5 Ways to Make Your Villain Terrifyingly Unforgettable

we're sisters best friends and authors on a mission to help you stoke your creative fire and live the life of your dreams we believe that purpose fuels passion and that creativity is your secret weapon for mass construction there's never been a better time to bless the world with your dream realized you're listening to the kate and abby show what's up guys welcome back to another episode of the kate and abby show today is a highly requested topic a long it's been a long time since we did one of these a story mining episode on villains this has been something that you guys have requested and we are delivering finally at long last it's been forever since we sat down and did a story mining episode and if you are new around here you can't remember the other story mining episodes basically what kate and i do is we sit down and put our heads together as writers as fans of story and we figure out what is it about stories that we love what is it that makes them work and specifically digging into elements that we admire about particular stories and figuring out why they work and how to apply those principles to our own writing so that's what story mining is all about and in this episode we're talking about how to craft an unforgettable villain more specifically five ways to craft a unforgettable villain that is terrifying and memorable and convicted somebody that you love to hate a character that you love to hate that's a great way to put it so we're digging into that today we have spooky haunting villains yes we have five story examples so this is going to be laid out like we're gonna go over five principles five ways that you can create a unforgettable villain in your story and for each principle we're going to give a story example that we personally love and have learned from and dig into that so before we get started we have to thank our sponsors who are you guys you're the ones who support us support this show and keep it going and we so appreciate your love and support so if you get value out of this podcast go to patreon.com the kate and abby show and help us keep this show alive and free of interruptions okay so let's jump into it let's get right into the first principle the first way to make your villain unforgettable and this to me is this applies to every character obviously but especially with villains is make your villain deeply conflicted this is so so important it's important with your main character no matter if they're a protagonist or an anti-hero but it's especially especially important with an antagonist and kate and i have both collectively agreed when we were brainstorming this episode that our favorite example of a deeply conflicted villain is george orlegan from poldark yes one of the probably the best villain yes so we're hugely into british television and a lot of these examples we're going to give are from yeah they're british and the british films british tv series take note and go check them out we were raised on british television mostly have always watched british television so watching sometimes or like when we watch an american thing it's like oh wow this is this is american okay but that's just us but there are so many incredible british shows that we're going to talk about here take note of them because they're amazing stories and poldark is one of our top favorites yes it is for sure i would say that it's like my favorite show of all time really wow yeah because it's definitely one of my top it never gets old to me i just like re-watch it so much because the writing is so good especially in the first two seasons and just everything about it is so immaculate but specifically the character of george who is the rival to our protagonist ross poldark so the story is mainly following ross poldark in the first first season first two seasons really before it starts to kind of veer off to other side characters but the character that you care the most about of course is ross he's the hero he is trying to help other people in his community and just be heroic but we also see that he is deeply conflicted but at the same time he is kind of in this rivalry with george who has always seen him as he's always kind of looked up to ross in a way but also resents him for that school i've rather admired him he said what he thought did what he liked where did i get him it got him a following it's something we frequently fail to acquire yeah resents him because he is like everything that george cannot be no matter how hard he tries because you see that he tries to kind of buy his way through social ranks and be somebody that is respected and liked but he's not likable because he he's a selfish person and he's too concerned with getting what he wants and being respected and being seen as somebody important that he totally misses it right and he's also resentful of the fact that ross actually has a lot less than he does because they both come from similar backgrounds but george is able to like sort of climb the social ladder and become very wealthy and very um successful is welcomed in of the high society circles and everything where ross isn't necessarily he isn't as wealthy but yet george can see that even with all his wealth and power he still doesn't have what ross has which is being loved by the people which is what he's always wanted but can never have so you have this really interesting dynamic of these characters have known each other for a long time since they were young people and that conflict has always been there kind of eating away at george warlegan's character i hope your new mind prospers it will i wish i had your confidence must you be envious even of that and so it creates this very interesting tension between the two characters and george is also in love with the same girl that ross has always been in love with so that just adds it's just like layering on the angst between these two characters and also their similarities because there is similarities with their character you can see that they come from a similar background they actually have a few similar character traits but they go they diverge there they go to different directions which makes it even more intriguing exactly yeah it does because their personalities are very similar like you said and how how you see george's internal conflict comes from really his background and that he's deeply insecure and even though you don't go into the past through flashbacks or anything and see his childhood you hear enough about his childhood and his upbringing and his background that he you know how he has this insecurity about he wasn't necessarily born into nobility right born into high society but he's been able to acquire the wealth and influence that has brought him to that level but he has this insecurity about that constantly right and so that is really a weakness yeah that gives an antagonist and any character really humanity yeah and that's that's a problem i think a lot of writers run into with writing villains is they try to make them bad and evil and sinister and they forget about the humanity aspect yeah you know i'm not saying that you should glorify your villain or make them seem like they are actually a good guy they've just made mistakes like sometimes they're not they're not good at all what they're doing is not okay yes what they're doing is now we can understand how they arrived at that point that's important there has to be a reason and i think that was one of the things we talked about a lot in when we were when we were starting to talk about like what makes a villain great is they have to have a reason for what they're doing it can't just be because i'm an evil psycho you know what i mean and no other reason at all and in george warlagan you see these very nuanced but yet deep reasons that are attached to his own insecurities so it makes it feel very realistic and very human and you see why he reacts to every single thing the way he does yeah and why he's not even satisfied when he sabotages ross's life and his decision his businesses the different ventures that he goes into george is like constantly sabotaging things for ross and even when he succeeds you can see that he's still not satisfied because he's dealing with his own internal conflict and his own demons continue to haunt him because it really has nothing to do with ross it's completely about himself right you know yeah so that's that's definitely step number one for any writing any character crafting any character but especially for antagonists because you want them to have a good reason for doing bad things exactly and go watch that entire show yes just really do i know some of you guys have already watched it based on our recommendation which is awesome because it's such a good show it's amazing so the next point the next way number two next way to make your villain unforgettable is a method that i find really really impressive when it's done well which is to hide your villain in plain sight and this can be pulled off several different ways but as kate and i were brainstorming this podcast we both thought of this example which is one of our favorite examples from classic literature from oliver twist the one of the villain characters dickens usually has a few multiple villains a whole gang of them a whole gang of villains but one of the main antagonists which is mr monks is his his name that he goes by in the book right and kate and i both have not read the original book of oliver twist but we both love the bbc series big surprise version um which i believe was made in 2007 yeah 2007 is we've seen like i think every adaptation of all the twists but this is in my opinion the best one is the 2007 bbc mini series of oliver twist and they took a few creative liberties with it that in our opinion just took the story to the next level with the internal conflict of the villains that just added so much to the story right so i believe in the original book it was that mr monks is the half-brother of oliver twist and he's basically trying to hunt him down and destroy him so that he his and his inheritance is not threatened um and if you know the story of oliver twist you know that of course everything ends happily for oliver in the end but the creative liberties that i thought were really well done in the series we're talking about is that mr monks was more of a central character in that show it was he was introduced earlier on in the context of the brownlow family and rose was also brought into the brownlow family as the well her uncle she calls him uncle she calls mr brownlow uncle but it's really her guardian and her sister was oliver's mother so it's kind of like it's one of those dickens family trees you need like to draw it out to be able to understand it sometimes it can be confusing but um so basically the the way that i thought they did it really well was to bring monks in earlier as a character that doesn't seem to be a villain he seems to be a kind of slimy side character that you're not sure what to think of him but he's generally accepted in their family and in society and he's looked upon as a perfectly fine gentleman that is trying to court rose trying to get her to marry him basically but she is a little bit like nothing yeah but she doesn't even really know quite why she doesn't like him but she just doesn't she just senses there's something a little something a little creepy going on in the in the background yeah exactly over there yeah and and they at first when you're seeing the antagonist you don't really know who it is because it's kind of like just showing the back of him when he's talking to characters so you're kind of like um who's that and at the same time you've already seen mr monks in the setting of the household and stuff like that so then when those two things come together and you make the connection of like oh he's the villain who's actually working behind the scenes when they finally do reveal that through this pretty pivotal conversation that he has with um fagin yeah and where it's finally revealed oh he's the one who's trying to make this deal to get oliver killed so that he gets the inheritance it's just this kind of like hair-raising moment oh my gosh it's the guy who's like living in the same house the villain hidden in plain sight i want him dead i want him wiped off the face of the earth [Music] and that's really what makes a villain so much creepier mm-hmm than like oh here i am you know the villain in the black cloak with the sickle and you know the the halloween mask it's like well obviously that's the villain you know running around uh talking like darth vader and stuff like we know that it's and it's not even that scary because we know what it is what is more scary to the human psyche is things that are unknown so when it's you know is that creepy monster looking thing trying to kill me or is my best friend secretly trying to kill me which one of those two things is creepier the best friend trying to kill you because you can't detect that right it's an unknown to you it flies under the radar and it's those things that truly scare people right in my opinion because it's not obvious you wouldn't guess it you could easily miss it and so that makes it feel so much more dangerous yes because it's a threat that you can't really identify yeah so it's like so much creepier like you're saying yeah and so much more thrilling i think it brings more suspense especially like you're saying that pivotal moment when you find out like oh my gosh mr monks is i think his name is edward i like kenny edward okay he is edward who's living in their house and trying to sabotage oliver's life it's like whoa it's this game-changing midpoint really right i think it kind of happens towards the midpoint i can't quite yeah i think it does it is around the midpoint of the series yeah so it's like it it adds that plot twist moment right you know that upends the protagonist's life yeah and also surprises the viewer surprises of the audience by revealing something that you weren't expecting it also introduces so much more uh suspense because now every time you see him interacting with the other characters who are none the wise you're like oh my gosh this is the villain don't tell him that don't you know what i mean yeah so add so much more you're so much more engaged yeah then like clearly everyone knows it's the villain because you would have to be like have your eyes closed to not know it's the villain yes exactly you'd have to have your head buried in the sand to not understand that this monstrous looking thing is the villain exactly yeah so the villain hidden plain sight very powerful tool yes very powerful definitely consider it if you are writing a villain and you're not sure what to do with them they should be the the scary ominous figure in the black cloak or if they should be the lying scheming person who is hidden in plain sight who doesn't seem harmless harmful at all they seem harmless right a wolf in sheep's clothing right that's the other thing i was looking for so point number three third way to make your villain amazing and terrifying and unforgettable is to give your protagonist this one's kind of niche give your protagonist a reason to spare or save the villain this is something that i find a really interesting conflict yes that when done well it is so engaging because you always expect the protagonist to be out to get the villain we know who the target is we know who the threat is we need to destroy them right we are on the warpath and it's everything is like a black and white issue we know exactly what we have to do to win this battle or a very clear path yeah but that also kind of doesn't leave room for those nuanced emotions and details and an example of this done well of giving your protagonist a reason to spare the villain and some really good internal conflict is in a series that kate and i both love again guess bbc oh yeah as bbc um i think four out of five of these are bbc and we're not even sorry and it is the series the musketeers such a good series the villain character of milady de winter who is i think one of the main antagonists in the book which i have not read the book yet but it's on my tbr i'd really like to read it yeah i know the show is based off of the first season i think is based off the book right yes i believe so yeah yeah and i know they took a little bit of creative liberties with some of the details but it's so good such good acting such good writing right and the thing is even even if some of these these series and films are different from the book it's it still can be case studied as a story because a story is a story a story is a story is a story yeah so even if it's a little different from the book and the musketeers is such a great show if you guys haven't seen it it's it's so good it it has great characters just fantastic writing but the character of milady particularly clashing with the character of athos is the conflict that we're talking about here because she is why don't you explain it because you know so much better than yeah so essentially she and athos were married a lot like way back when and it's introduced through flashbacks and those of you who've read the book or watched any adaptation know a bit about this so they're married um it was discovered that she he figured out that she was a petty thief she ended up lashing out through a series of events killing his brother and because of that because he was like the magistrate at the time i think um he had to convict her basically to hang and so he always felt like oh my gosh you know i killed my wife but his hands were tied because of the law and obviously he was conflicted and heartbroken too because she did just kill his brother so there's that love-hate relationship there so um unbeknownst to him she actually was cut down and revived and still lives so all this time years and years have passed he's a musketeer now he thinks she's dead but really she's haunting him with a thirst for revenge to take revenge on him for what he did to her the world says i've done terrible unforgivable things though i once loved a man and he loved me however once that's revealed once he once he finds her it's like she is his kryptonite because he still has feelings for her even though she's a little bit evil a lot evil a lot she like virtually can't destroy her he virtually can't destroy her because he already has so much internal conflict about the fact that it was his fault that she almost died she would have died if if she hadn't persuaded someone to cut her down and it was his decision he had the final deciding choice in the matter and he let that happen and he can never get over that and so because of his own internal conflict he it won't allow him to defeat the villain who is his ironically his own wife and on the flip side of that coin she's an incredibly complex and conflicted villain because she loves him but also was a thief conflicted by her own past and still lashing out violently to defend herself so she has all this baggage and you can see that part of her wants to be redeemed but part of her wants to be how she's always been so there's like this great conflict with her as a villain yeah and he's conflicted about his own feelings for her which inhibits him from ever being able to defeat her so it's like this it's like she is his baggage she is his ghost that prevents him from like ever being able to get away from her or defeat her right exactly and it creates such an interesting dynamic between the characters in such a great conflict because it's totally character driven yet it's like checkmate for the protagonist right and it's they're like always in this deadlock of not being able to defeat each other because they're battling with their internal feelings and desires and they just can't bring themselves to destroy each other and it's so it's such an interesting plot uh plot device especially for like series writing i think when you have a villain but you don't want to destroy the villain like in the first book because you have many other books planned or maybe you're writing a tv series and you don't want to destroy the villain because you need the villain you need this story to continue it's a great method for keeping a villain alive without it being this annoying merry-go-round of i try to destroy the villain but they can't be destroyed because they're all powerful like that is way less engaging to me right and this deeply conflicted like i can't because i love them yeah exactly i love the villain even though i hate the villain it's like yeah exactly it makes it so much more interesting and makes you engage with it so much more as the audience because you kind of you can empathize with the characters on both sides and wonder what you would do in that position right exactly yeah it's just it makes so much more sense than just every single bullet happens to miss the villain and they happen to live through every single explosion and car crash and car chase and falling off the cliff they're just indestructible it makes me feel like oh no they resurrected themselves again yeah you know it makes it more realistic like okay you kind of want you almost like it's like you want him to kill the villain but you don't at the same time because you understand the internal conflict and you understand how they both got to the point that they're both at it just makes it so complex and just oh so good it does you just want them to be happy yeah you just want them to be happy but they can't be because they're doomed from the start yep it's so good so con consider that when you're writing your next villain maybe make them un untouchable by the protagonist undefeatable not because they're all powerful but because the protagonist has this deep connection to them that they can't bring themselves to destroy the villain right another really cool way to use your villain especially for series writing but it also works for any type of story is to make your villain a misdirection so by that i mean it's like a you think that this is the villain but really they just it's revealed that they are pointing to a bigger worse villain or a mysterious villain that has not been revealed yet so this can be done several different ways but the example that came to kate and i was the first it's the first episode right the first episode of sherlock again british british jesus a lot of you guys have pro this is one of those british tv series though that was extremely popular in america so a lot of you guys have probably seen it comment below if you're on youtube and tell us because i'm sure a lot of you guys have seen this one yeah i had a rabid fan base this has a rabid fan base but yeah so the episode with what is it called the cab driver i think it's called the study in pink oh the studying pink right cause it's like it's i think it's like inspired by the study in scarlet which i haven't read but okay it's like the original sherlock holmes do you want to recap i don't know if i can adequately read that it's murder all of them i don't know how they're not suicides their killings serial killings we've got ourselves a cereal kid i love those there's always something to look forward to so essentially i i think i've watched more of the series than you hatched every single episode of it okay wow i've only watched like four or five so we all know moriarty is the super villain behind every bad thing that happens in sherlock the whole thing is the the the story behind the story is that morarity is out to get sherlock no matter what right but for the first few episodes of this series we see sherlock and watson battling their way through various villains who seem to have different motives completely different backgrounds come from different parts of the world different parts of the city are seemingly unconnected so in we and we were talking about this we got on this topic because we were wondering we see this in some like superhero films and stuff like that is like it seems like you know mohaha i'm the psychotic villain and i'm doing this for no reason other than the fact that i'm psychotic and i just want to destroy everything can that be workable because apparently it does work for stories to the extent that people will consume it and enjoy the story we see that with so many like you know you get that not in all of them because i'm not saying this by the way because i we like marvel films but you see this in some marvel like dc comics and different films that are similar to that you see the villain doesn't necessarily have a big strong reason why they're doing everything other than money power and world domination which is kind of like really broad vague terms like i want to control everything okay you know it's like kind of copied and pasted so can can it work obviously but like when can we use that when can we adequately use that the villain doesn't really have any reason whatsoever and what abby and i were talking about is actually makes that strong and usable and it actually makes your story even more intriguing is to use it in that the villain is pointing to a bigger villain it was you not your passenger see no one ever thinks about the cabbie it's like you're invisible just the back of an head so in the study in pink eventually sherlock of course finds the villain who is a cab driver who is killing people by making them choose one pill to take one of them will kill the person and the other one won't and he is interviewing the guys like the most concise to the point explanation i've ever heard and so he's trying to make sherlock play the game take one of the pills and see if he dies and sherlock is like you know why are you doing this and basically the guy is is like you know no reason he finally breaks down and gives him the excuse that he's dying and so he wants other people to die he can kill people before he dies himself of an illness and sherlock is like no that's not the that's not the real reason and it's kind of revealed like well i don't have any reason i'm just i'm just doing this because i can ha but then as the guy is dying because it's through series of events watson ends up shooting him through the adjoining building but as the guy's dying sherlock finally gets it out of him like why are you actually doing this and he says moriarty the name of the super super villain which sherlock doesn't know who he is at the time but it's like this haunting little plot twist that makes sherlock realize okay the real reason is you were working for someone else who is actually out to get me so it wasn't even you i thought you were the end game and you had no reason to do this and that's because you're not even the actual villain villain there's actually someone behind you right who's even bigger and badder that i didn't even know was there you know what i mean it's almost like you're so distracted with like trying to put out the fire in front of you and you turn around in the whole forest is on fire it's like that moment and so you can can you make a villain have basically no reason yes if you're using it as a plot twist i think is the best way to use that to point to something bigger so i think even in this case you still have an active antagonist because the ultimate antagonist yes morarity is using these other like mini antagonists to antagonize sherlock which then leads him closer to you know it it creates it's still the game that he's playing right so it's all part of the game and he's using these people as basically chess pieces in his game but he has a motive for the entire thing so it's not even it doesn't even matter like you were saying it doesn't quite matter as much if the smaller antagonist of the chess pieces that are antagonizing the main character don't have a deeply conflicted reason for doing what they're doing because the villain is just placing them where he wants them because it all points back to the main plot conflict right so as long as you still have that main plot conflict you still have this main antagonist that is like literally using people for his game against the protagonist as long as you still have that deep conflict there i think it's it can be really well done right which is which is great also for series writing yeah because if you don't necessarily want to reveal the super villain right away you can have some of those smaller antagonists that are the chess pieces and then they're kind of throwing the hero off the scent of the villain and then when you as the reader like oh that wasn't it either that was a dead end and it makes you realize it's like that plot twist moment where you're like oh there's something like bigger like oh you thought that was it watch this you know what i mean yes which i think sherlock did a good job of because definitely they were always what's at the center especially with mysteries when you're trying you're having a protagonist who's trying to solve a mystery really all a mystery is is a question right that they don't have the answer to and you the reader want the answer to this question and as the writer you are promising the reader the answer to this question and so bringing them on this journey through the eyes of the protagonist who's trying to also answer this question can be very engaging because as you go along you're trying to answer the question you're guessing you're putting together clues as well but there has to be a payoff there has to be a villain that eventually we meet everything points to them and the protagonist has to face off with them right so but but using smaller villains or antagonists as misdirections or chest pieces or however you want to look at it is a really can be a clever and unique way to throw off the scent of the reader while still adding suspense right and not confusing them or disappointing them but doing it in a satisfying way absolutely i agree and our last point here point number five fifth way to make your villain unforgettable and this might not be suitable for all villain arcs but it is definitely worth considering or antagonist arcs if you prefer that term is give your villain a redemptive arc so i have a i have a lot of questions some uh from writers who ask me um can i give my villain or my my antagonist a redemptive arc can they redeem themselves at the end of the story or are they just destined to be destroyed because they're evil and the answer is if they're an antagonist who still has some humanity left in them some empathy left in them somewhere in their dark little soul there is a spark of light they can be redeemed if you want to take that path that arc with your antagonist there is definitely a way to do this well and i wanted to mention it in this podcast because i think it can be really powerful when it's done well and can help to carry an important theme in your story depending on what big ideas what themes you want to weave into your story but the the theme of redemption basically and bringing your character kind of full circle from being a good person to going on this negative arc to starting to redeem themselves at the end or maybe they end up being destroyed anyway but they kind of redeem themselves as they're destroyed which in that particular case we were going to use the example of freyja from winter's war i can't remember the first part of that title the husband the husband winter is where everyone's gonna scream at me abby come on how could you forget that yes i've just listened to the soundtrack obsessively so the soundtrack is great i listen to the soundtrack many times before watching it i think that was fun it was really good really good i want to watch this because the soundtrack is so good which can be iffy to do that because sometimes you'll look oh now this has ruined my image of this track but this film no not so this was a really good film yeah so the character of freya i found interesting because you were you watched it first and then you were like we should watch this together because the antagonist arc in this story is really interesting and i wanted to see it because of that and it's interesting because it basically her story starts it's kind of like a prequel and then a sequel right because like the first part of it is like events that took place before the first movie and then yeah it's forward yeah it's big times yeah but it's mostly i would say i mean it mostly is leading with freya's character yes and so it starts with her in a good place a neutral kind of positive place of she's obviously conflicted but she has a good heart right they they did a great job building up the end her internal conflict was completely nailed when me and abby talk about make sure your your readers or your viewers know why the villain became the villain yes exactly they did an excellent job this is a textbook example of what we're talking about here because we see freya in the very beginning who's this kind of the sweet innocent sister out of the two she's kind of untouched by the evil from her sister it hasn't really rubbed off on her she's still a good person she meets this guy they have a kid she's gonna run off and get married and she kind of believes in true love and happiness and her sister takes it and destroys it she destroys freya's baby and makes her think that it was the boyfriend who did it which kind of just breaks freya's heart causes her to turn into elsa and blast the guy with ice i'm like this is like a darker version of frozen yeah yeah it is very similar and um you see how this moment of heartbreak and tragic tragedy destroys her as a person and so even with her power which is to like freeze everything and blast it away from her and protect herself is an example of what she's trying to do she's trying to guard and protect herself from ever being hurt like that again because now her heart's been broken forever so that's we see that is the reason for every single one of her following behaviors right and why she goes on to like wreak destruction on other people right and basically kidnap children by the hundreds and destroy their families and right turn them into her personal army it's pretty dank yeah it is pretty dang but we understand why she did it we saw her at her best now we're seeing her at her worst and we understand exactly what happened during the space in between yeah and then so then when the huntsman and his girlfriend whose name i can't remember i don't care want to be together because they're in love freya sees it and she's like that's not happening and it destroys their perceptions of their reaction right separates them yeah all i remember is the girl from interstellar and i know that's i know i should not refer to her character as that so uh yeah i think you're right i think it was sarah and i'm pretty sure his name was eric yes okay everyone's gonna be laughing uh every time you have to understand what we we're always just like chris hemsworth's character whatever so emily blunt doesn't want chris hemsworth to be happy because she's not happy so she destroys their relationship and okay yes you're right sarah so she destroys the relationship makes them think or makes him think that sarah died and was killed and she's destroyed she's lost you forever but it's not like this moment of oh the antagonist is just this bad evil witch lady who wants everyone to suffer we see why she wants them to suffer and why she doesn't want them to be happy right because she's like deeply traumatized by her own happiness being destroyed so she doesn't want anyone else to experience true love or happiness right and it's kind of like history repeating itself too because they were going to like run away together right yes yeah yeah so she sees that that's the exact thing that happened to her and so she can't bear for someone else to be happy when what she held most dear was taken away but then we see in the final battle showdown with the resurrected bad sister coming back i can't remember her name i've been trying rosanna ravenna okay i was trying to find her in the castle and i couldn't yeah i'm pretty sure because i'm like is it i think it's revenge again i only know this because i've listened to the soundtrack so much she resurrects herself big showdown battle with all sorts of magic and stuff and she finds out it was actually her sister who destroyed her kid and so she in a moment of realization realizing that she has been wrong about the world and her outlook on life and even about what happened to her in the past basically sacrifices her life to save the huntsman and the rest of her army that is now being threatened by the sister who she brought back yeah i loved her i loved you yeah so she kind of rediscovers her humanity and her love and her ability to love yeah like you think that she's kind of a lost cause character like she has been destroyed and emotionally wrecked and she can never love again but kind of the realization that she has at the end is that she loves her children the huntsmen as like their whole army and basically sacrifices herself to save them yeah and that is a good example of a redemptive arc because it all makes sense yeah it all works together it's not out of character but it's also you've also been taking on this whole journey with this character and seeing the reason why she does everything she does every every decision makes sense so i guess that's that's the thing to avoid when you're writing a redemptive arc for an antagonist is you don't want it to just be and we've seen this done many times this 180 degree turn around at the final scene for like no reason for no reason just you know what i have been mean i'm sorry i've been evil i'm sorry we forgive you it's like it's it feels cheesy because there's no depth of emotion behind it right there's no clear event that causes it to take place whereas in the case of winter's war the event is freya figuring out finally knowing the truth about who killed her child realizing it was never the guy she was in love with it was actually her sister this whole thing has been a setup to make her this dark evil witch queen she is exactly where her sister wanted her to be and it causes her to to kind of dig her heels and be like no i'm gonna rebel against that and i'm going to do something noble right now i'm going to save these people right so that makes total sense but there had to be that realization it couldn't just be uh you know what for a change of pace we're gonna just we're i'm gonna be nice right exactly because i'm tired of always being evil so it's boring it's boring to me now that phase is over now i'm going to be a good person there has to be a clear trigger there is to be clear reason why the care the villain is being redeemed right exactly so if you're going to do a redemption arc for your villain or your antagonist do it the right way right so those are our main our five points are five ways to make your craft a villain that is unforgettable and terrifying but your your audience kind of loves them in a way loves to hate them and wants to see them redeemed or wants to see the end the protagonist destroy them either way the five points again are make your villain deeply conflicted the most important one hide your villain in plain sight give your protagonist a reason to spare the villain make your villain a misdirection and or give your villain a redemptive arc so boom that's it that's go watch all those films and shows because take your own notes delve into this deeper and see what we're talking about here from your own perspective take notes and and come back and comment on that on the podcast and tell us what you thought give us your your feedback and your ideas we always love to discuss stories as you probably noticed kate and i could ramble about this for hours we have to really limit ourselves here so feel free to join in the discussion keep the discussion going in the comments below on kate's youtube channel you can find the video if you're not on there check it out youtube.com ka emmons follow her channel and follow the podcast thank you guys so much for listening thank you to our sponsors who make this show possible we couldn't do it without you guys thank you so much and if you get value or enjoyment out of this podcast show us some support go to patreon.com slash the caton abbey show and help us keep it alive and free of interruptions until next week stay stoked and rock on

Channel: K.A. Emmons

Views: 59,929

Keywords:

Id: UhPlLjXwEWU

Length: 45min 18sec (2718 seconds)

Published: Thu Dec 16 2021