“Hope through suffering” with Joni Eareckson Tada

[Music] chryso welcome welcome to the equip conference organized by the wales leadership forum we've been established for four years now but this is our first online conference and for obvious reasons our vision is to unite equip and resource men and women for ministry and our theme for this year's conference is holding out hope and whilst our vision is to support ministry in wales we're so excited by the fact that so many people have joined us from around the world from north america from south america from asia and from europe you're all welcome thank you very much for joining us just some general housekeeping before i get out of the way um you'll receive an email every day explaining what's happening today giving you the links for the conference and also what happened yesterday but um one thing we'd like from you we'd like feedback we'd like you to tell us who you are where you are tell us a little bit about you what you've got out of the conference what's what's encouraged you and what you'd like to see more of so keep in touch if you're not sure about something drop us an email so for tonight i'm pleased to hand over to your host for this evening is becca whitaker and she'll take you through the rest of the evening and the interview with johnny erickson thank you becca thank you chris yes good evening everyone thank you so much for being with us this evening we have got a real treat ahead of us tonight as we hear from johnny erickson tarda speaking to us about her experience of finding hope in the face of suffering now i know there'll be many of you watching this evening who are familiar with johnny's story be that through reading some of her books or perhaps watching the film that was made about her life but if you haven't heard of johnny let me just give you a brief glimpse into her story at the age of only 17 whilst diving into a lake johnny broke her neck and was left paralyzed as a result for over 50 years now johnny has lived her life as a quadriplegic without the use of her arms or her legs so she spent the vast majority of her life in a wheelchair she experienced depression as a direct result of her diving accident and she struggled greatly to understand why god would allow such suffering to come into her life more recently over the last decade johnny has also endured chronic pain in her shoulders and her neck and in addition to that she's battled cancer so she really is no stranger to suffering and yet through it all johnny has chosen to believe in the person of jesus and she claims to have found not just comfort but actual joy in her suffering because of her faith in jesus over the years johnny has used every opportunity that she's had to reach out to others with disabilities and to share the hope of her christian faith with them she's established a network called johnny and friends and along with the team there they have reached thousands upon thousands of individuals across the world who are living with disabilities and they have provided them with practical and emotional support so whether you are familiar with the christian faith here this evening whether you've clicked the link tonight eagerly anticipating hearing johnny or whether or not you have joined us just because the idea of finding hope in suffering has intrigued you you really are very welcome to be with us suffering is something that has been brought to the forefront of our minds this year like never before for many of us 2020 has been the hardest year that we have ever lived through as coronavirus has turned our normal lives upside down so we're especially grateful to johnny this evening for joining us and for giving us her experience of how to find hope in the midst of great suffering after johnny's message which will be played in a moment we're going to be talking to her live from california and we're going to get to ask her some of your questions so we'd really love you to get in touch tonight and to submit questions for us to ask to johnny later you can do that by just looking underneath your video and you should see a little link to slido which is a website by which you can submit questions to be asked to johnny and if you haven't got a slot under your video then you can go to www.slido.com and you'll be asked to enter a code which is wlf 2020 that's wlf 2020 and you'll be able to submit questions and hopefully later on we will get to put some of those to johnny but for now let's enjoy listening to johnny together hi i'm joni eareckson tada and i'm so delighted to speak to you women here at the equip conference sponsored by the wales leadership forum it is such an honor to be able to address my friends from wales first i love the welsh hymns guide me go thou great jesus lover of my soul the tunis welsh written by joseph uh barist with i think that's how you pronounce it uh my welsh accent anyway joseph was born into a poor but musical family and although he showed talent at an early age he was sent to work in the pudding furnaces of a steel meal at the age of nine years old wow yet he wrote one of the most enduring sacred tunes of all times it's uh it's like what a welsh national anthem and all this to say that i love your country and i had my husband and i had the great pleasure of driving through it many years ago when i was speaking in um let's see i was in cardiff and swansea newport and uh was it rihanna i think that's how you pronounce it i still describe how when we left england and we drove across the border of wales immediately everywhere along the roadside there were these wild daffodils i'd never seen anything so beautiful and so when we returned from your country to our farm in america we planted daffodils along the road leading to our farmhouse that way every spring we would treasure the very fond memories of our visit to the lovely rugged magical land of wales so thank you for welcoming me this uh this yankee from the states to your conference and i want to say a special thanks to pat norberry for inviting me here and also a greeting to my dear welsh friends roger and margot phillips who when they come to visit their family in america they always fellowship at our little church in southern california so friends how i wish i could see your smiles park my wheelchair next to you share our needs open our hearts and speak together of our faith and our wonderful savior jesus because i know if i were there we would become the best of friends because i love quote holding out hope such as is the theme for this conference most of you know that i broke my neck over 50 years ago that's a that's a long time to live in a wheelchair but through the years i have held on to hope often hope has been very hard to come by yet god has used the courageous testimonies of others to bring about a personal revival in my heart like the testimony of helen rosevier a christian sister from great britain her hope-filled story illustrates what happens when god uses personal revival to bring about revival in a whole nation her story is that powerful and let me tell it to you helen was born in hertfordshire england in 1925 after studying medicine at cambridge um helen traveled to what was then the belgian congo to serve as a medical missionary in the jungle of the congo she helped build a network of medical clinics many people including scores of young african nurses came to jesus christ under her leadership however when a brutal and vicious civil war broke loose helen was taken prisoner by rebel forces the same forces that demolished most of the training centers and medical clinics helen remained a prisoner for five months and in an interview she wrote this she said quote government soldiers came to my bungalow ransacked it then grabbed me i was beaten and savagely kicked losing my back teeth through the boot of a rebel soldier they broke my glasses so i could not see to protect myself from the next blow then one at a time two army officers took me to my own bedroom and raped me they dragged me out into a clearing tied me to a tree and stood laughing while i was there beaten and humiliated a soldier discovered in my bungalow the only existing handwritten manuscript of a book that i had been writing about god's work in the congo over an 11-year period they brought it out put it on the ground in front of me and burned it oh villagers helped secure her release but in all this chaos and madness during the horrors of war believe it or not fires of revival broke out because just listen to what happened next again this is from her interview and she says quote our field director had just returned to our province from a part of the congo where he had witnessed an unusual movement of the holy spirit a movement of repentance and revival he stood up in our midst in the hall of our bible school and began reading from god's word suddenly we heard a hurricane begin to blow which was odd for july the rushing wind frightened us and when the elders got up to take down the shutters we looked outside the palm trees were standing absolutely still against a moonlit sky there was a terrific noise and the building shook our director stood and said this is of god please just pray and do not be afraid it was if a force came in some some were thrown to the ground but no one was hurt one woman stood with her arms upraised and cried out it is because of our sin it is because of their sin and then a wave of confession and repentance broke out everyone called out to jesus asking for god's mercy most of those people had lost their homes they had lost their families and all their property and you would think they would be bitter and full of resentment against god but pain and loss and grief were not their focus no no no in that revival their sin was and no wonder revival spread in the congo here were a people of god whose humble response to deep suffering revealed hearts bent on holiness now here's the thing here's a lesson most of us have never tasted the horrors of war most of you may never serve in places like the belgian congo which is now the war-torn democratic republic of congo and i pray you have never been beaten or raped yet still helen's story should speak to you and me because national revivals begin with personal renewals but you know what you don't need a civil war such as happened in the belgian congo we don't need to lose home or property we don't need to lose family now true the spirit may use grief on that scale but he does not require suffering of that magnitude to set the stage for renewal and revival he just wants us to steward well the suffering we already have and a test of that can be something as simple as well how about philippians chapter 2 verse 14 do everything without complaining oh my goodness everything can we do that well saint sebastian once said when we get to heaven we will not regret that we suffered we will regret that we suffered so little and that little so badly sadly most people even uh believers we we don't know what to do with suffering we try to avoid it escape it drug it surgically i don't know exorcize it divorce it institutionalize it deny it do everything but actually go to god with it and learn how to live with it learn what it teaches us about ourselves because suffering is always the textbook that best teaches us who we are proof of that is watch your reaction the next time you get hit broadside with pain or affliction your reaction reveals the true you it reveals what's really in your heart is your heart compliant and content with god and his will we all know matthew chapter 16 verse 24 by heart where jesus says whoever wants to be my disciple he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me but do we do that do we really take up the cross and daily follow jesus christ down the hard bloodstained path to calvary with an uncomplaining spirit or do we just imagine that we do it sadly matthew 16 is more like a i don't know a screen saver on your computer it's more like a slogan on your coffee cup than a practical reality in our lives like you know who wants to go to the cross not one of us is inclined to go there no no not the cross it rubs against the grain of all that it means to be comfortable and human and uh and so god has to give us a little help in the form of suffering suffering helen roseveer discovered is god's sheepdog that snaps at your heels and drives you down the road to calvary where otherwise you might not be inclined to go suffering is kind of like god's it's god's jackhammer kind of like breaking apart all your rocks of resistance it's a chisel chipping away at your pride suffering is um it's god's choices tool it is his lemon that when he squeezes it hard outpours resentment bitterness and every little bit of self-pity that we try to housebreak to make look respectable suffering is god's ice cold splash on the soul kind of like whoa waking us up out of our spiritual slumber to face our sin just as those people in the belgian congo did most of all suffering is god's textbook that keeps showing you instructing you who you really are as a sinner and how much you need our savior every single day it is the prescription for revival now living most of my life without use of my hands or my legs has taught me the fundamentals of matthew chapter 16 the basics of personal revival because every morning even after more than five decades of sitting in this wheelchair without using my hands all this paralysis man i wake up and i'm thinking to myself god i still cannot do quadriplegia but you know what i can do i can deny myself the momentary luxury of self-pity i can deny myself sullen discontent i can deny myself the luxury of complaining and so then ask for grace and pick up my cross and follow jesus dying in the morning to a peevish grumpy spirit does that sound impossible well guess what it is it is not merely hard it is impossible but with god all things are possible so although i cannot do quadriplegia i can do all things through christ who strengthens me i'm uh i'm sure you can now see why i love the words of jesus in john chapter 6 verse let me read this to you i tell you the truth unless you eat the flesh of the son of man and drink his blood you have no life in you for my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and i in him wow right there you got very graphic language of just how much i need jesus he's my he's my drink he's my he's my food he's my he's my blood he's my he's my life i need thee all i need thee every hour i need thee [Music] friends my afflictions have given me this this visceral this tenacious requirement this need of jesus christ all because my disability has sandblasted my soul raw and if i get pneumonia or have to be in bed with pressure sores and if i'm tempted to think that god is piling on too much and i deserve come on now god just a little time off the holy spirit takes that sin holds it up to my face and insists johnny you are not the paragon of virtue you would like to think you are so don't look away this little trickle of rebellion this little insistence of yours to have things your way if you don't watch it that trickle is going to become a torrent if you don't deal with it now see what i mean affliction makes me deal with my transgressions and where else can i turn but to jesus christ only jesus has words of life for people whose suffering makes for makes for carnage in the soul and so every morning i do all things through christ whose blood i drink and whose flesh i eat you know our savior could not have found a more graphic more uh visceral way to describe what it means to abide in him and there's always more sin from which we can distangle ourselves so the hardship does not let up does it god has wired your world to be very difficult he keeps giving you more ice cold splashes of affliction to keep waking you up out of your spiritual slumber to the ever increasing beauty the delight the glory of the gospel of christ and the loveliness the sweetness the precious delight of our savior jesus it happened to me again a decade or so ago when chronic pain began to encroach pain in my lower back and hip became all-consuming robbing me of the ability to focus on anything i couldn't focus on anything i would get up in my wheelchair in the morning head to the headquarters of johnny and friends and upon arrival i'd have to lay down and i'd have to try to do work from my little office bed chronic pain made my quadriplegia feel like a a walk in the park i would dread the nights because i could not turn in bed to make myself comfortable but then i would dread the mornings knowing that my pain would be at its worst what do you know once again i was being driven to the cross like um one morning on the way to work i was in such pain i was almost ready to ask ken to turn around you have to understand uh he was driving the van down the 101 freeway and i was sitting in the back of my wheelchair tied down and we're having this conversation through the rear view mirror and he knows i'm in pain he can tell but i had not come this far on the freeway to only throw in the towel and so instead of asking ken to take the next exit and turn around and take me home and put me to bed i decided that morning on the way to work what uh psalm 119 verse 50. i knew it by heart a verse i had long ago memorized my self my comfort and suffering is this now get this my comfort and suffering is this your promises renew my life i said that out loud and then out loud in the van i began to voice all those promises to renew my life promises from god's word promises like um god your faithfulness will never fail me you promise that you promised that you are my ever-present help in this trouble right now you promised that you're going to carry to completion that which you have begun in me in christ jesus you you promised that your grace is sufficient yes even for this this intractable pain you you promise also you're never gonna leave me or forsake me you promise you will keep me in perfect peace as right now i make my mind fixed and stayed on you well i kept rehearsing more promises on the freeway and by the time we drove up to the johnny and friends headquarters and ken parked the van i wheeled down the ramp of the van and i was still in terrible pain awful pain but i had courage god made me brave and i was able to confidently move through the day knowing that i had a smile sent straight from heaven miraculous but then again there was another incident in 2010 there was the diagnosis of stage 3 cancer and i had a mastectomy and a long recovery in bed a difficult season of chemotherapy yet friend even when we cry out in agony in agony along christ such as i did with my cancer pleading oh my god have you forsaken me even then when we say that we are just as jesus was on his cross we are in the very center of our father's perfect will quick note here though let me add the father may have forsaken jesus on his cross when he cried out why have you forsaken me but he did so all to the end that jesus could then turn to you and say now because of what i did on the cross how i endured you have the assurance that the father will never abandon you he may have abandoned me but he will never abandon you i took your sin i endured my father's wrath so that you don't have to and he will never ever leave you he's always god with you god for you what a joy what a relief what a comfort god and his son jesus will never abandon us never abandon you i know this i i'm short of this and let me illustrate why uh one day ken was driving me home from the chemo clinic i was thin i was exhausted i was nauseous my hair was falling out and while driving i said to ken in the rearview mirror again we're talking through the rear view mirror i'm in the back and i said you know ken suffering is like a splashover of hell is terrible it's horrible you know it's like hell like a little splash over of reminding us what the actual hell from which christ rescued us and then as we kept driving we wondered out loud well then what are splashovers of heaven if suffering is like a splashover of hell what's a splashover of heaven are they those easy breezy bright days filled with unending comfort and we decided no a splashover of heaven is finding jesus in your splashover of hell oh friend there is nothing more heavenly than finding christ holding you fast in your personal hell and that's exactly what i felt like as we pulled up into our driveway i had not been forsaken i had not been abandoned god had promised me and he was with me in my suffering and nothing nothing felt more sweet and heavenly that moment it was straight out of second corinthians chapter 3 verse 18. you know how we are changed from glory to glory as we focus on him i'm going to tell you what i had been changed i i i pulled up in the driveway and when i got out of the van that morning i was i was a different person i was a different person than the johnny i was the day before and it happens whenever we discover suffering to be that dark companion that escorts us to the very foot of the cross but there are even greater glories of the gospel to see and more loveliness in jesus christ and his provisions and this is important i want you to listen up here let me explain in years past okay try and get this i had always been grateful that jesus you know empathized with my weaknesses like in the early days of my broken neck it helped me immeasurably to know that i had a savior who understood who was sympathetic to my miseries he felt for me as any merciful high priest would he identified with me he was he was looking out for me he was he was with me he was on my side but now with a little bit of spiritual maturity seeing jesus as precious in my hell right there that became a divine invitation to turn it around and now for me to identify with him not so much him with me but no me with him to see him suffering on the cross to grieve over the sins that caused him such pain like jesus i am resting resting in the joy of what thou art i am finding out the greatness of thy loving heart oh friend to identify with jesus and his affliction as he identifies with you my goodness i realized i had come upon something so precious and common with my savior and that was the approach to suffering i mean think of the think of the hate and the treason and the torture and the injustice and murder that led to the cross how in the world could the father allow those awful things to happen to his beloved son but the father committed what he hated the cross to accomplish something that he loved and that salvation for a world of sinners and this exactly describes how i am able to identify with him the father allowed something that he hated my broken neck my chronic pain and cancer to accomplish something that he loves christ in me the hope of glory yeah i guess it's true god allows all sorts of things he doesn't approve of god did not enjoy what happened that day to his son on the cross know no more than he quote enjoys the pain that you and i must endure in this broken world lamentations chapter 3 assures us that god takes no delight in our misery but it is what binds us to the heart of christ and once i grasp that how dare i cling to the sins that cause such misery for jesus just like philippians chapter 3 says i want to know christ i want to know the power of his resurrection that helps me pursue his holiness so that i might embrace him more fully in the fellowship of sharing in his sufferings now get this here's the important part i want to become like him in his death that is i want to pick up my cross daily and die to the sins that he died for on his cross that's what it means to become like him in his death you know not merely because it's the right or the righteous thing to do or that it advances me and sanctification no i want to do it because it brings delight to christ it pleases him it makes him happy so get this true revival starts with ridding yourself of every transgression that degrades and entangles every iniquity that enslaves you every sin you might try to housebreak to make look respectable every ounce little ounce of pride we foolishly think we can tame put to death the itchiness you know the issue is to get things your way the manipulating of others with precisely timed phrases the the fudging of the truth and that smug self-righteousness because only then can your soul and the souls of those you love your family your friends only then can believers be better bonded and when i say bonded i mean like hot glued as it were to the savior's heart get your heart pumping in rhythm with his then oh my goodness god's joy i mean joy so indescribable that it is worth the suffering more than worth all the heart god's joy floods over heaven's walls it fills your heart it flows out to others in streams of encouragement and finally it rises back to the father and a fountain of joyful ecstatic praise effervescing and an overflow of delight don't you want to love your savior like that for you are fulfilling christ's purpose when he came to save you when that happens that purpose is stated in john 15 when jesus prays that your joy in him might be complete that's how to make it complete and that's the purpose of your salvation ultimately that god might have his joy in you and we in turn have our joy in him to illustrate this um there have been times i have been in bed at night and man i am in such pain and yet i'm so happy how could that happen i'm so happy and in the dark i will find myself whispering like him oh love that will not let me go i rest my weary soul in thee i give thee back the life i owe that in thine ocean depths its flow may richer fuller be how can i be in bed in such pain yet be so happy i don't know but it's the perfect description of 2nd corinthians chapter 6 verse 9 10 where paul says we're sorrowful yet always rejoicing poor yet making many rich having nothing and yet possessing everything not that i have already attained to it paul says or have already been made perfect no but i press on to take hold of that for which christ jesus has taken hold of me friend that's what personal revival looks like and like in a revival when it happens you simply cannot keep it to yourself it's why i'm talking to you right now i've just got to tell others that jesus is worth it jesus is ecstasy beyond compare and it is worth anything any amount of affliction to be his friend his best friend for he is all together that lovely this beautiful fragrance of awakening brings revival to your own heart and helps usher in revival what do you know in your family and your church your community and who knows perhaps even a country so one final word about helen rosemere i started off with her story right i was privileged to meet that amazing woman in 1989 and knowing about her her life in africa when i met her i was struck by the fact that there seemed to be no scars no emotional wounds no inkling of oh i'm the victim no no in her i saw only victory so in light of that i i am going to allow her to have the final word from her book called a living sacrifice her reflections on her own suffering and listen to what she writes this is what she says could i see that god wanted to transform my life from a somewhat ugly useless branch into an arrow a tool usable in his hands to be thus transformed was i willing am i still willing for the sand papering the stripping the whittling processes that are necessary the ruthless pulling off of the leaves even flowers and thorns removing flowers might be doing without conveniences or remaining single in order to see a job done the snapping of thorns from that branch could be drastic dealings with hidden jealousies and unknown pride or giving up cherished rights in leadership the final stripping of that bark might include dying to self self-defense self-pity self-justification self-vindication self-sufficiency and more am i prepared for that pain which may at times seem like sacrifice in order to be whittled into a holy tool for god's service my willingness will be a measure of the sincerity of my true desire to express my heartfelt gratitude to him for his so great a salvation can i see such minor sacrifices in light of the great sacrifice of calvary where christ gave all for me wow helen rosevier would be the first to say that god cares most not about making you comfortable but about teaching you and me to hate our sin and grow up spiritually to love and adore him thus one form of evil suffering becomes turned on its head to defeat another form of evil and that is our transgressions our sin all to the praise of god's wisdom and the building of his kingdom through revivals small and great oh friends this is the hope i hold out to you i pray that god will do a great work of revival in your heart and that who knows lord willing that you might be god's agent of revival in your family your community and yes even in this country which in years past has seen such great revivals yes if you know christ as your savior suffer strong would you don't complain submit to christ and your joy will be so great nothing absolutely nothing will be able to keep you from proclaiming christ to everyone everywhere but if you are one who does not know christ i pray that the holy spirit has touched your heart through this message i really do revival friend can be yours with a simple honest prayer to embrace christ as your lord and savior look you're going to suffer anyway why not it have purpose correct so set aside sin and seat him on the throne of your heart i hope you have found that this has been as rich a time together for me or for you as it has been for me and god bless you all of you thank you for listening and should you wish to share your reflections oh i would love to hear them just visit our website at johnnyandfriends.org and while there learn more about our international outreach to share christ's hope through every hardship so that was johnny erickson tarda speaking to us and we have the privilege of being joined by her live now from southern california johnny welcome can you hear us i certainly can becca and a special greetings to all of those who've just watched that message and uh how good it is to be with you all ah we are so grateful to you for joining us this evening johnny um and just a reminder to those listening you can still submit questions for us to ask johnny now all you need to do is go to the link underneath your video or if you haven't got one of those links you just need to go to www.slido.com and enter the code wlf 2020 and you can submit questions for me to ask johnny johnny we've already had a lot of questions through so i hope you're up for a chat so people will be continuing to submit questions over the next few minutes but if i can be selfish and just kick off with the first one um there were so many moments in your talk johnny where um you shared with us such wisdom and insight and such honesty so we're so grateful to you for just that honesty with which you shared your experience um at one point in your talk johnny with all that you were facing you spoke of feeling like wanting to say to god oh god what haven't i had enough why have you let this happen to me and i think even those of us who haven't experienced much suffering will find ourselves asking a similar question when hard times do come you know why does a god who claims to be good and kind allow us to live through pain so could you perhaps start us off this evening by just helping us think through that a little bit more johnny well becca i know everyone who is watching right now has asked that question why at one time or another and it's funny when you ask why as it concerns your suffering it's never dry and abstract and theoretical it's not like chalking the word why on a blackboard in a classroom you know expecting an academic answer no when we ask why when we're hurting and suffering it is a gut-wrenching question that erupts out of our deepest part of our soul and when i think of that question why i always think of this illustration imagine yourself as a little boy on a bicycle and you go zooming down the hill on a street and you get to the bottom of the kill you make a sharp right hand turn on your bicycle and suddenly your front wheel collapses on the gravel and your bike goes clattering to the asphalt you skin your knee it's bleeding your daddy comes running up and there you are holding your bleeding knee and you're crying why daddy why well how cruel it would be if that child's father stood over him folded his arms and said well they're there child i'm so glad you asked that question and let me give you the answer to the question why first watch your velocity going down the hill and be observant of the trajectory of your turn be observant of gravel on the street but those would all be great answers to the question why why did that child hurt himself but that's not what the child wants i think when we ask why when we're suffering we are like that child and that we just want daddy to reach down pick us up press us against his breast and pat us on the back and say they're their sweetheart daddy's here it's okay everything's gonna be okay and becca i think that's what we all want in their innermost being we want god to be daddy warm personal up close we want him to be in the midst of our suffering we don't want answers so much as we want god to be the answer and so the god of the bible just like a good daddy is not quick to give us answers to that question why am i suffering but he is quick to give us himself he doesn't give us a bunch of words he is the word and he gave that word through jesus christ who called himself the word i am the word of life and so what in in the bible god gives himself as uh the husband to the widow or single woman in isaiah 54 in psalm 10 he gives himself as the father to the orphan in psalm 17 he gives himself as the mighty fortress to those who are weak and crying out in isaiah he gives himself as a wonderful counselor to those who are confused and depressed constantly in the bible god is giving himself and i think that shows his goodness you know we live in a terribly broken world hardship and heartache are going to be part of what it means to be human suffering is inevitable it's unavoidable it's the one certain thing we all experience no one escapes it and the reason we can't escape suffering is because the human race has turned its back on god choosing sin and all the brokenness that that comes with it but god saw this and was merciful he didn't leave us abandoned in our brokenness he's not a god who is uncaring or unfelt thinking when it comes to our misery the god of the bible likes to redeem broken things and he does something about broken things he sends jesus when jesus arrived on the scene he began to reverse that brokenness and he's still reversing it in my own life even now so many years later after i've embraced him as savior oh that's wonderful thank you johnny yeah we've um we've received lots of questions sort of following on from that so um you mentioned just now about the fact that our world is broken and when we face hard times we feel um afraid we feel fearful and lots of the questions that we've had sent through to us this evening johnny have been on that sort of subject of how to respond to suffering and feeling afraid at the prospect of suffering and i think if i can just talk of uh what we're facing in wales here at the moment even just today we've um we've had uh new uh lockdown local lockdown announcements made and there is a real climate of fear i think at the moment about a possible second wave of coronavirus coming and when we face suffering you said just now that it's a human response to be afraid um could we just talk about that that fear and how we handle that fear in when we sort of have suffering coming towards us you know we don't want to suffer do we you mentioned in your talk about how we we try and avoid it at all costs um so what what do we do how do we handle that that fear of encroaching suffering johnny have you got any any wisdom for us on you know what we do with that fear well um becca fear is a state of mind that happens when you feel as though your life is out of control fear happens when you feel exposed or unsafe or unsure about the future thinking the worst of the future um for instance uh as our friends watching know i i live in a wheelchair and i need help and if a regular caregiver decides to move or go back to college or gets married or leaves for another city well oh my goodness my chest starts to get a little tighter my mind becomes a bit anxious and i know i can tell that fear fear is on the rise and when fear starts to encroach i know that depression isn't far behind now now for a long time i allowed fear to have sway and open the door to depression but then i think wait wait wait a minute this fear is teaching me something about myself that i need to know so here's the thing and this is for our friends watching fear tells us something very important about ourselves it tells us that it's useless to think you're in control you're not in control so in a way fear instructs us it informs us about our spiritual condition it tells us it says gene becca jessica amy let your fears drive you to the one who can do something about them because you can't you're out of control place your life in the hands of the one who is in control the one who will keep you safe the one who is totally committed to your welfare and spiritual well-being that's what i tell myself as my caregivers are about to move to another city or or get married or they cannot assist anymore i've got to say jesus this is out of control i'm scared he's going to get me out of bed but jesus you tell me in psalm 62 verse 8 trust in the lord at all times and this is a test of my trust in you so although i'm out of control i'm gonna let my fear drive me to you where i know you do have control you know becca god says in jeremiah chapter 32 verse 40 and 41 i love this verse he says i will make an everlasting covenant with my people i will never turn away from doing good to them and i will put my fear that is a healthy dose of respect okay i'll put my fear in their hearts so that they will never turn away from me yes now get this he says in the word i will rejoice in doing them good i tell you what becca when we trust god he does good things for us in our soul he gives us peace instead of fear he gives us confidence instead of worry he gives us courage instead of anxiety he gives gives us joy in place of sadness this is the way that god rejoices in doing us good so don't be afraid of fear just let it teach you about your spiritual condition that you're lacking trust in the one who is in control so psalm 62 verse 8 trust in the lord at all times and your fears they'll dissipate they really will oh johnny that's oh and let me let me say one more thing becca let me say one more thing in california we're we're also experiencing new lockdowns i've been uh sequestered in my house now for um [Music] since march and uh governor newsom just alerted us that we're we're gonna have to be locked down for a little bit longer and so uh my lungs are very fragile i know that if i get covered 19 you know i'm that's it and so i'm at high risk and so i'm i'm staying in the doors where i'm saying god has said johnny stay indoors and i can trust him with that all right really is a worldwide thing isn't it i think it's um yeah it's amazing to think of just how every single one of us is is facing this this common this common fear this common suffering and i found it so helpful just now when you were talking about how it shows us um that we're not in control and uh yeah i think you're absolutely right suffering really does reveal to us um just how very much out of control of our own world we are um johnny you mentioned how suffering is um if i could just quote something that you said you describe suffering as being like a textbook that teaches us about ourselves and you've mentioned something of that already just now um how suffering can reveal our shortcomings our selfishness our sin now for those who are watching this evening who perhaps have never considered that idea before that hard times actually kind of reveal something of ourselves can you just explain that a little bit more to us how does suffering do that how does it sort of unlock who we really are well that's a great question becca and i'm no theologian but i do know this suffering as you said as i've said is a textbook that'll teach you who you really are we say we trust god but let that trust be put to the test through some some difficult disappointment or an unexpected death in the family or uh a rejection by your boss or a loved one and oh my goodness then you'll see who you really are you know and i often think that suffering suffering is like a lemon you know how when you squeeze a lemon everything that's sour and bitter comes out of it a stream of bitterness well that happens to me i deal with chronic pain and some days when the pain is really really bad it's like it's like a lemon being squeezed and out comes a peevish stream of resentment or bitterness or um anger or a sour disposition or short tempers with others or impatience or you know all these things about me that i thought i never was like that i think i'm i'm a paragon of virtue i am until suffering hits right we all think we're a paragon of virtue but then when suffering squeezes us like a lemon and out comes a sour disposition a peevish attitude about the day um impatience with others a quick temper fudging the truth manipulating others with precisely timed phrases hogging the spotlight not giving credit where credit is due complaining grumbling murmuring those things teach us about who we really are and that is good it is good that all those things are revealed because then we can take them to god for cleansing and redemption and for healing i always pray becca god i don't want to be the johnny i was yesterday i'm not satisfied with that johnny yesterday she was impatient with her husband ken she complained pretty bitterly she snapped at her friend i don't want to be like that so jesus today would you make a new johnny would you conform me further to the image of jesus christ make me more patient make me more resilient in my suffering make me more yielding and submissive in my hardships and and it all boils down to our relationship with jesus i mean becca here's the logic of it all if jesus loved us enough to die a torturous death if jesus loves us enough to rescue us when he certainly was not compelled to do that then surely he has proved his intentions toward you and me he has proved himself trustworthy why would you not trust the god who loves you so much that he will go so far as to die for you if you place your trust and confidence in jesus the closest you'll ever get to hell is the hardships you now experience on earth but if you don't place your trust in jesus the closest you'll ever get to heaven are the meager little joys you now experience on earth why risk it why choose hell over heaven pain and suffering are god's megaphones c.s lewis one of your own over there in the uk c.s lewis says that god whispers to us in our pleasures but he shouts to us in our pain pain is like a megaphone suffering is god's way of shouting to you wake up wake up wake up out of your spiritual slumber what have you done with jesus christ in your life are you prepared for eternity do you not want help in the midst of your hardships of course you do come to christ come to the cross so um i tell you jesus is our best friend when we hurt because here's a savior who knows exactly how we feel when we are in pain he feels the sting in his chest wow johnny and i think um so many of us have have felt as though 2020 so far has almost been that kind of that wake up call that you just mentioned you know trying to it lifts us out of our normal lives and as has brought the things of um reality if the things of life and death is put 2020 feels like it's put those things right in the forefront of our minds so that's a really um poignant message for us this evening um johnny we've had so many questions for you this evening um if i could just ask you a few of them now um one question that we've had uh has has been submitted to us this evening is why must we suffer at all to know god better you know what is it i guess about suffering that um means that it's god's god's agent to draw us closer to him why can't he do that through well sorry well becca i i don't think any of us have any idea how broken this world really is it is so broken and we complain about evil and suffering but i wish we would understand that god is is keeping his restraining hand against evil he's holding it back as it were there is a dam of evil there is a damn holding back a flood of evil god is holding it back and thank the lord that he controls evil and suffering because if he did not suffering would come barreling at us it will come flooding over us uncontrolled and who could ever bear to live in a world like that satan would make jobs of us all he'd hang all of our heads on his wall as trophies so let's let's kind of get it in perspective and realize that god owes this utterly rebellious planet absolutely nothing we were the ones who broke the contract we're the ones who said god i'm going to go my own way thank you i can run my life by myself and if all of us were honest with ourselves we'd say yep that's me trying to run life by myself but god in his great mercy did not leave us abandoned as i said a moment ago he is holding back suffering and he lets a little bit he lets a little bit of suffering leak through his fingers as it were and it may touch us but when it does it kind of makes us go whoa whoa what what was that all about oh my goodness it's suffering is like a wake-up call saying wake up wake up suffering is like an ice cold splash in your face to wake you up out of your spiritual slumber otherwise you just be lulled to sleep by satan's lullaby oh the world is so nice and easy and comfortable and i'm doing just fine thank you god without you having to demand anything of me like obedience so that's the way most of us would probably live so god has to let a little bit of that hardship that suffering that evil leak through his fingers as it were to touch us but please let's remember any suffering that touches us has first been filtered through his wise and loving fingers nothing can touch us except it has first gone past god and then through christ and then finally it reaches us and if that suffering has come that far it comes with great purpose so let's get a new perspective this world is a lot more broken than we realize a lot more evil than we realize and thank god that he is controlling that evil and suffering as much as he is because if he didn't control it suffering and evil would come barreling at us uncontrolled and i shudder to think of a world living in a world like that thank you johnny yeah so um across your talk um you spoke about how uh you have found your suffering as a means by uh which god has drawn you closer to himself and we've had one question that i'd love to get your insight on this person has asked what do you mean by when you find christ holding you fast so i think that was a phrase that you mentioned in your talk that christ was holding you fast for those who have not come across that phrase before could you just explain to us what what that means christ holding you fast well god's promises are totally reliable they are rock solid certain they are anchors deep anchors they are pylons driven down deep into his character and if i would but touch one of those promises and just wrap my hands around it and say jesus i'm going to embrace this promise and make it mine i'm going to trust you're never going to leave me you're never going to forsake me that's a promise i'm going to trust that you who have begun a good work in me will complete it till the day of christ jesus that's a promise i'm gonna i'm gonna believe that your promise where you say you are my ever-present help in any and every trouble these are promises these are your anchors god you are going to hold me fast you're going to keep me going steady you're going to keep me moving forward to heaven you're going to give me peace in this day as i trust in that unshakeable promise so that's what it means for god to hold us fast you give god a little inch and he'll make a million miles out of it and he'll hold us so fast as we give him just a a little mustard seed size bit of faith just a little and he blossoms it into a gigantic oak tree branches reaching to the skies i mean god makes so much of our little bit of faith if we would but place it in his promises and in his character and i think that's what it means for for god to hold us fast it's a hard world i still look at my diving accident as a terrible day but it was a wonderful day i look at the day when i'm in chronic pain is absolutely awful but yet they are thrilling because they draw me close to christ have me touch those promises and then god envelops me with his great strength and gives me power to move forward with with life and with a smile so i think that's that's how i would describe god holding me fast through his promises that's wonderful johnny thank you um we've had quite a few questions from those who are not necessarily suffering themselves personally but are seeking to support um those who are so full-time carers and also from a few parents as well whose children are suffering um how one of the questions is how would you encourage a friend who is bitter about suffering so someone who's going through something really difficult themselves and is struggling with bitterness the the question is how would you encourage a friend who is bitter about suffering and seem to refuse to bring that suffering to god to sort of turn to god in that suffering that's a hard question it really is because we are so prone to pity those who suffer great hardship and think well you know they they deserve to be bitter because their life is so hard they have it so bad so i'm not going to encroach in their in their lives in in that manner but i think we are doing that friend a disservice i remember when i got out of the hospital i was so so self-centered and i remember sitting on the living room couch watching television with my sister and in the middle of a television show i said to her would you mind getting me getting up and getting me a a coke out of the refrigerator and you know jay got up and went to the kitchen and got the coke and came back but while she was in the kitchen my other friend who was with me leaned over and said that was a selfish thing to do johnny you didn't even wait for a commercial you just interrupted your sister's enjoyment of this television show to suit your own fancy that's wrong that's rude and it's very uncomfy of you you need to change that shoe did that convict me and at first i was pretty angry at that friend for saying it for embarrassing me my cheeks got red my face flushed but i knew she was right she was absolutely right and so we have to when we're a friend of someone who's bitter or selfish and has a disability we've got to run our fingers over their souls and find those cracks those moments where we can interject biblical truth and say your bitterness is only hurting you here let me help you let's read that let's memorize a psalm together and let's trust in the lord at all times together let me help you with this because it's not wearing well on you and you're only digging yourself into more depression let me help you with that those are good ways good phrases good words to say to people who in their disability might be a little too self-centered that's really helpful thank you so much johnny i know that so many people listening are um supporting those who are struggling and not just um those who are struggling themselves um johnny we've probably got time for just one more question our time has gone so fast this evening and it's been so so um helpful to hear your wisdom and your insight into these um there's just one last question i'd love to ask you um when doubts about god's character rise in your mind is there a verse or a promise that reassures you in the midst of pain so um is there a particular verse or a promise that is the one that you hold on tightest to um in the midst of pain well i think that uh i think that verse in romans chapter 5 that this is the love of god okay here it is coming up here's the definition this is the love of god colon in that while we were yet sinners christ died for us if you would just think on that meditate on it reflect on that powerful truth while we were yet sinners while we had could have cared less about god while we snubbed our nose at him while we were cool and calloused and standoffish i don't need you god while we were like that giving him the cold shoulder christ died for us so when i am struggling to understand god's character in my suffering i look at jesus not just one bible verse but i look at jesus and i think to myself here is the god man who while i yet could have cared less about him died a torturous death to rescue me surely that proves his character and surely that proves the character of god the father because he sent his own son to do this and so god is worth my confidence and my trust because he has demonstrated his trustworthiness at calvary so when i'm hurting and when i'm feeling really painful and it happened the other night in bed so funny i was lying there in such pain and i did not want to ask ken to get up one more time to turn me because you know i'm paralyzed and so he has to get up and re-tuck my pillows and get me comfortable but it's always a lost cause because i can never get back to sleep it's so painful and i'm lying there and this is what i'm thinking jesus okay you're putting me through this so it must think that i can do this with your grace i don't think i can this pain is just absolutely miserable i don't think i can do it but you think i can do it with your grace so jesus i'm gonna hold you to your word i want you to show up now at two o'clock in the morning and would you please make my breathing calm chase away my anxiety brush away my fear help me to relax in your promises and if you would so be so merciful kind sir put me back to sleep and uh 99 of the time he does not all the time but but a lot of the times and i think that that is a practical expression of how one engages god in the middle of great pain god i don't think i can do this but your word says i can do all things to you if you would but strengthen me so that's a promise and i'm gonna hold you to please jesus give me your strength i'm gonna partner with your holy spirit participate with you and i'm going to move forward trusting that you'll give me grace and power and strength to do this because i can't do it by myself that's a good way to live that's the christian way to live actually if you think about that's the only way to really live oh thank you johnny thank you so much for sharing with us this evening you've been so honest and it's been so helpful so practical um and it's been a real honor to be able to chat to you and also to have an insight into uh your personal relationship with god as well and that's been a real example can i say something real quick before we close of course yes okay um i have a caregiver who stays overnight with me and last night we were watching on netflix epic trails and they showed a program about the coastal trail along the welsh coastline and i turned to my friend and i said i've never seen scenery so beautiful as that i don't know if the coastal line in wales is going to be in the new heavens and new earth but i said to my friend christy i said would you hike would you go with me on a hike on the welsh coastal trail along the cliffs would you do that for me and and then we'll rent one of those canoes and we'll paddle against the the rushing tides as they come up near what's it saint gallen i don't know what it is it's some little cove there along the welsh coast you guys have an awesomely beautiful country and so far that's my favorite episode of epic trails on netflix the welsh coastal trail that's a brilliant recommendation i haven't seen it yet johnny so i'll definitely look that up i feel um i'm a bit of an imposter into wales to be honest because i married a welshman to get over the seven bridge so i um i still got lots of discovering to do of the beauties of wales myself but um johnny thank you so very very much for joining us this evening it really has been a treat to chat to you and you've given us so much to think about as well and so we're really really grateful to you for your time this evening and for sharing with us so honestly as well um if i could just say to those who are watching now if um you are new to the christian faith or you've been listening tonight and you've been intrigued by what johnny is saying and you want something of the hope that she has that the comfort and the security that she has described to us this evening as a result of knowing jesus then we would love to hear from you if a friend shared a link to this evening's event with you please do get in touch with them ask them questions i'm sure they would love to chat to you more about what johnny has shared with us this evening and also if you would like to get in touch with us directly we would really love to hear from you you can get in touch with us by emailing info at walesleadershipforum.org we would love to hear from you to connect with you to answer any questions that you have and also we would love to point you as well to johnny's website that's johnnyandfriends.org there is so much more that we can learn from johnny um there is so much more um that her example can teach us so do head to that website and if you um would like to know more about johnny's amazing story then one fantastic place to start is this book uh johnny an unforgettable story do order that and and discover more of her story for yourselves well that brings us to the end of our time this evening johnny thank you so so much again for being with us um you have done incredible work around the world but we are so grateful for your time here this evening in wales in sharing with us your own personal testimony of your hope in the face of great suffering so thank you and just a word now and to those of you who are signed up to the rest of the equip conference do keep on checking your emails as there'll be regular updates there and we look forward to seeing you for the next event on wednesday evening at 6 15 but that concludes our evening now so thank you johnny again thank you so much for joining us it has been a real joy this evening so have a good night bye bye thank you [Music] bye you

Channel: Wales Leadership Forum

Views: 46,272

Keywords:

Id: XyGCoDG2OVg

Length: 74min 2sec (4442 seconds)

Published: Wed Sep 23 2020