on and then the outer outer ring outer sphere would be the environment so those would be like the three main headings of that first category and then the second category is using wise use of precepts and conventions and agreements in order to create the optimum conditions for growth in Dumber emphasis on development of communication skills and then emphasis on creating an interest and skills in in contributing to the wider society and then indeed so those are the two outer layers lately we had these kind of phrase like two outer to inner so those are the two outer categories and the two inner would be particularly teaching children how to to protect their minds against the unwholesome Dahmer's of anxiety and depression stress and so on and how to develop wholesome qualities of mindfulness and kindness and compassion and self motivation and patience and so on and then the fourth category and wisdom category is starting off with basic critical and creative thinking skills and going on to some more specific Buddhist contemplations so that's the the overall structure but it's not just what's being taught but it's the whole idea of the school as being a school of learners so wonderfully there is no text in which the Buddha refers to the arahant or the fully enlightened human being as a graduate so the idea is that an enlightened person is the person who's graduated from the Buddhist education and that everyone else except for arahants are all in need of education so we're all learners so there's this idea of the children alone at one learning community the parents or a learning community and the teachers are a learning community and that we should we should all seek to learn from each other and yet I could go on about this for a long time just one more point is there the key concept is of good friendship and so that the teacher in the Terra vada is not like a guru or a god figure he's like the best friend that you could possibly imagine that's the goal that's the idea of a teacher and trying to create like a community based upon principles of good friendship and that's in very much part of the way the school is run so the Buddhist influence not not solely in terms of subject matter but also in the way that we live together and learn together yeah and to just and I had the opportunity to visit the school when I was in Thailand this past summer and it's yeah it's quite a nice or the punyo prateep school and it's quite a nice place so I guess if any of you are interested in this kind of education or just education in general perhaps consider volunteering or getting involved with the school yeah anybody's once coming to trial and you're very welcome to come and visit or even to come and stay and participate in the life of the school for a time I have a question I'm like I'm like balancing focus and like internal versus external because I know like some people have like the conception that like Buddhism is kind of like an isolated practice where one focuses on like the self rather than like focusing like outside unlike societal issues and then on the flipside like people who focus too much on like societal issues might like burnout and like tear themselves out so I'm wondering like where you think the approach would be to like strike the perfect balance between the two yeah well I think most people who have any done any reading or any contact with Buddhism will be familiar with the word Dumber or dumber but in the time of the Buddha the the phrase that was used most commonly was done with ania and the Vino so kind of been lost but the Vinaya means all the ways in which we seek to construct the most conducive environment for for everyone to grow in the Dhamma so the veneer is taken to its most sophisticated level in the in the rules and there that the governed a life of the bhikkhus because this was a society within a society that the Buddha created himself and could structure himself but but it's it's also an idea that that applies to lay society and the idea of how we can create laws and regulations and conventions and customs and agreements in families in societies in which we can support the growth in Tama so so I think that it's been a that [Music] summers being like exclusively or overly focused on the individual is much more a comment on the transmission of how Buddhism's been transmitted to the west and the aspects of Buddhism that have been taken up by by people in the West rather than the original vision of the Buddha or as you can still find it practiced and experienced in some parts of Southeast Asia to this day or speaking about the term out of school well I think that you know I last few years I've been going to China quite a lot and speaking with Mahayana Buddhists and monastics and in China about this you know how far to go out to to relieve suffering in the world and and often the Mahayana Buddhist friends will say you know there is this kind of image of the tera vaada Buddhist has got a selfish and only involved in her own welfare so this it is a idea or a perception as within Buddhist communities also so I'm so all at all that I can say is that as we understand it the Buddha said that self development and development of the community had to go hand-in-hand and that they are they mutually reinforce each other and that if you want to [Music] to contribute to through your community you have to know how to look after your own mind because I you know I'm sure you've met people who get really passionate about doing something about injustice in society or or some environmental issues or whatever and throw themselves into it and then completely burn out within a year or two and so they're unable to sustain that kind of commitment over a long period whereas if someone is also looking after their heart training their heart and being mindful and patient and then they have the resources to be able to deal with all the challenges of helping others in a way that prevent them from getting burnt out also I think that a big problem with groups of well-meaning individuals in NGOs or in any charitable foundation tend to the attachment of views and opinions and everyone gets very particularly passionate you know when this idea I'm right and this isn't just for me this is for everybody this is for the country or for the planet you know and everything becomes up to turned up to 11 and having that meditative percept a perspective on views and opinions and how attachment works and how poisonous it is I think that also can help can mean a much more constructive engagement with with others and again to to be helping in long term rather than just a short term burst of enthusiasm and I guess I ever follow up to that if that's okay and yeah we read your your text on love in preparation for for the session and yeah you talked a bit about how kind of passion for a call country or something like that can like give us meaning in and like what you described just now but it can also kind of burn us out and robbed us of wisdom and I guess we've we've been talking in our discussions about a lot of current events um specifically what's what's happening in the United States and and what's happened as a result of coronavirus kind of these various and justices and I guess I was wondering when when these are emotional reactions are so strong and we feel so strongly about the issue how do we how can we better see the other side or kind of avoid having these one-sided perceptions of especially when we're like really passionate and inflamed by something that we see is wrong in the world yeah I mean this is some I think again our ability to do that is is enhanced by meditation practices in which we're learning to take a step back from views opinions thoughts emotions and being aware of justice flow without without an owner and so that kind of less identification with our own views and ideas and beliefs and fears enables us to open ourselves up to other opinions and views and also to see them as being selfless it's not you know not to make the demonic figures out of demonic behaviors you know not to just to solidify that thing and and and create this world of bad people and because it's there can be very depressing apart from anything else but I think that you know it's very common that we tend to make straw men and look for the the weakest and the most you know despicable all kinds of expressions of views and beliefs that we disagree with and that it's it's good to try and say well you know who is the most intelligent and and the most articulate person who expresses the kind of views that that I disagree with and really listen to them and say you know or some something that you find just how could anybody possibly think that or you know then the single well then that that is a real it's a really good challenge to think how how would it be possible to consider that as a rational and reasonable view or action because many cases those people do feel that what they're doing is rational and reasonable and how did you get to that point and what are the the premises the beliefs that you that you take on board and which will make that kind of you seem reasonable because it's usually within a within the context of a larger belief system and and I think that when you can deconstruct these things and see them in terms of thoughts and ideas which are based upon beliefs which are based upon and and then it just takes a lot of the the kind of the poison out of it when you see people to say behaving in these terrible ways and to see the the fear and the anger and the and the [Music] just the fact that someone can take on a false idea or like a poisonous belief maybe when they're young and then it just becomes part of them and then it becomes very impressed almost impossible for them to stand outside of that and even to consider the possibility that it could be wrong and I think as as as meditators as practitioners you know then if we if we tend towards that side that was in a sense of arrogance and you know voiceless and well maybe I could be wrong I could be wrong it could be wrong maybe someone who's very insecure and lacking any self-confidence and he maybe you need the mantra maybe I'm right maybe I'm right but just just finding that kind of balance between yeah that that's that sense of being right and just seeing that yeah that's that's probably the major cause of conflicts in the sense of of being right and in fact some years ago I I don't know if the I'm afraid I can't remember the name of the book but some some scientists had cognitive scientists I guess had isolated a particular area of the brain which is associated with absolutely unshakable confidence of belief in something and as I remember there was there is or was a man in Australia who was absolutely 100% convinced he's dead and he he participates in study sessions at the University and and and you just can't it you just can't argue him out of disbelief that he's dead in any logical way because he can always get around it yeah I mean this is true you know everybody most people Paul almost everybody was dead they're not putting any more in it you know but this is just why it's just so weird you know that guy I'm dead but like I can breathe and I can talk to you and I I just know I mean I I know so that that I I found absolutely fascinating that someone who had a car accident and then somehow affected this particular the brain suddenly had this incredibly unshakable confidence in the in the weirdest thing and and how yeah just I I think in any way of looking and reflecting on things that just releases or reduces that sense of you know this is a person who is a bad person or ism and and there are various ways of looking and reflecting and to to do that and I think that's the only way that dialogue ever takes place when we can identify and perhaps even allow others to recognize commonalities they may be a cliche but I think in the end that that's that's the way that it that it works you know identifying and and and and really putting effort into to emphasize and commonalities which means I'm wondering if you could share a bit with us about your path as a teenager what what were your questions when you went out seeking and did you have much exposure to Buddhism before what other spiritual paths did you explore and what was that like for you yeah I am I had asthma from the age of like I think from 18 months until I was 14 so I was always consider and at home a lot so I I read a lot so I became a real bookworm and probably much more bookish than if I'd gone to school and so I was like to be alone I like to read a lot and so I had a quite a questioning mind and I III just couldn't relate to Christianity it made no sense to me at all i I just couldn't get on with it and and so I and I I assumed that religion meant believing in things and I didn't think that you needed to believe in things too like religious dogmas in order to to live life but then when I was I think about 13 14 I got this question like what's a good way to live or what's the best way to live and your life as a human being and and that seemed it seemed to me to open up all rather a whole number of other questions like is that even a reasonable question and you know we can talk you know let's say let's say compare two different cars and we can say well this is a superior car because it goes faster because it's safer because it's more comfortable because it's more attractive so we have all these different criteria to did to distinguish between material objects but can we do that with with a life and say this is a better life than like that life and if so what are the criteria for doing that so so this was what the other area was why is the world such a mess why is there so much suffering in the world why is there so much injustice does it have to be like this and if it doesn't have to be like this what is your responsibility in a human being to make it better than what it is right now so these were the two questions I'm probably expressing them with more more articulately than I did at that age but but those were the two things that were really in my mind a lot of schools and and I'd also always had this absolute fascination with India from when I was small anything to do with in the errand and then a soil at this photograph of like a yogi you know sitting in the ischium was so cool and then then I read Sidharth there and Hermann Hesse books and and then there was a movie I don't forgive a saw that movie Sidharth there are you ever seen that German movie but the first scene is and it's like this lash luxuriant Indian scene and then you hear this sound ohm ohm and there's the young there's the Yanks it has some sitting Samadhi and yeah this I got to do this as I okay the other thing was I was living in a small kind of provincial town and and I was constantly looking for for a peer group I always you know I was always a bit you know not not quite fitting in with everybody else and and and it seemed to me the only group that I had any kind of sense of connection with was the hippies and so everything all came together with like that the love for adventure and to test myself and to learn about life and and to miss the hippie trail to to India so so after I after I finished high school I worked in a building site and in a warehouse omits money and then set off overland to India so so and I had many adventures and and I was all together in India for a year and visited different ashrams and was in a gaya for a while and and when unfortunately when I went to McLeod Ganj where the Tibetan community years III had hepatitis and I you know it's just just wasn't up to me and also I I I have this I don't know ever heard of a Fantasia do you know what that is it's only good it's only had a name for a few years now but it it means where your brain is completely incapable of creating images and colors so I have zero imagery in my in my brain and there's it's just people just starting to talk about this now you know this is kind of like a new thing you could look it up on Wikipedia a Fantasia so this was a huge obstacle to Tibetan Buddhism and visualizations I can't do this you know so I was very attracted to the look like the straightforwardness and the simplicity of tera vaada Buddhism so eventually almost two years later I got back to England and I could have been lost and one thing another I went on a meditation retreat and the teacher had been a monk in Thailand and in his Dhamma talks he would talk about the time that he was a monk and and I thought well that's exactly what I've been looking for for the past two years some more and don't yet obviously this is exactly what what I need to be doing so that led me to come to Thailand I think just left out an important thing earlier the first book I came across on Buddhism was the way of Zen by Alan Watts and and many of the monks that I know on people my generation you know have a great deal of gratitude to Alan Watts because his books were really instrumental in inspiring many people to begin spiritual part and and I remember just reading first couple of pages of that book sitting on a park bench in Cambridge and and just absolutely yeah just no question this is this is it you know and it wasn't like this isn't a kind of exotic Asian philosophy it was just like absolute common sense you know there's no there was no doubt about it yeah this kind of just a potted version very much I was wondering if you could comment or on the on the student-teacher relationship either in Buddhism in general or in the terabyte a tradition in particular yeah it's good events the following point from from the previous question in apart from my realization on TLT to really developed me the meditations based on visualization a more substantial doubt I had about Tibetan Buddhism was the relationship between the teacher and student and how the teacher is considered to be the Guru or the or sort of a living Buddha and that kind of absolute devotion to an unconditional devotion to a teacher I found that yeah not in rather uninspiring and dangerous you seem to me to open up the possibility for all kinds of corruption and I wondered whether I would be willing to to give myself to that kind of structure and so what particularly attracted me to Buddhist monastic tera vaada monastic order is that the lavinia discipline applies to all monks including fully enlightened arahants there are no exception so there's no there's not this idea that you reach a certain level and you don't have to do all this stuff anymore you don't have to keep all these rules and you because your mind is free and whatever you do is is his per saying enlightened behavior and it shouldn't be held after the North the norms of everyday behavior or something else and about that now what I liked is that that in this tradition then the teachers keep all the rules even if they don't personally need to do that but in order to be a good example to younger monks now fury if you're a young monk and you know you start a lot of the rules are really kind of irritating and you think I don't really need to do this you know what what difference does this make ultimately in this of the way the way your mind works and then you know if you've got the teacher oh you say oh and then when you get to that level you don't have to do it anymore so maybe I let that level already and maybe I'm just you know that you can teach yourself a lot but then when you see a teacher it keeps these his rules I was great very you know was real scrupulosity really carefully and then you say well if he keeps it and you know what possible excuse can I have for not doing that and the so that's a protection for for young monks and and one of the the rules for a new monk is that if he sees his teacher misbehaving he has a duty to with great respect to admonish or to express his his disease of what he what he's seeing so there are there are kind of checks and balances built into the monastic hierarchical monastic system by the Buddha to prevent those in power from taking advantage of those under their guidance and I I was very impressed with this and I felt that it created a system which were not absolutely kind of bulletproof there'll always be some corruption but as far as possible was set up in a way to minimize or to prevent that when I was possible and so over the years I would say other possibility is there have been so many of scandals in in Buddhist and spiritual communities because of this lack of clarity about the relationship between students and and and and and teachers and so for for a monk for instance with we're not allowed to to be alone in a room with a woman or to speak more than an absolute minimum number of words without another man present so that these are there are all kinds of rules which are meant to prevent even possibility of gossip or malicious malevolent kind of slanders have to be very very careful to maintain the integrity of that at that connection between particularly you know it's a heterosexual sense between male monastics and female teachers but whenever I mean a spiritual teacher is is someone who has that that kind of power and charisma and it can be very intoxicating for new students particularly and that's why spiritual teachers need a very clear cut moral standard to prevent that relationship from being distorted or corrupted and the same would work for a you know female teacher and a male student [Music] 18 so sorry so maybe just to add to return to something that mentioned before is the idea of interrogator of the teacher is that will call the kalyan emitter or is the good friend so it's like the best possible friend and someone who keeps you from doing stupid things and gives you guidance and you know when you're about to lose it and then chews you up and encourages you when you're discouraged and and shares and knowledge and understanding with you and is basically your spiritual welfare is his or her number one concern that would be the idea of the teaching I thank you would you be able to expand a little bit on what type of a friend ajahn Chah was yeah for me he he fulfilled all of the all of the the criteria for the spiritual friend so there are various levels and so in everyday life the Buddhist idea is that we will strive to be good friend or Gallion emitter to those around us into but in different ways so to try to be a good friend to our parents to be good friend to our spouses and build friends and boyfriends and our colleagues and and so on but in that that sort of special almost elevated form of the good friend or the kalyan emitter now the Buddha spoke of seven characteristics and I feel that that legend charcoal at least for me fulfilled all of those so the first is that the kalyan emitter just he gives rise to feelings of great love and affection in student and with without in China we used to go round to his his cottage and sit and he tell stories or we teach this or tell us off and he'd be there to like eleven twelve and you have to get up at three o'clock in the morning in US and East and unless he said Drive you away you you wouldn't go you wouldn't go back to your your hat you just just wanted to be there and be with him and musashi more fan him or just sit and listen and be in his presence so so there is that you know that's the most kind of Guru like quality and I was just that inspires that sense of love and affection secondly is that inspires respect and that's a that's the balance to the that could have the affection yeah there's that sense of respect and and reticence around him and and agent tries to inspire I mean I I'm somebody who quite you know I traveled around the West left home when I was 17 and I had all kinds of adventures and never really I guess it's kind of the recklessness of youth but I could say never afraid of anybody or anything that I can recall and I'm a knight in shiny feel afraid of him so this is kind of weird kind of thing I've just kind of love and affection and then fear it's not like he's trying to consciously inspire a fear but it's a fear like you said I could be able to come across like a a lion in the middle of the forest you know there's a sense of awe and respect and and through his through his life and his practice and his integrity of his practice and the the way he lived his life as a monk you just feel this great sense of respect and learn the third I mean it's like that you feel that you become better through being with him and you feel that your defilements become exposed and and become weaker and then you feel inspired to emulate him and you can feel that virtues within you are growing through being close to him or receiving his teachings forth is that the kalyan emitter is great patience and endurance with his students so you know students can get very they can be stubborn and opinionated or they can be very clingy and and they want to attack you or you want to sort of compete for your attention and so on and and so teachers have to be very very patient but the students foibles and and shortcomings and defilements after lighting Cheerilee had that quality to a great extent then he's someone who can express the Dhamma in a way that is appropriate to each individual each group of person is not kind of a fixed way of talking but one which takes into account the the the background the the spiritual maturity the needs of a person that he speaks to or teaches and is someone who can express the most profound principles of Dhamma in a very [Music] clear and easily understandable way but one in which that clarity and ease is not the result of the like dumbing it down or oversimplifying it but a genuine [Music] translation of something which is very subtle into similes and metaphors and language that an audience can easily grasp and the seventh quality of the Galliano meter is he never leads his students astray he never has any kind of personal agenda I want to be powerful and famous and and to take advantage of his students in any in any way or form so those those are the seven qualities of the kalyan emitter on the level of the spiritual teacher which laid down by the Buddha in the discourse as he inspires love respect emulation he he he enlists people out he's patient he he's a skilled communicator he knows how to express the dumb profound dumber in ways that are easily understandable he never takes advantage of his students so that's that's pretty sums that well sums up I didn't shower for me in those those qualities thank you I see that we're running close to the end of our time together but maybe we have time for one more question so okay well so you talked a lot about the qualities of a great teacher I'd like to hear some more about the qualities you think are important for great students yeah also the importance of the importance of finding like a great teacher first of all there there aren't that many great teachers around and even if there are even if you have the great good fortune and accumulated merit to find a great teacher it's not always the best thing for you sometimes great teachers tend to be famous and they have a lot of people around them and there can be a lot of pettiness and competition and yeah so it's not like you find a great teacher and now you that's it you know you're you're on the way you can okay and not be the case and making that crying because I know I've been in in Thailand for 40 years now and I've just seen so many people on this quest for a perfect teacher and then they end up you know completely discouraged or or wherever they go this their this fault-finding mind and they're always disappointed in in some area or some aspect if not the teacher then of the of the place the monastery or of the people around the teacher and and so I as as an attitude you know that I need a great teacher I'm not really in support of that I mean if you do then then great but not necessarily great I what I think is important is is a teacher where as I mentioned just now as you feel that there's progress being made that greed and hatred and confusion and doubt and jealousies and all these kind of negative mental states are over a period of time waning you know it's not like a day on day thing or even a week on week thing but you can see like a trend over and any over a period of time and that the wholesome numbers of mindfulness and clear comprehension and effort and patience and and and so on the loving-kindness and compassion are on the increase and you could say that yeah if it wasn't for this teacher then I can't see that happening so someone who's further ahead on the path and that you had that kind of connection with him that you find that your practice develops I think that's some more in this day and age that's a more practical you know the other thing is we you know we do have this incredible advantage of technology where now you can listen and and watch great teachers from rallyin have it whether it's inspiration or whether it's information now we have students have that access that would have been a dream you know for for monks and meditators for the last two thousand years you know to be able to listen and watch the great masters of that in a way that we can today it's unbelievable in terms of student then patience and consistency I think is is probably key that often it's a trap is to just really gone and retreat or something and really put in it's got a heroic effort for ten days or even more and then let it sort of all fritter away and then go back and do another retreat and let that and that fritters away and and then in the end you sort of lose your confidence in in the practice and the just maintaining a steady practice stay on day-in day-out that's in the long term that that's really important and maintaining that that interest in learning from whatever happens in your life you know it's all it's all it's all there to be to be learnt from so that that that stance and that that attitude of the of the student in every area of life you know learning how to be a human being learning how to be a man learning how how to be a son or her how to be a boyfriend or a husband or a father you know there's so many things and just looking at those things as like lifetime tasks and that we're learning but most important this commitment to learning the nature of the body in mind and really understanding how the mind works how the body works how they affect each other and training and education of our thoughts and feelings and emotions that that's like the heart and heart of the practice and the more you look then the more you see and and the classroom if you like is the present moment so it's not like you're in the present moment and that's it now you you know you're a spiritual adept but the present moment is is the environment it's the classroom in which you can do the work so unless you can learn how to be in that classroom [Music] or the present moment then there's nothing really profound taking place so a lot of meditation practices are just learning that skill and that ability just to be in the present moment for for a considerable length of time because that's when you really start to penetrate into the nature of things and to and to extract all the sort of wrong ideas and assumptions and attachments that we've accumulated over many many lifetimes so I say don't expect as a student if they don't expect to be inspired all the time or think that there's something wrong when you're not inspired because inspiration is also it's it's a conditioned phenomena you know we can't be and even monks can be inspired all the time but if you are struggling don't always look outside for inspiration from teachers and teachings but if you can develop that skill of reflection and contemplation in such a way that you can inspire yourself then you have an incredible resource you know that that developing that skill of inner motivation whether it's for in your working lives your academic life your working life or your spiritual life now you know this is how I feel right now not not how it should feel but this is how it is and what can I do about that you know so you you're just humbly accepting this is the raw materials that I've got right now and what's the best that I can do [Music] there's I don't know if you have a read this story or heard the story about Einstein so I tell this to school children as they're so Einstein I'm in the story anyway is that he went to some big conference and so this is towards the end of his life you know where he's got that very distinctive appearance but supposedly someone comes up to him at a conference and said who are you and Ryan rather than saying I'm Albert Einstein how could you not recognize me and I got two Nobel prizes and so on he says oh I'm student of physics and I think that captures that that attitude really really beautifully you know even like a world-renowned scientist and achieve all the accolades and fame and fortune and yet he considers himself a student of physics and think to to sustain that kind of perception of oneself is really helpful okay well thank you so much on behalf of I think all of us and the greatest community at Sanford thank you so much for coming to speak with us and Lena meditation and also thank you to the host center of British studies for co-sponsoring this event yeah this is really my first time so I got to learn how to do this it's an adapted that the new normal and I hope I'll get a bit more fluent as I as they do it more yeah so it's it's midnight here I think might be time for me to go and have a rest so I wish you all the best in your practice and may you be well happy and made all the negative mental states in your heart wither away and die me old positive mental states grow and flourish and maybe we can see each other again sometime you

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Length: 55min 36sec (3336 seconds)

Published: Thu Jun 18 2020